An odd share, a personal letter to a friend. Anyone going thru similar ?

[thepainterdoug]

Hey all, I had a tough weekend with a good friend arguing in public back and forth. It seems because I have always voted on a left of center side, an Obama voter twice, but now support Trump in a manner of sorts, that my friend feels I have betrayed him and cannot seem to tolerate my views on this.

anyone going thru similar? Im posting the letter as it was sent to him, names removed. questions welcome


////

Hey

I hope you and family have a good and peaceful weekend.

For us to remain good friends, we will always need to communicate. What are we if we don't, or feel we cant ? A true friendship would be a lie, if lies need be told to hold it up.
I am still unsettled about some things .

I don't want an encompassing indictment on my self, my morals or my character for any position I may take politically. Im am caring of all people, always was, always will be. There is no way if asked, are you for or against Trump, that one answer can explain the complexity of that question. So today we are walking around judging each other as a complete package on this issue. This is so wrong and so off base. I will not be held nor hold anyone to these ridiculous ideals. This is fanaticism.

You left dinner dejected and dismayed saying, I'm really disappointed in you Doug.
You said it several times.
How did I disappoint you? Did I do something to you? Do I owe you something Im not aware of ? It seemed to me you need me to be an Allie to your position. And that its a betrayal of me, of all people, that I don't share your views

Again, i didn't vote for Trump , thought all choice were bad choices and didn't vote . But the reality is, he is now the President, and in not all , but on many issues , he's doing a good job. That is my opinion which Im entitled to have . I am not the only person to share this view, many people at least 3/4 of people I know and speak to feel this way and agree. Are they all terrible people?
Im sure members of your own family, as well as other people you meet in day to day life, feel Trump is doing a good job as well. And anyhow, he's our President, good or bad.

Let me be clear. I am sensitive to the illegal people here as a human beings as a feeling person for all. But we are a Country of laws, and they were not forced to come here. They took a chance, but a chance ,and I don't blame them. And so I would be the last person to call them out, not support them, not take care of them. Some people, hateful people would say, get the **** out of here and call the authorities. That would never be me and to think anyone, much less my friends would believe that about me would be quite inaccurate and unsettling .

In fact the entire condition illustrates that there is no hard fast rule that works. We need the cheap labor, to make the kind of free market world we created work. And so its kind of a gray area endorsement to not holding the law to the letter to make our thing work as it does. But thats because the system itself is one of hypocrisy . Not just Trump. So there are many shades and views on this.

But this is one of a thousand issues that a President has to decide on, and his base, the people that voted for him want action of some sort taken. Many of these people are good and compassionate people as well.

Neither one of us has an answer or a handle on this problem. If you do, write an op ed and publish it. Possibly it will resonate, and some day can become law.

If the immigration laws need to be changed, lets change them. But how?
Tell me? You tell me how to change the law to make it fair for all who want to come here? Thats why I was happy to hear Trump call out Mexico for their part in causing a need for their people to flee. Well, we could discuss this for ever.

How easily things can get conflated, mis interpreted when we get our heels dug in. My capital letters in my email, wasn't yelling at you. They were just designed to stand out as I took your statement point by point. I should have changed the color instead .

I know you don't disagree with everything Trump is doing or has done. And you as well should know, I don't agree with everything he is doing .

But the level of hatred you carry in you about this guy is quite unsettling for me and quite unhealthy for you.
Its seems very personal, and well thats fine ,your entitled to feel as you do.
But you need to accept that I and others don't feel that. And that is not a betrayal or dismissal of you or you concerns and values.

And the media wants this guy out and is stirring up the pot as best they can to get him out. And the more they do that, the more I want him right where he is. And those reasons are my reasons, that Im entitled to have. And should you want to know them, just ask me.

This is a process, and so sorry to interrupt your weekend. But if I start censoring myself, holding back my feelings and all, our friendship will wilt and die a slow death in short time .

and for what? Trump?

we met the enemy, and he is us

[Bill Ryan]

Well, it happens here on the forum sometimes, as well: that for some, on some occasions, it can feel more important to be right about something than to preserve a valuable personal friendship.

Why is often it so important for us to be right? Does it really, really matter? Those may be quite good questions for us all to think about. :flower:

[Deux Corbeaux]

Thanks dear painter. This really touched me.
There was something resonating deep inside me.

[thepainterdoug]

thanks Bill. Getting harder and harder to have your own opinion on things respected for what it is. An opinion. Lots of assumptions on each other. The fact that Im an artist, songwriter and creative seems to mean I must also be a liberal. What is a liberal? a conservative? I reject all these boxes.

[Daozen]

I have a couple of friends who support Trump. One of them is a programmer. He likes Trump, thinks he's gonna make California better, lol. We had, like 5 mins of non-heated discussion on him three years ago, and that's it. I changed the subject back to programming and women, and we talked about that instead. So we never talk about that guy. It is not even a "sore point" in our relationship, we just talk about other stuff. There are a 1000 ways to connect with people.

I have another colleague, a Canadian guy, who is the most helpful, positive guy who ever walked the Earth. He comes in the room and it lights up a subtle gold. He loves Trump. But again, that conversation lasted 15 seconds. We talk about other subjects. Bodybuilding, teaching, Iron Maiden, whatever.

Last Saturday my parents and a friend were talking about Brexit. I ignored them and learnt Phyrygian scale on my practice neck.

It’s not that Im solipsistic or ignorant, I just know that you do not heal humanity by filling the room with hot air “opinions”. No one cares.

People have a right to an opinion, but I have a right to be bored with it. I am equally bored with staunch Obama supporters. If someone starts bleating about politics, I change the subject. If they persist, I go find someone else to chat to. Political pundits ascribe way too much importance to their opinions than they think.

Last night my Dad (who is around 75) told me there are companies taking old Maersk shipping containers and turning them into houses. They are providing low cost housing for the poor. But the chattering classes do not talk about things like this. They just drone on and on about Obama vs Trump. It’s painful. That, IMO, is the underlying reason why friendships are becoming severed. People are lashed to a tarbaby together and they hate each other for it.

It’s not about Obama or Trump, IMO. People are secretly annoyed at each other that they don’t have the restraint to do something practical except debate. I don’t mind what people think about politicians. I don’t get annoyed. What annoys me is the ridiculous belief that hot air will heal humanity.

95% of media theatre is a sticky trap. Politics is a manky dance, a puppet show to distract powerful souls.

You seem like a genuinely caring soul, Doug. Maybe you and your friend could play music or paint together… or farm, or feed the homeless, whatever. I'm sure you have done many interesting and productive things in your life. I guess it’s time for many of us to stop being hypnotized by the eight year pendulum, and change the subject to the future.

[thepainterdoug]

Thanks very much for this Doazen. And I agree, have an opinion, but also know it means nothing. I make things, paintings, write music and now creating a Broadway style musical. Its the hardest thing I have ever done in my life. Its the work , the process I enjoy. It matters, even if its never heard. I may be changing my name to " the composerdoug" !

[onawah]

I had a couple of people "unfriend" me on Facebook after I posted an article about problems on the US/Mexican border that was apparently deemed by them to be politically incorrect.
I just figure those individuals were not really friends at all, to take such dramatic action over something like that, without even discussing it with me or asking me why I thought there was a problem.
Being that reactionary is neither sane nor balanced, and until people understand that, I prefer not to have contact with them, in any case, so no loss there.
Which may sound rather glib :p but I feel like I can award myself that much space, at least. :nod:

[Franny]

I can feel for you Doug, it's something many people have experienced over the years but especially recently. It's the old joke about never discussing politics and religion. The divide is deep and wide for so many they will not engage with the 'other side'.

It also happened to me. A cousin dumped me and a number of friends, some of a decade or more. There was no one I wanted to vote for so I didn't vote; that was enough to disown me, a few quite wrathfully. It has left me virtually friendless where I now live, a strange situation.

I believe it was Thomas Jefferson who said something about never dropping friends and family over a difference of opinion. In attempting to maintain a connection with them I tried to explain that I would never let politics and opinions destroy a relationship but the reaction was dismissive or almost frightening with some of them. I let Trump win therefor I was not someone they could not trust, there was something not right about me etc. Very strange. It appears there was a lot of social engineering to divide the country during this last election process and afterwords.