Is it possible that realities for people will split within different dimensions?

[AMystic3434]

Is it possible that when the shift occurs that not everyone will go to the same place when they acend. Because within each dimension there are also muliple dimensions and realities that you exist on. Maybe people will be spread out amongst the 3rd and 4th dimentional realities depending on there vibration.

[Mark]

The russian scientist Dr. Stankov says that some people will go to the lower 5th dimension others who have done more soul work will go to the higher 5th dimension. He says that the lower 5th is still material so you will have a body by default, while the higher is purely ethereal. The entire concept of dimensions as it is used by the new age community is really confusing anyway as it does not correspond the scientific understanding of dimensions, which are primarily physical in nature. I find the concept of density to be better when refering to states of consciousness.

[craig mitchell]

For the last several years I have intuitively felt, and saw the image in my mind of a "split' occurring between 3d and 4d just as in mitosis in cell generation. My timeline is for the 4th and higher and I refute any lower 3d reality. Those that refuse to learn, or knowingly continue to do what they were up to during historical dramas, such as Atlantis, will be able to continue their sad greedy games in the 3d earth or some other place appropriate to their low vib cravings.

Regards, Craig

[pilotsimone]

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[9eagle9]

People already have split realities, alternate realities, different perceptions (which is what reality is based in how we process it or not process it) and access to multidimensional expressions so I'm not sure why that would change. Its very much up to the individual. It's a given that we create our own reality, so it doesn't seem strange to me that people would be divided or choose different realitys. Whether those realities are truthful, or non illusionary, is again up to the invidual.

[NeverMind]

OP, I believe that is exactly what happens in any case, regardless of any "shifts" - when people die.
(Perhaps even sooner than that. :-))

And you are creating that abode right now.

[TraineeHuman]

In my experience, sometimes higher-dimensional beings look like a point of light. But then they may show themselves as having a shape, which I understand to be a 4D body. But that shape still looks pretty ethereal compared to a physical or a solid physical object. So, what looks ethereal may be relative to where you're at.

A different point I would make is that the 3D world is actually a group creation, created purely through mutual agreement, and by all humans, animals, minerals and vegetables, and nature spirits. If many of us all happen to acquire the ability to create a 4D world or a 5D world for us to re-incarnate into, we may well re-incarnate there for our next life. But in the meantime, we should appreciate that before being born into 3D we agreed to submit to the rules of 3D as far as our body is concerned. Unless we happen to have mastery in certain very specialised and advanced abilities, I believe we can't undo that commitment until after we die -- and probably not for some time after that too. And since we go to the middle-to-lower(but not lowest) part of the 4D world at the time we die, maybe that's when the issue of creating a new, golden-age world will become more real and more intelligible to us.

[blufire]

I always find these threads fascinating and quite frankly very sad. I feel these thoughts and perceptions that we have to be “special” or vibrate “higher” or “better” very tragic.

Why is it that we cannot accept and thrive and love being 3D humans?

We have NO factual proof that there even are other dimensions or people that have switched timelines or that the “good works” that we do here in this place and time will “earn” us a place in a “better or higher dimension”. If these are things we all are supposed to be achieving then why are they theoretically and factually impossible?

Oh yes . . . I can see some clicking and loading this video clip and this guru and this important man said this or that . . . .

It is very sad and tragic.

I have absolutely nothing against striving to be the best we can be or searching and learning or wondering and loving or even becoming rightfully angry at the many injustices of the world.

I judge any of these types of philosophies with the following test: Is the information, knowledge or so called “truth” available to ALL humans across the earth, past, present or even future. Can the “regular” human achieve it or do you have to be special or in an elite group? If so I feel it is not truth.

It is another element that keeps us divided and unable to unite and meld together.

The Only Truth I feel at this point in my life is at the point of “shifting” (whatever that is) we ALL and I mean ALL of us will be released from this dualistic linear existence. ALL of our souls, life force, energy (however the little sucker is vibrating) will reunite back into The Time that has no beginning or end . . . . it folds and melds.

But right now in this place and time we ARE 3D and all beauty and wonder that it means and holds. Don’t spend your life hating this existence and wishing you were in another dimension or timeline. Grass is always greener on the other side don’t you know.

Okay . . . . I’m ready for the backlash . . . .

[xion]

I agree with you bluefire.


Is the information, knowledge or so called “truth” available to ALL humans across the earth, past, present or even future. Can the “regular” human achieve it or do you have to be special or in an elite group? If so I feel it is not truth.

I stated similar in my previous posts. http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?31208-Different-perspective-on-alien-theories-Velon-ET-threat-to-humanity&p=318912#post318912

The change is already happening, and its meant for all the people of the Earth. If it wasn't it wouldn't be called a change. I agree that maybe "some" will achieve some sort of enlightenment, and maybe some will ascend, but who knows.
There will always be people who will dedicate their lives to meditation to achieve enlightenment, no matter if the change is coming, if asteroids are falling, if battles are being fought, no matter of surrounding, people can still achieve it. It has been written throughout the history.
But to say that we are all going through some mayor planetary change in consciousness and that only some people will ascend, vanish to a higher dimension or wherever and the rest of people will stay behind is arrogant and small minded.

A lot of people are hyped with Mayan dates, and expecting instant something is going to happen on a certain date. If it does, nobody is gonna be more happier than me. I'm all in for that. But I don't think thats the way it works.
To achieve all that wonders of a human consciousness, and I don't even wanna mention enlightenment, it needs a lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of time and dedication.
I really hope, pray and dream that something will shake all the people of the Earth, and that we can all start thinking strait and move on to something constructive than this we have.
But something deep inside me is telling me that we have a lot of work ahead of us.
We made a really big mess of our planet and our society, and you all know that we can achieve wonders if we put our minds into it.

[Mad Hatter]

Mad Hatter dons his observers cap...

So I look at something that has survived for millenia longer than Homo Sapiens and I find a planet...

I see that almost everything in the nature of the way the planet goes about the survival business can be broken down into interlocking processes of exquisite simplicity...

This leads me to wondering if the solution to the question of becoming enlightened, ascending if you will, does not break down into something of equal exquisite simplicity..

If...we have all agreed to be here to help clean up this mess then surely we would be given the tools to achieve such...

This then causes me to wonder if the total population is balanced against the equivalent number of linear lifetimes to carry out the task...

Which then begs the question...would an exquisitely simple enough key, turned by each of us simultaneously, get the job done in just one day...

Hence my penchant for not being too fond of solutions that require 20 years of navel gazing in order to understand.

To address the OPs query, if there is an infinite field of potential containing an infinite number of dimensions and thus realities to explore and if free will exists this must simply come down to individual choice... Who knows we might even have the choice to be conciously aware of living in a 1000 dimension at once!!

Since I'm lousy at playing multi level chess and from my current vanatge point I fail to observe anything more than 4D, then for the moment this reality, for me, will have to do. :p

[king anthony]

...when the shift occurs... go to the same place when they acend... each dimension there are also muliple dimensions and realities that you exist on... vibration.

I say, what is this shift that is continuously spoken of!? There is no shift that was, is or will be - there has been, is now and will be change. The thought and discussion of accession is for "feel good" based on emotion and the descriptive phrase some/many use to describe this "feel good" is "it resonates with me".

Throughout history, religions have been used to deceive the masses, keeping fact/truth from them; as well, disciplined those who worship to be unconditionally subservient regardless if the master, such as "those others", is present in numbers.

Those who worship, in the traditional sense, have a belief that they will be taken to the "kingdom of heaven" and hardly ever ask "and then what". Knowing why human beings are by seeking, finding and accepting fact/truth is key to understanding "and then what".

I say, be careful what one asks for, for they might just get it.

Others who do not share the same type of belief system as stated above, spend their days in discussion of past lives and diverting responsibility of now to another life or existence in another dimension - as if this is.

Is this not human ego/arrogance that has made human beings into something more then what they are - while implying and imposing that there is some sort of right of passage to go elsewhere even when failure is!?

I say to all, be grounded in thought and body for this is who you are - (re)learn to think with clarity, objectively, logically and enjoy the human experience of emotion in its proper time and place. Lest, what has been over and over will continue to be again and again.

Is this a place for the promotion of feel good or a place for the promotion of facts and truths?

[blufire]

king anthony . . .thank you so much for this response and very wise words.

I feel many have a hard time understanding that even the New Age movement and beliefs is also a religion. Anytime you have to adhere to an “authority” (even if you believe it to be yourself (as god) and this authority tells you unless you do “these things” you will not be allowed into the next dimension or “heaven” it is not Truth.

The problem I see and that concerns me greatly is our human need to “belong” to something . . . .we seem to almost require someone else to lead the way or tell us what to do.

We as humanity are very easily lulled and manipulated.




...when the shift occurs... go to the same place when they acend... each dimension there are also muliple dimensions and realities that you exist on... vibration.

I say, what is this shift that is continuously spoken of!? There is no shift that was, is or will be - there has been, is now and will be change. The thought and discussion of accession is for "feel good" based on emotion and the descriptive phrase some/many use to describe this "feel good" is "it resonates with me".

Throughout history, religions have been used to deceive the masses, keeping fact/truth from them; as well, disciplined those who worship to be unconditionally subservient regardless if the master, such as "those others", is present in numbers.

Those who worship, in the traditional sense, have a belief that they will be taken to the "kingdom of heaven" and hardly ever ask "and then what". Knowing why human beings are by seeking, finding and accepting fact/truth is key to understanding "and then what".

I say, be careful what one asks for, for they might just get it.

Others who do not share the same type of belief system as stated above, spend their days in discussion of past lives and diverting responsibility of now to another life or existence in another dimension - as if this is.

Is this not human ego/arrogance that has made human beings into something more then what they are - while implying and imposing that there is some sort of right of passage to go elsewhere even when failure is!?

I say to all, be grounded in thought and body for this is who you are - (re)learn to think with clarity, objectively, logically and enjoy the human experience of emotion in its proper time and place. Lest, what has been over and over will continue to be again and again.

Is this a place for the promotion of feel good or a place for the promotion of facts and truths?

[pilotsimone]

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[starsha]

I always find these threads fascinating and quite frankly very sad. I feel these thoughts and perceptions that we have to be “special” or vibrate “higher” or “better” very tragic.

Why is it that we cannot accept and thrive and love being 3D humans?

We have NO factual proof that there even are other dimensions or people that have switched timelines or that the “good works” that we do here in this place and time will “earn” us a place in a “better or higher dimension”. If these are things we all are supposed to be achieving then why are they theoretically and factually impossible?

Is the information, knowledge or so called “truth” available to ALL humans across the earth, past, present or even future. Can the “regular” human achieve it or do you have to be special or in an elite group? If so I feel it is not truth. [/B]

It is another element that keeps us divided and unable to unite and meld together.


But right now in this place and time we ARE 3D and all beauty and wonder that it means and holds. Don’t spend your life hating this existence and wishing you were in another dimension or timeline. Grass is always greener on the other side don’t you know.

Okay . . . . I’m ready for the backlash . . . .






...when the shift occurs... go to the same place when they acend... each dimension there are also muliple dimensions and realities that you exist on... vibration.

I say, what is this shift that is continuously spoken of!? There is no shift that was, is or will be - there has been, is now and will be change. The thought and discussion of accession is for "feel good" based on emotion and the descriptive phrase some/many use to describe this "feel good" is "it resonates with me".

Throughout history, religions have been used to deceive the masses, keeping fact/truth from them; as well, disciplined those who worship to be unconditionally subservient regardless if the master, such as "those others", is present in numbers.

Those who worship, in the traditional sense, have a belief that they will be taken to the "kingdom of heaven" and hardly ever ask "and then what". Knowing why human beings are by seeking, finding and accepting fact/truth is key to understanding "and then what".

I say, be careful what one asks for, for they might just get it.

Others who do not share the same type of belief system as stated above, spend their days in discussion of past lives and diverting responsibility of now to another life or existence in another dimension - as if this is.

Is this not human ego/arrogance that has made human beings into something more then what they are - while implying and imposing that there is some sort of right of passage to go elsewhere even when failure is!?

I say to all, be grounded in thought and body for this is who you are - (re)learn to think with clarity, objectively, logically and enjoy the human experience of emotion in its proper time and place. Lest, what has been over and over will continue to be again and again.

Is this a place for the promotion of feel good or a place for the promotion of facts and truths?


Exactly. The grass is always greener on the other side, in another moment, or in another dimension. All this fantasizing about the future is just creating more dangling carrots for the human race.

Thanks to Blufire and King Anthony for being the voice of reason and clarity. The reality is, and what we do know, is that we are here now. Why do we need to make things more complicated than that? Because we don't like it here. Because we don't like the discomforts of life and so instead of dealing with it head on, we look to find a way to escape it. What if there is no escape?


King Anthony says ....
Is this not human ego/arrogance that has made human beings into something more then what they are - while implying and imposing that there is some sort of right of passage to go elsewhere even when failure is!?

This is it exactly, in this case though, i would call it 'spiritual' ego or spiritual arrogance. The notion that the spiritual elite get to go to a 'higher' dimension, or ascend to a better, or more special place than others is ego. To me a person with little ego doesn't see them self as any different than anyone else, they are honest, real and ordinary ... just another ant in the pile.

Letting go of seeking for 'better' higher and more, is the only way to actually embrace what is here now ... and live life as it is ... and see things as they really are. I think the reason so few want to do this is because this makes us realize and face our limitations, and the ego would rather be 'above all that'.

[pilotsimone]

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[Camilo]

I think the law of attraction will take care of it, and everyone will end up where they belong.

[starsha]

What about those of us who have proven it to ourselves? Those of us who are moving around consciously in places we've never been (or remembered). Major things happening in our lives that have never happened before. Are we to keep it to ourselves when we see threads where it makes sense to participate?

I'm seeing two kinds of people lately. Those who need proof of everything before they'll try anything (usually fear of failure types) or those who will try anything because they want information.

Now, there's not to say there isn't a process to remembering. You have to rid yourself of your old identity (old fears/pains need to move out of your body). Clean house, so to speak, so you are clear to receive more information.

The hardest part about this is trying to verbalize what occurs beyond the rational mind. A telepathic baby could understand what I mean, it's that simple. But to try and put into words (let alone prove! ha.) is practically impossible. This is why discernment on the part of everyone else is so important. Hopefully, everyone will learn to trust their bodies and intuition more than their minds. It's an absolute must at this point in time.


The Only Truth I feel at this point in my life is at the point of “shifting” (whatever that is) we ALL and I mean ALL of us will be released from this dualistic linear existence. ALL of our souls, life force, energy (however the little sucker is vibrating) will reunite back into The Time that has no beginning or end . . . . it folds and melds.

This is the way I feel it too. But, certainly you can understand not all people will be on the same path, at the same point. Some have more baggage to purge than others, it's all very individual. I have been purging for almost three years. Some have more fear, so it will take longer.

On one hand I see the shift as a purging of old energy that no longer serves us (think anger, jealously, unworthiness, doubt, shame). On the other hand I see it is energy/information now being made available to everyone. As if new kinds of rays are coming from the sun…and the more you clean out your bodies the more information you can bring in. Any sensitive person can tell you we do not live on the same planet we did just two years ago. Things have shifted dramatically. It's very exciting.


But right now in this place and time we ARE 3D and all beauty and wonder that it means and holds. Don’t spend your life hating this existence and wishing you were in another dimension or timeline. Grass is always greener on the other side don’t you know.

I didn’t see anyone on this thread hating existence. Again, you projected that. When you create these dramatic statements, it seems you really have no interest in speaking with integrity. You have something you find frustrating and you're using this particular thread to vent.

How hard was it to come on a thread and speak like you did? How hard was it to point out that much of what takes place beyond the 3D is impossible to prove?
I think your post was unfair. Some of us have a lot to share through our own experiences. I understand there is a sect of people who don't want information from anyone but scientists. I honor that. Please honor those of us who wish to do our own research and report back. You may just find we have value on this board.

Nice post Pilotsimone ... i see a bit of a different spin on it myself, but i do agree with most of what you are saying here ... and i can certainly appreciate you wanting to speak from a place of sharing your direct experiences rather than create more elitism by needing everything proven with science.

Personally though, i didn't see Blufire projecting. The OP states
"Maybe people will be spread out amongst the 3rd and 4th dimentional realities depending on their vibration." to me this does mean that the higher someone is vibrating, the higher they will go when they 'ascend'. Maybe it is my own projection here as well, but the OP seems to be pointing to spiritual elitism.

My understanding of projection is it is when someone takes a comment overly personally because they are in denial of a 'shortcoming' within themselves that the other person touches on. Usually something that they would rather not address head on, and prefer to keep it buried and hidden because they are attached to their 'special' picture of themself. For example if i say to you "i think you are stupid because you are an apple" you would simply say "i am sorry you are mistaken, i am not an apple."

If on some level you have a strong aversion to apples, and you have a personal identification to that aversion, my comment about apples would bother you. you would then react when i said those words about apples, and try to defend yourself, or even attack me, to get me to move away from talking about apples. If you are in denial about an aversion to apples, and try to cover that up with talking about how special oranges are, then it would bother you even more if i start talking about apples, or saying that you are an apple.

To me that is projection. And really, i don't know that anyone can really tell if another person is projecting or not. It can be hard to tell if someone is taking something personally or not. I think you can only tell if you yourself is reacting to something that someone else said. Being honest with yourself (and accepting of yourself as you are) is the way to go IMO.

[starsha]

Letting go of seeking for 'better' higher and more, is the only way to actually embrace what is here now ... and live life as it is ... and see things as they really are. I think the reason so few want to do this is because this makes us realize and face our limitations, and the ego would rather be 'above all that'.

Thank you, you just nailed it! Right here. Most still believe there are limitations. Or rather ego keeps playing this song to you. I promise, promise, promise this is a fallacy. There are no limitations. You just have to learn to master these gifts. You have everything you need. Do the work and find out for yourselves. Practice alchemy, meditate, work with entheogens. There are so many tools at your disposal.

Resist doing the work and your frustration/confusion will not only continue, it will compound. Trust me. I used to learn everything the hard way. :)


I really do wish to put good energy into this thread. I hope I am.

Thanks Pilotsimone :) But i didn't mean face your limitations in the sense that there are none.

Everyone has limitations, and there is nothing wrong with that! Personally i think it would be more 'positive' to say yes you do have limitations, but you are still worthy of love and appreciation, just exactly as you are. Trying to maintain that there are no limitations puts a lot of pressure on people, and just encourages a further denial of it. Which leads to more seeking, more projecting, and more defending. IMO.

I mean really. If you stop right now, and say

"i am worthy of love, appreciation, and acceptance .... right now, just as i am, limitations and all."

Doesn't that feel more honest than to say

"there are no limitations to being human" ?

Though perhaps i am misunderstanding you and we are actually saying the same thing with different words. If so just ignore me. :)

[norman]

These long rehearsed arguments are nuts. It's class war and snobbery.

Only the blessed rich say it's not about money.

Only the angry can forgive.

Only the snobs say, you don't understand.


Ever wonder where the idea of division came from, folks? Some go to lower 5th, some go to higher 5th, jeezz, sounds like the same old same old to me.

My Mother came from a family of house service people. That is, doing and fetching for well -ooff people. My Dad came from a mountain farming family who scratched a living on their own. I tell you, they were Chalk n Cheese. So totally different in every way. Never should have got together, unless it was to create me.

You can live in the "higher" place and find yourself serving and being barked at. You can livew in the "lower" place and be your own master. Ok, you might even be luckier than that.

But, don't just assume that the higher place is a better deal, especially if you get there by fancying it too much in the first place.

[king anthony]

...i would call it 'spiritual' ego or spiritual arrogance...

Again, this elevates human beings to something more then what is.

***POST EDIT***

The word "spirit" has a traditional meaning to most; even if the word is used to mean something different, it will more then likely be interpreted as something based on a traditional "belief system".


...Do the work and find out for yourselves...

Exactly.

[fox.mulder]

...when the shift occurs... go to the same place when they acend... each dimension there are also muliple dimensions and realities that you exist on... vibration.

I say, what is this shift that is continuously spoken of!? There is no shift that was, is or will be - there has been, is now and will be change. The thought and discussion of accession is for "feel good" based on emotion and the descriptive phrase some/many use to describe this "feel good" is "it resonates with me".

Throughout history, religions have been used to deceive the masses, keeping fact/truth from them; as well, disciplined those who worship to be unconditionally subservient regardless if the master, such as "those others", is present in numbers.

Those who worship, in the traditional sense, have a belief that they will be taken to the "kingdom of heaven" and hardly ever ask "and then what". Knowing why human beings are by seeking, finding and accepting fact/truth is key to understanding "and then what".

I say, be careful what one asks for, for they might just get it.

Others who do not share the same type of belief system as stated above, spend their days in discussion of past lives and diverting responsibility of now to another life or existence in another dimension - as if this is.

Is this not human ego/arrogance that has made human beings into something more then what they are - while implying and imposing that there is some sort of right of passage to go elsewhere even when failure is!?

I say to all, be grounded in thought and body for this is who you are - (re)learn to think with clarity, objectively, logically and enjoy the human experience of emotion in its proper time and place. Lest, what has been over and over will continue to be again and again.

Is this a place for the promotion of feel good or a place for the promotion of facts and truths?

It is a place of feel good. I got banned for openning peoples eyes to all possibilities despite how ugly they might be. PA has the potential to be a great place to rid the crap of the world but it too is a religion. You have a guru that is infallible to doing anything bad where everyone clicks the thanks button every time this guru sneezes. You have a few select elders that regularly post and also receive such thanks and praise. Then you get the person who challenges such beliefs who then gets persecuted and removed from speaking.

I Want To Believe

FM

[pilotsimone]

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[dddanieljjjamesss]

this is happening all the time, in every moment, always

[starsha]

Now, about the pressure you think many might feel... I do understand what you are saying here. I don't know the answer to that. It's human nature to worry, especially right now when nothing makes sense. I don't feel right holding back what information I have because someone else might feel pressure though. I don't feel it's irresponsible of me to post what I do considering this IS Project Avalon. These are supposed to be the awakened people. If I don't share it here, then where to share?



OK i am understanding you more now, thanks for clarifying. :)

The type of pressure i am referring to is more subtle than that. And i am the same as you, i have discovered a way to release that pressure ... and in my excitement about it, want to share what i have found with others. What i have found is that through self love and acceptance, and letting things BE as they are, that pressure melts. A space opens up where natural change can happen. When we can relax into the moment, and accept what is, we are more willing to own our shortcomings, and see them clearly for what they are so that we can then overcome them.

i hear you that all limitations are self imposed (i don't 100% agree) but to a person who is not yet willing or able to really see what you are saying here, they need to be able to start somewhere. And i feel that the only place you can start from is where you actually are here and now.

I agree with what you are saying about wanting to share what you have discovered, and i honor that 100%, but you can't expect all people to receive what you have to say in the way you want them to receive it. Even within the parameters that Bill has placed here for us all, there needs to be room for disagreement, otherwise people can't speak openly and freely and get to the bottom of things, or get to their own clarity.

i think J.K Rowling says it best ...


“Really Hagrid, if you are holding out for universal popularity, I'm afraid you will be in this cabin for a very long time" ― Dumbledore :)

That doesn't mean we can't be respectful to each other, but there is also the element of perception and projection that comes into play in these types of conversation. I liked Blufires post and thought it was straightforward, direct and honest. You didn't like it, and found it insulting. So who is projecting and who is not? Each of us has to make that call for ourselves.

[pilotsimone]

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[starsha]

Thank you for the conversation, starsha! You give me a lot to ponder. I look forward to hearing more from you on here. :)

Same to you Pilotsimone :)

[blufire]

I have hesitated to respond to your posts pilotsimone because of the level of intensity I seem to have provoked, as well as, my initial (very 3D human) response to want to correct you on several accusations you made directly and indirectly on who you assume I am.

I do feel however there are a couple things I would like to flesh out a bit more using some of your posts. I apologize because I don’t know how to do the multipost thing and I’m in the process of canning apple butter and a bit pressed for time and so I’m going to do the cut and paste thing.

You said:
You just have to learn to master these gifts. You have everything you need. Do the work and find out for yourselves. Practice alchemy, meditate, work with entheogens. There are so many tools at your disposal

And:

These are strange times. I don't think I'm doing anyone any favors by playing down our strengths and pretending dimensional travel is pie in the sky. It's not. And I just told everyone how to start...work with sacred geometry, meditate, and use entheogens.


This is what I meant when I said the ability to reach other dimensions or attain “higher” levels of consciousness should be available to everyone or for me it is not truth. You said we should practice alchemy and work with entheogens . . . . then for me this cannot be truth or the way to achieve higher consciousness because for one these things are not available to every soul on the planet and more importantly these esoterical methods are extremely dangerous and easily misunderstood

Every woman, man and child from the African plains to the coldest Artic region intuitively knows the collective is there and visit everyday they just don’t know it . . . . but their soul does.

I am a muti-generational herbalist and I have studied in Belize and Guatemala under the Mayan people. I have worked very hands on with entheogens starting with harvesting them directly from the rain forest. But it is because of a very spiritual experience with a very old Guatemalan Indian woman I have never used any of them . . . I haven’t “had” too.

I owned a herbal and natural healing shop before I moved here to the Appalachians and every week I would receive calls or people would come in or even track me down at my farm asking for entheogens and other herbs that are dangerous or borderline dangerous and I would turn them away. I could have made a great deal of money. But because of my experience in the rain forests my understanding became much much deeper.

You mentioned we here on PA are supposedly all awakened and that simply is not true. Those of us who choose to post then take on a very deep responsibility. Thousands of guests come to PA every day and are not awakened but are searching, as well as, there are very young members or older for that matter that have only began the process. For you to (I humbly feel) suggest these dangerous very difficult to understand methods to these very naïve people is irresponsible.


Okay on the 3D human comments I made. There is a definite “feel” throughout PA of not wanting to be 3D. Many here want to jump now to other dimensions or can’t wait for this one to end . . . ..

You said:

Resist doing the work and your frustration/confusion will not only continue, it will compound. Trust me. I used to learn everything the hard way.

And:

Make clearing out your old baggage your number one priority. When something comes up, choose any fear processing exercise and release it. It's pretty simple. It just takes time.

And:

Now, there's not to say there isn't a process to remembering. You have to rid yourself of your old identity (old fears/pains need to move out of your body). Clean house, so to speak, so you are clear to receive more information.
This is the way I feel it too. But, certainly you can understand not all people will be on the same path, at the same point. Some have more baggage to purge than others, it's all very individual. I have been purging for almost three years. Some have more fear, so it will take longer.

I DO understand mostly what you are saying here and the context these conversations are generally under. I am coming from a very different way of thinking . . . .I find it hard to engage in the new age philosophies so therefore I’m often misunderstood.

Instead of shedding all these things we deem as negative and undesirable as 3D how about we learn to integrate them fully. We live in a dualistic dimension meaning we are a complex amalgam of opposite and dual emotions and states of being. Good/bad dark/light positive/negative happy/sad love/hate. If you strive to shed yourself of the parts you deem bad or negative or “baggage” then in essence you are ridding yourself of the parts that in the end will balance you completely.

Why do we insist on making things so difficult and confusing??

Being 3D for me means lovin’ the good and bad parts about myself . . . . .there is a reason we have all these complexities . . . . it is part of the journey while in this 3D place.

I understand that in the New Age religion that it is the belief that the “good” emotions or states of being vibrate higher and faster (generalizing here) and that is what allows you to travel to other dimensions or when we “shift” those who have “put in the work” and rid themselves of the bad stuff will be the ones allowed to the higher or better dimensions and be “brilliant points of light” (sounds a lot like heaven doesn’t it ??) I simply don’t buy into it because that means there will be billions and billions of souls who I guess will be sitting on a toad stool stuck here on 3D Earth.

By the way I have a bumper sticker on my pickup that says “Knee Deep In Shift” . . . . although most people think it says I’m knee deep in S**t . . . .well that’ll work too.

[starsha]

i hear you that all limitations are self imposed (i don't 100% agree) but to a person who is not yet willing or able to really see what you are saying here, they need to be able to start somewhere. And i feel that the only place you can start from is where you actually are here and now.

I have to post when I'm led to post. What can I say about that? If you read through my posts, you will notice I'm not someone who loves to hear themselves talk. I try very hard to post only when I have something of value to add and my body/intuition agrees. I think that's all we can ask of anyone. I know for sure it will absorbed by those it will benefit and repelled by those it won't. Trying to figure out when to post (using all rational thinking and logic) is less effective for me now.

I figured that's how it worked for you, and i certainly didn't think you were posting to hear yourself talk. I can be guilty of this sometimes i am sure, talking/writing (to hear myself talk) helps me get to clarity ... but for the most part, this above example you illustrated is how it works for me too. And also for the most part my posts have the intention of love behind them, i really do think at the end of the day, all we are trying to say to each other is "hey, i care." :)


Starsha says ... I agree with what you are saying about wanting to share what you have discovered, and i honor that 100%, but you can't expect all people to receive what you have to say in the way you want them to receive it.


pilotsimone says .... The original poster on this thread was asking about something completely interesting. Because Blufire found this topic (dimensions) confusing and frustrating, he chose to rant in generalizations and insults. He was completely out of integrity and I pointed it out. He claims to want cohesion, but he makes posts that repel. Had Blufire started this thread and posted his rant, I would have ignored it completely. I would understand he is venting. They are a dime a dozen on here. The OP, however, was here for something better. I'm fine with Blufire choosing to derail. Everyone else needs to be fine with me trying to steer it back on track. :) Allow. Allow. Allow. Good lessons we are getting here. lol.

Thank you for the conversation, starsha! You give me a lot to ponder. I look forward to hearing more from you on here. :)

I meant no attack on the OP at all myself ... and my comments were similar to Blufires. My intention was simply to get to a deeper clarity on this subject. And i agree with what you say that if he is allowed to express his view, you should be allowed to steer it back. I would just also add that in you dishing out your words of wisdom and observations toward Blufire ... you also should expect to take it in return. (which i might add you did very gracefully) :)



...i would call it 'spiritual' ego or spiritual arrogance...

Again, this elevates human beings to something more then what is.

***POST EDIT***

The word "spirit" has a traditional meaning to most; even if the word is used to mean something different, it will more then likely be interpreted as something based on a traditional "belief system".



Yeah Anthony, i figured that's what you meant, but thank you for clarifying this. I meant to point to how the ego operates within the areas of religion and spirituality when i said 'spiritual ego,' i didn't mean it in the context of having 2 egos. :) (not that the ego is a 'thing' but you know what i mean) :) I see your point, wading through the maze of belief systems is indeed a tricky thing.
This is the very reason why i appreciate the directness with which you speak. (same goes for Bluefires post)

[king anthony]

FYI - I have the Avalon Knight style chosen - it has a dark background and the default for the post boxes are a dark grey - normally, the print is white. When people override the color it remains that color, thus the chosen style will not convert the print color to match the style. The blue used is difficult to see on a dark grey background; it is not my monitor, as it is a very big widescreen, HDMI and my "card" is awesome.

[starsha]

FYI - I have the Avalon Knight style chosen - it has a dark background and the default for the post boxes are a dark grey - normally, the print is white. When people override the color it remains that color, thus the chosen style will not convert the print color to match the style. The blue used is difficult to see on a dark grey background; it is not my monitor, as it is a very big widescreen, HDMI and my "card" is awesome.


Good to know ... i have changed my blue font back to black for you :)

[9eagle9]

The russian scientist Dr. Stankov says that some people will go to the lower 5th dimension others who have done more soul work will go to the higher 5th dimension. He says that the lower 5th is still material so you will have a body by default, while the higher is purely ethereal. The entire concept of dimensions as it is used by the new age community is really confusing anyway as it does not correspond the scientific understanding of dimensions, which are primarily physical in nature. I find the concept of density to e better when refering to states of consciousness.


Keeping to mind that a 'dimension' is a unit of measurement how does one go or ascend into a unit of measurement. Are we going to Dimension Length. Or Planet Depth?

A scientist should be the first to understand a dimension is not a place. Dimension indicates a measurement or value....in this context it means a measurement of density. Like the 4dimension has a certain density that is much lighter than the 3d dimension . When something is less dense, its 'lighter' . Light. Not light bulb light, or glowing light. Things that are lighter RISE or ....ASCEND.

We know these things. Really we do. Until some mystical 'scientist' comes along and tells us otherwise. And discarding everything that we know...we believe them.

Stick with what you know people.

The value of dimension has not changed. Or light. Or ascending.

We changed it to suit our tastes. Or perhaps by altering known values makes us sound 'mystical' and intune ...to what though? That the soul needs work? Okay and these are the same people in the next breath will tell you that the soul is perfect. Two opposing values. And we wonder why WE don't know what's going on.

[king anthony]

...And we wonder why WE don't know what's going on.

Well said... now can you tell me... how do I get to where I'm going... I lost my map. :)

[pilotsimone]

deleted post

[laughs-last]

In this I go with the little green dude, on panning the future threads too much.

'A Jedi must have the deepest commitment, the most serious mind. This one a long time have I watched. All his life has he looked away... to the future, to the horizon. Never his mind on where he was. Hmm? What he was doing. Hmph. Adventure. Heh. Excitement. Heh. A Jedi craves not these things.'

sure have a peek every so often if you can, checking the map so to speak. if you keep reading the map you'll miss all the scenery. focus on the moment its so much fun, I leave the BIG THINGS to, well that would be telling :) don't listen to me 'I know nothing'

BIG LOVE HUGZ AND SMELLY SWAMPS :jester:

[Mu2143]

The russian scientist Dr. Stankov says that some people will go to the lower 5th dimension others who have done more soul work will go to the higher 5th dimension. He says that the lower 5th is still material so you will have a body by default, while the higher is purely ethereal. The entire concept of dimensions as it is used by the new age community is really confusing anyway as it does not correspond the scientific understanding of dimensions, which are primarily physical in nature. I find the concept of density to be better when refering to states of consciousness.

Indeed new age is to create confusion and a belief system. Keeps you destracted from the real problem.. They talk about dimension with any understanding . First of all the body where in right now is manipulated to be what we are not so we belief mainstream science. What you should know is
We live in a physical hologram that is just as pyhsical if it is in a higher dimension. Our pyshical reality is created out of 5 spiritual dimensions and our bodies expresses 7 dimensions from the spirtual reality, but because we lost our light (Kickout of heaven not physical ,but the spirit) they could manipulated our DNA to makes us weak and wicked.

Because our DNA + water acts like a crystal you as a spiritual being have created another body(higher/lower self). The only way to get back being a spiritual being again is that you go against the things of this fleshy body (Repent ,back to heart). This is a process that takes time to get back ,because you have to rebuild your new self. (No duality). And you think why is that ,because there is a demonic spirit in every HU-MAN body ,causing you to do the things you normaly would not do.

[laughs-last]

Go with the flow, its tricky but you can't be in control of everything, however you can become aware that you are part of everything; viva the unity! For what other reason do we have brain that we only use a small part of, if it wasn't supposed to be upraded, or rather restored to its original capacity. Enjoy the change, keep positive and avoid dual thinking. Grab your metaphysical surf board and ride the surf, don't get caught in the wave.

BIG LOVE HUGS AND KAHUNAS :jester:

[Hughe]

Human is a projection of an universe. There are many universes also. This is my definition of human being at the moment.

Show me some scientific numbers I can guess about density. Will they do? It's absurd so many people buy into 3D, 4D, 5D dimensions/denstities whatever.

I'm a believer of all matter exits in hyperdimensional world. Modern sciences are heading into that direction. The cutting edge theory of all, the string theory, comes up with 11 dimensional universe. It's a theory not proven laws yet. In mathematics, the 4D cube contains eight 3D cubes, which means a space can house eight parallel 3D spaces just by adding one dimension.

Everybody knows 2D cube, a square. ;)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3e/2-cube.svg/600px-2-cube.svg.png

4D cube
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dd/4-cube_graph.svg/600px-4-cube_graph.svg.png

You can check out how 11th world will look like in 3D perspective. It's just pure mathematical view though.
cbprfcSVcyQ

11D cube (11 dimensions)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/ca/11-cube.svg/600px-11-cube.svg.png

The startling, dangerous yet mysterious fact is all our knowledge especially sciences and technologies are based on few axioms - pseudo truths that humans define as truth. Adding one or two axioms in the system will change everything at subatomic levels. The irony is most humans, 99.999999% of scientists only stick to traditional paradigm. Why? I don't know. As an individual even to grasp this limited collective knowledge is impossible.

If one goes deep along this nature of "uncertainty", "imperfection" caused by human perception, it will create a grand perspective that "Everything is illusion!" What a simplistic version of understanding? At some point I was in that weird zone. Mind - non-physical - is everything? By simply changing perspective of my view in reality, I go into a heavenly place from hell? Well, it does make sense too. You know about Quantum theory that matter exists in probability, there is no separation between matter and human consciousness. Furthermore, our mind is a result of complex electro-chemical reaction of trillions of neuron in brain.
Again, adding electromagnetic wave is the only medium in our universe then our universe itself can be a complete illusion. I personally learned depending on only one theory of everything is dangerous. Part of me always tell me life is much more than what we have discovered, projected.

The big problem modern humans need to solve is we completely lost from the past as a species. Considering multimillion years of human existence, we barely have less than 10,000 years of memory. 10,000 year is 1% of 1,000,000 year. Where is 99.9999% of our collective memory? As we moves back the time to past, our knowledge gets smaller.

Putting alien and human interaction theory opens up unknown area. I get lost in a vast universe. LOL. Most people tend to stand on solid platform. I prefer to keep floating in open space. I wish I have another set of eyes often so that one set is exhausted I put in recovery mode.


Is it possible that realities for people will split within different dimensions?
My answer is yes. Even the same dimensional world, i.e. 3D material Earth, we have different lives. My reality is totally different than people close to me who shares same space and timeline.

To me Earth is like a military boot camp for certain souls in our universe. More and more humans reveal their non-human identity these days. Earth is a weird planet for sure. I know I'll have to keep learning and moving not to be rotten in dead river.

[king anthony]

Indeed new age is to create confusion and a belief system. Keeps you destracted from the real problem... We live in a physical hologram that is just as pyhsical if it is in a higher dimension... ...Because our DNA + water acts like a crystal you as a spiritual being have created another body(higher/lower self)... ...because there is a demonic spirit in every HU-MAN body ,causing you to do the things you normaly would not do.

I say, by pointing the finger in your opening line, you have set the foundation to have three fingers pointing back at yourself. I say, human beings are flesh and blood and to understand this is to know and accept why human beings are.

Step out of the feel-good and seek this information yourselves for conformation. There is no demonic spirit; however, there are "those others" who have the ability to project... {I stopping in thought}


...For what other reason do we have brain that we only use a small part of, if it wasn't supposed to be upraded, or rather restored to its original capacity...

I say, the reason why human intelligence and the brain itself (and body) is limited, is by the design of some of "those others". To know, understand and accept this is to know, understand and accept the purpose of human existence, which is not about... {I stopping in thought}


Human is a projection of an universe. There are many universes also... ...More and more humans reveal their non-human identity these days...

I say, human beings are... {I stopping in thought}


Comment to all - general statement

{My shaking my head while in thought}..."ya know", I say - believe whatever it is that makes one feel-good - use common law arguments to be free, send love-and-light to... {I pause in thought} why not, for the value of the human species is truly reflected in the words (and actions) of most. I now remain silent in this thread.

[Mu2143]

Indeed new age is to create confusion and a belief system. Keeps you destracted from the real problem... We live in a physical hologram that is just as pyhsical if it is in a higher dimension... ...Because our DNA + water acts like a crystal you as a spiritual being have created another body(higher/lower self)... ...because there is a demonic spirit in every HU-MAN body ,causing you to do the things you normaly would not do.

I say, by pointing the finger in your opening line, you have set the foundation to have three fingers pointing back at yourself. I say, human beings are flesh and blood and to understand this is to know and accept why human beings are.

Step out of the feel-good and seek this information yourselves for conformation. There is no demonic spirit; however, there are "those others" who have the ability to project... {I stopping in thought}



This is exactly what the demon wants you to belief that you do not have to change so you have the feeling to be in a comfort zone.

People aren't saying it for nothing that we have to repent!! you have a cold blooded killer stuck in your head in a another dimension!!!where born lyers !!

They speak in the bible of the beast that is going to kill!!! guess who that is.... us if we do not turn away from this wicked way ...The mark of the BEAST is the mark of a MAN.

[starsha]

Thank you for your response, Blufire. I sincerely appreciate the time you took to help me understand you better.

I also want to thank you because your post was a trigger for me. I have a real problem accepting my own side that generalizes and lumps people together without much thought (when I'm frustrated and feeling intolerant). So, your post brought up some anger. What you actually meant was irrelevant since I already had my own 'filter' on it. If that makes sense.



Yep ... it makes perfect sense :)

[pilotsimone]

deleted post

[starsha]

starsha, I'm am really enjoying figuring out all of these triggers lately! People are going to start getting annoyed with me posting thanks to them for p*ssing me off. LOL.

I love fear processing! :becky:

haha! i know exactly what you mean, lol!

[DeDukshyn]

Is it possible that when the shift occurs that not everyone will go to the same place when they acend. Because within each dimension there are also muliple dimensions and realities that you exist on. Maybe people will be spread out amongst the 3rd and 4th dimentional realities depending on there vibration.

12 main timelines will branch out according to some. This begins to occur after the "split" (according to Inelia the split has already started). In many prophesies (certainly Christian) there is the talk of people "disappearing" in a "rapture" of sorts. This may just well be a symbol of the split or filtering of timelines. I will die on every timeline I am not attuned with and live on in the one I am attuned with. Again, this is just musings based on a conglomeration of religious prophesy, metaphysics, vibrational physics, and a little imagination ... but unless you understand string theory and advanced physics - you can call it whatever you want. Magic maybe ;-)

¤=[Post Update]=¤



...when the shift occurs... go to the same place when they acend... each dimension there are also muliple dimensions and realities that you exist on... vibration.

I say, what is this shift that is continuously spoken of!? ...

The shift from fear based decision making to love based decision making, the shifting away from ego centered thought to love centered thought ... er, where have you been? Surely you understand these concepts? "Reality" truly does change when this shift truly occurs within you. Mine did, and there is more shifting yet for me to do - looking forward to it - the new age labels are just labels for describing certain things - I prefer a more logical and scientific view of looking at it, myself.

[sshenry]

I don't get the sense we'll go to some particular dimension and stay there. My guess...the shift simply allows us to move between them (lower 4th & higher) depending on how you hold your vibration. I'm already moving between them and so are many others.

Thank you!

I see it (in my head) as the 'reality' of the chakra system. Each chakra being an 'anchor' to it's cooresponding reality.

3D is actually a necessary dimension for some work - it is EASIER in the higher dimensions, but some can only be done here :)

¤=[Post Update]=¤


People already have split realities, alternate realities, different perceptions (which is what reality is based in how we process it or not process it) and access to multidimensional expressions so I'm not sure why that would change. Its very much up to the individual. It's a given that we create our own reality, so it doesn't seem strange to me that people would be divided or choose different realitys. Whether those realities are truthful, or non illusionary, is again up to the invidual.

LOL, some of us have to deal with multiples at the same time, lol. Good to see you posting again :)

[king anthony]

Surely you understand these concepts?

I say, I do understand and thus my question still stands.

[king anthony]

This is exactly what the... ...the bible... ... a MAN.

I say, I do not have the luxury of belief or "comfort zone", for I do not rely on fiction, conveniently pre-packaged to give false empowerment. I say, many do not know who they pray to, defend or what they ask for - for one follows simply because of feel-good.

[Lifebringer]

I know we get a choice as we are free will creations and they also said they will not intervene without permission from us, however it really isn't in their hands, but by the Source/God will, i think.

At least that is what I gathered from in the channelings and communication on YouTube while the PTW were distracted with stopping Barack Obama from getting in and having to wait for another Republican, to finish all democracies and rule them with Central printing press/banks.

I voted yes for them to get them out of here. I've been saying it over and over, but also said if they could redeem them show mercy in a start or do over to get the right lessons this time.
Who knows, maybe they will come back born in a poor black mother in a red nazi type state, and have to face the discrimination?
Just saying, karmetic justice.

[DeDukshyn]

Surely you understand these concepts?

I say, I do understand and thus my question still stands.

Then the anser to that question is .. whatever answer is right for you.

[king anthony]

Then the anser to that question is .. whatever answer is right for you.

I say, the social conditioning that is, has falsely empowered most, with such nonsense as everyone is correct and that everything is an opinion.

[eileenrose]

Lots happening on this thread.

One thing I noted, for myself, is I don't feel this dimension idea, of a fifth dimension and we enter it, holds water.
I think it is just another channeling idea. So I will do some research (intuitively).
I only say this because I realized yesterday I had bought into the idea that the world or parts of it were in danger. I must
have picked up these ideas while reading a bunch of forums over the past few years (I was an avid channeler reader)....as I havn't had
in intuitive foreknowledge of any 'end of planet/human civilization' causes for concern, issues.

Yes we are hearing, from a few sources (which we don't know are certain or accurate), that the world is out of cash. And that people we are
referring to in mass as TPTB exist and therefore want us dead. But is it true, partially true or not true? I don't know.
I can say there are military types that exist (we see them) and that people like warfare (see that) and that we each of us individually keep
this game afloat (by sending our children to their 'education' centers so they can 'help their society').

I will say we probably were better off staying on farms (rather than going into the cities and trying out their form of 'schooling').

If there is anyone to blame, it would be ourselves (in all of this current uprising issues and lost money issues).

[DeDukshyn]

Then the anser to that question is .. whatever answer is right for you.

I say, the social conditioning that is, has falsely empowered most, with such nonsense as everyone is correct and that everything is an opinion.

You're right, silly me thinking you might be correct.

Edit: That sounded way more rude than I intended it (but within contest I think you may understand) ... but curious to hear response if you have one ... ;) ;)

[Intraphase]

A discussion on the dynamics of group destiny verses individual destiny.
First conflict is The Eternal Vs. The Infinite which I translate in 3D as Liberty Vs. Equality.
People avoid duality because it says to them "now is a decision node" when actually we jump back and forth constantly between those ideals.

Beings are narratives of information processing information they are part of The Eternal if they choose Continuity in The Continuum.
Fabrics are information traveling inwards and outwards along "the point becomes a sphere" geometry of the event horizon original position and its outward moving position.

Information processing information = Being-Presence
Information traveling round trips = Becoming-Essence

The continuum is event horizons interacting creating time by information traveling instantaneously between horizons creating computational drag-vacumn pressure.

If the key conflict is The Eternal verses The Infinite translated as Liberty verses Equality then many decision states and sets would form complex strategy outlooks.
As to limitless abilities, the only limit is ones management skills regarding simple ways of managing complex processes that create the environment the artist seeks. Here in dreamscape Earth the tilt is towards Equality with Liberty because that is what gets press, followers, adherents and partners in a creative endeavor.
Whereas in Liberty the measure is more on self reliance and building and storing world construction tool sets.

Similar to the other thread on "Clear Channels" the onus of proof of the existence of a "Clear Channel" is on the operator of the channel in question.
I work my own systems and the need to prove that to others doesn't enter the equation unless their is a malfunction between the filters and barriers that cause me to be a unique information process (being) and other unique information processes (beings). On the clock I use to construct systems I see a magor event every 25 years, with many lesser events along the way.

I believe in both points of view about seizing the beauty of the 3D construct were in and glorying in its beauty and raw power while staying cognizant and aware of the unlimited potential to construct other forms styles and catalogues of tools that are required for the next stage of information management. I prefer to call the totality of it all a continuum of constructs and probabilities rather than an illusion or virtual reality.

On a personal note I am a Libra so I get off on abstract dualities.
I also could never be abducted because my fleet of ships is substantial
If you need proof I suggest you write a few weeks prior to November 17 2064.
Until then enjoy 3D university dreamscape Earth and don't envy those who come and go as they please because we have responsibilities to cause and effect as free will forming elaborate feedback loops in the free will creates destiny and destiny creates free will duality of choices.

I get the point though of the other side (concrete) of the argument.
I consider the Sun Earth and Moon as personal friends who I feel gratitude towards. Looking on the other side of infinite possibility why would anyone gain extraordinary skills in dealing with the continuum other than to build or help build and facilitate a populated world of individuals interacting within free will's domain of, speed regulated-related, cause and effect ratios.

I admit the drama gets thick and involving towards being tempting at times.
The sorting of processes seems ongoing and the chaos based power addicts seem to have reached the limits of cause and effects ability to stay stable and they are crumbling from within, hence some people predisposition to create internal structures based on their own unique "benign" desire to let things happen around them instead of happening to them in the ultra personal way.


I am here now in this world to restore my own personal balance between Truth and Love with Truth requiring added weight instead of removing weight from the Love side of the balance. Ultimately I built all new tools and clocks and scale balances - transformers and barrier systems (ships) to adapt to shifting
realities. I chose not to reduce my capacity for Love (justice protecting mercy)
and instead upgrade my ability to manage Truth as accurate descriptions of freedom and responsibility interacting as cause and effect learning processes.

Red = Point / Metallic = Sphere :tinfoil3::tinfoil3::tinfoil3:
A demotivational gag on prime forms as hokey blather.
A ironic version of the funnier aspects of artifact creation.
The point to line to circle to spiral to sphere to spiral to circle to line to point.

http://cdn.loleasy.com/pics/1560-o.jpg

[Camilo]

Is it possible that when the shift occurs that not everyone will go to the same place when they acend. Because within each dimension there are also muliple dimensions and realities that you exist on. Maybe people will be spread out amongst the 3rd and 4th dimentional realities depending on there vibration.

I firmly believe that's what 2012 is all about, creator is giving us the opportunity to co-create with the universe the reality we want to live in, as this is a universe of infinite possibilities, and when the split of this reality into multilpe new ones occur at the end of the year, we all end up in the one we created, Isn't this wonderful?.......thoughts become things, so choose the right ones.

[Intraphase]

...And we wonder why WE don't know what's going on.

Well said... now can you tell me... how do I get to where I'm going... I lost my map. :)

You funny!
That is how we get there.
Toss the old map and methodically draw another.

I shall toss this into the mix.
Occasionally the "Keys To The City" go missing.
It seems like a game of button button "Who's" got the button.
And it is because The Who-God is a very subtle being who loves life.


A bit from Bohm

Part 2 A Map And City Share Info as The Abstract


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EY_m4Aasp18&feature=player_embedded
All six parts are online at youtube by clicking into the link at left corner.

Bohm: We acually make up everything, in the sense that all these theories are made up by us, but in these theories we place the parts, we may either place the parts as fundamental or the whole as fundamental. Now quantum mechanics is placing the whole as fundamental, that’s I think the most basic change it makes. Finally every theory is made up by us and we’re going to see if we can apply it coherently to reality. I think we could make an infinity of different kinds of theories and some of them would be more coherent than others. For example somebody mentally disturbed has another theory which we think is incoherent but to him it looks coherent, right. Because we can always ignore what is not working, we say we’ll solve that later.

Interviewer: Just just said that in reality we make it all up, not just the parts but also the whole. Could you explain that?

Bohm: Well, I think that that’s the question. What is the relationship of theory to reality. Now one view is that it reflects reality, that it corresponds to reality. Now I think that a view is only limited, like a map is said to correspond to a city. But there is nothing in the map that corresponds to anything in the city. But there is nothing in the map that corresponds to anything in the city, on the map you see dots and prints which is vaguely defined and the city is also vaguely defined. So what corresponds is certain abstractions that we abstract. But the map, the real test of the map is that it guides us correctly through the city. And if it is a wrong map we will find incoherence in our action, right. Now ..

Interviewer: But it’s not that you can compare this bit of the map, this bit of the city ..

Bohm: Well, only in a rough sense. That’s an abstraction. You can compare it, but it’s abstract. Therefore we make it all up, the question is how coherent is it when we try to make it work. That’s really the key. Now some theories are more coherent than others, but it’s often hard to tell. Because when we come to a theory as broad as a worldview, we find it very hard to detect incoherence because the worldview tends to state that things that don’t fit or are irrelevant or else says we’re gonna get them in order later, we haven’t solved that problem yet. So incoherence can easily be not noticed.

But if people are very, and also people would like not to have their worldviews questioned because they got used to them and feel comfortable with them. So therefore it’s very hard to question a worldview.

Interviewer: But in effect, that’s what you are doing?

Bohm: Yes.

Interviewer: And in effect you are questioning the whole western worldview?

Bohm: Yes, well I think all the worldviews have to be questioned. The eastern, the western. You see the west implicitly questioned the eastern worldview. Every worldview, I think, is limited. But I think the western worldviews limits have not been seen. And we need to go to a broader view, not necessary back to the eastern, though it may include some of the eastern. I think we need a kind of dialogue of these worldviews to go to something beyond.

Interviewer: Where do you see the limits of the western worldview?

Bohm: Well, just in the way that it focuses to much on analysis and it tends to lead to fragmentation. Now what I mean by fragmentation is not just division, distinction, because the parts and the whole are correlative concepts. A part is a part only because it’s part of the whole like a machine or a watch. Now a fragment is something you mean to break it up, to smash. So if you smash the watch you get fragments. Now the western view, it aims at getting the true parts of the universe, but in some ways perhaps it gets fragments. To some extend in physics it’s much more so, in fields like biology, psychology, sociology and so on.

Now if you brake it up falsely into fragments then you’re confused, you’re going to treat these separate when they’re not. And also you’re gonna unity what’s in the fragment when it’s not united. So it leads to confusion.

Interviewer: So in the west you confuse the part for the whole and vice versa.

Bohm: Yeah, you get confused about the part and the whole because you take a fragment as an independent whole.

Interviewer: But if you take the true whole, that includes everything. It would also include you and your perception of the whole.

Bohm: Yes.

[Humble Janitor]

Forgive me for my lack of knowledge but just how do we move between dimensions?

I find myself gravitating more towards a positive higher dimension with some of the life changes I have made over the past few months. I am transforming but into what?

[azure]

I feel like the dreamworld and the astral are varying dimensions that mesh with this one...

[Ba-ba-Ra]

Here is my interpretation: I believe all is Maya (illusion) - or a dream world as some aborigines believe.

As when we dream, everything seems real. The people, the buildings, the emotions (as when we are being threatened, etc). But then we wake up and it all goes away. As we evolve consciously we begin to have lucid dreams, where we know that we are dreaming within the dream. Again, as we evolve, we begin to realize that within the lucid dream (rather than just being the voyeur, we can begin to effect the dream by making choices and taking action), but we still wake up to what we call reality.

As we evolve from this point, we begin to realize that each state is really just another state of consciousness, some of which we have defined as reality, or dream or lucid dream ~ and then a thought begins to grow: Could what we call reality also be "woken up" from?" As we have these thoughts and we release the fear of losing 'this life, and the people and things we've acquired in it', then we begin to have glimpses into another consciousness. At this point we have acquired more ability to create, and as we begin to understand that ability we awake to the next state of consciousness.

Is there an end to these states? I don't know, I expect it's when we totally connect with Divine Intelligence.

[king anthony]

You're right, silly me thinking you might be correct.

Edit: That sounded way more rude than I intended it (but within contest I think you may understand) ... but curious to hear response if you have one ... ;) ;)

Rather then reword your comment, you let it stand and added a "disclaimer". You are curious to hear a response from me to what?




Well said... now can you tell me... how do I get to where I'm going... I lost my map.

You funny!

It was meant to be - I am glad you see it for that.


Forgive me for my lack of knowledge but just how do we move between dimensions?

I find myself gravitating more towards a positive higher dimension with some of the life changes I have made over the past few months. I am transforming but into what?

I say, there are no other dimensions; however, there are others places and as tangible as this place. To believe human beings are something more then what they are, is a belief system for feel-good - if this is what is sought, then this is what will be obtain.

[Cilka]

I feel that we ALL will ascend on this planet, and no one will have to travel to anywhere else because all the changes will occur here, on planet Earth. Why would anyone want to travel to somewhere else, when our home is right here? I think that humans will undergo the strongest positive changes, and those who do not resonate to the Earth's magnetic field, like the visiting ET's disguised as humans, will have to find a new home for themselves, and maybe those humans who will not want to adjust to the positive changes will have the choice to go along with the ET's.

[DeDukshyn]

You're right, silly me thinking you might be correct.

Edit: That sounded way more rude than I intended it (but within contest I think you may understand) ... but curious to hear response if you have one ... ;) ;)

Rather then reword your comment, you let it stand and added a "disclaimer". You are curious to hear a response from me to what?.

Correct, I chose carefully. What does that mean to you? I merely suggested that the answer you come up with is the one you seek. If you imply I am wrong than you imply little self confidence in your own answers as being valid. Herein lies the issue. IMHO. Not the other way around ... There is no absolute "rightness" -- you seem to be indicating that we are all missing the "absolute rightness" I suggest it is a figment of imagination. There are Truths and truths, but in my opinion - no standard of "rightness" that anyone must measure to. Experience is of equal validity. Thus, often personal answers are the answers that provide process, and process is goal in my opinion.

[king anthony]

Correct, I chose carefully. What does that mean to you... ...Experience is of equal validity. Thus, often personal answers are the answers that provide process, and process is goal in my opinion.

In answering "what does it mean to me", it means nothing to me. To what am I implying little self confidence with and to what have I implied you are wrong?

Social conditioning has falsely empowered this civilization in that everyone is correct, that there is more then one truth and there is nothing absolute. Have not those who imposed the said conditioning also taken away critical thinking skills, comprehension skills, logic and such, while keeping facts from the masses!?

What is this "rightness" you speak of - there is not right or wrong but rather what is and my words do not reflect a dualistic / non-dualistic fiction. At no time have I stated or implied "rightness" or "wrongness".

How can experience be equal when not all are equal, not all have experienced the same and not all have ability, despite all may having potential!? Are there not those who are more "privileged" then others on various "topics"!?

Does not a child seek the guidance from the parent or a student from a teacher!? Does not one ask from another for aid when in need!? Would it not be so, if all were equal, that these things would not be!?

I say, how would one know if another comes with knowledge, understanding and is simply attempting to share it?



The shirt and tie model: a person is wearing a shirt and tie.

Opinion - Does the shirt and tie combination go well together or not.

Theory - Is making the shirt and tie combination go well together or not.

Belief - Is the hope that one is correct in their theory of the shirt and tie combination going well together or not.

Hope - Is the impossibility of reason.

Faith - Is that someone other will agree, or disagree, with the theory or opinion that the shirt and tie combination goes well together or not.

The above said are fictions as they exist without form or evidence.

Fact - The shirt and tie remain the same despite of any fictions imposed.

Social conditioning has made it so that most cannot distinguish between the said fictions and fact. If one's process is the goal then I say, conclusion cannot be obtained as they perpetually seek and are never satisfied in gain.

To speak nonsense is of no benefit, as it complicates the uncomplicated, a luxury the human species has indulged in for some time now - something I wish not and do not.

[DeDukshyn]

Correct, I chose carefully. What does that mean to you... ...Experience is of equal validity. Thus, often personal answers are the answers that provide process, and process is goal in my opinion.

In answering "what does it mean to me", it means nothing to me. To what am I implying little self confidence with and to what have I implied you are wrong?

Social conditioning has falsely empowered this civilization in that everyone is correct, that there is more then one truth and there is nothing absolute. Have not those who imposed the said conditioning also taken away critical thinking skills, comprehension skills, logic and such, while keeping facts from the masses!?

What is this "rightness" you speak of - there is not right or wrong but rather what is and my words do not reflect a dualistic / non-dualistic fiction. At no time have I stated or implied "rightness" or "wrongness".

How can experience be equal when not all are equal, not all have experienced the same and not all have ability, despite all may having potential!? Are there not those who are more "privileged" then others on various "topics"!?

Does not a child seek the guidance from the parent or a student from a teacher!? Does not one ask from another for aid when in need!? Would it not be so, if all were equal, that these things would not be!?

I say, how would one know if another comes with knowledge, understanding and is simply attempting to share it?



The shirt and tie model: a person is wearing a shirt and tie.

Opinion - Does the shirt and tie combination go well together or not.

Theory - Is making the shirt and tie combination go well together or not.

Belief - Is the hope that one is correct in their theory of the shirt and tie combination going well together or not.

Hope - Is the impossibility of reason.

Faith - Is that someone other will agree, or disagree, with the theory or opinion that the shirt and tie combination goes well together or not.

The above said are fictions as they exist without form or evidence.

Fact - The shirt and tie remain the same despite of any fictions imposed.

Social conditioning has made it so that most cannot distinguish between the said fictions and fact. If one's process is the goal then I say, conclusion cannot be obtained as they perpetually seek and are never satisfied in gain.

To speak nonsense is of no benefit, as it complicates the uncomplicated, a luxury the human species has indulged in for some time now - something I wish not and do not.

There are no "facts" -- only agreements. Agreements that form our conditioning and this ... item ... interpreting "facts" is just as much a part of that conditioning.
And when you say "It means nothing to me." Then that is your answer with confidence - and it is valid. But it is personal to you, but still perfectly valid, despite your protests. There is no common reality.

[king anthony]

There are no "facts" -- only agreements. Agreements that form our conditioning and this ... item ... interpreting "facts" is just as much a part of that conditioning. And when you say "It means nothing to me." Then that is your answer with confidence - and it is valid. But it is personal to you, but still perfectly valid, despite your protests. There is no common reality.

I say, all may have ability but truly not all have potential and inclosing, "I wish you well".

[eileenrose]

Here is my interpretation: I believe all is Maya (illusion) - or a dream world as some aborigines believe.

As when we dream, everything seems real. The people, the buildings, the emotions (as when we are being threatened, etc). But then we wake up and it all goes away. As we evolve consciously we begin to have lucid dreams, where we know that we are dreaming within the dream. Again, as we evolve, we begin to realize that within the lucid dream (rather than just being the voyeur, we can begin to effect the dream by making choices and taking action), but we still wake up to what we call reality.

As we evolve from this point, we begin to realize that each state is really just another state of consciousness, some of which we have defined as reality, or dream or lucid dream ~ and then a thought begins to grow: Could what we call reality also be "woken up" from?" As we have these thoughts and we release the fear of losing 'this life, and the people and things we've acquired in it', then we begin to have glimpses into another consciousness. At this point we have acquired more ability to create, and as we begin to understand that ability we awake to the next state of consciousness.

Is there an end to these states? I don't know, I expect it's when we totally connect with Divine Intelligence.

This sounds accurate.
The actual experience is quite traumatic (and doesn't fit into our current level of receptivity....to just talk about....ie see the rest of this thread...which is just ignoring this option).

[DeDukshyn]

Correct, I chose carefully. What does that mean to you... ...Experience is of equal validity. Thus, often personal answers are the answers that provide process, and process is goal in my opinion.

In answering "what does it mean to me", it means nothing to me. To what am I implying little self confidence with and to what have I implied you are wrong?

Social conditioning has falsely empowered this civilization in that everyone is correct, that there is more then one truth and there is nothing absolute. Have not those who imposed the said conditioning also taken away critical thinking skills, comprehension skills, logic and such, while keeping facts from the masses!?

What is this "rightness" you speak of - there is not right or wrong but rather what is and my words do not reflect a dualistic / non-dualistic fiction. At no time have I stated or implied "rightness" or "wrongness".

How can experience be equal when not all are equal, not all have experienced the same and not all have ability, despite all may having potential!? Are there not those who are more "privileged" then others on various "topics"!?

Does not a child seek the guidance from the parent or a student from a teacher!? Does not one ask from another for aid when in need!? Would it not be so, if all were equal, that these things would not be!?

I say, how would one know if another comes with knowledge, understanding and is simply attempting to share it?



The shirt and tie model: a person is wearing a shirt and tie.

Opinion - Does the shirt and tie combination go well together or not.

Theory - Is making the shirt and tie combination go well together or not.

Belief - Is the hope that one is correct in their theory of the shirt and tie combination going well together or not.

Hope - Is the impossibility of reason.

Faith - Is that someone other will agree, or disagree, with the theory or opinion that the shirt and tie combination goes well together or not.

The above said are fictions as they exist without form or evidence.

Fact - The shirt and tie remain the same despite of any fictions imposed.

Social conditioning has made it so that most cannot distinguish between the said fictions and fact. If one's process is the goal then I say, conclusion cannot be obtained as they perpetually seek and are never satisfied in gain.

To speak nonsense is of no benefit, as it complicates the uncomplicated, a luxury the human species has indulged in for some time now - something I wish not and do not.

Allow me to try again.

Since I give very little value to those things you can touch, see, feel, read, etc. I do not share your point of view about "privileges". I live a very simple and humble life and yet I do not want things of this earth. To answer if everyone's experiences are equal - I would agree with you, they are not at all, but the issue there is assigning value to the experience based on worldly things, whereas in my reality, the true value lies in the consciousness behind those experiences, and the learning and understanding that creates more whole (holy - not in religious sense) satisfaction(<-wrong word..got stuck) of those experiences. I believe it is erroneous to assign superior value to the Items in the experience than the consciousness that has the experience.

And therefore ... I cannot share your point of view, but I understand it, and it does make sense from many perspectives.

Value of "knowledge" is not equally applied to all things for everyone. Experiences that one being has may not provide benefit for another and vice versa. My 2 cents ;)

[king anthony]

Allow me to try again... I cannot share your point of view, but I understand it, and it does make sense from many perspectives...

I say, even before reading your post, I say again - all may have ability but truly not all have potential and again I wish you well.

[Jeffrey]

Correct, I chose carefully. What does that mean to you... ...Experience is of equal validity. Thus, often personal answers are the answers that provide process, and process is goal in my opinion.

In answering "what does it mean to me", it means nothing to me. To what am I implying little self confidence with and to what have I implied you are wrong?

Social conditioning has falsely empowered this civilization in that everyone is correct, that there is more then one truth and there is nothing absolute. Have not those who imposed the said conditioning also taken away critical thinking skills, comprehension skills, logic and such, while keeping facts from the masses!?

What is this "rightness" you speak of - there is not right or wrong but rather what is and my words do not reflect a dualistic / non-dualistic fiction. At no time have I stated or implied "rightness" or "wrongness".

How can experience be equal when not all are equal, not all have experienced the same and not all have ability, despite all may having potential!? Are there not those who are more "privileged" then others on various "topics"!?

Does not a child seek the guidance from the parent or a student from a teacher!? Does not one ask from another for aid when in need!? Would it not be so, if all were equal, that these things would not be!?

I say, how would one know if another comes with knowledge, understanding and is simply attempting to share it?



The shirt and tie model: a person is wearing a shirt and tie.

Opinion - Does the shirt and tie combination go well together or not.

Theory - Is making the shirt and tie combination go well together or not.

Belief - Is the hope that one is correct in their theory of the shirt and tie combination going well together or not.

Hope - Is the impossibility of reason.

Faith - Is that someone other will agree, or disagree, with the theory or opinion that the shirt and tie combination goes well together or not.

The above said are fictions as they exist without form or evidence.

Fact - The shirt and tie remain the same despite of any fictions imposed.

Social conditioning has made it so that most cannot distinguish between the said fictions and fact. If one's process is the goal then I say, conclusion cannot be obtained as they perpetually seek and are never satisfied in gain.

To speak nonsense is of no benefit, as it complicates the uncomplicated, a luxury the human species has indulged in for some time now - something I wish not and do not.

"The opposite of fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." -Niels Bohr

"There is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so." -Shakespeare

I think a lot of people get stuck in the "all is one" mentality and think that at the end of the road every thing returns to source. Source is "good", source is love, and just because something may seem wrong or evil from our finite, relative perspective it's "all good" in the divine scheme of things. Rivers may turn crooked and wind this way and that, but they eventually lead to the ocean. Everything is essentially "right" (or eventually?). I've been stuck in that mentality. It's a slippery slope, and teeters on apathy in my opinion.. let me explain...

Vibrations:

The visible spectrum. Red to violet. Lower vibrations (below red)=darkness to the naked eye. Higher vibrations (above violet)=darkness to the naked eye. Two separate states of darkness appearing the same. People loose their ambition to fight the good fight once complacency sets in with the aforementioned mentality in the first paragraph of this response (symbolizing one state of vibration). Their right to feel (not to be controlled by their feelings necessarily), or to be righteously motivated by their feelings is traded in for "all I need to do is imagine my heart expanding and white love/light surrounding the earth". Don't get me wrong that has it's place. I am speaking from my own experiences here. It is very easy to become unwittingly complacent and borderline apathetic when you think yourself to be (striving) in a certain mindset/"vibration", when in reality you are in one that appears the same but is in fact not. I can't say whether this is the exception or the rule for certain.

There is wrong in the world, there is evil in the world, and I'm talking mainstream definitions here.

It's like the old Hindu priests arguing whether or not God was absolute or Personal. Brahman vs. Ishwara. Yes, God is absolute, but we cannot comprehend that yet, we can philosophize and talk around it all day. Our reality now, our progress is geared toward realization of an Ishwara. (this is the rule rather than the exception).

Sure, there is no right or wrong in the end. Right now though, the lines are defined (maybe not so clearly).

Rambling mode off.

[Andre]

This thread began with the following:

Is it possible that when the shift occurs that not everyone will go to the same place when they ascend. Because within each dimension there are also muliple dimensions and realities that you exist on. Maybe people will be spread out amongst the 3rd and 4th dimentional realities depending on there vibration.
I can only add to this discussion what I have read on the subject. There are many opinions on the subject in the public domain that have come from a variety of sources including reliable channels, leading edge scientists and enlightened humans. They each have their own opinion and no two opinions are alike. Some of them assert that only people with a sufficiently high vibration will ascend while others say everyone will ascend. From what I can tell, all these varied view points mean one thing; no-one really knows what it will be like until we create it!

But I do think it's just around the corner.

I think it's possible that when the Earth itself ascends, that everyone will be vibrated into the new dimension whether they like it or not. Once there, I think it's entirely possible that each of us will respond in different ways to this New Earth. Some will find the vibration intolerable and will quickly exit to a more compatible world, others will find it uncomfortable and may last awhile and then exit. Others will learn to adjust and still others will jump for joy and say "Finally, at last!".

The choice to stay or go will have to be made by each individual once they get there (or here, if you prefer multi-dimensional lingo). Vibrational Resonance will, to a very great extent, be the ultimate deciding factor.

There are also quite a lot of opinions about how the actual transition will occur. In some circles, this has often been referred to as the "three days of darkness" that precede actual ascension. But even there, as we (the collective consciousness) continue to redefine the nature of our own dimensional transition, this too may change. In fact, someone recently suggested we have "three days of light" instead of darkness. And why not? So, it's all morphing as we go.

Ideally, the transition itself will be smooth and easy for everyone on the planet. It's possible. But as a collective consciousness that is deciding moment to moment, we may or may not get to that stage. It may be an uncomfortable ride for many. But I would like to believe that everyone will be given the opportunity to transition.

[eileenrose]

Paul Lowe ( a spiritual guru - one of a kind) posted this on "Other Dimensions"

snip
"Receiving quite a few reports now - of people having ‘other worldly’
experiences. I like hearing about such events.

Whenever I have had such experiences, at the time, they seem so, so real,
and afterwards they seem so unreal it is hard to believe they really
happened. They did, because sometimes there were other people with me who had
similar sensations.

As we have been discussing lately, it seems we do have on this planet/in
this dimension, a wide range of levels of consciousness.

The majority, the normal level, is mundane - and not a lot of fun.
These people, without realising there is an alternative, are very stuck.
Not only are they not in touch with their higher potential,
they have not been informed that they have one. They do. We all do.

For some people it is easier to contact these higher levels,
and for others almost impossible.
It is easier to have these experiences if you are a little crazy.
Let me explain."

end snip

Read more at:
http://www.newrealities.com/index.php/blogs/item/1987-other-dimensions

[king anthony]

"The opposite... are defined (maybe not so clearly)...

Thank you for quoting my post; I wish you well.

[Bo Atkinson]

After leaving home at age 18...
I found and latched on to the concept that each person has their own reality.
I studied -ologies, -isms and -actualities, as seemed fit:

Perceptions focus viewpoints, like a camera recording scenes.
Viewpoints align perspectives, which are of relative dimensions.
As recorded scenes pile up, the amassing density shifts perceptions.
Gravity takes over, heh, but really we could choreograph reality somewhat.
By conceding with all the discretions of multiple viewpoints interacting.

Perception resonates frequency-tuned waves, such as sound and light.
Sound and light shape the viewpoints of multiple realities.
Light and sound realities are small sectors we can tune on the 'dial'.
Old radio metaphor for tuned into a specific frequency or band.
But, what if new broadcast services are then added to our focus of reality?
Will we hear them or see them, interact or feel them?
Ah.... have we improved our personal reality sensitivity?

Evolvement or devolvement, that is the question.

[DeDukshyn]

Allow me to try again... I cannot share your point of view, but I understand it, and it does make sense from many perspectives...

I say, even before reading your post, I say again - all may have ability but truly not all have potential and again I wish you well.

Thanks for once again for responding to me without reading my post. Classy guy! lol! You attempt to hide your arrogance behind the mask of what you call your "non-ego" humours me. Go ahead, respond again without reading my post ... lol.

[king anthony]

Thanks for once again for responding to me without reading my post. Classy guy! lol! You attempt to hide your arrogance behind the mask of what you call your "non-ego" humours me. Go ahead, respond again without reading my post ... lol.

Your words imply I have not read your posts, which is untrue. Then you confuse confidence with arrogance, something common with the socially conditioned - while personally attacking me.

I wrote, [quote] "...even before reading your post..." - which implies I wrote my reply, to your post prior to reading it. There is a reason I was able to do this and it is obvious you do not understand this.

I do not wish to continue this with you, thus my words, "I wish you well". In part, because you have made this personal, the thread has been derailed (for those who are interested) and this conversation is no longer productive.

[DeDukshyn]

[QUOTE=DeDukshyn;430885]Thanks for once again for responding to me without reading my post. Classy guy! lol! You attempt to hide your arrogance behind the mask of what you call your "non-ego" humours me. Go ahead, respond again without reading my post ... lol.

Your words imply I have not read your posts, which is untrue. Then you confuse confidence with arrogance, something common with the socially conditioned - while personally attacking me.

I wrote,
"...even before reading your post..." - which implies I wrote my reply, to your post prior to reading it. There is a reason I was able to do this and it is obvious you do not understand this.

I do not wish to continue this with you, thus my words, "I wish you well". In part, because you have made this personal, the thread has been derailed (for those who are interested) and this conversation is no longer productive.

"Thanks for once again for responding to me without reading my post." -- this is actually what I wrote. And you responded before reading my post, which means you responded without reading it -- exactly as I worded it. You may have read it afterward, but that was outside of the point and thus I did not address that scenario as it is irrelevant to my complaint. You took my point, took it out of context, changed the meaning of it a little over my exact words used and then had the "confidence" in being without flaw (which you are, only actions are flawed). You responded to a post without reading it (I don't care if you read it after responding ... not my point at all as my words reflect), and I found that .... unproductive.

If you care to debate back on topic, I would like to ask, how do you define "potential" within the context of your statement "all have ability, but not potential."? Is this potential as measured by the ego? or the spirit? Because in my beliefs the two are entirely seperate and in many ways opposite. I also believe that the potential of spirit is not bound by any physical greatness / "knowledge" / wealth / etc in this realm. I also believe it is infinitely more valuable than any worldly potential. Is it fair to say we have differing opinions on what we define as valuable potential? And thus it is fair to disagree due to differing opinions about the context?

[Delight]

I would like to ask, how do you define "potential" within the context of your statement "all have ability, but not potential."? Is this potential as measured by the ego? or the spirit? Because in my beliefs the two are entirely seperate and in many ways opposite. I also believe that the potential of spirit is not bound by any physical greatness / "knowledge" / wealth / etc in this realm. I also believe it is infinitely more valuable than any worldly potential. Is it fair to say we have differing opinions on what we define as valuable potential? And thus it is fair to disagree due to differing opinions about the context?

I am interested in looking at the idea of "Is it possible that realities will split". Based on the models we have where realities of masters did seem to "split" off (enlarging their dimensional experience) from conventional reality, it must be possible? Is it probable?

I certainly look forward to a split and I have faith that it is absolutely in line with what the One asks consciousness to achieve.

According to Tom Campbell, anything is possible. However some things are more or less probable than others. He has crafted a view on evolution that says that those experiences of the One that lead to more coherence (love is coherent) and support increasing elegance in the Universe are evolutionary.

cCzkGsdQu2k

Simplicity is more elegant than complexity for example.

A specific for instance:
When one looks at conventional reality, with technologies, one sees a great increase in complexity escalating. This is is to extent that one cannot even find the right parts for one's technological belongings when they break as there are sooo many variations of the same "thing" and the "things" are retired almost as soon as they are made. In the past, I have had to buy new cell phones because the platform changed and my old blackberry can't get parts easily now so may "have to" buy another....

....Unless I develop a network and we can communicate telepathically. This may seem "difficult" but I feel evolution is driving this possibility to a probability due to its keeping with the desired trajectory of Life itself.

On all levels it will be so much more "simple" and "elegant" to ditch any and all these external "things" that support our daily existence. Real evolution will favor the development of an insurgence of "mastery" of the body to regain all that will simplify.

It isn't strange to think that the most elegant solutions of the Universe favor the most "mastery" of the parts of the whole. We humans being a part of the whole will achieve the greatest probability of "mastery" at this time. Not because we deserve it but because we serve IT (the Universe).

And why not just accept that this is the easiest path to achieve increased coherence... telekinesis, telepathy, self healing, energy from aether, teleportation, bilocation, levitation... UNI says Yes, I say Thanks UNI. Maggie

[DeDukshyn]

I would like to ask, how do you define "potential" within the context of your statement "all have ability, but not potential."? Is this potential as measured by the ego? or the spirit? Because in my beliefs the two are entirely seperate and in many ways opposite. I also believe that the potential of spirit is not bound by any physical greatness / "knowledge" / wealth / etc in this realm. I also believe it is infinitely more valuable than any worldly potential. Is it fair to say we have differing opinions on what we define as valuable potential? And thus it is fair to disagree due to differing opinions about the context?

I am interested in looking at the idea of "Is it possible that realities will split". Based on the models we have where realities of masters did seem to "split" off (enlarging their dimensional experience) from conventional reality, it must be possible? Is it probable?

I certainly look forward to a split and I have faith that it is absolutely in line with what the One asks consciousness to achieve.

According to Tom Campbell, anything is possible. However some things are more or less probable than others. He has crafted a view on evolution that says that those experiences of the One that lead to more coherence (love is coherent) and support increasing elegance in the Universe are evolutionary.

cCzkGsdQu2k

Simplicity is more elegant than complexity for example.

A specific for instance:
When one looks at conventional reality, with technologies, one sees a great increase in complexity escalating. This is is to extent that one cannot even find the right parts for one's technological belongings when they break as there are sooo many variations of the same "thing" and the "things" are retired almost as soon as they are made. In the past, I have had to buy new cell phones because the platform changed and my old blackberry can't get parts easily now so may "have to" buy another....

....Unless I develop a network and we can communicate telepathically. This may seem "difficult" but I feel evolution is driving this possibility to a probability due to its keeping with the desired trajectory of Life itself.

On all levels it will be so much more "simple" and "elegant" to ditch any and all these external "things" that support our daily existence. Real evolution will favor the development of an insurgence of "mastery" of the body to regain all that will simplify.

It isn't strange to think that the most elegant solutions of the Universe favor the most "mastery" of the parts of the whole. We humans being a part of the whole will achieve the greatest probability of "mastery" at this time. Not because we deserve it but because we serve IT (the Universe).

And why not just accept that this is the easiest path to achieve increased coherence... telekinesis, telepathy, self healing, energy from aether, teleportation, bilocation, levitation... UNI says Yes, I say Thanks UNI. Maggie

Well put; I agree with and support the overall tone of your post. (haven't watched the vid yet, so I will not be commenting on it, lol)

There is the conventional reality - that as you said is growing infinitely complex, but that will always be a step down order from the subtle reality. A "shift" in consciousness is when one moves to the subtle reality for his sate of "being" and makes all his/her decisions from that plane - with little to no regard for what is happening in the conventional reality (I call it the practical reality, but conventional reality sounds even better). The shift, when described like this is not magical or mystical - just a shift in ones point of consciousness that has vast implications to the conventional reality - this is what is scaring the bejeesus out of the global elite - not angry mobs and protests, lol.

To split whole realities I believe is also possible. I'm a bit of a follower of the string theory (for what I know of it), which implies that realities are always splitting. Everytime an option is presented in the conventional reality that has lasting implications (think butterfly effect, or Christ's metaphor of thoughts as the "scattering of seeds - some root and grow on their own and some do not), then a new timeline is created that entertains that option. In spiritual / metaphisical scripts, I liken that to the Creator's desire to explore all possibilities. So in closing, I personally do believe in both "shifts" and the splitting of timelines. Convergence of timelines is way more interesting than splitting of timelines in my opinion.

Is there an "ascension" beyond the consciousness shift? I also believe that this is a real phenomenon that can be explained scientifically / metaphysically. The concept is similar to music in the sense that a C is a C no matter what octave it is played in yet the vibrational frequency is distinct on each. If you apply this vibrational physics to all existence (which is the only thing that anything actually consists of (vibrating electromagnetic energy that define all the particles in our physical universe)), then one can understand that things can indeed exist in different vibrational states. If one adds consciousness as "the potential director of vibrations" (which in essence it is in the subtle realm), then one can see the possibility that a vibrational ascension guided by a particular type of consciousness may well be a reality (I have studied all this from an engineers point of view and it all seems very true to me, if one has the broad understanding required to connect all the dots). My 2 cents ;)

EDIT: started the vid ... liking it so far! Very close to my personal findings. =)

[Delight]

Thanks for the discussion



then one can understand that things can indeed exist in different vibrational states. If one adds consciousness as "the potential director of vibrations" (which in essence it is in the subtle realm), then one can see the possibility that a vibrational ascension guided by a particular type of consciousness may well be a reality (I have studied all this from an engineers point of view and it all seems very true to me, if one has the broad understanding required to connect all the dots). My 2 cents

If one looks at what the sages say when they remind us that we are not body (this conventional reality body. And by extension the whole "body of reality"), but consciousness itself manifesting and the paradox of surrender is actually to "our Selves" the larger sate of consciousness. That means individually we "pop" into the larger state of consciousness when we grok the paradox of relaxing into who we already are. So many are claiming that this moment is about a new experiment. Maybe consciousness itself is about to "pop"?


I can't believe that!' said Alice.

'Can't you?' the Queen said in a pitying tone. 'Try again: draw a long breath, and shut your eyes.'

Alice laughed. 'There's no use trying,' she said 'one can't believe impossible things.'

'I daresay you haven't had much practice,' said the Queen. 'When I was your age, I always did it for half-an-hour a day. Why, sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast. There goes the shawl again!'

The brooch had come undone as she spoke, and a sudden gust of wind blew the Queen's shawl across a little brook. The Queen spread out her arms again and went flying after it, and this time she succeeded in catching it herself. 'I've got it!' she cried in a triumphant tone. 'Now you shall see me pin it on again, all by myself!'

'Then I hope your finger is better now?' Alice said very politely, as she crossed the little brook after the Queen.
( From Alice in Wonderland of Course)

[DeDukshyn]

Thanks for the discussion



then one can understand that things can indeed exist in different vibrational states. If one adds consciousness as "the potential director of vibrations" (which in essence it is in the subtle realm), then one can see the possibility that a vibrational ascension guided by a particular type of consciousness may well be a reality (I have studied all this from an engineers point of view and it all seems very true to me, if one has the broad understanding required to connect all the dots). My 2 cents

If one looks at what the sages say when they remind us that we are not body (this conventional reality body. And by extension the whole "body of reality"), but consciousness itself manifesting and the paradox of surrender is actually to "our Selves" the larger sate of consciousness. That means individually we "pop" into the larger state of consciousness when we grok the paradox of relaxing into who we already are. So many are claiming that this moment is about a new experiment. Maybe consciousness itself is about to "pop"?


I can't believe that!' said Alice.

'Can't you?' the Queen said in a pitying tone. 'Try again: draw a long breath, and shut your eyes.'

Alice laughed. 'There's no use trying,' she said 'one can't believe impossible things.'

'I daresay you haven't had much practice,' said the Queen. 'When I was your age, I always did it for half-an-hour a day. Why, sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast. There goes the shawl again!'

The brooch had come undone as she spoke, and a sudden gust of wind blew the Queen's shawl across a little brook. The Queen spread out her arms again and went flying after it, and this time she succeeded in catching it herself. 'I've got it!' she cried in a triumphant tone. 'Now you shall see me pin it on again, all by myself!'

'Then I hope your finger is better now?' Alice said very politely, as she crossed the little brook after the Queen.
( From Alice in Wonderland of Course)

Again, well put ... love the quote. Appropriate for sure, from my POV.

For me, I have the overwhelming sense of memory of this "new" state. I believe it is not new but forgotten. I also believe that much of our better original (very) ancient texts where trying to explain ths "Fall" so we could recognize it, remember and come out of our "spell of matter". However 95% of that info has been hijacked or stolen and kept secret or re-interpreted by those who wish to remain dominant over the conventional realm. When you consider the religious "Fall of Man" as a fall from the higher vibrational state, it can be humoured that there is something to some of these ancient texts ... re-interpreting them is required ... maybe a bit too metaphysical and off topic, but I feel a worthy consideration. My 2 cents ;)

[DeDukshyn]

Thanks for the discussion



then one can understand that things can indeed exist in different vibrational states. If one adds consciousness as "the potential director of vibrations" (which in essence it is in the subtle realm), then one can see the possibility that a vibrational ascension guided by a particular type of consciousness may well be a reality (I have studied all this from an engineers point of view and it all seems very true to me, if one has the broad understanding required to connect all the dots). My 2 cents

If one looks at what the sages say when they remind us that we are not body (this conventional reality body. And by extension the whole "body of reality"), but consciousness itself manifesting and the paradox of surrender is actually to "our Selves" the larger sate of consciousness. That means individually we "pop" into the larger state of consciousness when we grok the paradox of relaxing into who we already are. So many are claiming that this moment is about a new experiment. Maybe consciousness itself is about to "pop"?


I can't believe that!' said Alice.

'Can't you?' the Queen said in a pitying tone. 'Try again: draw a long breath, and shut your eyes.'

Alice laughed. 'There's no use trying,' she said 'one can't believe impossible things.'

'I daresay you haven't had much practice,' said the Queen. 'When I was your age, I always did it for half-an-hour a day. Why, sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast. There goes the shawl again!'

The brooch had come undone as she spoke, and a sudden gust of wind blew the Queen's shawl across a little brook. The Queen spread out her arms again and went flying after it, and this time she succeeded in catching it herself. 'I've got it!' she cried in a triumphant tone. 'Now you shall see me pin it on again, all by myself!'

'Then I hope your finger is better now?' Alice said very politely, as she crossed the little brook after the Queen.
( From Alice in Wonderland of Course)

I think I understand you more accurately after reading a few times. I think you mean that perhaps the collective consciousness may be able to undergo .... "something" (shift / ascension / whatever the descriptor) - in the same way individuals perhaps can? If so, I would concur and that would be an event upon itself ... not unspoken of ... but highly misunderstood - maybe I'm way off in my assumption, but still worthy of consideration IMHO. ;)

[Delight]

[/QUOTE]
I think I understand you more accurately after reading a few times. I think you mean that perhaps the collective consciousness may be able to undergo .... "something" (shift / ascension / whatever the descriptor) - in the same way individuals perhaps can? If so, I would concur and that would be an event upon itself ... not unspoken of ... but highly misunderstood - maybe I'm way off in my assumption, but still worthy of consideration IMHO. ;)[/QUOTE]

That is exactly what seems impossible but may be probable for consciousness evolving (hehe). Thanks