can you FORGIVE us?

[illuminate]

forgiveness is typically defined as the process of concluding resentment,
indignation or anger as a result of a perceived offense, difference or
mistake, and/or ceasing to demand punishment or restitution.

forgiveness and letting go can lead you down the path of healing and peace.
forgiveness is a healing journey for both body and soul. yet, even if you
know in your heart that you want or need to forgive someone, the path
toward peace can be difficult.

sept. 11th 2001 was a rude and violent wake up call for me.
I was two blocks away from the towers on that horrible morning, spent 8
years on head pills trying to cope with it. and even today, many years later,
those images are as fresh in my mind as the day they happened.

this holds true for most anyone who has born witness to a tragedy. it can
create depression, anxiety, panic and post traumatic stress disorder...
which in turn can create quite the domino effect of negative behaviors and
patterns in one's life.

so how does someone overcome something like this?

forgiveness.

I bring up this up because we are now fast approaching a time when many
truths will finally be set free. and as joyous as this seems, it will be very
debilitating for most people. most of these truths will rock the foundation of
people's belief systems and be very terrifying. remember how you felt
finding most of these things out for yourself, or how you feel about 911?

I've been able to forgive the adults who took advantage, a mother who
wasn't ready, a father who wasn't there, the friends who lied to me, the
lovers who've betrayed me and most important, I've even been able to
forgive myself... but 911 has been the most difficult.

maybe because 911 affected so many people, not just myself. maybe
because of the horrendous injustice. either way, it has been very hard.

so I wonder, as we are approach some of the biggest disclosures known to
man, will we all be able to forgive all the lies and deception?

after all the other emotions a human goes through when facing something
very bad, forgiveness and love are the only things to set us free from the
pain. so maybe we should start practicing forgiveness now, before the all
big ones hit.

forgive your family, forgive your friends, your neighbors, your enemies,
yourself, your governments, the bad e.t.s... even forgive all the
malevolent beings too.

not only will you be freeing yourself from the pain, you will be doing what
I think is the greatest thing you could give another person besides
unconditional love... leading by example.

maybe if we (the ones who are awake) all start doing this now, we will set
the pace for all our friends and loved ones who are not yet aware.

just a thought :wub2:

~ love in you ~

[Kinsuemei2]

It' looks like more than a thought.. It's a perspective! and a very good one at that, brilliant writing my friend.

Kinsuemei

[morguana]

i will second that :thumb_yello:
sounds like you have found your way illuminate
and yes i believe that you are right in that we can by our own thoughts and actions set an example for others, leading by example really does work, its a beautifull in its passiveness, and so not judging and aggressive.

not only will you be freeing yourself from the pain, you will be doing what
I think is the greatest thing you could give another person besides
unconditional love... leading by example.

maybe if we (the ones who are awake) all start doing this now, we will set
the pace for all our friends and loved ones who are not yet aware.

just a thought


thank you for shareing this insight
love
m x

[Stargazer1965]

Nice one Illuminate...I've been wrestling with this for so long....It's like an extra limb you don't really need. An itch that no matter how much you scratch doesn't go away.

There was another thread today with a short film I watched about the EGO and vengeance stems from the great liar EGO.

The EGO is bruised so we have to lash out at someone....and it's all a lie.

I hold grudges forever and the only one that ever was on the receiving end of my vengeance or was hurt by it....was ME

I'm starting to lay all those things down ....hoping to NEVER pick them up again.

Peace Y'all

[illuminate]

Nice one Illuminate...I've been wrestling with this for so long....It's like an extra limb you don't really need. An itch that no matter how much you scratch doesn't go away.

There was another thread today with a short film I watched about the EGO and vengeance stems from the great liar EGO.

The EGO is bruised so we have to lash out at someone....and it's all a lie.

I hold grudges forever and the only one that ever was on the receiving end of my vengeance or was hurt by it....was ME

I'm starting to lay all those things down ....hoping to NEVER pick them up again.

Peace Y'all

THX Stragazer for being so forthcoming, we need to hear this to know we are not alone!

and THX to you, Kinsuemei2 and Morguana for your understanding and love.

in writing this post and starting this thread, it is helping me to find
forgiveness for 911. this has been the hardest thing for me to do, and it has
taken the past 9 years to even get to a point where I able and ready to do
so.

my heart goes out to all my brothers and sisters for what they are going to
be made aware of soon. I want to be the best I can be to help others get
through everything we are about to face.

it's one thing to know something and a whole other thing to actually implement it.
"be the change you want to see..."

we CAN do it.
and when we can't quite do it alone, we CAN do it together :original:

I forgive us!

~ love in you ~

[Myplanet2]

difficulty in forgiving looks to me now as a function of the proverbial veil. While we are disconnected from the rest of ourselves, as in higher aspects, we are really not privy to what agreements we hold in our higher aspects.

I recently noticed once again how great tragedy is met with great outpourings of love and compassion. The Haiti Quake. I knew at once higher work was accompanying the sorrow and pain on the ground. Asking my higher guides about it, they instantly confirmed what my intuition was telling me. On a soul level, those courageous beings in Haiti were using that incident as a ride home. They knew they were not going to be participating in this "on the ground" ascension, and were going to be checking out early. They volunteered on a soul level, a level of their existence they are not even probably aware of in their 3D Aspects, to be in Haiti at that particular time to experience that mass "leaving" because it is not only a way to "go out with a bang", but it was known by all that the resultant out pouring of love and compassion from all over the world would crank our cosmic conscious vibratory level as a collective incarnated here on earth, up to a new frequency level.

I've come to view the 911 episode in much the same way. No matter how much the negative beings have used that incident to attempt drive in ever more draconian controls on the populations, the immediate counter wave of love and compassion, that followed within minutes, the shock and fear of the actual event, caught them completely by surprise. That wasn't supposed to happen. The world was supposed to fall neatly under their control after 911. It didn't. The worlds heart opened up a little more, and continues to do so every time they engineer another of their nasty events.

On our higher aspect levels, we are doing much much better in this game than it appears on the ground. We are managing to transmute every one of their feeble attempts at driving us down into fear into an opportunity to increase our love and compassion.

And it's making them a little trigger shy. It's like everytime they shoot one of us, the rest grow stronger and more loving.

Forgiveness is easy when you consider that everyone of their evil deeds, drives us inexorably towards love and compassion, instead of the expected fear and dismay.

we are winning this.

[Astra]

Dear Illuminate - Beautiful Soul! :wub2:
You writting is so honest, so full of Love, true Love. I am moved.

"To reconcile conflicting parties, we must have the ability to understand the suffering of both sides." -- Thich Nhat Hanh

Bllesings for you!

in Love and Light
Astra:wub2:

"Let us forgive each other - only then will we live in peace”-- Leo Tolstoy

[scanner]

You must forgive first yourself and then ALL others , they( being tptb) feed on the negative emotion . From your post you've done fanstasticlly well:thumb_yello:

[illuminate]

Thank you very much Myplanet2 for this valuable reminder.
this darn illusion can seem so real at times that it's easy to forget
that we choose...
Thank you for your wisdom :original:

and what a very sweet and heartfelt reply Astra...THANK U :wub2:

and Scanner, your statement is exactly the wisdom we need to hear and be reminded of... THANK U :wub2:

and THANK U to the rest of you for reading and opening your hearts!

~ love in you ~

[PilotSimone]

These are the threads that make a difference. Thank you so much.

[lindabaker]

So, you are a witness from two blocks away. That's so close you couldn't even see the top of the towers without straining your neck to look way, way, up. What you must have seen is enough for several lifetimes! You can of course stop reliving by changing your memory loop. As soon as one starts up, recognize it, and release it. Also, you don't have to repeat similar events in order to "freshen" the pain. I'm so glad you know this! Move above, by moving up on the spiral. Dr. Katie Gentile wrote an article about recovering from seeing the NYC towers fall. She worked in the city and witnessed both the tower fall and the Hudson River plane incident from a dock in Jersey. I will send her article to you. She has some very interesting ideas about forgiveness, retribution, and healing. Thank you so much for opening your heart to us. We won't forget but we can forgive. It's the only way out. Love to you, Linda

[lindabaker]

Apologies for length...couldn't figure out any other way to let Illuminate see this. Katie is a clinical psychologist who specializes in the impact of trauma. Linda


Original with permission from Katie to Linda March, 2009.

SAME PLACE, DIFFERENT STORY --Katie Gentile, Ph.D.
On the morning of September 11, 2001, I was on my way to work as usual when my partner, who had returned to our apartment to get something he forgot, ran out saying there had been an explosion at the World Trade Center. A helicopter or plane had hit it. We continued to the train (we live in Hoboken, directly across the Hudson River from Manhattan near the World Trade Center).
We rounded the street corner and approached the first pier in Hoboken to catch the train into the city. The sight of the Towers against a beautiful clear blue sky came into view, as well as an enormous fire with smoke streaming from the North Tower.
From there, near the first pier in Hoboken, I watched as a plane suddenly appeared low in the sky and struck the South Tower. I turned to my partner, and we left, not knowing or understanding what was about to take place.
This pier is where people gathered to watch from across the river as the towers burned and fell. It was a busy site for the next week or so, as people from throughout the area came to see the space of absence in the sky.
This past Thursday as I was walking again to the train my partner called to say a plane had crashed into the Hudson River. Deja-vu. I went to the pier again to see what was happening. This time it was different.
First, word was that everyone had survived. Additionally, this plane was surrounded by ferries, the Coast Guard and the Circle Line ships who were all able to help. Like watching the events of 9/11, there was something surreal about seeing a plane float down the river. But unlike 9/11, it was not terrifying; it was merely surreal.
I am an academic psychologist and trained psychoanalyst. I publish and specialize in the impact of trauma. So it was interesting to me that as I watched the plane float by, knowing the positive outcome, I felt I was re-experiencing 9/11 in a new way.
It is thought that people who have experienced trauma attempt to master it through repetition. For me, this was a healing repetition. Here I was in the same place, looking at another plane crash, under the same sunny blue sky, but it was markedly different.
Many of the things that we were unable to do during 9/11, we were able to do this time. The New York Waterways Ferries we often take into Manhattan were the first responders. And this time, in this situation, they were able to save the lives of the passengers.
It felt on Thursday like this plane crash, while in no way being a good thing -- I would not have wanted to be in that plane nor in the frigid water hoping for help -- was responded to in a new way.
Yes, no one died. But the pilot's knowledge is being celebrated. He knew what to do. The benefits of a skilled leader are being acknowledged as a good thing; a life-saving quality and a necessity.
I feel like the plane's successful water landing burst a bubble for me that was created by seven years of world-altering insidious abuses of power by U.S. leaders who showed no capacity to reflect, think or hold emotion. It burst it with a story about knowledgeable leaders, such as the pilots and crew, who knew what to do, and did it.
Again, I am in no way saying the crash was a good thing because it wasn't. Even though no one died, it doesn't mean that people weren't impacted and potentially harmed in significant ways.

[illuminate]

So, you are a witness from two blocks away. That's so close you couldn't even see the top of the towers without straining your neck to look way, way, up. What you must have seen is enough for several lifetimes! You can of course stop reliving by changing your memory loop. As soon as one starts up, recognize it, and release it. Also, you don't have to repeat similar events in order to "freshen" the pain. I'm so glad you know this! Move above, by moving up on the spiral. Dr. Katie Gentile wrote an article about recovering from seeing the NYC towers fall. She worked in the city and witnessed both the tower fall and the Hudson River plane incident from a dock in Jersey. I will send her article to you. She has some very interesting ideas about forgiveness, retribution, and healing. Thank you so much for opening your heart to us. We won't forget but we can forgive. It's the only way out. Love to you, Linda

Thank you Linda and I appreciate you!!!

and yes 2 blocks away was too close, I ran screaming for my life when the
first tower collapsed and didn't stop running and screaming until I hit the
east river and could run no more. I thought for sure I was dead and my
boyfriend at the time, was standing there with me, video taping the whole
thing. we lost each other in the sea of white smoke and weren't reunited
until almost 24 hours later.

that is the day I learned the true meaning of the kindness of strangers.

THX for the advice on changing my memory loop, this is important for me,
because it's the images that I can't seem to forget.

if anyone else want to speak up, please do, it's an amazing release to talk
about it!

~ love in you ~

[sjkted]

Yes, we can and we will. We are starting a domino effect right now. We cannot get to anywhere good in the future until we let good of the old. As more and more people get excited about the future, that excitement will be contagious. With such a positive outlook, there will be no more room to hold on to what has happened in days past.

--sjkted

[illuminate]

Yes, we can and we will. We are starting a domino effect right now. We cannot get to anywhere good in the future until we let good of the old. As more and more people get excited about the future, that excitement will be contagious. With such a positive outlook, there will be no more room to hold on to what has happened in days past.

--sjkted

EXACTLY! and FANTASTIC attitude sjkted, thank you for setting this example.

that is why I bring up forgiveness, it's a perfect way to truly move forward
and leave the past in the past. plus, it helps heal your soul... I only threw
in my personal journey to give a reference point and to show that it's
always possible.

I for one, am VERY excited about our future and think 2012 will be the
beginning of many amazing celebrations :original:

~ love in you ~

[cloud9]

I absolutely support the idea or forgiveness every day of our lives.
The most incredible paradigm we have to understand is than we don't know in a conscious level that perhaps some of the people who have done wrong to us, could be other aspects of ourselves doing what they came to do so we can repay or balance karmic debts.
Every time somebody says something about revenge or their desire to see other person in jail or dead or whatever else because they did something terrible, I always wonder what if.... and the lesson is always the same: NO JUDGMENT!!!
We just don't know.
Couples divorce in a sea of grudge and much negative energy without understanding that ALL relationships end at one time or another, nobody is obliged to be with us forever or for a lifetime, some relationships are meant for a short time and life or the universe takes care of that in very curious ways so we have to end the relationship even though we sometimes attach ourselves to other people because of fear or insecurity.
I really believe that just when we have the chance of remembering past lives this concept becomes really clear, otherwise most people keep on believing this is the only life we live and our only chance at love and hate.
So definitely forgiveness it's not just a good idea, actually forgiveness is LOVE for ourselves and others and it's the fastest way to light our some times heavy load, it makes us feel sooooo much better.
In order to do that, judgment has to out of our lives.

[Jack]

Thank you for this awesome thread! :wub2:

[orthodoxymoron]

Thank-you illuminate...and all posters on this thread. 9/11 seems to have awakened a sleeping giant...in a good way...even though it was probably intended to do just the opposite.

illuminate...you mentioned that your partner videotaped some of the tragedy that day. What became of that tape? Did it reveal any hidden clues? Also...you mentioned that there are revelations which will be difficult for people to deal with. Are these revelations related in any way to 9/11? It seems to me that 9/11 is part of a huge Pandora's Box...which includes a lot of what gets discussed in Avalon.

Reasonable immunity in exchange for disclosure, cooperation, and restitution...seems reasonable to me. Forgiveness is a good thing...but reasonable restitution should be a part of the package. Punishment may also have to be meted out under the laws of the land...but somehow the goal should be to turn the bad-guys into good-guys...and for the rest of us to forgive...but not necessarily forget.

:original:Namaste:original:

[sjkted]

I really believe that just when we have the chance of remembering past lives this concept becomes really clear, otherwise most people keep on believing this is the only life we live and our only chance at love and hate.


Not just that. It also points out how petty it is to have grudges with other people once you realize what causes some of these "problems" with other people that last lifetimes to resolve. None of it serves any purpose whatsoever. It is simply garbage to be discarded once you see it for what it is.

--sjkted

[shiftmonkey]

Great thread Tania.

Sometimes I'll wind up in a conversation with someone who says something like "I can never forgive him or her for such a thing." I tell them that forgiveness isn't something that you do to let the other person off the hook. Forgiveness is actually a gift to the self. It frees you from the poison thoughts and resentments that when harbored will corrode both your physical and spiritual health. It takes the weight off of your shoulders and puts it back where it belongs.

[Stargazer1965]

I wanted to add one more thing....This was the event that led to my awakening....Nothing added up and what was being pandered on the TV never set right with me.

But it took till Illuminate said it in this thread to bring something home to me.

I realized I was still mad and angry about these folks dieing so needlessly.

That it was an even on so many levels trying to make fools out of us to think we would swallow this garbage.

Then yesterday I realized it was my EGO screaming for revenge and retribution and the only thing I could do is really forgive.

In that forgiveness I grow and move on.

Whatever this was orchestrated for....it only worked a short while...Now here comes the PEace blowback!!!!

Peace all

[mudra]

Thank you illuminate for this beautifull thread :wub2:

The more we forgive ..the more we Love
The more we love .. the more we enjoy the present moment
The more we enjoy the present moment ..the more we are at peace
The more we are at peace ..the more we balance the world.
Love is every step .

Love for You
mudra

[pedro m.b.]

Forgiveness is choosing to love. It is the first skill of self-giving love. --Mahatma Gandhi

[illuminate]

illuminate...you mentioned that your partner videotaped some of the tragedy that day. What became of that tape?

I'm sure he still has it. we separated not long after 911 and I moved from
my beloved NYC in 2002. I'm sure he probably sold/gave the tape to someone
(he worked in the entertainment biz)


Did it reveal any hidden clues?

unfortunately no, it mostly contained the horror. people jumping to escape,
and the screams... I should have NEVER watched the darn thing, but I did,
and these are some of the images I am now desperately trying to forget.


Also...you mentioned that there are revelations which will be difficult for people to deal with. Are these revelations related in any way to 9/11?

gosh I sure hope not :original:
I was referring to (and sorry if I implied otherwise) the truths about E.T's,
religions, governments, HOW POWERFUL WE ARE... most of what has been
kept from humankind will shake us at the core of our being, our beliefs
systems, to learn that most of what we've been taught is a lie. how is
someone going to feel when they find out that their religion is man made
and not all true, or that their government has been brainwashing them since
they started going to school. no-one likes to be lied to, or betrayed, and I
worry that some of these truths will be so hard to swallow for most, that
forgiveness will be the last thing on their minds.

I want everyone to know, that no matter what, it is ALL OK. that it is not
real, this is an illusion. we chose this to have the experience, to learn, to
evolve and no matter how horrific something may seem, like 911, we chose
to experience it so that we can have the chance to forgive... gosh I hope
that makes sense.

let us remember... all we need is LOVE :wub2:

so, lets take this LOVE and spread it, share it, give it... we CAN tip the
scales, we CAN create anything we want. we CAN win the game.

~ I Love Us ~

[illuminate]

erqJF_ppqbk*

[Kulapops]

All we need is love :wub2:

I quite agree, and you, Illuminate have written here from the heart.

How good that feels to read. Truth. Your truth. In an alternative media full of extortions.

How different that reads to hearsay and speculation and fear based conjecture.

If only everyone would write and speak their truth from their heart, we would know each other so much better.

Thanks for your writing. Yes, forgiving ourselves is surely the first step, but using our hearts comes even before that i'm sure!

Peace n love n thanks

K

[Shaynard]

Beautiful thread illuminate... Thank you :)

Learning forgiveness is the lesson because it allows us to maintain our love at all times and therefor know it even more truly. Share it with everyone.

I forgive us, for we did not know... or rather .. could not remember.

Also, I forgive myself for what I have forgotten.

In light of love
Shaynard

[illuminate]

:wub2:

[Kulapops]

You know... it's worth bumping this thread... because I can see it slide idly into oblivion, while postings about the doings of the American administration and advance civilisation and all that claptrap you already know about because you've been mopping it up for the last year or so are riding high at the top of the Avalon hit parade.

So take a moment to ask yourself, who have you forgiven today ?

Forgiveness requires action, and reading about the various ends of the world in different scenarios only requires your attention and your energy to invest in hopelessness.

So c'mon... get with the love program. It's provable. Tell someone you love them, they feel great! You tell someone you forgive them - you feel better.

You read about Israel planning a war with Iran, how does that make you feel? Or about the American military moving into Haiti and making it into a large deep sea oil terminal ? Not good.

Bad news sells papers. Avalon seems to be no different. Watch all those really great and earnest posts slide away and drop off into the darkness.

This was one great heart thread I really enjoyed today. When it slips off the radar, will you come back here? Will you remember what was said?

Will we learn to forgive, too? Do you forgive Bush? Do you forgive Blair? Do you forgive the Illuminati?

Only when we can learn to forgive will we move forward, and the duality of right and wrong will become the unity that is love.

K

[Shaynard]

Today I have begun my day as I do everyday. Forgiving myself for forgetting.

Soon after I noticed that there was an "issue" within my home due to someone's poor decidsion. I smiled, and forgived them. Then proceeded to do my best to solve the "issue".

Next I knew I was reading some emails that contained some things I did not enjoy. I forgave those involved for their actions, and existence for allowing it to be so. I quickly saw "The Big Picture" so to speak, and found it all wonderful in a grand design.

JUST before this post, I was working with someone on another forum who was hurting themselves, and remaining very close minded and blind to themselves. During the conversation, I began to feel 'anger" and realized I must stop, center myself, forgive them, and send them my love.

This is a never ending process for me, one which I apply to my own life and the universe alike.. Centering.. Remembering.. Forgiving.. Loving.. Being.

In light, of love
Shaynard

[illuminate]

wow.

Kula that was so moving, it made me cry
tears of joy and love
you truly get it

and Shaynard, Astra, and everyone who has posted
or read with understanding...
you all remind me why I should always battle my ego

my ego tells me not to write posts like this
it told me not to start this thread
that no-one would care
no-one wanted to hear this
that it wouldn't matter
that it wouldn't make a difference

and I always hesitate to say anything
because I don't want it to be about me
but I feel if I don't share a true and intimate part of myself
then how could I ask you to share your love

you've really blown me away Kula...
AMEN my brother, I am so proud to be a part of you!
I AM so proud to be a part of each of you!!!

each and everyone of YOU makes a difference
everyday
with every thought

so please
I beg you
let's tip the scales and create the reality we all want


I love you!

[mudra]

http://fc08.deviantart.net/fs7/i/2005/237/f/0/Her_Flower_by_kittynn.jpg

One Love

mudra

[Kulapops]

my ego tells me not to write posts like this
it told me not to start this thread
that no-one would care
no-one wanted to hear this
that it wouldn't matter
that it wouldn't make a difference

and I always hesitate to say anything
because I don't want it to be about me
but I feel if I don't share a true and intimate part of myself
then how could I ask you to share your love


I love you!

You know Illuminate, I really wrestled with this when I first joined this forum... when I made my first posts.

If this Avalon community is really about building new ways and links between people, I should really keep my ego in check and see what is needed rather than bandy my tuppence about.

Because it's easy to see, early doors that there is a counter for how many people read the thread and also how many post to it. So it's easy for my ego to get trapped into the 'how well am I doing?' mode. 'How's my driving?' :original:

And it's quite shocking that the most heartfelt threads of truth disappear without a trace. Anyone remember Jenny32 or whatever she was called? How's she doing now? Put a thread up about something that can never be proven or verified as real, yet contains endless opinions.. and they run for weeks !

It's not what I thought Avalon was about... so I will always support the 'heart threads' Illuminate. It's what I signed up for. Wherever there is genuine interest in changing the world from the inside out, I will be there.

Ooh.. wait , no... my head's getting bigger again.. stop.. ah.. there. Ok.

gotta watch that :wink2:

Thanks for your thread Illuminate, we need that loving vibe here at Avalon sooo much...

K :wub2:

[Seashore]

...forgive your family, forgive your friends, your neighbors, your enemies,
yourself, your governments, the bad e.t.s... even forgive all the
malevolent beings too...

Thank you for your leadership. :wub2:

[Anchor]

Forgiveness is one of my favorite subjects, having recently realized how important it is for my own progress.

I roll these quotes out quite often - forgive me if you read it all before:

In the Law Of One, during an answer to a question about Jesus, "the entity" in the following quote (17.20) Ra stated When the entity had become able to integrate or synthesize all experiences, the entity began to speak to other-selves and teach/learn what it had felt during the preceding years to be of a worthwhile nature. The entity was absolved karmically of the destruction of an other-self when it was in the last portion of lifetime and spoke upon what you would call a cross saying, “Father, forgive them for they know not what they do.” In forgiveness lies the stoppage of the wheel of action, or what you call karma.

This set in motion a recurring line of questions and answers that went far through the subsequent Q&A's which I have always found fascinating and illuminating on the subject.

18.12 Questioner: You stated yesterday that forgiveness is the eradicator of karma. I am assuming that balanced forgiveness for the full eradication of karma would require forgiveness not only of other-selves but also the forgiveness of self. Am I correct?

Ra: I am Ra. You are correct. We will briefly expand upon this understanding in order to clarify.

Forgiveness of other-self is forgiveness of self. An understanding of this insists upon full forgiveness upon the conscious level of self and other-self, for they are one. A full forgiveness is thus impossible without the inclusion of self.

34.4 Questioner: Thank you. Would you define karma?

Ra: I am Ra. Our understanding of karma is that which may be called inertia. Those actions which are put into motion will continue using the ways of balancing until such time as the controlling or higher principle which you may liken unto your braking or stopping is invoked. This stoppage of the inertia of action may be called forgiveness. These two concepts are inseparable.

34.5 Questioner: If an entity develops what is called karma in an incarnation, is there then programming that sometimes occurs so that he will experience catalysts that will enable him to get to a point of forgiveness thereby alleviating the karma?

Ra: I am Ra. This is, in general, correct. However, both self and any involved other-self may, at any time through the process of understanding, acceptance, and forgiveness, ameliorate these patterns. This is true at any point in an incarnative pattern. Thus one who has set in motion an action may forgive itself and never again make that error. This also brakes or stops what you call karma.

It would seem to me that forgiveness and healing are interrelated to the extent that they are almost synonymous - the one cannot occur without the other.

> can you FORGIVE us

Yes.

A..

[Kulapops]

Thanks for the wonderful post Anchor...

Very enlightening.

These really are forgiving times!

I wonder how the New Threads board would read at Avalon if we were all enacting forgiveness ? Like this, perhaps ?:

"NASA witholds details of secret base on Mars - I forgive them !"

"Haiti overun by the American Military - I forgive us ! "

"4ft greys stole my grandmother, then made her watch porn - I forgive myself!"

:original:

K

Yes, I forgive myself... maybe that's the highest good we can do for planet Earth. Sod the baked bean collection, forgive yourself today ! lol

[Shaynard]

I forgive myself for the mistakes I will make today.

I forgive those I speak with who are still 'trapped in a box".

I forgive those who are caught by fear and confusion by the events of our world recently.

I forgive myself for "worrying" about it at all, ever.

I love you all and want whats best for you.

I forgive PA for being so active that some very beautiful threads get lost in the process.

I forgive myself for seeing anything as 'wrong" in the first place.


In light, of love
Shaynard

[Kulapops]

Thanks for your lead Shanyard.

Yes, I forgive anyone pursuing thoughts of doom and gloom on threads, I see my own anger at my own gullibility and not wishing to be foolish.

I forgive myself for being lazy and finding a virtual world at Avalon easier to fix than my own house and garden and certainly my own life!

I am grateful for everyone's truth, and everyone's lies, we are all one.

K

[futureyes]

i am so glad you listened to your inner voice over ego illuminate and began this thread ... i feel forgiveness ... really is the ticket to our freedom ...
only forgiveness transcends ego ... my how much pride we have in this world ... we have been so ingrained to remain so very rigid within our stubborness ... of continuing to protect that of which has no truth ... thereby allowing ego to govern all ...
forgiveness ... it is flexibility ... the ability to move ourselves from our old beliefs ... old patterns ... old ingraining ... and say to ourselves ... this no longer feels right ... it obviously no longer works in this world ...
and it is time ... for something different ...
and when we locate that soft spot within ourselves ... within all of our rigidness ... our ego ... when we finally locate that drop of forgiveness within our heart ... it no longer can remain a droplet ... it will expand within us ...
forgiving our own selves ... forgiving others ... forgiving what was ...
forgiveness within heart ... is our only way to move forward ...
matters not that others have not found their own droplet of forgiveness within for in time ... many will ...
matters that we do so now ... and expand our forgiveness ... remember the ripple effect ...
forgiveness is healing ... ours and the worlds ...
sometimes ... easier said than done isn't it ... like anything else ... it takes practise ... reading this thread alone ... we are well on our way ... :thumb_yello:
forgiveness ... transcends ego ... frees us from the cage of illusion ...
i forgive us ...
thank you again illuminate for this thread ... and others ... for posting your words of wisdom ... and writing from your hearts ...

:wub2:

[Anchor]

> forgiveness transcends ego

I see it similarly but I think forgiveness can only happen with each step that you make towards mastering, harnessing and understanding the ego for what it is.

Some refer to this as conquering, I used to think exactly that, but now I don't think its true.

Forgiveness is unconditional love under will - a conscious intent to resolve that which is forgiven.

I don't think it is instant an thing. It isn't in the words "I forgive". It requires a movement and an engagement of every conscious aspect of your beingness.

A very high degree of mastery would be required to simply say "I forgive you" and that be done completely.

I once forgave a man who stole money from me in the form of unpaid business invoices - I thought I was being clever at the time, I gave up chasing him down and shredded the invoices - I sort of forgave him. This was not an easy process for me and began with me wishing all sorts of nastiness on his business (for which I have no doubt paid a price!!).

Anyway once I let it go, for months I wondered if I had done the right thing - clearly I had resolved the situation or put it behind me - but if I had done it completely then how come I was still being troubled? Eventually I realised I had done the right thing in principle but for the wrong reasons - true forgiveness followed.

Therein I discovered that forgiveness is a process which in our 3D incarnation is more than just a fleeting intent. Full resolution takes time. (Time heals...) However, the better you get and the more detached you can be - the faster and more effective forgiveness will become.

A..

[Shaynard]

Very nice point of view Anchor. Thank you for sharing, and I "feel the same".


I forgive nature for doing what it must to balance itself.

I forgive myself for once again forgetting to call loved one's for no reason.

I forgive ego for wanting to be.

In light, of love
Shaynard

[illuminate]

^^ LOOK UP ^^
see all that love and wisdom flowing?
how could you not

so much wisdom in your posts
THANK each and every one of you, keep shining on!

:wub2: :wub2: :wub2: :wub2:

~ one love ~

[morguana]

="<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/3D4VMZb8wLY&hl=en_GB&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/3D4VMZb8wLY&hl=en_GB&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>"]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/3D4VMZb8wLY&hl=en_GB&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/3D4VMZb8wLY&hl=en_GB&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
:wub2:,
m x

[Anchor]

A tendril lashes out, a sharp word emitted in anger
The sting as the energy dissipates within the emotional body stirs the ego to action
But WAIT Mr Ego - my friend, we are not like that anymore! Nor shall we flatter you by allowing ourselves to grandstand over the forgiving of the attack, we will simply stay silent, or if offered, we will quietly accept ammends or apology.
No worries mate, it's nothing really, <because I love you>.

A..

[illuminate]

A tendril lashes out, a sharp word emitted in anger
The sting as the energy dissipates within the emotional body stirs the ego to action
But WAIT Mr Ego - my friend, we are not like that anymore! Nor shall we flatter you by allowing ourselves to grandstand over the forgiving of the attack, we will simply stay silent, or if offered, we will quietly accept ammends or apology.
No worries mate, it's nothing really, <because I love you>.

A..

:wub2:

[Shaynard]

I forgive myself for forgetting my dreams.

I forgive myself for punishing my body.

I forgive natural for the bitter cold.

I forgive my inability to adjust to it.

I forgive moments of anger and am thankful for the clearity they seem to bring afterwards.

I forgive fear for find it's way into our hearts.

I forgive our hearts from growing tired at times.

I LOVE the heart and how it always gets up and wins the battle.

In light, of love
Shaynard

[illuminate]

I refuse to be controlled or a battery or drug or energy source for any being

and I forgive them for trying :original:

~ love in you ~

[Mystic Pilgrim]

Illuminate and Anchor,

Thank you for your wise words. This thread seems to be God-given, as I was trying to figure out how life could be so downhill now when it seems to be so good just a few years back. I realized that I haven't "truly" forgiven a lot of people and things in the past - including myself.

A wise spiritual adviser told me once that we have to TRULY forgive ourselves to be able to move on with our lives. With forgiveness comes love in its truest form - for us, for our loved ones, for those who are in pain and those we have inflicted pain.

I pray that everyone finds true forgiveness and share the love that they are capable of giving not only to their family but friends but also for the whole of humanity.

Namaste.

Mystic Pilgrim

[shred]

="<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/3D4VMZb8wLY&hl=en_GB&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/3D4VMZb8wLY&hl=en_GB&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>"]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/3D4VMZb8wLY&hl=en_GB&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/3D4VMZb8wLY&hl=en_GB&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
:wub2:,
m x



So true, So beautiful

Love to all
Shred

[Kulapops]

Illuminate and Anchor,

Thank you for your wise words. This thread seems to be God-given, as I was trying to figure out how life could be so downhill now when it seems to be so good just a few years back.
Namaste.

Mystic Pilgrim

I think this is an important point... the more time we spend reading sad stories and horrible predictions, the more miserable life will seem. Because our power to change the illuminati or aliens is near zero. However, the power to change the self is within our grasp every second.

Life is Good... if we see it that way.

Just like the spanish inquisition.. if they finally do come knocking with the thumb screws, if you believe in a soul, then there really is nothing that can be taken from you, so why worry.

If you believe in a single consciousness, even the soul is expendable! That is, it is never lost because there is only one soul in the end...

K

[illuminate]

...
I pray that everyone finds true forgiveness and share the love that they are capable of giving not only to their family and friends but also for the whole of humanity.

Namaste.
Mystic Pilgrim

ME TOO! Thank you :wub2:

~ love in you ~

[Shaynard]

I forgive myself for what I've forgotten today.

I forgive myself for what I struggle to remember.

I forgive my friends for not understand "me" today.

I forgive me... I forgive us.. I forgive them.

I forgive and I love, and I am excited to be here still.

I forgive myself for asking to leave.

In light, of love
Shaynard

[Fredkc]

forgiveness is typically defined as the process of concluding resentment, indignation or anger as a result of a perceived offense, difference or mistake, and/or ceasing to demand punishment or restitution.

Forgiveness from others is an indication, but
Forgiveness of self is key.
When you no longer stand as your own accuser then "whatever it is" has truly fallen away.
Forgiveness is unconditional love under will - a conscious intent to resolve that which is forgiven.
In that process one ceases to re-create it, as well.

random thoughts...

[illuminate]

beautiful thoughts Fredkc, Thank you :wub2:

~ love in you ~

[mudra]

I found this nice story that fits so well the topic of your thread Illuminate ...

About a year ago, my boyfriend and I had split up. The cause for this had many elements that culminated to deliver the last blow. He was away from home often, I wasn't happy where we lived, our lives were quite stressful etc. etc. etc. You know the story. I was left devastated, with the wind completely knocked out of my sails so to speak. One morning I was standing in the shower when I experienced a rather persistent 'idea' coming to me. It was just one word: 'Forgiveness'. This, I thought was a bit strange... especially the fact that it wouldn't go away. It kept ringing at the back of my mind. Eventually, I sat down at the computer and Googled the word. I typed in 'forgiveness' and hit the enter button.

Loads of links popped up and I clicked on one randomly. Here, I discovered the story of a woman who had a similar nudging that I had had earlier that morning. Her problem however, was her father. He was a very militant type who never showed any emotion and was very aggressive, critical and just downright unavailable as a dad. She was interested in what Jesus had said about having to forgive seventy times seven times and decided that perhaps, there is a deeper meaning behind this than just taking it at face value.

Then, every day for seven days she sat down and wrote in long-hand: 'I forgive my father.' She noted that she really didn't mean it at the beginning, but that she kept going. It didn't matter that she didn't mean it initially. What did matter was that she was taking the first step towards releasing the poison of anger and bitterness that has imprisoned her for a lifetime. A while after this week of focused and structured forgiveness, she was visiting her parents. Over a period of time she had noticed a change in her old man, but by now the change was very evident and she commented on it to her mother. "Hasn't Dad just changed so much, Mom?" she said. "I know it sounds strange," her mother replied, "but it's only with you."

If you happen to be the person who wrote that story, I'd just like to thank you for paying it forward. It helped me to discover the power of forgiveness in my life. After having read it, I thought about it for a long time. Not without resistance either. There was no way I was going to spend the rest of my life making forgiveness lists. I simply didn't have the time and I get pretty bored pretty quickly. Then, one day, it dawned on me. I had to make a forgiveness rosary. I took 70 rose quartz beads and strung them up in a rosary fashion and every day for seven days, I would close my eyes and forgive the man out loud, as I moved from one bead to the next, using it as a sort of abacus of prayers. By saying one prayer for each bead you pull aside, one can safely remove your mind from counting. By the time you reach the knot, you know that you've said 70 prayers. This prayer has brought about some interesting events in my life.

The changes that happened were initially hardly visible and yet so powerful. We ended up getting back together again in the end and then, one day, upon my commenting on how much he's changed, he replied: "but I didn't try or do anything to change'. What I've learned about forgiveness is that it is a means of healing from within, above all else. The Forgiveness Prayer has become a part of my daily life now and I can recommend it to anyone who's ready to see the power of positive change happen in their lives & especially those who have difficult relationships with anyone from their parents to their spouse.

It will not always be easy and you will have to keep going at it, but the peace that comes from this prayer really is Divine and you will notice the change. Try it & then share it.

Love Always
mudra

[illuminate]

wow, Mudra, THANK U very much!!!

that is such a wonderful example...
and how very helpful that it includes
a practical application as well :original:

Thank you for thinking of us and sharing this :wub2:

~ love in you ~

[lilac]

I think it is important to mention Ho'oponopono here. This is the Hawaiian art of forgiveness, based on the understanding that we are all ONE and taking responsibility for the experience. It is easy to google and simple to learn. Another thing that has helped me tremendously with forgiveness is an oldish interview between David Wilcock and Larry Seyers, called "There's Only One of Us Here". Wilcock_Audioblog_2008.8.15.mp3 http://divinecosmos.com/index.php/start-here/larrys-corner/larry-articles/535-there-is-only-one-of-us-here

Part 1 and Part 2. I have listened to this over and over. It is funny and engaging. The idea about forgiveness that they discussed was that Forgiveness is the miracle that can change the timeline. That is an awesome thought to consider and an experiment worth trying. Thank you all for being Truth Seekers and for addressing an important issue like this that can really change the world.



.....sorry, first time posting a link... the above should work better:thumb_yello:

[No worries - I fixed it and merged the posts - A..]

[illuminate]

I think it is important to mention Ho'oponopono here. This is the Hawaiian art of forgiveness, based on the understanding that we are all ONE and taking responsibility for the experience. It is easy to google and simple to learn.

THANK U Lilac for this... I had never heard of Ho'oponopono,
THX for the introduction!
and Wilcock's "There's Only One of Us Here" is just brilliant,
a great reference for us all, thank you for sharing this.
He has such a wonderful way of summing things up!

The idea about forgiveness that they discussed was that Forgiveness is the miracle that can change the timeline. That is an awesome thought to consider and an experiment worth trying.

you bet it is!!! this is exactly what I believe as well.

forgiveness = freedom
fear binds the world and forgiveness sets it free

and the only way to experience true peace (inner peace) is
through forgiveness

in forgiving others, you are actually forgiving yourself

if you don't forgive, then you must judge

it also helps to remember that we are only capable of two emotions:
fear and love, that's it :original:

~ one love ~

[greybeard]

Thanks for starting this thread my friend.

Im not of any religion but the teachings of Jesus are a great influence on my life.
On the cross Jesus said " Forgive then for they know not what they do"
Basically they were spiritually ignorant.
I believe that Jesus came as a Saviour for all mankind and will intercede for us at the gates of heaven if we ask Him to. He also taught surrender or alignment to the will of God.

The Course in Miracles teaches there is nothing to forgive as we are one in Christ and it never happened. Basically the course says that we never left God we are dreaming our separation. The course is designed to awaken us from the dream.

When people give us a hard time its because they are not capable of doing otherwise.
We have the choice to take it personally or not.

There is a lovely story.
Two monks came acros a woman desperate to cross a swollen river.
The elder of the two chose to carry her across even though monks were not allowed to have physical contact with females and left her safely on the other side.

A few miles further on the younger monk remonstrated the other.
"Father you know it is forbidden to be in contact with a woman yet you carnied her across the river,"
The older one said. "Son I only carried her across the river you have been carrying her the last few miles"

People say and do things and if we are not carefully we can carry them for days.
Then who is hurting who?

Forgiveness is just letting go and being present in the eternal moment..

Past is history, future is mystery.

Chris
Namaste

[Anchor]

David Wilcock and Larry Seyers, called "There's Only One of Us Here".

Lilac

I listened to that as well last year - a quality chat between two friends.

My wife and I continually refer to Larry Seyers saying: "There is only one of us here!" - I'm changing my sig because of your post - thanks!

A..

[conjuredUp]

In my recent experience (because I am constantly changing and growing) I find forgiveness to be an extension of allowance. Of accepting what IS.

Time is an illusion as Mr. Wilcox states and so have many others. When we are seized up because of some event that occurred that our ego latches onto and forces us to relive over and over again, expecting a different outcome we are not accepting that event.

I've been working on allowing... allowing everything to be as it is. As it chooses to be. Who am I to ask anything or anyone to be any different than who or what they are? Even past events that caused me "trauma"? I am no better or lesser than any creature that has inhabited this, or any other planet.

When I ALLOW? There is nothing to forgive. There is only love.

Threads like this are the reason I stay on Avalon.
I love you, all. To the core.

LOVELOVELOVE,
C

[Anchor]

When I ALLOW? There is nothing to forgive. There is only love.

In so doing - you forgive. See how it works ?

A..

[mudra]

When I ALLOW? There is nothing to forgive. There is only love.

LOVELOVELOVE,
C

http://www.amtbweb.org/ecards/pix/Mindfulness/mcard2.jpg

I understand this Conjured up ...when we are completely in the present moment then mindfullness sets in . Mindfullness is nonjudgmental observation . It is the ability to observe without criticism. On sees then things without condemnation or judgement. One does'nt take sides as it's nonconceptual awareness that takes place without reference to self.
What we experience in deep meditation we extend to life itself and what is left in our present-time awareness is Love only. There is then indeed nothing to forgive for we carry no past judgment neither future expectations.

Love Always
mudra

[illuminate]

Good Day all you beautiful people!

Greybeard, I was hoping you'd chime in with your wisdom = )
THANK U, you always relay the best stories! and thx for bringing up the
Course in Miracles, the Course is what has really opened my eyes.

if anyone out there is wondering if the Course may be for them,
I highly recommend this book by Gary Renard called:

"The Disappearing Universe"
http://www.amazon.com/Disappearance-Universe-Straight-Illusions-Forgiveness/dp/0965680959

it's a wonderful precursor to the Course and even if your not interested
in the Course itself, it's a truly wonderful read!
from the cover...

"straight talk about illusions, past lives, religion and the miracles of forgiveness"

this book has helped me understand so much. it's super easy to read and even has
a wicked sense of humor. this is what has helped me understand the importance
of forgiveness and how to, especially with 911.

Renard's book gives a fantastic explanation of the ego too...
and as many of you know, our biggest battle in this experience is the ego.
oh that ego is trixie to say the least, Greybeard has a wonderful thread on
the ego here: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=18206

and conjuredUp... it is SO NICE to see you again, I remember you
and your love from avalon's inception. so glad to see you here now!
forgiveness, allowance, acceptance are kinda all in the same boat for
me and when you said:
"I've been working on allowing... allowing everything to be as it is. As it chooses to be."
me too! it took me a very long time to realize that no matter what anyone (of us)
chooses to do, whether it's saving a life or taking a life, that it's all just perfect! reminding
myself constantly that I AM the only one here helps me tremendously. to love a stranger
is to love myself. THANK U Mudra for bringing up mindfulness, as one of your beautiful
threads says: NOW IS LOVE

THANK U all for keeping this thread going, not for me, but for us!
it's SO easy to forget, and threads like this one and others on avalon that aren't
pushing fear, are the important reminders we all need. Blessings to us all = )

this is from the Course and I have made it my daily mantra:
seek not to change the world, but choose to change your mind about the world

~ love in us ~

http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac288/illuminate_photos/reach4stars.jpg

[greybeard]

THANK U all for keeping this thread going, not for me, but for us!
it's SO easy to forget, and threads like this one and others on avalon that aren't
pushing fear, are the important reminders we all need. Blessings to us all = )

this is from the Course and I have made it my daily mantra:
seek not to change the world, but choose to change your mind about the world


Yes its a great thread and it is so important to be positive.
Thanks also for your kind comments
Chris

[Shaynard]

I forgive myself for my absence and all I "left waiting" while I was ''away".

I forgive those who don't understand.

I forgive "him" for what "he" was trying to do.

I ask forgiveness for having to fight "him".

I forgive my ego for telling me it's 'all good", it's not.


I too greatly appreciate the teachings of "Jesus". Forgiveness, love, trust in oneself. Connection with the Mother and Father of our life here on "earth".

"Forgive them, for the do not know" is something I repeat to myself often.

I forgive my newest list of scars.

In light, of love
Shaynard

[mudra]

o-dHr_YihkQ

Love Always
mudra

[Seashore]

I'm listening to the archive of Freeman being interviewed by Henrik of Red Ice Creations (http://www.redicecreations.com/) during the 2nd hour on February 4, 2010, and what Freeman just said made me think about this thread.

They were talking about the New World order plans of the elite and how they go about achieving their goals.

The subject of 9-11 and the 9-11 truth movement has come up. Calling for justice is being explored, and Freeman has said that he "preaches forgiveness." He said that the elites want us to clamor for justice. He also pointed out that the elite are mind-controlled slaves themselves. I believe this to be true. So forgiveness is appropriate.

[Shaynard]

The subject of 9-11 and the 9-11 truth movement has come up. Calling for justice is being explored, and Freeman has said that he "preaches forgiveness." He said that the elites want us to clamor for justice. He also pointed out that the elite are mind-controlled slaves themselves. I believe this to be true. So forgiveness is appropriate.

Excellent... :thumb_yello: I agree completely and have been trying to express the same to friends. Thank you for sharing this..


I forgive my mistakes.. I did not know.

I forgive my mistakes.. I did know.

I forgive myself for not always being clear, and feeling I have to hide.

I forgive those who can't seem understand.

In light, of love
Shaynard

[Seashore]

Excellent... :thumb_yello: I agree completely and have been trying to express the same to friends. Thank you for sharing this..

You're welcome.

If we were to actually do this, it would free up a lot of energy for positive, life-affirming, action, wouldn't it?

[Shaynard]

You're welcome.

If we were to actually do this, it would free up a lot of energy for positive, life-affirming, action, wouldn't it?

Yes it definitely would. There are many things that have happened.. that are terrible. We all wish they had not happened, but.. we also can't change the past. So we learn from it, find our way to understand it.. and if we can forgive it.. We can let it go. Less energy spent on negative situations (without turning a "blind eye" to them either) will always get my vote.

In light, of love
Shaynard

[Seashore]

Yes it definitely would. There are many things that have happened.. that are terrible. We all wish they had not happened, but.. we also can't change the past. So we learn from it, find our way to understand it.. and if we can forgive it.. We can let it go. Less energy spent on negative situations (without turning a "blind eye" to them either) will always get my vote.

In light, of love
Shaynard

Thank you! I think this post sums things up very wisely! Especially not turning a blind eye. You're talking about dealing with the truth, with love.

[illuminate]

"Forgiveness is the fragrance that the violet sheds on the heal that has crushed it."
- Mark Twain

"Eating words has never given me indigestion."
- Sir Winston Churchill

"The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of the strong."
- Mahatma Gandhi

"Always forgive your enemies - nothing annoys them so much."
- Oscar Wilde

~ one love ~