Cults!

[Anchor]

INTERNET CULTS

The following information is presented for you, charged with the intent to help others avoid the subtle deceit of the internet cult.

In one way, you can read it as about mental clarity and hygiene, another way you can read it as light vs dark.

The core message is: take good care that you detect and if necessary avoid cult led thinking and thought-forms. Grasp your sword of truth, and with it excise such darkness from your life. What you read and accept is your responsibility. You can accept or reject whatever you like, and it must be you that does it.

I am not a qualified person. I expect that qualified readers will read this document and it is my hope they will add their professional clarity thereby enriching my message. The information below should be filtered knowing that I have claimed no authority and it should be rejected if found to be in error when tested within your-self.

It has been my observation that internet based cults start in easily identifiable stages, and each stage is accompanied by certain traits. These observations have enabled me to put together some information that may be able to work as a detection kit.

Here is a simple check list that I use to identify “cults”, “cult like thinking” and “cult formation”

1) First stage (Preparation/Introduction)
a. Enigmatic, new and unusually different thinking
b. Charismatic powerful personalities
c. Rigorous politeness and charm
d. Flattery – the less control of your ego you have, the easier that gets!

2) Second stage (Cultivation)
a. Unfolding of a stream of new and interesting information
b. Employment of devices used to create and maintain the drip feed of new (often these ones are making it up as they go along)
c. Use of anticipation as a means to create an atmosphere of expectancy – most often seen as the requirement to wait until certain dates before things happen or information is revealed
d. Many devices employed to emphasize the importance of the leader (extreme busyness, fragility, short temper, intolerance, hidden knowledge etc) [these traits are often suppressed at first, until they can be excused by those being hooked in]

It is important to state that up to stage (2) it is just as likely that you are seeing the presentation of information in good faith but by someone with a flair for the dramatic, or by someone with genuine hard to control constraints on their time etc. It is the stages after this that are the real defining point where serious attention needs to be placed on the process, because at this point several red flags should be being raised. Even if the person leading this process doesn’t know it, they are entering territory where it is very easy to mislead and unwittingly override the audience/members better judgement.

Cult groups maturing beyond the formative stages above, may well have formed by the coming together of: Genuinely real information, naturally and innocently dramatic presentation. However at this point, the messenger or emerging “leader” is ripe for external subversion and compromise by dark forces on the lookout for any suitable “channel” through whom they may gain magnified expression.

Therefore what can start innocently can easily move on to stage (3) but at this point the original messenger is not really working for his or her own original agenda – having been either obsessed or possessed by external and malevolent forces. Typically in the accidental situation you have a messenger with an under developed levels of psychic defence, distorted ego, personal issues that provide the necessary chinks in the armour for this to happen.

3) Third stage (Separation and Inculcation) This is the phase that really should be prompting you to tread extremely carefully and turn up the levels of discrimination and personal protection
a. Each member of the audience is contacted and invited to a special group /forum /meeting place. The internet provides many mechanisms for this where the work and succeeding stages can be followed
b. More details are bought forth as in stage 2, but only revealed to the separated members (generally speaking those that bought into the initial story) – at this point the members are being subjected to repeating information and reinforcement that they are special or different
c. Peer pressure will start to be cultivated, peer pressure is an essential part of stage 3 because this is one of the pre-cursors to the effectiveness of later stages and one of the means to prevent escape

People who have recently undergone significant personal consciousness changes or transpersonal experiences are especially weakened to the malevolent, obsessive or seductive forces involved in the move to stage three. People in that situation are best advised to get away from the new information – spend a few days grounding themselves and assimilating the experiences before rushing into new ones – so that the inner eyes can remain open and you can return with inner clarity before proceeding under un-encumbered freewill.

Later stages of cults will include some, all or a selection of the following - any time you see anyone of these, your bull**it detectors, and incoming darkness meter should hit the red zone, flags should wave and alarms go off.

• The requirement for attending physical meetings: with no regard to the cost or inconvenience.
• The requirement for you to change your lifestyles in some way, in ways you would not naturally have considered
• Initially some, but increasing or total financial involvement
• Mind control techniques that cannot easily be applied using the internet/written word: Love bombing, sleep deprivation, enforced intense study, repetition, sexual distractions, etc
• The requirement for you to be separated from your worldly assets and emotional support structures, family, friends etc.
• Assignment of special missions, titles or qualities
• Requirement to protect and fight for the leader!

A lot of the control techniques exerted on a cult member are very similar to the kinds of obsessive controls exerted by men in dominating or abusive co-dependent relationships. I have past experience of situations wherein men have controlled every aspect of their spouse’s lives so that they are completely trapped. In many ways escaping from a cult (deep into stage 4 in terms of this essay) is very similar to the challenge of escaping from a psychotic partner and a co-dependent relationship.

I was approached recently by a woman involved in a situation very similar to the above, which had just had a near miss, but owing to her inner honesty and spiritual maturity had reacted well when the first feelings arose that something was not right. I was able to spontaneously produce the following message that I feel was strongly inspired by my higher self and that was affirmative of the correctness of the course adjustment taken: I reproduce it here because it is actually relevant not just to her, but anyone who gets into a situation with what may turn out to be a cult and then changes their mind.

“********, you get to make all the decisions that affect your life and your future – every single one. Saying no and resisting trickery and pressure is your birthright. It is perfectly ok to have been down a path, and decided that it may be better to get to where you planned on, and then going by a different one. In making these decisions you must come first, because you are responsible for the outcomes of all of them. Putting others before yourself, especially people that you don’t really know should not really be a primary factor in making those decisions”

My feeling is that situations come along in life that change us, or change our friends. In rare cases these are divisive. As we all evolve it can often be the case that we separate, and the likeness attracting likeness moves us to a new group. This can, sadly, be the ending of some friendships in a 3D sense.

My humble request is that you carefully assess the motives behind all of the online structures and organizations that you encounter on the internet. Do this just as you would structures and organizations in real life, examine them in the light of common sense and allow the infinite inner love and wisdom guide your actions.

I honestly believe that I have written the above in the light and in the love of the one infinite creator – in whom I ask for the guidance and protection of all, and for the highest and best good of all!

Love

AJ..

[rhythm]

http://www.shopatoz.tv/images/uploads/follow%20your%20heart_full.jpg

you make some very good points here Anchor ..:thumb_yello:

im coming to the end of my journey here (duality)

and all i can realy say to you all is

i traveld many paths ...

heard great men and wimon speak ( and some dodgy ones too:lol3:)

but now i learned .. somtimes the hard way :wall

that the truth is in me ..so simple .. :original:

follow your heart .:wub2:. try not to lie to youself ..:nono:

forgive.. be.. commpasionate...take care of you ...

your worth it :wub2:love always rhythmmm:wub2:

A great and timely post Anchor....

[Oliver]

Just excellent, Anchor!

[Malletzky]

I honestly believe that I have written the above in the light and in the love of the one infinite creator – in whom I ask for the guidance and protection of all, and for the highest and best good of all!

Love

AJ..

You certainly did mate :thumb_yello:

love back to you :wub2:
malletzky

[morguana]

INTERNET CULTS

I honestly believe that I have written the above in the light and in the love of the one infinite creator – in whom I ask for the guidance and protection of all, and for the highest and best good of all!

Love

AJ..

and i believe that you have too, such a super post anchor, i hope it gets read by many here.

love and light to you
m x

[greybeard]

Hi Anchor
What you say is very accurate and good guidance.
Following your heart is not.
Everyone attracted into a cult thinks they are following their heart.
Till the third eye opens we can be led into all kinds of trouble for the right reasons.
Discernment and discrimination are very important after all it is your soul.
Dr David Hawkins in his book "Truth versus Falsehood" gives similar guidance to Anchor and suggests some safe paths/ teachers to follow.

Chris
Namaste

[Ross H]

Supreme post,

:winksmiley02:

[mudra]

INTERNET CULTS

“********, you get to make all the decisions that affect your life and your future – every single one. Saying no and resisting trickery and pressure is your birthright. It is perfectly ok to have been down a path, and decided that it may be better to get to where you planned on, and then going by a different one. In making these decisions you must come first, because you are responsible for the outcomes of all of them. Putting others before yourself, especially people that you don’t really know should not really be a primary factor in making those decisions”

Love

AJ..

I believe this is what it takes to know one's heart and live by it .

Thank you

Love Always
mudra

[Aztar]

Great work Anchor :)


Here is a quick clue for cult identification, cult members are prone to gang up on anyone they feel is a detractor and try to bait them with questions to deflect any serious questions put to them about there organization.

pPol_m8wm8Y

Also cults can use techniques that were originally perfected by the CIA, as in "Asset" acquirement, manipulation & control though well thought out and planed seemingly random events around a "Asset" that lead them down a structured path they believe they found on there own.

Think I've had any run ins with cults, you betcha I have.

[Céline]

Some how i completly relate to the guy holding th camera...

Great post Aztar..Great thread Anchor

[Jay]

Thank you for this posting! :original:

[pureheart7]

Excellent~~Thank You. Free Will is a topic worth discussing.

[Frank Samuel]

Thank you anchor . Through my travels I was involved with many groups and yes every group tells you that following them is the way to salvation, bad things will happen to those that do not follow their rules, It is a way to try and control your mind and emotions. The sharing with others inside of these groups create friendships that trap you into staying within these groups. I was kicked out of a few groups and others I decided to leave.:lol3:
The way to establishing a heart to heart connection to the origin of all things is within you , you do not need to follow anyone, much less these groups .
You have the power to transform your life to achieve happiness and inner peace. The answers to all of your questions are found within you.
For me this is one of the reasons I am so emphatic about being your own person, reclaiming your sovereignty. Too many people around the world get trap by many of these groups some for their entire lifetime. Is time to wake up , become independent, the spiritual journey is different for all of us yet our destination is the same, shed your attachments to these groups and follow your own path, you'll be okay . Thank you Anchor for the post.

Blessings to all..:original::thumb_yello::wub2::wub2::wub2:

[justpeter]

Aztar, I'm not sure how appropriate that Scientology video is to this thread. I'm not aware of Scientology being an "Internet Cult". I was in Scientology for over 15 years and I didn't associate it particularly with this thread until I saw your post.

Yes, it could be called a cult but in my opinion it contains a huge amount of valuable information which was vitally necessary for my spiritual growth. Would I recommend the Church of Scientology to anyone else? Absolutely not, but I would recommend Scientology tech to anyone so long as they got the data from the freezone (outside of the official church).

Scientology is a HUGE subject and it is easy to dismiss it as only a cult. In my opinion it deserves a more measured type of discussion.

That's my two-cents worth.

Peter

[futureyes]

thank you anchor ... wonderful post ...
we are human ... at times we place more trust in another or others than we place in our own selves ... giving up our power in the interim ...
come to the realization of what truly is actual ... take back our power and return to self for the wiser ...
sometimes a quick realization of truth ... sometimes truth to surface is a greater challenge for us ... the lesson takes longer ... those paths we chose leading us deeper and further from our truth ...
discernment indeed ... coupled with what we feel to be appropriate within our hearts ...
we may be led astray ... it is within everyone's free will ... to return to our own truth ... what feels true ... appropriate ...
internet cults and individual manipulators ... are everywhere ... we should not be so naive to think they are not ... for they are ...
be true to yourself ... as rhythm wrote ... try not to lie to our selves ...
only we can know ... our own truth ...
our own truth ... can only be found within our own core ... no where else ...
when another or others 'tell' you ... your truth is this or it is that ... however neatly it is packaged and presented ... red flags should appear ...
no one knows your truth ... only you do ...
frank samuel ... thank you for your words ...
anchor ... my hope is that everyone reads your post ...

:wub2:

[Stardustaquarion]

Thank you Anchor, excelent post!:thumb_yello:

That is why, and because of previous experiences that I know that the only way forward is to follow oneself

Self empowerment
Self Love
Self responsibility

:wub2:

[Myplanet2]

Excellent post AJ. Great bunch of info to add to the filters.

I'd add that it's not likely that Cult leaders follow some scripted play book when collecting a following, and so may not necessarily follow the above broader strokes in sequence.

Your heart doesn't lie. It's not capable of it. The more one centers their consciousness in their heart, the less they can be led astray.

We're in the relative no-mans-land between the 3rd and 5th dimensions. thinking mind is the filter for the 3rd and heart is the filter for the 5th. Learning to separate them in ones discernment is the key, or one of the keys. They are both valid filters, but the mind is immersed in illusions and accepts illusions as real. The Heart never makes that mistake.

As in your advice at the bottom of your post, each must do their own discerning and decision making. The process must be respected, or it is bypassed and nothing is learned.

There can be a temptation to "stop" someone from being drawn into a cult. There can be a lining up in opposition to a cult. But that level of play draws on 3D structures, not 5D. 5D is a place of balance where the heart is simply trusted, because it is never in error. And part of that trust is a trust in others to have the same facility available to them, as well.

Who knows what another's life path is. perhaps being drawn into a cult is a big part of it. Since the mind is accepting and even reinforcing of illusions, often we don't even know what our own lifes path is, until we exit a chapter with some great lesson learned. The proverbial "Aha...That's what that was all about". The Silver lining which emerges from the cloud.

Our higher selves set up some pretty dramatic experiences here in 3D, and it is easy to believe they weren't something we were arranging for ourselves as an opportunity to grow and understand, and exceed previous limitations.

The significance of the Laws from the handbooks grows as our experiences grow to embrace them. The laws of attraction, allowance, deliberate intent and balance all mean more to me than they did when I first read about them. balance requires the other 3 in order to come online. This then begs the question about whether we interfere with another's efforts at achieving balance, if we do not "allow" them to "attract" to them factors which will put them on a fence which they must then use their personal discernment to arrive at a decision which permits "deliberate intent".

Any situation can be approached from a bottom up or a top down perspective. Top down grants others their Godhood, and says I know you'll be ok, no matter what you choose. Bottom up says, "you better watch out, I smell danger for you!!", and it can be kind of undermining, even when the intentions are purly loving.

[HORIZONS]

Very good post .. much wisdom within it.

[stal]

good post anchor.

I'd add that it's not likely that Cult leaders follow some scripted play book when collecting a following, and so may not necessarily follow the above broader strokes in sequence.

if you look into it, a lot of them kinda do.

[Aztar]

Aztar, I'm not sure how appropriate that Scientology video is to this thread. I'm not aware of Scientology being an "Internet Cult". I was in Scientology for over 15 years and I didn't associate it particularly with this thread until I saw your post.

Yes, it could be called a cult but in my opinion it contains a huge amount of valuable information which was vitally necessary for my spiritual growth. Would I recommend the Church of Scientology to anyone else? Absolutely not, but I would recommend Scientology tech to anyone so long as they got the data from the freezone (outside of the official church).

Scientology is a HUGE subject and it is easy to dismiss it as only a cult. In my opinion it deserves a more measured type of discussion.

That's my two-cents worth.

Peter

I hear you justpeter.

The title of the thread is Cults, i wouldn't get to picky with the Internet cults part.

A cult by any other name is still a cult, the same tactics apply, I'm aware that the early work done by Scientology was extremely beneficial to the early practitioners but that was then and this is now and what it is now is a cult. (freezone excluded)

Something that starts out as helpful and beneficial can also be infiltrated and changed from the inside to another agenda.

I could just as easily have used Landmark or Moonies as an example but i chose that video because it shows Tactics.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Found some other information that may be helpful.

WHAT ARE CULTS?

The term "cult" is something that is very difficult to define. There are many different forms of cults, and precise definitions are often difficult. There are many negative stereotypes that also exist. Supporters and members often refer to cults as "new religions" or part of the new religious movement which gives them a little more credibility. Some definitions of cults are.

"a religious movement which makes a fundamental break with the religious traditions of the culture and which is composed of individuals who had or seek mystical experience (Galanter)."

"a group or movement exhibiting a great or excessive devotion or dedication to some person, idea or things, and employing unethical, manipulative or coercive techniques of persuasion and control (e.g. isolation from former friends and family, debilitation, use of special methods to heighten suggestibility and subservience, powerful group pressures, information management, promotion of total dependency on the group and fear of leaving it, suspension of individuality and critical judgment, and so on, designed to advance the goals of the group's leaders, to the possible or actual detriment of members, their families, or the community (West)."

"a highly manipulative group which exploits its members and can cause psychological, financial and physical harm. It dictates in an absolute manner the behaviour, thoughts and emotions of its followers. Manipulation techniques are used to transform the new recruit into a loyal, obedient and subservient member (Info-Cult)."

While a specific definition of a "cult" may be difficult, there are several common factors that seem to be a part of the kinds of cults that raise concern. While every group is different in their specific beliefs and rituals, some more common factors of cults are:

* has a living leader;
* cult doctrine based on leaders' techniques and beliefs;
* members adhere to leaders' beliefs;
* leader may claim special powers or connection to a higher being;
* leader is sole judge of dedication and quality of member's faith
* leader may be very comfortable while members suffer (leader may eat while others starve; leader may have sex while others remain celibate);
* leader may predict the end of the world;
* cult may say that it works to save the world but helps no one outside the cult;
* daily work demeaning;
* cults provide salvation - anyone outside cult is evil;
* members must cut self off from past life;
* ego destruction and thought control;
* questioning religion and criticism frowned upon - sign of bad faith; intolerance of other beliefs;
* individuality frowned upon;
* emphasize moneymaking;
* structure and discipline;
* non traditional religion;
* no grey area - everything and everyone is either right or wrong; pure or evil;
* members give up right to think and decide for themselves;
* use manipulative and unethical means to get members - i.e. do not provide a full explanation of who group is and what they do.

Source: http://www.victimsofviolence.on.ca/rev2/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=337&Itemid=27

[orthodoxymoron]

Thank-you for posting this Anchor. Perhaps we need to be saved from our saviors. My guess is that a lot of people (and aliens?) start out with good intentions...which subsequently pave the road to hell. I don't really know what the proper balance point is regarding leaders and followers. Perhaps a leader who teaches followers to be leaders is a good sign. Perhaps we need a plurality of facilitators rather than leaders. I don't know. I watched an interview with L. Ron Hubbard which I thought was very good...but I wouldn't touch Scientology with a 100 foot pole. I grew up in a church which many have called a cult. I later attended a megachurch headed by an extremely charismatic and articulate televangelist...with cultish characteristics. I ended up being disillusioned by both organizations...although I learned a lot from both of them. Perhaps the bottom-line is that "Power Corrupts. Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely." Perhaps the first and last commandment should be "Thou Shalt Have No Gods". Perhaps all paths are problematic...and that we should not have unreasonable expectations.

'Called to Be Free' is a video about the upheaval and transformation in the Worldwide Church of God. Even if you are not interested in religion or spirituality...it is a case study in human behavior, group sociology...and how change occurs in a religious organization...or any organization. YouTube - Called To Be Free (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WMGJERAGMT4) What happened to these people can happen to you or me. It's about leadership, abuse of power, gullibility, money, etc. Learn from other people's mistakes. People can dispense with one delusion...and accept another to replace the first. How about everything being up for grabs...all the time? Is this too emotionally upsetting? We desire certainty and peace...yet the world around us is constantly changing...and people and paradigms are in collision. Do we have to lie to ourselves and others...and live in a dreamworld...in order to find peace with ourselves and others? Can New Agers be just as deluded as the Old Agers? Can a very cool and hip new age guru take people for a ride just as easily as a Bible-thumping fundamentalist egomaniac in a megachruch? I'm beginning to despair regarding learning the lessons necessary to properly conduct business on Earth. The propensity of humanity toward delusion is disillusioning...to say the least. The gravitation toward sensation...will sink us. The lessons which one can learn from this video...can be applied to all religious and philosophical systems...especially where charismatic leaders and group peer-pressures are involved. One can think that they are right...and that there is no way that they could be wrong...yet in a few short months or years...they can find themselves drowning in disillusionment. I predict that there will be videos similar to this one regarding the New Age Movement. People have been burned over and over again...throughout the centuries. Please learn the lessons derived from the rude awakenings of the people in this video...and apply these lessons to the contemporary alternative thinking scene. I realize that we need to rethink everything...but that we need to rethink our rethinking...in most cases.

:original:Namaste:original:

[Steven]

Wow! Thank you so much for this Anchor. Very well presented and rounded. I agree with all you said and it is very timely and precious to all of us here. :thumb_yello:

Namaste, Steven

[Majorion]

Doesn't the Council of Thuban constitute an internet cult, correct me if I'm wrong.

[Aztar]

Doesn't the Council of Thuban constitute an internet cult, correct me if I'm wrong.


oh boy!

GRENADE!!

*leaps for cover*

[Stardustaquarion]

Doesn't the Council of Thuban constitute an internet cult, correct me if I'm wrong.

I think it fits the bill quite smugly but I also think that it is better to let the matter rest and do not add more fuel to the fire

We have spent so much energy already!

I wish there is a win win situation on this one but it takes two to tango:wink2:

Love

[Stardustaquarion]

Thank-you for posting this Anchor. Perhaps we need to be saved from our saviors.
:original:Namaste:original:

The problem is to identify why we need saviours and why we can not save ourselves

While there is much to re member is always useful to ask oneself if what it is on offer helps to empower or disempower oneself

Most of the free information out there is plain bs tha one can spend lifetimes reading and finish empty handed

The alarm bells for me start sounding when someone says follow me...you don't need to think or know just follow me I know what I am doing.....

Love

[swordsmith]

A lot of people have no idea they are even in a cult. By increments they are led piece by piece down the path thinking it IS in line with their freewill. It's only much later one might look back and say ...hmmmmm. Sometimes the cult leaders start out with good intentions , but go bad. Power corrupts, the ego is a hungry monkey and there are plenty of well meaning people with peanuts galore to give away.

I maintain the thought that nobody is who you think they are online until you have met them in the flesh, that's kind of why we have bodies. The body picks up many things the brain alone does not and the internet is an ideal place for role playing and editing . So many people just dying to give away their power. I guess because they want to be part of something greater.
You already are.

[orthodoxymoron]

Don't mess with the Thubans!! :nono: The Empire might strike back!! :shocked: This could result in the Thuban Missile Crisis!! :mfr_omg:
Here is a lecture given at MIT regarding how good people turn evil. http://mitworld.mit.edu/video/459 This lecture can help to explain how leaders and followers can go downhill...sometimes very quickly. I think this applies to the 'cult' topic. The following introduction was taken from the MIT website:

Perhaps no one comprehends the roots of depravity and cruelty better than Philip Zimbardo. He is renowned for such research as the Stanford Prison Experiment, which demonstrated how, in the right circumstances, ordinary people can swiftly become amoral monsters. Evil is not so much inherent in individuals, Zimbardo showed, but emerges dependably when a sequence of dehumanizing and stressful circumstances unfolds. It is no wonder then, that Zimbardo has lent both his expertise and moral outrage to the case of U.S. reservists who perpetrated the abuses at Abu Ghraib prison.

Zimbardo’s latest book, The Lucifer Effect, attempts to understand “how good people do evil deeds.” His talk outlines his involvement as expert witness for the defense team of one of the military police officers responsible at Abu Ghraib, and also provides a rich history of psychological research into the kind of behavior transformations evident in Iraq. First, Zimbardo presents a slideshow of Abu Ghraib abominations, including some digital photos that were not widely distributed by the media. Then he digs deep into the archives for a horrifically illustrated tour of experiments that make a persuasive case that certain, predictable situations corrupt people into wielding power in a destructive way.

He describes Stanley Milgram’s 1963 Yale-based research demonstrating that people will behave sadistically when confronted by “an authority in a lab coat.” A vast majority of the subjects delivered what they were told were dangerous electric shocks to a learner in another room, to the point of apparently killing the other person. Researchers skeptical of his results replicated them. This time, professors demanded that students shock real puppies standing on electrified grills. Zimbardo’s own prison experiment turned an ordinary group of young men into power-hungry “guards,” humiliating equally ordinary “prisoners” in the basement of Stanford’s psychology building. The descent into barbarity was so rapid that Zimbardo had to cancel the experiment after a few days.

The recipe for behavior change isn’t complicated. “All evil begins with a big lie,” says Zimbardo, whether it’s a claim to be following the word of God, or the need to stamp out political opposition. A seemingly insignificant step follows, with successive small actions, presented as essential by an apparently just authority figure. The situation presents others complying with the same rules, perhaps protesting, but following along all the same. If the victims are anonymous or dehumanized somehow, all the better. And exiting the situation is extremely difficult.

Abu Ghraib fit this type of situation to a T, says Zimbardo. The guards, never trained for their work helping military interrogators, worked 12-hour shifts, 40 days without a break, in chaotic, filthy conditions, facing 1,000 foreign prisoners, and hostile fire from the neighborhood. They operated in extreme stress, under orders to impose fear on their prisoners. Zimbardo believes the outcome was perfectly predictable, and while never absolving these soldiers of personal responsibility, believes justice won’t be done until “the people who created the situation go on trial as well: George Tenet, Donald Rumsfeld, Dick Cheney and George Bush.”

:original: Namaste :wink2: Constitutional :wink2: Responsible :wink2: Freedom :original:

[FIIISH]

Great thread, Anchor.

As an ex-Jehovah's Witness, I can attest to the power of the cult
influence and the difficulty one can encounter when disentangling.

I have not had a relationship with numerous family members for over 14 years
due to leaving this particular cult....

I think this particular experience served multiple purposes for
me and was integral to my growth. Painful, but necessary....

[TruthWillSetUFree]

Excellent post Anchor! One we should all heed its message


I couldn't help but wonder about the timing of it

As we are working on necessary 'triggers' to transcend their duality

It is remarkable how the deepest most misunderstood energy we have yet to understand fully would be of a sexual nature


It has triggered an enormous amount of negativity here when just hours ago we were all loving one another

Just an observation

I love you all Truthfully Profoundly and Honestly

Mary

[Stardustaquarion]

Hi orthodoxymoron

Thank you for your post, will read it later. I posted a link to another theory/book yesterday that deals with cognitive disonance (mistakes were made but not by me - booK :lmao:)

The way people come to terms with things that are unethical is by telling themselves that they are doing it for the good of humanity:nono: Is a form of self lie. Of course there is always a boss and money or salaries involved, black mail etc.

I don't know how the bosses deal with it but I am sure is the same principle "oh you ignorant mortals, the world will be better without you" or "we are better than you therefore we deserve more" kind of thing

When I read the book my jaw dropped:jawdrop:

Many people justify their behaviour by saying "oh is just business" as if the fact that they are producing money is a kind of license to kill

The root of the problem seems to be the philosophy of "survival of the fitest" and "the end justify the means"

Awfully interesting

Love

[Fredkc]

1. Great thread, Anchor. A tough, and valuable lesson for people to learn.

2. If the term "Cognitive Dissonance" (http://fredsitelive.com/reference/CognitiveDissonance.htm) is new to anyone, here is a short (10 paragraphs) description of the term, and how it works.

Fred

[mntruthseeker]

Fantastic Information Anchor, as usual coming from you

You have a fantastic insight


IMO, all religious organizations would be considered a cult.

[swordsmith]

Good article on cognitive dissonance, Fredkc. For example , on this forum, and we know that IS what we are really talking about, there is a lot of feeling if you are not positive and telling everybody you love them all the damn time that you are a curmudgeon. Fine, so be it. I dont love ANYONE on this forum, I don't actually KNOW anyone here, but the love thing and valueing it , makes people afraid of anything that might upset the apple cart, or Bill and Kerry having a split, or Thuban whatever causing hard feelings.
I DON'T CARE , what I care about is the truth and what that means to me. I still wish everyone " love " here, but it ain't personal, and if I don't like something, if I can be bothered, and if I think it might be useful I will say my piece, and that's why a lot of mind control goes over my head. Precisely because I don't care what anyone here thinks of me.
A wise woman I heard lecture a long time ago asked a room full of people what they would sell out for. Many people responded that they thought most people did for money and power, she shocked a lot of people by simply asking," and what about love?"
If I don't have a meal, or say, a disagreement with someone, then how can I know who the hell they are? I have no idea who Bill and Kerry are, so how would I really know their intentions?
I have no doubt that to some people here, this IS a cult.

[Fredkc]

My humble request is that you carefully assess the motives behind all of the online structures and organizations that you encounter on the internet. Do this just as you would structures and organizations in real life, examine them in the light of common sense and allow the infinite inner love and wisdom guide your actions.

Having been "out amung'em" in this arena for nearly 35 years, I would strongly suggest you not limit this advice to the online arena.

Fred's 2 cents worth

[orthodoxymoron]

Good article on cognitive dissonance, Fredkc. For example , on this forum, and we know that IS what we are really talking about, there is a lot of feeling if you are not positive and telling everybody you love them all the damn time that you are a curmudgeon. Fine, so be it. I dont love ANYONE on this forum, I don't actually KNOW anyone here, but the love thing and valueing it , makes people afraid of anything that might upset the apple cart, or Bill and Kerry having a split, or Thuban whatever causing hard feelings.
I DON'T CARE , what I care about is the truth and what that means to me. I still wish everyone " love " here, but it ain't personal, and if I don't like something, if I can be bothered, and if I think it might be useful I will say my piece, and that's why a lot of mind control goes over my head. Precisely because I don't care what anyone here thinks of me.
A wise woman I heard lecture a long time ago asked a room full of people what they would sell out for. Many people responded that they thought most people did for money and power, she shocked a lot of people by simply asking," and what about love?"
If I don't have a meal, or say, a disagreement with someone, then how can I know who the hell they are? I have no idea who Bill and Kerry are, so how would I really know their intentions?
I have no doubt that to some people here, this IS a cult.

What a profound comment swordsmith! Benevolent neutrality may be a good thing. Love often equals Submission. I don't love or hate the Thubans (if they exist). I don't love or hate demonic beings (I know they exist). I just want the truth...and a more sane way to manage the insanity. Please watch the entire M.I.T. video. It gets better and more relevant as it procedes. This is subtle stuff folks. None of us are above being taken-in by all manner of BS. None of us should be here trying to win a popularity contest. I know that I post things that make people angry. I don't do it to be mean. I do it to try to make things better...whether anyone likes it or not.

:original: Namaste :wub2: Constitutional :wink2: Responsible :wub2: Freedom :original:

[Stardustaquarion]

What a profound comment swordsmith! Benevolent neutrality may be a good thing. Love often equals Submission.

:original: Namaste :wub2: Constitutional :wink2: Responsible :wub2: Freedom :original:

Well this is the problem, unconditional love is unconditional but uncompromisable as well

If we compromise our principles to be popular we begin a cycle of cognitive disonance and co dependency

Sometimes, tough love is more real than pleasing people because that way people have the opportunity to see things that may assist them

There is a lot of confusion in the world about what love means. From my perspective love can not be conditional or be held to expectations, that is not love is need

Love:wink2:honestly

[sjkted]

Interesting you brought this up. The first thing that came to mind is David Wilcock's forum at divinecosmos.com.

--sjkted

[Church]

Oh MAN that video is funny! :naughty:

[swordsmith]

and actually, I am a very loving person. In the personal realm it grows naturally from experience and trust, in the impersonal realm, such as here, it is only because I care immensely that I post at all . Wishing the best for all means we have to be on our toes in order to SEE the way the wool is constantly pulled over our eyes all under the guise of our own projected good intentions . I can not say it enough the projections are what enable the bad peope to get away with it and they LOVE it,( theres the love word for you.)
Many actually operate from the place of the glorification of their own egos even if they latch on to a good cause. So much the better and easier, especially amongst a bunch of people who are primed to believe we are all one. No we are not, but we may soon have the ability to telepathically undertsand the ways in which we are and aren't. Unfortunately, I am pretty strong on this so when people are not aligned with highest purpose, it sticks out, and there is plenty of it right here .
Having visited LA once was enough to give me a good example of what passed for acceptable amongst that sort of mind set. If anyone is selling you something ,take notice.

[burgundia]

great post anchor..i feel there is a reason why you posted it now....

[Anchor]

great post anchor..i feel there is a reason why you posted it now....

Well there is a reason: basically I posted it after I finished writing it, which took an oddly protracted period of time.


I couldn't help but wonder about the timing of it

...

It has triggered an enormous amount of negativity here when just hours ago we were all loving one another

As I said the timing has to do with the catalysts playing in my life and the results of my own personal review of the situations as they unfold. Many of us have benefited in the extreme recently from much of the material posted on this entire forum.

Read the posts of Jack, MyPlanet2, Malletzky etc Wonderful glimpses of higher order thinking that coax us ever onward in our personal journeys.

I don't agree that negativity has been released. This is not about positivity nor is it negativity; in my view wisdom is not polarized this way, wisdom is simply wisdom, and it is the wisdom that causes the resonance phenomena not positivity or negativity. Negativity and positivity are necessary artefacts of our 3D matrix lives, but certainly not of the matrix where we are going and some of us already glimpse.

If there is any polarity to wisdom it would be love. Love and Wisdom are the next fronteir for most of us to balance. We are nearly done with the 3D artifice of negativity and positivity - and still I hear references to them that echo fear and conditioning.

Cutting with the sword of truth involves destruction - is that negative?

A..

[Anchor]

oh boy!

GRENADE!!

*leaps for cover*

lol

I thought that would happen.

The main drivers I think that motivated me to do this were emails and communication through private channels that have come since I de-moderated myself, which have led me to conclude that the advice to discriminate before you assimilate needed reinforcement. Perhaps with the move away from actively moderating the forum, I have more time!

I realise that this could be seen to only apply or be "targeted" at the Thuban material and yes the timing would suggest that is one of the catalysts for me doing the work above. Not completely the case. One should consider what is being done to this forum in terms of re-organization, how it has been in the past. All the organizational structures that you are presented with in life must be subjected to rigorous review and testing. Not all of them are good for you!

From time to time I have felt moved to write up some advice, whether it be about the changing energetic environment of the matrix we exist in and the likely effects this has on us (crazy times!) or the simple practise of taking a freezing cold shower everyday, or improving some aspects of organization in your life to prepare to meet some types of material inconvenience in an orderly manner.

Here is one very pertinent example from the past, I posted this over a year ago, please read it in the context of this thread:

http://www.projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=1999

I'm with Krishnamurti; truth indeed is a pathless land. One may walk those paths with companions for a time, but each of us must retain, unconditionally, full responsibility and accountability for each step we take on the pathless walk to truth.

With respect to the Thuban Q&A material: I have not changed my mind. I stand by my statements that I made in that thread, true when I made them and still true, which was that I found resonance within for some of the Thuban Q&A material presented in that thread; in particular the answers to the questions that I asked. This is a personal matter and not one that should guide the thinking of others.

I have also been asked if this is still true (since the close/open of the thread), and I am sorry to disappoint you but I do not have an opinion that I want to express about it since I fully respect the freewill of others and do not want to set myself up in giving judgement.

This is what everyone throughout the world is attempting to do. Truth is narrowed down and made a plaything for those who are weak, for those who are only momentarily discontented. Truth cannot be brought down, rather the individual must make the effort to ascend to it. You cannot bring the mountain-top to the valley....

So that is the first reason, from my point of view, why the Order of the Star should be dissolved. In spite of this, you will probably form other Orders, you will continue to belong to other organisations searching for Truth. I do not want to belong to any organisation of a spiritual kind; please understand this....

If an organisation be created for this purpose, it becomes a crutch, a weakness, a bondage, and must cripple the individual, and prevent him from growing, from establishing his uniqueness, which lies in the discovery for himself of that absolute, unconditioned Truth. So that is another reason why I have decided, as I happen to be the Head of the Order, to dissolve it.

AJ..

[TraineeHuman]

When we’re kids we need to follow and even obey our parents. Partly it’s for self-preservation. Also, we copy our parents because they are our prime examples of what is a human being. By the age of five we’ve largely forgotten how much who we consider we are is a copy of our parents.

Then we’re conditioned, brainwashed to follow teachers, probably priests/ministers/rabbis/etc, and then bosses, all the time taking it mostly as gospel that they know better than we do. Ouch! And pretending it isn't a type of gradual torture of the soul and of our magnificence.

In these ways and others, from since before we can even speak we get the habit that we can’t take the main responsibility for our own lives, our own souls. We’re so used to leaning on crutches, we can’t clearly imagine any more what it would be like to throw all the crutches away. We no longer consciously realize that the crutches are there, even. Unfortunately, that seems to be true of the great majority of people. 99%. All the statistics and surveys show that the people who join cults of any kind are as a group considerably more intelligent than average. Notice: they join cults because they believe more, fancier crutches are the only way to greater “strength”.

I believe this is why nearly everybody has lost touch, or lost trust, with what their own personal truth really is. In my experience it takes a lot of listening to and developing your heart (your intuition). But that then needs to be combined with some use of your critical intellect to observe how you are actually living your life.

[Steven]

1. Great thread, Anchor. A tough, and valuable lesson for people to learn.

2. If the term "Cognitive Dissonance" (http://fredsitelive.com/reference/CognitiveDissonance.htm) is new to anyone, here is a short (10 paragraphs) description of the term, and how it works.

Fred

Thank you so much Fred for this text. I bookmarked it. Spot on!

Namaste, Steven

[MargueriteBee]

I was once in a cult but I decided to manifest fabulous weath by keeping my money. :mfr_lol:

[Aztar]

Interesting Cult Video.

zxJyfqeaKU8

They use humor but someone did their homework for this video, its like Cult's 101.

[Stardustaquarion]

Interesting Cult Video.

zxJyfqeaKU8

They use humor but someone did their homework for this video, its like Cult's 101.

Awesome, great! Thank you

[Stardustaquarion]

Having been "out amung'em" in this arena for nearly 35 years, I would strongly suggest you not limit this advice to the online arena.

Fred's 2 cents worth

Very insigtfull, thank you

[Aztar]

Very insigtfull, thank you

Glad you liked it, i was surprised they got so much basic information in such a short video.

[Aztar]

Found this as well,Huge Cult playlist.

X2PT9gw80fM&feature=PlayList&p=D7B916265891A9E2&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=15

[orthodoxymoron]

The following is a very sad documentary regarding the Waco Massacre. I found it to be well done and balanced. Please consider this comparatively recent historical event in the context of current discussions regarding the New World Order, Cults, Fascism, Police State, etc. I like the idea of reexamining all terrorism, wars, disasters, assassinations, etc. This one is worth watching. Watch and weep:

1. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4298137966377572665

2. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1755692679103175934&hl=en

:original: Namaste :wub2: Constitutional :wink2: Responsible :wub2: Freedom :original:

[Boober]

Joining a Cult, is on my bucket list. I just want to see what the big deal is.

[Swanny]

Lets face it anyone that joins a cult has to be a couple of sandwiches short of a picnic :nono:

[swordsmith]

please join my cult boober, sandwiches galore, plus I'm honest, trustworthy and just give me your bank details. Hope this saves time . My god you are cute, maybe you can rope the gals in and we can cut a deal.

[Rob Wood]

To me, the bottom line is the bottom line. Everything of value in this life has a cost, and prudence and common sense dictates that before you buy something, you fully investigate the offer. That's increasingly easy to do on the Internet. No matter what it is, you're likely to find reviews, both positive and negative, of just about any group, product or service.

A cult, religion, "New Age" seminar, book or DVD is no different than a ShamWow. It's buyer beware.

Rob