Another member gone.

[blake]

Hello All,

I have only been an Avalonian since January, and yet so many worthy, active participants have left that I spent time and energy in getting to know by reading their posts regularly. It was disheartening to open the site this morning to read of yet another active, and worthy member leaving who posts I have read regularly over the past few months. Perhaps this is how Avalon has always been, and since I am relatively new I don't understand the politics of the short and temporary status of many of its active and worthy members? From my perspective, as long as people practice manners, and understand why manners are so important, not only with family and friends, but especially in the community at large, and especially in a public forum such as Avalon, then I am at a lost as to why so many feel they can not stay, or are banned from this site. Healthy debate, a sharing of different perspectives, learning and disciplining oneself to be polite to those who may think differently, who have different morals, or agendas, or who may have had a bad day is the basic mix and foundation for any community no matter how large or small, no matter how formal or informal. I am getting the impression that Avalon does not have or perhaps does not want a community with a solid foundation but would rather see people come and go. I welcome change but from my experience of working with groups all my life, is that anything “real” can not have healthy growth without a firm foundation. And a firm foundation takes time to build. I ask if the community of Avalon is being built in such a way to last through the centuries like the pyramids of old, or is it being built like the next fast food building, that is built only to be torn down when something else, not better, comes along?

I came to Avalon to debate and share my knowledge and experiences in exchange for learning about the perspectives and knowledge of others; and I find most Avalonians exceedingly generous in the knowledge that they share. Obviously there are many that I heatedly disagree with but as long as basic manners are practiced I think its wonderful that someone could challenge my thinking and perspective. I never did like “yes” people.

Public schools, at least in America, in my opinion, teach mediocrity not excellence, because they are so controlled in what can or cannot be said. They teach people to be worker bees, to be servants to the few. Those free thinkers, those that challenge the status quo are not welcomed. I am wondering, if underneath all that is said on this site, if the bottom line for those who are banned or suggested to find a new home is because they too challenged the status quo in some way? Sometimes the most difficult part of a foundation to put in ends up being the strongest stone in the foundation that allows it to stay in place for centuries. How is Avalon building a solid foundation? Or is it being built like the next fast food building, because a solid foundation is not wanted on some level?

I don't know what is happening at Avalon; but it seems as though not all perspectives are welcome. I haven’t figure out quite yet what level of challenge of the status quo is acceptable. I have to admit at being quite shock at some of the new moderators comments to some posters.... Ace is one poster that comes to mind, but there are many others. And yet, I read, on the site, during the “Charles Material, that Avalon was suppose to be the "new civilization." I am wondering how Mr. Ryan and the new mods define this “ New Civilization”?

From my short presence here, Avalon doesn’t seem to have progressed very far in terms of building a real community, as the turn over, from what I have seen, is quite large. Avalon is an exclusive club. It is not opened to all, and many have been and will be asked to leave. And it is my opinion that the majority of those asked to leave or who have been banned has taken a huge chuck of the foundation of this community with them. The banning of these people has been the community’s lost. But maybe I misunderstood, and building a strong community is not one of the agendas of Avalon?

We are all from different countries. I think that was part of the appeal, of taking our valuable time and choosing to spend some of it here. Sadly, it doesn’t appear that Avalon wants a real community, or it has not figured out, or acknowledged what building a real community is all about. People are people. And because of that a community that understands how to deal with human nature will established a strong foundation to withstand the good times and bad and continue to grow stronger. A community that doesn’t figure out how to deal with human nature will forever be starting over. I wonder what type of community Avalon has been in the past, is now, and will be in the future? But so far permanence doesn’t seem to be its strong point. Trust and respect takes time to build. I haven’t been here very long, and I still haven’t figured out who is welcomed and who is not. It appears that this is more of a teaching forum.... and like most public schools in America, it appears not to like the status quo challenged. But that is all just my opinion.

Sometimes we outgrow relationships, sometimes realtionships are not a good fit. But the best relationships, the healthiest relationships takes time to build as they grow and change with time and experience. This constant within change allows the foundation of any respected relationship to become stronger through time. So part of making a relationship work is doing the work of a relationship, and that calls for commitment, understanding, and a respect for differences.

I thought Avalon was an intellectual community of ideas and shared experiences, and that in the sharing of our different perspectives, and in our debates, in a respectful manner, we could all grow as human beings. It appears with so many people leaving or be banned that I was wrong. Now I view it differently. Without a solid foundation, its members will not grow with each other, but will, sooner or later, outgrow each other.
And that my fellow Avalonians, in my humble opinion, is why humans insist on, metaphorically always reinventing the wheel, instead of learning from the past to make a better today.

Sincerely,

Mr. Davis

[Chicodoodoo]

Another member gone? Who did we lose?

Avalon would not be a community if we did not care about the loss of any one of our members.

[Calz]

Mr. Davis,

You have brought great insight particularly to financial topics.

I hope you can stay ... as I hope with so many members who have gotten discouraged lately.

Even if you (or any member) post on a rare occasion when moved to do so it still brings a lot to the table for the rest of the membership. It isn't a one-way street provided we retain our base. Most all avalon members have insights and gifts to offer.

Cal

[norman]

Another member gone? Who did we lose?

Avalon would not be a community if we did not care about the loss of any one of our members.

Icecold

and now GAIA too


the sadness is crippling.

[DevilPigeon]

Another member gone? Who did we lose?

Avalon would not be a community if we did not care about the loss of any one of our members.

I think 2 have departed - IceCold & Gaia

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?19625-I-feel-the-need-to-move-on

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?19588-Goodbye-and-good-luck-to-my-friends

[edina]

Hello All,


Sometimes we outgrow relationships, sometimes realtionships are not a good fit. But the best relationships, the healthiest relationships takes time to build as they grow and change with time and experience. This constant within change allows the foundation of any respected relationship to become stronger through time. So part of making a relationship work is doing the work of a relationship, and that calls for commitment, understanding, and a respect for differences.


Sincerely,

Mr. Davis

Thank you Mr. Davis for taking the time to express yourself here, genuinely and honestly.

I find I feel so resonant with this part of your letter. I have learned much from watching people like Chicodoodoo, Flash, SKAWF, and more that I cannot remember right now who continue to stay with the process of relating, and growing.

Continuing to stay engaged because we care, I feel is very important.

I would love to see more discussion about community, and how communities build bonds. In the days to come, as our social order continues to break down, I feel we are going to want to have very strong relationship skills, to ensure our communities stay bonded.

In the real world, we may not always be able to chose who ends up in our community, especially if events turn catastrophic. But, we can chose to be committed to slogging through the messy stuff, until we can forge the bonds of solidarity.

In writing, there is a saying, blah, blah, blah,...gold.

If a writer censors the blah, they will never discover the gold.

You are a very good man, Blake.
Happy to know you.
grace, edina

[Darla Ken Pearce]

Mr. Blake ~ sweetie ~ no matter how things may appear, Avalon is becoming a warm, loving, nurturing, strengthening source of information and sharing of the highest magnitude. No one is ever kicked off this great spiritual place of family without warning. Only those who are unable to comprehend the spirit of giving, loving, assisting, sharing fully in all things positive can find peace here.

Those who are unable to transition from all the burdens and negativity of 3D warlike behavior will be comfortable with the new Fifth dimensional tone available to all here. After warning when personal attacks and derision and heckling come forth, and to those, still and repeatedly who cannot see the light for all the darkness within their own perceptions, well, they are asked to take these old systems and old negative ways and behaviors outside the perimeter of this most loving of families simply because they hold others back from ascension in their own nature of progression. We are here joined in unity of purpose and upliftment of ourselves and other family members and it is open and free to all the bright and shining light now available to all, but when darkness and personal attacks, ridicule, insults, lack of personal vision come forth and when one is unable, unwilling and cannot heed or make a simple slight adjustment to "cause no harm." Well, it cannot be allowed to poison all the love that Avalon holds for those willing to be kind. Kindness is a new and potent force of love and caring ~ that is assisting all of us into the higher dimensions that are open, without boundaries, beckoning us to enter into a new state of unconditional love. Those who wish and desire to get out of the old governing negatives of endless war and destruction instead of building the new structures open and available to all who desire and ask to receive these great blessings. None can be allowed to hinder the upward flow in the nature of things and beings in our new world being born now.

For any who cannot make this tiniest of attitude adjustments after sufficient warning, and sometimes many, many warnings have been given without proper response in bringing forth light instead of harmful attacks and darkness and negativity, well, it is only right and proper that they are asked to take their negativity and insults elsewhere. If we are to become Galactic Citizens and after 13 million years of incarnations for the first time this is open to us and yes, we are being asked just this to ascend into the higher realms that are open and available to all who ask at this time ~ all are invited and assisted into a new reality, a new Earth, a new dawn, a new Golden Age. It is our purpose for being here even if we have for a time forgotten it.

So it is.... if you are willing to accept and honor and cherish all other beings which is a stark and unchangeable standard of love ~ according to Universal Law you must tarry longer in the negativities of 3rd dimensional wars, limitations, judgments and negativity you have placed upon yourself before the Universe and your own perceptions can move forward more fully into the light of love and understanding. Know that you are cherished here in the great spirit of Avalon but a certain basic standard of kindness and love are, indeed, required of all. Much love! And so it is.... At any time, any who can make these small adjustments will be invited with open arms back into the brightest of joy, hope, sharing that is a very tangible blessing here at Avalon and throughout all galaxies, universes and worlds in all of creation. Pretty great, eh? Much love! xoxoxoxox

[Nasu]

Good call all. Lets continue to be the change. Only we can..N

[Gaia]

Great post Darla,we must never lose sight of the aims of Avalon imho.

Blessings to all !

Gaia

[K626]

Another member gone? Who did we lose?

Avalon would not be a community if we did not care about the loss of any one of our members.

Icecold

and now GAIA too


the sadness is crippling.

When did they join?

k

[Jake]

Blake, Thank you for your post. Your honesty and sincerity definitely shines through. You have asked several questions from the heart. Please allow me to answer from the heart.

"Perhaps this is how Avalon has always been, and since I am relatively new I don't understand the politics of the short and temporary status of many of its active and worthy members?"
Avalon has always encouraged members and friends to make the best decisions for themselves and others. If an active member decides to leave, then we have no choice but to honor their decision.

"I ask if the community of Avalon is being built in such a way to last through the centuries like the pyramids of old, or is it being built like the next fast food building, that is built only to be torn down when something else, not better, comes along?"
Avalon is a work in progress, involving real people with real concerns about the community, who volunteer their time to help make Avalon the best forum community of its kind. We give our hearts and souls to this task. We should all be delighted to be here. As mods/admins, We are members of this community too. We are just as challenged by the loss of good members as you are. To answer your question: neither! This Avalon is a COMMUNITY OF PEOPLE. Not an ancient empty structure, and not a fast food resemblance. ;)

"I find most Avalonians exceedingly generous in the knowledge that they share."
Yes, you are correct. This is an awesome place to be. Everyone works hard to make this work.

"I am wondering, if underneath all that is said on this site, if the bottom line for those who are banned or suggested to find a new home is because they too challenged the status quo in some way?"
There are different approaches to challenging the status quo. I think if we were to do away with folks who challenge the status quo, we would not have a single member. Every issue is meaningful to us. We handle every concern on an individual basis, and we have really good people who have accepted the challenge of making some tough decisions regarding the moderating of forum members. There are other, excellent forums out there that do not insist on the level of highly respectable discourse. If you feel that engaging in a way that allows for more abrasive jargon, then maybe Avalon ISN'T the place for you. That is not a bad thing. IMOO. I don't care what forum people choose to discuss these types of issues. Ultimately, we are on the same team, fighting for the same cause.

"How is Avalon building a solid foundation?"
We have literally, thousands of honest and hard working people who give from their hearts, all that they possibly can to forward the vision of Avalon. These folks are the members who post here every day, and commit, at least a part of their lives to participate in that exact goal, building a solid foundation. We are doing it together, with people. We have a team of PA staff who give tirelessly to these same goals. We also have people who put their personal lives at risk to bring forward truth and understanding and knowledge and wisdom.

"From my short presence here, Avalon doesn’t seem to have progressed very far in terms of building a real community"
Then you have some wonderful realizations ahead of you. Avalon is strong.;)

"I haven’t been here very long, and I still haven’t figured out who is welcomed and who is not."
Everyone is welcome to apply. Not everyone is accepted. And NOT everyone is up to the challenge. And, yes, we do have a high standard of discourse.

"Sometimes we outgrow relationships, sometimes realtionships are not a good fit."
I agree with that. Very well put! Sometimes it is time for folks to move on. Sometimes that challenge will include the familiar pains of departing with friends.

"So part of making a relationship work is doing the work of a relationship, and that calls for commitment, understanding, and a respect for differences. "
I agree wholeheartedly. That is why we commit ourselves to a high level of respect for one another. Lots of folks here have their differences, one of the things that sets Avalon apart from other forum communities is that we insist that each member do their part to forward these shared goals, despite their respective differences.

We are all in this together. This forum, that forum, the other forum. We are all on the same team. I hope that I was able to touch base on most of your concerns.
And I truly appreciate you challenging the status quo with the level of respect that you did. It does make a difference.
Best regards,,,, Jake.

[Moonwish]

Dear Mr. Davis;

AS a teachor-trainor you have it all right.

You know what is gong down. Never doubt this.


You will be told of a middle ground which does not exist,

Can we be the sheep of the sheeple? It seems we can.

If we don't pay attention, no one else will.



The game is nearly over, and nobody noticed. How sad.

[Fred Steeves]

Hi Blake, there appears to be a separate phenomena, and not just here, of a simultaneous gathering and splitting up so to speak. I hope Bill starts a thread on this as it's very important, and as far as I know he's the first one here to bring it up. (Bill, are you listening?)

As far as the rest of what you're talking about here, just from my point of view, it's not that easy to get the boot here. I've seriously challenged Bill's judgement on a couple of issues here including Charles, and have not even received a frowny face or detention. I'm quite sure not bitch slapping somebody upside the face before disagreeing with them is useful.

Funny thing is, when I had the opportunity to meet Bill last week and spend a couple hours of interesting conversation, the last thing on my mind was to bring up one of the things I have disagreed with him on, why do that? What a waste of time, there are many many more things that unite us all than divide us, why focus on division? I'll leave that crap to TPTB. As for Icecold, sure he was a valued member here and had very intelligent posts, but let's not forget he CHOSE to leave, he wasn't booted. Not sure it's fair to blame ANYONE there, people come and people go-just like how this post started.


Cheers,
Fred S.

[Whiskey_Mystic]

Funny thing is, when I had the opportunity to meet Bill last week and spend a couple hours of interesting conversation, the last thing on my mind was to bring up one of the things I have disagreed with him on, why do that? What a waste of time, there are many many more things that unite us all than divide us, why focus on division? I'll leave that crap to TPTB. As for Icecold, sure he was a valued member here and had very intelligent posts, but let's not forget he CHOSE to leave, he wasn't booted. Not sure it's fair to blame ANYONE there, people come and people go-just like how this post started.


Great comments, Fred. I hope to meet you someday. (slap me if I already have!) Personally, I enjoy talking to Bill about topics I disagree with him on. It's interesting and with Bill I can discuss different points of view without it being an attack on who he is or who I am. I think this is how it should be with all gentlemen and gentlewomen. (gentlepeeps?) Bill models perfectly the way to discuss differing viewpoints in a civilized way which is productive to the understanding of all. It's like a yoga asana. The Civil Discourse Pose.

Regarding Jake's comments, I am personally prone to shoot from the hip with "abrasive jargon". It's often a kneejerk thing. My time on Avalon is teaching me to temper that. So, the models of appropriate behavior here are very valuable to the development of my own diplomacy and civil debate skills. I'm saying that I appreciate that about Avalon. Points of view are not censored here. It's about the manner in which a point of view is presented.

[Carmody]

Yes, the battle lines are being drawn (sadly) and in this case it is a near global phenomenon of internal-societal lines of demarcation. It's a splitting down idealogical lines, a 'caste-ing' of society, is one way of putting it. In this case, not elite and peons, but spiritual-open etc vs linear-ignorant etc.

There are untold billions in the gap that have not classified themselves in any internal fashion and the battle is for them.

Soon, these internally unclassified people... they will achieve the requisite awareness to begin forming those questions in their minds, as the global situations that rock and tumble about them come to their given 'heads' and burst upon the land in an open manner. Their attempts at reflection will then begin in Ernest.

The trick is to have a properly built and functioning lemonade stand for them to cruise by ....as their given times (the 'why me' internal look moments, etc) comes. When they finally search for reasons and the understanding/unraveling of their given dilemma.

The PTB has their own designs on how to get this done to the populace 'at large'. What solutions that need to be put in front of people in order to enter into 'effective herding'.

We have other ideas.

[DevilPigeon]

-----

LetThereBeLight has now also decided to leave.

And Bashi has been sent on a 1 month vacation....

Bit of a busy old day

[Deborah (ahamkara)]

Leaving, staying. listening, rejecting. These are all about free will. As vibrational energy shifts, some are no longer comfortable. We can observe this without judgement. Peace to each of you. It is always about individual choice.

[araucaria]

Gaia, as I see from the post just above yours, joined on 28th January. The question is, when did she leave? She's still here!



Another member gone? Who did we lose?

Avalon would not be a community if we did not care about the loss of any one of our members.

Icecold

and now GAIA too


the sadness is crippling.

When did they join?

k

[Rocky_Shorz]

this is too funny...

every time things get slow we have a few woe is me members jump in to say goodbye...

appearing again to say hello

and then again goodbye...


I'm starting to wonder if anyone ever left... ;)

[Chicodoodoo]

As for Icecold, sure he was a valued member here and had very intelligent posts, but let's not forget he CHOSE to leave, he wasn't booted.

I'm not sure you can assume that. It's very common in government to boot wave-makers out by privately asking for their resignation and insisting that they go quietly. Then on camera you make a big deal out of how you accepted their resignation with enormous regret while playing up what a fine job they did while serving the administration and how they will be sorely missed. It's a complete charade for public consumption. I don't know the particulars in Icecold's case, but if you read between the lines, it looks like a similar situation.


I’m taking Bill’s advice and moving on.
I made a commitment last night that I would not mention my concerns regarding the reasons for leaving.

Why would he have to commit to leaving quietly? That doesn't sound like the Icecold that debated me so doggedly at times (and thank you for that, Icecold).

[Carmen]

I was part of the old forum, and really loved it. Knew most people and it felt like family. I was very reluctant to come to this new one, but Gio persuaded me. Well, to me the new forum was god-awful. It seemed to me to very male oriented! Warriors stomping all over the place, male as well as female. Aggressive would have been my description. Richard's personality and manner was not my cup of tea. I just observed for awhile , then withdrew. Coming back just recently, I was pleasantly surprised. It is much gentler now, still a bit of agro, but certainly not what it was. Healthy, somewhat heated discussion, is normal, and necessary. Only one of my previous friends are still here, out of about twenty, and they were active participating members, so obviously they were unhappy also. Overall, I observe now a far more balanced, dynamic forum with a large participating membership.

[SteveX]

http://www.pic4ever.com/images/dying.gif

[Fred Steeves]

As for Icecold, sure he was a valued member here and had very intelligent posts, but let's not forget he CHOSE to leave, he wasn't booted.

I'm not sure you can assume that. It's very common in government to boot wave-makers out by privately asking for their resignation and insisting that they go quietly. Then on camera you make a big deal out of how you accepted their resignation with enormous regret while playing up what a fine job they did while serving the administration and how they will be sorely missed. It's a complete charade for public consumption. I don't know the particulars in Icecold's case, but if you read between the lines, it looks like a similar situation.



Come on Chico, you're obviously an intelligent guy and I admire your tenacity, I really do. But don't you think you're kind of reaching for the stars here with the federal government analagy? Comparing Bill and the Moderators(ha, reminds me of Mike and the Mechanics:eek:) to the likes of an Obama, Bush, or Clinton?

I'm just sayin man...Seriously?


Cheers,
Fred S.

[Nasu]

As for Icecold, sure he was a valued member here and had very intelligent posts, but let's not forget he CHOSE to leave, he wasn't booted.

I'm not sure you can assume that. It's very common in government to boot wave-makers out by privately asking for their resignation and insisting that they go quietly. Then on camera you make a big deal out of how you accepted their resignation with enormous regret while playing up what a fine job they did while serving the administration and how they will be sorely missed. It's a complete charade for public consumption. I don't know the particulars in Icecold's case, but if you read between the lines, it looks like a similar situation.


I’m taking Bill’s advice and moving on.
I made a commitment last night that I would not mention my concerns regarding the reasons for leaving.

Why would he have to commit to leaving quietly? That doesn't sound like the Icecold that debated me so doggedly at times (and thank you for that, Icecold).

Ahha! Got you! You are the Agent provocateur after all. Sowing the seeds of mistrust! Clearly the Draco's have taken over our mods, as I am sure you know, get him!!! ….

Only kidding, come Chicodoodoo, see clearly, please.. Look between the lines here. Some are disgruntled and have caused a stink and been booted, others have joined them, others have expressed their sadness, some have been mishandled and left, more have left, some have joined and read this crap and left, then others have commented on that, then others have taken that the wrong way, then the war of the mods, then some more depressing crap happened, then most of us had to pay our taxes, then others got board and left, then others posted about the other sites chatter, then others felt they had to make a choice, more left, more joined and read that crap, then we reacted to that, then you pipped in, then I mumbled a load of crap, then someone took me the wrong way, then you and I got banished, then there was just the newbies left and finally they left. Bill and the mods clean up after the long weekend party and rub their heads from the pain of the hangover...

Meanwhile the real agent provocateurs are rubbing their hands and smiling. Trust nobody, trust every body, we need to be strong here in Avalon, we need to work together, through this and out the other side. Please Chicodoodoo, we need each other for reasons we are not yet fully aware, we need to be mutually reenforcing, we need to be individuals and we need to be one.

In my opinion we need to be true to the thought of our mission and this moment, Avalon and avoid distraction, other than continuing to exert ourselves we should enter into nothing else… N

[edina]

As for Icecold, sure he was a valued member here and had very intelligent posts, but let's not forget he CHOSE to leave, he wasn't booted.

I'm not sure you can assume that. It's very common in government to boot wave-makers out by privately asking for their resignation and insisting that they go quietly. Then on camera you make a big deal out of how you accepted their resignation with enormous regret while playing up what a fine job they did while serving the administration and how they will be sorely missed. It's a complete charade for public consumption. I don't know the particulars in Icecold's case, but if you read between the lines, it looks like a similar situation.


I’m taking Bill’s advice and moving on.
I made a commitment last night that I would not mention my concerns regarding the reasons for leaving.

Why would he have to commit to leaving quietly? That doesn't sound like the Icecold that debated me so doggedly at times (and thank you for that, Icecold).

Chicodoodooo, again, you ask good questions! And I hope you continue to do just that. I would love to hear Icecold's answer to this question.

Every voice does deserve to be heard.

And, I hope that when he hears/sees the choir for healing (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?19661-Healing-Choir) that he may reconsider, it is up to each of us how we choose to proceed now...

[Chicodoodoo]

Comparing Bill and the Moderators (ha, reminds me of Mike and the Mechanics :eek:) to the likes of an Obama, Bush, or Clinton?

Whoa, please don't take it that way. Obama, Bush, and Clinton are criminals of the highest order. It would be quite inappropriate to place Bill and the moderators in that category. I do not mean to imply that at all. I was not making an analogy so much as pointing out the kind of charade that is practically the status quo in our "politically correct" society. Honesty and truth are often recast as effective propaganda, and those that counter these efforts are "dealt with" (silenced). The example from government was just that, an example to illustrate what might be behind Icecold's departure. Like the statement made that Icecold CHOSE to leave, it is purely speculation.

[Fred Steeves]

Thanks for correcting me on that Chico, sorry about the mistaken comparison. Those kind of things happen easily communicating through a keyboard for both sender and receiver.


Cheers,
Fred S.

[Chicodoodoo]

then others have commented on that, then others have taken that the wrong way, then the war of the mods, then some more depressing crap happened, then most of us had to pay our taxes,

TAXES?! And I thought there were already enough negative forces dragging down my vibrational frequency! Must we bring up that unpleasant memory as well? ;)

[Seikou-Kishi]

Whatever happens, has happened or hasn't happened I think Bill's integrity is something upon which we can all depend.

[Constance]

Thanks for all the sharing everyone.


I'm off too...

Mods, please unsubscribe me...

[trenairio]

Take care, it's your choice.

[loveandgratitude]

Becareful Constance............you are leaving when so many new amazing people are being attracted here. Many with a high spiritual energy, I feel a new injection of positive energy as the old falls away.

I have felt the energy "over there" ....very dense to say the least.

AS TO THE FUTURE OF AVALON -

The road to success is always under construction

[Nasu]

Thanks for all the sharing everyone.


I'm off too...

Mods, please unsubscribe me...

Good Luck Constance, I hope you find the path that feels right for you. N

[blake]

Thanks for all the sharing everyone.


I'm off too...

Mods, please unsubscribe me...

Hello Ms Neal,

So sorry you are leaving.

Sincerely,
Mr. Davis.

[Nasu]

Thanks for all the sharing everyone.


I'm off too...

Mods, please unsubscribe me...

Hello Ms Neal,

So sorry you are leaving.

Sincerely,
Mr. Davis.

Yea nice one, thanks Mr Davis, look what you started, now Constance has gone as well!

Only kidding. Today is a big day or its just another day, I am still contemplating it.. I know you were being sincere, sorry for being flippant.. Lets hope there's a few of us left when the dust settles. N

[Rocky_Shorz]

could the mods please merge all these goodbye threads...

Post it up where new members say hi... ;)

[Nasu]

could the mods please merge all these goodbye threads...

Post it up where new members say hi... ;)

Good one Rocky. Well said.. N

[Rocky_Shorz]

to activate the account they need to post there, when someone says goodbye, it should auto deactivate...

It would make life much easier for the mods

[kinerkid]

When did forgiveness become conditional?

Quote from a mod on the healing choir thread:
Wow, this is wonderful, and I really hope this is sincere. Can you please remove all of the poisonous things that have been said about Project Avalon, Bill Ryan, and Inelia Benz from the Nexus forum, and then let's pass the peace pipe around.

(I'll close the thread at this point.)

Dennis

[White Phoenix]

Hello everyone,

As a PA Forum newbie I haven't seen any of the "politics" that may or may not be present here, but I'm glad to be a part of this community and hope that whatever energies myself and other noobs contribute will serve to create a more harmonious environment.
This ship won't sink, it's crew have too much buoyancy for that to happen! :)

[sandy]

Thanks for all the sharing everyone.


I'm off too...

Mods, please unsubscribe me...

So sorry to see you go,

I will miss your knowledge, wisdom, love, and soft energy Constance, and Avalon has lost out in your absence..:sorry:

[loveandgratitude]

Welcome White Phoenix. What a beautiful name.
There are a few renovations/adjustments going on. A beautiful new interior is underway for an envolving forum. With any renovations, old worn out furniture although once prized have to be let go so new furniture can take its place. At first it may seem uncomfortable with the comings and goings, the disruptions, but finally when all the wonderful new things are feeling at home, we can all sit down and enjoy our new surroundings. I welcome you into a spiritually evolving world.

[andywight]

Icecold just got back from a weeks ban, does anyone here think that might have had something to do with his leaving? :doh:




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvEQmhobLVE

[DeDukshyn]

Well, I didn't realy like Icecold's methods but he definately brought up some good debate; no argument there - will miss that. I resonated well with many of Gaia's and Constance's posts so I will miss the vibration increasing posts that they both often brought to the table. Good luck in all your endeavours guys and thanks for what you contributed to Avalon.

[noxon medem]

- wow
Cannot believe nobody posted this one yet :


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBZ8ulc5NTgonstant
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBZ8ulc5NTg

BTW:
" Change is the only known constant ..."

- Avalon is no longer a warship.
For the first part of the year it was.
Timelines are changed now, and
big time adjustments happening.
For good.

Take it easy all.
At the wells.

:fish2:
nm

[jackovesk]

I think we've all had our moments of doubt, disagreements and questioned whether or not we should move on.

I have been a Loyal Avalonian for just over 1 year...Hopefully this is my 1st and only forum I will be participating in...

I too have had a peek at other forums to see what other platforms are available to share our knowledge and the TRUTH as we know it...

I do miss the Knowledge & Wisdom we used to get from long-time members like...

Zook http://nexus.2012info.ca/forum/image.php?u=6&dateline=1304215003 & Fredkc http://nexus.2012info.ca/forum/image.php?u=2&dateline=1301684758

Both Zook & Fredkc were quick to pull you into line and made you question and challenge your shared information with commonsense and maturity without judgement or mallice. It was sad to see them go...

In the end my Mission is to Share as much of the TRUTH as I know it, with as many people as I can and am always Mindful of the 1,000's of non-members who frequent this forum and read our posts aswell.

...and Avalon is Still one the best forums to use...IMHO

I have never been into that 'He said/She said crap...

So Good Luck & Best Wishes to 'All' those that have chosen to leave Avalon and for those that choose to stay.

Remain 'Centred' and 'Focussed' on Why? you decided to join Avalon to start with...

[Lord Sidious]

I think we've all had our moments of doubt, disagreements and questioned whether or not we should move on.

I have been a Loyal Avalonian for just over 1 year...Hopefully this is my 1st and only forum I will be participating in...

I too have had a peek at other forums to see what other platforms are available to share our knowledge and the TRUTH as we know it...

I do miss the Knowledge & Wisdom we used to get from long-time members like...

Zook http://nexus.2012info.ca/forum/image.php?u=6&dateline=1304215003 & Fredkc http://nexus.2012info.ca/forum/image.php?u=2&dateline=1301684758

Both Zook & Fredkc were quick to pull you into line and made you question and challenge your shared information with commonsense and maturity without judgement or mallice. It was sad to see them go...

In the end my Mission is to Share as much of the TRUTH as I know it, with as many people as I can and am always Mindful of the 1,000's of non-members who frequent this forum and read our posts aswell.

...and Avalon is Still one the best forums to use...IMHO

I have never been into that 'He said/She said crap...

So Good Luck & Best Wishes to 'All' those that have chosen to leave Avalon and for those that choose to stay.

Remain 'Centred' and 'Focussed' on Why? you decided to join Avalon to start with...

I miss em too.
Zooknugget was one of the first to pm me when I got here. Seikou-Kishi was the first and Modwiz was the third.
Good people are at a premium these days.
It may be a good thing that some people stay and some go elsewhere.
We can work more effectively if we are not divided/distracted.
Maybe.

[Dennis Jonathan]

I live by a few simple rules:


Never be afraid to seek truth, and question.

Soften your heart to the situations of others.

In conflict:

If possible, mediate with a pure heart.

If not, keep clear of the drama.


I posted here because I respect your bold and well articulated approach to asking questions Blake.

To be honest, this is the first I've heard about many of these departures.

I just don't find the drama interesting at all.

[Hughe]

Members who leave Avalon can always see threads. That's a good thing of Avalon. There are four to five times more guests than members any given time. I think they can rejoin whenever they want. Am I right? If not, this is a big problem IMHO. Avalon should welcome back previous members without prejudice when they like to rejoin.

If I had 100 hours per day, I would like to develop friendship with other members down the path.
It unlikely happens. Like Carmody said public forums on the net is spiritual battle ground.
Avalon might be one of the front lines at the battle.

Some can't take and got to leave for their best intent. Some will remain actively. New members come in.

I come here once or twice a day, check new info and recharge my energy cause I hardly see any individuals that I can interact with good intention and common ground.

Hope I will be able to provide practical knowledge that really help other members one day.

Best Wishes

PS: Trolls and skeptics always ask for the proof and authenticity of the information. In free society, there is no authority that forces the truth. Instead, it exists as it is. It's up to one's choice whether disregard information or take it as truth and have benefit from it. How much truth are on the textbook nowadays? 20% is okay? I even doubt it.

[Fred259]

I think we've all had our moments of doubt, disagreements and questioned whether or not we should move on.

I have been a Loyal Avalonian for just over 1 year...Hopefully this is my 1st and only forum I will be participating in...

I too have had a peek at other forums to see what other platforms are available to share our knowledge and the TRUTH as we know it...

I do miss the Knowledge & Wisdom we used to get from long-time members like...

Zook http://nexus.2012info.ca/forum/image.php?u=6&dateline=1304215003 & Fredkc http://nexus.2012info.ca/forum/image.php?u=2&dateline=1301684758

Both Zook & Fredkc were quick to pull you into line and made you question and challenge your shared information with commonsense and maturity without judgement or mallice. It was sad to see them go...

In the end my Mission is to Share as much of the TRUTH as I know it, with as many people as I can and am always Mindful of the 1,000's of non-members who frequent this forum and read our posts aswell.

...and Avalon is Still one the best forums to use...IMHO

I have never been into that 'He said/She said crap...

So Good Luck & Best Wishes to 'All' those that have chosen to leave Avalon and for those that choose to stay.

Remain 'Centred' and 'Focussed' on Why? you decided to join Avalon to start with...

Wow, now we are talking....

I always referred to Zook as the Zookaroid I bet he had an IQ of 350+++ or whatever, but Zook being a true gent and modest by nature would always play it down.

F KC, reminds me of James Last. Now Ive really insulted him! Fred was equally sharp, short on words that would linger in your mind for the next 90 minutes… clever..

Thanks Jacko for sharing…

[starsmoonmtns]

I'm sure there have been more than those two? But what do I know? Or any of us for that matter............?

[edina]

There are a lot more that have left or are on vacation, I went to PM some of my friends and was surprised to discover a half a dozen are gone. I was stunned, and these are good people, they were not uncivil, troll-like, or aggressive.

Some of my friends may ask me why I stay, it's because I love the child, not Avalon, but the new humanity that is being birthed right before our eyes,

Also, someone asked what will happen if all the PeaceMakers leave, I've given that question some thought.

[Snowbird]

At this point in time, those joining and those unjoining should not cause concern. Division and reconnection should really be applauded. We're going to be seeing this and experiencing this more and more into the future.

Most of the PA posters who have left are now all over on Nexus. There is a soul reason for this. Its happening everywhere. There is absolutely no judgment in this statement, but most of those now on Nexus, I have never really soul-connected with them. There is fabulous intellect over there, as well as here on PA. But there is a division taking place that transcends description. It is not a negative by any means. It is merely a regrouping of souls.

[edina]

Snowbird, I like how you said "There is a soul reason for this." I find I agree with this.
The connections are not lost, they just look like it at the surface.

The hope was that the connections would not become severed. When I look in at the energetic affect, I saw where the connection threads of the four forums where dark, and now they are bright with a warm golden light. I feel good, that a body can grow without becoming fragmented.

[Tane Mahuta]

Another member gone? Who did we lose?

Avalon would not be a community if we did not care about the loss of any one of our members.

Icecold

and now GAIA too


the sadness is crippling.

Project Avalon & Camelot have never lost any family members. They go out to the wild, re-spawn, then they come back with a new perspective, enriching us all!:high5:

nuff said

[Carmody]

At this point in time, those joining and those unjoining should not cause concern. Division and reconnection should really be applauded. We're going to be seeing this and experiencing this more and more into the future.

Most of the PA posters who have left are now all over on Nexus. There is a soul reason for this. Its happening everywhere. There is absolutely no judgment in this statement, but most of those now on Nexus, I have never really soul-connected with them. There is fabulous intellect over there, as well as here on PA. But there is a division taking place that transcends description. It is not a negative by any means. It is merely a regrouping of souls.

Yes, there is a different vibe over there. It can be a rowdier bar at times. I like differences, so I'm open to both flavors, and even some others.

[loveandgratitude]

Avalon at the moment is like breathing in clean freah air after a rain storm. Full of ions.

I PERSONALLY LOVE THE NICE PEACE AND HUMOUR THAT HAS DESCENDED UPON AVALON AT THIS MOMENT.

Gives one time to think and reflect, change perspective , get new insights without having to battle every word.

JUST LOVING IT. :peace:

[Chicodoodoo]

Hopefully, it’s still considered a good thing to share different perspectives here on Avalon. If this is not allowed, I ask that the moderators point out my transgressions publicly so that I and others may learn from my mistakes. That being said, here is a dissenting opinion, just for balance.


At this point in time, those joining and those unjoining should not cause concern. Division and reconnection should really be applauded. We're going to be seeing this and experiencing this more and more into the future.

Divide and conquer is the successful strategy used by the controllers to keep the masses from uniting and organizing. To say this is no cause for concern is incorrect, in my opinion. The "unjoining" you mention, a type of division, was often forced. Is that cause for concern?


Most of the PA posters who have left are now all over on Nexus. There is a soul reason for this. Its happening everywhere. There is absolutely no judgment in this statement, but most of those now on Nexus, I have never really soul-connected with them.

Human beings have a tendency to rationalize their beliefs. Having never "soul-connected" with the ex-members appears to be such a rationalization. Shouldn't the fact that you didn't "soul-connect" with them be a cause for concern? The flaw may lie at your end.


There is fabulous intellect over there, as well as here on PA. But there is a division taking place that transcends description. It is not a negative by any means. It is merely a regrouping of souls.

[ Mod-edit: I removed the last paragraph of Chicodoodoo's response. It impugned the motives of not one, but three Avalonians, with some colorful examples to boot. Yes, I see Chicodoodoo's request above that such examples be discussed openly. No -- such will be deleted from this forum. Chicodoodoo is enjoying a one week vacation from this good forum. - Paul. ]

[loveandgratitude]

HI Chicodoodoo....................sometimes especially in such turbulent times of discord, disunity, disasters, disconnection with the planet, people (using the word dis - meaning against) sometimes, just sometimes peace and harmony is needed to rest the spirit so we do not get exhausted by all the turmoil. This does not mean that peace is a permanent state of being, just a state of flux. I enjoy a repreive,
a quiet moment to rest and reflect. I am sure you also like these quite moments also.

What I am enjoying at the moment is the rainbow after the storm. I hope you are enjoying a little peace in your life as well. Treasure these moments because they come and they go just as quickly.

Shared perspective is what turns the world around, as long as we can do this in a respectful way. When one has to attack a person character and openly launching an all out war on the person just for opinions, then we are no better than TBTB attacks on cultures, religions etc. I value your opinions and welcome them. As long as we can discuss them in the spirit of education and learning and sharing. Looking forward to your positive interactions in the future.

[Snowbird]

Hopefully, it’s still considered a good thing to share different perspectives here on Avalon. If this is not allowed, I ask that the moderators point out my transgressions publicly so that I and others may learn from my mistakes. That being said, here is a dissenting opinion, just for balance.


At this point in time, those joining and those unjoining should not cause concern. Division and reconnection should really be applauded. We're going to be seeing this and experiencing this more and more into the future.

Divide and conquer is the successful strategy used by the controllers to keep the masses from uniting and organizing. To say this is no cause for concern is incorrect, in my opinion. The "unjoining" you mention, a type of division, was often forced. Is that cause for concern?


Most of the PA posters who have left are now all over on Nexus. There is a soul reason for this. Its happening everywhere. There is absolutely no judgment in this statement, but most of those now on Nexus, I have never really soul-connected with them.

Human beings have a tendency to rationalize their beliefs. Having never "soul-connected" with the ex-members appears to be such a rationalization. Shouldn't the fact that you didn't "soul-connect" with them be a cause for concern? The flaw may lie at your end.

Chicodoodoo, I will post this response now in anticipation of your return.

You appear to be ramping up for some sort of confrontation and the only confrontation that I will offer you are my thoughts on this subject. You have mentioned rationalization and cause for concern and flaws. This is head and mind talk, not heart and soul talk. From what you responded, I assume you think that I think that I am better-than-them. I don't. Different? Yes. Better-than? No. We all started in the PA sandbox and are expanding out to the neighbor's sandbox and will one day all group together again on the big beach, after we have all/each learned what is necessary for us to not only be together in peace, but become one in peace and in loving relationship. This is what everyone is working on right now. It is necessary for us to be with others who have similar soul-characteristics while we become strengthened so that one day we can branch out and successfully rejoin. It is obvious that we cannot flow together right now. There is no judgment. This is merely spiritual soul fact.

I posted this affirmation on the Forgiveness thread, but I think that it is also very applicable here.

I deeply and truly love and approve of myself.
I trust in love.
I open my heart to love.
I follow the path of the heart.
I forgive those who need forgiving for not being what I wanted them to be.

[Karma Ninja]

Without meaning to offend anyone, this thread comes across as a little self serving...it's almost like trying to rally the troops before they march off into the wilderness. The only thing missing is declaring "WHO'S COMING WITH ME?".

If we leave than we were never meant to be here in the first place. I was a member of the original Avalon and stopped posting as well. I am back now and it is because the vibe and mood of the forum has changed.

The differing opinions and ideas are what is great about this site and I should also say, I don't want to see anyone leave. At the same time, if we have to 'pick up our ball and go home' than perhaps we are so set in our beliefs that we never really embraced the intention of this site either. "If we don't believe in freedom of expression from those whose opinions we despise, than we don't believe in freedom of expression at all" - (A loose quote from Noam Chomsky) In a confusing world, like the one we find ourselves in, we must never set our beliefs to the point where we are sure we are correct. The more I learn, the more I realize I know nothing. I think we are all old enough to make our own decisions. If the loss of someone on this forum is so devastating than perhaps that person has something to decide too.

With members coming and going, people quitting and being asked to leave...there is a constant flux and change that will never stop. This is the way of Avalon. If those who leave feel the need...they may come back. Those who have been asked to leave may never come back. We own and live by our actions.

Peace!

[Mad Hatter]

Trolls and skeptics always ask for the proof and authenticity of the information.

I do hope that all here continue to make the distinction between the two since I have no desire to live on planet 'Groupthink' for lack of sceptical input.

[DeDukshyn]

On the topic of banned members ...

Why are the same questions on the topic being asked over and over and over again when the answer will never change? What's the definition of insanity? (doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result).

Why are some of us continually claiming that members are being banned for reasons they are not? No one was banned for speaking their mind - ever. That didn't happen! People were banned for breaking their agreement they made to honour the rules of Avalon. Full stop. Just because some of that coincided with some individuals "speaking their mind" - does not make that the reason for them getting banned! Who even tries to use such obviously flawed logic?!

I learned in this course I took about something they called a "distinction". A distinction is the seperation of two or more constructs that have become fused together, because in that event you get a distorted definition, meaning, or view of the situation; make the distinction and all becomes very clear. A very simple example would be the fact that the meanings for the words "important" and "urgent" often get fused together and one might say that urgent and important mean the same thing -- they do not. "Urgent" has a time implication and "important" does not. Urgent may or may not be important - but needs to be addressed with a time consideration, and important may or may not be urgent at all - it just indicates that it will need to be addressed at some point; quite different definitions really - a distinction that I feel is important for clear communication (there are thousands of others).

Now back to the topic of the lack of distinction being recognized in the reasoning behind why members get banned ... There needs to be a distinction made between "speaking you mind" and "breaking the rules of the forum" -- While speaking your mind isn't necessarily breaking the rules, chances are that while you are breaking the rules you were speaking your mind. But does that mean that speaking your mind will get you banned? I think by now it should be clear to all that that is a dumb question. However, if you are the type of person that can't keep these distinctions clear in your mind, then it may be easy to think that one thing means the other. This means this and this means that and that means this so that must mean that .. ad infinitum -- a major part of what cause the "human condition", and it is a fallacy. In reality nothing means anything else -- things are what they are -- and there are no "reasons" -- we create these constructs so we can justify our "feelings"(emotions) and our actions that get based on those "feelings", because there is no proper logic or reasoning in using those "feelings" in decision making processes becausse they are controlled by the ego anyway.

This is why these "distinctions" are important to watch out for, they can make clarity of a muddied situation whether internal with yourself or external in communication with others. I can clearly see that a few members trying to make "speaking your mind" and "getting banned" have the same or a connected meaning. But it should be obvious to even them now that there is no connection - stop trying to make one!

Every post I make I "speak my mind" and I have no fear of being banned because I know I am a good enough communicator that I can get accross absolutely anything on my mind without breaking the rules. But if I didn't have confidence I could do this, then yes, perhaps I might expect myself to be potentially be banned for merely "speaking my mind"

This topic is over IMHO and any one who keeps beating the "don't speak your mind" drum had better realize what they are exposing about themselves and their ability to reason.

[Amer]

I am sorry to see Chicodoodoo banned from the forum for one week. His posts make me think, well thought out, seeking out both the intellectual and spirit parts of us and trying to push their boundaries. You may agree or disagree with him but I love the challenge in many of his words.

To be honest I have never found him offensive to other members, simply a voice that seeks to engage in meaningful debate and as I see it- meaningful debate is not always polished and shiny but it will step on your toes and sometimes hurt. Ouch.

Paul you have banned him for the week due to the fact that he impugned the motives of three members.


I removed the last paragraph of Chicodoodoo's response. It impugned the motives of not one, but three Avalonians, with some colorful examples to boot. Yes, I see Chicodoodoo's request above that such examples be discussed openly. No -- such will be deleted from this forum. Chicodoodoo is enjoying a one week vacation from this good forum. - Paul.


If you take from the Oxford dictionary the meaning of to impugn it is “to dispute the truth, validity, or honesty of (a statement or motive); call into question”

Ok well this is part of the business of Avalon no? It is surely not an offence and it is an inevitable step in much discourse that seeks to get at truth. If we are going to give weekly bans to members for calling into question statements ( which is what Chicodoodoo’s original uncensored post did but with no offence, merely challenging some members on what they had written and who no doubt would have been well able to respond and hence open for us an interesting and important debate )- well then a very large group of Avalonians get your bags packed!

If on the other hand we take Cambridge’s meaning of to impugn ( forgive me everyone the pedantics- I’m a teacher and words mean the world to me and it is the means in which we are moving our thoughts around here and so it’s important to be clear) it is “to cause people to doubt someone's character, qualities or reputation by criticizing them.”

Well I warrant this is a bit more serious because it focuses its definition on the attacking of the character, yet I believe that Chicodoodoo did not do this in his post, he challenged a way of thinking and did not attack the person. He was simply forthright in his post.

However I am led to a quandary because in the thread on Chemtrails started by Ktlight, grannyfranny100posted the following directed at Fred259





Fred

What kind of credentials do you personally have? You sure are convinced by more government rubbish that excludes existing chemtrails, the photos and the technical analysis of the garbage that they are spraying from planes that you claim can not be done. How convenient. Personally I have heard that TPTB now have "trolls" writing on forums. Is the pay good?



Fran

So she overtly accuses Fred259 of being a forum troll and not only this but also of being directly paid to do so by none other than “the powers that be”. Heavy stuff indeed. To me this is impugning the character of an individual without proof of the fact.

Paul can you explain to us why you banned Chicodoodoo for impugning the motives of certain members’ statements yet you pushed your “Thanks” button to thank Frannygranny100 when she so very obviously impugned the character of another member? I always love to know the “why” of things and perhaps I am mistaken but for me there seems to be a clear “why” here- no?

[ThePythonicCow]

Ok well this is part of the business of Avalon no? Itis surely not an offence and it is an inevitable step in much discourse that seeks to get at truth.
What I removed was a rather colorful, mean spirited, and unjustified attack on three members.

It was not "simply" a respectful discussion of the truth or falsity of some assertions.

It will remain removed from public view.


He was simply forthright in his post.
In what remains in view, perhaps so. (That's why it's still in view.)

You are in no position to make claims about the part I removed, for that you cannot see.

He was not being "simply forthright" in the part I removed.

These things are seldom black and white, and can almost always be represented in some other light by someone intending to make the best case they can for some other analysis. This particular case was more clear cut than many I've seen. We don't hold open court with public evidence on this forum (nor do most forums, so far as I know.) We do the best we can, to make this a healthy forum for presenting a wide diversity of controversial subjects from a variety of perspectives. Sometimes that means removing posted content. Sometimes that means sending members on "vacations" or banning them outright.

I realize that some, likely including yourself, do not like the "removing posts and vacationing or banning posters" part of what I said.

As you may recall, I have used the analogy of raising children before.

Actually, that's no such a good analogy.

Let me try this analogy instead.

Imagine you have been asked to referee a football game (soccer, American football or rugby - doesn't matter.) Unlike most such games where all the players on the field will have similar size, strength and experience, imagine that you have everything from 50 kilo grandmothers out for a little exercise, to world class 100 kilo football players in their prime. If the big guys go flat out, then some grandmother is going to end up in the intensive care unit of the local hospital.

So you provide some assist to the "light weights", and you moderate down the physical violence of the "heavy weights." You don't stop the game and hold court on each flag you throw. Like any good referee, you do your best not to become too big a distraction from the game itself.

We have such a variety of participants here. Some are naturally timid souls who have never participated in a web forum before. Some are quite experienced with forums and quite able and willing to make their points and advance their views.

Fortunately, this is a web forum, not a football scrum. So our physical bodies are in little danger.

However we do discuss some material here that most of our members find quite important to their lives and the future of life as we know it.

[Ilie Pandia]

I agree with Paul on his post.

The moderation team has sometimes a different point of view from what Avalon members have, because we have different tools at our disposal and we can see posts that have been removed from public view (for example) and we have to take that into consideration when we make our decisions. We also cannot realistically read all the forum all the time and some posts we do miss.

But we do our best, as a team, to keep this a good forum, an informative one, where even guests can get informed without having to dig trough personally attack and unnecessary arguing... I am actually convinced that most of you would take the same decisions if you were in our place...

[Darla Ken Pearce]

As the solar winds blow Adamantine Particles our way, everything that needs to be let loose in order to let in more love within our own bodies, minds, and spirits, is AMPLIFIED and these winds are blowing over all of us at this moment in time and well into the future and coming days.

The new consciousness that is rising in us ~ whether we like it or not, protest it or not, accept it or not ~ flow freely, and some on Avalon post pictures of the solar flares coming our way from the Sun with these winds of great change that are upon us now. We might all want to watch.

Even though I thought I had dealt with many issues, for instance, with my family. The recent death of my beloved Father served to highlight it to me on a very personal level. All the old things, grievences, hurtful things, we've been carrying around for ~ in some instances ~ for decades ~ are a thing of the past. They come forward up and out of us and directly into our conscious field as never experienced before. It's harsh and at times, painful, they can cause new anger long displaced ~ now ~ finding outlets ~ never experienced prior to these times.

Know that no one is immune. We all hold these old negative thoughts and patterns that are to be let loose or they very well could harm or kill us. This is what we've been witnessing here more than any other factor. How you view these things is part of your own baggage. I assure you as they were mine. We will all be experiencing them, so be prepared with understanding and love for yourself and then go outward to others.

On behalf of our great moderators on Project Avalon, Bill, and many others kind enough to share their space with us, thank you for the light hand you have upon these boards. Not acceptable, however, are these continuing personal attacks by those mostly gone now of their own choice.

It was their choice to choose not to be kind or decent in regards to the sharing of ideas and even though warned, could not manage to make the necessary family adjustments in good taste. It can happen to anyone including me. This is not some battlefield where winners take all and neither is it a place where the feelings of others can be totally neglected held to some invisible, harmful, standard that is not in the great and abiding spirit of Avalon.

Please stop this mincing and chewing up of something nasty to eat over and over again and keep throwing up all over the place. It's not productive to anyone much less ourselves. It is beneath us to bicker and have a contentious spirit.

There are plenty of places, sites, on the internet and other places for brawls and unkindness. This is what we are here to find ~ a better kinder way to treat others and be treated ourselves. No one here is your enemy, we are family, and the only true requirement is to be kind and honor each other in large and small ways. And in this manner, we create what we so desire to create, peace within this world ~ and not in some future day but right now, this moment.

Much love! Goodbye to those leaving, and hello to those new ones replacing them. I assure you ~ we will all meet again under the banner of a New Golden Age without regrets. Again, thanks to Bill and Paul and other moderators for holding all of us to a new code of ethics long missing in our current world outside of Avalon. Let no one breech these loving shores with contention. And so it is... xoxoxoxo

[aranuk]

Well said Darla

Stan

[starsmoonmtns]

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/images/icons/icon1.png Another member gone. (from blake)



Without meaning to offend anyone, this thread comes across as a little self serving...it's almost like trying to rally the troops before they march off into the wilderness. The only thing missing is declaring "WHO'S COMING WITH ME?".

I find the tread to be very honest. Not self serving at all. There are lots of choices in life.... this was theirs...
Really, the thread itself was self serving. And very honorable.
Shows something inside of you that maybe you weren't thinking clearly about.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

As did he.

[Jeffrey]

"Do you want to change the world? How about beginning with yourself? How about being transformed yourself first? But how do you achieve that? Through observation. Through understanding. With no interference or judgment on your part. Because what you judge you cannot understand." -Anthony de Mello

This has been, for me, a place to dig and uncover certain truths. These truths have been hidden from us by forces outside of ourselves as well as truths that we have buried within ourselves. The relationships and dynamics of exchange here should be used to better ourselves (intrinsically speaking). Everyone is a student—we are all our own masters. There is Ultimate Truth, and this Truth is made up of everyone's individual truths. Something that may hold true for me, may not hold true for my fellow.

Truth is fluid though. Change is growth. The opinions exchanged here should be used as grind stones for the sword of knowledge each of us carry. We should not be using this privileged weapon against each other, but to slice through the ignorance within ourselves. It is not my job to convert another to my viewpoint if they do not agree with my opinions. I'd prefer not to busy myself trying to pick splinters out of anothers' eye when I myself cannot see clearly. I only have power over myself, and I choose change. Righteous change. Remembering what Edgar Cayce said, we grow to heaven. To remain stubborn in my perspective, out of fear, is to dull my Spirit. Water that stays in the same puddle for too long becomes stagnant. Nobody cares to drink from a diseased pool because it leads to sickness and death. If I remain in the river of ever-flowing knowledge I will encounter twists and turns, torrents and tranquility, waterfalls, and a mix of obstacles, but eventually I will get to the ocean. I can see why a member would be banned for spreading stagnancy amongst the community. At the same time though, it is our choice as individuals whether or not to take part in that reality. To ban a member is to deny an aspect of reality, which is counter productive to spreading the truth and light far and wide.

Harm cannot be done when nothing is there to meet the tip of it's blow. One can lead a horse to water, but the horse cannot be forced to drink.

If it becomes obvious that a member is posting again and again with the intention of spreading dissension or smearing another member, then maybe that member should have limited posting until their motives are cleared up with the administrators. We are here to help each other help ourselves. As long as we remember that then we will be fine.

It is important to note that roses bloom among thorns, but weeds will suffocate a garden if they are not uprooted meticulously and regularly. I trust that Bill and the administrators of this community will use right discernment to tend to this garden and allow it to grow to it's beautiful potential.

Much Love and Thanks to you all,

Vivek

[DoubleHelix]

Vivek, what a fantastic post.. so wise and so very true.

[Mad Hatter]

Mad Hatter dons the devil's advocate hat...

Hi Paul

I don't particularly wish to run the risk of 'earning' a holiday but I do feel the need to take you to task over some of this...


What I removed was a rather colorful, mean spirited, and unjustified attack on three members.

It was not "simply" a respectful discussion of the truth or falsity of some assertions.

Could it be that under the, what I imagine to be, enourmous workload you and the team are under, that your assesment was unfortunately, merely based on a cursory look at what was being said?


It will remain removed from public view.

Perhaps a caveat is missing here ie 'on this forum'


You are in no position to make claims about the part I removed, for that you cannot see.

I'm no sherlock holmes but it did not take long to figure out where it might turn up and my first guess was correct.

Herein lies the crux of the matter, if you did not anticipate such then that is unfortunate because the upshot of that is it makes your statement above come across as a little arrogant and I am sure that was not your intent.


He was not being "simply forthright" in the part I removed.

In point of actual fact, unfortunately or otherwise, since the information 'is' in the public domain we are in a position to assess judgement calls made by all parties involved and draw our own conclusions. For me in this case, I read the reference to previous posts as nothing more than examples to back up the case he was attempting to put across...


These things are seldom black and white, and can almost always be represented in some other light by someone intending to make the best case they can for some other analysis.

Obviously I'm guilty of currently attempting to do just that, but what I'd like to ask you is would it not have been possible in this case to have removed only one sentence in that final paragraph ie names/post numbers thus fullfilling the requirements of your mod duties to protect gentlers souls BUT would have left the punchline of that post intact?

Or am I missing the point and it was actually the references to the potential use of Orwellian newspeak that crossed the line? If so this would be an enormous pity because I would have been denied the opportunity to examine a take on things I had not in fact considered up to that point.


I realize that some, likely including yourself, do not like the "removing posts and vacationing or banning posters" part of what I said.

Vacation / Ban by all means but it is the removal of posts that I feel is a slippery slope unless specifically requested by the poster.

Otherwise where is the opportunity to learn from others mistakes? From my reading of his posts I am pretty sure this is also the position Chicodoodoo takes.

Where is the opportunity to build trust in any of the judgement calls the mod team may be called upon to make?

More importantly, where is the ability to assess what has gone wrong so as to be in a position to offer assistance if it is within our power to do so?


As you may recall, I have used the analogy of raising children before.

Understandably so...


Actually, that's no such a good analogy.

and understandably so...


. Like any good referee, you do your best not to become too big a distraction from the game itself.

With that in mind is it really your job to protect me if as an adult, I as a flyweight, deliberately make the choice to get in the ring with Jabba the Hut??

Perhaps Avalon could provide a members only, non public venue, for say clowns like me to try out in a David vs Goliath type contest with thumbs up thumbs down from those munching popcorn on the sidelines to indicate exactly how stupid or irrelevant I'm being, thus preserving the atmosphere in the rest of the neighbourhood. With only those who don't mind that level of robustness giving feeback from which willing participants could learn.

Anyway, once again let me reiterate the fact that you and the team are doing a fantastic job and I hope that you will take on board what I have, probably inadequately, tried to express here in the spirit with which it is intended.

cheers

[ace]

Hi Mad Hatter....

I here Chile is nice this time of year!!

Regards
Ace

[toothpick]

Hello everyone.
Not to sure what to say about another member leaving Avalon.
Haven,t been here all that long, so, I did not get much of a chance to know these leaving members.
Except for reading thier posts along with everyone elses, which I might add were all excellant, above average, very good.
I had to dig out my big old Oxford dictionary and my theasraus just to keep up with you Avalonians.
I was so intimidated by your threads and posts that it took me a month to get up the courage to post a few words, what fun.
As for anyone leaving Avalon I havent been here long enough to form an opinon on that.
Might I say though how very happy I am to have found this incredible community.
Dare I add that I think Avalon has changed my life in a couple of ways.
Mostly it gives you a place to talk with like minded people.
I can,t imagine why anyone would want to leave Avalon, I just finally found it.
Although, I can understand being disgruntled, there is always two sides to every story.

toothpick

[Mad Hatter]

Hi Toothpick


there is always two sides to every story.

I usually discover three sides to any story - yours, mine and the truth. ;)

cheers

[DeDukshyn]

People come and people go in all our walks of life -- this will never change and reasons always myriad -- but what can change is the need for finger pointing whenever it happens. Let's spend our energies appreciating what they brought whether we agreed or not.

[toothpick]

Hello Mad Hatter
I concede, you are absolutely correct sir.

toothpick

[Amer]

we do discuss some material here that most of our members find quite important to their lives and the future of life as we know it.
On this Paul we can most surely agree and it is not my intention to become your sparring partner :fencing:on decisions made! You are the administrator and I a member. Nor is it my intention within the forum to be a thorn or to cause stagnancy- using Vivek's imagery.


I hope that you will take on board what I have, probably inadequately, tried to express here in the spirit with which it is intended.


Mad Hatter has expressed himself eloquently enough also for what I would have liked to have said so I shall not waste anymore cyber space paper, though I would have appreciated a clarification regarding the final point I brought up in my post which I believed to have been important. It is not to be then.

[andywight]

However I am led to a quandary because in the thread on Chemtrails started by Ktlight, grannyfranny100posted the following directed at Fred259





Fred

What kind of credentials do you personally have? You sure are convinced by more government rubbish that excludes existing chemtrails, the photos and the technical analysis of the garbage that they are spraying from planes that you claim can not be done. How convenient. Personally I have heard that TPTB now have "trolls" writing on forums. Is the pay good?



Fran

So she overtly accuses Fred259 of being a forum troll and not only this but also of being directly paid to do so by none other than “the powers that be”. Heavy stuff indeed. To me this is impugning the character of an individual without proof of the fact.

Paul can you explain to us why you banned Chicodoodoo for impugning the motives of certain members’ statements yet you pushed your “Thanks” button to thank Frannygranny100 when she so very obviously impugned the character of another member? I always love to know the “why” of things and perhaps I am mistaken but for me there seems to be a clear “why” here- no?

Hi Paul,

I'd like to know the why to.

[Seeker]

Frankly, I am tired of people announcing they are leaving. Just go. Why do you need to make a post about it? If you came here to debate, then don't leave and debate. I don't mean to be harsh but I don't understand why everyone that leaves has to make a big melodramatic announcement? What makes them think they are so important that they have to do that? For every one that leaves, another joins. I think the new blood is good. The gene pool is much healthier now. Not that the people that left were bad people. In fact, they were some fine people in my opinion, as much as you can judge someone through a forum. "Avalon is a different place now," is what is said a lot. Embrace the change. You can go somewhere else but you will never experience what Avalon was again.
American public schools have wounded you because you say permanence isn't a strong point here. Why do you want permanence? There is no such thing as permanence. Your cravings for something solid are fed and encouraged in American public schools but there are other things on the menu if you look. There is nothing solid in this world. Everything is moving. I learned that in American public schools!
A strong community can withstand people leaving but a community where everyone is happy all the time and agrees is not strong. Avalon is doing just fine. This is Bill's vision and I don't agree with all of his decisions but I respect the fact that this is his vision and he is guiding it in the direction he wants to go. It is fine to leave to manifest your own vision but if your vision is just to talk about how bad your old forum was, maybe your aren't as visionary as you thought you were.
Again, I apologize for being harsh but I am sick of people making announcements that they are leaving. Anyone else leaving, please, just go. Instead of being a place to learn and debate about things, we are becoming a soap opera with all of these stories about who said what behind the scenes and what is happening at other forums. I go to other forums and all of the old Avalon people just talk about how bad Avalon is. They don't talk about anything new. Move on. This soap opera stuff is pointless and very boring. Don't waste our time. I am an idiot for wasting this much time writing this!

[Moonwish]

Frankly, I am tired of people announcing they are leaving. Just go. Why do you need to make a post about it? If you came here to debate, then don't leave and debate. I don't mean to be harsh but I don't understand why everyone that leaves has to make a big melodramatic announcement? What makes them think they are so important that they have to do that? For every one that leaves, another joins. I think the new blood is good. The gene pool is much healthier now. Not that the people that left were bad people. In fact, they were some fine people in my opinion, as much as you can judge someone through a forum. "Avalon is a different place now," is what is said a lot. Embrace the change. You can go somewhere else but you will never experience what Avalon was again.
American public schools have wounded you because you say permanence isn't a strong point here. Why do you want permanence? There is no such thing as permanence. Your cravings for something solid are fed and encouraged in American public schools but there are other things on the menu if you look. There is nothing solid in this world. Everything is moving. I learned that in American public schools!
A strong community can withstand people leaving but a community where everyone is happy all the time and agrees is not strong. Avalon is doing just fine. This is Bill's vision and I don't agree with all of his decisions but I respect the fact that this is his vision and he is guiding it in the direction he wants to go. It is fine to leave to manifest your own vision but if your vision is just to talk about how bad your old forum was, maybe your aren't as visionary as you thought you were.
Again, I apologize for being harsh but I am sick of people making announcements that they are leaving. Anyone else leaving, please, just go. Instead of being a place to learn and debate about things, we are becoming a soap opera with all of these stories about who said what behind the scenes and what is happening at other forums. I go to other forums and all of the old Avalon people just talk about how bad Avalon is. They don't talk about anything new. Move on. This soap opera stuff is pointless and very boring. Don't waste our time. I am an idiot for wasting this much time writing this!


I appreciate Seeker's idea that if you want to go, just go. I also understand Civil Disobedience. Isn't there room for both? If a person has no "case" that's pretty obvious, isn't it?

We really need to get past the BS and to the crux of the matter. I don't really think we have all the time in the world here. We better get off the road before we get hit. That's not so hard, is it?

I also enjoyed Seeker's idea of public school menus and their fixed offerings. I still miss honeybutter on real yeast rolls and that nasty ground steak with packaged gravy. Sorry but it's true.
This community must survive and thrive. That needs to happen and we have to make it so. (number one, for Star Trek Next Gen fans)

This vehicle is part of the transformation. Many of you see the big picture, and we have to keep that in mind. Park egos at the door, and bring yourselves in. Quite simple.

[loveandgratitude]

When its time to go, its time to go.... going....gone


7347

[Lettherebelight]

Frankly, I am tired of people announcing they are leaving. Just go. Why do you need to make a post about it? If you came here to debate, then don't leave and debate. I don't mean to be harsh but I don't understand why everyone that leaves has to make a big melodramatic announcement? What makes them think they are so important that they have to do that? For every one that leaves, another joins. I think the new blood is good. The gene pool is much healthier now. Not that the people that left were bad people. In fact, they were some fine people in my opinion, as much as you can judge someone through a forum. "Avalon is a different place now," is what is said a lot. Embrace the
change. You can go somewhere else but you will never experience what Avalon was again.
American public schools have wounded you because you say permanence isn't a strong point here. Why do you want permanence? There is no such thing as permanence. Your cravings for something solid are fed and encouraged in American public schools but there are other things on the menu if you look. There is nothing solid in this world. Everything is moving. I learned that in American public schools!
A strong community can withstand people leaving but a community where everyone is happy all the time and agrees is not
strong. Avalon is doing just fine. This is Bill's vision and I don't agree with all of
his decisions but I respect the fact that this is his vision and he is guiding it in the direction he wants to go. It is fine to leave to manifest your own vision but if your vision is just to talk about how bad your old forum was, maybe your aren't as
visionary as you thought you were.
Again, I apologize for being harsh but I am sick of people making announcements that they are leaving. Anyone else leaving, please, just go. Instead of being a place to learn and debate about things, we are becoming a soap opera with all
of these stories about who said what behind the scenes and what is happening at other forums. I go to other forums and all of the old Avalon people just talk about how bad Avalon is. They don't talk about anything new. Move on. This soap opera
stuff is pointless and very boring. Don't waste our time. I am an idiot for wasting this much time writing this!

No one is wasting your time but yourself, Seeker. I had some good advice not too long ago from one of our good mods. If a certain thread bothers you, just focus on something elsewhere. It's not always easy, especially when something bugs you about the thread, it definitely requires controlling the mind, but it's a good excersize in tolerance.

To explain this thread, just briefly, many longstanding members have left since the Charles material was introduced. Avalon members are not like a lot of other people
you might meet....indeed, everyone is screened a little to join in the first place. These unusual people have invested a lot of time, sharing their knowledge through posts. We all appreciate the time and thought that goes into composing a post, especially if one has other work/personal commitments.

Ah, that word...personal. The problems we see in the world around us, are largely due to impersonalism. Throw away relationships...crack open another
box of employees...don't worry there's plenty more where they came from...all are attitudes which will gradually become a thing of the past as human consciousness
continues to evolve.

Everything is personal, we might just not recognise it. Personally, I am sorry that anyone feels they have to leave Avalon, I still think it's a great place for people to
meet and exchange info.

I value all the personal opinions expressed here, and that includes yours also, Seeker, and likewise I thank everyone for tolerating mine. :)

[Ross]

Again, I apologize for being harsh but I am sick of people making announcements that they are leaving. Anyone else leaving, please, just go. Instead of being a place to learn and debate about things, we are becoming a soap opera with all of these stories about who said what behind the scenes and what is happening at other forums. I go to other forums and all of the old Avalon people just talk about how bad Avalon is. They don't talk about anything new. Move on. This soap opera stuff is pointless and very boring. Don't waste our time. I am an idiot for wasting this much time writing this!

Firstly, anyone can make a departing announcement...thats their choice to do so, your choice to read the announcment and feel "sick"..."other forums" as you state do not "just" talk about Avalon and nothing new...thats complete bollocks. There are threads (minority) on other forums that question Avalon but certainly only a minority.

Statements as quoted above, are far from the truth and IMO a rather narrow view point of which needs to be corrected...IMHO.

Regards

Ross

[Flash]

I did subscribe to Avalon because I had been reading the threads for about 2 years prior. I got in may be one week prior to Charles happenings. The forum was substantially different then because the people in it were different overall. I did enjoy the old, this is why I came in.

Since Charles, the new influx, the forum has greatly changed. For the best, the worst, I do not know, all I know is that I still enjoy it but for reasons vastly different from those for which I came in. And to tell you the truth, I think the forum would have benefitted to keep both types of members, new and old. But this did not happen.

Personnally, I don't think this is linked to evolution and vibrations changes where people becoming different split. When one starts to think that way, the path is being traced for traditional thinking - separation instead of tolerance, judgment instead of openess of the heart, incomprehension based on egos, and this, from all sides. Easy to think like PTB no! We have been trained for this kind of thinking, leading to biaises. The other path is quite difficult based on our lack of training.

Most of us are children in the evolution scale. What do we do with children? We tolerate the mistakes, try to show the way, we open the discussion, and we guide the behaviors by having specific behavioral norms. As long as those are respected, anything may be tought or said, it is fine.

I have never seen those norms specifically named and explained in this forum. Therefore mods are left with personal judgment to make their job. It makes it harder for them in fact, and also more subject ot controversy from the members.

I still do not understand why this is not very clearly written for all to refer to. To which adults members could freely subscribe when they come in the forum. Much less forced departures would be necessary and vacations could be explained just by naming the exact point (article) that was infringed upon. So simple.

And Paul, I am here talking of spiritual children, not grown up adults that are compared to children to be raised.

[andywight]

Chicodoodoo just got canned!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvEQmhobLVE&feature=player_embedded

[buckminster fuller]

Removing posts from public scrutiny is I think a really bad mistake. If we are to cultivate trust and communication, this is the wrong way to do things. It would be different if people were using their real names on the forum. As it is not the case, it only resemble a pretty one sided/fascist view of things to unilateraly decide that this or that line should not be seen by others... And thus it is only a mean to control the content of the forum. And as I use to say.. Only truth hurts.

[Lord Sidious]

Removing posts from public scrutiny is I think a really bad mistake. If we are to cultivate trust and communication, this is the wrong way to do things. It would be different if people were using their real names on the forum. As it is not the case, it only resemble a pretty one sided/fascist view of things to unilateraly decide that this or that line should not be seen by others... And thus it is only a mean to control the content of the forum. And as I use to say.. Only truth hurts.

I disagree. Anything libellous or filthy should not be here.
The whole point of moderation is to allow the threads to flow.
That can't happen with all types of stuff staying where it was.
That is how people can disrupt the forum easily.
I am guilty of this myself, without that being a conscious thing.
Derailing a thread for example. The best option is to split it into two.
Retaining focus isn't easy these days with all the energy fluctuations going on.

Like this nuggetry for example.
http://camelotforum.com/index.php?option=com_kunena&func=view&catid=3&id=42468&limit=10&limitstart=10&Itemid=164#42632
How is that helpful?

[blake]

Removing posts from public scrutiny is I think a really bad mistake. If we are to cultivate trust and communication, this is the wrong way to do things. It would be different if people were using their real names on the forum. As it is not the case, it only resemble a pretty one sided/fascist view of things to unilateraly decide that this or that line should not be seen by others... And thus it is only a mean to control the content of the forum. And as I use to say.. Only truth hurts.

I disagree. Anything libellous or filthy should not be here.
The whole point of moderation is to allow the threads to flow.
That can't happen with all types of stuff staying where it was.
That is how people can disrupt the forum easily.
I am guilty of this myself, without that being a conscious thing.
Derailing a thread for example. The best option is to split it into two.
Retaining focus isn't easy these days with all the energy fluctuations going on.



Hello Lord Sidius,

I always believe in watching one's manner's. And I do not particpate in a discussion that escalates into such emotional debasement. However, it is my opinion that it was the nay sayers who derailed Chichdoodoo's thread into an emotional quagmire. Had they not particpated in the thread, that they complained so much about, perhaps Chicodoodoo would still be here; and the thread may have become a well deserved long run of intellectual banter. The point is, was he subconciously, or not, set up in a way? The nay sayers didn't have to respond to him, or even particpate. Why did they?

Remember what it was like for you, Lord Sidius, when people so easily threw stones at what you were saying instead of listening and trying to understand your point?


The book is called "The Resurrection" where I got these quotes from. Maybe or may they don't apply to Avalon?

"Your father made the mistake common to many educated men...... he forgot that people are lazy they need to be lead." page 337

"They have been told to replace thought with faith, a good Christian does not question. A good Christeian accepts what he has been given. It does not matter if he undertsand it." page 337

Just Pondering

Sincerely,
Mr. Davis

[Lord Sidious]

Removing posts from public scrutiny is I think a really bad mistake. If we are to cultivate trust and communication, this is the wrong way to do things. It would be different if people were using their real names on the forum. As it is not the case, it only resemble a pretty one sided/fascist view of things to unilateraly decide that this or that line should not be seen by others... And thus it is only a mean to control the content of the forum. And as I use to say.. Only truth hurts.

I disagree. Anything libellous or filthy should not be here.
The whole point of moderation is to allow the threads to flow.
That can't happen with all types of stuff staying where it was.
That is how people can disrupt the forum easily.
I am guilty of this myself, without that being a conscious thing.
Derailing a thread for example. The best option is to split it into two.
Retaining focus isn't easy these days with all the energy fluctuations going on.



Hello Lord Sidius,

I always believe in watching one's manner's. And I do not particpate in a discussion that escalates into such emotional debasement. However, it is my opinion that it was the nay sayers who derailed Chichdoodoo's thread into an emotional quagmire. Had they not particpated in the thread, that they complained so much about, perhaps Chicodoodoo would still be here; and the thread may have become a well deserved long run of intellectual banter. The point is, was he subconciously, or not, set up in a way? The nay sayers didn't have to respond to him, or even particpate. Why did they?

Remember what it was like for you, Lord Sidius, when people so easily threw stones at what you were saying instead of listening and trying to understand your point?


The book is called "The Resurrection" where I got these quotes from. Maybe or may they don't apply to Avalon?

"Your father made the mistake common to many educated men...... he forgot that people are lazy they need to be lead." page 337

"They have been told to replace thought with faith, a good Christian does not question. A good Christeian accepts what he has been given. It does not matter if he undertsand it." page 337

Just Pondering

Sincerely,
Mr. Davis

I know about you Blake and no, you don't get ''out of order'' and you do keep your manners.
And yes, I know about the risk of people not ''getting'' you as you point out, I have a thread about that.
That is part of why I feel sad to see the Chiconugget leave.

[buckminster fuller]

Removing posts from public scrutiny is I think a really bad mistake. If we are to cultivate trust and communication, this is the wrong way to do things. It would be different if people were using their real names on the forum. As it is not the case, it only resemble a pretty one sided/fascist view of things to unilateraly decide that this or that line should not be seen by others... And thus it is only a mean to control the content of the forum. And as I use to say.. Only truth hurts.

I disagree. Anything libellous or filthy should not be here.
The whole point of moderation is to allow the threads to flow.
That can't happen with all types of stuff staying where it was.
That is how people can disrupt the forum easily.
I am guilty of this myself, without that being a conscious thing.
Derailing a thread for example. The best option is to split it into two.
Retaining focus isn't easy these days with all the energy fluctuations going on.

Like this nuggetry for example.
http://camelotforum.com/index.php?option=com_kunena&func=view&catid=3&id=42468&limit=10&limitstart=10&Itemid=164#42632
How is that helpful?

This is why there are forum rules, if people break them then they decently can be asked to leave. Removing the posts linked to the ban is like taking away the evidence of a crime, it does not allow clarity of justice. As for people derailing threads, chico has been first hand victim of that since the united people thread, which meant to be creative and constructive. Opposite viewpoints were often purely oriented toward dissent and never brought anything of value. Only discouragement and ideological oppression.

I really feel sad about it.

Peace