Go Back   Old Project Avalon Forum (ARCHIVE) > Project Camelot Forum > Project Camelot > Project Camelot General Discussion

Notices

Project Camelot General Discussion Reactions, feedback and suggestions on interviews, current events and experiences.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-04-2010, 12:45 PM   #1
Kojak
Avalon Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 15
Default Mr Laviolette?? please explain??

I recently saw Paul on camelot and was very impressed, and bought his book. I thought this would be a must for the library. Now I've just seen some information that requires some clarification from him. I must say though, I'm not here to cause trouble ,although this post would look that way. I admire Kerry and Bill and believe they act with integrity, I have watched all their videos, they do an excellent job, excellent!! We're all different, and all pushing for the "truth". Anyway, here's a link for you regarding the issue, the story is about 3/4 the way down, and here's the cut and paste below-

http://www.realityzone.com/currentperiod.html

SECRETS OF ANTI-GRAVITY DEBUNKED
2009 Dec 27 from Brian McDermott
I recently purchased a book from you that you have been promoting on your website, entitled “Secrets of Antigravity Propulsion,” by one Paul A. LaViolette, Ph.D. May I say at the outset, that I am mystified as to how anyone could possibly have a Ph.D. and write such a book.

I scrolled down the contents page, and was absolutely gob-smacked to find a chapter there, Chapter 10 on Page 296, on what the author called “The Searl Effect.” I thought the author would be calling Searl to heel for misleading the public with his absolute nonsense; but, upon reading the chapter, I found that he went on waxing lyrical, singing the praises of the “Searl” machine, what it was supposed to do, what effects it had, how it “glowed in the dark,” how it “lifted itself off the table”, and went up and “banged against the ceiling”, how the “roller” magnets rolled around the ring, how it “went up into space”, etc. etc.

Let me explain my very own experiences with John Searl, some years ago now. As Past-President of the Inventors’ Association here in Australia, when I lived on the Gold Coast for some years, and with some successful patents to my credit and runs on the board – one of them winning the AUSTRADE Australian Export-of-the-Year Award for 1989 - I first heard and read about John Searl and what he was supposed to have done, in a magazine here, who obviously bought his story, as I did, in my naivete at the time, and trusting him, I spoke to him a number of times on the phone from here in Australia, and he invited me over to where he lived in north London, as his house guest, to inspect his “generator,” with a view to investing in it and developing it. He gave me next to no details over the phone.

After some consideration, and as I had some time and money on my hands at the time, I accepted his offer, and arranged to spend 10 days over there as his house guest. John Searl met me at Heathrow airport, and took me to a rented shack in th north London suburb, in what was a very low-class accommodation, a real hovel, to say the least. That was the first shock. After having a cup of tea and a piece of toast, we began to talk, and it took me about 20 to 25 minutes to come to the realisation that Searle didn’t have anything! NOTHING! He couldn’t even talk properly! All he wanted was for me to give him money!

He spoke of how his first “generator” took off on its own accord, glowing, and went up and bounced against the ceiling, the second one flew off into space, and he lost it – it never came back! The next one he made also took off and did the same thing, and it went up and flew over Denmark, and he had to contact some “amateur radio operators” over there and instruct them to send up some signals to it, which then turned it around and brought it back home, safe and sound! I asked him how he knew it was over Denmark, and he couldn’t answer that. I asked him how he knew who to contact amongst the amateur radio operators in Denmark, and he couldn’t answer that either. I asked him what frequencies he told them to transmit, he couldn’t answer that either. I asked him how they could transmit signals to a “saucer” that didn’t have any radio receivers or controls in it, and no steering gear or navigation equipment (I am a commercial pilot and former flying instructor also), he couldn’t answer that either. I could immediately tell that he was making up his stories as he spoke. Nothing made sense.

I asked him where it was now, and he said they dismantled it! I asked him where were the parts then, and or the NdFeB magnets, which were expensive, and he couldn’t answer that either. He made an attempt to convince me that it worked, and how it worked, and when he sensed, and then realised that I was not believing him, he stopped talking, and a couple of big crocodile tears rolled slowly down his face. He didn’t try any more.

He spoke of neodymium – he couldn’t even speak properly, or pronounce words properly, he didn’t even know what the properties of NdFeB magnets were, he didn’t even have one magnet in his place – no bits and pieces, nothing. Moreover, he had no technical knowledge whatsoever. I was absolutely flabbergasted how someone could carry on like John Searl did, trying to con money out of people. I am even more flabbergasted how someone with a PhD could write about him the way he has in this book. He hasn’t done any homework whatsoever. It is simply an outrageous compilation of plagiarism, to sell a book. Had I known that he had written up Searl, Townsend Brown, et al in the book, I never would have purchased it. It’s A CON!




I would love to know what's going here, who's telling the truth? Unfortunately this diverts us from the main game, but we need answers nonetheless.
Kojak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2010, 03:10 PM   #2
abraxasinas
_
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Queanbeyan/Canberra; NSW, Australia
Posts: 635
Default Re: Mr Laviolette?? please explain??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kojak View Post
I recently saw Paul on camelot and was very impressed, and bought his book. I thought this would be a must for the library. Now I've just seen some information that requires some clarification from him. I must say though, I'm not here to cause trouble ,although this post would look that way. I admire Kerry and Bill and believe they act with integrity, I have watched all their videos, they do an excellent job, excellent!! We're all different, and all pushing for the "truth". Anyway, here's a link for you regarding the issue, the story is about 3/4 the way down, and here's the cut and paste below-

http://www.realityzone.com/currentperiod.html

SECRETS OF ANTI-GRAVITY DEBUNKED
2009 Dec 27 from Brian McDermott
I recently purchased a book from you that you have been promoting on your website, entitled “Secrets of Antigravity Propulsion,” by one Paul A. LaViolette, Ph.D. May I say at the outset, that I am mystified as to how anyone could possibly have a Ph.D. and write such a book.

I scrolled down the contents page, and was absolutely gob-smacked to find a chapter there, Chapter 10 on Page 296, on what the author called “The Searl Effect.” I thought the author would be calling Searl to heel for misleading the public with his absolute nonsense; but, upon reading the chapter, I found that he went on waxing lyrical, singing the praises of the “Searl” machine, what it was supposed to do, what effects it had, how it “glowed in the dark,” how it “lifted itself off the table”, and went up and “banged against the ceiling”, how the “roller” magnets rolled around the ring, how it “went up into space”, etc. etc.

Let me explain my very own experiences with John Searl, some years ago now. As Past-President of the Inventors’ Association here in Australia, when I lived on the Gold Coast for some years, and with some successful patents to my credit and runs on the board – one of them winning the AUSTRADE Australian Export-of-the-Year Award for 1989 - I first heard and read about John Searl and what he was supposed to have done, in a magazine here, who obviously bought his story, as I did, in my naivete at the time, and trusting him, I spoke to him a number of times on the phone from here in Australia, and he invited me over to where he lived in north London, as his house guest, to inspect his “generator,” with a view to investing in it and developing it. He gave me next to no details over the phone.

After some consideration, and as I had some time and money on my hands at the time, I accepted his offer, and arranged to spend 10 days over there as his house guest. John Searl met me at Heathrow airport, and took me to a rented shack in th north London suburb, in what was a very low-class accommodation, a real hovel, to say the least. That was the first shock. After having a cup of tea and a piece of toast, we began to talk, and it took me about 20 to 25 minutes to come to the realisation that Searle didn’t have anything! NOTHING! He couldn’t even talk properly! All he wanted was for me to give him money!

He spoke of how his first “generator” took off on its own accord, glowing, and went up and bounced against the ceiling, the second one flew off into space, and he lost it – it never came back! The next one he made also took off and did the same thing, and it went up and flew over Denmark, and he had to contact some “amateur radio operators” over there and instruct them to send up some signals to it, which then turned it around and brought it back home, safe and sound! I asked him how he knew it was over Denmark, and he couldn’t answer that. I asked him how he knew who to contact amongst the amateur radio operators in Denmark, and he couldn’t answer that either. I asked him what frequencies he told them to transmit, he couldn’t answer that either. I asked him how they could transmit signals to a “saucer” that didn’t have any radio receivers or controls in it, and no steering gear or navigation equipment (I am a commercial pilot and former flying instructor also), he couldn’t answer that either. I could immediately tell that he was making up his stories as he spoke. Nothing made sense.

I asked him where it was now, and he said they dismantled it! I asked him where were the parts then, and or the NdFeB magnets, which were expensive, and he couldn’t answer that either. He made an attempt to convince me that it worked, and how it worked, and when he sensed, and then realised that I was not believing him, he stopped talking, and a couple of big crocodile tears rolled slowly down his face. He didn’t try any more.

He spoke of neodymium – he couldn’t even speak properly, or pronounce words properly, he didn’t even know what the properties of NdFeB magnets were, he didn’t even have one magnet in his place – no bits and pieces, nothing. Moreover, he had no technical knowledge whatsoever. I was absolutely flabbergasted how someone could carry on like John Searl did, trying to con money out of people. I am even more flabbergasted how someone with a PhD could write about him the way he has in this book. He hasn’t done any homework whatsoever. It is simply an outrageous compilation of plagiarism, to sell a book. Had I known that he had written up Searl, Townsend Brown, et al in the book, I never would have purchased it. It’s A CON!




I would love to know what's going here, who's telling the truth? Unfortunately this diverts us from the main game, but we need answers nonetheless.
Yes Kojak; I had similar experiences about 'pretend' scientific inventors and 'pioneers'.
Paul LaViolette is similar to Tom Van Flandern; both are 'fair dinkum' scientists with PhD's from respectable universities.
BUT both of them, in the course of their investigations, decided that there are fundamental 'mistakes' in the 'standard models' of the scientific paradigms.

Now of course there are humungous improvements to be made of those 'standard models'; BUT just as Einstein DID NOT 'throw out' Newton, but used Newtonian Mechanics as a Basis to build upon; so will the 'scientific revolutions' be necessarily build upon the basis of the Relativities.

Both Paul and Tom decided to 'throw out' Einstein and so soon 'lost credibility' in their respective academic environments.

Then both went 'alternative' and sought for avenues to 'validate' their 'heresy from the mainstream' in encompassing parts of the 'alternative science' movement whenever suited to their own agendas.

So I presume that Paul LaViolette came across some of Searle's (yes I remeber him being published in what was it Nexus, New Dawn?) claims and he then found correlations with his concepts, presuming of course, that Searle's claims would be true.

You, unfortunately have found out by personal experience, that the 'smart scientists' are as biased in their judgements as everyone else, when it suits personal egocentricities.

My experience was with an American, Joseph Carter, who published in a Melbourne alternative magazine called Nemesis (now defunct). In this magazine he 'made friends' with the editor in praising his efforts to 'expose' the bankrupt fiscal and medical systems on this planet. (The editor, George, was rather informed about alternative medicine and the banking rorts, but knew very little about science).

So Joseph Carter claimed himself to be 'the greatest physicist' who ever lived; he had solved the Fermat's Last Theorem (Years before Andrew Wiles actually did so at Cambridge); he was constantly monitored by the CIA and the FBI, who wanted his great inventions and on and on.

Now and this is important for anyone reading this; Joseph REALLY BELIEVED this to be so and was in no manner trying to con anyone.
How can I tell?
He handwrote over three long pages in meticulous handwriting outlining his 'brilliance and genius' to me as someone who had 'challenged' his scientific understanding via the editorial section of Nemesis.
Iow, Joseph had dismissed the tides as a gravitational phenomenon, ridiculed the Einstein Universe and Quantum Mechanics and on and on.

Reading his 'ideas of how the universe works', made me write a lengthy letter to the editor (all of this occurred over a decade ago, when I was not computerized) -outlining that the universe did not 'work the Joseph Carter' way.

Being a friend of Joseph's, George sent my letter to Joseph before publishing it to obtaing Joseph's 'scientific commentary' on my reply.

Joseph Carter replied to George in a most hilarious (to me, very serious to him I suppose) manner accusing me (and my supposed academic organisation) of whatever under the sun and so forth.
He could refute nothing I said and so a pages long 'letters to the editor' section in Nemesis stands as a testimonial to the event.

But it didn't end there and this is why I am sharing this story with the forum.
Soon later I received another personal and handwritten letter from Joseph Carter, in which he challenged me privately to deconstruct his 'theories about the universe' and his book: 'The Ultimate Theory' or something like that.
I replied and invented the following scenario.
My organisation was working vehemently on a particle accelerator or synchrotron, colliding muons with antimuons.
One of Joseph Carter's 'new physics' was the transformation gradient between eloectric and magnetic fields in such accelerators.
As his ideas would CHANGE the decay rates of relativistic muon-antimuon collisions; I made the following proposal to him.
'Joseph, if your new physics is correct, then we here, working on the muon synchrotron simply require your detailed formulations to REPLACE the equations of Special Relativity. We shall program the computers with your formulas and prove your theory and overnight you will become a world famous physicist and win a Nobel prize.
We here, after reading your works, are convinced that it might work.
We have written out a cheque of 10,000 dollars in your name; which we shall send immediately to you upon receipt of your ground breaking formulae.'

About 10 days later I then received Joseph Carter's reply.
He never mentioned anything about alternative equations to undo Relativity but said something like: "I've got something much better for you; a machine which will do such and such 'free energy' etc. etc. All I need is a generator or dynamo to get it going."
In this letter was a rough drawing of this 'machine' connecting to a power source.

I did not reply to Joseph Carter and he never followed up the offer of $10,000 to replace the equations of special relativity.

Hopefully I have not bored you with this anecdotal story (I've still got the letters somewhere); but to me the significance is the superegocentricity of such 'pioneers' and yet they are SINCERE in a basic kind of way.

Thanks to anyone for having read this.
I thought sharing this would be illuminative on a forum such as this.

Abraxasinas
abraxasinas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2010, 07:33 PM   #3
Kojak
Avalon Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 15
Default Re: Mr Laviolette?? please explain??

Abraxasinas ! Thanks very much, you didn't bore me at all, I thank you for taking the time to help educate me. An excellent response. I hope that the Camelot people ask Paul to respond on the article regarding Searle. I think it is very important that this situation is addressed.

BTW, I was in your town recently, saw the "Masters" at the museum. Even if I only had 5-10minutes to do so-unfortunately. Check your pm.
Kojak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2010, 06:44 AM   #4
Barron
Avalon Senior Member
 
Barron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 358
Default Re: Mr Laviolette?? please explain??

Hi Kojak.

Your story mirrors that of my Dad (a retired electronics) engineer in some respects. Thanks for posting it.
Barron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2010, 12:39 AM   #5
Kojak
Avalon Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 15
Default Re: Mr Laviolette?? please explain??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Barron View Post
Hi Kojak.

Your story mirrors that of my Dad (a retired electronics) engineer in some respects. Thanks for posting it.
No worries Barron!! I think someone should make sure this info gets to Kerry and Bill ,it needs to be clarified. I was so impressed by Lavoliette initially, I want to know the truth. Can someone contact K or B??

Also! I bought the book, so I want to know!!!

Also Barron, can you change your Avatar please? I fell into a trance for 2hours, and only just got out of it, and am late for work now.

Last edited by Kojak; 01-07-2010 at 12:48 AM.
Kojak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2010, 12:59 AM   #6
waitinginthewings
Avalon Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: BC. Canada
Posts: 1,340
Default Re: Mr Laviolette?? please explain??

Kojak: here is a link to a recent interview (Nov. 20/09) done with Mel Fabregas of the Veritas Show....you can listen to part 1 for free.....you will need to be a member to listen to part 2......their phone connection was disconnected 24 times during the interview....very interesting.

http://www.veritasshow.com/guests/50.php
waitinginthewings is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2010, 02:13 AM   #7
Kojak
Avalon Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 15
Default Re: Mr Laviolette?? please explain??

Quote:
Originally Posted by waitinginthewings View Post
Kojak: here is a link to a recent interview (Nov. 20/09) done with Mel Fabregas of the Veritas Show....you can listen to part 1 for free.....you will need to be a member to listen to part 2......their phone connection was disconnected 24 times during the interview....very interesting.

http://www.veritasshow.com/guests/50.php
Thanks WaitingintheWINGS!! i'll check that out. It's funny how things happen, eg 24 disconnections. I could go on, re those type of situations......

I feel that there must be merit in Paul's work, I'd just like to know how Searles work got in the book, if the article is correct. There's dark forces at work, that's for sure...........
Kojak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2010, 08:57 AM   #8
Barron
Avalon Senior Member
 
Barron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 358
Default Re: Mr Laviolette?? please explain??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kojak View Post
No worries Barron!! I think someone should make sure this info gets to Kerry and Bill ,it needs to be clarified. I was so impressed by Lavoliette initially, I want to know the truth. Can someone contact K or B??

Also! I bought the book, so I want to know!!!

Also Barron, can you change your Avatar please? I fell into a trance for 2hours, and only just got out of it, and am late for work now.


Sorry Kojak, i love this Avatar as i am a hypnotherapist! Would you prefer i swap it for a swinging watch on a chain?
Barron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2010, 09:30 AM   #9
dayzero
Avalon Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Southern England
Posts: 458
Default Re: Mr Laviolette?? please explain??

Yes, good topic....

I'm into a bit of fringe science among other things


there's a maelstrom of stuff out there, and some of it may be true!

the main problem, as in all these fringe areas,
is that it is by definition and necessity stuffed with cointel
and or crazy 'believers' of one sort or another with all sorts of
dead horses to flog and axes to grind......
and of course, this brings some very strange politics.
and all this amounts to a total morass of conflicting information,
designed, primarily, to be bewildering enough to stop any conclusions
forming. it's a familiar pattern and tactic.

["We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, CIA Director]

i believe very soon we're going to start getting FAR clearer indications of what/who is worth looking at and what is fantasy
[for one reason or another].

Soo......I already thought that Violette was suspect - thanks for the post!
dayzero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2010, 01:33 PM   #10
gscraig
Avalon Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 335
Default Re: Mr Laviolette?? please explain??

Quote:
Also Barron, can you change your Avatar please? I fell into a trance for 2hours, and only just got out of it, and am late for work now.
LOL!!! Nice
gscraig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2010, 08:20 PM   #11
waitinginthewings
Avalon Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: BC. Canada
Posts: 1,340
Default Re: Mr Laviolette?? please explain??

Quote:
Originally Posted by dayzero View Post
Yes, good topic....

I'm into a bit of fringe science among other things


there's a maelstrom of stuff out there, and some of it may be true!

the main problem, as in all these fringe areas,
is that it is by definition and necessity stuffed with cointel
and or crazy 'believers' of one sort or another with all sorts of
dead horses to flog and axes to grind......
and of course, this brings some very strange politics.
and all this amounts to a total morass of conflicting information,
designed, primarily, to be bewildering enough to stop any conclusions
forming. it's a familiar pattern and tactic.

["We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, CIA Director]

i believe very soon we're going to start getting FAR clearer indications of what/who is worth looking at and what is fantasy
[for one reason or another].

Soo......I already thought that Violette was suspect - thanks for the post!
Lately, I feel more & more that everything is a big lie, even everything that we are learning through the alternative news sources. I am also inclined to think that everything we are being fed through whistleblowers, books, conferences etc. is just another matrix being overlayed over the old matrix which is still in existence for those who do not question anything.....so we now have 2 matrix..................no wonder I desperately want to get off this planet.
waitinginthewings is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2010, 08:16 AM   #12
Kojak
Avalon Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 15
Default Re: Mr Laviolette?? please explain??

Quote:
Originally Posted by waitinginthewings View Post
Lately, I feel more & more that everything is a big lie, even everything that we are learning through the alternative news sources. I am also inclined to think that everything we are being fed through whistleblowers, books, conferences etc. is just another matrix being overlayed over the old matrix which is still in existence for those who do not question anything.....so we now have 2 matrix..................no wonder I desperately want to get off this planet.
You're so right, very right, re BIG lie!! some of these whistleblowers and so forth are definitely full of ****. But who is your guru, who do you follow, i want to look at John Lash and Sonia Barrett, they are ringing through to me, as possibly real deal types. Not that i wil worship them, or feel i have found the "whole truth", but feel they have good info.The conferences and so forth are like big travelling circuses, clowns, jugglers, trained animals....etc. Your right, just so much BS!!!! In my opinion,the answers are in you, it's just getting them out, with some direction? Stay on the planet.......

I am careful what I put in my body and also have worked very hard to clean it properly. Believe me, it makes an enormous difference, enormous. Aspartame, flouride and all the other wonderful things they expose us to....We all have potential, they don't want you to explore and utilise, or for you to think. Everything has an energy and you only want "good" ones in you, as they effect you, and sickness in your body, and clogged areas, eg- mucoid plaque, assist negative entities to attach, which want to hang out here to, non physical parasites, helping create the monkey mind. bla bla bla.And then to work out who the creator is, and who the scammer is!! Who's connected to who ,at the top, so many have the same spots and stripes when you look deep enough. Hyperdimensional entities, are affecting us, vectoring our behaviour, definitely. It's a game, but we're eternal, so show no fear to the "truckers". This is but a drop in the ocean, in our overall existence, just observe it and play the game. If your good ( I think Peter 218-Bible, illustrates this, look it up, I can if you can't?), they can't win, but do they try and stir the pot, the "truckers", truck em!!! We win in the end, us goodin's, you'll see!! woohoo!


Dayzero- Great response, loved reading your thoughts. I will look up the website. Rotten batteries died on the keyboard b4, just as I was writing this, charged em up! An interesting comment by William Casey!? Now I have more to read and look up, as if i have a shortage of reading material!?!? Thank You!!!

Last edited by Kojak; 01-08-2010 at 10:10 AM.
Kojak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2010, 05:59 PM   #13
Jnana
Avalon Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Indiana
Posts: 653
Default Re: Mr Laviolette?? please explain??

Before defending relativity too vigorously, I think one needs to consider how, within conventional physics, enormous craft can be made to hover silently in the sky and then take off silently at incredible speed. Einstein's interpretation of gravity as a curvature of space makes this incredibly difficult if not impossible. Other interpretations of gravity, many of which are based on the existence of some sort of aether, make field propulsion practical and relatively easy. Given that manipulation of gravity by electric fields has been demonstrated (T. Townsend Brown and others), I think it is fair to say that although Einstein's equations provide good predictions, his interpretation of the mechanism of gravity is suspect. Other mechanisms fit these same equations and lend themselves more readily to a unified field theory that makes the engineering of gravity control devices relatively easy.

While I understand how easy it is to conclude that Searl is a nutcase, if you read the rest of the chapter you will find that LaViolette discusses a replication of the Searl device in more detail than Searl's original device. He also discusses a simple motor based on a roller bearing that was demonstrated by a physics student and which explains one aspect of how the Searl device works. To say that LaViolette accepted all of Searl's claims at face value is a bit unfair, although he does repeat some of the claims (e.g., "health benefits") without further comment.

Overall, the book is a pretty good introduction to various aspects of alternative physics and devices based on principles that are inconsistent with standard physics. He also has a bit of background on which companies are doing work in electrogravitics and how the coverup of the associated scientific principles is maintained. Whether LaViolette's own pet theory, subquantum kinetics, eventually proves to have superior predictive ability remains to be seen.
Jnana is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 08:21 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Project Avalon