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viking
20th October 2011, 15:15
Interesting times...

Libya & Gaddafi - The Truth you are not supposed to know


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XorKTwkFPDU&sns=fb

transiten
20th October 2011, 15:29
Well i surely have no possibility to evaluate this infromation even if i've heared some of it on Swedish radio, a program where pple can call and tell their meaning about just everything. I'm eagerly waiting for further comments.

Earth Angel
20th October 2011, 15:32
wow that is incredible information........no wonder the US want him dead

WhiteFeather
20th October 2011, 15:49
Wow, Thanks for this Viking. Awesome.

truth4me
20th October 2011, 15:50
The assassination of Gaddafi and we all know that's what it was,just another in a long line by the NWO to grab another country's resources. America the beautiful--- the home of the free and land of the brave....yer right. :(

viking
20th October 2011, 16:03
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsQtxF_eNjk&feature=related

viking

truth4me
20th October 2011, 16:32
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsQtxF_eNjk&feature=related

vikingviking, my friend, this is the best video I've seen on Avalon in awhile. Was not Gaddafi and Farrakhan speaking truth? yes they were and Gaddafi basically predicted he was going to get took out. American people are so brainwashed and blinded by what's really going on. My nephew is at my home today. He's 27 and has fell for the American trap hook,line and sinker. He's telling me it was good that Gaddafi was killed<murdered >. Viking you know my friend . Viking you know.........:sad:

Peace of Mind
20th October 2011, 16:36
If you read Muammar’s “Green book”, I’m sure you’ll see the bigger picture to his demise. He probably had the best plans for government…something I’m sure the elites of the world didn’t want to come to past….

http://middleeast.about.com/od/libya/a/me090906.htm.

I’m growing tired of all this wicked propaganda being place on those that want to do good for the world. We must wake up fast and do something to stop this hostile takeover before it’s too late. There will be no one to blame when you find yourself and love ones shackled down in concentration camps. Noone!

Peace

Camilo
20th October 2011, 16:49
It doesn't sease to amazeme the naivity of people from European countires and USA, when they talk about a reality they know nothing about. None of you has ever lived in a country with a tirant, despot dictator as a ruler, where you have no rights, and your entire life is controlled. Please wake up. Educate yourselves before you talk about soemthing you know nothing about. That video was made by Gaddafi and his people, of course you're not going to be shown the truth, but what he wants you to believe. Wake up!

divine_moments_of_truth
20th October 2011, 16:49
Had to grab a quote from Peace of Mind's link


“All methods of education prevailing in the world should be destroyed through a universal cultural revolution that frees the human mind from curricula of fanaticism which dictate a process of deliberate distortion of man's tastes, conceptual ability and mentality.”

Seems like a cool guy.

Max

viking
20th October 2011, 19:16
Qaddafi made HUMAN RIGHTS A PRIORITY IN LIBYA!

http://economicsnewspaper.com/economics/the-libyan-crisis-spontaneous-revolution-or-coup-in-progress-28187.html
In an article published February 28, 2011 on the site picked up by Fox News and The Post April 26, 2011, we also learn that “While the UN hounds feverishly to condemn the Libyan leader, Muammar Gaddafi, for grave abuses against demonstrators, the organization Human Rights Council prepares to approve a glowing report for Libya on human rights. His report commends Libya for helping improve educational opportunities for making human rights a “priority” and to have improved under his “constitutional”. Several countries, including Iran, Venezuela, North Korea and Saudi Arabia, but also Canada, Libya to give positive points for the legal protections it provides to its citizens – who are now in revolt against the regime and face bloody reprisals [3].

In conclusion, although controlled media disinformation, Libya is a country that, beyond oil, 144 tons of gold in the vaults of the Central Bank of true Government of Libya, a country that offers its people free medical services and quality education system and a 100% subsidized by the state, a country that offers interest-free loans to its citizens, a country that has no debts to the IMF, World Bank or other financial institutions around the world and finally a country which, for all these, is a rich country, sovereign and independent
why the Libyan people had necessarily to civil war and its leader suddenly became a tyrant and dictator who should be evicted as soon as possible by the international coalition. And all this, name of “democracy” that must settle by force and allowing insurgents to better serve the interests of the Masters of the World.

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/MD14Ak02.html

Portions from above link - it has much more information - but this is the information confirming part of what the video states.

[Libyans] are entitled to free treatment, and their hospitals provide the best in the world of medical equipment. Education in Libya is free, capable young people have the opportunity to study abroad at government expense. When marrying, young couples receive 60,000 Libyan dinars (about 50,000 US dollars) of financial assistance. Non-interest state loans, and as practice shows, undated. Due to government subsidies the price of cars is much lower than in Europe, and they are affordable for every family. Gasoline and bread cost a penny, no taxes for those who are engaged in agriculture. The Libyan people are quiet and peaceful, are not inclined to drink, and are very religious.

They maintained that the international community had been misinformed about the struggle against the regime. "Tell us," they said, "who would not like such a regime?"

Even if that is just propaganda, there is no denying at least one very popular achievement of the Libyan government: it brought water to the desert by building the largest and most expensive irrigation project in history, the US$33 billion GMMR (Great Man-Made River) project. Even more than oil, water is crucial to life in Libya.

Another provocative bit of data circulating on the Net is a 2007 "Democracy Now" interview of US General Wesley Clark (Ret). In it he says that about 10 days after September 11, 2001, he was told by a general that the decision had been made to go to war with Iraq. Clark was surprised and asked why. "I don't know!" was the response. "I guess they don't know what else to do!" Later, the same general said they planned to take out seven countries in five years: Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, and Iran.

What do these seven countries have in common? In the context of banking, one that sticks out is that none of them is listed among the 56 member banks of the Bank for International Settlements (BIS). That evidently puts them outside the long regulatory arm of the central bankers' central bank in Switzerland.

The most renegade of the lot could be Libya and Iraq, the two that have actually been attacked. Kenneth Schortgen Jr, writing on Examiner.com, noted that "[s]ix months before the US moved into Iraq to take down Saddam Hussein, the oil nation had made the move to accept euros instead of dollars for oil, and this became a threat to the global dominance of the dollar as the reserve currency, and its dominion as the petrodollar."

According to a Russian article titled "Bombing of Libya - Punishment for Ghaddafi for His Attempt to Refuse US Dollar", Gaddafi made a similarly bold move: he initiated a movement to refuse the dollar and the euro, and called on Arab and African nations to use a new currency instead, the gold dinar. Gaddafi suggested establishing a united African continent, with its 200 million people using this single currency.
And that brings us back to the puzzle of the Libyan central bank. In an article posted on the Market Oracle, Eric Encina observed:

One seldom mentioned fact by western politicians and media pundits: the Central Bank of Libya is 100% State Owned ... Currently, the Libyan government creates its own money, the Libyan Dinar, through the facilities of its own central bank. Few can argue that Libya is a sovereign nation with its own great resources, able to sustain its own economic destiny. One major problem for globalist banking cartels is that in order to do business with Libya, they must go through the Libyan Central Bank and its national currency, a place where they have absolutely zero dominion or power-broking ability. Hence, taking down the Central Bank of Libya (CBL) may not appear in the speeches of Obama, Cameron and Sarkozy but this is certainly at the top of the globalist agenda for absorbing Libya into its hive of compliant nations.

Libya not only has oil. According to the International Monetary Fund (IMF), its central bank has nearly 144 tonnes of gold in its vaults. With that sort of asset base, who needs the BIS, the IMF and their rules?

All of which prompts a closer look at the BIS rules and their effect on local economies. An article on the BIS website states that central banks in the Central Bank Governance Network are supposed to have as their single or primary objective "to preserve price stability".

If the Gaddafi government goes down, it will be interesting to watch whether the new central bank joins the BIS, whether the nationalized oil industry gets sold off to investors, and whether education and healthcare continue to be free.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=jWzNhk3zv4U


And>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O35_Ai6EsMU&feature=player_embedded

viking

avid
20th October 2011, 19:28
I feel sick after reading all the 'profiteering' corporate-sponsored/owned mainstream media news today. The 'rent-a-mob' and 'bought-a-delinquents' - the 'useful idiots' being filmed dancing around, shooting in the air. Ha - they will soon also realise they have been betrayed, and what should have been theirs has been 'shared out' to those from the so-called 'friendly' countries of NATO... disgusting beyond belief. If you see the 'useful idiots' dancing - feel sad for them, as they have literally shot themselves in their own feet....

truth4me
20th October 2011, 19:36
It doesn't sease to amazeme the naivity of people from European countires and USA, when they talk about a reality they know nothing about. None of you has ever lived in a country with a tirant, despot dictator as a ruler, where you have no rights, and your entire life is controlled. Please wake up. Educate yourselves before you talk about soemthing you know nothing about. That video was made by Gaddafi and his people, of course you're not going to be shown the truth, but what he wants you believe. Wake up!well......I guess it's kinda like 9/11 for the american people.Of course the american people aren't going to be shown the truth,but what our government wants us to believe. Correct me if I'm wrong--- doesn't Libya have the largest oil reserve in Africa? I believe they do.......by the way Iraq has the largest oil reserve in the world....Iraq #1 Hussein took out of power----Libya #1 in Africa Gaddafi took out today........seems that the American government is very happy for Gaddafi demise......

norman
20th October 2011, 20:53
I had the money and a passport, I'd go to his funeral.

viking
20th October 2011, 21:23
Hmmmm.... well we can make comparisons to other countries...just trying to figure out what he did wrong!!!

http://kauilapele.wordpress.com/2011/09/05/the-libyan-system-consider-this-is-it-one-that-we-would-want/

Now why would I post this? I’m not a political poster. But after seeing this article here, it was like I was looking at just what our next world could and may look like. I didn’t know any country had a system like this. At the very least, this system has many features that perhaps all “governance” systems would do well with.

These few videos may offer some insight into what is not being disclosed about Libya and events in Libya. I am not an expert on Libya, and can not vouch for all of the information in these videos, but I do sense we are not being informed at all about what is really going in in Libya right now. Apocalypse (unveiling) anyone??

Here is a nip from the first video (just below the following).

All Libyans receive a portion of the sale of Libyan oil – Directly to their Bank Accounts.
Max income tax in Libya is 12%.
Banks do not charge interest in Libya (Islamic Bank Model, not the Rothschild Slave System).
All Libyans have a home. Ghaddafi vowed that his parents would not get a house until everyone in Libya had a home. Ghaddafi’s father died while he and his wife were still living in a tent.
There are no mortgages on houses in Libya.
Should someone wish to farm, they receive free land and seeds and animals.
There are no Electricity Bills in Libya.
All Education is Free in Libya.
Everyone gets Free Medical – Even the Protestors …
Each newlywed couple receives 60,000 dinar gift from the government.
Gas in Libya is sold at the outrageous price of .12 cents per liter (bigger than US quart).
Automobile purchases are financed at zero interest.
Ghaddafi completed a massive water project to irrigate land to free Libya from dependance on Imported Food



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXLQAUUpJwU&feature=player_embedded


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMXyCqdPPoU&feature=player_embedded


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yUrCkDHguc&feature=player_embedded

http://kauilapele.wordpress.com/2011/09/05/the-libyan-system-consider-this-is-it-one-that-we-would-want/

viking

Jeffrey
20th October 2011, 21:32
This whole situation really hurts my heart.

truth4me
21st October 2011, 03:16
This whole situation really hurts my heart.yes it does my friend....yes it does.:(

Lord Sidious
21st October 2011, 03:45
I had the money and a passport, I'd go to his funeral.

If I had the money not only would I go, I would fly you in too.
And by the gods, would I raise a ruckus.

Lord Sidious
21st October 2011, 03:49
It doesn't sease to amazeme the naivity of people from European countires and USA, when they talk about a reality they know nothing about. None of you has ever lived in a country with a tirant, despot dictator as a ruler, where you have no rights, and your entire life is controlled. Please wake up. Educate yourselves before you talk about soemthing you know nothing about. That video was made by Gaddafi and his people, of course you're not going to be shown the truth, but what he wants you to believe. Wake up!

You assume much, friend.
How do you know who and what we are?
Where we have been?
Who we know?
Although I appreciate your intent, the delivery let you down.

Watching from Cyprus
21st October 2011, 07:37
Hey you all, (Thank you Viking for posting this)

If this is not to stir you all up and to see the plan of the Elite completely clearly then you most be using a ton of "Sugar Free Chewing Gum" full of Aspartam and Flouride making you dumb and numb.... Now is the time to feel what your heart tells you after watching these vids... For Gods sake it is not you, you stupid assess... it is your children you should think about if you have love in your hearts. You have to educate your children even from very young about the world they are growing up in, and FORGET ABOUT ALL MATERIALISTIC THINGS, since they have no place in a world of Love. It is not about being the best football player or charmer of the girls or becoming a doctor or b/w-anker, being rich in money and have a big house and boats and cars .... IT IS ALL BS AND THAT IS THE STATE YOU HAVE TO SNAP OUT OF NOW NOW NOW. Put all this behind you and WAKE UP.

Sorry i am p........ off which i should not be since anger does not solve problems (maybe it start with it i dont know)

Love you all
Peter

viking
21st October 2011, 09:49
Hey you all, (Thank you Viking for posting this)

If this is not to stir you all up and to see the plan of the Elite completely clearly then you most be using a ton of "Sugar Free Chewing Gum" full of Aspartam and Flouride making you dumb and numb.... Now is the time to feel what your heart tells you after watching these vids... For Gods sake it is not you, you stupid assess... it is your children you should think about if you have love in your hearts. You have to educate your children even from very young about the world they are growing up in, and FORGET ABOUT ALL MATERIALISTIC THINGS, since they have no place in a world of Love. It is not about being the best football player or charmer of the girls or becoming a doctor or b/w-anker, being rich in money and have a big house and boats and cars .... IT IS ALL BS AND THAT IS THE STATE YOU HAVE TO SNAP OUT OF NOW NOW NOW. Put all this behind you and WAKE UP.

Sorry i am p........ off which i should not be since anger does not solve problems (maybe it start with it i dont know)

Love you all
Peter

Hi Peter ... yes I agree...it bloody maddening hey!

Well...this could just well be another chink in their armour... as more and more people realize that whats coming through the mainstream is utter bollox...

Truth will emerge but how many will recognize her?? time for gaia to have a re-shuffle me thinks!!


~~~~~~~~

Some more tid bits here...

The majority of the people who oppose Gadaffi are young rebels, who don’t poses the knowledge of the history of their own country!

1.

the Great Man Made River project, in Libya which is probably the largest and most complex engineering project in the world was invested by Gadaffi, which is taking over 20 years to build and costing over 30 billion dollars to make it happen, ALL of the money used to help this project was purely from Libya, not a single dollar was borrowed from the outside world. This project is a great investment. , a huge complex irrigation system, it has also been dubbed the 8th wonder of the world.


This will help farmers cultivate land and provide fresh water to the masses the ability to grow crops with sustainability and able to produce enough crops that it will have to bring in migrant workers from overpopulated Egypt which will benefit Egypt and export crops which will stimulate its economy further. A long term sustainable project, which is criticised and envied by the west. A country that can provide for itself without the need to import anything and in debt to no country is frowned upon by America.



2.

Libya has probably the best health care system in the whole of Africa, whereby infant deaths per 1000 is decreasing year on year,
This currently stands at about 18/1000 which is better than most African countries.
Figures from WHO shows that 71% have good access to clean water (2000), 97% access to good sanitation (2006)



3.

Compulsory Education: In the Libyan Jamahiriya education is free to everyone from elementary school right up to university and post-graduate education, both in Libya and abroad. Pre-university education is divided into primary, preparatory, and secondary education. Schools are everywhere. For nomads, there are mobile classrooms and teachers. Educations is compulsory between 6 and 15 yrs old


In the 1990 Libya was put under US sanctions which restricted the amount of oil it was allowed to export and limit the amount of imports it was allowed to receive his included medical supplies and bare necessities such as foods, this is a control which America has put in place in over 40% of the entire world, it wants to control the economy of the world.


In 2001 The Act is amended to allow the US president to punish non-US firms investing more than $20 million annually in the energy sectors in Libya or Iran.



4.

Gadaffi asked for having a United States of Africa, who was the 2009 chair person for the Arab union he stated this in June 2007 in guinea and again in February 2999 in Ethiopia


He said “I shall continue to insist that our sovereign countries work to achieve the United States of Africa.” The BBC reported that Gaddafi had proposed “a single African military force, a single currency and a single passport for Africans to move freely around the continent”.


This would make it the 3rd most populated state after china and India. From one body they would have more power in world influence, and will be at less risk to threats, don’t forget much of Africa was one body, but was split up by Britain and France,


Remember this ‘UNITED WE STAND, DIVIDED WE FALL’


viking

Watching from Cyprus
21st October 2011, 13:00
[/QUOTE]

Hi Peter ... yes I agree...it bloody maddening hey!

Well...this could just well be another chink in their armour... as more and more people realize that whats coming through the mainstream is utter bollox...

Truth will emerge but how many will recognize her?? time for gaia to have a re-shuffle me thinks!!
[/QUOTE]

Hi Viking,

You are absolutely right..100% and after i have tried to wake people up including my family (not wife and son.... they understand) without any luck and find they all want to stay slaves to Money, and huhhh we are afraid of stepping outside the box.. After this i really cant care less about the human race as is on this planet and i will only care for my wife and son.. The rest must take care of themselves now... It is even difficult to have a conversation with the rest of the family and staying interested in the complete nonsense (for me) they wish to tell of news (i live in another country than my family) like our friends just bought a new BMW and came to show it the other day... bla bla bla, holidays in Greece every year and it is ohhh so fantastic and cheap over there and the sea was minimum 30 degrees celcius, since it HAS to be warmer than in Cyprus where i live... who cares ... Lets go to the jungle and live of nature

Sorry for the hick ups...

I am ready for Gaja to shake her skin and wow how people in general really deserves to be shaken well.

Love you all who has the heart on the right place.
God bless Gaddafi
Peter

viking
23rd October 2011, 15:25
GADDAFFI'S LAST FORMAL SPEECH:

THIS IS VERY MOVING:

In the name of Allah, the beneficent, the merciful...

For 40 years, or was it longer, I can't remember, I did all I could to give people houses, hospitals, schools, and when they were hungry, I gave them food. I even made Benghazi into farmland from the desert, I stood up to attacks from that cowboy Ronald Reagan, when he killed my adopted orphaned daughter, he was trying to kill me, instead he killed that poor innocent child. Then I helped my brothers and sisters from Africa with money for the African Union.

I did all I could to help people Understand the concept of real democracy, where people's committees ran our country. But that was never enough, as some told me, even people who had 10 room homes, new suits and furniture, were never satisfied, as selfish as they were they wanted more. They told Americans and other visitors, that they needed "democracy" and "freedom" never realizing it was a cut throat system, where the biggest dog eats the rest, but they were enchanted with those words, never realizing that in America, there was no free medicine, no free hospitals, no free housing, no free education and no free food, except when people had to beg or go to long lines to get soup.

No, no matter what I did, it was never enough for some, but for others, they knew I was the son of Gamal Abdel Nasser, the only true Arab and Muslim leader we've had since Salah-al-Deen, when he claimed the Suez Canal for his people, as I claimed Libya, for my people, it was his footsteps I tried to follow, to keep my people free from colonial domination - from thieves who would steal from us.

Now, I am under attack by the biggest force in military history, my little African son, Obama wants to kill me, to take away the freedom of our country, to take away our free housing, our free medicine, our free education, our free food, and replace it with American style thievery, called "capitalism" ,but all of us in the Third World know what that means, it means corporations run the countries, run the world, and the people suffer.

So, there is no alternative for me, I must make my stand, and if Allah wishes, I shall die by following His path, the path that has made our country rich with farmland, with food and health, and even allowed us to help our African and Arab brothers and sisters.

I do not wish to die, but if it comes to that, to save this land, my people, all the thousands who are all my children, then so be it.

Let this testament be my voice to the world, that I stood up to crusader attacks of NATO, stood up to cruelty, stoop up to betrayal, stood up to the West and its colonialist ambitions, and that I stood with my African brothers, my true Arab and Muslim brothers, as a beacon of light.

When others were building castles, I lived in a modest house, and in a tent. I never forgot my youth in Sirte, I did not spend our national treasury foolishly, and like Salah-al-Deen, our great Muslim leader, who rescued Jerusalem for Islam, I took little for myself...

In the West, some have called me "mad", "crazy", but they know the truth yet continue to lie, they know that our land is independent and free, not in the colonial grip, that my vision, my path, is, and has been clear and for my people and that I will fight to my last breath to keep us free, may Allah almighty help us to remain faithful and free.

-- Mu'ummar Qaddafi.

~~~~~~~~

viking

Leon
23rd October 2011, 15:48
Shame this has happened...

Is it not time that the whole Middle East, North Africa and the world woke up and stopped these people with their cunning, manipulative ways...

That would be the rebellion of a lifetime...

How many more leaders need to die? those who do not comply to NWO?

How many more need to die who speak out against NWO?

ghostrider
23rd October 2011, 16:12
I never saw Gaddafi or Sadam try to take my house, my car, my air, my children, or my bank account. can't say the same for the U.S / IRS/ DOE or the Bank of ( you fill in the bank). Between General Motors, Chemtrails, the IRS, and the dept of Education Gaddafi was looking pretty good.

Kimberley
23rd October 2011, 17:05
I saw this post a few minutes ago From Yiolas:
http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?33097-Gaddafi-s-death-OFFICIAL-update&p=338204#post338204

I thought this needed to be posted here also...

You've got see this short clip of Hillary Clintons reaction to Gaddafi's brutal murder.


http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7385396n

modwiz
23rd October 2011, 17:32
[/COLOR]
I saw this post a few minutes ago From Yiolas:
http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?33097-Gaddafi-s-death-OFFICIAL-update&p=338204#post338204

I thought this needed to be posted here also...

You've got see this short clip of Hillary Clintons reaction to Gaddafi's brutal murder.


http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7385396n

She is coming out of her energetic closet. Notice she has let her hair grow out. She is allowing her 'priestess' to show now. Priestess of what? Hmm. Good question.

viking
24th October 2011, 08:38
Interesting article...

People have been so worried as to whether the Leader of the World Revolution, Muammar Qaddafi of Libya, is dead or alive. Let us examine this question, and reach some definitive positions based upon the Third Universal Theory, which Muammar Qaddafi championed.

First, let us consider why it matters, or does not matter. To the terrorists attacking Africa's Libya, NATO, the mercenaries and the "Islamist" rats it matters, because that has been their key number one objective, from which all else follows. For them Qaddafi = Libya = Jamahiriya.

NATO, the American-European military alliance has dug itself into a corner from day one, because their first aim was to kill Qaddafi, and the reasons for them wanting to do so have been explained in countless other analysis articles here on Mathaba.Net.


Mathaba Editorial on the "Death" of Muammar Qaddafi

From the start of the NATO bombing, which they thought would take 2 to 3 days to achieve its objective of killing Qaddafi, later revised to 2-3 weeks, then 2-3 months, and then "indefinitely", Mathaba stated that NATO would not be able to do so.

On the very day of their biggest ever failure, when they went in an all-out massive desperate bombing of Qaddafi's home which he still would not run away from, in order for the Rome meeting of Clinton to be able to declare a victory, it backfired when he went out to feed the animals, and instead his 3 grandchildren and youngest son died along with many others.

That damaging news was immediately squashed by the sudden release within a few hours, of the "death of Bin Laden", so as to deflect world media away from sympathy for Qaddafi and his family, and toward the power and might of the USA. Only problem is, on the web, people quickly figured out that this was not Bin Laden who was dumped at sea, let alone the problem that he had died many years earlier.

But that did not matter, because 99% of tell-lie-vision (TV) viewers believed it, just as they did when Obama's White House came up with his forged birth certificate, which later proved as evidenced by traces left in the history of the file uploaded to the White House web site, to be a fake because it had been edited, not only scanned.

Understand that the "international media" meaning this crowd, always get their way, because most people get their news and influence from there. They report a lie ad infinitum (such as the "Libya did Lockerbie" lie) but when the opposite is proven to be the case (witnesses admitted being paid $4million each and recanted their evidence), that "new" news is either not reported, or reported only in passing, on some small inner pages or paragraph.

Now we have the reasons and timing for Qaddafi's "death", before we address whether he is actually dead or not, and why he is dead and is not dead.

Reasons include that a recent internal NATO and CIA review of the war on Libya revealed it to be a mess and a pathetic failure. Not only had Qaddafi continued to survive, but he was getting more famous by the day, and with that, the danger of his ideas and example, being discovered. More on that in a while.

Further, the objectives, to control Libya, it's oil and water, and to separate it from the rest of Africa, also failed abysmally, even though they cut off all Libyan broadcasting stations, both TV and Internet, by bombing, denial of service attacks, hacking, and threats -- the green resistance continued especially in central Libya.

This, in spite of non-stop bombing, missile and terrorist attacks, and a total blockade and siege and then destruction of democratic Jamahiriya cities where the population were holding out, and where the "rebels" could not enter: mass starvation and total destruction ensued, bombing of hospitals, and over 60,000 dead.

Yet still those civilians in those towns, armed to defend themselves, did not give in to NATO bombs and terrorist rockets and assassinations. Then NATO in desperation started to use banned weapons, mini nukes, chemicals, and "poor man's" fuel bombs, resulting in further large-scale massacres, in the past week.

The world media was about to be unable to ignore this any further although they had been silent during months of atrocities and blockades, with photos now emerging in recent days, showing a town utterly destroyed with bodies littering the streets. An urgent distraction was again needed.

With in-fighting in recent weeks between the rebels, monarchists, kleptomaniacs, criminals, 'al-Qaida' and mercenary groups all initially united only in their hatred for Qaddafi now falling apart and in open confrontation with mass resignations from among their ranks and leadership, something needed to be done.

With NATO pilots and drone operators realising that there is indeed a very real danger of them having to face justice for war crimes and crimes against humanity, and with pilot fatigue and dissatisfaction creeping in as after 8 months of non-stop aerial bombing the truth has become known to them that they are not there to protect civilians but instead to bomb them, something had to be done.

Hillary Clinton needed to visit Tripoli, to "rally the troops", and provide a brave face for the Europeans who were increasingly worried about being on the forefront of a war that they have started to realize they cannot win, and which will ultimately backfire, for many reasons already covered here on Mathaba.Net and elsewhere.

So, the big white lady descended on Libya for a few hours and spoke, calling for the capture or death of Muammar Qaddafi, knowing that as with Bin Laden, the videos and images were already prepared. Lo and behold, presto, a day later, "Qaddafi" was both captured and killed.

Yes, he is now dead, for the world media. And the incredibly and deliberately shaky videos, prove it, as do the doctored still images. No one, especially not Obama, needs to declare Qaddafi dead, for the rebel "TNC" so-called Transitional National Council (or what is left of it, less than a dozen people), said it is so, and Jazeera and Al-Arabiya as well as PRESS TV and Russia Today echoed the "news" as fact.

Problem is, he is also not dead. Not only because he was not captured and not killed, as reported elsewhere here from reliable sources, but because he already lives in the hearts of millions. And this now brings us to the next point, as to in which ways Qaddafi is dead or alive, and whether and how much it matters.

Qaddafi is alive. It matters, because NATO has thus not won the war, and not even won their first "easy" objective. It matters because some people need a leader and won't operate without that leader: the large numbers of volunteers converging on Libya from around Africa, are not all going there for reasons of defending Libya, Libyans, or even Africa, but because of their love, appreciation and solidarity for Qaddafi and wanting to help him as the "Brother Leader".

Yet, even though Qaddafi did not die and most people still have not woken up to the fact that we live in a digital world where all images, videos, and sound, can easily be forged -- not only by easily available commercial image and sound manipulation software, but by military grade programs and super-computers.

People have not woken up to the fact that the very "main stream" media they have come to rely on, as well as their political leaders, have less education, less common sense, and less experience, than one would expect, and thus are also easily misled.

But one day, Qaddafi will die, and in that sense is already dead, as the rest of us are too. However, he has lived to see his philosophy actually put into practice, something very few philosophers in the world have ever had the privilege of. Sadly, he has also lived to see it destroyed. But no quite.

What has been destroyed, is Libya, but not the Jamahiriya: not the values, ideals, and democratic, economic and social relationships that have proven to be so strong as to withstand the world's most powerful and brutal military forces for almost a year, and still hold out. And this has resulted in a great opportunity, as we shall see.

The entire world faces a cross-roads over the coming year, and we remember the New Year message from Mathaba on 28th January 2011 saying that this would be the most important year ever:



As we start 2011 this is going to be a most important year for future life on this planet. It is essential to STAY INFORMED, and SHARE what you know with others. Mathaba, as the world's leading independent news agency is playing an important part in giving people the tools for making the world a better place.

That cross-roads, now has a chance of taking the right turn, because the very key solutions to those problems facing the world, were being ignored and Mathaba was a lone voice in the wilderness talking about the Third Universal Theory. Now however, thanks to the war on Libya and the attacks on Qaddafi, people the world over are asking what it is that is going on -- it is clear to all that it is not about protecting civilians, and has led to millions reading The Green Book.

Further, hardly anyone outside Libya knew anything about the Jamahiriya, about how all power, wealth and arms were in the hands of the people in Libya, or that Qaddafi had handed power to the people in 1979 two years after the creation of the Jamahiriya, and the introduction of direct, participatory democracy.

This, and the amazing economic benefits that resulted from it, are the reason that even during NATO bombing he could go around Tripoli in an open air car and no one would shoot at him, without any real security, as shown in this video shot during April this year, one month into the bombing of his home.

Other truths started to surface, and resulted in millions of people world wide posting videos, articles, and comments on social media. Truths such as these.

Now, what is to be done, and what is Muammar to do? Actually, he has been trying to tell everyone who has been listening these past many months, a few key points and yet from what we see, it is not getting through to everyone, even those who are his fans around the world, and which we summarize here below:

* I am not the Libyan resistance, the Libyan resistance is the people. They will continue to fight, until NATO and all others against them, leave Libya. They will lay down their lives to defend their freedom, as will many of my own family. I live in their hearts, and in the hearts of millions.

* I am not the government of Libya, I do not hold any official government positions. I am a revolutionary. I am outside of power. Power rests with the Libyan people.

* I have spoken all my words, so many times, until I grew tired. "It is all there in the pages of The Green Book. Please read it and you will understand."

* I have completed my work, I gave power, wealth and arms to the people, who possess it. I am just one man among millions in Libya.

* I brought to light the Third Universal Theory. It is as if mankind had become locked in a cave without sunlight, and forgotten what sun light looked like. I found the rusty keys on the floor, and put them in the lock. Thus all that is needed is to turn the key to come out into the sunlight again.

* The Green Book is a collection of truths, showing the way for solving the problems of power via democracy, wealth via socialism, and the social basis of the Third Universal Theory. As the farmer, I did not create the fruits, but picked them from the tree and placed them into a basket, The Green Book.

The above are an English language para-phrasing of some of the things he has said. During the current conflict he also gave clear advice:

* I will never give up on Libya, I will fight to the end, I will not run nor leave my home land.

* NATO will have to leave, they can never occupy Libya, they will never live in peace stealing our wealth.

* The (rebels) will not last one day without NATO, so they should make peace now while they have a chance.

* Do not trust the media, they will say I have said this or that, that I have died, or that I am here or there. They lie, and are easily manipulated, so do not trust them.

* No orders are needed, come out into the streets, clean the country from the rats until the green flag of freedom is flying everywhere again.

So, why does anyone need to hear from him yet again? What difference does it make if he is alive in freedom, or dies in freedom? Either way, is victory. Either way, is a motivation to those who love him. If he is alive, they are motivated, if he is martyred they are motivated.

Why are people avoiding getting on with the real work to hand, which is to, among other things:

* Study The Green Book and put it into practice, forming green charter committees everywhere and calling for people's conferences.

* Organize and mobilize, hold rallies with green flags, videos, posters, t-shirts, or even travel to Africa to defend the Jamahiriya.

* Get out there and spread the truth, call others, wake them up, show them the evidence, recruit more members to the movement.

* Report your actions, submit rally, meeting, protest, or other reports and statements via pub.mathaba.net

* Network with others, using open source tools such as mathaba.info

The Green Charter Movement will soon be launching a wiki in addition on its web site, which will explain many of the concepts, definitions, and structures of the movement.

Remember, even though the Leader is at the time of this writing still very much alive in more ways than one, he does not need to speak: all has already been spoken and written, it is now up to us all to hear those calls and put them into practice, and then in future if the time is right and we have finally done something along the way of building a Universal Jamahiriya, he may choose to address us again. For now, let the enemies of freedom remain confused and fearful, while we move forward united and strong, and continue the green march to people's power as a solution to the problems of corruption, exploitation, oppression, war, need and greed.

Some of the following tasks are still very much outstanding, and all should now become involved in the work:

* Registering sufficient numbers of people at www.peoplesconference.org/reg so that people's conferences can be formed in various areas. The IPCO will contact everyone when the time is right and there is something to report, a publication called "World Conference" is planned.

* Adopting the Green Charter for the interim, and spreading www.greencharter.com so that the green charter movement will grow world wide and show the way forward to people's power (Jamahiriya) everywhere.

* Making sure that all those who have committed crimes are held to account, see www.peoplesconference.org/cah -- and assisting with the creation of a world crimes data base at www.worldcrimes.org as well as the entering of data into it and the organization of World People's Conferences on Crimes Against Humanity to be held in 8 locations around the world, by March 2012.

* Collecting funds for all the above, to assist with expenses, publicity, donate via the website www.peoplesconference.org as well as www.mathaba.net/donate.htm

* Forming International Solidarity Committees around the world to coordinate an effective mass migration toward whatever location is decided time and place, to put and end to the war and rebuild the Jamahiriya, or otherwise to create a new Jamahiriya, with this formation to be coordinated by IPCO.

* Join the mailing lists and any other means of staying informed, such as www.mathaba.net/support and www.mathaba.net/go/daily

* Costing and Production of T-shirts, Posters, green flags, green books (Green Charter International has ISBN and copy right and printers, funds are needed to print)

* Building of alternative and independent communication networks, which will continue to function without electrical grid, Internet, or phones

http://www.mathaba.net/news/?x=629077

~~~~~~~~

Thought I'd post this as well.... truth from the media!!!!! ha ha ....bloody numpty's ....

read here....

http://fightingforliberty.ning.com/profiles/blogs/it-s-a-freaken-plan-not-terrorists-geeeeeez



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_-lzI8I0_0&feature=player_embedded

viking

viking
24th October 2011, 09:05
http://www.fourwinds10.net/resources/uploads/images/GhadaffiAliveOct11.png

Interesting read here ...

http://fightingforliberty.ning.com/profiles/blog/show?id=2881777%3ABlogPost%3A88187&xgs=1&xg_source=msg_share_post

~~~~~~~~

viking

Cartomancer
24th October 2011, 14:11
If you mess with the $ then this is what happens to you. Ask Lincoln and Kennedy. Anyone who doesn't want to play ball dies.

norman
24th October 2011, 20:46
If you mess with the $ then this is what happens to you. Ask Lincoln and Kennedy. Anyone who doesn't want to play ball dies.

Unless it's China.

Then we ALL die.

161803398
25th October 2011, 04:04
Cynthia McKinneyvhDaK7Yg5d0

161803398
25th October 2011, 05:58
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_f8YKZKTbc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pkMQooK44Q

viking
25th October 2011, 10:07
A wise young lady speaks her mind...

Deliberately destroy a countries infrastructure then pay private contractors public money to build it back up again. Where have I heard this before?

British businessmen should be 'heading to Libya for contracts': http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2e7p5zgNQk&feature=feedu


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2e7p5zgNQk&feature=feedu

viking

viking
25th October 2011, 12:00
Bloody shameful ...I really hope this type of info will somehow reach the masses ...I was only chatting to one of my friends about this yesterday... talk about brainwashed...had to bite my lip... I pray that the masses find the 'truth' ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FrVteq87gA&feature=share


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FrVteq87gA&feature=share

viking

161803398
25th October 2011, 18:51
This is an old video about Lockerbie bombing and framing Libya.

eXH7mIRfS3s

161803398
25th October 2011, 21:08
What a surprise! So, with all the years so many people telling the Western world to wake up and here we are in 2011 and I'll bet that 99 percent of the North American population believes that Gaddafi was what the media says he was and that America and Nato liberated the Libyans. I would bet money on that. I dunna think anyone wants to wake up.

http://money.cnn.com/2011/10/25/news/international/libya_oil/

That's why these guys are so gutsy and don't give a DAMN whether anyone believes their lies or not. The know that most of the people in the world are uncaring, uninvolved, lazy idiots.

I want off this satanic planet.

161803398
26th October 2011, 00:35
well this isn't "truth" exactly but its interesting rumours:

http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi?read=197040

http://dimensionalbliss.com/2011/03/11/qadhafi-libya-seen-from-another-angle/

Lord Sidious
26th October 2011, 03:42
well this isn't "truth" exactly but its interesting rumours:

http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi?read=197040

http://dimensionalbliss.com/2011/03/11/qadhafi-libya-seen-from-another-angle/

The link to rumourmillnews could be one of THE most important ever posted on this forum.
EVERYONE better get over to the page linked to and read it.
Then read up on Faction Two.
And no, I am not joking.
I just read it and read around on that site.
I am still thinking about this and there is more to it than is on the net.

sygh
26th October 2011, 05:28
This may very well be the straw. Hillary Clinton is not a good woman/person.

161803398
26th October 2011, 06:34
http://killinghope.org/

He missed Cambodia.

I was trying to figure out who the exiled Royals might be.

Lord Sidious
26th October 2011, 09:02
http://killinghope.org/

He missed Cambodia.

I was trying to figure out who the exiled Royals might be.

If you read the links on rumourmillnews a bit, you will see they are Hapsburgs, the family that ran the Austro-Hungarian empire.

jorr lundstrom
26th October 2011, 09:24
I saw this post a few minutes ago From Yiolas:
http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?33097-Gaddafi-s-death-OFFICIAL-update&p=338204#post338204

I thought this needed to be posted here also...

You've got see this short clip of Hillary Clintons reaction to Gaddafi's brutal murder.


http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7385396n

I do understand why Billy Boy prefered another woman in the Oral Room

instead of this bitch.

viking
26th October 2011, 10:33
well this isn't "truth" exactly but its interesting rumours:

http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi?read=197040

http://dimensionalbliss.com/2011/03/11/qadhafi-libya-seen-from-another-angle/

The link to rumourmillnews could be one of THE most important ever posted on this forum.
EVERYONE better get over to the page linked to and read it.
Then read up on Faction Two.
And no, I am not joking.
I just read it and read around on that site.
I am still thinking about this and there is more to it than is on the net.

Just to re-itereate what Sid has stated...most of us here know here whats what, but these articles are a real eye opener and with excellent information... A must read for folk seeking 'truths' about Libya ...

Interesting story about the Pyramids!! wow ... any further links would be appreciated...

viking

viking
26th October 2011, 15:51
well this isn't "truth" exactly but its interesting rumours:

http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi?read=197040

http://dimensionalbliss.com/2011/03/11/qadhafi-libya-seen-from-another-angle/

The link to rumourmillnews could be one of THE most important ever posted on this forum.
EVERYONE better get over to the page linked to and read it.
Then read up on Faction Two.
And no, I am not joking.
I just read it and read around on that site.
I am still thinking about this and there is more to it than is on the net.

Just to re-itereate what Sid has stated...most of us here know here whats what, but these articles are a real eye opener and with excellent information... A must read for folk seeking 'truths' about Libya ...

Interesting story about the Pyramids!! wow ... any further links would be appreciated...

viking

Just thought I'd bump this again to those who havent read the 2 links above...

viking

Eagle
26th October 2011, 15:58
Indeed what has happened in Lydia I am sure has happened in other places. I am not a Gaddafi fan but I agree with what most of you are saying that there was a serious lack of what really happened as opposed to what the PTB want you to know. Truly sad times when a leader of a country can be killed without a trial of his peers(if needed) where is the Justice!

Calz
26th October 2011, 16:06
:welcome: back Dig

Eagle
26th October 2011, 16:09
:welcome: back Dig
Thank you I am the much better because of it. Lets just say I am greatful for another shot.

161803398
26th October 2011, 17:47
The couldn't have a trial of Gaddafi because of Lockerbie and maybe a lot of other things they didn't want coming up. Possibly that's why they want to kill his entire family.

161803398
26th October 2011, 18:16
http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi?read=33924

You are right Lord Sid, this is going to take a lot of thought.

However, I do remember someone saying something to the effect that we should really thank George B. for being so stupid that everyone in the world became aware of the NWO.

161803398
27th October 2011, 00:09
Danaans and Tuatha de Danaans

http://clyde.winters.tripod.com/chapter6.html

http://www.kelleyheckart.com/Tuatha_de_Danaan.html

The Irish have been called the "black" people of Europe :)

161803398
27th October 2011, 04:07
I cant find much about Libyan pyramids but there are some beautiful rock carvings said to be 12K years old. But they say that the most ancient ones have the highest artistic content.

http://romeartlover.tripod.com/Desemath.html

http://romeartlover.tripod.com/Deseauis.html

161803398
28th October 2011, 02:26
Lockerbie:

oGuzIHwkAf4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICBnVtUkXwI

161803398
28th October 2011, 02:43
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3jEdnSmdws

Rocky1
28th October 2011, 03:14
Now that Gaddafi is gone we will have to wait and see what the future holds for Lybia. I only wonder why, if life was so perfect in Lybia, there were riots. I honestly don't know. I love conspiracy theory so I wouldn't be surprised by anything anyone has suggested. The media presented many educat4ed you men and women who could not find work, similar to what we are now experiencing in the US.

From an American point of view we do not rely on Lybian oil unlike most of Europe. After Lockerbie and the US subsequently blowing up his house and killing his son, we have had little difficulty with Gaddafi.

It will be interesting to see if the Muslim brotherhood acquires power in Lybia the way it appears that they have throughout northern Africa. If sharia law is now the law of the land I wonder if Lybia is taking a step forward or a step backward. I do not know enough about the region to opine intelligently, but I hesitate to say anything favorable about a man who intentionally kills the youth of his country merely to retain power. We may have some serious problems in our country, but the last time we intentionally killed our own in the streets was during the Kent State riots nearly 40 yars ago and the Branch Dividian incident with David Koresh in Waco Texas. There is no questiun that our people kill each other due to the massive number of guns in our streets, but these killings are by "nuts", not the military.

Like I said, I don't know enough to comment intelligently, and I recognize that there is likely to be more instability after his death, but I question his refusal to step down when he could - and now he is dead. It seems like an extreme decision, as was the decision to kill the young people in Lybia. although I no longer jump to conclusions merely based upon what the media portrays, and I have become much more open-minded, but it seems to me that Lybia may be better off without him. On the other hand, I could be 100% wrong. Only time will tell.

161803398
28th October 2011, 03:26
But why would anyone expect Gaddafi to be perfect? There are riots in America. Would that justify foreign intervention.

161803398
28th October 2011, 03:30
There are always a certain percentage of "rebels" in any country. There is a percentage of what can be called "die hard" supporters too. Then there are people who go back and forth. Sometimes someone's support will go up just before an election. I understand that Gaddafi had about the same support as any American politician on an average day but his percentage of "die hard" supporters was a bit higher. Knowing this you can see why leaders of any country would be horrified by what has happened.

161803398
28th October 2011, 03:41
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2PM0HfmqBE




The fact is they see nothing wrong with terrorism unless it is directed at them, the newspapers cover this up but the rest of the world knows this. So, logically and, as a matter of history, it is only a matter of time if a country wishes to pursue these policies.

Lord Sidious
28th October 2011, 03:42
Now that Gaddafi is gone we will have to wait and see what the future holds for Lybia. I only wonder why, if life was so perfect in Lybia, there were riots. I honestly don't know. I love conspiracy theory so I wouldn't be surprised by anything anyone has suggested. The media presented many educat4ed you men and women who could not find work, similar to what we are now experiencing in the US.

From an American point of view we do not rely on Lybian oil unlike most of Europe. After Lockerbie and the US subsequently blowing up his house and killing his son, we have had little difficulty with Gaddafi.

It will be interesting to see if the Muslim brotherhood acquires power in Lybia the way it appears that they have throughout northern Africa. If sharia law is now the law of the land I wonder if Lybia is taking a step forward or a step backward. I do not know enough about the region to opine intelligently, but I hesitate to say anything favorable about a man who intentionally kills the youth of his country merely to retain power. We may have some serious problems in our country, but the last time we intentionally killed our own in the streets was during the Kent State riots nearly 40 yars ago and the Branch Dividian incident with David Koresh in Waco Texas. There is no questiun that our people kill each other due to the massive number of guns in our streets, but these killings are by "nuts", not the military.

Like I said, I don't know enough to comment intelligently, and I recognize that there is likely to be more instability after his death, but I question his refusal to step down when he could - and now he is dead. It seems like an extreme decision, as was the decision to kill the young people in Lybia. although I no longer jump to conclusions merely based upon what the media portrays, and I have become much more open-minded, but it seems to me that Lybia may be better off without him. On the other hand, I could be 100% wrong. Only time will tell.

Just remember that we are taught from a young age that our nations are ''the good guys'' and anyone else is obviously bad.
Very, very basic, but that conditioning stays with us all our lives, until we let it go.
It doesn't matter how well you run a nation, there are always those who don't like it and don't like you.
That is natural.

kreagle
28th October 2011, 06:01
This is certainly not the information we have been fed here in America. Gaddafi certainly didn't do himself any favors with his overall appearance. He dressed and presented himself in a rather strange way,.....almost in a halty, dictatorial way. He also seemed flippant in his demeanour. I'm sure that's how the West, (us), wanted him to appear, so we would draw the opinion that we all did. Now we are hearing something very different. Makes you wonder. Now don't get me wrong, in that I readily acknowledge that our hierarchy is rotten to the core and not to be trusted. Not to say that I completely buy everything that I'm reading here,....but it does make you reconsider. Makes me wonder if we'll ever know what has really transpired over the many years, in this world, or will we have to all find out in the great beyond?

Lord Sidious
28th October 2011, 06:24
This is certainly not the information we have been fed here in America. Gaddafi certainly didn't do himself any favors with his overall appearance. He dressed and presented himself in a rather strange way,.....almost in a halty, dictatorial way. He also seemed flippant in his demeanour. I'm sure that's how the West, (us), wanted him to appear, so we would draw the opinion that we all did. Now we are hearing something very different. Makes you wonder. Now don't get me wrong, in that I readily acknowledge that our hierarchy is rotten to the core and not to be trusted. Not to say that I completely buy everything that I'm reading here,....but it does make you reconsider. Makes me wonder if we'll ever know what has really transpired over the many years, in this world, or will we have to all find out in the great beyond?

The Colonel marched to the beat of his own drum.
Why does that make you feel uncomfortable?

Omni
28th October 2011, 07:14
Great video, I'm not sure all is true just because I have no clue about libya. But if all that is true, Gaddafi is much much better than any of the douchebags starting the wars. Sounds like he's got a lot of things right. And if all that is true, it's obvious why they targeted him.

jcocks
28th October 2011, 08:06
Hmmm..

The more you look into these things...the less you realise you know ....

Lily de Cuir
28th October 2011, 08:38
Great video, I'm not sure all is true just because I have no clue about libya. But if all that is true, Gaddafi is much much better than any of the douchebags starting the wars. Sounds like he's got a lot of things right. And if all that is true, it's obvious why they targeted him.

Hey All,

This is a really great thread, thanks LS. I've sent links of this to my friends.....had some interesting comments back. It's all about waking up people who believe the mainstream crap, versus reality.

But people please, do not use the term 'douchebags'....do you actually know what it means Omniverse? It is very degrading to women.

Drop it please.:sad:

Cheers,
Lily de Cuir

Lord Sidious
28th October 2011, 12:51
If you want to see the Colonel, check this out.
http://abcnews.go.com/Archives/video/jan-27-1989-barbara-walters-interviews-gadhafi-12966961

Just found some more links to the interview. In parts, unfortunately.

http://abcnews.go.com/Archives/video/jan-27-1989-gadhafi-denies-terrorist-links-12967036

http://abcnews.go.com/Archives/video/jan-27-1989-gadhafi-introduces-family-12967106

Providence
28th October 2011, 13:10
If you want to see the Colonel, check this out.
http://abcnews.go.com/Archives/video/jan-27-1989-barbara-walters-interviews-gadhafi-12966961

He was right about the American people, and the American government, I just wish we would have seen through the media fog at the time and realized what he was saying. Of course, I would have interpreted this differently several years ago, with the 'twist' of the media, but it looks very different now.

kreagle
28th October 2011, 13:38
This is certainly not the information we have been fed here in America. Gaddafi certainly didn't do himself any favors with his overall appearance. He dressed and presented himself in a rather strange way,.....almost in a halty, dictatorial way. He also seemed flippant in his demeanour. I'm sure that's how the West, (us), wanted him to appear, so we would draw the opinion that we all did. Now we are hearing something very different. Makes you wonder. Now don't get me wrong, in that I readily acknowledge that our hierarchy is rotten to the core and not to be trusted. Not to say that I completely buy everything that I'm reading here,....but it does make you reconsider. Makes me wonder if we'll ever know what has really transpired over the many years, in this world, or will we have to all find out in the great beyond?

The Colonel marched to the beat of his own drum.
Why does that make you feel uncomfortable?

It's not that it makes me uncomfortable,....it's just that he didn't do himself any favors in trying to "sell his point of view" to the Western world by presenting himself in such a flamboyant way. He seemed to be almost sinister, or evil, in many ways,.....or else that's the way I think most Americans perceived him to be.

Lord Sidious
28th October 2011, 13:42
This is certainly not the information we have been fed here in America. Gaddafi certainly didn't do himself any favors with his overall appearance. He dressed and presented himself in a rather strange way,.....almost in a halty, dictatorial way. He also seemed flippant in his demeanour. I'm sure that's how the West, (us), wanted him to appear, so we would draw the opinion that we all did. Now we are hearing something very different. Makes you wonder. Now don't get me wrong, in that I readily acknowledge that our hierarchy is rotten to the core and not to be trusted. Not to say that I completely buy everything that I'm reading here,....but it does make you reconsider. Makes me wonder if we'll ever know what has really transpired over the many years, in this world, or will we have to all find out in the great beyond?

The Colonel marched to the beat of his own drum.
Why does that make you feel uncomfortable?

It's not that it makes me uncomfortable,....it's just that he didn't do himself any favors in trying to "sell his point of view" to the Western world by presenting himself in such a flamboyant way. He seemed to be almost sinister, or evil, in many ways,.....or else that's the way I think most Americans perceived him to be.

Aha, ok, got ya.
The problem is cultural.
If you haven't been around arabs so much, some of their behaviour appears strange.
I have spent a lot of time with them, so my comprehension of their English and their idiosyncrasies is better.
I think very highly of them and their culture, except the lower status of their women, which the Colonel didn't appreciate either.

Providence
28th October 2011, 16:07
It's not that it makes me uncomfortable,....it's just that he didn't do himself any favors in trying to "sell his point of view" to the Western world by presenting himself in such a flamboyant way. He seemed to be almost sinister, or evil, in many ways,.....or else that's the way I think most Americans perceived him to be.

I don't believe that he needed to sell his point of view to the Western world, it wouldn't have worked anyway, and he, of all people, understood that more than any of us at the time. This is, as Lord Sidious has pointed out, an interpretation through cultural "glasses". He had proven that his system worked, he knew how diabolical the US government can be when they set out to take down a dictator, and I think he knew the futility of trying to state your case to a people blinded by misinformation and lies.

No offense intended kreagle, just my point of view!

161803398
29th October 2011, 04:30
I think part of the problem Gaddafi had was that he was a combination of things not usually seen together, one of them being genius. Most people don't like people who are different. People keep crying out for something new; can't think of what that might be; and then when they see it, instead of being open; they start making judgments about it "Well, that just not normal".

I'm thinking of that acting excerise "neanderthals approaching a chair". New things cause a lot of suspicion.

161803398
29th October 2011, 05:33
Its going to be like Ireland.

http://www.opinion-maker.org/2011/10/libya-the-actual-war-begins-now/

Lord Sidious
29th October 2011, 05:45
Its going to be like Ireland.

http://www.opinion-maker.org/2011/10/libya-the-actual-war-begins-now/

Very interesting.
Those young Libyans are better informed than most westerners.
And they show the corporations are already there.
Just like the Colonel has said would happen.

truth4me
29th October 2011, 06:41
This is certainly not the information we have been fed here in America. Gaddafi certainly didn't do himself any favors with his overall appearance. He dressed and presented himself in a rather strange way,.....almost in a halty, dictatorial way. He also seemed flippant in his demeanour. I'm sure that's how the West, (us), wanted him to appear, so we would draw the opinion that we all did. Now we are hearing something very different. Makes you wonder. Now don't get me wrong, in that I readily acknowledge that our hierarchy is rotten to the core and not to be trusted. Not to say that I completely buy everything that I'm reading here,....but it does make you reconsider. Makes me wonder if we'll ever know what has really transpired over the many years, in this world, or will we have to all find out in the great beyond?

The Colonel marched to the beat of his own drum.
Why does that make you feel uncomfortable?

It's not that it makes me uncomfortable,....it's just that he didn't do himself any favors in trying to "sell his point of view" to the Western world by presenting himself in such a flamboyant way. He seemed to be almost sinister, or evil, in many ways,.....or else that's the way I think most Americans perceived him to be.a few years back when I was "asleep" I thought of Gaddafi as a "kook"job. As I woke up to what was really going on the "kooks" are really the people that are asleep believing everything the media tells them.....They are to busy worrying about who will win the Super Bowl or the next NASCAR race to worry about what happens to people in other countries....

161803398
29th October 2011, 06:46
The Cost Of Killing Gaddafi

Posted on 28. Oct, 2011 by Editor in Hot Topics
[Translate]
TRUE ACCOUNT OF THE WESTERN AGENDA…………..

By Shenali Waduge

In 2009 Libya was a friend to the US so much so that Libya allowed several US corporate giants to enter and approval was given for training of Libyan security personnel and civilians. These were the civilians that eventually became “rebels” given arms by the West to overthrow Gaddafi in a movement called “liberating Libya”. Arming locals has become a new strategy to avoid deaths to coalition forces while NATO is tasked to take on the indiscriminate air strikes. So what has been the cost for killing a man who has ruled a nation for 42 years without debt to the IMF or the World Bank? It took 8 months for US-NATO to take over Libya, the pro-US Libyan Government may celebrate and rejoice but that celebration is as short-lived as the jubilations in Iraq and Egypt where the people are beginning to realize their country would have still been better off with Saddam Hussein and Hosni Mubarak!

The world needs to know that Gaddafi gave Libyans. Education in Libya is free to everyone from elementary school right up to university and post-graduate study, at home or abroad, Libyans enjoy free health care, ratio of one doctor per 673 citizens. Libyans are given interest free housing loans, free land for farmers. In 2010, Libya ranked 53rd on the Human Development Index (out of 170 U.N. member states), making it a “high human development” country, electricity is free for all its citizens. If a Libyan buys a car, the government subsidized 50% of the price. Price of petrol in Libya is $0.14 per liter. Libya has no external debt and its reserves amount to $150 billion – now frozen globally A mother who gave birth to a child receives US$5,000, 40 loaves of bread in Libya costs $ 0.15, 25% of Libyans have a university degree, All newlyweds in Libya receive $60,000 Dinar (US$50,000) by the government to buy their first apartment so to help start up the family. Prior to the international sanction placed on Gaddafi and Libya in the 1980s, it was one of the richest in the world by GDP per capita – with a living standard higher than Japan. It was the richest in Africa before the revolution. Libya is the only country in North Africa where terrorists do not exist. Fundamentalists have no voice whatsoever in Libya. Not a single terror-incident has been recorded in Libya during Gaddafi’s regime. Gaddafi is no saint but the above examples show that the qualities of leadership that made Libya what it was need to be benchmarked against what the US & West have in store for Libya that has been purposely destroyed to advance the agenda of the West.

With the death of Gaddafi the most important question is where are the 50,000 people that Gaddafi is supposed to have killed prior to US-NATO forces attacking Libya? Clearly the “genocide” claim is a lie – a little too late as the objective of killing Gaddafi has been achieved.

The number of civilian casualties as a result of US-NATO airstrikes, rebel attacks and pro-Government forces range between 1000 & 10,000. These remain only “estimates”. Mainstream media has erred in blaming deaths caused by pro-Gaddafi totally ignoring the reality that the majority of deaths would have resulted by the indiscriminate bombing by US-NATO air strikes. NATO cannot deny that it has purposely targeted civilian infrastructure – hospitals (Al-Tajura Hospital and Saladin Hospital in Ain Zara), power generating facilities, water purification systems, tv stations and other communication networks, civilian airports, schools, government buildings and residential complexes. The purpose of such bombings is obviously to destroy the country’s institutions. The UN Human Rights organization or other human rights bodies seem to care little for the realism behind the exercise of freeing Libya and at the fatalities that has been caused by NATO which has no mandate whatsoever to carry out air strikes on Libya. What these international bodies are doing to humanity is a shame and a crime for which all of them must be tried for holding office and remaining silent over crimes taking place under false motives and concocted lies.

Thus the “humanitarian” bombing campaign part of the R2P agenda is part and parcel of a new military strategy carved by the West and a major component of this strategy is to destroy civilian infrastructure. This methodology was applied in Yugoslavia and Iraq where bridges, power plants, water systems, cultural and historical heritages, schools and hospitals were all identified as “legitimate military targets” validated in advance. In Yugoslavia the civilian economy was the target.

The US military intervention in Libya has cost America USD896million. While UK tax payers have to fork out £200m and likely to cost up to £1bn and rising just to kill one man! In all the operation to free Libya of Gaddafi would have cost USD 2 billion.

The USA is morally and financially broke, uneducated and sick but it is its arrogance that continues to think that all nations must bow down to US dictates. Gaddafi’s Libya will soon find out what it is like to live in a country without Gaddafi’s charisma in a country that is soon likely to be fleeced by the West. Where people will be broke, without money, hungry, paying for all services but reminded all the while that they are “free, liberated & enjoying the fruits of human rights”. In the meanwhile, the US will ensure friction amongst tribes in Libya so that turmoil will prevail just like they are doing in Iraq and Afghanistan while Western oil giants cease the oil, gold and all natural resources that Libya possesses which in reality was the reason for the whole exercise of humanitarian intervention.

It is not difficult to comprehend the trend that is taking place and the dangers of the West’s financial turmoil will mean further “humanitarian” operations on targeted nations and the basis for the next stop being Syria is already under way.

Let all US-NATO nations realize that the people of the world are no fools. Citizens of these nations may be fooled since mainstream media have blinded them with lies and false versions to brainwash them but nemesis for the innocent deaths will follow US-NATO and their leaders for the destruction they are doing to the people, the environment and to nations throughout the past decade.

Courtesy Sri Lanka Guardian

161803398
29th October 2011, 06:53
http://www.opinion-maker.org/2011/10/us-led-bogus-wars/

Lord Sidious
29th October 2011, 06:54
Did anyone notice that this is how Darth Sidious killed the jedi?
He had a secret order implanted into the clone troopers and when the time came, they turned on them.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09n0qd_n4c0

161803398
29th October 2011, 07:06
Has President Obama become a joke?

Posted on 26. Oct, 2011 by Alan Hart in Opinion
[Translate]
I am also wondering if Obama has any real grasp of the fact that largely because of his support for Israel right or wrong, America is becoming as isolated in the world as it is.

Last Saturday in his radio address to his own people and over the internet to those around the world who still think he is worth listening to, President Obama said, “This week we had two powerful reminders of how we've renewed American leadership in the world.” That made me wonder which of the two d’s should be applied to him – duplicitous or deluded. (I won’t argue with any readers who might say that he is both because being duplicitous eventually makes you delusional. Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu is best proof of that).

According to Obama the two powerful reminders were the death of Muammar Gaddafi and the end of the war in Iraq. The day before his Saturday show the president declared the killing of the Libyan leader to be “momentous”; and he told his fellow Americans that the long and costly war in Iraq will be over by the end of the year and that all 40,000 U.S. servicemen and women still there “will definitely be home for the holidays.”

It could be that I am missing something but I can’t see how the killing of Gaddafi was one of two powerful reminders of renewed American leadership in the world. That said, one possible implication of Obama’s rhetoric is that CIA agents and their Libyan assets played a major role in bringing the Libyan pot to boiling point for regime change. If that was so, Obama’s unspoken message to his fellow Americans last Saturday was something like: “Trust me. I’m not a soft touch. I am more ready and willing than any of my recent predecessors to authorise whatever actions are necessary to destroy those who stand in the way of our foreign policy objectives.” (No doubt some of those who advise Obama are hoping that Iran will be the next target).

The only reason why all American servicemen and women will be leaving Iraq is Obama’s failure to persuade the government of Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki to keep US bases and several thousand troops there indefinitely on America’s terms. They were that American troops would not be subject to Iraqi law. (In each of the many countries country where American forces are based, the US insists on legal immunity for them, refuses to let them be tried by foreigners).

As Jonathan Steele pointed out in an article for The Guardian, the issue of legal immunity for American forces was especially sensitive in Iraq “after numerous US murders of civilians and the Abu Ghraib scandal in which Iraqi prisoners were sexually humiliated.”

The same article delivered what I think is a very sound judgement of America’s achievement in Iraq. Steele wrote:

“The final troop withdrawal marks a complete defeat for Bush's Iraq project. The neocons' grand plan to use the 2003 invasion to turn the country into a secure pro-Western democracy and a garrison for US bases that could put pressure on Syria and Iran lies in tatters… Their hopes of making Iraq a democratic model for the Middle East have been tipped on their head. The instability and bloodshed which the US unleashed in Iraq were the example that Arabs sought to avoid, not emulate… But the neocons' biggest defeat is that, thanks to Bush's toppling of Saddam Hussein, Iran's greatest enemy, Tehran's influence in Iraq is much stronger today than is America's.”

How that contributes to renewing America’s leadership in the world is beyond my comprehension.

In his radio address Obama the master of rhetoric also said, “After a decade of war, we're turning the page and moving forward with strength and confidence.”

I found myself wondering what his confidence is based on.

America is bankrupt (as are most if not all the nations of the Western world).

According to the latest polls, Obama’s job approval rating is somewhere between 36 and 42 percent, and likely to fall to an historic low if there is not significant progress on reducing unemployment (or at least halting its rise) and home ownership foreclosures.

And according to a CNN/ORC International poll, only 15 (repeat 15!) percent of Americans asked said that they trust the federal government to do the right thing most of the time.

On the foreign policy front the only two things America leads the world in are support for the Zionist (not Jewish) state of Israel right or wrong and targeted assassinations

I am also wondering if Obama has any real grasp of the fact that largely because of his support for Israel right or wrong, America is becoming as isolated in the world as it is.

I’ll conclude by saying that it gives me no pleasure to write about Obama in the way I am now doing. I was among the many who were initially inspired by his rhetoric and dared to invest some hope in the view that he would change America and the world for the better. I now think he was never going to be a president who could give substance to his soaring rhetoric because he was too inexperienced and too naive for the job.

So with regret my own answer to the headline question is “Yes”, he has become a joke.

Footnote:

As I write one of the questions I am asking myself is this. Is it possible that supporters of Hillary Clinton will seek to prevail upon Obama not to run for a second term, to clear the way for them draft her, to give the Democrats what they will believe to be a better chance of preventing the Republican Mitt Romney being the next occupant of the White House? Much might depend on how much of a boost Obama gets in the polls for bringing the servicemen and women home from Iraq. But obviously all bets will be off if the American and perhaps even the whole global economy crashes between now and the end of the year.

Rating: 9.9/10 (13 votes cast)

Violet
29th October 2011, 07:19
Okay now, I do respect the dead but I have a problem with the overglorification of Gadafi lately.

I mean what do we do with other facts:

- Lockerbie
- apartheid treatment for the people of Ben Ghazi
- attempt to kill Hassan II of Morocco
- the killing of numerous political dissidents and active muslims
- the wasteful life of the riches his children led
- the bribe he attempted to give in order to make his son a famous football player when he was refused in Europe
- the bribe he (alledgedly) paid to Switzerland to free his son when jailed for assault servants (Not sure what it was here exactly: I also heard: threat to remove all of the Libyan assets from Swiss banks. Whatever it was, it sure got the son out pretty quickly.)
- the discrepancy between the natural wealth of Libya and the actual state of the country and citizens. Now, in se there's nothing wrong with Libya, in fact it's doing so good in Africa that we're obviously glorifying it now. But by the wealth of Libya, living standards should be 10 if not 100 times more voluptuous than the UAE. So, part of the wealth is gone missing...somewhere.
- ...

Well, I'm just curious, why these things no longer matter now. And we don't need to talk harsh about the man. He's dead and suffered an inhumane death, let this be clear.

Lord Sidious
29th October 2011, 07:29
Erm, Lockerbie is down to al ciada, most likely.
The rest? Dunno about them.
As I have said, he isn't perfect, but a stack better than the ''leaders'' we have in the west.

161803398
29th October 2011, 08:18
It's not that it makes me uncomfortable,....it's just that he didn't do himself any favors in trying to "sell his point of view" to the Western world by presenting himself in such a flamboyant way. He seemed to be almost sinister, or evil, in many ways,.....or else that's the way I think most Americans perceived him to be.

Well, remember mom and apple pie Ted Bundy who looked like a TV lawyer. A lot of evil people look exactly like that. They try to cover it up. I don't think they'd be meeting Barbara Walters in a tent, for instance. He answered her questions in a thoughtful way. She might not have liked the answers...and certainly told her audience what they should think of them (I hate that). Did you notice how the new temp. leader of Libya smiles as he pummels women back to the stone age. Now THAT'S evil.

And what was that jazz about eye contact. In North America we make a big deal about this and I constantly watch people staring at me while I'm talking and not hearing a word I say. North American's are visual. Other cultures are auditory. In Ireland for instance you will often find people who don't look at you at all when you are talking; but they will hold their ear out. I think her comments were very stupid.

161803398
29th October 2011, 08:42
Lockerbie again:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGuzIHwkAf4=player_embedded


There's more videos and other posts about Lockerbie scattered around here and there.

161803398
29th October 2011, 08:47
And what do we do about this? Think Nato will help?

http://killinghope.org/


And what do we do about this "humanitarian" bombing. Does anyone buy into that?

And I have some wealthy friends. Their kids didn't turn out too well either.

viking
29th October 2011, 09:08
Okay now, I do respect the dead but I have a problem with the overglorification of Gadafi lately.

I mean what do we do with other facts:

- Lockerbie
- apartheid treatment for the people of Ben Ghazi
- attempt to kill Hassan II of Morocco
- the killing of numerous political dissidents and active muslims
- the wasteful life of the riches his children led
- the bribe he attempted to give in order to make his son a famous football player when he was refused in Europe
- the bribe he (alledgedly) paid to Switzerland to free his son when jailed for assault servants (Not sure what it was here exactly: I also heard: threat to remove all of the Libyan assets from Swiss banks. Whatever it was, it sure got the son out pretty quickly.)
- the discrepancy between the natural wealth of Libya and the actual state of the country and citizens. Now, in se there's nothing wrong with Libya, in fact it's doing so good in Africa that we're obviously glorifying it now. But by the wealth of Libya, living standards should be 10 if not 100 times more voluptuous than the UAE. So, part of the wealth is gone missing...somewhere.
- ...

Well, I'm just curious, why these things no longer matter now. And we don't need to talk harsh about the man. He's dead and suffered an inhumane death, let this be clear.

Hi Violet ...I appreciate your input but you need to take in all the information here on this thread, alot of what you have stated is only hear say and presented via the 'western media tricksters' ... it is easy if you possess all the tools to condition the masses ... you need to dig a little deeper for actual 'truth' on this topic ... As Sid has stated he was no where near being an angel, but what he achieved in Libya is an embassment to alot of western countries...we always have 2 sides to the coin...

viking

Lord Sidious
29th October 2011, 09:09
It's not that it makes me uncomfortable,....it's just that he didn't do himself any favors in trying to "sell his point of view" to the Western world by presenting himself in such a flamboyant way. He seemed to be almost sinister, or evil, in many ways,.....or else that's the way I think most Americans perceived him to be.

Well, remember mom and apple pie Ted Bundy who looked like a TV lawyer. A lot of evil people look exactly like that. They try to cover it up. I don't think they'd be meeting Barbara Walters in a tent, for instance. He answered her questions in a thoughtful way. She might not have liked the answers...and certainly told her audience what they should think of them (I hate that). Did you notice how the new temp. leader of Libya smiles as he pummels women back to the stone age. Now THAT'S evil.

And what was that jazz about eye contact. In North America we make a big deal about this and I constantly watch people staring at me while I'm talking and not hearing a word I say. North American's are visual. Other cultures are auditory. In Ireland for instance you will often find people who don't look at you at all when you are talking; but they will hold their ear out. I think her comments were very stupid.

The observation about eye contact was not only incorrect, in that he did look her in the eyes, but it was very juvenile.
This is partially why the Colonel says Americans don't know much of the outside world.
In lots of cultures, the Australian Aborigines for example, only a superior can look you in the eye. This is why you will often hear ''What are you looking at?'' when you look them in the eyes, they take it as a challenge.
If you are in Libya, do as the Libyans do.
If you are in New York, do as Americans do.
That is what the neutral individual with intelligence would do.

lake
29th October 2011, 09:18
This chap has a passionate point of view:


zCnFBqVwhw8

Violet
29th October 2011, 10:20
Okay now, I do respect the dead but I have a problem with the overglorification of Gadafi lately.

I mean what do we do with other facts:

- Lockerbie
- apartheid treatment for the people of Ben Ghazi
- attempt to kill Hassan II of Morocco
- the killing of numerous political dissidents and active muslims
- the wasteful life of the riches his children led
- the bribe he attempted to give in order to make his son a famous football player when he was refused in Europe
- the bribe he (alledgedly) paid to Switzerland to free his son when jailed for assault servants (Not sure what it was here exactly: I also heard: threat to remove all of the Libyan assets from Swiss banks. Whatever it was, it sure got the son out pretty quickly.)
- the discrepancy between the natural wealth of Libya and the actual state of the country and citizens. Now, in se there's nothing wrong with Libya, in fact it's doing so good in Africa that we're obviously glorifying it now. But by the wealth of Libya, living standards should be 10 if not 100 times more voluptuous than the UAE. So, part of the wealth is gone missing...somewhere.
- ...

Well, I'm just curious, why these things no longer matter now. And we don't need to talk harsh about the man. He's dead and suffered an inhumane death, let this be clear.

Hi Violet ...I appreciate your input but you need to take in all the information here on this thread, alot of what you have stated is only hear say and presented via the 'western media tricksters' ... it is easy if you possess all the tools to condition the masses ... you need to dig a little deeper for actual 'truth' on this topic ... As Sid has stated he was no where near being an angel, but what he achieved in Libya is an embassment to alot of western countries...we always have 2 sides to the coin...

viking

Are you truly claiming that no such things happened in Switzerland and that the servants or Western media tricksters probably made the story up? That Gadafi's children did not lead wasteful lives? I mean, come on...This is a bit naive don't you think?

I won't finish the whole list but surely we can't go on blaming Western media and the Rotschilds for everything we feel is not right.

Violet
29th October 2011, 10:37
This chap has a passionate point of view:


This makes sense too.

viking
29th October 2011, 10:39
Okay now, I do respect the dead but I have a problem with the overglorification of Gadafi lately.

I mean what do we do with other facts:

- Lockerbie
- apartheid treatment for the people of Ben Ghazi
- attempt to kill Hassan II of Morocco
- the killing of numerous political dissidents and active muslims
- the wasteful life of the riches his children led
- the bribe he attempted to give in order to make his son a famous football player when he was refused in Europe
- the bribe he (alledgedly) paid to Switzerland to free his son when jailed for assault servants (Not sure what it was here exactly: I also heard: threat to remove all of the Libyan assets from Swiss banks. Whatever it was, it sure got the son out pretty quickly.)
- the discrepancy between the natural wealth of Libya and the actual state of the country and citizens. Now, in se there's nothing wrong with Libya, in fact it's doing so good in Africa that we're obviously glorifying it now. But by the wealth of Libya, living standards should be 10 if not 100 times more voluptuous than the UAE. So, part of the wealth is gone missing...somewhere.
- ...

Well, I'm just curious, why these things no longer matter now. And we don't need to talk harsh about the man. He's dead and suffered an inhumane death, let this be clear.

Hi Violet ...I appreciate your input but you need to take in all the information here on this thread, alot of what you have stated is only hear say and presented via the 'western media tricksters' ... it is easy if you possess all the tools to condition the masses ... you need to dig a little deeper for actual 'truth' on this topic ... As Sid has stated he was no where near being an angel, but what he achieved in Libya is an embassment to alot of western countries...we always have 2 sides to the coin...

viking

Are you truly claiming that no such things happened in Switzerland and that the servants or Western media tricksters probably made the story up? That Gadafi's children did not lead wasteful lives? I mean, come on...This is a bit naive don't you think?

I won't finish the whole list but surely we can't go on blaming Western media and the Rotschilds for everything we feel is not right.

Hi Violet...The Rothchilds have their tentacles in more things that you could ever imagine ...I'm not saying the Gadafi children did not lead wasteful lives as many high ranking officials do ... its disgusts me, to say the least ...

We have been controlled for thousands of years by these evil selfish greedy manipulators ... for too long ... soon it will be our turn.

I am far from naive my freind.

viking

Violet
29th October 2011, 10:58
Okay now, I do respect the dead but I have a problem with the overglorification of Gadafi lately.

I mean what do we do with other facts:

- Lockerbie
- apartheid treatment for the people of Ben Ghazi
- attempt to kill Hassan II of Morocco
- the killing of numerous political dissidents and active muslims
- the wasteful life of the riches his children led
- the bribe he attempted to give in order to make his son a famous football player when he was refused in Europe
- the bribe he (alledgedly) paid to Switzerland to free his son when jailed for assault servants (Not sure what it was here exactly: I also heard: threat to remove all of the Libyan assets from Swiss banks. Whatever it was, it sure got the son out pretty quickly.)
- the discrepancy between the natural wealth of Libya and the actual state of the country and citizens. Now, in se there's nothing wrong with Libya, in fact it's doing so good in Africa that we're obviously glorifying it now. But by the wealth of Libya, living standards should be 10 if not 100 times more voluptuous than the UAE. So, part of the wealth is gone missing...somewhere.
- ...

Well, I'm just curious, why these things no longer matter now. And we don't need to talk harsh about the man. He's dead and suffered an inhumane death, let this be clear.

Hi Violet ...I appreciate your input but you need to take in all the information here on this thread, alot of what you have stated is only hear say and presented via the 'western media tricksters' ... it is easy if you possess all the tools to condition the masses ... you need to dig a little deeper for actual 'truth' on this topic ... As Sid has stated he was no where near being an angel, but what he achieved in Libya is an embassment to alot of western countries...we always have 2 sides to the coin...

viking

Are you truly claiming that no such things happened in Switzerland and that the servants or Western media tricksters probably made the story up? That Gadafi's children did not lead wasteful lives? I mean, come on...This is a bit naive don't you think?

I won't finish the whole list but surely we can't go on blaming Western media and the Rotschilds for everything we feel is not right.

Hi Violet...The Rothchilds have their tentacles in more things that you could ever imagine ...I'm not saying the Gadafi children did not lead wasteful lives as many high ranking officials do ... its disgusts me, to say the least ...

We have been controlled for thousands of years by these evil selfish greedy manipulators ... for too long ... soon it will be our turn.

I am far from naive my freind.

viking

No of course not. I couldn't claim that of you with certainty not knowing who you are, could I know. :o

I guess it were the statements to which I was alluding.

viking
29th October 2011, 11:13
Interesting link here which is buried in the depths of this thread...

Notice the images at the end ... Looks a very sharp looking country to me...and not what the 'western media tricksters' are portraying ...now they have completely trashed many towns and villages ... hey guess who gets the contracts for re-build !!!

Anyway have a read here...

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?32944-Libya-Gaddafi-The-Truth-you-are-not-supposed-to-know&p=343035#post343035

viking

161803398
29th October 2011, 17:09
Aisha Gaddafi is a lawyer, mediator and former goodwill ambassador to the UN. I have no idea how "wasteful" she is. What is the relevance of "wasteful" children to anything? Is Nato now killing the parents of "wasteful children". I dont get it. Or are we saying parents of wasteful children are bad people? hmmmmm I have serious concerns if that is the case...sounds a tad extremist to me.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/8052611/Aisha-Gaddafi-defending-the-wrongly-accused.html

Personally, I didn't like Gaddafi's hat :) But I think I know the people who are the most wasteful. These wars that go on forever are a waste of human life; a waste of money; and a waste of the environment and resources.

But I think they are a little economical because they are using the depleted uranium on the people of the middle east and africa. Now there's a resource that's not being wasted.

Here is some arab dos and don'ts. I think its probably impolite to maintain eye contact with women in their culture...that is if you are a nice guy.


ARAB CUSTOMS AND CULTURE


All Arabs share basic beliefs and values that cross national and social class boundaries. Social attitudes have remained constant because Arab society is more conservative and demands conformity from its members. It is important for Western observers to be able to identify and distinguish these cultural patterns from individual behaviors. Although Iraq is a secular country, the traditional Islamic culture predominates, with Qur’anic Law playing an active role in the day-to-day life in the country.


ARAB WORLD VIEW:

An Arab worldview is based upon six concepts: atomism, faith, wish versus reality,
justice and equality, paranoia and the importance of family over self:

• Atomism. Arabs tend to see the world and events as isolated incidents, snapshots, and particular moments in time. This is a key psychological feature of Arab culture. Westerners look for unifying concepts whereas Arabs focus on parts, rather than on the whole. It also means the Western concept of cause and effect is rarely accepted by Arabs who may not necessarily see a unifying link between events. They do, however, maintain a long-term memory over actions and events. It is important to point out that it is memory, not necessarily history that is important.
• Deep belief in God. Arabs usually believe that many, if not all, things in life are controlled by the will of God (fate) rather than by human beings. What might appear as fatalism initially is more deeply a belief in God's power, sovereignty, active participation in the life of the believer, and authority over all things (business transactions, relationships, world events, etc.).
• Wish versus reality. Arabs, much more so than Westerners, express emotion in a forceful, animated and exaggerated fashion. Their desire for modernity is contradicted by a desire for tradition (especially Islamic tradition, since Islam is the one area free of Western identification and influence). Desiring democracy and modernization immediately is a good example of what a Westerner might view as an Arabs “wish vs. reality.”
• Importance of justice and equality. Arabs value justice and equality more than anything else. All actions taken by the US will constantly be weighed in comparison to tradition and religious standards.
• Paranoia. Arabs may seem to be paranoid by Western standards. Suspicion of US intent in their land and a cautious approach to American forces are a primary example. Some Arabs view all Westerners as agents of the government that may be “spies.” Especially in the ethnically diverse areas, mistrust runs deep amongst these various groups.
• Family over self. Arabic communities are tight-knit groups made up of even tighter family groups and most often, apart of tribes. Most Westerners pride themselves on personal accomplishments instead of the typical Arab whose focus is on family pride and honor.


FAMILY:

Arab families are often large and strongly influence individuals’ lives. The family is the
basic societal unit and is very strong and close-knit. Arabs gain status by being born into the right family. A patriarchal system, the father is the head of the family and is considered a role model. Few women work outside the home, though the number has increased with urbanization. Each gender is considered its own social subgroup, interacting only in the home. All activities revolve around family life, and any member’s achievement advances the reputation of the entire family. One’s family is a source of reputation and honor, as well as financial and psychological support. An Arab’s first loyalty is to the family, which cannot be dishonored. Therefore, maintenance of family honor is one of the highest values in Arab society. Since misbehavior by women can do more damage to family honor than misbehavior by men, clearly defined patterns of behavior have been developed to protect women and help them avoid situations that may give rise to false impressions or unfounded gossip.


HONOR:

An Arab’s Honor is cherished and protected above anything else, sometimes
circumventing even the need for survival. Criticism, even constructive criticism, can threaten or damage an Arab’s honor; it will be taken as a personal insult. The Arab must, above all else, protect himself and his honor from this critical onslaught. Therefore, when an Arab is confronted by criticism, you can expect him to react by interpreting the facts to suit himself or flatly denying the facts. Therefore, a Westerner should take a very indirect approach towards any corrective remarks and include praise of any good points.
Similar to this concept is the importance Arabs place on appearances and politeness
regardless of the accuracy of the statement. For example, to questions which require a yes
or a no, such as “Do you understand?” the Arab's preoccupation with appearances and
politeness automatically requires that he answer “yes” whether it is true or not. In the Arab world, a flat “no” is a signal that you want to end the relationship. The polite way for an Arab to say no is to say, “I'll see what I can do,” no matter how impossible the task may be. After the Arab has been queried several times concerning his success, an answer of “I'm still checking” or something similar, means “no.” Such an indirect response also means “I am still your friend, I tried.” Therefore when dealing with Arabs or Iraqis, remember that the “yes” you hear does not always means yes and might mean no.






WOMEN:

Traditional Arab women are subordinate to men in their society. The extent varies by country, and you cannot generalize. The most restrictive conditions exist on the Arabian Peninsula, and the most relaxed conditions exist in Egypt, Syria, and Lebanon. In Iraq, dress codes for women are still conservative with women wearing headscarves in public. Dresses are cut from below the knee to the ankle and blouses cover the shoulder and much of the arm. Women in Iraq do not hold managerial positions and their opinions and input will most likely be ignored. Do not show any type of interest in an Arab woman or female members of an Arab family. Do not photograph them, stare at them or try to speak to them. Do not ask about women, it is considered too personal and rude. It is best to ask about the "family," not a person's wife, sister, or daughter. Men should stand when a woman enters the room. Public displays of affection between the sexes, even foreigners, are unacceptable. Arab society has a basically negative stereotyped impression of Western women as loose or immoral. Female soldiers need to be careful not to reinforce this impression by their dress and conduct.

As a Male, Do:

• Respect the privacy and protected role of Arab women.
As a Male, Do Not:
• Flirt, hit-on, touch, hug, talk in private with Arab Women. IT WILL ENDANGER
THEIR SAFETY. Family members and the average Arab man will threaten a woman if
they witness any casual relationship occurring with a foreigner.
• Try to engage an Arab woman in conversation unless you have been formally
introduced.
• Stare at an Arab woman or maintain eye contact with them.
• Talk in public to professional women, even non-Arab women, except on business.
• Kiss, touch or show affection toward any woman in public, including a non-Arab
woman.
• Ask an Arab direct questions about his wife or other female members of his family.
• Expect an Arab to introduce you to a veiled woman.

If you are a Woman, Do:

• Dress in a manner acceptable to Arabs. Uniforms for US Armed Forces personnel are
always correct. For civilian attire, western clothing is acceptable if it is loose and
covers the neck, arms and legs. Western women are not expected to wear veils.
Wear what would be appropriate within a US compound or facility.
• Expect to be excluded from some stores.

If you are a Woman, Do Not:

• Wear tight or revealing clothing in public. This is considered immodest and undignified
in Arab culture.
• Kiss, touch or show affection toward any man in public.
GREETINGS:

Arab men shake hands very gently and may pull those he greets toward him and kiss
them on either cheek in greeting. Arabs may also hold hands to walk to other locations. If an Arab does not touch someone he greets, he either does not like him or is restraining himself because he perceives the person is unaccustomed to being touched. After shaking hands, the gesture of placing the right hand to the heart is a greeting with respect or sincerity. (For women, placing the right hand over the heart after serving food is a sign of offering with sincerity.) To kiss the forehead, nose, or right hand of a person denotes extreme respect. Shake hands with the right hand only; the left hand is considered unclean. Failure to shake hands when meeting someone or saying good-bye is considered rude. When a Western man is introduced to an Arab woman it is the woman's choice whether to shake hands or not; she must initiate the handshake. Women shake hands only using their fingertips. Do not touch their palm and do not kiss her hand. Women do not kiss a man’s cheek in greeting, it is considered immodest.


GESTURES:

There are gestures used in the Arab world that convey different meanings from those
used in America.
• An Arab may signify “yes” with a downward nod. “No” can be signaled in several ways: tilting one’s head slightly back and raising the eyebrows; moving one’s head back and chin upward; moving one’s head back and making a clicking sound with the tongue; or using the open palm moved from right to left toward the person.
..• “That’s enough, thank you,” may be indicated by patting the heart a few times.
..• “Excellent” is expressed with open palms toward the person.
..• “OK” may be shown by touching the outer edge of one’s eyes with the fingertips.
..• The “A-OK” (forming a circle with the index finger and thumb of one hand) gesture is
considered obscene by Arabs.
..• The “thumbs-up” is considered obscene by the older, more traditional Arabs. The
younger generation has taken on the Western identification of saying hello. It is
recommended that soldiers wave in return.
..• The left hand is considered unclean; the right hand should be used when gesturing.
..• To beckon another person, all fingers wave with the palm facing downward.
..• Other gestures include kissing your own right hand, then raising your eyes and your
right hand used for expressing thanks.
..• Touching the fingertips of your right hand to your forehead while bowing the head
slightly, is a sign of deep respect.
..• Placing the right hand or forefinger on the tip of the nose, right lower eyelid, top of the
head, mustache or beard means “it’s my responsibility,” or “I’ll gladly do it for you.”
..• Hitting the right fist into the open palm of the left hand indicates obscenity or contempt.
..• Stroking the mustache in connection with an oath or a promise indicates sincerity.
..• Do not allow the exposed sole of your foot/shoe to face a person, it is interpreted as a
grievous insult, and considered extremely bad manners.
..• It is important to sit properly without slouching. Never sit with one ankle on your other
leg’s knee, leaving the bottom of your foot pointing at someone. Sit with both feet on
the floor and palms down on the thighs. Do not slide down or wiggle around excessively, it is considered very rude.
..• Do not lean against walls or have hands in your pocket when talking.
..• Do not point or beckon someone with the index finger it shows contempt for the person being pointed at, as if they were an animal.
..• Men stand when a woman enters the room; everyone stands when new guests arrive
at a social gathering and when an elderly or high-ranking person arrives or departs.


HOSPITALITY:

Arabs are generous and value generosity in others. Hospitality toward guests is essential for a good reputation. Arab hospitality requires that refreshments must always be offered to guests. When anything is offered, it is considered polite for the guest to decline at least twice before accepting, and for the host to offer at least three times before finally accepting a guest’s negative response.

As a Guest, Do:
• Arrive on time and expect a meal if you are invited to an Arab home. (Remember that
Arabs usually give approximate times but will welcome guests warmly whenever they
arrive).
• Understand that if a female accompanies you, she may be separated from you during
the visit to join the women in their living area.
• Always use your right hand in eating, drinking, offering, passing or receiving anything.
• Try all different foods offered you. You may ask about a dish that is unfamiliar to you.
• Eat heartedly.
• You may be offered alcohol. Remember General Order #1.
• Take seconds, even if only a small amount. It’s a compliment to your host.
• Compliment your host on the food and wish him always a full table.
• Take your leave promptly after the second or third round of coffee or tea after a meal.
Arabs usually socialize and converse before the meal, not after.
• Thank the host profusely for his hospitality and good conversation.
• Plan to return the hospitality.

As a Guest, Do Not:

• Feel obligated to bring a gift. If you do bring a gift, make it a gift for the children, which is always appreciated.
• Praise too much any of your host’s possessions; he may give it to you. If he does you
are expected to give something in return.
• Be aware that your presence may threaten the safety of your host, take appropriate
precautions.


As a Host, Do:

• Accompany your guest outside the door or gate when he leaves.

As a Host, Do Not:

• Appear anxious to end the visit.
• Ask or expect an Arab to uncover his head.

161803398
29th October 2011, 17:43
This project was expensive. Nato bombed it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qogT-DDKHgQ

161803398
29th October 2011, 18:06
OH...this is the lady who was married to the CIA agent who was talking about Faction 1 and Faction 2.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxMs-t76X58

Lord Sidious
30th October 2011, 00:45
Alf shukr, for the three posts.
The one on customs is exactly what I meant.
Luckily for me, I know them well, the arabs and I have admired them for many years.
I just struggle with the lesser position that women have in their society.

161803398
30th October 2011, 01:09
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaSEiF2niFU

Coming from a country with a Christian fundamentalist leader who believes that the end of the world is coming (and he seems to be increasingly influenced by this idea) I sometimes wonder how much the PTB are acting on these beliefs. There was another thread taking about people in the Pentagon saying the Annunaki are coming back. This guy, David Flynn in this and other videos talks about Jerusalem. In one video he shows the geometry and the special geometric position Jerusalem is in. So, do they believe that the "angels" will return if they rile up all the religions and get everyone fighting with each other. Then they can knock off the Persians have their NWO religious centre of the World in Israel. And do they need to steal so much money to build their great one world temple there. Is that part of what is behind Nato's dreadful behavior and the destruction of a beautiful country. I think the disgusting murder of Gaddafi, the bombing of the River, Hilary's behavior, the "humanitarian" bombing, the use of terrorists as "rebels" etc etc - these are acts of provocation, designed to be especially hurtful to any right thinking person.

161803398
30th October 2011, 17:57
This is what "liberation" looks like:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UL9jCWz8Pc


http://thesantosrepublic.com/2011/07/crime-against-humanity-nato-hits-libyan-great-man-made-river-russia-and-china-act-now-please/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lujzCYJYAU

161803398
30th October 2011, 20:02
Another war:

http://globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=27360

161803398
30th October 2011, 20:16
Al Qaeda Flag in Benghazi

http://uruknet.info/?p=m82678&hd&size=1&l=e

Lord Sidious
30th October 2011, 20:24
Interesting.


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/35/Flag_of_al-Qaeda_in_Iraq.svg/500px-Flag_of_al-Qaeda_in_Iraq.svg.png

The script on the flag says ''la illaha, illalah, Muhammad rasullulah.
This means ''There is no god but god and Muhammad is his messenger'' and is known as the Shahada.
This is what you say to convert to islam.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shahada

Ironic that NATO would bring Al Qaeda to Libya, no?
No, it isn't.
It is entirely consistent as they created this monster to start with.

161803398
30th October 2011, 20:36
Financing terrorism is expensive. Now they have Libyan oil to help.

I guess things were too quiet and the whole terrorist idea was losing credibility.

Or maybe the PTB just dont care about it. Going to Iran and calling up the BIG PERSIAN from the well.

I guess no one will want to go the middle east for the next 4.5 billion years after this mess is over.

161803398
30th October 2011, 20:47
ooops, I think I accidentally converted to Islam. ;)

viking
31st October 2011, 16:02
WHO WAS MUAMMAR QADDAFI? LIBYA'S WEALTH REDISTRIBUTION PROJECT

by Mahdi Darius Nazemroaya

Colonel Muammar Qaddafi symbolizes many things to many different people around the world. Love or hate the Libyan leader, under his rule Libya transformed from one of the poorest countries on the face of the planet into the country with the highest standard of living in Africa. In the words of Professor Henri Habibi:

When Libya was granted its independence by the United Nations on December 24, 1951, it was described as one of the poorest and most backward nations of the world. The population at the time was not more than 1.5 million, was over 90% illiterate, and had no political experience or knowhow. There were no universities, and only a limited number of high schools which had been established seven years before independence. [1]

Qaddafi had many grand plans. He wanted to create a South Atlantic Treaty Organization to protect Africa and Latin America. He advocated for a gold dinar standard as the currency of Muslim countries. Many of his plans were also of a pan-African nature. This included the formation of a United States of Africa.

Qaddafi’s Pan-African Projects

Colonel Qaddafi started the Great Man-Made River, which consisted in a massive project to transform the Sahara Desert and reverse the desertification of Africa. The Great Man-Made River with its irrigation plans was also intended to support the agricultural sector in other parts of Africa. This project was a military target of NATO bombings. Without just cause, NATO’s bombing campaign was intent upon destroying the Great Man-Made River.

Qaddafi also envisioned independent pan-African financial institutions. The Libyan Investment Authority and the Libyan Foreign Bank were important players in setting up these institutions. Qaddafi, through the Libyan Foreign Bank and the Libyan Investment Authority, was instrumental in setting up Africa’s first satellite network, the Regional African Satellite Communication Organization (RASCOM), to reduce African dependence on external powers. [2]

His crowning achievement would have been the creation of the United States of Africa. The supranational entity would have been created through the African Investment Bank, the African Monetary Fund, and finally the African Central Bank. These institutions were all viewed with animosity by the European Union, United States, International Monetary Fund (IMF), and World Bank.

Qaddafi’s Wealth Redistribution Project

Qaddafi had a wealth redistribution project inside Libya. U.S. Congressional sources in a report to the U.S. Congress even acknowledge this. On February 18, 2011 one report states:

In March 2008, [Colonel Qaddafi] announced his intention to dissolve most government administrative bodies and institute a Wealth Distribution Program whereby state oil revenues would be distributed to citizens on a monthly basis for them to administer personally, in cooperation, and via local committees. Citing popular criticism of government performance in a long, wide ranging speech, [he] repeatedly stated that the traditional state would soon be “dead” in Libya and that direct rule by citizens would be accomplished through the distribution of oil revenues. [The military], foreign affairs, security, and oil production arrangements reportedly would remain national government responsibilities, while other bodies would be phased out. In early 2009, Libya’s Basic People’s Congresses considered variations of the proposals, and the General People’s Congress voted to delay implementation. [3]

Qaddafi wanted all the people of Libya to have direct access to the nation’s wealth. He was also aware of the deep rooted corruption that plagued the ranks of the Libyan government. This was one of the reasons why he wanted to apply a model of political anarchy in Libya through progressive steps. He was talking about both these project for a few years.

On the other hand, the Wealth Redistribution Project, along with the establishment of an anarchist political system, was viewed as a very serious threat by the U.S., the E.U., and a group of corrupt Libyan officials. If successful, the reforms could have created political unrest amongst many domestic populations around the world. Internally, many Libyan officials were working to delay the project. This included reaching out to external powers to intervene in Libya to stop Qaddafi and his projects.

Why Mahmoud Jibril Joined the Transitional Council

Amongst the Libyan officials that were heavily opposed to this project and viewed it with horror was Mahmoud Jibril. Jibril was put into place by Saif Al-Islam Qaddafi. Because of strong influence and advice from the U.S. and the E.U., Saif Al-Islam selected Jibril to transform the Libyan economy and impose a wave of neo-liberal economic reforms that would open the Libyan market.

Jibril became the head of two bodies in the Libyan Arab Jamahiriya, the National Planning Council of Libya and National Economic Development Board of Libya. While the National Economic Development Board was a regular ministry, the National Planning Council would actually put Jibril in a government position above that of the Office of the General-Secretary of the People’s Committee of Libya (which is the equivalent of the post of a prime minister). Jibril actually became one of the forces that opened the doors of privatization and poverty in Libya.

About six months before the conflict erupted in Libya, Mahmoud Jibiril actually met with Bernard-Henri Lévy in Australia to discuss forming the Transitional Council and deposing Colonel Qaddafi. [4] He described Qaddafi’s Wealth Redistribution Project as “crazy” in minutes and documents from the National Economic Development Board of the Libyan Arab Jamahiriya. [5] Jibril strongly believed that the Libyan masses were not fit to govern themselves and that an elite should always control the fate and wealth of any nation. What Jibril wanted to do is downsize the Libyan government and layoff a large segment of the public sector, but in exchange increase government regulations in Libya. He would also always cite Singapore as the perfect example of a neo-liberal state. While in Singapore, which he regularly visited, it is likely that he also meet with Bernard-Henri Lévy.

When the problems erupted in Benghazi, Mahmoud Jibril immediately went to Cairo, Egypt. He told his colleagues that he would be back in Tripoli soon, but he had no intention of returning. In reality, he went to Cairo to meet the leaders of the Syrian National Council and Lévy. They were all waiting for him inside Cairo to coordinate the events in Libya and Syria. This is one of the reasons that the Transitional Council has recognized the Syrian National Council as the legitimate government of Syria.

Do Not Pity the Dead, Pity the Living!

Muammar Qaddafi is now dead.

He was murdered in his hometown of Sirte.

He stood his ground until the end like he said he would.

The Transitional Council, which vowed to take him to court had him murdered.

He even reminded the men who beat him, anally raped him, mocked him, and finally murdered him that they were not following the laws of Islam about respectful treatment of prisoners. NATO played a central role and oversaw the whole event.

The murder was systematic, because after Qaddafi was murdered his son and several other Libyan leaders were killed too.

Colonel Qaddafi’s death marks a historic milestone for Libya. An old era has ended in Libya and a new chapter begins.

Libya will not become a new paradise like the Transitional Council says. In many cases the living will envy the dead, because of men like Mahmoud Jibril, Ali Tarhouni, and Sliman Bouchuiguir.

Mahmoud Jibril is a mere opportunist. The man had no problems being a government official under the late Qaddafi. He never complained about human rights or a lack of democracy. He was the prime minister of the Transitional Council of Libya until a few days after the savage murder of Colonel Qaddafi. The opposition of Jibril to the late Qaddafi’s Wealth Redistribution Project and his elitist attitude are amongst the reasons he conspired against Qaddafi and helped form the Transitional Council.

Is this ex-regime official, who has always been an open supporter of the Arab dictators in the Persian Gulf, really a representative and champion of the people? How about his colleagues in the Transitional Council who negotiated oil contracts with NATO member states, even before they held any so-called government positions in the Transitional Council?

Mahdi Darius Nazemroaya is a Sociologist and Research Associate of the Centre for Research on Globalization (CRG), Montréal. He specializes on the Middle East and Central Asia. He was on the ground in Libya for over two months and was also a Special Correspondent for Flashpoints, which is an investigative news program carried on numerous stations in the United States and based in Berkeley, California. Nazemroaya has been releasing these articles about Libya in conjunction with aired discussions (now archived) with Cynthia McKinney on Freedom Now, a show aired on Saturdays on KPFK, Los Angeles, California.

Notes

[1] Henri Pierre Habib, Politics and Government of Revolutionary Libya (Montmagny, Québec: Le Cercle de Livre de France Ltée, 1975), p.1.

[2] Regional African Satellite Communication Organization, “Launch of the Pan African Satellite,” July 26, 2010:

<http://www.rascom.org/info_detail2.php?langue_id=2&info_id=120&id_sr=0&id_r=32&id_gr=3>

[3] Christopher M. Blanchard and James Zanotti, “Libya Christopher M. Blanchard and James Zanotti, “Libya: Background and U.S. Relations,” Congressional Research Service, February 18, 2011, p.22.

[4] Private discussions with Mahmoud Jiribil’s co-workers inside and outside of Libya.

[5] Internal private documents from the National Economic Development Board of the Libyan Arab Jamahiriya.

Oct. 27, 2011

Further reading here...
http://www.fourwinds10.net/siterun_data/government/fraud/africa/news.php?q=1320023068

161803398
1st November 2011, 04:51
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/8858409/Saadi-Gaddafi-smuggled-into-Niger-by-team-of-ex-special-forces-from-Australia-and-New-Zealand.html

jcocks
1st November 2011, 10:57
Ironic that NATO would bring Al Qaeda to Libya, no?
No, it isn't.
It is entirely consistent as they created this monster to start with.

Sounds exactly like what Emporer Palpatine did with the Seperatists (ie Al Queda / the Libyan Rebels sounds very much like the Seperatists in the first three star wars movies)....

I wonder if there's an "Emporer Palpatine" down in one of the DUMBS somewhere?

Lord Sidious
1st November 2011, 11:44
Ironic that NATO would bring Al Qaeda to Libya, no?
No, it isn't.
It is entirely consistent as they created this monster to start with.

Sounds exactly like what Emporer Palpatine did with the Seperatists (ie Al Queda / the Libyan Rebels sounds very much like the Seperatists in the first three star wars movies)....

I wonder if there's an "Emporer Palpatine" down in one of the DUMBS somewhere?

There is one, but I doubt that he is underground, he may not even be on earth right this minute.

Eagle
1st November 2011, 12:34
Ironic that NATO would bring Al Qaeda to Libya, no?
No, it isn't.
It is entirely consistent as they created this monster to start with.

Sounds exactly like what Emporer Palpatine did with the Seperatists (ie Al Queda / the Libyan Rebels sounds very much like the Seperatists in the first three star wars movies)....

I wonder if there's an "Emporer Palpatine" down in one of the DUMBS somewhere?

There is one, but I doubt that he is underground, he may not even be on earth right this minute.

Are you sure its just one, I think it is the small group of Emporers

Lord Sidious
1st November 2011, 15:15
Ironic that NATO would bring Al Qaeda to Libya, no?
No, it isn't.
It is entirely consistent as they created this monster to start with.

Sounds exactly like what Emporer Palpatine did with the Seperatists (ie Al Queda / the Libyan Rebels sounds very much like the Seperatists in the first three star wars movies)....

I wonder if there's an "Emporer Palpatine" down in one of the DUMBS somewhere?

There is one, but I doubt that he is underground, he may not even be on earth right this minute.

Are you sure its just one, I think it is the small group of Emporers

There may be a few apprentices, but there is only one boss.

AlexanderLight
1st November 2011, 15:20
Here are two links you may like:

Muammar Gaddafi - The Truth! (http://humansarefree.com/2011/10/muammar-gaddafi-truth.html)

Libyan Coup: The Truth (http://humansarefree.com/2011/10/libyan-coup-short-history-of-wars-and.html)

viking
1st November 2011, 15:31
Here are two links you may like:

Muammar Gaddafi - The Truth! (http://humansarefree.com/2011/10/muammar-gaddafi-truth.html)

Libyan Coup: The Truth (http://humansarefree.com/2011/10/libyan-coup-short-history-of-wars-and.html)

Thanks Alexander...

That second link is excellent....worth a read folks ....

viking

jackovesk
2nd November 2011, 08:05
http://rense.com/1.imagesH/ghad_dees.jpg

161803398
3rd November 2011, 03:50
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8rySxhjtyk






http://www.youtube.com/watch?yGeFhZqTOnM

161803398
3rd November 2011, 03:55
http://www.zimbio.com/Muammar+Gaddafi/articles/thoZJ8eBt1o/Jesse+Jackson+Questions+Motives+Libya

161803398
5th November 2011, 08:40
Benghazi Flag video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAfBoOsYK1c

161803398
5th November 2011, 08:51
Just before Nato started bombing Libya; the UN had decided to give Gaddafi an award for his achievements in the area of human rights. I cant decide whether to suck on some lemons or break a dish.

http://nsnbc.wordpress.com/2011/11/01/un-report-offers-smoking-gun-proof-of-nato-and-us-lies-about-libya/

161803398
5th November 2011, 09:41
Remember when you were a kid and you read history books about things people did long ago..and you thought to yourself: "how could anybody ever be that stupid?" Well, we are gonna be a laughing stock for the next 2K years. If there is a next 2K years.

Lord Sidious
5th November 2011, 09:56
Remember when you were a kid and you read history books about things people did long ago..and you thought to yourself: "how could anybody ever be that stupid?" Well, we are gonna be a laughing stock for the next 2K years. If there is a next 2K years.

Who is this ''we'' you speak of?
I am a legend in my own lunchbox, didn't you know? :p

viking
5th November 2011, 10:33
Just before Nato started bombing Libya; the UN had decided to give Gaddafi an award for his achievements in the area of human rights. I cant decide whether to suck on some lemons or break a dish.

http://nsnbc.wordpress.com/2011/11/01/un-report-offers-smoking-gun-proof-of-nato-and-us-lies-about-libya/

Cheers 16 ... posted on facebook ect etc ...

Excellent find...do read it folks....

viking

norman
5th November 2011, 18:01
Many people believe Gaddafi was a 'bad' man because they believed the story that PanAm flight 103 which exploded over Lockerbie in Scotland was his dirty work. How can we have sympathy for man who would do that to innocent people?

Well, Who really did do it, and why did they blame Gaddafi for it?

Here is a 16 part video which takes a look at the story all over again:

It's called The Maltese Double Cross.

PART ONE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TMU0vCGNz4


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TMU0vCGNz4

161803398
6th November 2011, 04:53
Gaddafi gets a mention here. Not bad poetry about our times:

shSsqP5vNEQ

161803398
8th November 2011, 08:59
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ED_cxSUnu0

161803398
11th November 2011, 21:03
In business you always have to keep your eyes on the future:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/10/mokhtar-belmokhtar-al-qaeda-libya-weapons_n_1086122.html?ref=libya

161803398
11th November 2011, 21:10
http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2011/11/11/libya-war-nato-fears-war-crimes-prosecutions_n_1087920.html?ref=libya

161803398
11th November 2011, 21:15
the new Carmen Sandiego? Goddamn it! I want new writers.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/03/saif-al-islam-gaddafi-whereabouts_n_1073235.html?ref=libya

161803398
13th November 2011, 23:06
a "Sea" of Al Qaeda flags in Benghazi.

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/282353/benghazi-sea-al-qaeda-flags-john-rosenthal

http://muslm.net/vb/showthread.php?t=457921

Lord Sidious
14th November 2011, 04:48
a "Sea" of Al Qaeda flags in Benghazi.

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/282353/benghazi-sea-al-qaeda-flags-john-rosenthal

http://muslm.net/vb/showthread.php?t=457921

Those nuggets celebrating.
I wonder if they know what they are REALLY celebrating?
Their womenfolk will find out.

161803398
14th November 2011, 05:05
Those nuggets celebrating.
I wonder if they know what they are REALLY celebrating?
Their womenfolk will find out.

Yep, that's what I hear from my middle eastern "experts". Sigh.

161803398
15th November 2011, 05:32
I don't know what date this is. But the picture is interesting to compare to the picture of the celebrants waving flags....gives an idea who is who.

JgI9pCg6URw

161803398
16th November 2011, 02:28
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NG8PzfJCv_8

bfv1uPBmR5g

161803398
19th November 2011, 19:31
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cR7l0jGX5AQ

viking
21st November 2011, 09:53
I really do wonder what will become of Saif ... with all that he knows about the evil westerners and co, he is sitting on a very precarious position or holding all the aces!!... may the truth unfold!

quote...
Prince Andrew was a regular visitor to Tripoli as a trade ambassador and is reported to have played host to Saif at Buckingham Palace and Windsor Castle. Lord Powell, the former adviser to Margaret Thatcher and John Major, chaired a company that agreed construction deals in Libya.

Another person linked to Saif is Nat Rothschild, of the banking dynasty, who has business interests in Libya. In 2008 Saif was a guest at a party thrown by Mr Rothschild at his New York home. He was later a guest at a shooting party at Mr Rothschild’s British country home and also stayed at the family’s villa in Corfu.

Lord Mandelson, then Labour’s Business Secretary, was also a guest at the villa and has admitted discussing with Saif the fate of Lockerbie bomber Abdelbaset Al Megrahi, who was later released from prison in Scotland because of failing health.

full article here...
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2063561/Gaddafis-son-Saif-Al-Islam-captured-quizzed-Blair-Mandelson-Prince-Andrew.html#ixzz1eKdtOoSK

viking

viking
24th November 2011, 13:31
A must listen ...

Awesome speech by Farrakhan ...

His speech starts at 13 minutes ...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNLqQ2cN-PA

viking

viking
29th November 2011, 10:04
Well we knew didn't we!!



November 28, 2011

BANI WALID, Libya (Reuters) - Every revolution has its losers. Libya's new rulers, who swept to power three months ago in a revolt against Muammar Gaddafi's 42-year rule, have promised the country a brighter future. In the biggest cities, celebratory gunfire and the war-cry "God is great" can still be heard daily.

In Bani Walid, long a stronghold for Gaddafi loyalists and one of their last bastions to fall during this year's civil war, the mood is entirely different.

On a quiet Friday morning -- the day of rest in this almost entirely Muslim country -- a middle-aged man drew the metal shutters of his shop closed to speak freely about how Libya's new leaders have brought this town nothing but empty promises.

"Under Gaddafi everything was great. And now there's nothing," he says, speaking on condition of anonymity for fear of retribution by forces loyal to the National Transitional Council (NTC), which led the revolt against Gaddafi.

"They will find me," he says, adding angrily: "Anyone who tells the truth in Libya gets slaughtered."

Bani Walid, which sits on a rocky perch above a lush valley dotted with olive trees, is a town divided.

"Before the liberation, half the people were Gaddafi loyalists, half were with the revolution," said Tariq Faqi, a 28-year-old doctor who works at the town's hospital, after Friday prayers at the Abdel Nabbi bil Kheir Mosque.

"Now they accept reality and they're waiting to see what happens ... People feel they can't trust the new government until they see improvement."

SECURITY

After the fall of Tripoli three months ago, Gaddafi's son Saif al-Islam hid among the town's 100,000 or so inhabitants. He says Western warplanes fired on his convoy as he fled, and their missiles blew off part of his thumb and index finger.

Bani Walid is also home to the Warfalla tribe, the biggest in this vast, oil-rich country of roughly six million people, and one upon which Gaddafi often relied to stay in power.

Here as all over Libya, security remains one of the top concerns. A militia from Tripoli, a good two hours' drive away, conducted a raid in Bani Walid this week, sparking a firefight in which several people were killed on each side.

Talks between tribal elders have eased tensions, and most people interviewed felt life had since returned to normal, but residents disagreed over how much faith to place in a central government they said had yet to deliver concrete results.

A provisional national government was sworn in on Thursday with the aim of steering the country towards democracy and dealing with the most pressing problems, with elections to a constituent assembly due in the middle of next year.

The new government was put in place by the unelected NTC, which still wields significant influence over all government matters and had the final say in each of Prime Minister Abdurrahim El-Keib's cabinet appointments.

The country is still teeming with weapons, and Libya's new rulers have yet to disarm and make an army out of the patchwork of militias that roam the country, often far from their homes, occasionally clashing with each other, settling old scores.

Keib says his top priorities are improving security and looking after former rebel fighters and their families, but if he is to convince all of Bani Walid of the benefits of democracy, he will have to tackle a far wider range of issues.

"The situation now is good," school administrator Abdullah Mohammed, 36, said when asked about security, standing next to the mosque which, unusually, was damaged in the war, a testament to the intensity of the fighting that took place here.

"There was an incident two days ago but now it's getting better," he added as he left Friday prayers, echoing the sentiment of many who described the raid by men from Tripoli's Souq al-Juma neighbourhood as an isolated case.

While many residents said they did not want any more armed "outsiders" coming to their town after a war in which many local homes were destroyed and looted, most said they were happy for a national army to come and help secure the town.

"We want Libya to be united. We don't want any problems between us," bank employee Garera Salem Mohammed, 52, said in a largely empty square bearing the scars of war.

WINNERS AND LOSERS

Bani Walid's position on a hilltop made it virtually impregnable by ground forces alone. To take it, warplanes from Western countries in the NATO alliance pounded Gaddafi's forces while NTC troops battered the town with artillery.

At the fruit and vegetable market, the most common complaint was that banks had not reopened yet, as they have in Libya's cities, even though there is a nationwide restriction on monthly cash withdrawals.

"The market is dead. No one has any money with which to buy anything," said Munir Ali Muftah, 24, who was finding no takers for his dates and took shelter from the still-warm winter sun under his neighbour's tarpaulin roof.

"The people whose homes have been destroyed are not back yet," he added.

Of the market's few customers, most said they hoped the central government would bring an improvement in daily life but did not want to go so far as to predict it, replying simply with "insh'Allah" -- God willing -- when asked about the future.

Others were already growing impatient.

"We haven't seen anything from the new government. There's no money, there are no funds available for anything," said Moussa Juma Maymoun, 46, who was selling cigarettes, lighters and snuff stacked on the trunk of his car.

"In the former system, our situation was good. Everything was fine. But now everything is different. When you talk about elections and democracy, where is the democracy?" said Maymoun, who used to water olive trees for the agriculture ministry.

As the government begins to tackle all the problems of a country emerging from decades of dictatorship, it should think of the victims of this eight-month war as much as of the NTC fighters who emerged victorious, the local doctor said.

"Many of the civilians evacuated (during the war). They returned to find their homes destroyed, their belongings stolen. The government must take this into consideration and do something for them," Faqi said outside the mosque.

"Their priority should be the civilians, at least as much as the rebels. Civilians suffered a great deal in this country."

With national security still fragile and myriad factions continuing to compete for power ahead of next year's elections, the government would only achieve national unity by helping the war's losers as well as its winners.

"Educated people realise things can improve over time and are willing to be patient but here there are all levels of education," Faqi said.

(Additional reporting by Oliver Holmes and Taha Zargoun, editing by Peter Millership)

http://uruknet.info/?p=m83480&hd=&size=1&l=e

viking

Lord Sidious
29th November 2011, 10:11
That we did Viking, that we did.
Another nation down the tubes.

norman
1st December 2011, 21:33
Quaddafi's speech to the United Nations Council in 2009..............(English Translation)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10UT3WaYbJ0


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10UT3WaYbJ0

norman
1st December 2011, 21:46
http://africaindependence.com/AlGaddafiOrgAlGathafiOrgAlGaddafiSpeaksSpeechesofA lGaddafi.aspx



Al Gaddafi Speaks -

China..America..The inevitable Confrontation

6.3.2010

I dealt with the problem of the Ukraine in view of its impact on international peace. It is for the same reason that I deal with the problem of China and America. Mine is a small country that is concerned for international peace, therefore I try to the extent possible to make a contribution to the maintenance of international peace and security.

A direct confrontation between major powers is harmful to all. However, regardless of the efforts of peace-loving leaders, the Sino-American problem cannot be solved. I find it very alarming to have to say to the world that the Sino-American problem does not lend itself to mediation or solution. It is an inevitable and unavoidable problem. All that is happening now is the preparation for direct confrontation or attempts to postpone it. But it is unavoidable. America would like it to be an indirect confrontation. China would like to postpone it as much as possible. However, it is in the nature of things for the two sides to find themselves moving inexorably towards confrontation. However, the current rapprochements and the occasional skirmishes are simple tactics to postpone confrontation, gain time or move towards indirect confrontation as preferred by America. The world and peace-loving leaders must not be hoodwinked by the side shows and maneuvers such as trade and customs disputes, market dumping and the pressures on China to increase consumption or to raise the exchange rate of its currency or attempts to use environmental degradation as a pretext to slow down China’s progress.

The fact is China is a very dangerous world competitor. It is much more dangerous to the US than the USSR used to be in the past. The USSR depended on ideology to defeat America politically. In addition, it depended on its arsenal of weapons of mass destruction. Ideology is a philosophical matter and a matter of faith. It depends on its adherents. The moment the leadership changed in the erstwhile “leftist” countries, the policies shifted from left to right. Even some of the leftists themselves moved to the right.

China is a different kind of competitor. It is a rising economic power and America is unable to stop it. It has an unprecedented human wealth. In addition, it is a nuclear-weapon state and a permanent member of the Security Council. Everywhere in the world, China is making economic, human and political inroads. Unlike America which unwisely has chosen the harsh military approach, China is making those inroads using soft power. America continues its brazen interference in the internal affairs of states in the name of democracy and human rights. Africom is a case in point. Such interference is no longer acceptable. America itself is condemned in the field of human rights. It makes a habit of taking losers as allies.

Those who do not know the facts believe that the current crisis of the arms deal with Taiwan is a passing crisis. Nothing could be farther from reality. America is aware of the danger China poses. It knows that the next international confrontation will be with China. The new pssolicy adopted by America is one of creating regional deterrents to China in order to make their confrontation an indirect one. The strategic US policy aims at keeping China busy with those regional deterrents so as to avert a direct confrontation with China. Those deterrents are India, Indonesia, the Philippines, Japan, South Korea, Taiwan and maybe Viet Nam as well!! The most important among them are Taiwan, India and Japan. America’s objective is to keep China busy with those regional deterrents so as to avert a direct confrontation with it. It is a well-known fact that the US used China in the past as a regional deterrent against the USSR when Maoism broke away from Soviet Marxism-Leninism. Pitting Russia and China against each other was America’s biggest gain. America wishes to see that kind of gain continue in the future. It is the strategic equivalent of having a Euro-American confrontation. That would be a major gain for Russia and China. Therefore, America will not cease to arm Taiwan against China, nor will it cease to support India against China.

In accordance with the policy of creating regional deterrents against China, it is in America’s interest to see Japan become a major military power. This is happening now.The limitations placed on Japan after World War II no longer serve the interests of America in the face of the real danger or in its unavoidable confrontation with the Yellow Giant.



Source: Al Gadafi Speaks

The Original Website of Muammar Al Gaddafi, has been shut down by NATO/UN/RATS! We have re-build his PERSONAL website (and still doing`it), to educate and inform everyone about Libya and Al Gaddafi! This website will be aviable in Espan/Eng/Ara

..and will soon be aviable in French/Russ/Portog/Ger! Thank you, for visiting this website!

161803398
25th December 2011, 02:00
"What I have seen with my own two eyes is unbelievable – people committing the cruelest acts - crimes against humanity while they cry out Allahu Akhbar. They are like drugged people. We have uncovered mass graves of Qaddafi loyalists – with their hands tied behind their backs - all executed. I want to tell them that every person they tortured, every person murdered, every woman they raped, every home they destroyed and looted and everything they did to our dear leader and his family will be avenged.

This is not the first time this has happened to us Libyans – this is exactly what happened to us when the Italians occupied our land – thanks to the leader we are a very educated people now – we know our history and our heroes. The NTC has already taken the picture of Omar Al Mukhtar off the Libyan dinar but it does not matter – they can destroy every picture of Omar Al Mukhtar and the leader, because the story of his bravery and the bravery of his son Muammar Qaddafi is in our hearts – these men can never die - and this gives us the belief and certainty that we will overcome these thieves again – believe me, it is only a matter of time."

http://juneterpstra.com/custom3_2.html

161803398
25th December 2011, 08:13
https://vivalibya.wordpress.com/2011/12/02/urgent-appeal-for-the-life-of-ahmed-ibrahim/

161803398
26th December 2011, 00:38
The Al Qaeda who were in prison in Libya were released to help with the "rebellion" and their leaders are now part of the Libyan Government.

http://www.disinfo.com/2011/11/libya-the-real-story/

efields
26th December 2011, 01:47
Had to grab a quote from Peace of Mind's link


“All methods of education prevailing in the world should be destroyed through a universal cultural revolution that frees the human mind from curricula of fanaticism which dictate a process of deliberate distortion of man's tastes, conceptual ability and mentality.”

Seems like a cool guy.

Max

LOL One thing you can be sure of, Whatever you are hearing, its Spin. One must discern with their own heart. You will never get the Truth here... or there... Many agents on the Board here and everywhere. You hear sprinkles of facts with dis-info. All these Boards have been compromised by agents who pose as fellow seekers.We play right into there hands sheeple. These forums are the avenue to confusion. Nearly all of them are infiltrated. If they get popular they are Targets of these agents. Use original thinking, not much of that on Earth. Everyone follows either the Collective or the Counterculture. They are all manipulated to one degree or another. Trust no one, save yourself on all these topics. You can feel Your Truth..

Happy Holidays. Petty Tyrants run the world. Beware, and Be Safe. Do not be Led.......Your positions against the Collective are necessary to the Collectives Survival. We have been comprimised and guided by off-world intelligence to have a state of disarray and to further the ease of our handling. Puppets we are, It makes their intervention easier and some would even say necessary. We are asleep Big-time and its in their interest to maintain that position. They can come and go at will as we are in denial..We are asleep in the extreme. They control the disclosure and most other policy decisions. No one would believe this. Thats how adept they are.

Read 'Allies of Humanity', a FREE Book at Marshall Vian Summers site. See another perspective. Its Never what you are presented through 'proper' channels, of that you can be sure. There is no were to run. Simply Awaken. Become Aware.

namaste

Dawn
26th December 2011, 03:25
I sent the video shown in the 1st post out to a number of my distant friends by email. Here is an answer I got back.
Hi Dawn,

Merry Christmas.

The video was great... too bad it's not true. My friend (and former neighbor), Bill, has worked in Libya -- on two occasions, for several months each time -- and he says it is run by a dictator, Gaddafi, as a police state. That was a long time ago, but the leader is the same. I can't imagine that it's turned completely around with the same person in office. Now if it was November of 2012, then it would be far more believable and even possible. I don't follow world politics unless it pertains to the ascension. There is so much dis-information out there.

Carole


I will ask her what years her friend was there.... but the video may be propoganda. Without an eye witness who was there how are we to know for sure what was happening.

YUPANQUI PUMA
26th December 2011, 04:09
It doesn't sease to amazeme the naivity of people from European countires and USA, when they talk about a reality they know nothing about. None of you has ever lived in a country with a tirant, despot dictator as a ruler, where you have no rights, and your entire life is controlled. Please wake up. Educate yourselves before you talk about soemthing you know nothing about. That video was made by Gaddafi and his people, of course you're not going to be shown the truth, but what he wants you to believe. Wake up!

Thanks for your quote, however, after being in so many countries I would like to say that you are not quite right, because many of these countries bad named as having a tiranny system,in reality, they are far away from this!!

Dawn
27th December 2011, 04:36
I just got the answers back from my friend who wrote the first time here: http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?32944-Libya-Gaddafi-The-Truth-you-are-not-supposed-to-know&p=388421&viewfull=1#post388421

I'm going to post them here just as they came from me. It appears the video which starts this thread may be propoganda, or not, you decide:


Merry Cristmas to you Carol,

Can you ask your friend what years he worked there. 1975, 1976 and 1977. (Two 18 month contracts, back to back).

Also, was he living among the Libyan people, or was he in an American compound? They did not have any American compounds at that time. He worked in the desert and also lived both in the desert and in town (Tripoli, Bengazhi, El Cedar) and also worked in Algeria, Tunsia and Morocco. That gave him a good comparison of their regimes compared to Qaddafi's regime, as they were all Arab type states.
He was there when Qaddafi started nationalizing the country and it became a military police state with torture chambers exactly like Sadam Hussein had.

Does he speak their language? He did then... just a little bit.

Did he spend quality time with any Libyans who had grown up in, and were living in that culture? Yes, they were his work crew. Four times a day they sat down and had tea breaks (like coffee breaks) together. He was invited to their homes, when they were in town, with several overnight stays.

His base camp was Waha (geographically located in the Sarah Desert in an area called the Sand Sea). He was training the Libyans to do pipe welding. In his trailer compound he lived with both Americans and Libyans.

Over the years he watched as the government (Qaddafi and his cadre) changed the living conditions into an oppressive state, backed by his military police and hit squads. If you opposed anything within the government you didn't return home. Say something wrong = slit your throat.

Every public place had to have a picture of Qaddafi hanging on the wall (ala Hitler). Bear in mind that the oppressive state of affairs within the country were not directed only at ex-pats living and working within the country, but the Libyan population as well.

To bring it more up to date, the regime and it's oppressiveness didn't change for the better, it actually got worse over the years up until Qaddafi's recent death. All of the people that you might have seen on TV or YouTube, parading in the streets in favor of Qaddafi were basically paid to do that, just like the current mourners and supposed followers of Kim Ju Yong in North Korea. In Arab countries they have professional "cryers". They are paid to cry.

His advice would be that unless someone has actually lived in the country for more than just a few months, then and now, they don't really know the truth of what Qaddafi's regime was like.

While Bill was there, there were a lot of Russians and Czechoslovakians working deep in the desert in an area called Dahara Jilo, building chemical warfare facilities and rudimentary nuclear experimental facilities (not for power, but for weaponization). This he knows for a fact!

All of the supposed supporters of the recent activities in Libya were backed by the Muslim brotherhood in various other sundry Al-queda type groups.

As far as Libya goes, the "Arab Spring" movement was nothing but a cover up for the overthrow of the Qaddafi regime and the eventual take over of Muslim brotherhood/Al-queda types. The U.S. was mislead by believing that the opposing factions were truly interested in gaining freedom and a special form of a democratic government.

Hope this answers your questions. It certainly gave me a history lesson I wasn't aware of.

Bill's on his way back to Santa Maria and he keeps calling with more notes on this subject:

Airplane that was blown up was a direct order of Qaddafi. Had terrorist training camps in the desert near where he worked.

The company Bill worked for, Camco A.G., was 2/3rds owned by a Libyan company, not an American company, and the other 1/3rd was owned by a Swiss company. There were only two American ex-pats within the company. Most others were English or Libyan. One was American with Canadian citizenship. Every move they made was watched by CIA type agents and their rooms were searched daily while they were out working. Literally, a 300 pound man stood there with his arms folded and watched them all day. They never saw him take time out to eat.

161803398
29th December 2011, 04:22
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0fUxVgxj0vc

161803398
29th December 2011, 04:31
They would have had to pay an enormous number of people:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nSnlIlATIKw

Sirte:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YC0JNg_kJjs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vl8KKKcvYa0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbBiVHvHHcQ

Aisha in Bab El Azizia.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvzwyu7tXew

I had to add the girl because she impresses me. She is a very outspoken and articulate girl. I think that says something. I think it also says something that one of the first things the new Libyan government did was to restore Sharia law.

161803398
29th December 2011, 06:41
Cynthia McKinney's observations of Nato bombing in Libya:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x46KIVIdaY4=player_embedded#!


Is it America's and Nato's job to decide what government a foreign country should have? Gaddafi is not from the West; Libya is not in the West. Libya is in Africa and is not one the the United States of America. People keep saying he was a "dictator" which may or may not be true but what business is that of anyone except the people of Libya.

161803398
29th December 2011, 07:12
The Al Qaeda groups that were working with the CIA were in Benghazi and had been suppressed by Gaddafi which is why they didn't like him. An Al Qaeda flag now flies over Benghazi. Libya was taken off the list of supporters of Terrorism in 2006. Shortly before Nato started bombing Libya, the UN had decided to recognize Gaddafi for his achievements in the area of human rights. His daughter, Aisha Gaddafi, was the UN's goodwill Ambassador.

161803398
29th December 2011, 17:34
Here is some information about Mr. Jabril, the transitional leader:

http://alethonews.wordpress.com/2011/10/27/mahmoud-jibril-and-qaddafi%E2%80%99s-wealth-redistribution-project/

about the writer: Mahdi Darius Nazemroaya is a Sociologist and Research Associate of the Centre for Research on Globalization (CRG), Montréal. He specializes on the Middle East and Central Asia. He was on the ground in Libya for over two months and was also a Special Correspondent for Flashpoints, which is a program based in Berkeley, California. Nazemroaya has been releasing these articles about Libya in conjunction with aired discussions (now archived) with Cynthia McKinney on Freedom Now, a show aired on Saturdays on KPFK, Los Angeles, California KPFK.org.

161803398
29th December 2011, 18:01
America recruiting the next generation of 9/11 Highjackers (or in my opinion the next generation of fall guys):

http://dandelionsalad.wordpress.com/2011/09/05/we-are-recruiting-the-next-generation-of-911-hijackers-by-chris-hedges/

about the writer: Chris Hedges spent two decades as a foreign reporter covering wars in Latin America, Africa, Europe and the Middle East. His latest books are Death of the Liberal Class, and The World as It Is: Dispatches on the Myth of Human Progress.

Arrowwind
29th December 2011, 18:06
"Oh what tangled webs we weave"

it is clear that whatever the truth is, whatever lie it is, if it does not fit with the overall globalization agenda that truth or lie is doomed.

161803398
29th December 2011, 18:12
Failure of media to report Nato war crimes:

http://dandelionsalad.wordpress.com/2011/12/20/libya-reporting-war-crimes-after-the-facts-by-finian-cunningham/

about the writer: Finian Cunningham, formerly based in Belfast is Global Research’s Middle East and East Africa correspondent and a Featured Writer on Dandelion Salad. He can be reached at cunninghamfin@yahoo.com. See his new book: The Globalization of War: The “Military Roadmap” to World War III, by Michel Chossudovsky and Finian Cunningham.

161803398
29th December 2011, 18:22
it is clear that whatever the truth is, whatever lie it is, if it does not fit with the overall globalization agenda that truth or lie is doomed.

I have come to believe that what you say is true for most people on this side of the Atlantic ocean, for a long time to come. But, in the case of Libya, I believe the truth will out eventually. The people of Libya are educated now and they will speak. The truth will not out for everyone in America but certainly for many in Africa, South America and Asia....and, not surprisingly, Ireland.

I have an Irish friend who used to joke about America being like an island, isolated from what was going on in the rest of the world. Maybe its not such a joke.

I believe it is so important that Americans begin to listen to what the rest of the world has to say...and to listen with an open mind.

161803398
1st January 2012, 21:13
http://www.uruknet.info/?p=m84412&hd=&size=1&l=e

161803398
6th January 2012, 21:41
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbPQXpSgU4M

161803398
14th January 2012, 08:17
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=28645

http://www.laguerrehumanitaire.fr/english

161803398
21st January 2012, 21:41
Fighting continues in Libya:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=OLh2Z3Uvrxc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9G17xqnx_0

http://www.scoop.it/t/from-tahrir-square/p/1024714566/us-deploys-12-000-troops-in-libya

161803398
21st January 2012, 22:07
Last interview of Gaddafi:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=X-LGrTdL7B0

161803398
21st January 2012, 22:19
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=X-LGrTdL7B0

161803398
17th February 2012, 09:19
http://www.lizzie-phelan.blogspot.com.au/2012/02/breaking-news-founding-declaration-of.html

viking
18th February 2012, 10:43
Maybe the ET's will put a stop to this nonsense!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nV1sk9mSJEY&feature=g-all-a&list=PL53A833CE4ABD2B27&context=G20fa0d7FAAAAAAAAAAA

viking

Black Panther
19th February 2012, 21:22
kN_NJJn49mM

"Lizzie Phelan visits Zlitan just a few days before the NATO
massacre of at least 85 civilians in Majer, Zlitan. This time
she witnesses the remains of Mustafa al-Mrabet's house
which was bombarded by NATO killing his wife and two
small children. She also interviews Fatah, whose son Walid
was assassinated with 3 of his friends by a NATO apach
gunship as they drove for their evening meal."

13945

161803398
3rd March 2012, 20:13
Ramsey Clark on Libya:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?6pHChh32uH0

WhiteFeather
9th March 2012, 01:12
Still shocked from this video. Had to Bump for those Avies who haven't seen this yet.

161803398
7th May 2012, 09:25
Gaddafi and the Gold Dinar:

DawvDXiay3o

161803398
14th January 2013, 04:05
"It seems finally Silvio Berlusconi has admitted that NATO's intervention in Libya was orchestrated by then French President Nicolas Sarkozy who wanted to get a share of Libya's natural gas and oil, after the latter traveled to Libya and saw posters of Qaddafi embracing Berlusconi.

The discovery of large natural gas reserves in the Mediterranean coast of Syria, Lebanon, and Israel has prompted another artificial "Arab Spring revolution" in Syria, whose toppling means not only gaining control of Syria's natural gas reserves and those of Lebanon - as "Lebanon goes as Syria goes" - but also finding a route for Qatar's natural gas pipeline to pass to Europe & Turkey, as Qatar is looking to offer Europe & Turkey a good deal on this natural resource while cutting out Europe's current supplier, Russia."

Source: Sama Channel (Syria)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?P6J8P3mOkxM

Flash
15th January 2013, 04:11
the whole picture is very clear, money first, people last. American Empire at its worst is described. Gaddafi did a lot of good in his country despite the bad sides. Those 3 videos on this page are very telling. But the American people will never see them for the most part.