Bullying, a social dis-ease

[Charlie Pecos]

Hello Avalon,

I am starting this thread so that I may continue to speak my truth to whomever might be so inclined to listen. For nine grueling years of my life, I was a bullied child. No one would lift a finger to stop it. Not the teachers who turned a blind eye, not even the two people who I should have been able to trust the most... my parents. Please do not misunderstand me, I love my parents, they are good people. They made mistakes.

As adults, we tend to be so caught up in the rat race, we forget what matters most... our kids. Nothing prepares us for child rearing like raising children. We learn on the job and we make lots of mistakes. My purpose here is to call attention to an area of our childrens life that is easily overlooked, an area that can have devastating consequences if not properly monitored.......what happens to our children while they are at school.

If left unfettered, a bully or group of bullies can do tremendous damage to the self esteem of a young, outgoing, and intellingent person, crippling them emotionally for decades to come. This is what happened to me.

Before the first year of my primary school education, I was a fit, outgoing, and emotionally healthy young man. After the ninth year, I was overweight, disenfrachised, withdrawn, depressed, suicidal, and had a low self esteem. I have fought with these demons ever since. My parents and teachers were unable or unwilling to do anything meaningful to help me.

To this day, I find it difficult to approach a perfect stranger and introduce myself or even to say "hello". I have just recently realized the reason for this: There is still a child inside of me who is afraid of being rejected, afraid of being put down because I don't meet someone elses expectations of who I should be. This epiphany is a major breakthrough for me as I can now move forward with my healing and recovery.

I am no longer that small child. I do not need to hold on to that part of me any longer. I am a full grown man with a beautiful family, I am awake and aware of who and what we truly are, and I feel a connection to all in Gods creation. For the first time in my 40 years on this rock, I love myself and I love all of you, even if I don't agree with you. I am free to speak my truth, to shout it from the rooftops! I am finally able to stand here before you and tell of my journey, and to do so proudly and with confidence.

If you are a parent, please, go hug your kids and tell them you love them. Do this one simple thing many times a day. Take the time to find out what they are going through at school, is any one giving them a hard time? Who are their friends?
Who are their enemies? If your child is gaining weight and you are bothered by it and don't understand why, know this: We use food to comfort us, the fat acts as an emotional insulation against the cruel barbs and taunts of thoughtless bullies.

If I can impart just one crucial piece of knowledge, let it be this: Listen to your children, please, hear what they have to say. They will tell you whats wrong if you listen to them, give them room to speak and don't dismiss them when they tell you something that makes you uncomfortable. Then, take action...this is the single most important part. These spirits are so special and can be damaged so easily in this harsh environment. We must nurture them so they may grow and live to their full potential. We must teach them how to become the change we all here at Avalon see coming. They are our future and that is why what I have to say is important to say here.

I apologize if this is not appropriate for Avalon, and the Mods have my permission to remove it if they deem it not acceptable. I am doing this in the hopes of helping others and also as a form of healing for myself.

Anyone who reads this and is inspired to share their story, even if it is off the topic, please do so. I find that the threads are much more enjoyable when they are allowed to evolve in a free flowing manner.

With Love and Gratitude,

Charlie

[Rainbow44]

Hello Charlie,

Thank you for sharing..........there are different forms of bullying and I think many people can relate to your story.
I think threads like this makes all of us think and that is always a good thing.

Blessings,

Rainbow

[Maria Stade]

Th-ank you !

Yes we see this in all levels, and it must be stoped.

People must learn to say No to this kind of behavior.

It creates so much wounds that takes long time to heal.

Love and blessings !

Maria

[Lord Sidious]

Sorry to hear that Charlie.
The irony about bullies is that they are generally worse off than those they bully.
Not that this makes anyone feel better, but it is a fact.
Institutions tend to try and ignore it.
There are ways to crack down on them.

[An Cailleach]

Oh J!

Your thread is perfectly relevant as far as I can see. You are such a special person. You ARE that big bear that's full of hugs (metaphorical of course!).

It's funny but when I was at school I saw/witnessed/was aware of ZERO bullying. I count myself lucky in certain respects that I went the school that I went to... because had it been any other school, I'm sure I would have been a target for bullies.

I was always so sensitive. Even though I was the class clown (classmates fondly let me be that), I was never ever naughty, just a bit cheeky and without the back-chat. The reason for this is that from a very early age I had empathy and was always aware of how words and actions could hurt someone badly, even if that was not the intent. I was always very careful not to hurt or offend anyone (except family, where I did lash out)

If ever something embarrassing happened to someone (something that everyone else cracks up laughing at), my reactions have always been to completely distract people's attention away from the person and do or say something silly myself, because i have always understood that those first moments in an embarrassing situation can be torturous for the person concerned. I have never laughed at anyone to belittle them or big myself up, I have never said hurtful things to anyone to gain power over them (apart from maybe in family rows..) and I have never tried to control anyone else for the sake of control.

I am writing this J because I feel that the only reason why I knew at such an early age why not to hurt other people is because I must have been through the wringer in another lifetime. I REALLY feel other people's (and animals') pain - emotional and physical. I am so sorry that you had to go through what you did ... and for so long. For the umpteenth time this week I am trying to fight back the tears.

As someone else on another thread quoted: Hurt people hurt people. So on behalf of humanity, I apologise for what those bullies did to you and I apologise that those in charge of your well-being were not given the correct tools to give you the protection that you so badly needed.

But I thank you for being you and for putting up with the hurt, which in turn made you search for the truth within, so that you could eventually become a member here and a friend of mine. I'm proud to have you as a friend.

Know that you are love, and you are loved

Elva xx

[Teakai]

Hi Charlie - I think there are so many people who spend so many years of their adult lives just trying to recover from the damage of the school system - in all sorts of ways.

Public schools are really a very unnatural place. A spiritless institution of conformity that stunts both mind and soul. All are damaged just to varying degrees. I moved to 6 or 7 different schools when I was a child.
At one of them I encountered a mild form of bullying by a small group of older girls. We didn't stay long in that town, though. It was one time when I was very happy to move.

Very good advice you gave about listening to your children and paying attention.

[lazer]

Nicely put Charlie...proud of you..... all the way...

Infant and junior school were fine....secondary girls only school..different kettle of fish....
I spent most of that latter time....learning outside and away...from that area...( called..legging it )
Besides not really fitting in..and getting bullied sometimes...
The last straw for me...was this boring history lesson...i spent most of my time..day dreaming....
The teacher slammed her ruler down on my desk...and shouted in my ear..." What do you think of Hitler"...
My immediate reply was " don't know miss..never met him "...it was a serious response to her question..
Everyone howled with laughter...as she ushered me out the door...

What an education...i had about reality and survival....still being educated to this day...

[Ammit]

Thanks for sharing Charlie.

It is sad that bullying still takes place and mostly un-noticed in our schools, but it does not stop there. It continues through out
our adult lives too. It seems to be something we constantly live with, the bully boss, bully partner and those that wish to control
some part of our lives.

All you need to do is spend one whole day watching the antics of others, the bickering behind another persons back when they
are not around, being singled out by others in preference to others.

It is all bullying, but often called something else, harrassment, abuse either physical, verbal or emotional it amounts to the same
thing and the same results, it lowers your self esteem, confidence and trust of others.

Hope this makes sense as I am ranting on.....

Ammit

[Jakinabox]

:ohwell:............................

[Meesh]

Very important thread! One of the most insidious forms of bullying if "relationship bullying" which involves intentional group exclusion. I remember a lot of that in middle and high school (more common among girls).

[KosmicKat]

If you have been bullied, or you know someone who is bullying, please take a minute to check out bullying.org.

My own experience tempts me to think that the school playground is also the first training ground for the terrorist of the emerging generation. My own parents made light of the problem until I came home with visible wounds (but this was almost at the end of my school experience). Since then, I have been through repeated experiences which I perceive as bullying, mostly by managers (whom I consider inept) but also from my step-children. In my own case, I have to admit that feeling bullied often results in an over-reaction on my part which does nothing to strengthen my standing.

[Wub]

Bullies exist everywhere sadly and they want power and control. Its a form of projection, but its also a form of mental illness. I tell my students that bullies have mental health problems. We should pity them, offer them counselling and in the worst cases, rehabilitation. Its interesting to see how bullying behaviour quickly decreases when their targeted victims show pity, understanding and use mental health related vocabulary when interacting with them...very interesting....

[Lord Sidious]

Bullies exist everywhere sadly and they want power and control. Its a form of projection, but its also a form of mental illness. I tell my students that bullies have mental health problems. We should pity them, offer them counselling and in the worst cases, rehabilitation. Its interesting to see how bullying behaviour quickly decreases when their targeted victims show pity, understanding and use mental health related vocabulary when interacting with them...very interesting....

And if that doesn't put em on the straight and narrow, a couple of sharpened carrots up their nostrologies will.

[dan i el]

Thanks for starting the thread and for the sage words, Charlie.

[Charlie Pecos]

Rainbow44: Hello Charlie,

Thank you for sharing..........there are different forms of bullying and I think many people can relate to your story.
I think threads like this makes all of us think and that is always a good thing.

Blessings,

Rainbow

Thank you for reading and replying!


Maria Stade: Th-ank you !

Yes we see this in all levels, and it must be stoped.

People must learn to say No to this kind of behavior.

It creates so much wounds that takes long time to heal.

Love and blessings !

Maria

Thank you Maria. This is why I felt it imortant to speak my truth here at Avalon. WE have the power to do anything in creating a better world for all.


Lord Sidious: Sorry to hear that Charlie.
The irony about bullies is that they are generally worse off than those they bully.
Not that this makes anyone feel better, but it is a fact.
Institutions tend to try and ignore it.
There are ways to crack down on them.

Hi Sidious!
I became aware of this during this process, I do feel empathy towards those kids (now adults). I can only imagine what their lives were like that made them want to hurt others.
It is my conviction that the institutions themselves are the root cause of the problem. They create an environment where hostility towards others can grow and thrive.


GlobalCitizen: Oh J!

Your thread is perfectly relevant as far as I can see. You are such a special person. You ARE that big bear that's full of hugs (metaphorical of course!).

It's funny but when I was at school I saw/witnessed/was aware of ZERO bullying. I count myself lucky in certain respects that I went the school that I went to... because had it been any other school, I'm sure I would have been a target for bullies.

I was always so sensitive. Even though I was the class clown (classmates fondly let me be that), I was never ever naughty, just a bit cheeky and without the back-chat. The reason for this is that from a very early age I had empathy and was always aware of how words and actions could hurt someone badly, even if that was not the intent. I was always very careful not to hurt or offend anyone (except family, where I did lash out)

If ever something embarrassing happened to someone (something that everyone else cracks up laughing at), my reactions have always been to completely distract people's attention away from the person and do or say something silly myself, because i have always understood that those first moments in an embarrassing situation can be torturous for the person concerned. I have never laughed at anyone to belittle them or big myself up, I have never said hurtful things to anyone to gain power over them (apart from maybe in family rows..) and I have never tried to control anyone else for the sake of control.

I am writing this J because I feel that the only reason why I knew at such an early age why not to hurt other people is because I must have been through the wringer in another lifetime. I REALLY feel other people's (and animals') pain - emotional and physical. I am so sorry that you had to go through what you did ... and for so long. For the umpteenth time this week I am trying to fight back the tears.

As someone else on another thread quoted: Hurt people hurt people. So on behalf of humanity, I apologise for what those bullies did to you and I apologise that those in charge of your well-being were not given the correct tools to give you the protection that you so badly needed.

But I thank you for being you and for putting up with the hurt, which in turn made you search for the truth within, so that you could eventually become a member here and a friend of mine. I'm proud to have you as a friend.

Know that you are love, and you are loved

Elva xx

Hi Elva, how are you doing? Thank you for posting. Thank you for not participating in the bullying, and in fact trying to distract others away from the hurt and pain. I went through what I went through for a very good reason. I feel that it was, in part, to articulate the pain and suffering it causes to many people, to draw the awareness to a social problem that exists to this day. There is no need to apologize to me, it is what it is. I forgive all for their actions.



Teakai: Hi Charlie - I think there are so many people who spend so many years of their adult lives just trying to recover from the damage of the school system - in all sorts of ways.

Public schools are really a very unnatural place. A spiritless institution of conformity that stunts both mind and soul. All are damaged just to varying degrees. I moved to 6 or 7 different schools when I was a child.
At one of them I encountered a mild form of bullying by a small group of older girls. We didn't stay long in that town, though. It was one time when I was very happy to move.

Very good advice you gave about listening to your children and paying attention
Hi Teakai, wow, your going to start me on another rant! Yes, I feel there are many deficiencies within the educational system, a cookie cutter one-size-fits-all program. The only problem is, people develop at different rates. People have different interests. If one is a gifted artist, why must we force multiplying fractions into their head? If one needs to learn this information at a later time one can simply do so. Why cram all this wasted knowledge into the heads of our young people who will forget it and never use it? Wouldn't our time and resources be better spent developing their natural, God given talents in a holistic and nurturing environment, specified to the core interests of the individual and not the system?


Lazer: Nicely put Charlie...proud of you..... all the way...

Infant and junior school were fine....secondary girls only school..different kettle of fish....
I spent most of that latter time....learning outside and away...from that area...( called..legging it )
Besides not really fitting in..and getting bullied sometimes...
The last straw for me...was this boring history lesson...i spent most of my time..day dreaming....
The teacher slammed her ruler down on my desk...and shouted in my ear..." What do you think of Hitler"...
My immediate reply was " don't know miss..never met him "...it was a serious response to her question..
Everyone howled with laughter...as she ushered me out the door...

What an education...i had about reality and survival....still being educated to this day...

Hi Lazer, oh boy can I relate to what you said about daydreaming! I was always off in my own little world because theirs wasn't working for me.
I would have loved to see the look on that teachers face when you told her that!


Ammit: Thanks for sharing Charlie.

It is sad that bullying still takes place and mostly un-noticed in our schools, but it does not stop there. It continues through out
our adult lives too. It seems to be something we constantly live with, the bully boss, bully partner and those that wish to control
some part of our lives.

All you need to do is spend one whole day watching the antics of others, the bickering behind another persons back when they
are not around, being singled out by others in preference to others.

It is all bullying, but often called something else, harrassment, abuse either physical, verbal or emotional it amounts to the same
thing and the same results, it lowers your self esteem, confidence and trust of others.

Hope this makes sense as I am ranting on.....

Ammit

Oh yes! We are talking about something that happens everywhere in our society, not just at school. My wife, until recently, worked for a major cell phone company. She was witness to many occasions where new hires were treated with less than the respect they deserved by their coworkers. She did her best to befriend these people and set the example for her coworkers, but in the end, she couldn't take the negative environment anymore. It's like my dad used to tell me.....think before you act. We as a society need to learn to treat others as we want to be treated, a hostile environment only creates more hostility, it is self perpetuating. But here's the thing, I have been in many positive environments where this same principle applies in the other direction.
It's all in what WE choose.


Jackinabox: Thank you Charlie/James,
I can totally relate to your story. After being verbally bullied by peers and teachers during secondary school, I am a total social phobic with almost no self confidence despite going through councelling.
My son is home schooled. He struggled enough during primary school due to ADHD which meant he stood out from his peers. Teenagers can be so cruel, theres no way I'm letting my son go through what I did or even being one of the laughing bystanders!
Best wishes on your recovery x

Hi Jack! Yes, the self esteem is the first to go and the hardest to gain back. For many years I did not see myself as worthy of having a girlfriend. Girls were interested but I was so emotionally damaged that I could not see these situations for what they were.... genuine interest in me on the part of the female. I'm sorry to hear about your son, I hope he is doing much better now. Please, don't let the system convince you he needs to be put on meds just because he isn't taking to their programming. There is nothing wrong with him or you. It is the system that is inadequate, not people. ADHD is a load of Bull****! Just an excuse to put perfectly healthy people on mind altering medications so they won't rise up and change the system for the better.


Meesh: Very important thread! One of the most insidious forms of bullying if "relationship bullying" which involves intentional group exclusion. I remember a lot of that in middle and high school (more common among girls).

Absolutely, I've witnessed it many times in my life. Please ladies, If a man is trying to control you, if he is trying to dictate what you will or won't do, please, RUN, don't walk. If your friends don't treat you with love and respect, please, find some friends who do. You are a special person and you DO NOT deserved to be treated in an unkind way by anybody, even family.


KosmicKat: If you have been bullied, or you know someone who is bullying, please take a minute to check out bullying.org.

My own experience tempts me to think that the school playground is also the first training ground for the terrorist of the emerging generation. My own parents made light of the problem until I came home with visible wounds (but this was almost at the end of my school experience). Since then, I have been through repeated experiences which I perceive as bullying, mostly by managers (whom I consider inept) but also from my step-children. In my own case, I have to admit that feeling bullied often results in an over-reaction on my part which does nothing to strengthen my standing.

Thank you KosmicKat, I can relate to what you said more than you know. I was instructed by my father to just sit on my bullies because I was so fat that I easily outweighed them. It's like telling a rape victim to quit getting raped, meanwhile, the perpetrators are allowed to continue unabated. My parents expected me to take care of the situation, something I had absolutely no tools or confidence for.
In situations where I perceived bullying as an adult, I would become angry and confrontational with the other person. This led to many problems in my personal and professional lives.
Now, I let them be who they are and then I tell them who I am and if the two don't mesh, I leave.


Wub: Bullies exist everywhere sadly and they want power and control. Its a form of projection, but its also a form of mental illness. I tell my students that bullies have mental health problems. We should pity them, offer them counselling and in the worst cases, rehabilitation. Its interesting to see how bullying behaviour quickly decreases when their targeted victims show pity, understanding and use mental health related vocabulary when interacting with them...very interesting....

Hi Wub, it sounds as though you are a good teacher. We recently went through a situation where my daughter was being bullied at school and was afraid to express it to her mom and myself.
She was quickly becoming more reluctant to go to school. One moring she begged her mom to stay home. When we finally got it out of her, I immediately contacted the principle and the teacher. I shared with them what happened to me and I instructed them that I was fully prepared to pull my daughter out of school Immediately if this problem was not quickly resolved. I also told my daughter that it was her call if she wanted to change schools to get away from her bullies, I would back her no matter what. The teacher whose class this was occuring in was completely surprised. She runs a very chaotic classroom which is not condusive to the learning process. I wasn't surprised she was not aware.

Educators, the ADULTS nearest to the children during school hours, must make an effort to be aware and step in to stop the abusive tactics before thay can take bloom. We ask so much of our teachers already, in my estimation they simply don't have the time or inclination to step in and head off trouble before it gets going. This is not the teachers fault, it is the system that is broken. If the system were to concentrate on developing human beings to their full potential, instead of stressing high test scores and threatening teachers jobs if they don't have them, the world we live in would look very different than it does today.

[Lord Sidious]

Yes, Charlie, the institutions are a huge part of the problem.
In fact, the system thrives on keeping us in conflict with each other.
They NEED that to survive.

[Charlie Pecos]

We are closing in on the 12th anniversary of the Columbine Tragedy that occurred here in my home town, Denver, Colorado. I remember that day well. The shock, outrage and horror of the community, the nation, and the world. I remember, clearly, people expressing disbelief at how two kids could do that kind of damage. How could they kill all those innocent kids? What could drive someone to do something so heinous? Why, why, why?

I have been very silent on this subject, until now. You see, I know EXACTLY how and why. When you have been bullied, picked on, put down, and made to feel like less of a person, the ego can only take so much before the anger arises and with it rage. Many is the time that I would daydream about walking into my school with a fully automatic M-16 rifle and spraying the place with bullets. I wanted to kill every single one of those bastards who had ever hurt me, who had hit me or uttered a thoughtless insult. I saw absolutely nothing wrong with killing people who had hurt me so deeply; vengeance would be mine at last. The feeling of empowerment that fantasy gave me was overwhelming and glorious. You bet I can relate!

The surprise does not at all lie in the fact that Columbine happened, the surprise is that it did not happen sooner. School shootings happened before Columbine, but Columbine was the worst. Look at the school shootings that happened afterwards. Once the trail is blazed, others will follow. I did not have access to firearms while I attended school, and I also knew the difference between fantasy and reality. If I would have had access to a gun, who knows what I would have done. I did start taking a knife to school to protect myself though. What is it that takes us right to the edge of a great precipice and yet holds us back from stepping off the cliff? What is it that allows others to do so freely and without regard for the ramifications?

Fully fifteen people lost their lives that day, and yet there are only thirteen crosses at the Columbine memorial. The vitriolic backlash against the two kids who perpetrated the worst act of violence in educational history was most unfortunate. Did these members of the community learn nothing about love and forgiveness? This simple fact explains why bullying continues to this day.

In my view, Klebold and Harris were the most wronged people in the whole school. This could have been prevented. These kids were failed by the system, their teachers, and their parents. They were hated in life and hated in death. What does this say about our society? I feel much empathy toward all who died that day, but I maintain that the biggest victims were Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold. My heart cries because the system and society failed them. This fact is the true tragedy of Columbine. What did they endure that pushed them to the point where killing folks was the only answer? It could have easily been me. We all make choices, we can decide to do or not to do, but when we are in a place of great emotional pain, choices become less clear. That being said, the worst acts of violence go unnoticed in schools around the world everyday, emotional violence that is.

It will happen again. Bet on it. Schools still have not made meaningful changes and kids are still being bullied, harrasssed, and tormented to this very day. A child left to torment is like a kettle left to boil, the pressure will be released at some point. Who will be the next to get burned?. Who are the true victims then? Is it the perpetrators acting out of hurt and anger at a system that failed them, or is it the society and institutions that turned a blind eye to the problem? The institutions and the system don't work. This much should be obvious to a retarded monkey. We must make an effort to rebuild the institutions and our society into a model that will work for all, not just the relative majority who naturally conform.

By increasing awareness, we can change a deeply flawed and destructive system. We can created a system that empowers and uplifts sensitive and special spirits as well as the more mainstream and "normal" crowd. We can honor each other in a way that allows everyone to be who they truly are, in a way where we do not pass judgement on others who are different from us, in a way where our differences are celebrated instead of ridiculed. What a wonderful world this will be when that day comes.

[Charlie Pecos]

Yes, Charlie, the institutions are a huge part of the problem.
In fact, the system thrives on keeping us in conflict with each other.
They NEED that to survive.

And that is why WE must change it. Once the institutions fall, it will be a brand new world.

¤=[Post Update]=¤


Clearly I remember, picking on the boy, seemed a harmless little F***.
Ooh, but we unleashed the lion.......

MS91knuzoOA

[firstlook]

Everyone at every point in their life is good enough. Whatever someone has to offer the world is good enough.

This is what needs to circulate in all institutions IMO. This of course leads people to see how the current hierarchal structures just cant cut it anymore.

Great post Charlie Pecos. Really Really great post.

:)

[Charlie Pecos]

Everyone at every point in their life is good enough. Whatever someone has to offer the world is good enough.
This is what needs to circulate in all institutions IMO. This of course leads people to see how the current hierarchal structures just cant cut it anymore.

Great post Charlie Pecos. Really Really great post.

:)

Yes, and every child needs to be made aware of this from a very early age. They must be told that us adults are not perfect, that we make mistakes, and that their feelings are valid and of concern to us.

[modwiz]

I feel it is incumbent on those who are so empowered and have the physical/mental gifts to do something about bullying step in and interrupt the flow. Each bullying situation is unique and some are beyond our talents but too many of us stand sheepishly aside when, especially as a group, something could be done.
I've had my share of bullies but very few really had the gifts required.

I will not catalog my interventions because of the obvious self congratulation involved with that kind of endeavor. But I do have a short and interesting story that ended particularly well. It occurred about 30 years ago.

I was a messenger for a big magazine corporation. I was in our break room and noticed to men picking on another younger and smaller man. I commented that they seemed to be wanting to tumble with somebody and that since the young man seemed unwilling to do so that I was available for them to try and work out their aggressions on. The two aggressors looked at each other in astonishment and were absolutely dumbfounded.

You see, these three men involved in their dance were African-Americans. Here I was, a French-Celt, interceding on behalf of one of "them".
Not only did I stop the bullying I became fast friends with the other two and we formed a nucleus of good friends of all nationalities and kept the peace in this all male environment.

They were so moved by my standing up to them in defense of one who they figured would be outside my purview of concern that wanted to have a friend like me.

Life has lots of hidden gifts for us if we dare to truly engage it.

[Maria Stade]

I feel it is incumbent on those who are so empowered and have the physical/mental gifts to do something about bullying step in and interrupt the flow. Each bullying situation is unique and some are beyond our talents but too many of us stand sheepishly aside when, especially as a group, something could be done.
I've had my share of bullies but very few really had the gifts required.

I will not catalog my interventions because of the obvious self congratulation involved with that kind of endeavor. But I do have a short and interesting story that ended particularly well. It occurred about 30 years ago.

I was a messenger for a big magazine corporation. I was in our break room and noticed to men picking on another younger and smaller man. I commented that htey seemed to be wanting to tumble with somebody and that since the young man seemed unwilling to do so that I was available for them to try and work out their aggressions on. The two aggressors looked at each other in astonishment and were absolutely dumbfounded.

You see, these three men involved in their dance were African-Americans. Here I was, a French-Celt, interceding on behalf of one of "them".
Not only did I stop the bullying I became fast friends with the other two and we formed a nucleus of good friends of all nationalities and kept the peace in this all male environment.

They were so moved by my standing up to them in defense of one who they figured would be outside my purview of concern that wanted to have a friend like me.

Life has lots of hidden gifts for us if we dare to truly engage it.

I hear you !

Yes we should all aktiv go in and stop it together.

Be the change you wish to see by doing the right thing !

That is important in forums also we should, be the way !

Thank you !

Love

[Charlie Pecos]

I feel it is incumbent on those who are so empowered and have the physical/mental gifts to do something about bullying step in and interrupt the flow. Each bullying situation is unique and some are beyond our talents but too many of us stand sheepishly aside when, especially as a group, something could be done.
I've had my share of bullies but very few really had the gifts required.

I will not catalog my interventions because of the obvious self congratulation involved with that kind of endeavor. But I do have a short and interesting story that ended particularly well. It occurred about 30 years ago.

I was a messenger for a big magazine corporation. I was in our break room and noticed to men picking on another younger and smaller man. I commented that htey seemed to be wanting to tumble with somebody and that since the young man seemed unwilling to do so that I was available for them to try and work out their aggressions on. The two aggressors looked at each other in astonishment and were absolutely dumbfounded.

You see, these three men involved in their dance were African-Americans. Here I was, a French-Celt, interceding on behalf of one of "them".
Not only did I stop the bullying I became fast friends with the other two and we formed a nucleus of good friends of all nationalities and kept the peace in this all male environment.

They were so moved by my standing up to them in defense of one who they figured would be outside my purview of concern that wanted to have a friend like me.

Life has lots of hidden gifts for us if we dare to truly engage it.

Thank you for sharing and choosing to make a positive difference in your world. As you learned, everybody wins.

[Gone002]

When I was in secondary school, a close friend was getting picked on and getting beaten up on a regular basis. I asked him why he never did anything and he had been bullied so much he had forgotten he had a choice. Needless to say I waited until the bullies were alone and I beat them down to size ,after that they never touched him again. to this day my friend still has no idea why the stopped. Yes a rash action but that’s all I could do, no one cared not even teachers or his parents.

[Charlie Pecos]

When I was in secondary school, a close friend was getting picked on and getting beaten up on a regular basis. I asked him why he never did anything and he had been bullied so much he had forgotten he had a choice. Needless to say I waited until the bullies were alone and I beat them down to size ,after that they never touched him again. to this day my friend still has no idea why the stopped. Yes a rash action but that’s all I could do, no one cared not even teachers or his parents.

Thank you for having the courage and temerity to do the right thing when no one else would. You are a great friend.

[Gone002]

When I was in secondary school, a close friend was getting picked on and getting beaten up on a regular basis. I asked him why he never did anything and he had been bullied so much he had forgotten he had a choice. Needless to say I waited until the bullies were alone and I beat them down to size ,after that they never touched him again. to this day my friend still has no idea why the stopped. Yes a rash action but that’s all I could do, no one cared not even teachers or his parents.

Thank you for having the courage and temerity to do the right thing when no one else would. You are a great friend.

Your the one with courage and a huge rack of balls, for opening up so much. I hope you never give up, if only more people knew your story they might stop bullying if they new it had such an affect.

[firstlook]

I still think alot of society subscribes to the "survival" method. That a person has to learn to fend for themselves. While there is a basis in this, I also know that people use this as an excuse to not stand up for what they know is right. The best way for people who are feeling scared to find their inner strength is to see it in others.

This creates lasting confidence in society.

[Charlie Pecos]

I still think alot of society subscribes to the "survival" method. That a person has to learn to fend for themselves. While there is a basis in this, I also know that people use this as an excuse to not stand up for what they know is right. The best way for people who are feeling scared to find their inner strength is to see it in others.

This creates lasting confidence in society.

Yeah, it's "called sink or swim, kid". Too much damage has been done with this faulty thinking. They used it on me, I was supposed to take charge of the situation and find my empowerment. Only problem is, I was too afraid and insecure to do so. Not anymore. I'm calling out the system, time to do some cleaning.

[Linden]

Thank you so much for this Thread, Charlie!! Bullying has become an overwhelming problem in our schools. I appreciate your bringing attention to this problem that should be kept in the forefront of school's agendas. I have found many more people these days tend to be overly aggressive with their selfish behavior, and their children adopt these patterns from their parents. Where I live, many people just live in their own little worlds, as if they have blinders on and don't even acknowledge the presence of other precious beings around them. I know everyone has their problems, and perhaps that is the reason for this behavior, but I feel that part of our mission and purpose in this world is to acknowledge and honor each other in our oneness of existence.

I myself am overly sensitive because of bullying at a very young age from peers and my mother. I just never seemed to *fit in* anywhere.

Unfortunately bullying doesn't stop in childhood. Only a few years ago, I was bullied out of a job I loved because the manager would not intervene and support me. I had many students in my class come to my defense, in writing, but the owner of the establishment needed the bullies more than me in the jobs they held. I was totally blown away that such behavior could be ignored by adults, but after all money is more important in businesses than human beings. This incident really did a number on me considering experiences from my past, and it has taken me several years to recover, and feel better. The damage never totally goes away though, and even though I may have improved from this incident, my overly sensitive nature has been reinforced.

I love the Avalon forum because I have found so many spiritually in touch people here.

In closing...let's be and teach honor and recognition for each other's spirits of which we all are one. Love and Peace and Namaste, Linda

[Charlie Pecos]

When I was in secondary school, a close friend was getting picked on and getting beaten up on a regular basis. I asked him why he never did anything and he had been bullied so much he had forgotten he had a choice. Needless to say I waited until the bullies were alone and I beat them down to size ,after that they never touched him again. to this day my friend still has no idea why the stopped. Yes a rash action but that’s all I could do, no one cared not even teachers or his parents.

Thank you for having the courage and temerity to do the right thing when no one else would. You are a great friend.

Your the one with courage and a huge rack of balls, for opening up so much. I hope you never give up, if only more people knew your story they might stop bullying if they new it had such an affect.

I just do what comes naturally to me, that which "feels" right. I am currently writing a book about my journey, let us see where it goes.

Thank you for the positive feedback, it lets me know I am on the right track.

[Charlie Pecos]

Thank you so much for this Thread, Charlie!! Bullying has become an overwhelming problem in our schools. I appreciate your bringing attention to this problem that should be kept in the forefront of school's agendas. I have found many more people these days tend to be overly aggressive with their selfish behavior, and their children adopt these patterns from their parents. Where I live, many people just live in their own little worlds, as if they have blinders on and don't even acknowledge the presence of other precious beings around them. I know everyone has their problems, and perhaps that is the reason for this behavior, but I feel that part of our mission and purpose in this world is to acknowledge and honor each other in our oneness of existence.

I myself am overly sensitive because of bullying at a very young age from peers and my mother. I just never seemed to *fit in* anywhere.

Unfortunately bullying doesn't stop in childhood. Only a few years ago, I was bullied out of a job I loved because the manager would not intervene and support me. I had many students in my class come to my defense, in writing, but the owner of the establishment needed the bullies more than me in the jobs they held. I was totally blown away that such behavior could be ignored by adults, but after all money is more important in businesses than human beings. This incident really did a number on me considering experiences from my past, and it has taken me several years to recover, and feel better. The damage never totally goes away though, and even though I may have improved from this incident, my overly sensitive nature has been reinforced.

I love the Avalon forum because I have found so many spiritually in touch people here.

In closing...let's be and teach honor and recognition for each other's spirits of which we all are one. Love and Peace and Namaste, Linda

Hi Linda, thank you so much for sharing with us. I am so sorry to hear that you had to go through your experience. I can relate all too well to not fitting in. You are right that bullying does not stop when one graduates from school. The good news is that we have the power to change this. I wish you much love and happiness. It has been said that money is the root of all evil, and I whole heartedly agree.

The bullying, harrassment, and ridicule continue long into adulthood. Problem is, we allow it. Too many times have I allowed coworkers to treat me as less than equal, but in equal measure are the times I myself treated someone less than justly. I have recognized this, and now I choose to honor all who I have contact with by treating them as friends, even if I suspect they're not. I choose to be the change I want to see. I'm only getting started here.

In our society, we are taught and it is constantly reinforced that we are separate from others, that we are entitled to behave like overgrown brats. Listen kids, we all die. We all leave this place. We take NONE OF THE STUFF with us. The only thing we get to take home is our experience, good and bad. A few nights ago, I had a dream that I had died and left behind my wife and daughter. I was filled with enormous sorrow and regret for not accomplishing what I set out to do here. I was deeply saddened that I had let them down. I need to speak my piece, to let others know that what they say and do profoundly affects the people around them. I was taught by a very good man that those who are around you in your everyday life are your family. As you all are around me virtually, I consider you family.

[Linden]

I am so sorry to hear that you had to go through your experience. I can relate all too well to not fitting in.

Charlie, Thank you for your compassion! Your thread has been very healing for me...Love and Peace, Linda

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Oh, and let me know when your book comes out Charlie! I am very interested!!

[Charlie Pecos]

I am so sorry to hear that you had to go through your experience. I can relate all too well to not fitting in.

Charlie, Thank you for your compassion! Your thread has been very healing for me...Love and Peace, Linda

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Oh, and let me know when your book comes out Charlie! I am very interested!!

This thread is all about the healing and compasssion. We are here to celebrate our life and our journey.

It will be a while for the book yet as I am only on the first chapter, but I will let everyone know when I get to that point.:)
Writing here helps to build my confidence and get my thoughts down on paper as it were.

[Shezbeth]

Sorry, but I'm going to 'dim the lights' as it were.
Wow Charlie, you've said a mouthful and stirred up a bloody hornet's nest in me. Experiences, emotions, and disturbances I had left in the recesses. I identify completely with what you have said, and agree. It does happen, and the effects are life-changing. Time for some catharsis.

As a child I was naive, outspoken, and expressive. An extrovert to the extreme - I wanted to be everyone's friend, and I didn't mind or hesitate in telling them.

Now, I am a guarded, pessimistic, and withdrawn introvert who would doesn't speak until those around show a receptivity to what I have to say - else I won't bother.

What happened was about 9 years of bullying, ostracism, and victimization. I won't go into specifics but physical, mental, and emotional abuse were the norm. My teachers didn't care for me because I was smart enough that I could learn the material by reading the book and then catch (and point out) flaws in their reasoning/teaching.
The kids felt I was 'fair game' because I was 'the smart new kid' who's self-esteem wasn't based on any social grouping or parental economic standing in the community (moved to a tight-knit rural community at age 9). In short, I didn't much need the teachers to learn and they knew it, and I didn't need the other kids to feel good about myself and they knew it.

Kids would form little groups (groups of males and females) to follow me around and torment me about anything and everything that they could sink their teeth into. I could speculate at what their conscious/unconscious psychological and energetic motivations were but I prefer not to think about it much.

Suffice it to say, it worked. After years of abuse I became reserved, distrustful, and withdrawn. I remain so to this day.

What didn't help, and I add this as a corrolary to your appeal to parents, was mine. My parents were not available, open, or receptive to what was going on. It wasn't until 6 years in that anyone had the slightest inkling of what was really happening, and then was dismissed as "not getting along with kids at school" - this from both parents and teachers.
The moment a child's confidence with an adult, particularly their parents is disturbed, irreparable damage has been done.


I know EXACTLY how and why. When you have been bullied, picked on, put down, and made to feel like less of a person [...] I wanted to kill every single one of those bastards who had ever hurt me, who had hit me or uttered a thoughtless insult. [...] These kids were failed by the system, their teachers, and their parents.

Yeah. Yeah. I had a list. Not who would die, but who would survive. I think there were 15 or so out of 1000+.

But I also recognize that were it not for traumatic experiences as a child, I might not have the courage to challenge the 'official story', the MSM, the Government impositions, the corruption, etc.. I'll admit today, and this is as close to forgiveness as I can come at this time in my life, maybe it all wasn't such a bad thing.

I still want to throttle anyone who talks about "boys being boys" when addressing bullying,....

[Icecold]

Birds of a feather modwiz old chap.

More power to you my friend and brother.


Great stories Charlie and Shez. Thank you.

[Lord Sidious]

Pity some of you guys and girls didn't have a supply of sharpened carrots on ya.
That would have stopped em, believe you me.

[Charlie Pecos]

Sorry, but I'm going to 'dim the lights' as it were.
Wow Charlie, you've said a mouthful and stirred up a bloody hornet's nest in me. Experiences, emotions, and disturbances I had left in the recesses. I identify completely with what you have said, and agree. It does happen, and the effects are life-changing. Time for some catharsis.

As a child I was naive, outspoken, and expressive. An extrovert to the extreme - I wanted to be everyone's friend, and I didn't mind or hesitate in telling them.

Now, I am a guarded, pessimistic, and withdrawn introvert who would doesn't speak until those around show a receptivity to what I have to say - else I won't bother.

What happened was about 9 years of bullying, ostracism, and victimization. I won't go into specifics but physical, mental, and emotional abuse were the norm. My teachers didn't care for me because I was smart enough that I could learn the material by reading the book and then catch (and point out) flaws in their reasoning/teaching.
The kids felt I was 'fair game' because I was 'the smart new kid' who's self-esteem wasn't based on any social grouping or parental economic standing in the community (moved to a tight-knit rural community at age 9). In short, I didn't much need the teachers to learn and they knew it, and I didn't need the other kids to feel good about myself and they knew it.

Kids would form little groups (groups of males and females) to follow me around and torment me about anything and everything that they could sink their teeth into. I could speculate at what their conscious/unconscious psychological and energetic motivations were but I prefer not to think about it much.

Suffice it to say, it worked. After years of abuse I became reserved, distrustful, and withdrawn. I remain so to this day.

What didn't help, and I add this as a corrolary to your appeal to parents, was mine. My parents were not available, open, or receptive to what was going on. It wasn't until 6 years in that anyone had the slightest inkling of what was really happening, and then was dismissed as "not getting along with kids at school" - this from both parents and teachers.
The moment a child's confidence with an adult, particularly their parents is disturbed, irreparable damage has been done.


I know EXACTLY how and why. When you have been bullied, picked on, put down, and made to feel like less of a person [...] I wanted to kill every single one of those bastards who had ever hurt me, who had hit me or uttered a thoughtless insult. [...] These kids were failed by the system, their teachers, and their parents.

Yeah. Yeah. I had a list. Not who would die, but who would survive. I think there were 15 or so out of 1000+.

But I also recognize that were it not for traumatic experiences as a child, I might not have the courage to challenge the 'official story', the MSM, the Government impositions, the corruption, etc.. I'll admit today, and this is as close to forgiveness as I can come at this time in my life, maybe it all wasn't such a bad thing.

I still want to throttle anyone who talks about "boys being boys" when addressing bullying,....

Hi Shezbeth, thank you for sharing. Feels good, don't it? Getting it off your chest and out into the open.

If you feel so inclined, you are welcome to share more, if it helps.

Wishing you much love and healing energy.

¤=[Post Update]=¤


Pity some of you guys and girls didn't have a supply of sharpened carrots on ya.
That would have stopped em, believe you me.

LOL I believe so!

[Shezbeth]

I appreciate the sentiment. Other details are aside, the point I focus on is that abuse/bulling DOES happen, often it is ALLOWED to happen (through negligence, apathy, or conscious knowledge of those in a responsible/authority position), and that the effects are VERY long-lasting. I'm 30 years old and I'm not done dealing with it completely.

[Icecold]

I appreciate the sentiment. Other details are aside, the point I focus on is that abuse/bulling DOES happen, often it is ALLOWED to happen (through negligence, apathy, or conscious knowledge of those in a responsible/authority position), and that the effects are VERY long-lasting. I'm 30 years old and I'm not done dealing with it completely.

My son inherited my abhorrence and reaction to bullying. I often told them stories of rescuing the weak from bullies. I gave all of my sons teaching in compassion and courage, to stand up for the weak and the meek.

During the Sydney Olympics, my eldest twin son was working as a bar tender at the Olympic venue. While travelling to the venue he was waiting on Tempe Station in Sydney with a large crowd of people. Two men decided for some reason to target some poor man and began to bash him quite mercilessly. No one moved to help the man, except my son.

He pulled the man out of it and confronted the bullies. They saw him as their next target. One of them took a swing at my son and my son broke his nose. He then dealt with the other. When he's finished, the entire platform of people were clapping him. He's a good boy.

WHAT IS NOT BULLYING - NOTE>>>

When talking about bullying, it is very important for parents (and teachers and kids) to understand what bullying is not. Many times, a single act or behavior is out of proportion, but it is not considered bullying.


Some people think that bullying is any aggressive behavior and although such behaviors are a source of concern and need attention, it is important to separate them from bullying.

Bullying is recurring and deliberate abuse of power.


It is not easy for kids to understand the difference between a deliberate act and an accidental one, but it surprises me that many grownups also talk about things people do to them as if they were done intentionally to hurt them. Such perception is very dangerous, because every minor act of conflict, done without any intention to harm, can escalate and become a big conflict.

Much like in any communication, whether it is verbal or not, there are two sides involved. Bullying is a form of communication and depends not only on the giver but also on the receiver. For an incident to be considered bullying, the aggressor must want to hurt someone and the victim must perceive the incident as a deliberate act of abuse.

It is very important for the victim to know what bullying is not to make sure that when things seem hurtful, they will not fall immediately into the category of bullying, because the way to overcome bullying is different from the way to overcome other hurtful acts.

Not bullying list

This incidents on this list are NOT considered bullying:

Not liking someone - It is very natural that people do not like everyone around them and, as unpleasant as it may be to know someone does not like you, verbal and non-verbal messages of "I don't like you" are not acts of bullying.

Being excluded - Again, it is very natural for people to gather around a group of friends and we cannot be friends with everyone, so it is acceptable that when kids have a party or play a game at the playground, they will include their friends and exclude others. It is very important to remind kids they do the same thing sometimes too and, although exclusion is unpleasant, it is not an act of bullying.

Accidentally bumping into someone - When people bump into others, the reaction depends mostly on the bumped person's mood. If they have had a bad day, they think it was an act of aggressive behavior, but if they are in the good mood, they smile back and attract an apology. This is also relevant for playing sport, like when kids throwing the ball at each other hit someone on the head. It is very important for teachers and parents to explain that some accidents happen without any bad intention and it is important not to create a big conflict, because it was NOT an act of bullying.

Making other kids play things a certain way - Again, this is very natural behavior. Wanting things to be done our way is normal and is not an act of bullying. To make sure kids do not fall into considering it as an aggressive or "bossy" behavior, we need to teach them assertiveness. If your kids come home and complain that Jane is very bossy and she always wants things to be done her way, you can show them that they want it too and that Jane is miserable, because she is not flexible enough and she will suffer in life for insisting that things be done her way. Again, although it is not fun or pleasant, this is NOT bullying.

A single act of telling a joke about someone - Making fun of other people is not fun for them, but the difference between having a sense of humor and making fun of someone is very fine. It is important to teach kids (and grownups) that things they say as jokes should also be amusing for the others. If not, they should stop. Unless it happens over and over again and done deliberately to hurt someone, telling jokes about people is NOT bullying.


Arguments - Arguments are just heated disagreements between two (or more) people (or groups). It is natural that people have different interests and disagree on many things. Think about it, most of us have disagreements with ourselves, so it is very understandable to have disagreements with others. The argument itself is NOT a form of bullying, although some people turn arguments into bullying, because they want to win the argument so much. They use every means to get what they want and find a weakness in the other person, abuse knowledge or trust they have gained and use it against the other person. It is very important to distinguish between natural disagreements and bullying during an argument.


Expression of unpleasant thoughts or feelings regarding others - Again, communication requires at least two players. Although it may be unpleasant to hear what someone thinks about you, it is NOT a form of bullying but a very natural thing. In every communication, there are disagreements and some form of judgment about each other's attitude and behavior. If someone says to you, "I think this was not a nice gesture" or "You insulted me when you said this", this is NOT bullying but an expression of thoughts and feelings.
Isolated acts of harassment, aggressive behavior, intimidation or meanness - The definition of bullying states that there is repetition in the behavior. Bullying is a conscious, repeated, hostile, aggressive behavior of an individual or a group abusing their position with the intention to harm others or gain real or perceived power. Therefore, anything that happens once is NOT an act of bullying. As a parent, it is important that you pay attention to what your kids are telling you and find out if things are happening more than once.

All the behaviors above are unpleasant and need to be addressed, but they are not to be treated as bullying. Many times, labeling a single act of aggression can turn it into bullying just by perceiving it that way.

[Dennis Jonathan]

Great thread James. I think this is an important subject.

Most bullies, never stop bullying. The adult version of bullying is typically less physical, but it is no less harmful.

It's really easy to fall into this trap. I had a sobering experience with this a few weeks ago.

I was away on a business trip on the second week of February. There were about 30 of us in a corporate training class. We knew each other from previous classes, but only groups of 5-7 were in those classes, so obviously there were immediate circles that formed.

In between my last training, and this one, I found this forum, and began the most recent level of my spiritual awakening. The experiences that followed were a humbling reminder of how far I have to go.

I am pretty easy to get along with. I like to crack jokes, I try not to talk to much, I've spent a lifetime perfecting the art of getting people to like me. That's not a positive trait, and why I developed this self defense mechanism is a story for another post.

So my group of 5 picked up right where we left off. We were sharing stories, reliving old ones, we had a really strong bond. What we didn't have, that other groups had, was a black sheep.

As the group of smaller groups started to intermingle. New friendships formed, circles intertwined, and a good time was had by most. What happened next was horrifying.

It is said, that in every chicken coop, a natural pecking order is established. Every chicken has the understood right to peck a set of chickens for any reason. Some chickens are un-peckable. The chicken on the top of the pyramid can peck everyone, and is immune to being pecked. Conversely, the chicken at the bottom of the chain, is pecked by everyone, and can never peck back.

There was one woman in our class, that was very outspoken. She asked a lot of questions, many of them were admittedly very obvious to most of the class, and she would ask the same question a variety of ways until the trainers just stopped responding.

The people from her class, immediately rolled their eyes every time she spoke up, and it soon became a class wide practice. Even the other trainers would make faces out of sight when she would raise her hand.

I fell into this too, because as I said, many of her questions were just silly.

During lunch, and at breaks, people would recount their stories, and imitations of her antics. The groups would have one sided debates about her, and it got more and more obnoxious. I am ashamed to say I partook in many of these conversations.

At times, people would have conversations about her, and make jokes, while she was at the same table.

She is a very attractive woman, and many assumptions about here were made.

After the third night, one of the women from my original class looked upset. I approached her during a break, and asked what was wrong. She started telling me about issues she was having back at the office, and then bursted into tears. She told me about how bad she felt for this woman being picked on. She told me that the woman confided in her the night before, heartbroken, about how awful she felt, and how alone she was. My friend told me that she had been in that situation before, and it horrified her to realize that she was on the other end of it now.

As she was talking, a lump formed in my throat. Every eye roll, and snide remark came to memory. Every comment I said, and did not interrupt echoed in my mind. Even a few times that I saw her sitting alone, looking longingly for someone to sit with her, came to mind. How had I let this happen? Especially now? How did I contribute to it?!???!?

I let her finish her thoughts, let her cry on my shoulder. Thanked her for her courage to say something. And determined to change my actions. We made a pact to befriend her, lift her up, come to her defense, and be her circle.

It was that easy. As soon as the rest of the chickens saw that some of us chose not to peck, they chose not to as well. As soon as 2 of us interceded for her, the focus of the mob shifted. It was as if by just standing near her, we made her less of a target.

This is not a self glorifying story. It is an embarrassing one, that I haven't even shared with my wife. I felt like a Christian, who helped nail Christ to the cross. I felt like a Judas unto myself. I felt...feel like I am a blink away from being the worst of us.

Sorry this was so long. I feel like it's important. Bullying is not just about kids. And bullies aren't only after lunch money.

Thanks for giving me the courage to share this James.

Love you man.

[Sol Va]

If you are a parent, please, go hug your kids and tell them you love them. Do this one simple thing many times a day. Take the time to find out what they are going through at school, is any one giving them a hard time? Who are their friends?
Who are their enemies? If your child is gaining weight and you are bothered by it and don't understand why, know this: We use food to comfort us, the fat acts as an emotional insulation against the cruel barbs and taunts of thoughtless bullies.

If I can impart just one crucial piece of knowledge, let it be this: Listen to your children, please, hear what they have to say. They will tell you whats wrong if you listen to them, give them room to speak and don't dismiss them when they tell you something that makes you uncomfortable. Then, take action...this is the single most important part. These spirits are so special and can be damaged so easily in this harsh environment. We must nurture them so they may grow and live to their full potential.
Charlie

Charlie, Thank You for your beautiful and courageous post. I too was bullied by my sister and no one protected me. The young narcissist and sociopath bullies are incredibly destructive to others. I affirm that loving and affirming and valuing our children will help them recover from the attacks of bullies. What could be even more potent is just, for all parents who could do this, take the children out of the school environment which permits this, or sees bullying as normal. As adults we can also talk story about who tries to bully us, and how we don't take it. Help the children and other adults identify that the abusive perpetrators are damaged specimens and not to be believed in.
Blessings on you and your recovery, Charlie.

Hugs
Grace

[Icecold]

Further Information on BULLYING - A FAQ.

Bullying facts and myth

Myth: Bullying mainly happens in schools

Fact: Although we may think of bullying in association with school life, bullying is part of everyday life. There is bullying towards family members (partner, child, sibling), bullying towards people who are different (based on race, religion, appearance, abilities), bullying towards people at work (employees, service providers, customers). Sadly, the list is too big to mention it all here.

Myth: Bullying is hurting someone physically

Fact: You do not have to touch someone to be a bully. Physical attack is just one form of bullying and not necessary the worst. The others forms are:

Verbal attack - name-calling and put-downs. Put downs can be for any form of difference, for example:
Different culture or ethnic background
Gender
Sexual orientation
Physical features - Weight, height
Skills, ability or disability - too smart, stupid…
Economic status
Marital status
Physical appearance - clothes, jewelry
Religion
Association with a group
Threatening and intimidation
Taking possessions or stealing (money or possessions)
Exclusion from a group
Myth: Bullying is a boy thing

Fact: It is true that physical attack, which is only one form of bullying, is mostly done by boys, but girls use other forms of bullying, like putting down, name-calling and harassment more than boys do, which can be just as painful as being physically hurt.

Myth: Bullies hassle people they do not know well

Fact: Bullies need to know their victims in order to bully them. Bullies find a weakness and use it to hurt. Without knowing someone, it is hard to know if they will be intimidated by something.

Myth: Kids who stand out are more subject to bullying

Fact: Kids can be bullied by their parents for their appearance, (lack of) skills, having different values and more. Bullies do not need a majority to support themselves, just a weak enough victim and a psychological need for power.

Myth: Bullying is a normal stage in kids' development

Fact: Bullying is a learned behavior, which is the use of some sort of power to compensate for having a weakness.

Myth: If we ignore bullying, it will disappear

Fact: Many times, ignoring is a good way not to give attention to negative things, but in bullying, ignoring is a reward. If we ignore, we deliver the message that bullying is acceptable.

Myth: Telling you have been bullied will only get you into more trouble

Fact: Research in schools has found that bullying stops when an adult, an authority or a friend is being involved.

Myth: Parents cannot do much to prevent their kids from being bullied

Fact: Research has found that kids who have better relationships with their parents are less likely to be bullied. Think about it. A good relationship helps the parents detect the first signs of bullying towards their kids and to solve the problem before it gets out of control.

Myth: Bullying gets worse as kids get older

Fact: Bullying declines as kids get older. There are more bullying incidents in primary school than in high school.

Myth: Bullying is done face to face only

Fact: Unfortunately, in the last few years, we have a new form of bullying called "cyber bullying". It can be done through social networking sites, emails and even with the use of mobile phones by sending abusive or threatening messages to others.

Understanding what bullying is should be the first step in making sure your kids do not be victims of bullying. Talk to them about the facts, listen to their stories and help them recognize the bullying in their own life.

Next time, I will introduce some statistics about bullying. I did not want to scare you just yet, so I left it for chapter 2.

Keep your kids safe and strong.

[trenairio]

[edit][edit][edit]

[Icecold]

Further.... People Associated with Incidents of Bullying....



Other Bullying Players

It is commonly thought that the bullying game is run by two main players, the bully and the victim. However, there are many other players taking part in this game. Understanding the role of the other players can greatly change the dynamic of the bullying act. Their weaknesses are not obvious, so they are not easy targets, but do they defend the weak? Encourage the bully? Do nothing?

As a group, the kids who are watching an act of bullying are called "Bystanders". Research studies claim that in 85% of the situations, there are other kids witnessing an act of bullying. Most bystanders feel very uncomfortable with the bullying, but do not intervene for different reasons. As a parent reading this, you probably say to yourself, "I'd rather my kid leave the scene and not get into extra trouble". Well, this is very wise, but more often than not, bystanders leave without getting the help of anyone else.

Statistically, 57% of the times, when another child intervenes, the bullying stops within seconds! So bystanders have lots of power. They just do not know it. The main problem is not that they do not help the victims. It is that they help the bully by being an audience for his act of power.

There are different types of bystanders:

Ringleaders are kids in power that orchestrate a bullying act by using their social position. They do not bully directly but use a weakness of a bully to gain power over other weak kids.
Associates are kids who actively join in the bullying. It could be because they are afraid of the bully or the ringleader, but they will not initiate a bully act themselves. In some strange way, they are some kind of victims too.
Reinforcers are kids who do not bully directly but give feedback to the bully by commenting, smiling or laughing. Again, these kids do not initiate an act of bullying towards other kids, but boost the bully's confidence with their behavior by being a supportive audience.
Outsiders are kids who are on the victim's side but keep quiet when watching an act of bullying. They are afraid of the bully, so they say and do nothing in order to avoid drawing any attention to themselves.
Defenders are rare kids who actively try to stop the bully and comfort the bullied victim.
Most of the kids in the bullying game are bystanders. Here are the reasons they are involved:

The bully is their friend
They do not like the victim
Telling on a bully is tattling or dobbing and they are fearful for their social reputation
They are afraid that not supporting the bully will make them the next target
They are afraid that supporting the victim will show their weakness and attract undesired attention to them
Many parents are so happy their kids are not bullies or being bullied they do not support the other participants in the bullying "game", but by doing nothing, they risk that when something happens to their own children, no one else will come to defend them.

It is our social responsibility to help those who are weak, because we will probably be weak one day and need the support of others. Supporting bullying bystanders can make a huge difference to the bullies and to the bullied victims and may help change the course of this disturbing trend.

Again, when one of the other players defends the victim, 57% of bullying acts end within 10 seconds. When the defender gets outside help, a third of the bullying acts stop as soon as an adult intervenes.

The problem is that we do not have many defenders, but with the right guidance, we can give our kids skills and power to stand up and be a voice for the weak.

Join me next week for the discussion about the home of the bully. Hopefully, it will help you reflect and make sure that you parent your kids in a way that will minimize their chances of being bullies.

[InCiDeR]

(...) I felt like a Christian, who helped nail Christ to the cross. I felt like a Judas unto myself. I felt...feel like I am a blink away from being the worst of us.

Sorry this was so long. I feel like it's important. Bullying is not just about kids. And bullies aren't only after lunch money.

Thanks for giving me the courage to share this James.

Love you man.

Thank you James for starting this thread. Thank you modwiz, Shez, Icecold and all Avalonians sharing your story and thoughts. Finally, Dennis, thank you for sharing your story. Do not feel ashame of yourself, it is easier than we might believe to fall into these pit falls:

The Stanford Prison Experiment
http://www.prisonexp.org/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sd3KXppIBDs

Asch Conformity Experiment
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asch_conformity_experiments

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYIh4MkcfJA

Milgram experiment
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milgram_experiment

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2PGnHHnRMk


Sometimes I would like to believe I wouldn't fall into the above traps, but to be honest, I am sure I would... and knowing that fact saddens me, because I also had my shared deal of bullying! / Thomas

[Humble Janitor]

I grew up with bullying and was a bully for a brief period of time. Never really fit in with school. Never really conformed. I reveled in being the "outcast" and being someone different.

I'm still learning. Years of meaningful social development just down the drain. It's too bad that a lot of people I've befriended have no patience for this. You can't just get over years of not being part of a conversation. It can't be done overnight. It takes years of mis-steps.

[sleepy]

xxxxx xxxxx

[modwiz]

(...) I felt like a Christian, who helped nail Christ to the cross. I felt like a Judas unto myself. I felt...feel like I am a blink away from being the worst of us.

Sorry this was so long. I feel like it's important. Bullying is not just about kids. And bullies aren't only after lunch money.

Thanks for giving me the courage to share this James.

Love you man.

Thank you Charlie for starting this thread. Thank you modwiz, Shez, Icecold and all Avalonians sharing your story and thoughts. Finally, James, thank you for sharing your story. Do not feel ashame of yourself, it is easier than we might believe to fall into these pit falls:

The Stanford Prison Experiment
http://www.prisonexp.org/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sd3KXppIBDs

Asch Conformity Experiment
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asch_conformity_experiments

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYIh4MkcfJA

Milgram experiment
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milgram_experiment

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2PGnHHnRMk


Sometimes I would like to believe I wouldn't fall into the above traps, but to be honest, I am sure I would... and knowing that fact saddens me, because I also had my shared deal of bullying! / Thomas

Thomas, time to think and change your programing and believe a new story about yourself. You are no longer a sheeple. You would realize this was sick behavior and refuse to be a part of it. Just because an episode of the Twilight Zone is filming in our sector of reality there is no reason to be a willing actor. This is the difference between "realized" human beings and the sleepwalkers.

This world depends on us not being one of "them".

We cannot continue to be useless eaters or we will be fit for nothing better than to be slaves for the NWO and be culled when our wretched numbers begin to foul the Earth.

We detest the Elite, and rightly so, for their abuses of power. How are sheeple different in character? The people in these experiments were not elites, except for the white coats perhaps.

We will not be like them. We are the choices we make.

Choice is where power begins!

[Shezbeth]

Thank you Icecold for an extensive overview and analysis of the subject. I have only one thing to add, and it is intuitively derived. Take it with a grain of salt ^_^

Bullies, particularly in the moment of bullying are not consciously aware of what they are doing. If one were to separate them from the situation they could reasonably state that their acts resulted in harm (of whatever nature) to the victim and that they don't intellectually mean to cause harm to another person. What they won't say and likely won't be aware of is the brain drugs (my term, the correct term is Neuro-Peptides; See What the Bleep Do We Know?) and the physiological and biochemical response. These perpetrators actually (in a certain sense) get a buzz from their actions NOT dissimilar to those observable in a drug user.

In the moment, the Ringleaders experience an intense rush of gratifying chemicals. Their experience of those chemicals, and the desire to increase the dosage, is what perpetuates the act. I find that such behavior and the willingness to perpetrate comes from a previous victimization - the Ringleaders were once victims themselves. The victimization therefore is a transference on their part, a very crude method of distancing themselves from the victim 'they once were'.
The Reinforcers also experience a rush of chemicals, but different from the Ringleader in that there is an underlying wonderment and excitement in seeing what the Ringleader will do and to what extent the incident will escalate. They are not in conrol of the situation so they are as you said bystanders, but their reinforcement causes an increase in the gratification of the Ringleader who then escalates the behavior and the observation of which results in the gratification of the Reinforcer.

Again, I haven't formally studied brain chemistry to a degree that I can authoritatively state this, nor have I similarly studied psychology. In saying so it is just a theory, but one I've yet to disprove.

BIG ups for the posting of the Stanford Prison experiment!

[Icecold]

Modwiz,

B.F..Skinner's got a lot to answer. Sadist.

Thank you for the correction InCiDeR......I did mean him.

[InCiDeR]

Modwiz,

J.B.Skinner's got a lot to answer. Sadist.

My Dear friend, you meant B.F Skinner?

[Charlie Pecos]

Icecold- thank you for bringing to our attention on what bullying is not. Very well articulated, and I completely agree.

Dennis Jonathan- Thank you for coming forward and sharing your story, it took a lot of courage and I for one am very proud of you for recognizing your mistake and taking the necessary steps to help a friend in need. Cudos to you my friend.

We all make mistakes, it's what we do when we realize them that makes us who we are.

Edit:

Just want to thank Icecold again for the very accurate information on bullying. I can vouch that from my personal experience every fact is 100% true and I can verify it's accuracy from field observation.:)

Sol Va: Thank you for your contribution. Many blessings to you my friend.


Trenairio: Sorry for your predicament. You got to see it that it is just the nature of ego. I remember being a bully at times due to the fact that I was much taller than the other kids.

We have all been bullies at one time or another, the key is to change the behavior.

Hi Sleepy, thank you for your contribution. It was a shocking day indeed, I am glad your daughter was OK.

Shezbeth: Thank you for your insightful post, i found it most interesting.

[Shezbeth]

Bringing up the lights a bit,....

I fully recognize and appreciate that as a long-term symptom of my experiences came the following phenomenon which have benefitted me greatly, particularly in approach and address of topics that we discuss here on Avalon at length.

- A lack of confidence in the ability, perception, and responsible activity of those in positions of authority
- Radical self-reliance
- Ability to perceive intent in others
- Knowledge of baser human insticts and how to avoid being subject to them

Please note that I am NOT one for popular music (particularly THIS artist ~_~`), but heard it on the radio and felt it apropos, particularly the verse about doors being closed. I present the following as a lighthearted depiction of the evolution I have experienced as a result of everything previously mentioned.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTfZXh427B0 (sorry, one of those copywrighted vids)

Not everyone who drops us in a pile of sh*t is our enemy, and not everyone who pulls us out of it is our friend - Unknown

[Charlie Pecos]

Bringing up the lights a bit,....

I fully recognize and appreciate that as a long-term symptom of my experiences came the following phenomenon which have benefitted me greatly, particularly in approach and address of topics that we discuss here on Avalon at length.

- A lack of confidence in the ability, perception, and responsible activity of those in positions of authority
- Radical self-reliance
- Ability to perceive intent in others
- Knowledge of baser human insticts and how to avoid being subject to them

Please note that I am NOT one for popular music (particularly THIS artist ~_~`), but heard it on the radio and felt it apropos, particularly the verse about doors being closed. I present the following as a lighthearted depiction of the evolution I have experienced as a result of everything previously mentioned.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTfZXh427B0 (sorry, one of those copywrighted vids)

Not everyone who drops us in a pile of sh*t is our enemy, and not everyone who pulls us out of it is our friend - Unknown

Shezbeth my friend, much respect to you. I too learned these very same things. Years later when I came to know a psychopathic personality, I knew exactly who and what he was. He also knew that I could see right through him and it caused a great deal of friction between us. They don't like it when their intended victims can see right through them, makes them feel vulnerable.

In honor of your last line, I give you this parable. I have told it to my wife many times over the years:

One cold winter day out in the middle of the country, a lonely little bird sat pirched high upon a telephone wire. It was bitter cold and the little bird was nearly frozen dead when he fell from the wire, unable to hold on any longer. Our little friend fell to the ground and thought to himself "well, this is it, I am going to die". No sooner did he think this than a cow came over and took a big steaming s**t right on top of him. The poor little bird began to warm up and he could feel the life force flowing into himself again. Sure he was covered in s**t, but he was so happy to be alive that he began to sing his little heart out in celebration of life! A nearby cat heard the little bird singing, came over and dug him out of the s**t and promptly ate him. The moral of the story? Not everyone who s**ts on you is your enemy, not everyone who digs you out of s**t is your friend, and if you are warm and happy in a pile of s**t, keep your f***ing mouth shut!

Cheers mate!

Not typically a fan of Katy Perry but I must say, that song is inspirational, thank you!

[Dennis Jonathan]

Sorry for your predicament. You got to see it that it is just the nature of ego. I remember being a bully at times due to the fact that I was much taller than the other kids.

I feel you man.

I went from the fat kid everyone always picked on, to the biggest kid in school after a crazy growth spurt during the summer between 6th and 7th grade.

At first I spent my time taking on every bully and protecting all of the kids who were victoms.

The unfortunate consequence to this was gaining popularity, and getting invited into the tough crowd. Since my entire childhood experience was being the butt of every joke, and excluded from every group, I was gratefull for finally being "cool".

I dont remember when it happened, but somehow I went from the hero to the villain. I realized 3 or 4 years later when some younger kids saw me walking down the hall in highschool, and quickly sped past me, practically hugging the opposite wall.

I was still into some pretty bad stuff, but from that moment I started fighting for the little guy again.

Acceptance can be an alluring drug.

[Lord Sidious]

Charlie,

I remember that day well. I also live in the Denver Metro area and as I was returning to work from lunch, I heard about a high school shooting on my car radio. I had a daughter in high school and I was about to drive directly to her when they said the school was Columbine. I felt instant relief and then such sadness for the parents who would not get to feel relief. It was a tragedy. Your post reminded me of a program I saw and I wish there was something like this available to all kids. I found highlights from the program. I think it is beautiful and it made me cry when I watched it. I wanted to share this with you.
Thank you for sharing your story and for wanting to make a change.





http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_YuGSOvQ58&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2AJ7Vcxk3w&NR=1


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yCPi7FFlJk&feature=related

That should fix it.



Bringing up the lights a bit,....

I fully recognize and appreciate that as a long-term symptom of my experiences came the following phenomenon which have benefitted me greatly, particularly in approach and address of topics that we discuss here on Avalon at length.

- A lack of confidence in the ability, perception, and responsible activity of those in positions of authority
- Radical self-reliance
- Ability to perceive intent in others
- Knowledge of baser human insticts and how to avoid being subject to them

Please note that I am NOT one for popular music (particularly THIS artist ~_~`), but heard it on the radio and felt it apropos, particularly the verse about doors being closed. I present the following as a lighthearted depiction of the evolution I have experienced as a result of everything previously mentioned.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTfZXh427B0 (sorry, one of those copywrighted vids)

Not everyone who drops us in a pile of sh*t is our enemy, and not everyone who pulls us out of it is our friend - Unknown

See if that works.

[TigerLilly]

There is another type of bullying which I have seen a lot, that is bullying with a couple. When the stronger partner gets into the habit of making their spouse the butt of their jokes.

Its often pure ego, one person trying to make themselves look clever or witty at the expense of their partner. Often later dismissed with an "oh you know I didn't really mean it, you should be able to take a joke" .
But the result when it becames a habit is a devistating loss of confidence.

Its also more difficult for the observer to interfer when it is within a couple. Turning the joke or praising the injured party can work, but if you are too heavy handed you can just ruin everyone's evening and make things worse.

[Lord Sidious]

There is another type of bullying which I have seen a lot, that is bullying with a couple. When the stronger partner gets into the habit of making their spouse the butt of their jokes.

Its often pure ego, one person trying to make themselves look clever or witty at the expense of their partner. Often later dismissed with an "oh you know I didn't really mean it, you should be able to take a joke" .
But the result when it becames a habit is a devistating loss of confidence.

Its also more difficult for the observer to interfer when it is within a couple. Turning the joke or praising the injured party can work, but if you are too heavy handed you can just ruin everyone's evening and make things worse.

Demeaning the very one they profess to love.
Low.

[Icecold]

There is another type of bullying which I have seen a lot, that is bullying with a couple. When the stronger partner gets into the habit of making their spouse the butt of their jokes.

Its often pure ego, one person trying to make themselves look clever or witty at the expense of their partner. Often later dismissed with an "oh you know I didn't really mean it, you should be able to take a joke" .
But the result when it becames a habit is a devistating loss of confidence.

Its also more difficult for the observer to interfer when it is within a couple. Turning the joke or praising the injured party can work, but if you are too heavy handed you can just ruin everyone's evening and make things worse.

Thanks TigerLilly, that is a very important and common form of bullying. Happens between both friends and life partners. Will definitely poison a relationship.

[Charlie Pecos]

There is another type of bullying which I have seen a lot, that is bullying with a couple. When the stronger partner gets into the habit of making their spouse the butt of their jokes.

Its often pure ego, one person trying to make themselves look clever or witty at the expense of their partner. Often later dismissed with an "oh you know I didn't really mean it, you should be able to take a joke" .
But the result when it becames a habit is a devistating loss of confidence.

Its also more difficult for the observer to interfer when it is within a couple. Turning the joke or praising the injured party can work, but if you are too heavy handed you can just ruin everyone's evening and make things worse.

Hi TigerLilly, Thank you for posting.

I had a boss who would deliberately say things to inflame and antagonize his wife. I asked him why he did this and he told me that he liked the resulting fireworks. Not surprisingly, they are no longer married.

My wifes maternal grandmother has a husband who affectionately calls her "A**hole". A real peach of a guy, we can't figure out why she stays with him.

It all boils down to not having respect for other selves.