Consciousness, Christian Theology, and the Revelation of John

[4Q529]

Long story short, the Revelation of John can be explained only by someone who has personally received both the Vision of the "Son of man" and the Revelation of the "resurrection" (including the Revelation of the Memory of Creation--Genesis 2:7; and the revelation of the memories of previous lives--Luke 20:34-36).

Having no Knowledge whatsoever of Revealed Truth, the Christian theologians have concocted any number of utterly bizarre interpretations of the Revelation of John; in the process making probably tens of millions of dollars (theft by deception) with the sale of books, magazine articles, video and audio tapes, classes, etc. etc. etc.

What they do not understand is that the terms "dragon", "beast of the sea" and "beast of the earth" are to be understood as representing different aspects of the 'fallen' consciousness: the "dragon" symbolizing the 'movement' of self-reflection; the "beast of the sea" symbolizing the "self"; and the "beast of the earth" symbolizing the 'thinker'.

In the following video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uy5QeBRu3JI

Agent Smith represents the 'movement' of self-reflection or the "dragon", whereas Neo represents the "observing consciousness" or "Michael" (see chapter 12 of the Revelation of John).

The origin of the 3-dimensional 'curved' space within which the "self" exists occurs at time segment 5:29-5:33; after which "the Fall" is symbolized by time segment 5:45-6:08.

Then, in the following video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GALu0...eature=related

Agent Smith, as the “beast of the sea”/consciousness of the “self”, is graphically represented at time segment 2:15-2:23; whereas Agent Smith, as the “beast of the earth”/consciousness of the‘thinker’, emerges at time segment 3:01-3:05; references to the "beast of the sea" and the "beast of the earth" being found in Chapter 13 of the Revelation of John(The "beast of the earth" is also referred to in Sura 27:82 of the Koran.)

And, were these Truths about the Revelation of John to be more widely publicized--rather than the bizarre interpretations of the Christian theologians--there would be more of a chance for Peace in the Middle East than there is at present.

But the media is, of course, under the complete control of either the secularists or those whose economic survival depends upon the preservation of the bizarre doctrines of Christianity, Inc.

[Frank Samuel]

As a former theologian I can tell you that very few truly understand the scriptures, so I will give a doctor's degree to you because you understand a lot more than many of the theology professors that I had. I was so disenchanted that my path lead me into other roads to achieve the same destination. As we try to intellectualize religious books we tend to miss the whole point by using your internal essence your Heart you begin to understand these spiritual guides from a personal perspective. For example the end of the world is true for all of us, we die and we are reborn, the world is you.Fear manipulation has been an effective way to control religious people all over the world, is time to lift the veil. Universal truth is simple and very personal, the roads are many, the destination is the same.

[rosie]

40529, loving your thoughts on this matter!

This "well" is very deep, not too many people get the chance to see what's above, or below, the surface. They are too busy believing the lies.

But, I have faith in "humanity", to grow where it needs to grow, which is towards love, not war.

More and more people are speaking out, things are going mainstream, things that the "powers who wish they were" , do not want to get out. We are, by own natural destiny, love, and love will prevail, that I can 100% guarantee.

love & light to everyone tonight!

[Gnosis5]

I am interested in reading the source works that form the basis of Christian Science. There is a reading room locally. I have been told that their healing technologies are about 90% truth, but on such a high level that most people are left standing on the other side of a raised drawbridge.

[greybeard]

First dont shoot the messenger.
Dr David Hawkins is I believe a Mystic of our time and claims that there is a method of telling truth from false hood as in his Books "Power versus Force" and "Truth versus Falsehood"

http://www.veritaspub.com

When you go there please also go to the about section.

Dr Hawkins can remember all past lives and is in the state of full Enlightenment, there are levels of enlightenment.

He has developed a map of consciousness and way of calibrating all levels of consiousness.
He claims that the Bible and various other Holy Books calibrate highly but that "Revelations" is of a very low calibration and was actually channeled from the lower astral and is not concordant with the teachings of Christ which are of course valid. The Old Testiment except for Genisis Proverbs and Psalms also calibrates low as it depicts an angry paranoid judgmental god which is far removed from the truth and teachings of Jesus.
I realize these statements are controversial and will not debate them as I personally dont know. I can only point to the life work of Dr Hawkins who is in his 80s now and still dedicated to raising the consciousness of mankind.

Chris

[greybeard]

Truth is eternal or it would not be true.
How ever the perception of truth evolves.
The Old Testament reflected the perception of god that was prevalent at that time.
As is known historically the bible was radically altered by man at the council of Nancia (is that the spelling?)
So much of the old testament was doctored that it is not safe to quote any of it.
Jesus was crucified because he told the Truth as it is, eternal.

The current perception of truth as pointed to by recent mystics in the last and this century has moved much closer to Truth.
Perception is still not the same as subjective experience which is uniformly related to pointed to by curent enlightened sages.
The moment words are used it is not subjective experience.

Anything fear based is not of God.
That is an easy rule of thumb to measure by.

That is just my point of view not saying I am right.
Chris

[K626]

There are constantly changing views of 'truth' and versions of 'truth', it is alivea and moving as we are alive and moving. There is no one source which is dominant or central, we effect the source as the source changes us. Our very loose grip on reality often means a harder and more narrow search for some kind of truth. It's a waste of time.

[Gnosis5]

Originally Posted by K626

There are constantly changing views of 'truth' and versions of 'truth', it is alivea and moving as we are alive and moving. There is no one source which is dominant or central, we effect the source as the source changes us. Our very loose grip on reality often means a harder and more narrow search for some kind of truth. It's a waste of time.

Right, I had to start somewhere and focus even with the perception that I was narrowing myself, but for the purpose of future expansion. It is paying off in that I am not as dogmatic and fundamental and cultist as I once was. If I had chosen the wrong path I would be even more entrenched in "my way or the highway" maintenance of status and control societies.

[K626]

Originally Posted by Gnosis5

Right, I had to start somewhere and focus even with the perception that I was narrowing myself, but for the purpose of future expansion. It is paying off in that I am not as dogmatic and fundamental and cultist as I once was. If I had chosen the wrong path I would be even more entrenched in "my way or the highway" maintenance of status and control societies.

The simplest thing I can say is the old cliche: Follow your own path. LOOK for the signs. Once you start to synchronise with your phase self (the one that moves in and out of time and place) it will automatically start to SHOW/DIRECT you into a kind of timelessness. Once you feel timelessness/unplaceness it will start to trigger moments when you are out and about going about your normal business (whenever you feel drawn to someone or something in that moment - check it out ALWAYS. MMagiccal stuff. Good luck with it. Btw it really is ALL LIGHT.

K.

[Gnosis5]

Originally Posted by K626

The simplest thing I can say is the old cliche: Follow your own path. LOOK for the signs. Once you start to synchronise with your phase self (the one that moves in and out of time and place) it will automatically start to SHOW/DIRECT you into a kind of timelessness. Once you feel timelessness/unplaceness it will start to trigger moments when you are out and about going about your normal business (whenever you feel drawn to someone or something in that moment - check it out ALWAYS. MMagiccal stuff. Good luck with it. Btw it really is ALL LIGHT.

K.

Yes, I am starting to suspect that any spiritual "gangsters" that loom large over me now are probably merely 1% of a multi-universal society of beings.

[K626]

Originally Posted by Gnosis5

Yes, I am starting to suspect that any spiritual "gangsters" that loom large over me now are probably merely 1% of a multi-universal society of beings.

Starting to become aware will draw your guides to you. Whatever it takes and whatever the cost everyone who calls will be answered. From the beginning it was understood that there would be no end.

[Gnosis5]

Originally Posted by K626

Starting to become aware will draw your guides to you. Whatever it takes and whatever the cost everyone who calls will be answered. From the beginning it was understood that there would be no end.

May all the ends meet.

[THE eXchanger]

Originally Posted by Gnosis5

May all the ends meet.

indeed, may they all meet

always remember...

"allow only, those things,
that are in 100% alignment,
with your missions, your purposes, and, your tasks"
susan~the eXchanger

saves a lot of B.S,

does it NOT madam gnosis5 ?

[annemirri]

a.

[4Q529]

Originally Posted by greybeard

He claims that the Bible and various other Holy Books calibrate highly but that "Revelations" is of a very low calibration and was actually channeled from the lower astral and is not concordant with the teachings of Christ which are of course valid.

Then, clearly, he has not received either the Vision of the "Son of man" or the Revelation of the Memory of Creation.

Then, clearly, he does not know that the "serpent" in Genesis 3 is a symbol for the 'movement' of self-reflection; that the "tree of the knowledge of good and evil" is a symbol for the consciousness of the "self"; or that the 'fig leaves' of Genesis 3 refer to the thoughts of the 'thinker'.

Then, clearly, he does not understand that this symbolism is extended by Jesus in Saying #37 of the Gospel of Thomas.

Then, clearly, he does not understand that this symbolism is continued in the "dragon", the "beast of the sea" and the "beast of the earth" in the Revelation of John.

[greybeard]

Originally Posted by 4Q529

Then, clearly, he has not received either the Vision of the "Son of man" or the Revelation of the Memory of Creation.

Then, clearly, he does not know that the "serpent" in Genesis 3 is a symbol for the 'movement' of self-reflection; that the "tree of the knowledge of good and evil" is a symbol for the consciousness of the "self"; or that the 'fig leaves' of Genesis 3 refer to the thoughts of the 'thinker'.

Then, clearly, he does not understand that this symbolism is extended by Jesus in Saying #37 of the Gospel of Thomas.

Then, clearly, he does not understand that this symbolism is continued in the "dragon", the "beast of the sea" and the "beast of the earth" in the Revelation of John.

With respect clearly you perceive in your own personal way.
Clearly his subjective experience is his.
I dont know what he thinks about the statements in Genesis you mention, with respect neither do you.
im not about to try and change anyones point of view.
Im sharing what I believe to be so about what he has experienced to be so.
If any one wishes to investigate further what you are saying that is their free choice.
If any one wishes to investigate what Dr Hawkins teaches thats their freedom of choice.

I go with what Beren said on another thread,
Love love and then see what happens.
Love and fear are not compatible.
Regards and best wishes.
Chris

[HORIZONS]

Originally Posted by greybeard

With respect clearly you perceive in your own personal way.
Clearly his subjective experience is his.
I dont know what he thinks about the statements in Genesis you mention, with respect neither do you.
im not about to try and change anyones point of view.
Im sharing what I believe to be so about what he has experienced to be so.
If any one wishes to investigate further what you are saying that is their free choice.
If any one wishes to investigate what Dr Hawkins teaches thats their freedom of choice.

I go with what Beren said on another thread,
Love love and then see what happens.
Love and fear are not compatible.
Regards and best wishes.
Chris

This is a very open point of view, while the other seems to be closed and dogmatic.

[greybeard]

Originally Posted by HORIZONS

This is a very open point of view, while the other seems to be closed and dogmatic.

My belief Horizon is that God is Love and that is the attraction.
How would I learn anything if I dident have an open point of view with discernment of course?

Ive found that If people are lectured at then out of fear they will stay with their established beliefs even if these beliefs are proved to be wrong, therefor trying to cajole people is unproductive and a sheer waste of time, you just alienate them even though your point of view might be life saving and valid.

God being Love does not need force to bring people to believe in Him.
Jesus used love to attract disciples.
He taught love God,love your enemy and forgiveness.

Chris

[kriya]

Originally Posted by greybeard

He claims that the Bible and various other Holy Books calibrate highly but that "Revelations" is of a very low calibration and was actually channeled from the lower astral and is not concordant with the teachings of Christ which are of course valid.

Oooooooh, yes Chris a very controversial statement indeed!

In my view revelations is highly allegorical and is actually symbolic of a very high state of consciousness through vision. IMHO not a channeled piece of writing but the revelation of John, who I have been told was Jesus' greatest disciple (by which I mean he had the greatest realisations of all the disciples)

Love,

Kriya

PS Yogananda said Revelations was pure kriya yoga (or what can happen once its mastered)

[4Q529]

Originally Posted by kriya

IMHO not a channeled piece of writing but the revelation of John, who I have been told was Jesus' greatest disciple (by which I mean he had the greatest realisations of all the disciples)

Well, of course, that is the story which is told by the male disciples of Jesus.

But, in the Gospel of Mary and the Gospel of Philip, as I recall, the apostles acknowledge that Jesus loved Mary more than he loved them, "kissing her often on her mouth" (not lips, mouth).

In other words, both John and Mary received the Vision of the "Son of man"; but it was the Revelation of John which became a part of the Christian canon, whereas the Gospel of Mary was considered to be heretical; and, so, had to be hidden to prevent its complete destruction; although significant parts of the Gospel of Mary are, in fact, missing.

[kriya]

Originally Posted by 4Q529

Well, of course, that is the story which is told by the male disciples of Jesus.

But, in the Gospel of Mary and the Gospel of Philip, as I recall, the apostles acknowledge that Jesus loved Mary more than he loved them, "kissing her often on her mouth" (not lips, mouth).

In other words, both John and Mary received the Vision of the "Son of man"; but it was the Revelation of John which became a part of the Christian canon, whereas the Gospel of Mary was considered to be heretical; and, so, had to be hidden to prevent its complete destruction; although significant parts of the Gospel of Mary are, in fact, missing.

Yes I believe Mary Magdalene had great realisations also.

[greybeard]

Originally Posted by kriya

Oooooooh, yes Chris a very controversial statement indeed!

In my view revelations is highly allegorical and is actually symbolic of a very high state of consciousness through vision. IMHO not a channeled piece of writing but the revelation of John, who I have been told was Jesus' greatest disciple (by which I mean he had the greatest realisations of all the disciples)

Love,

Kriya

PS Yoga nanda said Revelations was pure kriya yoga (or what can happen once its mastered)

Hi Kriya.
I honestly dont know.
But I believe Dr Hawkins does.
Check him out, your open minded

http://www.veritaspub.com/

.

While he doesn't need verification, he just knows, he get every statement he makes checked rigorously and scientifically by students using the Kinesolgy muscle testing technique which was given credibility through the work of Dr Diamond.

You will find Dr Hawkins love of God and devotion to truth inspiring.

Love Chris

[Gnosis5]

Hello Chris,

Yes, part of my diagnostic readings is periodically getting a David Hawkins reading. Mine went up 90 points since I started my clearing work and got my first reading. The interesting thing that verified it for me is that at the time I hit my high mark I was intensely interested in the gospel of Thomas, and I found out later that its rating was exactly as mine. The points above me, which I was reaching for, were in the Buddhic range.

There is a David Hawkins forum that has ratings for a long list of books, music, art: http://www.level-of-consciousness.org/. Although I don't see anymore postings on it, the books rating is very interesting.

I would be interested to know how Christian Science healing technology rates.

A fine distinction to keep in mind is that even though some books or music may have an overall low rating, there might be some jewels in there nonetheless, but would call for more sorting and discernment. I used to call it my "truth governor" :-)

[Gnosis5]

Originally Posted by kriya

Oooooooh, yes Chris a very controversial statement indeed!

In my view revelations is highly allegorical and is actually symbolic of a very high state of consciousness through vision. IMHO not a channeled piece of writing but the revelation of John, who I have been told was Jesus' greatest disciple (by which I mean he had the greatest realisations of all the disciples)

Love,

Kriya

PS Yogananda said Revelations was pure kriya yoga (or what can happen once its mastered)

I met Yogananda in his disembodied state and personally I would rate Babaji higher then him. Yogananda's autobiography was a milestone for me in stepping outside the confines of my Christian indoctrination and moving toward a more understandable and practicable spiritual technology. However, when I connected with him in his disembodied state I found him personally somewhat manipulative and he left me in a bit of a huff (to say the least).

I agree with the fellas who use Hawkins' method who several of them independently rated Revelations. However, there may be something in the Revelations that might rate very highly. Hawkins is not the only one that gives a low rating to the book of Revelations. However, do your own tests.

If Revelations were thrown out of the NT that would not take anything away from the NT, in fact, it would shine brighter IMHO. The main focus of the NT, IMHO, should be the actual TOOLS that were given to Christians, such as prayer, meditation, praise, fasting, group agreements, connecting with higher self (holy spirit), processing entities and spirits, and some hearty admonitions.

My two cents

[4Q529]

Originally Posted by Gnosis5

Hawkins is not the only one that gives a low rating to the book of Revelations. However, do your own tests.

As previously stated, the only one who can have any real understanding of the Revelation of John is someone who has personally received both the Vision of the "Son of man" and the Revelation of the Memory of Creation. But that also pertains to the over-all significance of the Revelation of John. Thus, any attempts to 'test' the Revelation of John for its Truth originate in the thoughts of either the "beast of the sea" consciousness of the "self" or the "beast of the earth" consciousness of the 'thinker'--both of which are, in and of themselves, aspects of the 'fallen' consciousness which has, in effect, created itself rather than being Created 'by and in the image of God'.

Originally Posted by Gnosis5

If Revelations were thrown out of the NT that would not take anything away from the NT, in fact, it would shine brighter IMHO. The main focus of the NT, IMHO, should be the actual TOOLS that were given to Christians, such as prayer, meditation, praise, fasting, group agreements, connecting with higher self (holy spirit), processing entities and spirits, and some hearty admonitions.

My two cents

This ignores the direct connection between the Revelation of John and Sura 27:82 of the Koran's mention of the "beast of the earth"--thus establishing the continuity of the Revelations received by Jesus and Mohammed; which, if widely publicized, would sharply diminish the potential for violence between Christians and Muslims; but which would probably, on the other hand, impoverish many thousands of both Christian and Muslim religious 'authorities'.

And so, rather than suffering such a 'terrible' fate, these religious 'authorities' prefer to continue to lie--thereby, however, pushing this civilization towards horrors far beyond their most horrific nightmares.