Will you leave if the forum is a Paid Subscription?

[Bill Ryan]

Originally Posted by Kris Riley

If I was to donate my time authoring the dvds, which is something I do for work. The replicating of 200 dvds with cases and labels would cost about 1500 dollars (possibly less) and it would be decent enough to sell. You might make twice as much as you payed for duplicating and printing off sales. Also the place I work for can also do the sales and mailings of dvds to people and pay the royalties to Bill & Kerry. It's all about what you would want to spend.

Thanks, Kris - this is much appreciated.

Clearly it's a good idea. There would need to be a third-party system in place, and the same goes for merchandising and other similar 'added value' ideas. But this has to be possible to set up.

John aka#404 summarized our position well on the previous page. Here it is again - with some further added thoughts as Kerry and I debate this further:

We understand all the points of view and respect them fully. We're not at all decided how best to proceed. The problem we're trying to solve is basically how to fund Camelot... Avalon costs almost nothing to host compared with the running costs of the entire Camelot enterprise.

The problem is that we're running out of money and we have to find some way of keeping afloat. Lots of people do not realize that we sell nothing, have no independent financial support, and have gone way out on very thin ice in order to do our work, all of which has been made available for free.

Camelot's research will always remain free - because no-one can own this important information, that belongs to all of humanity. That is our firm position re Camelot and will never change.

Various solutions considered:

Advertising: never.

Merchandising: yes, good idea, if everything can be handled by a third party.

DVDs/CDs: all of our videos, transcripts and audios so far would fit on maybe 10 CDs, which could be sold as a set for about $90. It sure saves a LOT of downloading... and at less than $1 per hour for watching (and keeping) this material and all it contains, has to be pretty good value.

DVDs are a slightly different (higher quality) product... maybe of our most popular videos. If we sold separate DVDs of each interview, it'd be quite a catalog - and some items might not be as popular as others.

Donate buttons: they're at the foot of all our pages, on both sites, except the forum itself. We could add them to the forum pages... but it might be a bit of a coding challenge as the forum template software is not easy to amend. Prompts that we really appreciate donations (and are dependent on them!) do make a difference, and we do fully take that point.

The Book of Camelot: we have someone who's promised they will publish anything we write... but, actually, self-publishing might be a better way to go (or simply creating an online e-book). We do have a lot to write about, and all we need is the time.

Subscriptions:

* If we charged a nominal fee for membership, the forum would always remain accessible on a read-only basis to all visitors. We'd never once considered anything different.

* Having read all comments and suggestions, we're now thinking of an extremely modest $1 per month subscription - with the option, when registering, of choosing to add-on a regular, small voluntary monthly donation.

* We're also considering ways in which members could sponsor other nominated members. (Those with a genuinely tight budget, or with no bank accounts, might somehow flag a request for support in their member profile. No shame, just practicalities that we understand.) We welcome feedback.

We think that we we implemented all of the above, it would all work and Camelot's mission could continue. We can't really know until we do it.

I'd like to state again that we fully and respect understand all members' views on this and the other thread, and the very helpful way that all these views have been expressed. We're not in any way trying to lock anyone out: but we have no other sources of funding, and we're totally reliant on some system - now outlined above - which is at once a fair response for our work and continues to make all the information available.

Very best wishes to all, Bill

[orb]

Oh $12 a year is not bad. Also you could allow people to upload their own avitar if they pay, and use a canned avitar is they have not paid. And maybe have a $75 a year option where they get a great fancy cool t**** or something.

Originally Posted by Bill Ryan

* Having read all comments and suggestions, we're now thinking of an extremely modest $1 per month subscription - with the option, when registering, of choosing to add-on a regular, small voluntary monthly donation.

[dreb13]

Originally Posted by Bill Ryan

.
* Having read all comments and suggestions, we're now thinking of an extremely modest $1 per month subscription - with the option, when registering, of choosing to add-on a regular, small voluntary monthly donation.

2,709 active members as of 11/17/08
2709 * $1 a month = $2,709 a month.
$2,709 a month * 12 months = $32,508 a year

A buck a month sounds like it could go a long way....imagine $2 bucks

[Swanny]

Can we wait until the $ crashes before we pay???

[Dean Plejaren]

2,709 active members as of 11/17/08
2709 * $1 a month = $2,709 a month.
$2,709 a month * 12 months = $32,508 a year

That's assuming everyone subscribes. Take away my dollar..

[deepblu777]

WANTED: Job that pays me more than the $26.32 a day. I work for the school system and that's what I make...unless school is closed,
then I make -0-.

I feel for everyone trying to get by, these guys are doing a great job and I sure don't expect them to do it for free, either.

All my best wishes for us all...I'll still check in to read and look for new links to info. I will appreciate that, VERY MUCH!

I won't be able to thank you again or offer up any thoughts but I still have my own energy to put out there, so that will have to do.

Been nice communicating!

Love to all the Folks!

[dreb13]

Originally Posted by Dean Plejaren

That's assuming everyone subscribes. Take away my dollar..

I chose "active members" in that figure and not "members" assuming that most of the active members would chip in a buck a month.

There are 5,327 "members" listed as of 11/18/08 and I assume that most of them will not pay a fee to post on the forum.

[iainl140285]

All the info will remain 100% free from my understanding.
Anybody can view - no different from what it is now.

The only slightly backward thing is - if you have information or wish to express your opinion/ideas YOU will have to pay get it out there! Weird.
So, do you feel your info. good valuable enough to share?



Peace
Iain

[yikes!]

I think I can swing a $1, count me in for that during these hard times.

[ADAM KADMON]

Bill Ryan,

I have written you a PM suggesting more profitable alternatives rather than converting the forum to a paid subscription. I hope you will find time to read my message and respond, I think it would benefit everyone here and allow us to keep this forum for free which I think is ideal for everyone involved.

Since I've been doing internet marketing for the better part of 10 years, I know from personal experience subscription based forums, while appealing to the owner, does not appeal to many others. And the "fall out" of people would be great. If you have 2,700 members now, and 1/2 of them are active, you can count on only 20-30% of those active users sticking around once it's being switched to a paid model. Further, merchant accounts and automatic rebilling software and interfaces have a monthly operating cost. Finally, the fall out of peoples credit cards expiring, declines, and charge backs can quickly eat up any margins profits a model like this might bring in...

Thus, I propose a solution that will your supports will respond positively too and rather than dimish your following and subscriber base, indeed raise it and be vastly more profitable. I do hope, you will find the time to respond as it addresses everyone's needs and employs a skill-set I am proud to say have made me financially well off.

Hope to hear back,
Adam K.

I haven't read thru every post on this thread, so i don't know if anyone has suggested the following! if so my apologies in advance.

-how about asking for free will donations from members! whichever amount one can afford to donate!

[Karen]

I posted this to the new threads that have popped up on this subject - and I will read through the posts here to present any ideas and suggestions to Bill and Kerry and the mod team.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
If you cannot afford the minimal option of $1 per month, there will be other options available. Some members will gift in those who cannot pay. You could help out the project in some way. Just let us know ... post a Private Message to me or post here if you would like to find an option to stay.

The only limit is the lack of imagination to pursue solutions. We will do what is possible for those who want to stay.

For those who are leaving based on philosophical objections, without some income, Bill and Kerry will not be able to continue their work. This subscription fee is just one of many ideas, but others will take more time to implement.

Brainstorming ideas is encouraged. Please do not be disparaged.

Karen

[Rebel4Life]

hmmm will our stuff that we post get censored? I had a thread going and someone closed it down...why? Too much truth getting out there? An actual solution to the problem? I had a thread on common law going in case your wondering what it was about...

[Karen]

Originally Posted by Rebel4Life

hmmm will our stuff that we post get censored?

No, there is not any censorship as far as ideas. Rude and abrasive attitudes and a few other factors caused several hundred threads to be placed in an out of view review area. We are working on reviewing and restoring them as quickly as possible. The list was notified of this, but we realize it is highly unlikely that everyone can read all the posts.

I had a thread going and someone closed it down...why?

See above. Many threads were moved to the correct topic areas, we are now putting in a place holder to direct you to the new location.

Too much truth getting out there?

No, those types of suppositions have been made more than once, but as far as I know, no thread has been closed for content. I am new to the mod team and I don't know everything yet, but I think I'm right on that one.

An actual solution to the problem? I had a thread on common law going in case your wondering what it was about...

Carol has stated several times, we can find your thread and return it to the forum as soon as possible if you ask. I'll see if I can find it for you. It was mostly a matter of logistics, too many members too fast, too many posts, and not enough moderators/moderators stepping down. We do apologize and are working on making improvements, Karen

You can send me or any mod a private message if you have more questions.

[Bill Ryan]

Originally Posted by Rebel4Life

hmmm will our stuff that we post get censored? I had a thread going and someone closed it down...why? Too much truth getting out there? An actual solution to the problem? I had a thread on common law going in case your wondering what it was about...

Hi, Rebel:

Your thread almost certinly didn't get deleted. VERY few threads ever are. This is a rumor that has started and is just not true.

Some threads are MOVED (to an area where they are better categorized), and some are temporarily moved to a moderators' area for review. There's been a large backlog of these, but many have been sorted out now.

The problem has been that when a thread is bookmarked (or referenced in a blog, e.g.) then it SEEMS not to be there any more, and a rather brutal message shows up which says "You don't have permission to access this page".

It's a limitation of the vBulletin software that we cannot change that message - as best I know. It gives entirely the wrong message. It SHOULD say [something like]

"This thread has been moved to ________ . Please wait while we redirect you", or

"This thread has temporarily been moved to the moderators' area for review, and will be reposted as soon as possible."

We apologize for this limitation, and there's nothing we can do to change the messages or automatically redirect the pages. The solution is to use the Search function to find the threads (or individual posts) - you'll almost always find they're still on the forum.

Very best wisehs, Bill

[iainl140285]

Are the whistleblowers expected to pay to share their knowledge?

[Bill Ryan]

Originally Posted by iainl140285

Are the whistleblowers expected to pay to share their knowledge?

No.

[nibiru]

Sounds good and fair...the cosmic lesson for this is : Service to self- service to others in a balanced format.
Just please, i repeat, please open up diversity in payment methods... Not all of the users have credit cards, others do not move around with debit cards and for many others paypal is unexisting in their home countries...maybe a bank account number could work as an option also...and thank you very,very much for opening this forum...
Long live for project avalon !

[Karen]

Yes, there will be other payment options, including a PO Box for Snail Mail. PM me if you want to use Snail Mail. I don't have the address now, but will get it.

Originally Posted by nibiru

Sounds good and fair...the cosmic lesson for this is : Service to self- service to others in a balanced format.
Just please, i repeat, please open up diversity in payment methods... Not all of the users have credit cards, others do not move around with debit cards and for many others paypal is unexisting in their home countries...maybe a bank account number could work as an option also...and thank you very,very much for opening this forum...
Long live for project avalon !