This is the UFO my kids and I saw

[Theresa]

This is footage taken in Germany, we are in Michigan, but this is what we also saw, except when we saw it it was shaped more oval/rectanglish....cool!

http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=ft99NFxZPN0

[arcora]

xxx

[Sarahmay]

My husband saw an amber colored one like that--it was huge--it was no lantern, for sure!

[arcora]

xxx

[Magamud]

Arcora if you are trying to represent discernment then just go and say it.

[arcora]

xxx

[Sarahmay]

Sorry, but you have absolutely no authority to tell people if what they have seen is real or not. You're entitled to your opinion, but to dismiss someone else's sighting is unacceptable.

[arcora]

xxx

[David]

You're right...It's better to take them by the hand and lead them to la la land.

:wall:

Hey - here's an idea!

Let's just take everything written everywhere on the internet as absolute fact. Let's ignore contradictions and inconsistencies. We'll all live a happy unified life where we all agree on everything and we'll have total I'm OK - You're OK conciousness.

Sounds wonderful :trumpet:

Arcora, try following these guidelines. If you have a point to make, it might come through more clearly.


The 10 Signs of Intellectual Honesty
October 20th, 2008 by Mike Gene



When it comes to just about any topic, it seems as if the public discourse on the internet is dominated by rhetoric and propaganda. People are either selling products or ideology. In fact, just because someone may come across as calm and knowledgeable does not mean you should let your guard down and trust what they say. What you need to look for is a track record of intellectual honesty. Let me therefore propose 10 signs of intellectual honesty.


1. Do not overstate the power of your argument. One’s sense of conviction should be in proportion to the level of clear evidence assessable by most. If someone portrays their opponents as being either stupid or dishonest for disagreeing, intellectual dishonesty is probably in play. Intellectual honesty is most often associated with humility, not arrogance.

2. Show a willingness to publicly acknowledge that reasonable alternative viewpoints exist. The alternative views do not have to be treated as equally valid or powerful, but rarely is it the case that one and only one viewpoint has a complete monopoly on reason and evidence.

3. Be willing to publicly acknowledge and question one’s own assumptions and biases. All of us rely on assumptions when applying our world view to make sense of the data about the world. And all of us bring various biases to the table.

4. Be willing to publicly acknowledge where your argument is weak. Almost all arguments have weak spots, but those who are trying to sell an ideology will have great difficulty with this point and would rather obscure or downplay any weak points.

5. Be willing to publicly acknowledge when you are wrong. Those selling an ideology likewise have great difficulty admitting to being wrong, as this undercuts the rhetoric and image that is being sold. You get small points for admitting to being wrong on trivial matters and big points for admitting to being wrong on substantive points. You lose big points for failing to admit being wrong on something trivial.

6. Demonstrate consistency. A clear sign of intellectual dishonesty is when someone extensively relies on double standards. Typically, an excessively high standard is applied to the perceived opponent(s), while a very low standard is applied to the ideologues’ allies.

7. Address the argument instead of attacking the person making the argument. Ad hominem arguments are a clear sign of intellectual dishonesty. However, often times, the dishonesty is more subtle. For example, someone might make a token effort at debunking an argument and then turn significant attention to the person making the argument, relying on stereotypes, guilt-by-association, and innocent-sounding gotcha questions.

8. When addressing an argument, do not misrepresent it. A common tactic of the intellectually dishonest is to portray their opponent’s argument in straw man terms. In politics, this is called spin. Typically, such tactics eschew quoting the person in context, but instead rely heavily on out-of-context quotes, paraphrasing and impression. When addressing an argument, one should shows signs of having made a serious effort to first understand the argument and then accurately represent it in its strongest form.

9. Show a commitment to critical thinking. ‘Nuff said.

10. Be willing to publicly acknowledge when a point or criticism is good. If someone is unable or unwilling to admit when their opponent raises a good point or makes a good criticism, it demonstrates an unwillingness to participate in the give-and-take that characterizes an honest exchange.

While no one is perfect, and even those who strive for intellectual honesty can have a bad day, simply be on the look out for how many and how often these criteria apply to someone. In the arena of public discourse, it is not intelligence or knowledge that matters most – it is whether you can trust the intelligence or knowledge of another. After all, intelligence and knowledge can sometimes be the best tools of an intellectually dishonest approach.


http://www.thedesignmatrix.com/content/the-10-signs-of-intellectual-honesty/

[arcora]

xxx

[David]

:wub2:

[stefaan]

Nice, nice... you're getting along just fine.

[Orion Morris]

acora you are the type of a** that would get kicked out of any group if their ever was a survival situation...

what way is the lady spinning...

looks clockwise to me

[Dantheman62]

Cool Theresa!, wish I could've seen it also, arcora, kiss my butt! Enough of your blind in one eye and can't see out of the other attitude! oops, sorry, I'm supposed to be nice, kiss my butt please. LOL

[Gabe Gabriel]

I watched the dancer for a while and she moves both ways.

[starskipper]

For all those wondering if people interested in learning and discernment would post such rubbish as "UFOs are chinese paper lanterns"


http://www.drjudywood.com/articles/short/disinfo.html#eight






Arcora wrote :
>The fact is that the mind plays tricks and it sees what it wants to see. Thinking or hoping a lantern is a UFO doesn't make it so. We have to be on guard for our own minds if we are to advance into real truth. We are our own greatest deceivers which is the point I was trying to make by posting the dancer image.> [/QUOTE]

[arcora]

xxx

[Mike_Jetson]

Im struggling to see the clockwise point of view.

Its all counterclockwise to me. Any clues?

[arcora]

xxx

[Dusty Nothing]

to be honest i was enjoying the arguement, very constructive
i wouldn't throw you out of our group arcora, pretty lame to throw someone out a group for expressing discernment....

I thought the vid was pretty cool though

[Mike_Jetson]

Yep, I read what you wrote the 1st time.

I can never see how this could possibly be viewed as going clockwise. I thought it was an image that with a bit of studying could be seen going both ways, like the young woman/old woman image but nope I cant see it

[David]

If your having trouble, close your eyes and look at it again. It will change directions.

[arcora]

xxx

[Sarahmay]

If you are in rational thinking mode (left brain orientation) you will see it counter-clockwise.

If you are in emotional thinking mode (right brain orientation) you will see it clockwise.

When the hemispheres are balanced, you will see it go left to right to left to right.

This is very interesting...I didn't watch it for long, but only saw it clockwise. No big surprise there.

Thank you Acora for posting this, although I still disagree with you about the UFOs.

[Orion Morris]

that thing is crazy... it was blowing my mind for a minute...

I could only see it clockwise... then I focused on the outer foot and the outer hand.. suddenly it just started going clockwise...

haha... crazy!!

[Dantheman62]

Wow you're right OM, I finally saw it, at first I only saw counter clockwise, then after focusing on the outer foot and hand I saw clockwise! What a trip and sorry for getting off topic Theresa! Oh and to Mike Jetson, don't watch her outer foot and hand go around, just kinda stare at it, like space out on it, I was like you but I finally got it!

[Mike_Jetson]

Its like being in Room 101 this :), its counterclockwise.

Maybe shock therapy will help

[Jnana]

It's very easy to disregard someone else's sightings, in part because it is difficult to accurately describe what you have seen in terms that give the same impact as the sighting.

Even videos have a similar problem for a variety of reasons. A video of a lighted object in an otherwise dark sky gives no clues as to the size and motion of the object. The motion could be due to the camera moving, or the object moving. If the camera tracks the object and there are no background objects, you can't see that the object is moving. An average video camera does not pick up background stars well, so there are no reference points. You need a sophisticated night vision setup for that. Also, CG is so good now it is easy to produce very good fakes.

So, before telling an eyewitness they are misinterpreting what they saw, it would be better to ask for additional information. How was the object moving? Where was it in the sky? How did it appear/disappear? Were there other witnesses? etc, etc.

Sure, most UFOs are misinterpretations of objects with conventional explanations, but many are not.

The rectangular sky lanterns offered as an explanation of the diamond shaped UFO were the wrong shape and there was no evidence of a flame at the bottom. Not a good fit.

If you have done your homework you know there are sightings with ground visual, air visual, ground radar, and air radar tracking all on the same object with records and testimony from multiple witnesses/operators. They exist.

Ask to see one. You may be surprised!

[arcora]

xxx

[Elephant Man]

I did exactly that. Without getting negative, the first thing I investigated led me to the conclusion that there is a very high likelihood of self deception involved.


The first I thought when I read arcoras reply (the link) was that it was a humorous way of saying "hey look it could be..." I saw no negativity, only a humorous approach. I made a similar posting recently that was misinterpretated by some and erased by a mod. Humour can sometimes seem harsh, but for me at least, is very important. Especially when subjects get heavy and over serious. I know also that arcoras "lithium" link was taken wrongly by some, I personally almost puked laughing. Were different - thats all.
:groupwave:
I dont agree with many of your postings arcora, but love the wit :thumb_yello:

[Alexandra]

:original:

[Dantheman62]

Its like being in Room 101 this :), its counterclockwise.

Maybe shock therapy will help
HaHa, just try staring kinda at the right side of the picture, I can actually go back and forth now to where she doesn't turn at all!

[arcora]

xxx

[Alexandra]

:original:

[Jnana]

Originally Posted by Arcora
Originally Posted by Jnana
So, before telling an eyewitness they are misinterpreting what they saw, it would be better to ask for additional information.

I did exactly that. Without getting negative, the first thing I investigated led me to the conclusion that there is a very high likelihood of self deception involved.

Arcora,
I meant that you should ask the eyewitness for additional information. If you did so, there is no evidence in this thread.

Humor can be taken the wrong way by someone who is reporting an unusual sighting. It can be taken as ridicule.

[freekatz]

acora you are the type of a** that would get kicked out of any group if their ever was a survival situation...

what way is the lady spinning...

looks clockwise to me

My moneys on clockwise too:welcomeani:

[arcora]

xxx

[Alexandra]

Ok. I can accept that. I just had to ask .
:original:Alexandra

[Elephant Man]

she spins both ways, dependes on right or left brain usage :thumb_yello:

[ghglenn]

To reverse direction just look away from the screen, with your peripheral vision look at the image. Your brain will reverse the direction. Once you get it, it's kind of cool to "make" it rotate back and forth.

One person's UFO is another person's frisbee. Unless you are there to witness the event, it is hard to judge what an object is on film. I still enjoy getting exposure to these things....I am thankful that Theresa shared this event with us and I can appreciate Arcora's opinion as well. Both are valid.

[Rumas]

I first seen the picture clockwise for 20-30 seconds, I then it switched to counter clockwise for 10 seconds, then I it changed left to right, left to right. I can now look at the pictured and make a choice on how I want to see it. I always wondered what this meant.

Thanx for the picture and the info.

[Antaletriangle]

Like the 'psychological dancer' Arcora,initially i couldn't get it moving out of clockwise rotation at all but then i looked at the 'shadow' and got it moving anticlockwise-then at will move it any which way 'but loose'!!lol. Please forgive the suggestive pun.

[Brinty]

I watched the dancer for a while and she moves both ways.

Thank God for your observation Gabe! That means I'm not the only one. :original:

I was about to make an appointment to have my sanity checked. I thought I might have been suffering from some esoteric disorder from spending too much time in Avalon land. :insane:

[Treckie]

That dancer is cool. What a trip. She turns in what ever direction i want her to now. :smoke:

[Dantheman62]

Sorry Theresa, your thread got totally hijacked because of the dancing lady, and people don't read the threads from the beginning!

[Luminari]

Like the 'psychological dancer' Arcora,initially i couldn't get it moving out of clockwise rotation at all but then i looked at the 'shadow' and got it moving anticlockwise-then at will move it any which way 'but loose'!!lol. Please forgive the suggestive pun.

Yeah, focus on the 'shadow' if you want to see her change direction.

Acora why are you here.. this forum is a haven from people like you, take your disinformation and your sceptisicm somewhere else please. (que smart ass reply from acora...)

[Greg10036]

This is footage taken in Germany, we are in Michigan, but this is what we also saw, except when we saw it it was shaped more oval/rectanglish....cool!

http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=ft99NFxZPN0

It is cool and I believe you. Blessings to you and your family.
g.

[KathyT]

Which way is this dancer spinning? Clockwise or counter-clockwises?

We see what our brain tells us we see (what we want to see).



Oh, this is cool. I thought I was only seeing counterclockwise... until I closed my eyes and looked back, and it was clockwise. Couldn't change every time, it takes a bit of effort... seems the mind does it when it wants to, not because I want it to.

But then, I found if I concentrated, I could make her flip back and forth at every half turn. I could control it with my mind.

Thanks for sharing!

[recallone]

- edited from original rant -

Arcora, I really don't understand what you get out of this website. I don't think I've ever seen you post anything inspiring, encouraging, or even remotely filled with love. Why are you here?
Other than the obvious, that is. It's pretty clear to everyone here that you're really just all about starting fights and derailing threads. So what, exactly do you get out of this group?

[fastarr]

It doesn't depend on brain usage.... she spins both ways anyway. Just watch for a while and her direction will change. Watch the location of the shadow that moves below her.

[taomation]

Some people just don't get enough attention so they have to stir up controversy to amuse themselves.

No one can convince anyone of anything. Just as with perception "the truth" comes from the perceiver. Be pateint and tolerant and let people find their truth at their own pace and in their own mind. I can't imagine someone without an open mind being interested in this forum, unless he or she had alterior motives...Tao

[Humble Janitor]

I watched the dancer for a while and she moves both ways.

She starts out counter-clockwise, clockwise and back to counter-clockwise.

[arcora]

xxx

[arcora]

xxx

[Orion Morris]

arcora-

Your version of truth is Christian fundementalist. I am not saying that is wrong, but going around and telling everybody that they need to see things from your perspective is very selfish. Your youtube video evidence doesnt hold a candle to the idea that truth comes from the perceiver... Nothing we can say to you will change what you believe to be true and the same goes for your comments to somebody else....
perception of the observer determines the observers truth...

[arcora]

xxx

[David]

arcora-

Your version of truth is Christian fundementalist. I am not saying that is wrong, but going around and telling everybody that they need to see things from your perspective is very selfish. Your youtube video evidence doesnt hold a candle to the idea that truth comes from the perceiver... Nothing we can say to you will change what you believe to be true and the same goes for your comments to somebody else....
perception of the observer determines the observers truth...


Hi Orion, he is trying to mix logic with religious fanaticism. It makes no sense, only insanity.

[arcora]

xxx

[Orion Morris]

:mfr_lol:


When or where have I ever come out in favor or defense of religion?

:original:


You argued with me about christianity and the bible for a few hours yesterday. You seemed to support the word of the bible and discredited the word of the Koran and claimed that Buddhism and Taoism are not religions.

I cant stream video here at work but I assure you arguing with the philosiphy that ones truth depends on ones perception is not going to get you anywhere.
:original:

[arcora]

xxx

[David]

Man in Black: Truly, you have a dizzying intellect.
Arcora: Wait til I get going! Now, where was I?

[Orion Morris]

And you know the truth...

your on the enlightened path????

right buddy... that is why you spend all your time on the internet arguing with people at work about how your right and the bible is the best book and your not religious???

seriously..... listen to what your saying



a. Reading the bible and following it's teachings is not religion. Religion's are corrupted organized bodies that sprung up around the book and I have no religion. The bible is a book of truth's that everyone should read and contemplate before passing judgement on it or on me. So many here rail against this book that they have never read with an open mind.

b. It's too bad that you can't watch the video. Please do when you get home and tell me if you still want to make that statement. (By the way, I didn't say 'one's' truth. I said truth - they are two different things.)

[Kahunamahalo]

So...what happened to the ufo sighting?

[arcora]

xxx

[Kahunamahalo]

No really, what happened to the ufo sighting?

[David]

Lets get back on topic.

[ralok_j]

No really, what happened to the ufo sighting?


Read here: http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=5145 then come back to this thread


As strange as this sounds, I saw something similar about 2 weeks ago, but it was late in the afternoon and didn't emit any light.

[NXS]

To me... the picture of the dancer is simply a gif that rotates clockwise for a fixed amount of time, then goes clockwise for a fixed amount of time.... then looped.... no real secret or training of brain to come to this conclusion either.... gif's are wonderful, wonderful pics =).

[Sarahmay]

To me... the picture of the dancer is simply a gif that rotates clockwise for a fixed amount of time, then goes clockwise for a fixed amount of time.... then looped.... no real secret or training of brain to come to this conclusion either.... gif's are wonderful, wonderful pics =).

Don't think so. I looked at it for a long, long time yesterday and it only went clockwise. Today, it started clockwise, then I cocked my head and focused on something else on the screen and then she changed position. Then she started going half turn one way, half turn the other. I'm much more balanced today, I guess!

[addalight]

Well, I see the original poster has left and ACURA has put his/her spin on the subject, completely changing it. I'm sure your ego is enjoying the:eyes: dance you have created here.

[Jenny]

I want to remind all members in this thread to abide by the guidelines and keep it civil.

Thank you all.

:original:


Jenny

[sammytray]

This is footage taken in Germany, we are in Michigan, but this is what we also saw, except when we saw it it was shaped more oval/rectanglish....cool!

http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=ft99NFxZPN0

Michigan???? My home town :original:

Lots of fresh water around michigan.... Hmmmm

[Accipiter_Phi]

Theresa,

On Thursday, October 30, 2008: @~22:20:00, I was returning home from giving a presentation at UCLA... I felt it went quite poorly, and I was obsessing on my missteps (I went way over the alotted time and got cut off before the best support of my thesis was even presented).

I was driving North on Pacific Coast Highway (1/2 mile away from Malibu Canyon when a bright light flashed in my peripheral vision. Initially, I ignored it.

When I reached Malibu Canyon (my exit), I saw the flash again... then it disappeared. I was so bummed on my presentation that I turned inland... for 1 minute... before I decided "Oh, why not," and I turned around and parked at Malibu Bluffs Park.

I pulled out my 10X80 magnification astronomy binocs and went to the bluffs edge overlooking the Pacific where there were no trees to obscure this massive view.

Well, over the ocean & North of me was this bright orange blob.

"Mars" I thought. Wait, Mars isn't in our sky tonight at this time. Oh, and there are absolutely no planes visible at this exact moment (which is freakishly rare).

I braced the Binocs and trained in on the object.

It was a warm, bright orangish red OCTAHEDRON... plain as day.

Wait, "is this collamination in my binocs?" I wondered aloud. A couple quick adjustments and I retrained on the octahedron... whose image was now as sharp as a razor, and clearly exhibiting a mid "seam," it was a 3 dimensional octahedron of orange red light.

Waves of realization washed over me, yet, I felt unusually calm... even blissful. I am a natural empath (as we all "should" be). This craft was benevolent... just cruising parallel along the beach.

I watched for over 20 minutes as it leisurely cruised North along the coast. Eventually it disappeared over the ocean's horizon... which means it was pretty huge.

As soon as it left, normal LAX traffic resumed... it seemed to appear during a lull.

It was no lantern. It was not my imagination. I have seen a lot in this here town over the years... including several UFO's: the 1st one I ever saw was 1 hour after the 1994 Northridge 6.7 earthquake at 5 in the morning. I lived in Northridge at that time... it wasn't a lantern either.

So, Theresa... you saw what you saw. Non experiencers will never understand until they live through their own REAL experience.

Life is more than we know.

[MacGyverCanada]

errr... I see clockwise... even the shadow suggests a clockwise rotation. Rational explanation for my 'emotional' view of the picture,

It coulda been a UFO, coulda been a flying lantern, coulda been a high-energy plasma discharge from highly compressed granite... who cares. Someone saw something weird and posted it for our consideration. Exchange rationale, sure, but please stop drawing these battle lines.

[halebox]

Holy **** the dancer is good practice going from rational to emotional. I had her going back and forth in half rotations!

[Theresa]

Hey ho!

Whats become of our little UFO sharing, then, eh?

Arcora...you must be feeling a little ganged up on. I didn't read every one of those exchanges, and I am being very careful not to step on feelings, but I say, just send love y'all.

Arcora, I agree with you, the truth IS the truth. But I must say, I'm not exactly sure what that is yet. I suspect that if I did, I would not be typing these words on this forum right now. As they say, "you don't know what you don't know, until you know it, then it's no longer in the catagory of "don't know." I have a lot of empirical evidence that ultimate truth is still in the "don't know what I don't know" catagory.

But I have had some experiences in my life that are pointing me in what I think is the right direction toward ultimate truth. Basically, if I feel good, and am a nicer person, and people's lives are enhanced by interacting with me, then whatever is motivating me to be that must be something more aligned WITH truth than AWAY from it.

Having piled up a few of those experiences in my 43 years I'm starting to see a general path toward truth, based on feelings of goodness, love, abundance, responsibility, productivity and general overall good citizenship type behavior.

I have found that I developed these traits more from listening to my inner wisdom than an outside authority, although outside authorities were helpful in pointing out which direction to move toward. Sort of like, dont' have to reinvent the wheel if I just do onto others as I'd have them do onto me....of course, I've also had to trust myself, love myself and forgive myself to even have a CLUE of how to start being a better person. Over and over....and continuing.

I want to share something about that UFO. I have felt really expanded since seeing that, and I have had such a solid sense of PEACE, and my intuition is clearer than ever. The voice of Holy Spirit that I channel has also been clearer and stronger. I think that these sightings are promoting an awakening in consciousness. And never more in my life have I felt totally clear and inspired to trust the process!!!

We get to choose which state of consciousness we wish to honor. Love moves us closer to ultimate truth and fear moves us farther away. Its just a matter of noticing "am I closer to ultimate truth with this thought, or farther away?" and then adjust accordingly. I think ultimate truth is so simple its been right in front of us all along!

*disclaimer note: taking on this practice can be hazardous to your sense of self righteous superiority, sense of victimization or overt judgmentalism, and is guaranteed to produce illogical feelings of bliss, joy and giddy connectedness with all other beings. Proceed at your own discretion! :lol3:

[arcora]

Arcora...you must be feeling a little ganged up on.

I'm used to being lonely and right. No worries.

Best of luck with your channeling biz. Hope your direct line to God sells better than the Galactic Federation of Nutjobs did.

I'm outa here.

But first - one suggestion for you (out of LOVE)

http://www.your-onlinepharmacy.com/dr/n/Lithium.shtml

[David]

I'm used to being lonely and right. No worries.

Best of luck with your channeling biz. Hope your direct line to God sells better than the Galactic Federation of Nutjobs did.

I'm outa here.

But first - one suggestion for you (out of LOVE)

http://www.your-onlinepharmacy.com/dr/n/Lithium.shtml

I know what love is but all I'm feeling from you is hate and anger.

[Theresa]

Arcora, this is a community where you are wanted and appreciated. If you found this place then you must be an expansive thinker and one who cares about humanity.

You don't have to believe anything anyone says, but do consider learning to meditate and listen to your OWN heart, my friend. Whatever you consider "GOD" to be, ask it to open your heart to the truth within yourself.

Galactic whoevers aside, I DO know that when I am heart centered I just feel good and manifest good things into my life. If the messages I hear are congruent with that feeling of goodness, then I am inclined to trust them.

No amount of nice sounding words will feel good if they are coming from a dark source, of that I know. The only way to get there is from within...

ok....just breathe.....be cool, open yer heart.

[Accipiter_Phi]

[*disclaimer note: taking on this practice can be hazardous to your sense of self righteous superiority, sense of victimization or overt judgmentalism, and is guaranteed to produce illogical feelings of bliss, joy and giddy connectedness with all other beings. Proceed at your own discretion!]

[Arcora, this is a community where you are wanted and appreciated. If you found this place then you must be an expansive thinker and one who cares about humanity.] - THERESA

Wow! Theresa... You're my hero...

You absorbed all that dark ego based judgment, ridicule, and pomposity and just radiated light right back! You spoke from the heart about YOUR truth... since, at the end of the day, this is all we can do.

...And he had nobody left to "fight" but his own interior issues.

What a valuable lesson I just relearnt about the power of being harmless, honest and compassionate; leave it to a mother... whoa!: Mother Theresa :lol3:

... and that deserves the "slow" clap.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mIl4cu8-Is

[Antaletriangle]

Hey you're all good guys on here-i've seen some of arcora's posts and he appears intelligent to me maybe there is anger but it's o.k.-if it can't be vented on us lot on here then it is dire straits and not the band!!lol.Everyone should chill it dine a bit,relax and clear thoughts;we can become too serious if we allow it and it's not always right that way-feel the simplicity and beauty of existence-Arcora don't leave as you said ("I'm outta here!");we need opinions big guy.
Anyway Hubble image-only joking!!Just messed about for 10mins.
http://www.projectavalon.net/forum/picture.php?albumid=17&pictureid=4724