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Tarka the Duck
28th January 2012, 14:33
Is anyone else battle-weary? Not against the PTB in all their shapes and forms, but between fellow members/camps of PA. Even as I write this, I am expecting people to take offence...

For example on a current thread, the abuse that was dealt out by a couple of contributors was unnecessary. It was personal and aggressive. One member was accused of being a shill and asked how much they were being paid, and all the posters who expressed doubts were referred to as trolls.

The truth about the whole situation is not yet known. It may well never be the same truth for all viewers: that seems to be the nature of this alternative world.

We are in danger of creating an environment here that is very unattractive to any who don't follow the mainstream. Isn't not following the mainstream why most of us are here?

I don't understand blind adherence to unsubstantiated claims.
It's even more difficult to understand the apparent hatred directed at those who dare to investigate further.
It's not a crime not to believe every conspiracy theory that is fed to us...

Yours,

A Very Sad Duck

Borden
28th January 2012, 14:43
Right! I knew it! How dare you? I knew that duck looked like some sort of alphabet operative! Who are you and the duck really working for?

(p.s. actually I wholeheartedly agree with you.)

Borden

Nathalie
28th January 2012, 14:45
It's not a crime to believe anything you want. Even blind adherence to "unsubstantiated claims". But when egos step in, this is when wars start. We souldn't give a **** what others think, it really is none of our concern. What is thruth? Nothing but perception, I think. This being said, let's all express our different opinions and celebrate our differences, or leave the building when we get uncomfortable. Simple as that.

NeverMind
28th January 2012, 15:08
Unfortunately, this was one of the first things I noticed - much to my surprise and slight shock, I might add - when I joined: the incredible touchiness of so many posters.

Personally, I don't understand such a frame of mind.
But this much is clear: defensiveness is usually a sign of internal lack of certitude.
But there's nothing wrong with not being certain (usually it is far more "hygienic" than absolute certitude) - unless one fails to recognise it in oneself, and then blames others for not validating a claim that one is not so sure oneself.

I say, the only way forward is, well, pressing forward: expressing one's views, without resorting to ad hominem attacks.
That's it.

:)

Dorjezigzag
28th January 2012, 15:10
Excellent post Tarka

You can asses someone on their actions, for instance you see someone murder someone you can accuse them of being a murderer
but..
It is very difficult to judge someone’s intentions, but constantly people pass judgement on this comments such as 'you want to get attention, cause trouble, troll, shill, etc, etc
The only person who really knows the intention ( which occurs inside an individual), is the person who has made the post and unless someone claims psychic powers which they need to communicate before they make accusations it is not for anyone else to speculate what their intention is. They can ask the question 'what was your intention' and point out weaknesses in the argument but they are not in the position to definitely state what the others intention is without suitable evidence.

I think before people hurl insults like shill, troll etc, etc they should perhaps rather than analysing the other persons intention analyse their own intention in attacking someone in this way. Why do you feel so much hate and anger towards this person or argument? Do you fear what they represent? Just remember love conquers fear

Once the focus leaves the debate and it becomes personal, with insults flying, it soon descends into abusiveness which is harmful, negative and draining.

Jean-Marie
28th January 2012, 15:20
This is exactly why I rarely post. I read everything I can and I give thanks to posters, but it does make you think twice before putting yourself out there.... If I have something I want to add to a thread I wait a bit and usually someone will eventually post what I was thinking. It is much easier reading the conflicts going on between pa members than it is to put yourself in the middle of it.

Project Avalon is an incredible community with people that are not afraid to speak their minds. That is why I love this forum. The information and perspectives of the members is what makes it a wonderful place. When people go after each other I chalk it up to every has a bad day every now and then. Some are just expressing their views and do not mean to attack. You have to keep in mind that some people are more passionate about what they believe than others and everyone has their turn at having a bad day!

-jean-marie

BestLion
28th January 2012, 15:25
Nice write up Kathy! Well I was the one who was accused of being a paid shill, a troll, being accused of never being in the army (because someone couldn't identify a US Army Class B uniform) I tried not to take it personally. It is upsetting though.
The truth of that case will come in a few weeks..
I'm like most here. i want to filter through the BS, and find personal truth.
You can't take thing personally, and you can't please everyone.
Overall this is a good community, good info, good stuff..and I just dont want to see it go to crap due to some deception.

I think before people hurl insults like shill, troll etc, etc they should perhaps rather than analysing the other persons intention analyse their own intention in attacking someone in this way. Why do you feel so much hate and anger towards this person or argument
Well this is case by case, That topic is a interesting plot on the government, Fed, and what may happen, and people want to believe it..Thus if someone comes and says 'WAIT" it doesn't go down good. This is understandable. But yes to build a good case we need all sides of the story.Once the case is closed then we can move on, but this case is far from closed.
Anyway i hold no bitterness towards anyone, I learned long ago to hold a grudge is no way to live!

CD7
28th January 2012, 15:31
Well this "drama" always seems to b apart of forums, and "real" life quite frankly! Those who purposely intend to "stir the pot" know who they are, ...aside from this good communication is a realization that all of us are expressing from different perspectives...and together these differing perspectives make up the whole. Its literally AS IF everyone is in a room placed in different positions OBSERVING a chair. Everyone is going to EXPRESS a DIFFERENT ASPECT of the chair BECUZ they see the legs, the seat, the cusion from a different angle. Now it would seem that many would be "lying" about the chair if their "position" is obscured from others who SEE the chair from their PERSPECTIVE. Name calling and putting people down for their perspective...is quite literally a lack of perspective in human insight...



Curious....if we all come together and unite in CONSCIOUSNESS via KNOWING/SEEING all PERSPECTIVES. WE ALL KNOW THE CHAIR INSIDE OUT UPSIDE DOWN...what a game changer that would BE :hug:

Black Panther
28th January 2012, 15:39
This is exactly why I rarely post. I read everything I can and I give thanks to posters, but it does make you think twice before putting yourself out there.... If I have something I want to add to a thread I wait a bit and usually someone will eventually post what I was thinking. It is much easier reading the conflicts going on between pa members than it is to put yourself in the middle of it.

Project Avalon is an incredible community with people that are not afraid to speak their minds. That is why I love this forum. The information and perspectives of the members is what makes it a wonderful place. When people go after each other I chalk it up to every has a bad day every now and then. Some are just expressing their views and do not mean to attack. You have to keep in mind that some people are more passionate about what they believe than others and everyone has their turn at having a bad day!

-jean-marie

I like your post, so I like to see more of you :wink:

I think ego's will keep on arguing on the forum. The only thing
we can do ourselves is not to feed our own ego and the ego of others.
Sometimes someone 'attacked' me because of the thread I started.
Just by being conscious of what others post it's possible to let those
words go through me instead of feeding my own ego and attack
them in return.

In the beginning I used to read all those ego posts, but I have learned
it ain't worth reading them. And it ain't worth to be part of it for sure.

I do think there are more members who do not post often, because of being
afraid of getting attacked. That's a shame! Just say what you wanna say
and if others don't like it..well...we don't have to agree all the time. But there
are always people who appreciate your vision.

Dorjezigzag
28th January 2012, 15:39
Best Lion,

Well this is case by case

I am curious in which case do you feel it is appropriate to hurl insults based purely on your perceived intention of another without appropriate hard evidence?

BestLion
28th January 2012, 15:46
Best Lion,
Quote Well this is case by case
I am curious in which case do you feel it is appropriate to hurl insults based purely on your perceived intention of another without appropriate hard evidence?
Let me clear this up. To insult a person personally is not cool. What I meant case by case is that if a real poster posted on a video log about say ..The Annunaki...who has credentials, spent years in Sumeria -Mesopotamia area, learned the language etc....and then someone bombast the forum and discredits this guy....says he fake etc..then that could be understandable, that people would be a bit upset at that poster who bombasted the expert on Sumeria, who tried to discredit a subject matter expect who has documents, video footage, pictures of him in Mesopotamia area ect.. Thats kind of what I am referring to on case by case.

Tarka the Duck
28th January 2012, 15:51
Well this "drama" always seems to b apart of forums, and "real" life quite frankly! Those who purposely intend to "stir the pot" know who they are, ...aside from this good communication is a realization that all of us are expressing from different perspectives...and together these differing perspectives make up the whole. Its literally AS IF everyone is in a room placed in different positions OBSERVING a chair. Everyone is going to EXPRESS a DIFFERENT ASPECT of the chair BECUZ they see the legs, the seat, the cusion from a different angle. Now it would seem that many would be "lying" about the chair if their "position" is obscured from others who SEE the chair from their PERSPECTIVE. Name calling and putting people down for their perspective...is quite literally a lack of perspective in human insight...



Curious....if we all come together and unite in CONSCIOUSNESS via KNOWING/SEEING all PERSPECTIVES. WE ALL KNOW THE CHAIR INSIDE OUT UPSIDE DOWN...what a game changer that would BE :hug:

I understand what you are saying, and yes, wouldn't that be wonderful?! ;)

But my concern in the OP was not about the fact that we are all biased in our opinions because our view is partial...it was the inability of some to accept that that is the case!
I am the worst for muttering under my breath about my perception of the stupidity of something someone may have written, but I'd hope that I would manage to have enough self control to stop myself from abusing that person.

Kathie

CD7
28th January 2012, 15:57
it was the inability of some to accept that that is the case!


Yes, and i was relating why some have an inability to "accept"

gooty64
28th January 2012, 16:08
The BS detectors have gone mad!

"How do you like your whistleblower now?" -I heard someone say on a Avalon thread recently.

That's madness!

Tony
28th January 2012, 16:13
It's fun playing ball, you can really sharpen your skills.....and wit!

QqLU-o7N7Kw

Dorjezigzag
28th January 2012, 16:17
Best Lion,
Quote Well this is case by case
I am curious in which case do you feel it is appropriate to hurl insults based purely on your perceived intention of another without appropriate hard evidence?
Let me clear this up. To insult a person personally is not cool. What I meant case by case is that if a real poster posted on a video log about say ..The Annunaki...who has credentials, spent years in Sumeria -Mesopotamia area, learned the language etc....and then someone bombast the forum and discredits this guy....says he fake etc..then that could be understandable, that people would be a bit upset at that poster who bombasted the expert on Sumeria, who tried to discredit a subject matter expect who has documents, video footage, pictures of him in Mesopotamia area ect.. Thats kind of what I am referring to on case by case.
Even though the individual in question has perhaps been abusive , making claims without sufficient evidence ( as you have presented the case, I am not familiar with it) I don't feel it is needed to insult him back and go down to that level, focus on the debate not the individual, the argument you have presented without insults seems quite sufficient. Of course can be easier said than done:p

expect who has documents, video footage, pictures of him in Mesopotamia area ect

jackovesk
28th January 2012, 16:41
Is anyone else battle-weary? Not against the PTB in all their shapes and forms, but between fellow members/camps of PA. Even as I write this, I am expecting people to take offence...

For example on a current thread, the abuse that was dealt out by a couple of contributors was unnecessary. It was personal and aggressive. One member was accused of being a shill and asked how much they were being paid, and all the posters who expressed doubts were referred to as trolls.

The truth about the whole situation is not yet known. It may well never be the same truth for all viewers: that seems to be the nature of this alternative world.

We are in danger of creating an environment here that is very unattractive to any who don't follow the mainstream. Isn't not following the mainstream why most of us are here?

I don't understand blind adherence to unsubstantiated claims.
It's even more difficult to understand the apparent hatred directed at those who dare to investigate further.
It's not a crime not to believe every conspiracy theory that is fed to us...

Yours,

A Very Sad Duck

Try not to take it personally Tarka,

We are (ALL) battle-weary in some way...

Personally I am tired of blind followers who have lost any remblance of 'Discernment'...

...and I am sure some of those followers are tired of me..!

There is absolutely 'Nothing Wrong' with asking questions of any and all information that flows through this forum...

The 'Key' is to live your own 'Truth' whether another disagrees with you or not..?

The thing that is really 'Energy Zapping' is when you strongly believe something is 'True' and some others don't share your view...


Influence only Manifests in 'Truth' not 'Opinion'..! jackovesk

Recently as you know there has been alot of conjecture regarding the likes of Bill Wood, David Wilcock & Ben Fulford...

I don't trust David Wilcock and never really have, sure some of his teachings resonate but its nothing that you can't find elsewhere. He's just a slicker presenter than most. Lately I have been finding more and more holes in Ben Fulfords information, but I still listen to what he has to say for entertainment purposes.

I somehow believe that their maybe some truth to the (T1) story from Bill Wood, but after the 2nd interview with his new buddy clouded my view of him, not so much of his message...

Repeating myself again, its 'High Time' we (ALL) started Look (Within) for the Answers, instead putting so much trust in Whistleblowers and Psuedo Gurus...Start taking some 'Responsibilty' for your own 'Truth' instead counting on others to do it for you..!

Having said all that...

Tarka, I say 'Get Over It' & 'Get On With It' and enjoy the 'Journey' instead worrying about others who don't agree with you...

Regards,

Jack :)

Rahkyt
28th January 2012, 16:47
I think it's a reflection of the energy now. Also, the tone of a forum comes from the top down. Leadership to the membership. When folks who sometimes get a bit extreme see how much they are allowed to get away with, their behavior then becomes codified and the norm, which others emulate. A certain amount of disagreement and contention is always good, robust, vibrant, expansive. But when it gets down into the dregs and personal insults become the norm rather then the exception, it becomes a statement about the community itself.

firstlook
28th January 2012, 16:51
Whatever the topic, its best to remember that this really all is a game. Its not personal.

We can talk about all the ideas we want, but acting like they are for the best of everyone is actually pointless unless action is actually implemented. Each one of us know what works for us individually. Its how we blend into each other that is the hardest part.

Someone always feel that they are putting forth more of an effort because of ideals agreed upon. Funny how we are such victims to exactly what makes the PTB so strong and organized. They see things as a game. If we can remember that, then we can take our willingness to improve the game by understanding that we want all players to turn the corner of the board at the sometime. We like seeing people progress.

Its hard to measure progress and worth without causing shame and fear which we like to give into when we feel like we haven't shared ourselves and gotten a "result".

I think I don't ask enough questions before I make a statement. I'll try to do that more. Also being specific and complicated is probably what makes our species so capable of interaction. Its easy to say I Love you, and good, but I think doing it on specific levels helps.

But once again, its just a game, a ride, a journey, etc...

nf857
28th January 2012, 16:51
Hi,

I agree with all what is put here, its ridiculous that people think there views are the only right views, do they really think they are truely awakended with that statement. First time accross this is when i went on the spiritually forum, i was trying to understand and get a better insight on a title thread called 'Does Reality Remain There' for expressing my questions/theories, i got told i basically didnt belong on the spirituality forum, even a bit of bullying went on, not naming names as they know who they are, & they no they were in the wrong. I was also accused of trying to de-rail a coversation, when in reality i was just asking questions and trying to get a better understanding, seems if you dont beleive the 'one consiousness' theory your are penalized on this forum x

Lifebringer
28th January 2012, 16:53
Our work is cut out for us, as some are not there yet. Some are purging negative influences from their souls. I look at it when they post, put some other fact link up with more graphic and move on. If they take it in, great, if not, it's not my loss. We can only be wayshowers, can't force the source.
Free will and all that.

firstlook
28th January 2012, 16:54
Heres a question. Why is trust important to TALK about?

Really, I don't understand this. Not being sarcastic in saying "don't do it"! But I really don't see how a simple word can progress thought. If something is not useful to you, why is it not useful to another?

This has always plagued my sense of sharing and interaction.

Jean-Marie
28th January 2012, 16:56
We are all in different in our levels of awakening. We all have had a moment when we truly believed that we were right and our view was the only logical view. We need to feel patience and understanding for those that are at different levels of awakening and awareness.

Tarka the Duck
28th January 2012, 16:57
I think I don't ask enough questions before I make a statement. I'll try to do that more

Ooooo, that warms the cockles of my heart, that does ;)
If we all did that, wouldn't things be different?!

firstlook
28th January 2012, 16:57
Do we need to be more sensitive to those who do not trust certain things in their path? I mean basically thats saying I fear something. Certainly this is a masked comment. Perhaps we should try to be more understanding.

Just trying to get my thoughts out.

I mean, we shouldn't get defensive when we don't understand why people don't trust things we do. Or the other way round. I think this is an interesting focal point for many arguments that turn hot. Both sides trying to understand how the other can see things this way.

Tony
28th January 2012, 17:06
Always know the difference between an argument and abuse!!!

kQFKtI6gn9Y

humanalien
28th January 2012, 17:08
I see the problem as this. We have a lot of very intelligent people
on this forum. Cudo's to all of you. The problem is that they over
think things in their minds and once they come up with an answer
to their problem, there can be no other answer to the problem.

Then, when someone else comes in and tries to give a possible
answer to the problem, the ego's of the intelligent people are
bruised an then the in fighting begins.

Being intelligent doesn't mean that you have all the answers, nor
does it mean that you can solve all the problems.

Truth of the matter is that intelligent people are more likely to
believe in someone elses lie, no matter how ridiculous it may be,
than lesser intelligent people.

I once was watching a show on tv where three people were selected
to get hypnotized on live tv. The hypnotist also selected a friend of a person
that was going to be hypnotized because he was going to tell each person,
once they were under, what to do. (Cluck like a duck, bark like a dog and
stuff like that).

The friend told the hypnotist that he would never hypnotize his friend
because he was highly intelligent and he could never succumb to being
hypnotized.

The hypnotist told the friend that he was wrong. He said that the more
intelligent a person is, the faster they go under.

Providing that this is true, it's not a far stretch to assume that intelligent
people will believe a lie, faster than a lesser intelligent person.

Look at how fast most of you fell for all that charles crap, bill included and
no sooner had they figured out that charles was a lier then inellia comes
along and most of you fell for that one to.

Look at how david wilcock has everyone fooled into believing that he is
be all to end all in the knowledge department. He seems to know everything
about everything and when the opportunity presents itself, he is right there
in the middle of it all like he has always been there. You guys seem to overlook
that at every chance he gets, he is promoting his books. Yes, david is intelligent
and he is using that against you to sell his material.

Anyway, i think you all know where i'm going with this. People need to use a
lot of discernment when dealing with questionable information and people.
Stop jumping on these people's bandwagons and giving them credibility before
you do any type of discernment on them. Use the brain that you were given
for something other than a hat rack. Question everything, several times and
do a lot of research if you have any doubts.

If something can't be proven, then chances are, it's a lie.....

Whiskey_Mystic
28th January 2012, 17:11
Every now and then it is a good idea to take a break from PA and the internet in General. Take three days off from any news site, forum, or Facebook. In fact, turn off your TV and computer completely for three days. If you feel withdrawal symptoms, turn on the radio. Focus on nature, presence, and simplicity. Have a cup of tea. Listen to the birds. Read a poem.

It's ok. The apocalypse will still be here when you come back.

humanalien
28th January 2012, 17:30
Every now and then it is a good idea to take a break from PA and the internet in General. Take three days off from any news site, forum, or Facebook. In fact, turn off your TV and computer completely for three days. If you feel withdrawal symptoms, turn on the radio. Focus on nature, presence, and simplicity. Have a cup of tea. Listen to the birds. Read a poem.

It's ok. The apocalypse will still be here when you come back.


I don't take three days off but i do take a full day off, once in a while,
just to get a way from all the craziness. I does help a lot and i do recommend
that people do this.

Thanks for the tip.

jagman
28th January 2012, 17:49
Every now and then it is a good idea to take a break from PA and the internet in General. Take three days off from any news site, forum, or Facebook. In fact, turn off your TV and computer completely for three days. If you feel withdrawal symptoms, turn on the radio. Focus on nature, presence, and simplicity. Have a cup of tea. Listen to the birds. Read a poem.

It's ok. The apocalypse will still be here when you come back.


I don't take three days off but i do take a full day off, once in a while,
just to get a way from all the craziness. I does help a lot and i do recommend
that people do this.

Thanks for the tip.

You sneaky little Alien.

another bob
28th January 2012, 18:06
Q: When you are on the other side of the curtain with no illusion what does it feel like can you still remember? How do you see this life on the other side of the curtain?

A: Like watching small children on a playground. They have grand ideas of becoming superheroes, they have fun and play, fight, cry big tears. The next day the same thing.

~Q & A with Lou Baldin


:yo:

christian
28th January 2012, 18:28
One member was accused of being a shill and asked how much they were being paid

We really don't want to go down that road, I agree.


and all the posters who expressed doubts were referred to as trolls.

This is not true, it was being said, that there are many trolls in there "you know who you are".
But again, we don't need to call anyone names, that doesn't add gravitas to any valid point.


I don't understand blind adherence to unsubstantiated claims.
It's even more difficult to understand the apparent hatred directed at those who dare to investigate further.
It's not a crime not to believe every conspiracy theory that is fed to us...

I want to clear up this huge misunderstanding:

I neither believe nor disbelieve Bill Wood's story - no blind adherence from me.
His story cannot be proven as of now one way or the other, my whole intention was to remind people of this fact, especially those, who were fast in calling him names and calling for Bill & Kerry to part with him. - The hatred as I perceived it was just as well directed at those, who did not join the "burn him" calls.

Don't believe, don't attack --- this would be my advice.

Tarka the Duck
28th January 2012, 19:09
Don't believe, don't attack

Totally agree.

You could say that it was down to my warped hyper-sensitivity ( ;)), but part of the reason for writing this thread was the number of knives that seem to have been whipped out as soon as it became apparent that some people were looking into Bill Brockbrader's background.

It felt as if some saw that as a sacrilegious act that spoke of a lack of faith in those whom they choose to revere.

another bob
28th January 2012, 19:12
Don't believe, don't attack --- this would be my advice.


"Just observe, don't interpret."

~Gil Grissom, CSI

:yo:

Tony
28th January 2012, 19:19
One of the problems when discussing a topic is making it personal. And so, we go from objective discussion to a subjective one.

When this happens, we are actually saying how righteous we are...and this in turn creates a reaction in someone else, who feels they are equally as righteous. This causes the energy winds from the chakra just below the naval to rise up into the heart, throat or head and create havoc in our mind and tension in the body! We get hot-headed...and when this gets expressed on the forum, some underling in the Illuminati will grin, then smile, then laugh, then pick up the phone and ring their superior to tell them, “They're at it again!”

Don't give in to base instincts. Sharpen your wit. And humour!

Yours incredibly righteously ;)

Tony

jagman
28th January 2012, 19:20
Kudos chiquetet. Very good advice, I have watched the Bill Woods drama unfold and I have some how managed to keep my personal feelings
quiet. There is nothing wrong with practicing discernment, But there is a problem with being rude & nasty

Rahkyt
28th January 2012, 19:25
it's arguing with emotion. admittedly, difficult to separate the two. combine that with an agenda and the descent becomes inevitable. in a place where you have so many of so many differing understandings, how can it be any different than it is here?

gooty64
28th January 2012, 19:39
Tarka, what I noticed was the (lack of decent) manner in which the inquisition into the authenticity of Bill Wood was handled by a few.

Careless manners on the Bill Wood thread reduced the level of decorum to the point where I dropped out of the discussion.

My manners-I hope-are improving each week. I am deleting more comments before I hit the reply button lately.

I try to re-read my comments before posting and imagine if this will help or hinder the discussion constructively towards truth or resolution.



Don't believe, don't attack

Totally agree.

You could say that it was down to my warped hyper-sensitivity ( ;)), but part of the reason for writing this thread was the number of knives that seem to have been whipped out as soon as it became apparent that some people were looking into Bill Brockbrader's background.

It felt as if some saw that as a sacrilegious act that spoke of a lack of faith in those whom they choose to revere.

Whiskey_Mystic
28th January 2012, 19:59
I think what can be tiring is that some people don't know the difference between discussion and debate. In a discussion, you share ideas and consider things from different angles together. In a debate, you pick a side and defend it while attacking other points of view. I leave it up to you to decide which of these approaches will lead to greater understanding.

Hint: Project Avalon is a great place to have a discussion. ;)

christian
28th January 2012, 20:03
Don't believe, don't attack
part of the reason for writing this thread was the number of knives that seem to have been whipped out as soon as it became apparent that some people were looking into Bill Brockbrader's background.

It felt as if some saw that as a sacrilegious act that spoke of a lack of faith in those whom they choose to revere.

To expand on what gooty just said:

'Question everything' - that's a main purpose of Avalon, isn't it? But with style :cool:

What I objected was a low-quality research and I intended to calm down those who jump to conclusions based on low-quality information or simple speculation and then promote their conclusion vigorously as fact. I'm in search of proof like anyone else and if I was a judge in a courthouse on his case, I simply could not come to a conclusion right now and I'd not appreciate anyone in the courthouse attempting to drag Bill into a prison before this case is examinated more thoroughly. It's simply very hard to find good evidence right now, we got to be patient, I figure.

There were those saying "Bill resonates with me" or "I believe it", I let them be, those people were rather peaceful after all, the way I perceived it, and I'd only mind if they force their believe upon others.

CD7
28th January 2012, 20:22
I simply cannot wait until the dayz of theory, scientific fact, conclusion, proof, blk and white, written in stone, written in ink are no longer used...i simply CANNOT wait

firstlook
28th January 2012, 20:36
I simply cannot wait until the dayz of theory, scientific fact, conclusion, proof, blk and white, written in stone, written in ink are no longer used...i simply CANNOT wait

Those are all fine things by themselves. Its how we adapt to change that creates suffering. But yeah, the major influence behind alot conflict is that we have to get somewhere and Now. We think things wont happen if we do not force it to. Thats a huge misconception IMO. Least amount of effort moment to moment always works out the best.

I stress the moment to moment part. :)

firstlook
28th January 2012, 20:43
it's arguing with emotion. admittedly, difficult to separate the two. combine that with an agenda and the descent becomes inevitable. in a place where you have so many of so many differing understandings, how can it be any different than it is here?

This makes me not so down about things. Everyone is imperfect. No special group or mission eliminates this universal understanding. Once you reach for perfection, you will fall. I think thats when things get emotional IMO.

jp11
28th January 2012, 20:53
Tarka the Duck, interesting take on it.
Is anyone else battle-weary? Not against the PTB in all their shapes and forms, but between fellow members/camps of PA.

I left the forum last night feeling discouraged, disappointed, weary...and then vegged in front of the tube for about 2 hours to take a break.

As it turned out I couldn't remember where I left off last night so I ended up reading some of the pages I had seen last night before I called it quits. From a fresh perspective some of it didn't seem quite as offensive.

I understand we all have different points of view, different perspectives, etc. But what I don't understand and/or appreciate is when it does get personal and posters start attacking one another because they are not willing to agree to disagree.

Common decency, being kind and rereading one's communication before posting...how many times has this been said and yet still the same few continue to go all out with their hostile, nasty communications. As though that's funny (my perception) or OK. Well, imho it is not!

Again, my opinion, we are here to share information, expand our own awareness and/or consciousness, contribute to the greater good. And this does not happen when we allow our small ego to take over and BLAST another.

Thank you to all for your thoughtful posts.
:wave: :grouphug:

Bollinger
28th January 2012, 21:07
Is anyone else battle-weary? Not against the PTB in all their shapes and forms, but between fellow members/camps of PA. Even as I write this, I am expecting people to take offence...

For example on a current thread, the abuse that was dealt out by a couple of contributors was unnecessary. It was personal and aggressive. One member was accused of being a shill and asked how much they were being paid, and all the posters who expressed doubts were referred to as trolls.

The truth about the whole situation is not yet known. It may well never be the same truth for all viewers: that seems to be the nature of this alternative world.

We are in danger of creating an environment here that is very unattractive to any who don't follow the mainstream. Isn't not following the mainstream why most of us are here?

I don't understand blind adherence to unsubstantiated claims.
It's even more difficult to understand the apparent hatred directed at those who dare to investigate further.
It's not a crime not to believe every conspiracy theory that is fed to us...

Yours,

A Very Sad Duck

Hi Kathie,

I think you hit the nail on the head when you say “I don't understand blind adherence to unsubstantiated claims”.

There is nothing more dangerous and rage inducing than blind faith. It is the culprit behind some of the worst atrocities in our history and stirs in humanity something so deep that even it has trouble defining or controlling it.

If a thousand people say they believe something without anything to back it up, do we risk their wrath by pointing out the irregularities, or do we consume and except their conditional love by joining in?

Of course there are moments when even the most ardent atheists and materialists privately confess to themselves some sort of faith because there are things in this world that no amount of scrutiny or dissection will ever explain and there are also many things that we can and do understand using established tools and rules at our disposal.

I don’t for a moment think that any particular person, group or society is blessed with the perfect truth because that really would be extraordinary and yet so many sects believe utterly that theirs is the correct path. What choice do they have but to believe it if everyone else around them is saying the same thing? Once in a while, the feeling runs so deep that it requires to be settled not by debate but bloodshed which ultimately becomes woven into the tenets and practice of that blind faith.

What we often see in forum discussions is exactly the same phenomenon but occurring without armed combat. People then revert to using the most effective weapon and you may find yourself on the receiving end of ridicule, sarcasm, insufficient acquaintance with the faith and even personal abuse. It is all aimed at shutting the other up or out so they stop interfering with the movie.

Have you noticed how a lot of threads seem to start or transmute into a religious fete, exuding evangelical pomposity aiming to separate the believers from the doubters? That’s not a debate. That is simply a test of your faith.

You’re with us or with the terrorists; in the words of a famous x-president. My answer to that would be: I’d rather be with the human race.

another bob
28th January 2012, 21:16
I simply cannot wait until the dayz of theory, scientific fact, conclusion, proof, blk and white, written in stone, written in ink are no longer used...i simply CANNOT wait



"If what has been analyzed
Is analyzed through further analysis,
There is no end to it,
Because that analysis would be analyzed too.

Once what had to be analyzed has been analyzed,
The analysis has no basis left.
Since there is no basis, it does not continue.
This is expressed as nirvana."

~Shantideva


:yo:

Kristo
28th January 2012, 21:57
Unfortunately, this was one of the first things I noticed - much to my surprise and slight shock, I might add - when I joined: the incredible touchiness of so many posters.

Personally, I don't understand such a frame of mind.
But this much is clear: defensiveness is usually a sign of internal lack of certitude.
But there's nothing wrong with not being certain (usually it is far more "hygienic" than absolute certitude) - unless one fails to recognise it in oneself, and then blames others for not validating a claim that one is not so sure oneself.

I say, the only way forward is, well, pressing forward: expressing one's views, without resorting to ad hominem attacks.
That's it.

:)

My sentiments exactly NeverMind. I feel myself pulling back more and more. If I don't agree with a thread or post, I leave it alone. Too often I try to peruse threads I find interesting, only to have to sift through a few people who don't agree with it, yet rather than leave they keep posting over and over again, attempting to (I guess) change the minds of other intelligent people who clearly won't. So be it. Move to another thread and leave that one for those who are interested. That imho is EGO taking over when one feels the needs to keep participating on a thread they think is bogus. If I saw a thread title that said "Madam Cleo predicts End of World in 2012!!!" I would save my energy and sanity and not even read it... respecting the right for those who decide to delve into it to have at it.
I am tired and weary of this PA just because of this very subject.... *yawn*

jjjones
28th January 2012, 22:36
hi friends, unconditionality, acceptance and being non-judgemental are the keys to awareness and peace within oneself. this thread sounds like a group of woodpeckers pecking. if someone wants to stir the crap to make it stink, then let them smell it and just ignore them. if people do not know you personally, then why be thin skinned? it is what it is- a forum and threads, the purpose is to speak your thoughts and learn to discern. if some are brash and ignorant, so what, they are making an arse out of themselves, not an arse out of you. really if we on this forum are always complaining, how in the same hill are 7 billion of us going to ever unconditionally accept and love each? think maybe it would be helpful if ALL of us go within ourselves and have a good look around at ourself and be grateful that we still at this point in time have the freedom to speak and to have freedom on the internet. I am fully aware of the big time heavy energy moving in our lives and it is going to get somewhat heavier for awhile. hang in there everyone! Namast, love and peace universally :)

Dorjezigzag
28th January 2012, 22:38
By definition a debate is not necessarily

you pick a side and defend it
like many words it has more than one meaning
we do not need to debate this, just look in your dictionary!
but there may come a time when a point is presented and you disagree, there is nothing wrong with this, it is O.K. to disagree, perhaps the debate will then involve you taking sides (points of view). You can then hopefully and those watching the debate come to some kind of deeper understanding with one another.
If you don't put your point across how will people become aware of other view points?

Too many people are saying they don't want to post because they disagree and they don't want to argue. If you feel strongly about something have no fear and put your point across, respectfully of course.

In certain contexts a discussion can become pretty heated as well. They discussed their opposing views;)




I think what can be tiring is that some people don't know the difference between discussion and debate. In a discussion, you share ideas and consider things from different angles together. In a debate, you pick a side and defend it while attacking other points of view. I leave it up to you to decide which of these approaches will lead to greater understanding.

Hint: Project Avalon is a great place to have a discussion. ;)

CD7
28th January 2012, 22:48
I stress the moment to moment part.




Oh im in the moment alright! The moment of witnessing the "Alice in wonderland effect" so i thought id comment..and YES! tip the hat guy..ditto wht shantideva said :)

crested-duck
29th January 2012, 00:13
Say what you mean-mean what you say- but do'nt say it in a mean way!! It's really that simple, we all know this, but sometimes we need to be reminded, as we all seem to forget it, at times .

NeverMind
29th January 2012, 00:23
I understand, Kristo, totally. And it may be the wisest thing to do, if for no other reason, precisely to save one's own calmness.
The problem is, if all the non-argumentative posters refrain from posting.... well, you can guess the rest.
But it still wouldn't be tragic, except for the forum itself, which would rapidly deteriorate.


If I saw a thread title that said "Madam Cleo predicts End of World in 2012!!!" I would save my energy and sanity and not even read it...

Oh, I would LOVE to see a thread titled like that!
I sure need a good laugh right now.
Come to think of it, just this mention of a hypothetical thread with that title made me chuckle pretty loudly. :)
(I do think it could use a few more exclamations marks, though.)

Anchor
29th January 2012, 00:57
This thread is brilliant.

I chose to read it from the perspective of energy exchange, and choosing what to do with your energy.

Basically those people who feel a bit down after reading PA - well some of your energy got taken? Where did it go?

There is so much traffic on PA these days, I simply cannot read it all, so I just pick the things that I like.

Carmody
29th January 2012, 01:29
Is anyone else battle-weary? Not against the PTB in all their shapes and forms, but between fellow members/camps of PA. Even as I write this, I am expecting people to take offence...

For example on a current thread, the abuse that was dealt out by a couple of contributors was unnecessary. It was personal and aggressive. One member was accused of being a shill and asked how much they were being paid, and all the posters who expressed doubts were referred to as trolls.

The truth about the whole situation is not yet known. It may well never be the same truth for all viewers: that seems to be the nature of this alternative world.

We are in danger of creating an environment here that is very unattractive to any who don't follow the mainstream. Isn't not following the mainstream why most of us are here?

I don't understand blind adherence to unsubstantiated claims.
It's even more difficult to understand the apparent hatred directed at those who dare to investigate further.
It's not a crime not to believe every conspiracy theory that is fed to us...

Yours,

A Very Sad Duck

right at the moment it got ugly, we had a x class solar flare.

If one does not understand how that affects things in the human sphere of existence, then an attempt should be made.

Yes, we really are that connected to things.

Which is why I mentioned that issue, right in the thread. :)

tonius
29th January 2012, 01:32
I understand, Kristo, totally. And it may be the wisest thing to do, if for no other reason, precisely to save one's own calmness.
The problem is, if all the non-argumentative posters refrain from posting.... well, you can guess the rest.
But it still wouldn't be tragic, except for the forum itself, which would rapidly deteriorate.


If I saw a thread title that said "Madam Cleo predicts End of World in 2012!!!" I would save my energy and sanity and not even read it...

Oh, I would LOVE to see a thread titled like that!
I sure need a good laugh right now.
Come to think of it, just this mention of a hypothetical thread with that title made me chuckle pretty loudly. :)
(I do think it could use a few more exclamations marks, though.)

I think one can learn more from this thread and similar ones than all the channeled messages put together, Why ? because there is interaction between us,simple crude human(soul) interaction.

Filling your head all the time with cool stuff and guessing which dimension is coming next takes away from what is here now,it may be food for the ego which is always thrilled for next alien, mesiah to come , but is poison for the heart,and by heart i mean that deep place within each of us ,where we all Really are.It seems simplicity is the key to 'return' there.

Strangely the more one tries to complicate things by dreaming about other dimensions or trying to vibrate more, further that place seems to be.
Sometimes we get lost on disccusing on probable futures or gathering so much infomation on the technalities of this illuson that we forget where we were going.Maybe it will take us some time, after being tired of playing around with the attractions of this illuson,to go back 'Home'

I myself would encourage everyone to speak openly, tell what you think openly with no worry of how it will be percieved.If you try to force your opinions in the frame of 'kindness' they change form in the eyes of the perciever.By this i mean dont force it also in the opposite direction,than you are just acting to hurt.

peronal note : Never thought a bunch of pixels (words) on a screen, wich in itself is not real, can hurt an Infinite being like we are.

In fact i would love to have my feelings 'HURT' ,that would tell me more about me than the person who wrote it,independently of his/her real intentions.
If we are shy even here, in the heart of 'AVALON' than freedom on this earth would be in real danger.

peronal note(stop with these personal notes you fu..er :eek: ) : If i had saved a penny for each time my Intuition has been 'Hurt' by channeled massages and letters from Jesus i would be a Billionaire

greetings to you all from 'Tonius Captian of the Galactic Pirates' :cool:

WhiteFeather
29th January 2012, 01:53
We have lost some great members on this forum due to this, And I Miss Them Very Much Whole Heartedly. Fred S, Artemesia and many other 24K Golden Nuggets as well. Sometimes perhaps you have to turn the other cheek, Or Just Simply Ignore The BullShyte. It happens in every forum.

spiritguide
29th January 2012, 01:57
To this day they do not provide proper communications courses in the schools. We know the PTW likes us divided and the lack of this subject matter in our educational system is assisting them in many ways. Your taught how to read and write and proper sentence structure. Is that all communication is? Do they teach nonverbal communications to the mainstream students? Some of the theory of communications is learned mostly through experiential learning and hard to find. Proper communication is necessary for SYNERGY and that is what we are all looking for here at Avalon. Synergy is what winning teams are made of and once we learn it we will be a winning group against divide and conquer. Research SYNERGY and the light will go on. This is what the Japanese used to take our auto industry away from us. IMHO

sleepy
29th January 2012, 02:39
xxxx xxxxx.

Rahkyt
29th January 2012, 03:04
right at the moment it got ugly, we had a x class solar flare.

If one does not understand how that affects things in the human sphere of existence, then an attempt should be made.

Yes, we really are that connected to things.

Which is why I mentioned that issue, right in the thread. :)

Needs to be repeated because it needs to be understood intuitively and experientially. These things affect us all whether we consciously realize it or not. Watching it and consciously choosing not to participate has been an exercise in self-control on my part. Not speaking on things I am knowledgeable about and that I might vehemently disagree with folks about is a solid realization regarding some of my own issues and also a testament to the reality that my participation is not necessary, which is, in turn, a lesson in humility and ego-dampening. Being aware in the last week and some change of the effect of these solar flares and seeing it manifest here and in other venues has been quite sobering. It has put to the test and raised to the level of serious consideration much that many have been postulating and that has been heretofore dismissed as nonsense. It will be interesting to continue to watch how the energetic workings of the world and cosmos without continue to affect our communications and how we each respond to it in our interactions with others here.

DNA
29th January 2012, 04:10
Recently as you know there has been alot of conjecture regarding the likes of Bill Wood, David Wilcock & Ben Fulford...

I don't trust David Wilcock and never really have, sure some of his teachings resonate but its nothing that you can't find elsewhere. He's just a slicker presenter than most. Lately I have been finding more and more holes in Ben Fulfords information, but I still listen to what he has to say for entertainment purposes.

I somehow believe that their maybe some truth to the (T1) story from Bill Wood, but after the 2nd interview with his new buddy clouded my view of him, not so much of his message...

Repeating myself again, its 'High Time' we (ALL) started Look (Within) for the Answers, instead putting so much trust in Whistleblowers and Psuedo Gurus...Start taking some 'Responsibilty' for your own 'Truth' instead counting others to do it for you..!

Having said all that...

Tarka, I say 'Get Over It' & 'Get On With It' and enjoy the 'Journey' instead worrying about others who don't agree with you...

Regards,

Jack :)

I was curious as to how your opinion was going to change when Wilcock was displayed so prominantly in the second Wood interview.
I am forever perplexed as to your disposition towards the guy(Wilcock). I could understand if you had a beef with his information, but it seems to be a more personal reason you dislike the guy, which perplexes me also, because for all you say about the guy being a slick salesman,,,he really is not.
The guy just presents information and backs it up with sources.
How is that slick salesmanship? He is never really selling himself. He is giving information he feels is pertinent, he is not channelling or asking anyone to drink any kool-aid. He gives most of this information away for free.

I don't think folks who take in Wilcock's information should be accused of having a lack of discernment. Objectivelly exposing yourself to data does not mean you have to believe everything or anything any one person states. It's as if you are afraid Wilcock's information will some how descredit the conspiracy community, if such a thing could be said to exist.

I don't think Wilcock is a guru or a pseudo guru. And if you want folks to look within themselves so much then why are you posting a couple of new threads a day?

I have nothing against the information you post, you post some great stuff, I'm just saying, don't suggest one thing by posting tons of new information and then chastise folks for doing this same exact thing except that they are looking for the information in an area that you consider unsactioned or that you do not approve of.

Ryan and Cassidy obviously approve of Wilcock's information to the point that they keep including his input on some of their most important interviews.
Are they so much in error that we need to amend our ways because something about Wilcock offends you?

I honestly believe Wilcock is trying to help the community and the world at large. How is this hurting anyone or anything?

markpierre
29th January 2012, 06:40
One thing about 'us' that will certainly not 'ascend' if that's the acceptable term, is separate human identity. That aspect of the function of our minds is going to do and say and imagine
and rationalize anything and everything it has to, in order to stay what it considers 'alive'.

It's literally life and death, and the death of the ego is NOT an allegory. It's everything we feel (not what we think we know) not about 'death', but about obliteration.
No more you.
And don't be fooled that self identification moves at will in and out of the influence of the ego. They both are formed of each other and both are mechanisms of the other. Both entirely unreal.

Just be accepting and forgiving here, because no one here is exempt.
As much as we feel that we 'can't be bothered', or we believe that we've got our own communication sorted, everyone has a shield around their little selves.
It thinks it wants help but argues with the answers. It thinks it's doing service and it's really just justifying however it defines itself.

The same confrontations that happen here are happening in all of our lives. I wouldn't begrudge a bit of the real work to reveal itself wherever it serves it's purpose.
Recognize the ego, recognize the function it serves to your sense who and what you are, and the insidiousness of it.
And learn to not be fooled that it means anything. That's the process.
The only way of 'overcoming the ego' (like we think we can), is to disempower it. Let it be just ridiculous enough to reveal the fraud of it.

It's been said elsewhere, that the only tool that falsity has to assert and maintain itself is force. But power wins over force.
It's being revealed all around us.

Acceptance is power. Truth is power. Not the truth of whatever information I think is important, but the truth of me.
Unconditional love is acceptance. Conditional love is fear. Some of us need to work on that a little, and so we are.
Here, and wherever we go. Every minute of every day.
What are we willing to accept? That we might be wrong about everything?
No, we're not particularly willing, and so all this struggle and urgency to get the facts straight.
Good luck.

Everyone will have this experience: 'my fraud' is more convincing than 'other's frauds.' Other's frauds are so easy to detect. That's a good one for the lightworker identities to examine.

You're in the ocean. You're going to drown. It's up to the you that thinks it's a body to draw in that first breath of water. If you struggle you've made the choice to not choose,
and yet that moment approaches and then arrives.
Well that's a pretty pathetic allegory of what's actually occurring, but you can tease yourself with the sensation of it.

Are you (and myself) ready right now, to let go of everything we know? Including our selves? Even 'the unknown' implies the fraud that there's something to know.

It's really good to get honest and question ourselves a little deeper and avoid the distractions of chicken and egg stories. There is no answer, but we get so much medication from debate. Conceptual thinking is the thing that's unreal.
That's the sickness that hides reality.

The self that invented itself, is going to learn a lot about resistance.

Project_Buggy_Beach
29th January 2012, 08:05
I try and give everyone on this site the benefit of doubt and know I could have a much longer discussion with any of them then almost everyone I come in contact with on a daily basis who I don't dare bring up subjects important to me since it always results in the subject being altered as quickly as possible.

Tarka the Duck
29th January 2012, 09:42
There is nothing wrong with practicing discernment, But there is a problem with being rude & nasty

Absolutely. You know that. I know that.
So why does a post that accuses another member of being "obnoxious" and "transparently negative" get more than a dozen thanks?

modwiz
29th January 2012, 10:10
There is nothing wrong with practicing discernment, But there is a problem with being rude & nasty

Absolutely. You know that. I know that.
So why does a post that accuses another member of being "obnoxious" and "transparently negative" get more than a dozen thanks?
13257
..........:faint2::sad::ohwell::noidea::jaw:

Tony
29th January 2012, 10:25
Taking away empathy.



Derren Brown's Gameshow: a question of individualism
Derren Brown's second show in his The Experiments series raises even more questions than the 'Assassin'.

In 'Gameshow', Brown explores what happens when individuals merge into a mob. To test the theory that when individuals lose their sense of self they also lose their morals, he sets up an audience to think that they are taking part in a new gameshow that he is hosting called 'Remote Control'. To participate they must don masks to ensure their anonymity. The audience is asked to decide the fate of a young man who is spending Friday night out with his mates. The mates, and people in the bar, are in on the whole thing. During the course of the show the audience get to choose a positive or negative outcome for the young man. Every time the majority opts for the cruel one. Our innocent stooge becomes a puppet as the audience whoops with joy at the awful time he is having. Even when they are not asked for a view, some audience members shout out suggestions like "smash his TV".

Disturbingly, this could actually be a bona fide TV show although one would hope Derren Brown would never front it.

Brown brilliantly makes his point about human nature with a combination of showmanship and psychological understanding. The ending jolts the audience back to reality. One hopes that when they went on they thought hard about what they had done.

What does this studio recreation of something akin to William Golding's 'Lord of the Flies' tell us about the individual?

The speed with which a bunch of people who don't know each other turn against someone they have never met is frightening. The baying mob lap up the misery that they are helping to inflict.

One might draw the conclusion that it is imperative to have strict laws that control human behaviour given how easily it is to manipulate people. Surely people must be controlled by harsh moral edicts and the threat of punishment to prevent them from running amok?

The counter view is that it is that control that causes all the problems. By attempting to create a sense of loyalty to a moral regime you remove the very individualism that prevents the emergence of the mob. The more people give up their sense of self the more easily someone can use that grouping to turn on another group. Far better, according to this approach, to remove all artificial constructs and let individuals voluntarily co-operate with each other. The less the individual can hide behind a group that makes the individual anonymous the better.

Essentially, the two contrasting views are authoritarian and libertarian. Classical liberals will instinctively dismiss the former. But they will be slightly concerned about what might happen in the latter world. If everyone is free and co-operating then all well and good. The problem arises when someone comes along and attempts to imposes a system on the majority. If enough people can be convinced that they should follow this charismatic leader, and they are likely to be charismatic, they then become mob fodder.

This is partly why classical liberals like limited government, checks and balances and an emphasis on freedom. Democracy itself has to be checked in a classical liberal society.

What Derren Brown's phony gameshow warns us that democracy is no guarantee. At the beginning of the show over 80% supported a negative outcome. By the end it had reduced to around 60%. That is not only a majority but a solid majority. Looked at like that, not only is democracy no guarantee, it is a mechanism that can be used to justify harmful behaviour.

Depending on your political inclination, you will plump for one of the above options or some sort of compromised mix.

Rahkyt
29th January 2012, 12:45
I really hate it when people use their intellect to bully others. Draw forth reactions from them that seem to fulfill their "predictions", making them seem like a guru. What they say seems to make sense in a self-fulfilling prophecy kind of way while being only representative of basic pyschology and a form of double-speak that sounds like "tough love" and "telling it like it is" when, in fact, it is arrogant, condescending and just a higher form of trolling.

More thread hi-jacking tactics its sad to watch and even sadder to participate in. Thuggery masking as higher spirituality. Another issue to deal with when considering how we interact with each other.

Daft Ada
29th January 2012, 13:19
I completely agree Kathy, It's why I rarely post these days other than a comment of agreement here and there. I am a member of a lot of forums and go by many names but this one in particular seems to have many members who think their point of view is the only truth and they jump down the throat of anyone who doesn't agree with them, and as you say, usually in a very nasty and uncalled for way. No one should ever talk to another human being in that way, but quite frankly if it does happen, it's up to the mods to jump on and put a stop to stop that.

sleepy
29th January 2012, 13:30
xxxx xxxxxx

Tarka the Duck
29th January 2012, 13:31
Every now and then it is a good idea to take a break from PA and the internet in General. Take three days off from any news site, forum, or Facebook. In fact, turn off your TV and computer completely for three days. If you feel withdrawal symptoms, turn on the radio. Focus on nature, presence, and simplicity. Have a cup of tea. Listen to the birds. Read a poem.

It's ok. The apocalypse will still be here when you come back.

This is why I love camping. No phone, no TV, no internet, just mother nature. It is too cold to disapear for the weekend but I do love it. It is good for my soul.

Take me with yooooooo!!

sleepy
29th January 2012, 13:45
xxxxxx xxxxxx

markpierre
29th January 2012, 14:00
And some cigars..

Tarka the Duck
29th January 2012, 14:12
And some cigars..http://projectavalon.net/forum4/asset.php?fid=10143&uid=6567&d=1327846059

Mmmmm...not sure this is the image I want to portray of myself...I'll stick to the marshmallows I think!

kcbc2010
30th January 2012, 01:39
I've only recently come back to PA because I reached a point where I just couldn't take it anymore. I've been a lot happier this time around. However, I need to say that I am kind of surprised at the level of attacks because I have high expectations for the people who come here.

A lot of what I want to say has already been said by others, so I really don't want to repeat their thoughts. Sometimes, you have to move to another sandbox and play there.

Everyone has issues that just put you into a defensive mode and the fact is that it's hard to have a discussion when you are on defense. You aren't listening, but waiting for the next attack. I try to choose conversations wisely and figure out which ones I can gain from or contribute something.

Franny
30th January 2012, 02:39
I really hate it when people use their intellect to bully others. Draw forth reactions from them that seem to fulfill their "predictions", making them seem like a guru. What they say seems to make sense in a self-fulfilling prophecy kind of way while being only representative of basic pyschology and a form of double-speak that sounds like "tough love" and "telling it like it is" when, in fact, it is arrogant, condescending and just a higher form of trolling.

More thread hi-jacking tactics its sad to watch and even sadder to participate in. Thuggery masking as higher spirituality. Another issue to deal with when considering how we interact with each other.

Thank you Rahkyt, an eloquent statement about this. Iʻve been watching it for awhile now and just keep my fingers off the keyboard and wonder why.

I refrain from posting most of the time because I am no longer an articulate writer or speaker due to an injury. I know if I post anything even slightly controversial, it will be usually be poorly written and I will be unable to defend my statements if the trolling starts.

I know Iʻm not the only one as I have had convo with others about this. Many donʻt feel they will be able to post as well, nor are they as aggressive as some others, so their voices are not heard.