Something is a brewing, HMMMM

[Lionhawk]

Wow! Tone3jaguar starts a thread and people are having problems keeping their meds in balance. Now if the emotional body of those would just unplug, we might learn something that is of greater value. In which this thread and the intent was to keep people informed of the possibilities that are manifesting in the now. Let's face a reality here. I want to leave this Planet. Just look at what has happened in this thread and it becomes very obvious as to why I want to leave it. I'm very tired of swimming in a polluted river with a bunch of floating debris that I find myself exerting extra effort just to navigate around. I didn't say that I agreed with the reported results but I do support the effort of what is trying to be conveyed by Tone3 jaguar. It does exists in that field of potential. So I can accept the possibilities as being probable. There are no limitations. We limit ourselves, PERIOD. But to try to limit everyone's thinking is just a disgrace with the innuendos and ridicules. So if I may say it, Grow up will ya? Every path is different and it isn't your job to say what works for you is to work for everyone else. Hey, if what works for you is working then God Bless you. But if you are coming here to create chaos, because there is something lacking in your paradigm, then you will only end up showing what is lacking within you. Look in the mirror, then get real with yourself because you are the one who is polarizing yourself for more baggage. I got tied of carrying that baggage. It takes to much effort to lug around.

If you don't like what is presented here, then just move on. It doesn't need to get personal. Many here are striving to move forward and we find ourselves surrounded by parasitic behaviors that have only one purpose in mind. To suck the life force out of you. So if you are a parasite just know you are revealing to everyone what you are with lame threats and boring comments. What you can't stand is that someone may have succeeded in the developments of the spirit and are not just talking the talk but walking it. That's in the first hand and you can't touch that. Why do you think that there have been secret societies in the past where a lot of this stuff was kept secret. Because many can't handle the truth. It's your paradigm, and if you want it to be limited so you are comfortable and secure then that is of your choosing. But it is not for you to dishonor someone else's paradigm because of your limitations in yours.

And we wonder why we are at BASE 0. Isn't it obvious as to why? I respect the right to free speech as with many out there. But not the abuse of it and to justify it because someone feels entitled emotionally is an abuse of that gift. It damn sure isn't no blessing. It is one thing to have the right to free speech but another to abuse that right by infliction of negativity onto others. Same with free agency. All the problems we are facing in this sector is because of the abuse and misuse of that gift. You choose!!!!!!!!!!

Meanwhile, back at the ranch...................

Namaste'

[Barcarolle]

Lets face it we are all here for a reason, we have been manipulated and controlled for eons and its now time for us to grow outside the DNA constraints given to us and do the unexpected, break free from the self imposed shackles(remembing who we really are)

We need to remove ego, detach emotional baggage, be completely open minded and aware, and be ready to follow the universal lead.

Was perfectly said in this thread that we cannot leave with baggage, baggage acts as an anchor and a psychic magnet that will forever hold you back. I dont want to do this for another few thousand years, im tired and i also want to go home.

Having a 3D mind will not allow us to recall all we have learned, we will incarnate again with no memory and continue making the same mistakes over and over, by allowing, learning and with focused intent we can outwit the puppet masters and magic makers by evolving ourselves.

Everyone here is on their own journey, we have millions of realities ahead and we right now can choose our own path .... Enjoy the journey, the times ahead are unprecedented and exciting. Allow everyone to be positive, appreciate everyone's views as we all have something to offer, remove the negative energy it does not resonate in here and let your light shine so we all can feel your love so we all can grow together as one.

Lionhawk you have added significant power to this site and my hat goes off to you, some may feel threatened. This place was heading in a backward direction then your arrival rejuvenated some of us in sheer excitement ...... Some others here provide excellent service but unable to allow others to share the center stage, this is not a competition, no medals ceremonys our own reward is going home.

Enjoy all the information we are getting, this stuff will not be available for us much longer...... Study it, love it, decern it, decipher it and above all enjoy it.

Namaste

[Lionhawk]

All I can say is that it isn't about me. I am only trying to share the lessons I have learned on my path. Just know I have been a hard head in my past and to the point where everything came with great sacrifices. In other words I have done it the hard way. Savy? I don't want anyone here to believe me. Absolutely NOT! You have within your hands your very life. It is a responsibility and you will be accountable for it. Check your baggage and you will see what I am speaking of. I didn't come here to prove anything. I also didn't come here to be attacked on any level. But I find that is also happening and I haven't been here a week yet. So there must be something to the energies I am anchoring here is all I can figure. The dark don't like it and ask me if I care. So with that I say we move on and start getting ourselves prepared for what is ahead on our separate paths. There is a sense of great urgency in the air right now and the Field of Potential is about to manifest something. A birth is about to take place and I find that exciting!

Again thank-you for the kind words but forgive me if my head doesn't swell up. Again it isn't about me.

Namaste'

[orthodoxymoron]

Originally Posted by Lionhawk

I didn't say that I agreed with the reported results but I do support the effort of what is trying to be conveyed by Tone3 jaguar. It does exists in that field of potential. So I can accept the possibilities as being probable. There are no limitations. We limit ourselves, PERIOD. But to try to limit everyone's thinking is just a disgrace with the innuendos and ridicules. So if I may say it, Grow up will ya? Every path is different and it isn't your job to say what works for you is to work for everyone else. Hey, if what works for you is working then God Bless you. But if you are coming here to create chaos, because there is something lacking in your paradigm, then you will only end up showing what is lacking within you. Look in the mirror, then get real with yourself because you are the one who is polarizing yourself for more baggage. I got tied of carrying that baggage. It takes to much effort to lug around.

If you don't like what is presented here, then just move on. It doesn't need to get personal. Many here are striving to move forward and we find ourselves surrounded by parasitic behaviors that have only one purpose in mind. To suck the life force out of you. So if you are a parasite just know you are revealing to everyone what you are with lame threats and boring comments. What you can't stand is that someone may have succeeded in the developments of the spirit and are not just talking the talk but walking it. That's in the first hand and you can't touch that. Why do you think that there have been secret societies in the past where a lot of this stuff was kept secret. Because many can't handle the truth. It's your paradigm, and if you want it to be limited so you are comfortable and secure then that is of your choosing. But it is not for you to dishonor someone else's paradigm because of your limitations in yours.

And we wonder why we are at BASE 0. Isn't it obvious as to why? I respect the right to free speech as with many out there. But not the abuse of it and to justify it because someone feels entitled emotionally is an abuse of that gift. It damn sure isn't no blessing. It is one thing to have the right to free speech but another to abuse that right by infliction of negativity onto others. Same with free agency. All the problems we are facing in this sector is because of the abuse and misuse of that gift. You choose!!!!!!!!!!

Meanwhile, back at the ranch...................

Namaste'

It's a problem...isn't it? If the secrets of the universe are revealed to the general public...we go nuts. If the secrets of the universe are concealed within secret societies...they become incredibly corrupt. I vote for revealing the secrets of the universe to the general public. Yes...we will go nuts...but eventually we will get over it and grow up. Then everyone will be an elite. Hopefully we will survive...and become at least a 1 civilization...instead of being a -1. Not making disagreements personal is an excellent place to begin. Just stick to the facts.

[Lionhawk]

Thank-you Sideshow Shaman!

I just figure it is within's everyone's power to know that they have the right to know the truth. Same as the right to defend ones' self. You have the right to be your own sovereign being. You have been given the Gift of Free Agency. What more do you need to realize that all these things are yours to exercise on any level you see fit? Everything else is a management issue. Internal or external. The basics stay the same incarnation after incarnation, but the management issues are always what seems to get changed. It's just an issue of how you manage what you are and in what direction you are going on your journey. The journey could be to anywhere. Enough said.

Namaste'

[14 Chakras]

Originally Posted by orthodoxymoron

It's a problem...isn't it? If the secrets of the universe are revealed to the general public...we go nuts. If the secrets of the universe are concealed within secret societies...they become incredibly corrupt. I vote for revealing the secrets of the universe to the general public. Yes...we will go nuts...but eventually we will get over it and grow up. Then everyone will be an elite. Hopefully we will survive...and become at least a 1 civilization...instead of being a -1. Not making disagreements personal is an excellent place to begin. Just stick to the facts.

An important thing to note, do we really think the bad guys understand the 'secrets of creation'? Personally, I think they are very ignorant to the secrets of creation or they would align themselves very quickly with the light because it really is in the own Self interest. The more karma they create, the more they run from their divine plan, the worse off things are going to get for them.

The more they align with the higher will, the will of the infinite, the more that the true mysteries of creation will be revealed to them, the more they will grow in true power, true wisdom when they are in alignment. Truthfully, it is only ignorance that drives the dark forces, if only they would turn around and pass their test "all would be given unto them".

I suggest the secrets of the universe will not be revealed by the 'secret' societies, because they don't know them at this point! True, the bad guys know the secrets of manipulation, but they don't know truth, or they'd align themselves with it, because it's to their best interest to do so from an enlightened standpoint!

The secrets will be uncovered, discovered, and revealed by those that are in alignment with the higher Will, which is the will that is 'win win' for all life.

Let's see if we can all "win" here on this forum too! It's all about coming up higher for each one of us after all, together we are more... nice to have the varying viewpoints, that's what drives things forward.

[14 Chakras]

Sharing my understanding on the ascension bit:

Ascending out of this world is not something that we're looking to do at this important time.

The goal is to ascend in consciousness while remaining here so that we can help with the collective ascension . To be in the world but not of it. To be in the game, but see through it.

Any talk that we are supposed to 'disappear' I would suggest is dangerous talk... However, I understand that in the example with Jim Self he may be talking about people that have passed from the body (died), then ascended, this is a good thing, they graduate from the schoolroom and don't have to come back here under amnesia again...

For us here though, we're here for a big party!!!

Raising up and healing of this planet and all of it's people is what we came here to do, let's enjoy our jobs and celebrate our planet and the goodness that abounds here when we know where to look .

[Anchor]

Originally Posted by Lionhawk

I'm very tired of swimming in a polluted river with a bunch of floating debris that I find myself exerting extra effort just to navigate around.

Strength to you!

Reminder: You chose this Your probably regretting it sometimes, but it is quite helpful to remember that you chose, and you are a very qualified and very strong swimmer.

I for one am glad you did choose. We need all the help we can get down here.

There is a saying that I heard around these parts. The truth will set you free but first it will p!ss you off. What I see is that people on here - looking for answers are finding those answers of the p!ss-off variety.

A..

[Lionhawk]

Originally Posted by Anchor

Strength to you!

Reminder: You chose this Your probably regretting it sometimes, but it is quite helpful to remember that you chose, and you are a very qualified and very strong swimmer.

I for one am glad you did choose. We need all the help we can get down here.

There is a saying that I heard around these parts. The truth will set you free but first it will p!ss you off. What I see is that people on here - looking for answers are finding those answers of the p!ss-off variety.

A..

Anchor said it plain as day. "The truth will set you free but first it will p!ss you off."

I revealed a truth. Why? To bring to your awareness what is happening in the now. I don't have any regrets doing that. None! I wasn't looking for trouble when I came here. I'm also not here to create trouble. But I am here to share and the truth of what I know. It is a choice to observe it or not. At the same time, going back to this truth, I have every right to defend myself. How I do that is another story. One that they haven't figured out yet. It's like this. I have been attacked. Not because I went looking for it. I am also not the only one who has been attacked. I'm also not talking about how one may be attacked on a thread either. I'm talking about behind the scenes. With the use of technology that I have seen them use before. Again I didn't go looking for it. That was when I first started to bring this out in the open. I have better things to be doing then deal with this kind of thing. But at the same time, I have seen what kind of damage this stuff can do. I figure that if people have a heads up they can prevent bad stuff from happening. You can't do that if you just sit on the fence. I'm not sitting on the fence. Another thing is that if I didn't see all the positive people who are here, I would just probably leave myself. I came here because the work that many are doing to expose the truth, is so important in the now. I came to contribute. Not take. I brought my gifts and my talents, to help. That's it. Whether you accept that help is of your choosing. I have already been doing that. The results are showing up and I can only hope that it adds to the log pile that others here have already stacked up in these terms. We are here to help each other on any level we are capable of. So get a grip and either participate in the "SOULUTION, " or just sit on the fence and watch it pass by you. It matters not to me as I find these times very exciting and more exciting as I participate in them. Savy? If there is another way of putting it, it is walking the walk. Not talking the talk. I can back up what I am saying and it is no ego trip. So spare me that will ya?

Myplanet2,

Thanks for your input and I get for the most part of what you're saying. But I also have to tell you that this is not a game. Maybe some are treating it like a game, but it is no game. If you were to have contact with any real ascended being out there, they will tell you that the darkside is here. These things even have the gall, to attack Heaven. They don't succeed but they try. I can't sugar coat it as others have. If the emissaries from Heaven say that we are in a war and that it is a battle for souls, then just look around and tell me that is false. When I look around, I see it. Not because I want to. Again the truth will set you free. What you don't know is that I have been fighting for my right to live since I can remember. My childhood was terrifying. By the time I was 7, I had experienced a Draconian, an abduction attempt, and lived in a house that would make the movie Poltergeist look like a cartoon. So you bet I take this stuff seriously. You wouldn't want to have this resume'. Hell I don't even want it but I have had to make due with the cards that were dealt me. What else can you do but try to make the best of it? Also to still have some kind of sense of humor. It's like this.... If you are a lighted being, they want to snuff you out. Plain and that simple. Their hate is what drives them and it is our love of Creation that drives us to go forward. Even the best of the best are prone for an attack. Not because they asked for it. Nobody in their right mind wants that. It is a perception. It is also whether you can perceive the whole spectrum and not just limited parts of it.

When I was young, my father took up the bottle because he didn't know how to deal with what was happening in the home place. He wanted to numb his perception because of what was going was beyond any explanation. When you are a parent, one of the first instincts is to protect your young. He didn't have any answers as to how to do that. When these things come after your kids, it gives a whole new meaning to the word game.

When you have friends, you also want to protect them. Hiding behind some rock somewhere isn't going to get that done. It's also selfish. On the same lines of suicide. A very selfish act. I am not about to hide from it now. I don't know how.

But make no mistake as a battle has been going on for years. Ets and the rest of it. That is why it is important that we at this forum and everywhere else, do what we can to insure that we become into being. In the meantime, I am going to do what I can behind the scenes, to insure, that the mess is dealt with. It has already begun and there are more here that concur with that because they have seen what has happened. It just isn't a forum, it is a place where souls gather to improve themselves to become into being. The forum is just a template, an intersection where this can take place. Look at where everyone is addressing from. All over the World. This is where we are at. Anchored in this 3D and in order for us to move upward, we have to just shed all the stuff and just BE.
Then the real work begins. Many are striving to graduate. Once you graduate, then you go to work. There are those also here, that could have left already as in what you call ascension, but because of the nature of what is going on, they are staying behind to see this whole thing through. Many think it is about their ascension. That's the illusion. It's about Gaia's ascension and that is why we are here. We came to assist her. Whatever that takes.

If you end up on a ship, you will have more responsibilities than you could dream of. No one is going home so quickly. But you will have better facilities and tools to assist what is about to happen. Do you think these Ets are here to just fly by and say Hi? We're here. They have been assisting the Planet for eons. The good ones that is. I can't help it that we have bad ones too. I didn't make or write any of this up. It isn't scifi. It just is. It is about the battle for souls. It is whether or not you choose where you decide where you make your stand.

So with that I want you to know I am making a stand in this forum. I will not go hide behind a rock. But rest assured I will make this stand with others as well because we know the value and importance that this format can achieve in terms of light. In terms of growth. My fire is lit, and you are more than welcomed to throw a log onto it. I gladly share it for the cause is greater than most will ever know.

In humble service, I bid you all a great day!

Let the truth set you free! Right on Anchor!

[Myplanet2]

fair enough, T3J. Nothing in your answer to disagree with.

Maybe one little clarification. I do believe it can be of benefit to spell out that the likelihood is that a lot of people will exit the game in the next while, and that it's by choice. This way, there is the option of not being drawn into the lower bands out of Grief or desire for revenge, etc. It leaves a way open to encounter death and not have your frequency knocked down as a result.

If it's possible to maintain a victim mentality, it's possible to return to fear and anger as ways of reacting, rather than to exercise choice in how one will deal.

everything else harmonizes with the model I currently favour.

[Myplanet2]

Lionhawk, I'm sorry, but no. We are miles apart in our perspectives.

disengaging is not hiding. Walking away from a conflict is not hiding, nor is it a sign of a lack of courage. If it is true that no one wins a fight, and that it simply strengthens a polarity, then deciding one will "take a stand" is simply an intentional prolonging of a terminally ill game. And yes, it is a game. Not the slightest shadow of a doubt about that. It can look all serious and scary with 3D eyes and emotions, but it's just a silly little game from another perspective, which is where I choose to look from.

If you succeed in turning Avalon into some sort of battleground where "good" makes its final stand against "evil", and it actually takes hold, then I'll take my final leave of this place with all alacrity, because I'm not interested in taking a thousand steps back after all the forward progress I've made in being here, and learning and growing, over the last year.

fear holds no interest for me at this point.

All the ascended beings I've been in contact with, including those who've never descended in the first place, meaning they never came down into the lower realms to have that experience and then having to work their way back up and out, say virtually the same thing. Yes, there is dark, but it's so the light will mean something, and it's only seen as polarized to the degree that you describe in good ole 3D. nowhere higher than that. It's our 3D perspective to take that view. I've addressed the issue of the idea of battles in heaven and the creator in a power struggle with some entity that thinks it knows better, and all that fantasy, and the 12th dimensional beings say that's nonsense. never happened. It's hilarious to even consider. Its 3D invention. Ask the being formerly known as Jesus, or ask Archangel Metatron, or Michael. The story originates in our realm, not theirs.

After sorting that controversy out, the higher dimensional beings go on to describe how to disentangle ourselves from this "mess" as you put it, and never once has one of them that I've talked to, said "fight", or "take a stand".

Not sure what your "ships" reference refers to. The only higher dimensional beings I'm in contact with who even use ships, are the Arcturians, and we'd never see those if they didn't want us to. The Arcturians are my primary guides, personally, and they are warriors and protectors. They don't fight. They use love to restore harmony, as do all the rest.

The way up and out of this mess is not to follow the patterns that got us into it. Einstein said something about a problem requiring a higher level of consciousness to solve it than the one that created it. I agree with this view in this case.

Anything which guides you towards conflict, is not of the highest light. Of that I am also 100% certain. You have to watch who you talk to.

[tone3jaguar]

Lionhawk,

I was once in the hostile universe paradigm. Actually I am 32 and I was in that paradigm for 31 years. That was the logical conclusion that I had come to based off of what I had seen and experienced which is very similar to what you describe. Even now I have this dualistic consciousness where sometimes I am in the old paradigm and sometimes I am peaceful in the new one. The new one being that the dark supernatural happenings in my life where actually a necessary catalyst for the development of my soul. I am still in the process of phasing out of the old hostile universe paradigm and into the peaceful universe paradigm. I think that this is exactly where I am supposed to be right now.

It is truly enigmatic because on the one hand I know that all forces regardless of polarity are all part of the learning template here in 3d reality. On the other hand when ever I am faced with the now rare circumstances of a supernatural or technological attack I go defensive because that is part of my warrior nature. Then every time after it is over I look back at what happened with impartiality because I know that it was all just an illusion.

[tone3jaguar]

Here is another good way of visualizing the whole timeline deal that I found on a Google image search. I am not sure who came up with this, but I think it is a great graphic to explain the logistics.

[Myplanet2]

Originally Posted by tone3jaguar

Here is another good way of visualizing the whole timeline deal that I found on a Google image search. I am not sure who came up with this, but I think it is a great graphic to explain the logistics.

Bashar and the 9th Dimensional Pleiadian collective have excellent descriptions for this multiple timeline model. Their description includes covering how the model changes as our perceptions and vibrational frequency change. Not far from the linear perspective that is more customary for us still, is the notion that all these parallel universes coexist in the now, outside of 3D, and not even in the sense of running concurrently, but literally now. A single point in which everything happens, and we simply choose from the smorgasbord of experiences. So that shifts the notion of us having lived so many times, to the notion of a large number of examples of Me having the experience of a lifetime, at the same time, and if we contact another one, we are drawing on the experience of another me, all coordinated by our higherselves/oversouls.

To project out from this premise, you have to bend your linear 3D consciousness tools to see that the entire round trip learning experience away from All that is (insert label of choice) took no time. it was a singularity which occurred in not time at all.

A hint of the scope of the intelligence at work here.

[Lionhawk]

Tone3Jaguar,

Yes the paradigm. That term can screw with your head if you're not careful. Everyone's understanding of that is a personal one at best. But if we look at it in dimensions it makes better sense to me. But the word paradigm gives the idea of endless possibilities of what you want. Now this is where I have to back up and not put the cart before the horse.

When you are two years old, it's not like you have any spelling B trophies. Or have any education to speak of. You barely have any sense of where the toilet is. You have no idea where that stuff goes. Heck, they didn't even have kindergarten when I came up in my little town. I must be getting old. Never thought I would ever say that.

This stuff is dimensional to me. Heaven as most call it, is in the very paradigm that everyone seems to want to get away from. That shift has not occurred yet as far as I know it. It might shift to another paradigm after 2012 but it hasn't yet. Maybe in another time line. The possibilities are endless. My point is I am in the now dealing with the present paradigm as it stands. Anything else is just la la land. I'm not saying it isn't real but I am in this one and that is where I am working from. I am grounded here as with everyone else. If you were in another paradigm we wouldn't be having this conversation. So I am dealing with what I have. As far as I can tell , we are still in a hostile paradigm.

It isn't like I could go back to another paradigm either, in this life stream. They would be different worlds apart. What I am saying is that we chose to come here in this time line and that is what we are dealing with. We were birthed here into all this stuff. We were born into it. Some born into a war, famine, cold, and every possibility imaginable with it's polarity. It is what it is here. I have heard people say we will be going into the fifth like it is going to be one cool ride. At the same time they don't work on advancing themselves to change their base frequency to match those higher densities. It's just dreamland as in another paradigm that they feel entitled to. What I am saying is that we are here and everything else is somewhere else until we accomplish what needs to be done here first. The cart before the horse is just a crazy painting. I don't need to complicate what is already complicated. I strive to simplify it the best way I can so that I can see clearly what I have to do next. I'm not going to be skipping the rungs on a ladder just so I can get there quicker with the possibility of risking the missing of a rung. It's a long fall. I just want to get it right the first time so I don't have to go back and start all over again. Been there done that. Who hasn't?

Just know that where we are is still here. The big picture isn't pretty and it is how we swim through it. The more stuff that is hanging off you the slower you'll be able to swim. Granted we are striving to get to that other paradigm but we have to swim through here first. I know I can't have a bunch of stuff hanging on me anyways. I sink without as it is.

[tone3jaguar]

Jumping on the MP2 bandwagon, another quote from Einstein...

"The the most important decision a person will ever make is if they live in a hostile universe or a peaceful one."

Even if your reality right now seems apparently fixed, it could change in an instant with one shift in your set of core beliefs. One time I had a massive shift in consciousness when I first woke up to the spiritual world almost 13 years ago. The reality was so much different that there where even buildings where there did not used to be buildings. That is how radically one can shift their timeline.

[Swanny]

Some interesting ideas here.
It's great how the mind works, you can think to yourself that you have it all worked out, even find people that think along the same lines as you, and then something new pops up and that that was so true doesn't quite fit anymore.
It's safe to say none of us know where we are headed, we just think we might have an idea.
IMO the most important thing is not to let the ego take over and look down on others just because you think you know something they don't, only an ars ehole would do such a thing, and my bet is that they don't allow over inflated egos in the next dimension

[Myplanet2]

Originally Posted by tone3jaguar

Lionhawk,

I was once in the hostile universe paradigm. Actually I am 32 and I was in that paradigm for 31 years. That was the logical conclusion that I had come to based off of what I had seen and experienced which is very similar to what you describe. Even now I have this dualistic consciousness where sometimes I am in the old paradigm and sometimes I am peaceful in the new one. The new one being that the dark supernatural happenings in my life where actually a necessary catalyst for the development of my soul. I am still in the process of phasing out of the old hostile universe paradigm and into the peaceful universe paradigm. I think that this is exactly where I am supposed to be right now.

It is truly enigmatic because on the one hand I know that all forces regardless of polarity are all part of the learning template here in 3d reality. On the other hand when ever I am faced with the now rare circumstances of a supernatural or technological attack I go defensive because that is part of my warrior nature. Then every time after it is over I look back at what happened with impartiality because I know that it was all just an illusion.

Here's a tidbit from Jim Self, T3J. Paradox only means what we understand it to mean in 3D. In 4D and beyond, it actually means what was true before, may not be true now, and what was false before, may not be false now. This is interesting because it is the basis of choice, and also has the interesting quality of bypassing the apparency of time. This is what changes the past to bring it in support of the now moment. And changes the future to bring it into support of the now moment. 4th and 5th D have no then. It provides choice. We choose now, and "then" supports our choice. too cool.