True Love doesn't exist in Marriages or Families

[raymond]

Too many of us grew up in dysfunctional families with pretty screwed up parents. Our parents didn't give us the love and happiness which we were seeking for and when we grew up, we grew up with a pretty big hole in our psyche.

Then we got introduced to sex and both men and women begin to seek the love and happiness which they are missing through marriages or through having their own children. Adult men and women all over the world seek to create their own families where the love and happiness which they missed in childhoods will be reproduced in their own marriages and families.

However, Osho once said,"Lust is about looking for Happiness. Love is about giving Happiness."

How many men and women get married for the sake of giving happiness to the other partner instead of seeking happiness from the other partner?

How many men and women give birth to children for the sake of giving happiness to their children instead of seeking happiness from their children?

I have heard this phrase,"aren't you looking for happiness? aren't you looking for love?" too many times when I asked everybody why they fall in love.

It is always the same answer. They are looking for happiness and love. They are LUSTING for happiness and love whether be it through sex or love.

[Davidallany]

The use of modern languages have been set up this way through literature and religion. Jordan Maxwell has some work related to this.

[raymond]

The media industry, educational system and the government even propogate this lie that one can only find true love and true happiness in marriages and families. This is to cover up the real reason for marriages and families. Which is to create a population of slaves to run the economy so that TPTB can continue its grip on power and lead a life of luxuries.

"There is no Indian Chief without the Indians" as the saying goes.

But let's get back to the topic at hand. As long as you have lust in your consciousness, as long as you hunger for love, for recognition, for happiness, is that True Love?

Because from what I understand True Love is about giving without any expectations of reward.

It is like stranger helping another stranger out of kindness not because of filah piety or our of a sense of duty.

How many of us give love to our wives/husbands/parents/children out of a sense of duty or expectations of receiving rewards?

This is why I say True Love can never exist in marriages or families. There is always this hunger, this materialistic element, this give-and-take reward system existing in marriages and families.

I think there is this saying,"treat all women as your sisters, daughters and mothers, treat all men as your brothers, sons and fathers"

If you can show compassion and kindness to a stranger without any expectation of reward, especially sexual rewards, then that is the purest form of Love of all.

THzi7O-W2AI

[raymond]

I am sure a lot of moms out there, upon reading my post, will comment, "hold on, do you know how much I sacrifice for my kids everyday? Waking up early, washing their clothes, putting up with their crying and baying and breaking of glasses and furniture, defecating in their beds, so on and so forth"..

Hey look, I admit it.. you are showing plenty of love for your children and I salute you for that..

But try giving all those love you gave to your own flesh-and-blood children to children not related to you in any manner and then I will call that True Love.

uuKl4QoHoJY

[raymond]

True Love only exist between enemies.

When you can love those whom you hate and whom give you pain, that is the purest form of love of all.

[shadowstalker]

True Love doesn't exist in Marriages or Families
Contradicts this
But try giving all those love you gave to your own flesh-and-blood children to children not related to you in any manner and then I will call that True Love.
Because now you are talking about giving true love out side the family unit.
You can't have it both ways and still have the original statement mean anything.

[enfoldedblue]

Hi Raymond,

While I respect your opinion, and feel that you raise an important issue, I will have to say my experience is very different. I feel your title may be a wee bit general.
I have certainly been in relationships where this is true, and I feel it would apply to the family situation I was raised in. However I have now something very different with my own family. My husband and I have such deep love for both ourselves, eachother, and our child that the others happiness and wellbeing is as important as our own. We treat eachother like a god and goddess and our love becomes more profound everyday. We consciously choose to focus on love and consciously weave its nature into all aspects of our life. All members of our family feel loved cherished, supported and nurtured... we are a functional unit. Also having this solid base provides us with the inner happiness to continue to spread love in the wider world as well. I have no enemies.


Also to me this statement doesn't make sense: "When you can love those whom you hate and whom give you pain, that is the purest form of love of all.'" Because if you really felt true love toward them you could no longer hate them.

Anyway...my perspective..

LOVE ALLways, c

[toothpick]

There is nothing in life as special or lovely as true, or unconditional love.
It is like puttng warm clothes on out of the dryer on a chilly morning.
It is something you will know and feel immediately.
Usually it seems to occur in the family unit, but, not always.

toothpick

[Lost Soul]

There is "love" which is ego based and lasts only so long as the ego's desires and needs are met. Then there is selfless love which is what The Creator gives. To learn more about it, suggested reading: Children of the Law of One and the Lost Teachings of Atlantis by Jon Peniel. It's online for free.

[Violet]

I am sure a lot of moms out there, upon reading my post, will comment, "hold on, do you know how much I sacrifice for my kids everyday? Waking up early, washing their clothes, putting up with their crying and baying and breaking of glasses and furniture, defecating in their beds, so on and so forth"..

Hey look, I admit it.. you are showing plenty of love for your children and I salute you for that..

But try giving all those love you gave to your own flesh-and-blood children to children not related to you in any manner and then I will call that True Love.



Partially agree with the love view. It's a bit like with nature where people just take and take and don't really give much or anything back.

I'm just not sure about the complete inability to realise this in a longterm commitment such as marriage. It's more to do with matching, I believe. If two like-minded people who are willing to both give and receive love meet, why not marriage then?

Furthermore, there are couples that have no health issues and adopt children merely for the sake of giving them the love they could not get from their biological parents. This is also a child-parent relationship.

[raymond]

True Love doesn't exist in Marriages or Families
Contradicts this
But try giving all those love you gave to your own flesh-and-blood children to children not related to you in any manner and then I will call that True Love.
Because now you are talking about giving true love out side the family unit.
You can't have it both ways and still have the original statement mean anything.

You still don't get it.

The love between a mother and her flesh-and-blood children is totally different from a surrogate mother and another woman's child especially if that other woman is a stranger or even an enemy of the surrogate mother.

You are a woman and I am pretty sure you know some women whom you hate.

Will you love the child of the woman you hate most (assuming she is no blood relations of yours) as though that child is your own?

If so, then that is True Love.

I am not saying the love between a mother and her flesh-and-blood children isn't deep nor good but there is the element of "bonds" or "duty" or "giri" in that relationship.

Think about it.

[raymond]

Hi Raymond,

While I respect your opinion, and feel that you raise an important issue, I will have to say my experience is very different. I feel your title may be a wee bit general.
I have certainly been in relationships where this is true, and I feel it would apply to the family situation I was raised in. However I have now something very different with my own family. My husband and I have such deep love for both ourselves, eachother, and our child that the others happiness and wellbeing is as important as our own. We treat eachother like a god and goddess and our love becomes more profound everyday. We consciously choose to focus on love and consciously weave its nature into all aspects of our life. All members of our family feel loved cherished, supported and nurtured... we are a functional unit. Also having this solid base provides us with the inner happiness to continue to spread love in the wider world as well. I have no enemies.


Also to me this statement doesn't make sense: "When you can love those whom you hate and whom give you pain, that is the purest form of love of all.'" Because if you really felt true love toward them you could no longer hate them.

Anyway...my perspective..

LOVE ALLways, c

Try giving the same degree of love which you give to your husband to another man. No sex or lust involved, mind you.

Try giving the same degree of love which you give to your own child to a total stranger's child.

No one can truly love someone whom they hate or even someone whom they don't know. This is why it is called True Love.

To let go of the hate and love.

¤=[Post Update]=¤


There is nothing in life as special or lovely as true, or unconditional love.
It is like puttng warm clothes on out of the dryer on a chilly morning.
It is something you will know and feel immediately.
Usually it seems to occur in the family unit, but, not always.

toothpick

i don't think true, unconditional love will ever happen or has ever happened in a family unit

there is the blood in the relationship which taint the True love aspect of it.

why don't you try loving a stranger as though he/she is your family?

then that will be True Love

otherwise the love is always mercenary if there exists some sort of bond between two people

¤=[Post Update]=¤



I am sure a lot of moms out there, upon reading my post, will comment, "hold on, do you know how much I sacrifice for my kids everyday? Waking up early, washing their clothes, putting up with their crying and baying and breaking of glasses and furniture, defecating in their beds, so on and so forth"..

Hey look, I admit it.. you are showing plenty of love for your children and I salute you for that..

But try giving all those love you gave to your own flesh-and-blood children to children not related to you in any manner and then I will call that True Love.



Partially agree with the love view. It's a bit like with nature where people just take and take and don't really give much or anything back.

I'm just not sure about the complete inability to realise this in a longterm commitment such as marriage. It's more to do with matching, I believe. If two like-minded people who are willing to both give and receive love meet, why not marriage then?

Furthermore, there are couples that have no health issues and adopt children merely for the sake of giving them the love they could not get from their biological parents. This is also a child-parent relationship.

Does one love all children in the world as though all children belong to him or her?

Can you look at an attractive unknown man/woman and love him/her without having lustful thoughts?

Then that is true love.

¤=[Post Update]=¤


There is "love" which is ego based and lasts only so long as the ego's desires and needs are met. Then there is selfless love which is what The Creator gives. To learn more about it, suggested reading: Children of the Law of One and the Lost Teachings of Atlantis by Jon Peniel. It's online for free.

I don't understand why nobody thanked you in this post.

This is the most enlightening post in this thread so far.

[raymond]

There are hundreds of immortals in today's world. Maybe even thousands of immortals.

These immortals live for hundreds of years. Some really powerful ones even live for thousands of years and a few even longer.

Do you know why these immortals have not brought forth the teachings of immortality to the general public?

This is because they know that if every single Tom, Dick, Harry and Sally knows about these techniques, no one would bother working anymore. No one would even bother procreating and starting families.

The concept of a Family Unit is a term started by the Dark Ones themselves.

They know that if the Average Joe is distracted by the impermanent tribulations of starting a family, then humans, the entire humanity would be too tired to work on or even think about the teachings of immortality.

Because if no one works, no one procreates, the entire economy would be ruined and there wouldn't be any propagation of the Human Race anymore.

Thus the ET overlords, in order to maintain their fcuking grand experiment, told the immortals to keep quiet about these immortality teachings or the immortals would be fcuked with.

The immortals. being very risk-adverse people, thus kept their mouth shut and give out their teachings to only a very select few.

Afterall, they already gained immortality so what do they have to gain by disseminating the teachings to the public only to be punished by the ET overlords?

Why the hell do you think TPTB has wasted so much money, energy and resources on brainwashing the public?

This is the reason why!

The fcuking family unit, which everybody is so misleaded into thinking that it is like the most important thingy in the world, is the bloody reason why the entire Human Race has not transformed into a Race of Immortals by now.

Everybody focus so much on fcuking procreating and forget about a higher goal! That of becoming Immortals!

[ktlight]

What we people call love of your partner is a clinging of images of the other in mind. If the image changes, as it will inevitably, so does the 'love'. We want the image to stay as it was because it induces the feeling that was enjoyed. But, as we grow, we change.

Think about a friend you have not seen for a while and then meet again. In the mind, the image of that friend does not change, so it's quite a surprise to see that the change does not fit what is. And then a new image replaces the old one.

We learn to love ourselves first. Everything starts within, otherwise it cannot be out there.

[Pony Express]

I grew up in a family so disfunctional, it would fall off today's charts. But I've been married to the same man for 54 years. We have three children. None of them are "normal." There are not many problems that I haven't seen.

After so many years of experiencing love in its many phases, and having experienced a spiritual growth that would take a book to explain, I can only say this: True love DOES exist in marriage and in families. It just doesn't come packaged the way one expects.

Anyone under 60 years of age comes with varying degrees of cognitive dissonance about love, I suspect. But it exists. Trust me.

[enfoldedblue]

Hi Raymond,

I personally find it easy to love from a far...I have many male friends as well as children who I have deep love for. I find it is those closest to me who are there 24/7 who really challenge me the most (especially when I'm feeling irritable or tired). The intimacy that is shared with family members can't be compared to friends or strangers.

Peace and love to you

LOVE ALLways, c

[fox.mulder]

Afterall, they already gained immortality so what do they have to gain by disseminating the teachings to the public only to be punished by the ET overlords?Everybody focus so much on fcuking procreating and forget about a higher goal! That of becoming Immortals!

Yes the obsession with procreating is an issue that is not dealt with at all. Particularly say in the US, how many kids have to put up with mums boyfriend or dads new girlfriend. You people should be asshamed of yourselves.

[Violet]

[QUOTE=enfoldedblue;303399]Hi Raymond,


Does one love all children in the world as though all children belong to him or her?

Can you look at an attractive unknown man/woman and love him/her without having lustful thoughts?

Then that is true love.

¤=[Post Update]=¤



Honestly? Yes, I do love and worry about all children as if they were mine.

And I do love all men and women so long as their behaviour makes it worthwhile doing so. Because I know in the end we are all one.

I cannot always exclude feelings of lust when looking at adults of the opposite sex but it's never exploitative in the sense that what I think about them is within an imaginary setting of an imaginary bond that is based on mutual respect. (For example: if this woman were my wife, ...)

[motherlove]

I believe true love does exist just like gravity. We choose just don't choose from the program. Best Wishes.

[The One]

How many men and women give birth to children for the sake of giving happiness to their children instead of seeking happiness from their children?

Not many men at all i think


Simple
You are the power

[ghostrider]

ehummm, my queen and I both live to give to each other first, she is the first woman that cares about me first over herself, and I am that way to her , we live in bliss=everyday. all of our friends are jealous, but we understand, it is hard to find a soulmate these days. when you love your children more than life and you find someone that feels the same and talk awhile, and be friends first for a year or so, the wedding part was easy, the day to day living easy, the future together easy, it's been eight years we have never fought , not once. I love her too much to ever be angry. to all the ones still searching, learn to listen first, speak second. this is my realm. I grew up in a yelling fighting home, with drinking and such, I told myself , when I marry , no drinking, no yelling and no cheating, only peace and love and we would talk calmly and never yell in front of the kids. it worked. my boys never saw me fight or yell in my home or in front of them. today they are calm and very smart , people always asked what did I do ? I listened to them first, and never lost my temper, and talked to them like adults from day one . my grandaughter just turned two and can get the iphone and pull me up and call me by herself. learn to listen first and talk softly.... you'll be amazed.

[TATODAY]

Hi Folks, I am 40 next April and have never been told by my Mother that she Loves me. I spent the last 10 years working with Emotionally disturbed Kids mostly boys, I felt for their pain. The abyss of their suffering is immense and for every 120% of energy you put in there is a miniscule movement forwards or backwards. Can young people be possessed by negative entities - possibly I feel. Giving and receiving love is very much an energy thing. I spoke to my 4 yr old on the phone and she was upbeat and full of conversation and suddenly she started to imagine that I was sat next to her - I went along with it and said "Yes I am just coming through the front door now can you see me" - "Yes she said you are sat next to me" My heart opened immensely and I new she felt it. Very nice. In transactional analysis we can see the games that we play in order to fill the time vacuum. Avoidance of intimacy (Love) is normally the rule and can come in the form of Withdrawal, Ritual, Pastimes, Activities, or Games. I take part in a tradition of Yoga set forth by Swami Gitananda who died in the 90's and there is a lovely image of him in Samadhi at his death and is it headlined with "From the alone to the alone". I found this statement very interesting and after watching the recent Tibetan Book of the Dead narrated by Leonard Cohen I gleaned some more insights into this deep seated Dukha - low level anxiety related to our final demise as a shell. Cohen says - "In the end we all must die and our hopes and fears will be irrelevant". I feel intimacy and love comes from sharing this understanding that we are transient and impermanent and that man is made of non man elements and so we are all that we see and can touch that realization through mindfullness (Or whatever tradition/ Mind construct a person enjoys). I share my love with my children by excitedly exploring the different characters, animals or beings that we would like to take on when this shell is gone...Dolphins are favourite at the moment. I believe Love exists in families certainly........

[The One]

I love you all xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

[Star1111]

Raymond

Good thread and certainly thought provoking.

I just wanted to make a comment on one of your comments "Because from what I understand True Love is about giving without any expectations of reward.

Do we ever really give LOVE, care, kindness without wanting some kind of reward, be it a smile, a comment a stroke? Deep down do we really not need some type of reward - I doubt this.

I do believe in unconditional LOVE within families and I also believe that true LOVE is to 'give of thyself'.

Again, do we ever really do that though? Can we do that in our human incarnation with the ego/mind/body in play?

I am confidient we can and certainly do as our higher selves, our souls but not sure about whether we can do that as humans.

I am fortunate to deeply love as a human and in this form to I know that I would happily give my life for some of the people who belong to my family.

Therefore I would say true love (from my human perspective) can and does exist in families.

[kudzy]

Imagine:

It's Valentine's Day and a very sweet child, that you don't even know, gives you a present. It is the most thoughtful, kindest, sweetest, loving gift that you can possibly imagine. Your heart instantly becomes a big puddle of mush, your are awe struck, dumbfounded. You couldn't believe that someone could be that kind, that thoughtful. There are no words to describe this feeling.

Imagine:
That gift is your life.

Just something Ayahuaska showed me, it seems relevant to me.

[westhill]

The first question is "Do you love yourself?"
In this world, love is seen as an entry for loss, fear and emptiness... But if you engage love, you can walk (light) side-by-(dark) side with all its aspects in understanding.
We will get hurt, heal and try again. It's all about knowing/loving yourself. How many lifetimes will it take to master this?
westhill

[stardustaquarion]

IMHO much of what does not work in our lives comes from un-met expectations. Perhaps, dropping all expectations and re-thiking what is what we are really seeking is a way out of the constant looping of bad experiences

Do we really have the right to expect others to give us what we do not give to ourselves? Why do we want a specific experience?

The other problem is what Joe Marsalla has described as "love adiction" and "love dealer". When we are "in love" certain hormons get released from our brain and make us feel good, as time goes by in any relationship things normally pan out as we "expect" them but where are those expectations come from? social conditioning? church? family? movies?

As the nuns in my school said, relationships are 10 pct love and 90 pct tolerance...on those basis...what is the point of a relationship? are humans better equiped for short encounters?

Freedom to be who we are is the highes love we can give to ourselves...all the rest will fade away sooner or later

[shadowstalker]

totally different from a surrogate mother and another woman's child especially if that other woman is a stranger or even an enemy of the surrogate mother.

Now you see you didn't say that, This situation has nothing to do with family cuz now you giving the idea of a forced situation from an outsider, A forced obligation thrusted upon someone from out of the blue. That and there are many different variants to that theme, once again you created a generalize situation. to be able to change on a whim.
You are now comparing apples to oranges...This still has nothing to do with Family And marriage...

You keep sending signals to folks that all must be done within a realm that truly does not exist in this world. not all can be expected to commit to these circumstances. not everyone is capable of these circumstances, but that does not mean that true love does not exist within Family and marriage.

The expectations are to high and not truly realistic to the 3d paradigm of duality, and soul contracts.. No one can be expected to hold true to these so called definitions of love.

I can still unconditionally love and forgive my using husband but there is nothing that states in books or teachings that bind me to still live with him or stay married to him, I can still love him unconditionally after the divorce and from a distance. I would not wish him ill will but wish him well with his new mate. a lot of folks can do this but you can not expect all to comply to your definitions of love, that would create judgement and undue stress not only to the person but to the spirit as well. A person can still love a child be it there or another with out raising them. But to give up and force ones self to do something to prove to another like that turns that other person into a slave, you first have to love yourself and sometimes that means to do what it right for you on a personal note and spiritual. One can not expect another to commit to such standards in the type of world this is, when we have free will choice. But to be told we are not capable is unrealistic to say the very least.

On top of that, I personally would not know the others soul contract let alone a child, the above statements you keep making may inter-fear with another soul contract.

The guide lines you have been posting are not feasible to all personal soul contracts in this world even in a general statement.
You can not expect to have folks drop there soul contracts and live up to any of those standards to which by the way you keep adding to every once in a while.

Would i personally stress myself to prove that I am capable to do all that one asks of me with these guides lines?
I would have to be honest I would say no, why? because I am not here to be tested so harshly And I would not do that to another either.

I can also honestly say that with what you have posted thus far, that at one point or another (to which btw you keep changing) that you will always find someone that will not hold to those standards and your point will be proven, which is sad because in this world of creating an out and high standards someone will always loose to what you are trying to prove, in your personal mind and personal definitions.

[<8>]

Hi Raymond..

I dont realy like the word "true love" does it meen i dont love my loved ones? True love to me are more a word tha came from when to people fall in love, and cant think of anything else.
But even though the love seem to fade away from when two people fall in love, they build there trust in each other and thats how families are build.

Thats why it hurts so much when you lose your trust in a loved one.

About hate... I dont hate anyone, if the world break down tomorrow, and Obama's children end up in my lap. I feed them and do my best to see no one hurt them.

[ceetee9]

There are many levels of love of which unconditional love (true love) is the highest form. Like most human things it must start from within. If you cannot love yourself, unconditionally, how could you possibly love another? You haven't the tools, the reference point, or the understanding. Perhaps George Benson's 1977 song (later popularized by Whitney Houston) "The Greatest Love of All" summed it up best: "learning to love yourself is the greatest love of all." Once you can unconditionally accept and love yourself for whom and what you are then you are equipped with the ability to unconditionally accept and love others as well.

You are right in that most people believe that they will find fulfillment, love and happiness externally. That all they need is to find the right person to give them what they so desperately want and need. And this is why so many search their entire life never finding it, never realizing that fulfillment, love and happiness comes from within and not from without.

So whether true love exists in marriage or families are entirely dependent upon the level of understanding of, and commitment to, what love is of those involved in the marriage and family.

[heyokah]

This asks for unconditional love....

y6Z66U31wr4

Yes, there are many levels of love indeed ....

[Providence]

Good post, controversial but good!

Love to me is not centered in the emotions, the warm and fuzzy feelings, although they feel good, love is an unconditional level of commitment. I grew up being told what was expected of me for me to be happy, and I can tell you from experience, it's all wrong. You do have to love yourself, (once again not the warm and fuzzy stuff), and then you can love others fully and in spite of the emotional response they generate in you.

[raymond]

Imagine there's no Heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will be as one

Imagine no possessions
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or hunger
A brotherhood of man
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will live as one

Too often we treat our parents, children, spouses, families as possessions.

[NeverMind]

Too many of us grew up in dysfunctional families with pretty screwed up parents. Our parents didn't give us the love and happiness which we were seeking for and when we grew up, we grew up with a pretty big hole in our psyche.

They gave you what they could, to the best of their abilities at the time.
I am sure they were sorely lacking in many aspects; even "perfect" parents are.

But none of that matters, really. It's from "holes" - from WOUNDS - that the most stupendous creative forces arise. (Not necessarily "artistic" - one can be creative - in fact far more so - by re-creating one's own Being.)

Did you know that?
It is true.

Holes make you whole.
Where there are profound wounds, "holes", there is room for Light to penetrate and cleanse and revive.
The armour of those few who - bless them! - never felt they experienced any conflict and separation, tends to be much more resistant to the highest of the higher lights.
It may sound like rhethoric, and I am sorry if it does; but it is true nevertheless.



Adult men and women all over the world seek to create their own families where the love and happiness which they missed in childhoods will be reproduced in their own marriages and families.

There are also adult men and women all over the world who do not seek anything through procreation; who do not seek procreation itself (and not necessarily for some pessimistic reason).
There are also adult men and women who are opening their homes and their hearts, who are giving almost everything they have, to people, including children and adults they have never seen in person, who have far less than themselves, materially and emotionally.

There are all kinds of people, and many more motives, than Osho & Co. would like to concede.
The fact they don't blow their own trumpets doesn't make them - or their endeavours and achievements - any less real.

But you would be well advised to ask yourself: what about them? Why is it that they apparently do not count?
There are hundreds of thousands of them; why do they not count for you when you compose the picture of the world?
(This is not a hostile question - far from it. It is a friendly question, whether you recognise it or not.)

Also, ask Osho WHY - why exactly - it is more desirable to give instead of taking?
(I know he's dead; but that never stopped any real teacher; and rest assured, I am not talking about OUIJA boards.)

Why exactly is giving happiness to others more desirable than giving "happiness" for oneself?
(As if the two were separated!)
What do we gain from it - for there clearly appears to be something to be gained.
(I might add the question, what does accepting our giving make of those who are the recipients of our benevolence? But that would be a rational game, and those aren't really productive, except for entertainment purposes.)

Was there a little voice inside of you that scoffed at question above just now? You know, that little voice that recognises when something is "self-evident", without actually knowing the answer?

Nothing is self-evident, certainly not because others tell us so.
And none of us, not even those who have travelled most extensively, both in body and in spirit, have more than a vague idea of the Otherness of the others.

But I can tell you this: the lives and universes, if you will, that people all over the world are creating within themselves right now, as we speak, for all living beings eventually to benefit, defy description. Even if they could be described - and, by some miracle of momentary empathy, fully understood - they would boggle the mind and transfix forever the world view of anyone who could catch a glimpse of them.
The fact that they are not acknowledged, or even recognised, does not make them - and certainly not their light and fire - any less real.

(To avoid misunderstadings, I am not talking about some sect or anything ridiculous like that. I am talking about people, men and women, children and old people, secretaries and farmers and writers and plumbers - all over the world, who dare to dream BIG, to LIVE that waking dream of the Heart - and have the right "equipment" to do so with particular efficacy.)

So, if I may offer a word of advice: whatever you do, do not generalise. Never ever generalise.
Generalisation is possibly the most effective blinder - but a very useful tool for demagogues - that the human rational mind, the feeble creature that it is, ever created.

Try instead to remove any subjective assertions from your language. Nothing is - everything seems, specifically to you (i.e. to every individual). Always be aware of that, always express that, and your path may become much lighter and more joyful.

Finally, I am sorry if any part of this message is not clear, or clear enough. It was not my intention to make it obscure.
But I do not pretend to have fathomed the intellectual and spiritual scope of all and each - or ANY - of my readers, so I speak as I would to myself... well, more or less. : )

I am aware that misunderstandings are inevitable. Such is the nature of words.
But I also know, from experience, that even misunderstandings - as long as they are our own, not someone else's interpretation - eventually, if the will is there, lead to the essence of whatever was expressed.

Good luck. : )

[Referee]

True Love is that unconditional love me think's it is very rare. But out there.

[davyj0nes]

This of course assumes that love exists; i want to take a look at the immortality post. Humanity's goal is not to achieve immortality, indeed they already have, they have achieved immortality through their children. So says the Bible; so we can see then families do not have anything to with this thing called 'love', but instead have to do with the parents desire to 'live on' through their children. So i guess i am agreeing that true love does not exists in families, but am disagreeing that families impede immortality, because having families is how men/women achieve immortality.

[heyokah]

Imagine there's no Heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will be as one

Imagine no possessions
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or hunger
A brotherhood of man
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will live as one

Too often we treat our parents, children, spouses, families as possessions.

Watch this. Isn't this love ? It's not a 'natural' family, but what this woman did, this Mum.
She and her little family, are credit to the Human Race.
That's love....

SQRf4g079UY

[Logan]

I'd like to respond directly to the original post and say true love does exist, you simply have not found it yet.

I had two parents who hated each other frankly. They were not in love, that was clear from a young age. They fought, clawed, whatever, until they divorced after repeatedly lying to me about the state of their marriage.

That does not mean I can't find love. I have fit. My wife is the most amazing pure-hearted woman I've ever known. We have a relationship based on respect and the fact that before we are lovers or parents we are FRIENDS. My wife is my best friend.

I'll tell you something about love that is difficult for those trying to find that someone for their life. You can't find true love until you love yourself. You have to accept yourself for all your weird quirks and whatever, because we all have em. I'm not perfect, but I have found perfection in my life because I have found the perfect counterpoint to my personality.

Don't get me wrong, it doesn't happen overnight. I had to kiss a few frogs so-to-speak on the way to meeting my wife. But I tell you when we met, it was clear who I had found.

Literally when we held hands (and when we still do) there is energy there. It's a real tangible energy that we share when we are close to each other.

We took that love and we had a son a couple years ago. He is loved, his parents love each other, and his life will be all that much easier because of it. Whatever trials and tribulations he has he will know he ALWAYS has a place at home with us.

If I can find love like this, anyone can. I've been trough Hell and back and I was at a point in my life where yeah sure, I think I'm a good catch but will I find ANYONE who I can stand to be around? Will I find anyone who can stand to be around me?

Yes, I did. Anyone can. It takes an open mind, confidence, and a willingness to put your heart out there for the right person.

Just writing this I want to run home and hug my wife.