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S-L
5th February 2012, 14:49
[mod-edit]New readers: "Bill" is Bill Wood (William Brockbrader) and Charles is Atticus (Stephen Hodges)[mod-edit]

How many of us sent a dollar to Bill? How many of us joined Charles/Atticus' online forum? How many of us got a pass to board the mothership? How many of us defended people who manipulated us?

How discerning are we? Not as a group or community, but as individuals?

If we can't discern fellow human beings, then how can we discern the Alien Intervention? This is a time for radical self-honesty. Reacting defensively to these questions is not helpful.

If an intelligent and clever human being can sit down in a chair, tell us a story, and have us believe it, then how well can we possibly fare discerning the stories told to us by the Alien Intervention?


We are here to activate your DNA.
This world belongs to us as we seeded it with life.
We are your long lost brothers from a distant star, we merely want to help you grow spiritually.
We are here to help you ascend!
You will destroy this world without our assistance.
Etc...

We are dealing with other intelligent species that are more advanced and cunning than we are. They have demonstrated skill in telepathy, mind control, and brainwashing. Regardless of who your favourite author is on the subject - regardless of the story you wish to believe - take heed! If we have difficulty discerning fellow human beings, then we are doubly challenged in discerning an intelligent being from a distant star, someone who does not adhere to human psychology, human culture, human values, human history, etc.

No matter what your opinion is on the Alien Agenda, regardless of how many decades it took you to come to this understanding, be wary of the stories that they put out. Be cautious. Any story that seems to put us in a subservient role, or one of trust, or one of needing something from them, should be treated with extreme caution.

This is not being fearful or negative. This is being alert, aware, and cautious. This isn't a game. We couldn't even discern Bill and Charles. Be careful with Aliens. Be smarter. Accept that perhaps you're wrong. The stakes are too high to make a mistake here. They are abducting people left and right. Can you tell friend from foe? How certain are you? Are you willing to bet this planet on it?

9eagle9
5th February 2012, 15:12
People have come to believe that denial is some form of spirituality.

Denial is not spirituality. It's denial.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Help us grow spiritually. How do you 'grow' that which is unlimited in the first place? How to make more of what is already infinite? Extending the life of the eternal?

Can you build a condo at the end of the universe? Where would we begin building it at.

DreamsInDigital
5th February 2012, 15:17
SL would you seriously quit with your fear mongering? It's one thing to be skeptical, but seriously.

S-L
5th February 2012, 15:24
SL would you seriously quit with your fear mongering? It's one thing to be skeptical, but seriously.

There's nothing fearful about the above! Accepting that perhaps the universe is a competitive environment is not fearful - it is realistic. It is cautious. It is being aware. Some of us are more trusting of Aliens and their agendas than we are of our next door neighbour. Do you see the problem here? Why should they have our trust? They are abducting thousands upon thousands of people.

What you call fear, I call critical thinking.

GaelVictor
5th February 2012, 15:25
I knew both Atticus and BW for what they were during their first interviews.
My positronic brain has a special detection module for BS.

I know that many Avalonians have similar abilities. Look for their guidance if you're in the dark.

AlternativeInfoJunkie
5th February 2012, 15:26
I'm with you sl. I for one feel like i have been too trusting. Not everybody can be an honest soul. i just wish everyone was sometimes.

Arrowwind
5th February 2012, 15:29
How many of us sent a dollar to Bill? How many of us joined Charles/Atticus' online forum? How many of us got a pass to board the mothership? How many of us defended people who manipulated us?

How discerning are we? Not as a group or community, but as individuals?

?[/B]

Absolutley agreed. Not only did people fail to discern those who did and called it got belittled in the face of the public here, surely an attempt to silence.
I do not see SL as fear mongering... only stating the facts as they stand.
We have a long way to go before we are fully human yet, it seems.

RMorgan
5th February 2012, 15:43
Hey mate,

Well, this subject actually is really worrying me a lot.

How come such a great number of people here in PA, who were supposed to be more "awakened" than the masses, believe such things????

I mean, just look at the latest hoax, that alien trip. Lots of people here were actually thinking that an alien would pick them up at home, riding a black limousine, to take them into an intergalactic trip aboard an alien mothership, without having a single bit of evidence about that! I´m sorry for the word, but how stupid this sounds??

If your phone rings and someone tells you have been chosen to go on a trip to the Caribbean Islands for 10 days, completely free of any charge, would you believe that as well? Come on!!!

There is a lot of hoaxers, charlatans and mentally ill persons out there. If someone makes a website, in order to blacklist any alternative character whenever he tells a big lie, well, I guess we wouldn´t have a handful of credible names right now. However, people love to forget. Just look at how busy was the alien trip thread during the last days and how it is right now. People are ready to forget about that and to buy into another scam.

To make things worse, there are always the excuses...Oh, he was a victim of an AI!!! Oh, he was mislead by a CIA psy-ops!!

Come on!! The chances are much bigger that these characters are either mentally ill, charlatans or even both!!

Please, I understand some people are desperate to believe something is coming down here to save us. However, it´s time for us to assume the responsibilities over our actions. If you choose to believe something, believe your family, your friends, your loved ones, because they are the closest thing you will find to call "real".

I really hope some of you have learned the lesson after this latest gullibility disaster.

Whenever someone, anyone, makes a huge claim or promise, he should also present proportionally big evidence and proof to back it up.

It shouldn't ´t be hard for a genetically modified super soldier to prove his abilities, right?

It also shouldn´t be hard for a man who have daily contact with entities from another dimension or planet to prove it, right?

Enough is Enough!!! Please, WAKE UP!

With all due respect and much love,

Raf.

PS: By the way, there are 99% of chances that, in most cases related to such subject, we´re are dealing with the most dangerous alien species ever, which is called MAN.

NewFounderHome
5th February 2012, 15:46
I wonder of the purpose of this thread? Sorry!

S-L
5th February 2012, 15:54
I wonder of the purpose of this thread? Sorry!

Learning from our mistakes, becoming more discerning, and even becoming less easily trusting. Also, to bring up some points about the Alien Agenda that often people are not interested in discussing. It's so rare to hear someone say: "perhaps they don't have our best interest at heart." Such things are seldom heard on this forum. The recent events are a good learning opportunity for us all, but only if we talk about it. If we don't, then this will just keep happening over and over again.

RMorgan
5th February 2012, 15:55
I wonder of the purpose of this thread? Sorry!

Hey friend,

I guess the purpose of this thread is to take a very commonly and recurrent mistake, analyze it and finally learn something from it, instead of letting it be forgotten and repeated eternally.

Cheers,

Raf.

Snowbird
5th February 2012, 16:16
Is it possible that another purpose for this thread is for us all/each to acknowledge that we are at differing stages of spiritual development and discernment? What may appear obvious to some is a foggy vision to others. I certainly think that it is a good idea to voice your opinion if you genuinely feel that something is off course or that someone is heading off the path. Making mistakes is a huge and wonderful teacher. I've had egg-on-my-face any number of times throughout my life. I accept and learn from these teaching tools. And, I hope that when I fall short of the mark (sin, anyone?) that those around me will be kind and supportive.

That's just me. :love:

dddanieljjjamesss
5th February 2012, 16:19
We are our experience.
Sometimes we will fool ourselves,
to teach us a lesson.
Sometimes we will remember.
But it is us.
It's always us.

Kelly
5th February 2012, 17:15
Great post, and i have to say, i used to be really trusting, until a few months ago, when i was on the receiving end of a supposed GFL commander because i questioned.
Right now, im not trusting anything i hear, im not taking things at face value, and im certainley not following blindly or being subserviant to anyone!!!

This what you have posted is just common sense not negative, and we need to have more of it!!!

jackovesk
5th February 2012, 17:30
[mod-edit]New readers: "Bill" is Bill Wood (William Brockbrader) and Charles is Atticus (Stephen Hodges)[mod-edit]

How many of us sent a dollar to Bill? How many of us joined Charles/Atticus' online forum? How many of us got a pass to board the mothership? How many of us defended people who manipulated us?

How discerning are we? Not as a group or community, but as individuals?

If we can't discern fellow human beings, then how can we discern the Alien Intervention? This is a time for radical self-honesty. Reacting defensively to these questions is not helpful.

If an intelligent and clever human being can sit down in a chair, tell us a story, and have us believe it, then how well can we possibly fare discerning the stories told to us by the Alien Intervention?


We are here to activate your DNA.
This world belongs to us as we seeded it with life.
We are your long lost brothers from a distant star, we merely want to help you grow spiritually.
We are here to help you ascend!
You will destroy this world without our assistance.
Etc...

We are dealing with other intelligent species that are more advanced and cunning than we are. They have demonstrated skill in telepathy, mind control, and brainwashing. Regardless of who your favourite author is on the subject - regardless of the story you wish to believe - take heed! If we have difficulty discerning fellow human beings, then we are doubly challenged in discerning an intelligent being from a distant star, someone who does not adhere to human psychology, human culture, human values, human history, etc.

No matter what your opinion is on the Alien Agenda, regardless of how many decades it took you to come to this understanding, be wary of the stories that they put out. Be cautious. Any story that seems to put us in a subservient role, or one of trust, or one of needing something from them, should be treated with extreme caution.

This is not being fearful or negative. This is being alert, aware, and cautious. This isn't a game. We couldn't even discern Bill and Charles. Be careful with Aliens. Be smarter. Accept that perhaps you're wrong. The stakes are too high to make a mistake here. They are abducting people left and right. Can you tell friend from foe? How certain are you? Are you willing to bet this planet on it?

Don't you think most already innately know this..?

...and the few who don't, have too much time on their hands continually jumping on the never ending Merry-Go-Round to debate it..?

Rahkyt
5th February 2012, 17:32
People are indeed at different places in their research, in their understanding, in their knowledge, in their life journeys. Let me put this out there:

1) What if you are sitting at home one night, half-watching television, then, all of a sudden, there is a voice in your head? Stating that it is an alien? What do you do?

2) What if you and a friend are just playing around, go out and buy a Ouija board, and it works? And you can tell for sure that your friend isnt moving it and you aren't either?

3) What if you have a visitation from what seem to be little grey dudes, or you see a UFO up close?

My point is, that many of us do not have these kinds of experiences. So it is easy for those who do not to look at those who say that they do and laugh. Or disbelieve. But it is not so easy for those who have experienced things that are not explainable by traditional methods to do so. For those who have seen past the veil, it is often easier to give these strange experiences and experiencers, claims and claimants the benefit of the doubt, to, if not disbelieve, then, at least, withhold judgement, until more information arrives.

In a place like PA, and in the Awake and Aware movement in general, you have people who are just awakening mixing with people who have been awake their entire lives. Often it is a volatile mix, as we see here every day. The limitations of a text-based communication network works doubly against us here because so many are empathic, utilize their extra-sensory perceptions, react to what they sense behind words, energies, etc. And when it comes to the alien agenda and the extraordinary claims that get folks so bent out of shape, the connection between personal evolution and interaction with ultra-dimensional entities is lost in the mix of emotions and recriminations. Dealing with entities for whom time is malleable is a thought and potential reality that must boggle the mind if thought about in-depth. Dealing with entities that have possessed civilization and history spanning hundreds of thousands of years, millions of years, even billions of years, is a possible reality that, if we take the time to think about it, is really difficult to comprehend, as far as their motivations are concerned.

Being aware is good. Being cautious is fine. But, really, if any of those civilizations out there who people think are here really wanted us? To destroy us? They could in an instant.

In that scenario, fear is not the proper response. Curiosity and attention are.

NewFounderHome
5th February 2012, 17:45
I wonder of the purpose of this thread? Sorry!

Learning from our mistakes, becoming more discerning, and even becoming less easily trusting. Also, to bring up some points about the Alien Agenda that often people are not interested in discussing. It's so rare to hear someone say: "perhaps they don't have our best interest at heart." Such things are seldom heard on this forum. The recent events are a good learning opportunity for us all, but only if we talk about it. If we don't, then this will just keep happening over and over again.

We have been learning from our mistakes for how many generations, centuries and more.
We are at the point of moving, taking action, if it is of trying stuff outside of our comfort zone, well so be it.
I don't think of myself as better than anyone else and I don't look down on no one either.

So what information is this thread bringing that we don't know? What is new?

Well i will hold back from posting in this thread, since my word might not be well chosen.

RMorgan
5th February 2012, 17:54
I wonder of the purpose of this thread? Sorry!

Learning from our mistakes, becoming more discerning, and even becoming less easily trusting. Also, to bring up some points about the Alien Agenda that often people are not interested in discussing. It's so rare to hear someone say: "perhaps they don't have our best interest at heart." Such things are seldom heard on this forum. The recent events are a good learning opportunity for us all, but only if we talk about it. If we don't, then this will just keep happening over and over again.

We have been learning from our mistakes for how many generations, centuries and more.
We are at the point of moving, taking action, if it is of trying stuff outside of our comfort zone, well so be it.
I don't think of myself as better than anyone else and I don't look down on no one either.

So what information is this thread bringing that we don't know? What is new?

Well i will hold back from posting in this thread, since my word might not be well chosen.

Hi my friend,

Well, the problem is that the human animal is the only known animal that makes the same mistake over and over again.

Contrary to what you´ve said, generally, we haven´t been wise enough to learn from our mistakes.

If we had indeed learned from them, we would be living in a completely different planet and system right now.

Cheers,

Raf.

Carmen
5th February 2012, 17:56
My mistakes are mine to make and often they will be my best learning! No one tells me what I should or should not believe. That is the domain of my Inner Self. Free choice is just that. We are all adults here. No need for the discernment police who think they know best for everyone.

Love and light

Carmen

marique3652
5th February 2012, 17:59
Great post, and i have to say, i used to be really trusting, until a few months ago, when i was on the receiving end of a supposed GFL commander because i questioned.
Right now, im not trusting anything i hear, im not taking things at face value, and im certainley not following blindly or being subserviant to anyone!!!

This what you have posted is just common sense not negative, and we need to have more of it!!!

I totally agree with you Kelly and S-L. Why does using discernment equal being negative? I was right there with you Kelly when you and I were questioning (at a different group), and we both were put on the hot seat, called dark souls, and verbally bashed for raising any discerning questions, so I totally understand where you are coming from and how you are feeling. I also feel that any channeling or claims from anyone at all that puts themselves above we "silly" humans and wants us to be subserviant or give complete trust to them because they know so much more than us, is completely suspect with me. Having been an abduction "statistic" I am very very cautious of off world races that claim they want to "rescue" us from ourselves. People say they "know" that these races who make claims to humans are benevolent, but I am not just going to go along with others and think they are all okey dokey. How do people REALLY know? Is it because of something they have read or channelers that are telling them that? That does not necessarily make it so. Maybe if I had taken a ride with Ashtar or had a brunch with Sanada or sipped tea with St Germain or AA Michael maybe I would think differently, but alas that has not happened. I need and want tangible physical evidence of benevolence, and do not trust humans to make that judgement call just yet. Humans have been mistaken before when dealing with off world entities or interdimentional species, and that is a subject for another post so I will not go there... That is why S-L's post resonates so much with me. There is nothing wrong with using our human intellect and analytical powers to think things through, and that does not make a person dark or negative. That is how I feel.

RMorgan
5th February 2012, 18:02
My mistakes are mine to make and often they will be my best learning! No one tells me what I should or should not believe. That is the domain of my Inner Self. Free choice is just that. We are all adults here. No need for the discernment police who think they know best for everyone.

Love and light

Carmen

Hey Carmen,

No offense intended here, but personally, I´m not trying to police anyone; I´m trying to help others. It´s a completely different thing.

Whenever I see someone falling into a trap, or for a scam or hoax, I feel like I have the moral and ethical obligation to help and, sometimes, avoid a deception.

I can´t even remember how many times I´ve warned people here about false predictions, false gurus and fake promises...People don´t listen most of the times, but at least I´m doing my part.

I can´t see a person sitting on the porch, waiting for an alien to pick him up in a black limousine and pretend it´s ok. Can you?

Cheers,

Raf.

Whiskey_Mystic
5th February 2012, 18:08
There are certain signs to watch for and tactics of group manipulation to be aware of. Cult leaders, under any guise, will establish that some of you are special. Chosen. Or that you might be. Then the rest will feel envious and want to earn their way into the chosen group. The feeling of specialness creates loyalty and bonding along with a sense of purpose that can be directed by the cult leader.

Stephen (Charles) came and at first was just an interesting interview with new information. Then he said he was looking for a team of people and stated or insinuated that they would change the world, be major players at the highest levels of power, interact with St. Germaine, form a matrix paradigm for a new world, etc. He lashed out at those who questioned him, including Inelia, and caused a huge rift in the Avalon community. Vague answers, misdirection, teasers, and promises of special status were used to manipulate.

Brockbrader started last night by saying that those who donated a dollar were special. They were the true lightbearers of the grand change and he dubbed them Captains. He lost me right there. He knew what he was doing. It's a standard technique and is even used by some popular self-help/spiritual authors and speakers. Bill Harris even used to teach business seminars on how to milk your followers for money using this technique. Probably still does.

Anyways, I appreciate the OP (original post) as discernment is a subject of worthy discussion. The point of my post here is that there ARE things you can learn to help you out in this regard. Understanding the strategies and techniques of mass mind control, NLP, social engineering, marketing, and media communication is a great first step.

"Believe nothing, O monks, merely because you have been told it or because it is traditional, or because you yourselves have imagined it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings, that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide. " -Buddha

Vitalux
5th February 2012, 18:11
[mod-edit]New readers: "Bill" is Bill Wood (William Brockbrader) and Charles is Atticus (Stephen Hodges)[mod-edit]

How many of us sent a dollar to Bill? How many of us joined Charles/Atticus' online forum? How many of us got a pass to board the mothership? How many of us defended people who manipulated us?

How discerning are we? Not as a group or community, but as individuals?
[/B]


Hi Folks

I am really sorry to learn about the situation with Bill Wood worked out with such a disappointment.

Some of you might recall what when I first tried to raise some awareness about my concerns, I was met with quit a bit of attack from members.:der::mad2::boxing::smash::nono::wacko:

As a result of that attack I actually dropped out of Avalon because I felt perhaps this is not a place which was spiritually and psychologically healthy if I was looking to increase my knowledge about the world around me.

Once again, I am sorry to learn that the vast majority appeared to suffer a major blow to their faith in which they had placed in both Kerry and Bill Wood.

I actually, when I dropped out, was hoping that my initial assessment of Bill Wood was incorrect.

:rain:

marique3652
5th February 2012, 18:16
:grouphug:



I wonder of the purpose of this thread? Sorry!

Learning from our mistakes, becoming more discerning, and even becoming less easily trusting. Also, to bring up some points about the Alien Agenda that often people are not interested in discussing. It's so rare to hear someone say: "perhaps they don't have our best interest at heart." Such things are seldom heard on this forum. The recent events are a good learning opportunity for us all, but only if we talk about it. If we don't, then this will just keep happening over and over again.

We have been learning from our mistakes for how many generations, centuries and more.
We are at the point of moving, taking action, if it is of trying stuff outside of our comfort zone, well so be it.
I don't think of myself as better than anyone else and I don't look down on no one either.

So what information is this thread bringing that we don't know? What is new?

Well i will hold back from posting in this thread, since my word might not be well chosen.

Hi my friend,

Well, the problem is that the human animal is the only known animal that makes the same mistake over and over again.

Contrary to what you´ve said, generally, we haven´t been wise enough to learn from our mistakes.

If we had indeed learned from them, we would be living in a completely different planet and system right now.

Cheers,

Raf.

So true. It reminds me of an Albert Einstein quote that resonates with me. :wizard:“Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”

Carmen
5th February 2012, 18:23
No, of course no but that's not the point I'm attempting to make. Lately we have had thread after thread warning people about false information, the love and light brigade etc. It's getting rather tiresome. Surely we can decide for ourselves. I realize many people are well meaning in their comments but others just seem overly controlling in this regard.

When people start waking up to subjects spiritual they go through many stages. Some people have sudden full awakening but most do not. They start toying with new age subjects but usually realize after a short time that it is a rather superficial and move on to better understanding. We grow in our understandings and realizations as our own Inner Self starts to point us to truth.

I, for one would not have wanted anyone to have taken away my first tentative learnings.

My question for the information police is who are these people you keep talking about? Who are you referring to?Those who believe anything you don't or have experienced something you haven't! Who cares if someone jumps in with both feet to do something outrages! Even if it doesn't work out. We are taught to be so politically correct nowadays in case we do something wrong! A few of us need to jump off a cliff into the unknown. We need to be like kids who try anything. That's how they learn. Thats how we learn.

ViralSpiral
5th February 2012, 18:24
So true. It reminds me of an Albert Einstein quote that resonates with me. :wizard:“Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”


or


Civilization, in fact, grows more and more maudlin and hysterical; especially under democracy it tends to degenerate into a mere combat of crazes; the whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by an endless series of hobgoblins, most of them imaginary. H. L. Mencken

RMorgan
5th February 2012, 18:37
No, of course no but that's not the point I'm attempting to make. Lately we have had thread after thread warning people about false information, the love and light brigade etc. It's getting rather tiresome. Surely we can decide for ourselves. I realize many people are well meaning in their comments but others just seem overly controlling in this regard.

When people start waking up to subjects spiritual they go through many stages. Some people have sudden full awakening but most do not. They start toying with new age subjects but usually realize after a short time that it is a rather superficial and move on to better understanding. We grow in our understandings and realizations as our own Inner Self starts to point us to truth.

I, for one would not have wanted anyone to have taken away my first tentative learnings.

My question for the information police is who are these people you keep talking about? Who are you referring to?Those who believe anything you don't or have experienced something you haven't! Who cares if someone jumps in with both feet to do something outrages! Even if it doesn't work out. We are taught to be so politically correct nowadays in case we do something wrong! A few of us need to jump off a cliff into the unknown. We need to be like kids who try anything. That's how they learn. Thats how we learn.

Hey Carmen,

I understand and respect your point of view.

However, I can´t really answer some of your questions, because I´m not an information police. I´m a teacher.

One of the most useful things that teachers can do, is teach people about his conclusions and insights, who are based in his own experiences and in the analyzes and studies of other people´s experiences as well. If sometimes I can inform people, in order to help them to avoid the same mistakes I´ve done in the past, or to avoid making mistakes I´ve learned from other people´s experiences, that´s great for me.

I don´t see any reason for a person to have to learn everything from scratch, from their own mistakes, since we already have a huge "mistakes to be avoided" database. This is the very principle of learning and the accumulation of knowledge.

Could you imagine a world were everyone would be required to start their learning experiences from ground zero? That´s why we have books, teachers, universities and even genetic inheritance, so people can learn in a faster, wiser and more condensed way.

A wise man learns not only from his own life experiences. He has the ability to observe, analyze and learn from other people´s experiences as well, so he can avoid making a mistake without the need of experiencing the mistake itself.

Cheers,

Raf.

DreamsInDigital
5th February 2012, 18:52
There's nothing fearful about the above! Accepting that perhaps the universe is a competitive environment is not fearful - it is realistic. It is cautious. It is being aware. Some of us are more trusting of Aliens and their agendas than we are of our next door neighbour. Do you see the problem here? Why should they have our trust? They are abducting thousands upon thousands of people.

What you call fear, I call critical thinking.
Tell me how your blanket claims that all Aliens are evil and abducting thousands upon thousands of people aren't fear mongering and maybe disrespectful to the other ET/ED's that are out there that are trying to do something good for humanity, risking their lives to save our asses? Or some of the other stuff you've said in the past isn't fear mongering? Do you know that if it wasn't for some Benevolent ET/ED's interfering with NWO/PTW plans 96% of United States would be a Nuclear Waist land? It was do to information I passed on (from my own contact with Benevolent ET's/ED's of 27yrs) to another friend of mine that has contacts with Benevolent ET/ED's working to save humanity. It feels great to have been a part of saving an entire country full of peoples lives. And, that we would have already been at war with Iran? And, likely another good portion of the world would be too. I'm not going to comment on this thread further, I don't have the time, or patience to do it so tactfully anymore. But, you really have a lot to learn about the world and universe around you. And, I hope to be able to see how much you change when you expand your awareness and knowledge of it.

Let me tell you and other something, there are very FEW races, mostly Reptoid and Greys and one Rouge Group of Alpha Centaurians more commonly referred to as Pleiadians/ALcyones that are involved with the Secret Government, they are the ONLY ones that are participating in the abductions. But, the majority of Abductions are being perpetrated by the Shadow/Secret Government. I was an professional psychic detective for several years, until I got to close on to many MKULTRA child abduction cases and the FBI/CIA both threatened my life that if I didn't stop I'd be dead. They were all perpetrated by the Government, not Parasitic Grey Aliens or Reptoids, but those are generally the only ones other than the Alcyones and Sirian B's that are involved in Abductions.

Laura Elina
5th February 2012, 18:55
Einstein also said that only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity (and he wasn't sure about the former), I enjoy that one.

I feel... As long as we don't have our own house in order, we shouldn't invite any visitors.

To my knowledge I've had two alien encounters and I sure did not feel warm and fuzzy when the other one took place, my mind wants to interpret it as an abduction. When I saw what they were doing to me, I started screaming my head off, never felt pain like that in my life, and I thought I was gonna be split in half by the pain, the second one wasn't as bad, but I did feel slightly uncomfortable, physically... The mind bend is immense, it's like... Your mind is gonna crack and your soul will escape through that crack, because you can't handle it, you can really feel it happening.

The thing is, as vague as my memories are of those incidents, the fractions that I do remember, I remember every second of it, every detail, the physical aspects, what my body felt, what my voice sounded like when I started screaming and how the entities reacted to that, what the other one was wearing and what the other one wasn't, the air... How it felt, the sound, everything, the thoughts that ran through my head.

But yet again... The second time wasn't as bad.. I didn't even leave my bedroom and they seemed more gentle and I actually learned something while it was going on, but I don't know if I should call them visitors or abductors, there's a difference I suppose. And that's small scale, can't even begin to think I would have to try and discern whether there should be heavier duty alien presence on Earth.

I have enough hard time "discerning" between different presidential candidates.

Like I said... Until we have our own house in order, maybe a no visitors policy should be in place. I don't know. Even though I haven't had a jolly good time with visitors, suppose that's the politically correct term, lol, I can't go and say every single entity has tricks up their sleeve and want to chain humans to their agenda, suppose that would make me a galactic racist, it's not like all humans are "bad" or dangerous just because they come from a place you've never been or seen.

I honestly don't know a whole lot about alternative skill sets such as... Telepathy or being able to read energies or energy signatures, but suppose acing those skills would help with the discernment process. Just a guess, I'm going on a limb here.

(I wanted to add that even if my experiences haven't been encouraging, I want to believe there are some factions out there, who really have humanity's best interest in their hearts... Or at least that's their intention, sometimes it's even with the best intentions that things turn out bad. It would be a bit disheartening, if that was not the case, but most of all... I want mankind to have humanity's best interest in its heart. But I guess that makes me another love and lighter. I want us to have our s*** together, and to be able to say... We did it.)

nf857
5th February 2012, 19:01
Hi,

Its nice to hear some rational free-thinkers on here, quite refreshing. I was first interested in the spirituality forum, i hold no set beliefs, & first became interested in the thread 'Does Reality Remain There?' which i thought was a great philosophical/scientifical/spiritual debate, however it soon got heated with 2 other members and myself, as my rational questions/queries seem to offend their belief's. I don't go in for the 'One Cousiness' theory, i like the budda teachings, however i dont like the idea of something taken responsibility from myself. I like to be in control of my own thoughts. I was even told to go on different forums by one person as their are lots of lies on other forums, in other words, here is the only truth in our little circle, you dont belong buzz off. Made me laugh. How above people think they are too others. I was brand new on here as well then tut tut!!!

We are all supposed to help and guide each other, whilst disagreements happen often, thats the human condition, i think its wise to be cautiouss, afterall isnt that whay are natural instincts & are sub-consiouss works? The truth nobody knows what the heck is going on this crazy planet or any other planet for that matter. The more we learn, the more confusing it gets, conflicting information, discernment comes in handy. x

Carmen
5th February 2012, 19:22
Yes, I do understand where you are coming from RMorgen and respect your perspective. Let me see if I can explain better!

To me spirit is quite mysterious, wild, and completely out of the box of the 3d grid. We start off as children in life, full of spirit! Full of the need to explore this realm and we have new young bodies with which to do it in. We have a go at anything and also fall over repeatedly, hurting ourselves but getting up and trying the next thing. Our parents (if they are wise) allow us to fully explore without too many restrictions. We learn as we go.

Then we hit the teenage years and really get into it! Hopefully our parents have instilled in us some useful values before this time as if they haven't we are in for a rough ride. Anyway, teenagers will insist on experiencing life to the full and this can be a worrying time for parents. Usually they come out the other side older and wiser and have not been caught in any of the addictive traps along the way.

As teenagers come into young adulthood society's grid starts to mould them into place. The need to find meaningful work to make money to survive kicks in. Marriage, children, responsibility. The spirit in them, that wild, do anything, force gets pushed down into the surviving, fitting in, political correctness of the grid, the controlling of attitude, of mind. So life goes on but becomes kinda set.

Then, something happens! Sometimes suddenly, traumatic, but the grid is breached by an event, a realization and we start to question. It is a stirring of spirit within us again. This awakening can take many forms but it is a breaking out of the grid of conformity. We go exploring again because this is something new and exciting. We try to talk about to friends and family but are met with disbelief and often antagonism. This birthing of something new in us can take years of learning and growing, but after this awakening there is no going back. Exploration is on us full force but it is usually a completely alone journey with those around us having no idea of the passion of this new direction in our lives. Through many years of exploration and often pain and heartache we make contact with an inner voice, an inner knowing. In moments of silence we feel it. The life force comes rushing in. In that space of just being, we know and life becomes simple. We know that all we went through, all the so-called mistakes were all worth it. They were all part of our souls promptings to explore, to bring to wisdom all of our experiences. Nobody can or should take away our karma. They are our opportunities of growth, of learning. We become as little children again exploring the world of spirit with passion and fearlessness.

So, you see, what I explore and what I choose to believe is up to me, nobody else.

Love and light to All

Carmen

Abductee S
5th February 2012, 19:25
i have to agree with s-l on this one too. i've been deceived before by people i trusted and people who i didn't know, but thought i could trust. even if you haven't had an abduction experience to convince you of the alien intent, we need to be very cautious. what could happen if we are too cautious? what could happen if we are trusting when we should have been cautious? i choose to be cautious as the alternative is not good.

fox.mulder
5th February 2012, 19:33
@ SL

Good luck with your quest for the truth. I thought that this forum was really cool until I noticed the continue spin of stories that people were easily believing. This encouraged more people to spin more stories. You can check my posts and see that the bulk of my stuff was trying to get people to stop auto believing each story. I was also trying to get people to post their opinions not as "fact" but as actual opinions. What did this get me? Alot of of negative remarks and 2 bans from one particular moderator. You can check my posts nothing i posted was justified as ban worthy. I am convinced that this forum is just another room in the matrix. Its just another religion/cult where you have a head guru, the elders and the blind followers.

Mulder
5th February 2012, 19:54
Firstly, don't beat yourself up because deceivers are very clever and plan what they are doing. Just like you don't beat yourself up after getting mugged, also don't feel "it's my fault" when you're deceived. People need to pick themselves up and learn from the experience - perhaps this is one of the reasons why they incarnated in this life - to increase our discernment. Now, just because some people were deceived is NOT a reason to leave PA or this blog. You're not going to find a perfect community, but a community that honestly admits it's mistakes is perfect for me.

AlternativeInfoJunkie
5th February 2012, 19:58
There's nothing fearful about the above! Accepting that perhaps the universe is a competitive environment is not fearful - it is realistic. It is cautious. It is being aware. Some of us are more trusting of Aliens and their agendas than we are of our next door neighbour. Do you see the problem here? Why should they have our trust? They are abducting thousands upon thousands of people.

What you call fear, I call critical thinking.
Tell me how your blanket claims that all Aliens are evil and abducting thousands upon thousands of people aren't fear mongering and maybe disrespectful to the other ET/ED's that are out there that are trying to do something good for humanity, risking their lives to save our asses? Or some of the other stuff you've said in the past isn't fear mongering? Do you know that if it wasn't for some Benevolent ET/ED's interfering with NWO/PTW plans 96% of United States would be a Nuclear Waist land? It was do to information I passed on (from my own contact with Benevolent ET's/ED's of 27yrs) to another friend of mine that has contacts with Benevolent ET/ED's working to save humanity. It feels great to have been a part of saving an entire country full of peoples lives. And, that we would have already been at war with Iran? And, likely another good portion of the world would be too. I'm not going to comment on this thread further, I don't have the time, or patience to do it so tactfully anymore. But, you really have a lot to learn about the world and universe around you. And, I hope to be able to see how much you change when you expand your awareness and knowledge of it.

Let me tell you and other something, there are very FEW races, mostly Reptoid and Greys and one Rouge Group of Alpha Centaurians more commonly referred to as Pleiadians/ALcyones that are involved with the Secret Government, they are the ONLY ones that are participating in the abductions. But, the majority of Abductions are being perpetrated by the Shadow/Secret Government. I was an professional psychic detective for several years, until I got to close on to many MKULTRA child abduction cases and the FBI/CIA both threatened my life that if I didn't stop I'd be dead. They were all perpetrated by the Government, not Parasitic Grey Aliens or Reptoids, but those are generally the only ones other than the Alcyones and Sirian B's that are involved in Abductions.

I like your positive message of hope about benevolent ETs dreams in digital. But unfortunately there are people who don't have psychic abilities (like me) and/or haven't had contact with benevolent ETs (like me). People like me have no way of verifying your claims of positive ET intervention and actually if you think about it, it makes more sense for someone like me to have a healthy skepticism than to count on any form of help from ETs/EDs. It is disempowering. I think the people from other worlds who might be watching this mess would be delighted if we all took our power back ourselves instead of them having to nudge us along every step of the way. If they are helping that is great and i am very thankful to them. If they show themselves and they genuinely want help then that is great and i welcome their help. Until i know for sure though i am just going to assume that they aren't and they won't. No offense to them. I just feel it is disempowering for us as a race to think that they constantly have our backs. Come on fellow humans! Let's roll up our sleeves and fix this mess ourselves.


Oh and by the way: I WANT TO BELIEVE...

Vitalux
5th February 2012, 20:07
@ SL

Good luck with your quest for the truth. I thought that this forum was really cool until I noticed the continue spin of stories that people were easily believing. This encouraged more people to spin more stories. You can check my posts and see that the bulk of my stuff was trying to get people to stop auto believing each story. I was also trying to get people to post their opinions not as "fact" but as actual opinions. What did this get me? Alot of of negative remarks and 2 bans from one particular moderator. You can check my posts nothing i posted was justified as ban worthy. I am convinced that this forum is just another room in the matrix. Its just another religion/cult where you have a head guru, the elders and the blind followers.

Thank you for this post.
It is, in my opinion, a very accurate assessment of problems which will eventually implode Project Avalon.

There appears to be an arrogance within Project Avalon that membership is a Diploma of Truth.

In actuality, we are all just as blind as Helen Keller in knowing what is Real or what is Truth.

http://meded.ucsd.edu/osa/publications/HumanCondition/images/HelenKeller.jpg

To think otherwise, would be both Arrogant and Hypocritical

Kyra
5th February 2012, 20:07
I saw through Charles instantly - and made numerous posts about it here on Avalon ... and ended up being the very small minority, so stopped my participation here for quite some time.

It is Bill Wood who piqued my interest again. He is genuine, in my opinion, and represents what he believes with sincerity.

Here is what I see as the problem:

Bill has a clear agenda: He wants to reach out to all the military whose programs are cracking, and give them the encouragement to take the red pill, peel the layers off, and look down the rabbit hole. He brought Eva in to say, "Hey, there is support for you. There are people connecting the dots, who will help to midwife the rebirth of your real self, the guy you were before the programs were inserted."

Those listening who were typing up a storm in the chat window had a clear agenda: They want new knowledge bytes of juicy facts and stories to gnaw upon. They live for it. These are the hardened knowledge junkies, the ones whom you can't impress, who have heard it all, who can snipe with rapier wit and decimate a normal, non-sophisticated person in seconds.

Kerry (christened "our bitch", thank you Mod Wiz) as it seems felt a good deal of pressure to keep pestering Bill to condense his story down to its most titillating essence, in order to throw some meat to the dogs.

Bill, to his credit, and perhaps, due to his lack of sophistication, refused to budge from his pre-decided format: he wanted to speak to his fellow military brothers, and all those who have been mind-controlled. He kept repeating very basic information that all of us PC and PA veterans already knew because Bill knew that he had to lay it all out very simply for these guys that would eventually make contact with this recording.

Bill's statement that this is going to rock your world, startling info, etc. may be a non-event for us vets. But for those who are just peeling the scales from their eyes, just beginning to understand how severely they have been programmed, this is mind-blowing info, and it needed to be said.

Yes, his first session was the best, so it was easy to see that Kerry thought he could continue to deliver on that level. But as we expand our awareness of a bigger picture, can we not make the allowance that sometimes (as this instance has proven) the Camelot format might be the proper vehicle for many reasons, for a "basic" message to get out that has a much wider audience than just those of us on the fringe?

Almost like saying, "Oh, we get it, this one is for the kiddies ..." And then being gracious about it. Allowing it and supporting it.

The triage and understanding needed when one begins to awaken from heavy duty mind control is extreme. I find it disheartening that so-called advanced beings are so quick to pile on Bill as fake when he is so clearly (IMHO) exactly who he states he is ... and points out the system that jails each one of us. It is not a physical jail, but a jail none the less.

Now I have been aware of this system for some time now. I have seen it in some extreme situations. And I am talking about a system that gathers whatever dirt it can upon an individual, and influences them to put themselves into compromised positions, then records it, and uses it as possible blackmail or coercion evidence to pull the puppet-strings when indicated.

This is the message that Eva and Bill were bringing to a very large audience:

"Hey, you've been messed with in the extreme. Chances are you've been led to some compromised situations and photographed or recorded. This has all been a set up to control you. Even your thoughts may not be your own. But there is a way out, there is hope, and there are people who have come through it. You're not alone."

Bill seems intent on reaching out to help this group of people. Eva reminds us that extends to all of us, who are being electronically bombarded via cell towers, TV and various other means.

No, he was not the guy to give you the next tasty morsel in the insatiable hunger of those collecting files of the dark side. He's just a guy who, once freeing him self, (which is an on-going process for all of us) wants to reach out a helping hand to others in the same fix. I think that is called the Boddhisattva path.

No, I am not sainting him. I am merely stating that those who are disappointed with his 3rd session are only so because they tried to make him into someone other than he is.

He is just a fellow human being with a fascinating story. I believe both Bill and Eva have good hearts, and want to help their fellow man (and woman).

This is the cycle where each one of us can look within and check to see if the majority of our energy is directed towards Service to Others, and better yet, UNITY consciousness.

That seems to be the price of admission to the world we want to see.

AlternativeInfoJunkie
5th February 2012, 20:18
Oops nevermind. My bad. Just saw the in my opinion part.

Wiremu2011
5th February 2012, 20:53
Very good question. I always wondered why, that for the amount of intelligence and wisdom in this forum, there appears an equal amount of gullibility IMHO.

Flash
5th February 2012, 20:54
The gullible are everywhere and the sharks too, be humans or aliens.

One lesson, do not follow the crowd. Understand the movement, but do not follow.

We could not discern sh t from gold if we were with aliens, imho.

NeverMind
5th February 2012, 20:57
People have come to believe that denial is some form of spirituality.

Denial is not spirituality. It's denial.

I wish some "alternative" website - perhaps this one? - would take this dictum and serve it, in big, bold letters, to their visitors on every page.
Because all too many sure do need to see it. Often.

Flash
5th February 2012, 21:01
@ SL

Good luck with your quest for the truth. I thought that this forum was really cool until I noticed the continue spin of stories that people were easily believing. This encouraged more people to spin more stories. You can check my posts and see that the bulk of my stuff was trying to get people to stop auto believing each story. I was also trying to get people to post their opinions not as "fact" but as actual opinions. What did this get me? Alot of of negative remarks and 2 bans from one particular moderator. You can check my posts nothing i posted was justified as ban worthy. I am convinced that this forum is just another room in the matrix. Its just another religion/cult where you have a head guru, the elders and the blind followers.

Most of the critical thinkers (not the right people, those that are in the know, but those that can evaluate, weight, test and then decide, which is critical thinking) are gone from Avalon. Critical thinkers are a pain in the butt, because they see things from many angles and are often wrong, but yet, they bring a quality of evaluation that is necessary. And yes, they are sometimes hard to deal with because they want proof and they want critical thinking from others. The pain is necessary to see clearly, we should have endure them in order to progress.

But they are gone, most of them. And they are few in between in real life, hard to recruit (they will critically analyse the forum before joining), and they thrive in environment that admits the difference and are ready to take challenges. I am not sure Avalon can recruit them anymore, nor Camelot. THen give your dollar to bill w. Critical thinkers are the best debunkers, no critical thinkers, very little debunking. imho

Herbert
5th February 2012, 21:13
You nailed it Kyra!


I saw through Charles instantly - and made numerous posts about it here on Avalon ... and ended up being the very small minority, so stopped my participation here for quite some time.

It is Bill Wood who piqued my interest again. He is genuine, in my opinion, and represents what he believes with sincerity.

Here is what I see as the problem:

Bill has a clear agenda: He wants to reach out to all the military whose programs are cracking, and give them the encouragement to take the red pill, peel the layers off, and look down the rabbit hole. He brought Eva in to say, "Hey, there is support for you. There are people connecting the dots, who will help to midwife the rebirth of your real self, the guy you were before the programs were inserted."

Those listening who were typing up a storm in the chat window had a clear agenda: They want new knowledge bytes of juicy facts and stories to gnaw upon. They live for it. These are the hardened knowledge junkies, the ones whom you can't impress, who have heard it all, who can snipe with rapier wit and decimate a normal, non-sophisticated person in seconds.

Kerry (christened "our bitch", thank you Mod Wiz) as it seems felt a good deal of pressure to keep pestering Bill to condense his story down to its most titillating essence, in order to throw some meat to the dogs.

Bill, to his credit, and perhaps, due to his lack of sophistication, refused to budge from his pre-decided format: he wanted to speak to his fellow military brothers, and all those who have been mind-controlled. He kept repeating very basic information that all of us PC and PA veterans already knew because Bill knew that he had to lay it all out very simply for these guys that would eventually make contact with this recording.

Bill's statement that this is going to rock your world, startling info, etc. may be a non-event for us vets. But for those who are just peeling the scales from their eyes, just beginning to understand how severely they have been programmed, this is mind-blowing info, and it needed to be said.

Yes, his first session was the best, so it was easy to see that Kerry thought he could continue to deliver on that level. But as we expand our awareness of a bigger picture, can we not make the allowance that sometimes (as this instance has proven) the Camelot format might be the proper vehicle for many reasons, for a "basic" message to get out that has a much wider audience than just those of us on the fringe?

Almost like saying, "Oh, we get it, this one is for the kiddies ..." And then being gracious about it. Allowing it and supporting it.

The triage and understanding needed when one begins to awaken from heavy duty mind control is extreme. I find it disheartening that so-called advanced beings are so quick to pile on Bill as fake when he is so clearly (IMHO) exactly who he states he is ... and points out the system that jails each one of us. It is not a physical jail, but a jail none the less.

Now I have been aware of this system for some time now. I have seen it in some extreme situations. And I am talking about a system that gathers whatever dirt it can upon an individual, and influences them to put themselves into compromised positions, then records it, and uses it as possible blackmail or coercion evidence to pull the puppet-strings when indicated.

This is the message that Eva and Bill were bringing to a very large audience:

"Hey, you've been messed with in the extreme. Chances are you've been led to some compromised situations and photographed or recorded. This has all been a set up to control you. Even your thoughts may not be your own. But there is a way out, there is hope, and there are people who have come through it. You're not alone."

Bill seems intent on reaching out to help this group of people. Eva reminds us that extends to all of us, who are being electronically bombarded via cell towers, TV and various other means.

No, he was not the guy to give you the next tasty morsel in the insatiable hunger of those collecting files of the dark side. He's just a guy who, once freeing him self, (which is an on-going process for all of us) wants to reach out a helping hand to others in the same fix. I think that is called the Boddhisattva path.

No, I am not sainting him. I am merely stating that those who are disappointed with his 3rd session are only so because they tried to make him into someone other than he is.

He is just a fellow human being with a fascinating story. I believe both Bill and Eva have good hearts, and want to help their fellow man (and woman).

This is the cycle where each one of us can look within and check to see if the majority of our energy is directed towards Service to Others, and better yet, UNITY consciousness.

That seems to be the price of admission to the world we want to see.

Selene
5th February 2012, 21:34
Brilliant, Kyra! Well said and well thought out indeed.

(Mind you, so are the majority of the posts here, friends. I just felt this one deserved an extra thank you...)

Cheers,

Selene


I saw through Charles instantly - and made numerous posts about it here on Avalon ... and ended up being the very small minority, so stopped my participation here for quite some time.

It is Bill Wood who piqued my interest again. He is genuine, in my opinion, and represents what he believes with sincerity.

Here is what I see as the problem:

...

Lifebringer
5th February 2012, 21:37
I always said if they wanted to wipe us out, why wait all this time. They are millions of years ahead of us in technological advances. If it were you and you have been zipping around for eons, would you worry about the primative life forms that couldn't even see in dimensions unless assisted with the energy of evolution, that they have known about for millions of millenia?

i just have to use my instinct and ask my higher self, and think things through. I myself was a little perturbed about the no smoking part, but when i thought about it some more, I thought if the body is the temple for communication with higher self, then why continue to pollute it. The ptw didn't put tobacco here for my best interest, but to make money off my slow death as I light each one up.

Like i said, I think things through and alcohol isn't good on the four wheeled vehicle drivers, so a swift craft that crosses the stars, shouldnt't be handled by someone who would risk lives on other planets.
I will wait until Valentines day and a week after for those who may have gone on the ships

Borden
5th February 2012, 21:47
Hi S-L, good points.

I don't know about the ET thing, I really don't. I have lots of theories, but your thread is not the place for them. I was however amazed a while back to see you roundly attacked for the idea that ETs might not be benevolent.

It's a funny thing, but on here I think I am generally seen of one of these negative, cynical people ... but in my life I'm seen as the weirdo who believes ridiculous things! I wish the people who have criticized me here for my perceived skepticism could see me in heated argument with friends and family over a variety of subjects ... I think they'd be surprised and quite possibly want to side with me! Help! I don't have a category to fit neatly into!"

I'm increasingly alarmed too by the apparent willingness of so many people here to fall for any old rubbish and follow it. I'm just as alarmed at the way in which those who question said rubbish are usually attacked. These same people often use the word 'sheeple' about the mainstream world. The irony is depressing.

I want the real deal, not the con-artists and the delusional ... but I do believe the real deal exists or I wouldn't come to places like this in the first place. And yes, I'm someone who is alert for deception. The whole ET subject is, as you say, a lot bigger deal than people who sit in front of a camera a spin a yarn. If we can't even sort the wheat from the chaff regarding them ... then we're really stuffed when it comes to other (greater) intelligences.

This doesn't mean I necessarily believe all ETs are evil or nefarious. I wouldn't want to fall for them if they are, that's all.

Borden

Aetheric Traveler
5th February 2012, 22:00
Help, I'm getting messages in my gold filling from a mentally deranged ET with an agenda and I can't find my remote.

After reading all these posts, it's pretty clear that the change that everyone wants to see is never gonna be found in "someone else".

Ghandi said it, " Be the change you want to see in the world".

We're all changing............at different speeds.

Let that be ok with yourself........

and you'll ride out any storm.

Cheers,
AT

Anchor
5th February 2012, 22:50
My mistakes are mine to make and often they will be my best learning! No one tells me what I should or should not believe. That is the domain of my Inner Self. Free choice is just that. We are all adults here. No need for the discernment police who think they know best for everyone.

Great post Carmen, and I concur.

I think people have forgotten how important making mistakes and learning actually are.

I liken the discernment police to parents afraid[1] to let their kids play properly lest they hurt themselves.

There are a lot of police parallels too - its a great analogy. Ego being one, and not themselves understanding the true nature of the "laws" they are trying to enforce the another.

John..

[1] Fear is a key theme among most of the discernment police I notice.

jaybee
5th February 2012, 23:18
@ SL

Good luck with your quest for the truth. I thought that this forum was really cool until I noticed the continue spin of stories that people were easily believing. This encouraged more people to spin more stories. You can check my posts and see that the bulk of my stuff was trying to get people to stop auto believing each story. I was also trying to get people to post their opinions not as "fact" but as actual opinions. What did this get me? Alot of of negative remarks and 2 bans from one particular moderator. You can check my posts nothing i posted was justified as ban worthy. I am convinced that this forum is just another room in the matrix. Its just another religion/cult where you have a head guru, the elders and the blind followers.

Thank you for this post.
It is, in my opinion, a very accurate assessment of problems which will eventually implode Project Avalon.

There appears to be an arrogance within Project Avalon that membership is a Diploma of Truth.

In actuality, we are all just as blind as Helen Keller in knowing what is Real or what is Truth.

http://meded.ucsd.edu/osa/publications/HumanCondition/images/HelenKeller.jpg

To think otherwise, would be both Arrogant and Hypocritical



we must never forget that this forum...like any other forum dealing with conspiracies is heavily infiltrated.

In fact this forum may get more attention than most because of the work that Bill and Kerry have done over the years.

I don't want to keep harping on about infiltration but if you don't take this into account then you are not experiencing the reality of this forum.

It is a dynamic that has to be taken into consideration.

I am getting more than a strong feeling that there is a real push here at the moment to piss genuine members off, in various ways and to literally...bring the forum down.

This may be to do with 2012...I don't know.

I have been taking a look at the Nexus2012 forum and it is astonishing what is being said by 'some' over there....did you know that the new Guru on the block Pila...could be Bill Ryan? Of course Pila isn't Bill Ryan....heaven knows who Pila is. But this is the sort of mind games that are being played with us.

The agents/spooks/mischief makers are going all out to bring down Project Camelot and Project Avalon...IMO.

In obvious ways and subtle ways. At what point do genuine members just disappear because of all the rubbish and the games?

I feel a loyalty to Bill (R) and to Kerry...even though I don't think they are always right. 'Charles' and Brockbrader being two examples.

At what point do the fake members win? The reality is that they are practically unstoppable. They can work together and more or less control the forum. This is going to sound paranoid....and maybe it is...but it is what I honestly think.


rant over


.

The Arthen
5th February 2012, 23:35
I saw through Charles instantly - and made numerous posts about it here on Avalon ... and ended up being the very small minority, so stopped my participation here for quite some time.

It is Bill Wood who piqued my interest again. He is genuine, in my opinion, and represents what he believes with sincerity.

Here is what I see as the problem:

...



Exactly as you said, and exactly my thoughts as well.

One of the key things I do often see, is that we often make a whistleblower to be much more than human because we are excited about the 'information' we can get from that person. So we either expect more than what a plate can carry, or we just get bored with the information we already know (sometimes, just because we're bored of what we know - doesn't mean that anyone giving out basic information that we already know - is lying!)

'Bill' is limited in what he knows as well, AND in terms of how he can express himself while keeping certain secrets that he has to keep for now. Why the **** he said "Everyone who gave a dollar is a Lighter" I really don't know. He could be an outright charlatan - or he could just be like the rest of us. Saying something stupid. We all say stupid things in the spur of the moment live, from time to time.

Either way, only time will tell. Until this day I still don't know what to make about a good chunk of what David Wilcock talks about - but something just tells me at least he's genuine in his curiosity.

Bill's expression has clearly yet to perfect itself; but it does not mean that everything then that comes from his mouth is bull****, just because he's trying to be alittle more confident than his usual meekness (and ****ing up our expectations of how 'cool' he's supposed to be in the process).

That alone can severely disrupt the personal discerning process - the Discerning Process is an evolutionary one in itself. It's good to discern healthily, but on the other hand it's very tempting to doubt just for the ****ing sake of doubting, just to show off what a "veteran", a "senior", one is in the world of alternative info. I've seen this **** way too many times. And it's because of **** like this that truth-finding and basic truth-spreading suffer.

This kind of behavior, if not self-checked from time to time, can result in "truthseekers" getting severely derailed, if not completely.

Borden
5th February 2012, 23:38
@ SL

Good luck with your quest for the truth. I thought that this forum was really cool until I noticed the continue spin of stories that people were easily believing. This encouraged more people to spin more stories. You can check my posts and see that the bulk of my stuff was trying to get people to stop auto believing each story. I was also trying to get people to post their opinions not as "fact" but as actual opinions. What did this get me? Alot of of negative remarks and 2 bans from one particular moderator. You can check my posts nothing i posted was justified as ban worthy. I am convinced that this forum is just another room in the matrix. Its just another religion/cult where you have a head guru, the elders and the blind followers.

Thank you for this post.
It is, in my opinion, a very accurate assessment of problems which will eventually implode Project Avalon.

There appears to be an arrogance within Project Avalon that membership is a Diploma of Truth.

In actuality, we are all just as blind as Helen Keller in knowing what is Real or what is Truth.

http://meded.ucsd.edu/osa/publications/HumanCondition/images/HelenKeller.jpg

To think otherwise, would be both Arrogant and Hypocritical



we must never forget that this forum...like any other forum dealing with conspiracies is heavily infiltrated.

In fact this forum may get more attention than most because of the work that Bill and Kerry have done over the years.

I don't want to keep harping on about infiltration but if you don't take this into account then you are not experiencing the reality of this forum.

It is a dynamic that has to be taken into consideration.

I am getting more than a strong feeling that there is a real push here at the moment to piss genuine members off, in various ways and to literally...bring the forum down.

This may be to do with 2012...I don't know.

I have been taking a look at the Nexus2012 forum and it is astonishing what is being said by 'some' over there....did you know that the new Guru on the block Pila...could be Bill Ryan? Of course Pila isn't Bill Ryan....heaven knows who Pila is. But this is the sort of mind games that are being played with us.

The agents/spooks/mischief makers are going all out to bring down Project Camelot and Project Avalon...IMO.

In obvious ways and subtle ways. At what point do genuine members just disappear because of all the rubbish and the games?

I feel a loyalty to Bill (R) and to Kerry...even though I don't think they are always right. 'Charles' and Brockbrader being two examples.

At what point do the fake members win? The reality is that they are practically unstoppable. They can work together and more or less control the forum. This is going to sound paranoid....and maybe it is...but it is what I honestly think.


rant over


.

Look, you might be right about plants, spooks, etc ... I honestly don't know, and I sway from one opinion to the other.

One thing I do know is that I got pretty angry with that Pila person, and the accusations or at least insinuations that I'm such a plant or fake member flew about briefly. I'm most certainly not, and to imagine that people might think I am is a weird feeling. So that's my perspective on other people who have had such claims made against them. By the way, the idea that 'Pila' is Bill Ryan is ludicrous, I agree. What would be his motive? Also, I don't visit the Nexus site, but now I'm feeling paranoid that anyone there thinks I'm something nefarious ... I was after all the guy who took most issue with Pila in his thread! My motives are stated there. Mild irritation became outrage when he informed a sarcastic poster that he'd seen a vision of ill fortune for the guy. That was not on at all.

On the subject of infiltrators ... have you considered that the best way to attack a forum like this one would be to fill it with nonsense that makes it look flaky? I wouldn't accuse anyone of that because I don't want to engage paranoia, but it is sometimes at the back of my mind.

Sorry, maybe I'm being paranoid now. (Niggling worry about anything being said about my posts on Pila's thread in the Nexus place though, argh!). And sorry, S-L, for going a little off topic here.

By the way, I wouldn't be here in the first place if I didn't like Bill, which, as you say, doesn't make him infallible in my eyes.

Borden.

enfoldedblue
5th February 2012, 23:47
I think one of the most important lessons I have learnt on my journey is to allow everyone else to have their own. Our society teaches us to compare and judge. Our egos love to look at others and see how silly, ignorant etc they are, this makes the ego feel good...feel superior, and ultimately distances us (temporarily)our own insecurities. When we trust that everyone's journey is perfect for them, and remember everyone learns different things in different ways at different times, we can let go of the need to judge and compare and we cease to contribute our energy to the mechanisms of social control, and instead create a freer space for ourselves and those around us.

xx

Whiskey_Mystic
5th February 2012, 23:53
Let's not start giving a rat's ass what people on Nexus think about anything. That's just a huge waste of time. May as well start caring what people at ABTS think. Don't even worry about it.


:focus:

The Arthen
5th February 2012, 23:57
I think one of the most important lessons I have learnt on my journey is to allow everyone else to have their own. Our society teaches us to compare and judge. Our egos love to look at others and see how silly, ignorant etc they are, this makes the ego feel good...feel superior, and ultimately distances us (temporarily)our own insecurities. When we trust that everyone's journey is perfect for them, and remember everyone learns different things in different ways at different times, we can let go of the need to judge and compare and we cease to contribute our energy to the mechanisms of social control, and instead create a freer space for ourselves and those around us.

xx


Correct.

However, if you feel you can reach out and explain when you know you can - just do it. Don't hesitate. It's a very fine line between this and overly-judging.

What happens when ALL of us lets everything pass out of grace?

Lies and deception will also start passing themselves off "as grace".

enfoldedblue
6th February 2012, 00:02
I think one of the most important lessons I have learnt on my journey is to allow everyone else to have their own. Our society teaches us to compare and judge. Our egos love to look at others and see how silly, ignorant etc they are, this makes the ego feel good...feel superior, and ultimately distances us (temporarily)our own insecurities. When we trust that everyone's journey is perfect for them, and remember everyone learns different things in different ways at different times, we can let go of the need to judge and compare and we cease to contribute our energy to the mechanisms of social control, and instead create a freer space for ourselves and those around us.

xx



Correct.

However, if you feel you can reach out and explain when you know you can - just do it. Don't hesitate. It's a very fine line between this and overly-judging.

What happens when ALL of us lets everything pass out of grace?

Lies and deception will also start passing themselves off "as grace".

Yes sharing our truth is important. But for me the key is sharing it without ego attachment.

jaybee
6th February 2012, 00:11
Look, you might be right about plants, spooks, etc ... I honestly don't know, and I sway from one opinion to the other.

get this...:).....I'm on another forum and I have (more or less) got the spooks pegged there as I have observed and been part of the interactions for a few years.
They even know that I know...but I still interact with them and have a joke with them etc etc. Because they are a permanant fixture...so you have to. You have to work round it....and do your own thing.


I even think that some of the same 'agents' or what ever we want to call them are here with different user names...of course. There will be proxy servers and sockpuppets etc. I get the same feel off some of the people on my suspect list here as I do from the ones on the other forum.



One thing I do know is that I got pretty angry with that Pila person, and the accusations or at least insinuations that I'm such a plant or fake member flew about briefly. I'm most certainly not, and to imagine that people might think I am is a weird feeling.

I have had hints like that subtely pointed in my direction so I know how you feel. But here's the thing...the 'spooks' here are going to 'attack' genuine members in all sorts of ways...ringfence them....cast aspersions...piss them off in various ways. To try and get rid of them.


So that's my perspective on other people who have had such claims made against them. By the way, the idea that 'Pila' is Bill Ryan is ludicrous, I agree. What would be his motive? Also, I don't visit the Nexus site, but now I'm feeling paranoid that anyone there thinks I'm something nefarious ...

When I saw that about the theory being banded about Bill Ryan pretending to be Pila...I was like....FFS. But it was a deliberate attack on Bill (R)....calculated. (imo)


I was after all the guy who took most issue with Pila in his thread! My motives are stated there. Mild irritation became outrage when he informed a sarcastic poster that he'd seen a vision of ill fortune for the guy. That was not on at all.

I didn't see that...but I agree it was out of order...typical mind game rubbish.




On the subject of infiltrators ... have you considered that the best way to attack a forum like this one would be to fill it with nonsense that makes it look flaky? I wouldn't accuse anyone of that because I don't want to engage paranoia, but it is sometimes at the back of my mind.


yes I have considered it...and I think that is the reality....it is at the front of my mind..in fact I made a comment along those lines in the Beckow 'space joy ride' thread.


Sorry, maybe I'm being paranoid now. (Niggling worry about anything being said about my posts on Pila's thread in the Nexus place though, argh!). And sorry, S-L, for going a little off topic here.

don't be sorry...join the club....don't worry about Nexus forum...I think you got a mention of approval...they watch this forum and many bitch about it. Some think the Pila thing is hilarious. Which it is. But they would wouldn't they if it was a spooks game. Watching it play out.


By the way, I wouldn't be here in the first place if I didn't like Bill, which, as you say, doesn't make him infallible in my eyes.

Borden.


that's right.....none of us are.......phew this is a bit long. I'm having a bit of a blow out on this subject because it is painful to see what's going on.


cheers


.

S-L
6th February 2012, 00:38
On the subject of infiltrators ... have you considered that the best way to attack a forum like this one would be to fill it with nonsense that makes it look flaky? I wouldn't accuse anyone of that because I don't want to engage paranoia, but it is sometimes at the back of my mind

This has also been at the back of my mind of late. It's so relative, though... one person's gem is another's worthless piece of noise. I don't think there's a solution to this issue.

9eagle9
6th February 2012, 01:23
Because they believe their own stories.


Hey mate,

Well, this subject actually is really worrying me a lot.

How come such a great number of people here in PA, who were supposed to be more "awakened" than the masses, believe such things????

I mean, just look at the latest hoax, that alien trip. Lots of people here were actually thinking that an alien would pick them up at home, riding a black limousine, to take them into an intergalactic trip aboard an alien mothership, without having a single bit of evidence about that! I´m sorry for the word, but how stupid this sounds??

If your phone rings and someone tells you have been chosen to go on a trip to the Caribbean Islands for 10 days, completely free of any charge, would you believe that as well? Come on!!!

There is a lot of hoaxers, charlatans and mentally ill persons out there. If someone makes a website, in order to blacklist any alternative character whenever he tells a big lie, well, I guess we wouldn´t have a handful of credible names right now. However, people love to forget. Just look at how busy was the alien trip thread during the last days and how it is right now. People are ready to forget about that and to buy into another scam.

To make things worse, there are always the excuses...Oh, he was a victim of an AI!!! Oh, he was mislead by a CIA psy-ops!!

Come on!! The chances are much bigger that these characters are either mentally ill, charlatans or even both!!

Please, I understand some people are desperate to believe something is coming down here to save us. However, it´s time for us to assume the responsibilities over our actions. If you choose to believe something, believe your family, your friends, your loved ones, because they are the closest thing you will find to call "real".

I really hope some of you have learned the lesson after this latest gullibility disaster.

Whenever someone, anyone, makes a huge claim or promise, he should also present proportionally big evidence and proof to back it up.

It shouldn't ´t be hard for a genetically modified super soldier to prove his abilities, right?

It also shouldn´t be hard for a man who have daily contact with entities from another dimension or planet to prove it, right?

Enough is Enough!!! Please, WAKE UP!

With all due respect and much love,

Raf.

PS: By the way, there are 99% of chances that, in most cases related to such subject, we´re are dealing with the most dangerous alien species ever, which is called MAN.

Sidney
6th February 2012, 01:34
Hey mate,

Well, this subject actually is really worrying me a lot.

How come such a great number of people here in PA, who were supposed to be more "awakened" than the masses, believe such things????

I mean, just look at the latest hoax, that alien trip. Lots of people here were actually thinking that an alien would pick them up at home, riding a black limousine, to take them into an intergalactic trip aboard an alien mothership, without having a single bit of evidence about that! I´m sorry for the word, but how stupid this sounds??

If your phone rings and someone tells you have been chosen to go on a trip to the Caribbean Islands for 10 days, completely free of any charge, would you believe that as well? Come on!!!

There is a lot of hoaxers, charlatans and mentally ill persons out there. If someone makes a website, in order to blacklist any alternative character whenever he tells a big lie, well, I guess we wouldn´t have a handful of credible names right now. However, people love to forget. Just look at how busy was the alien trip thread during the last days and how it is right now. People are ready to forget about that and to buy into another scam.

To make things worse, there are always the excuses...Oh, he was a victim of an AI!!! Oh, he was mislead by a CIA psy-ops!!

Come on!! The chances are much bigger that these characters are either mentally ill, charlatans or even both!!

Please, I understand some people are desperate to believe something is coming down here to save us. However, it´s time for us to assume the responsibilities over our actions. If you choose to believe something, believe your family, your friends, your loved ones, because they are the closest thing you will find to call "real".

I really hope some of you have learned the lesson after this latest gullibility disaster.

Whenever someone, anyone, makes a huge claim or promise, he should also present proportionally big evidence and proof to back it up.

It shouldn't ´t be hard for a genetically modified super soldier to prove his abilities, right?

It also shouldn´t be hard for a man who have daily contact with entities from another dimension or planet to prove it, right?

Enough is Enough!!! Please, WAKE UP!

************************************************** ************************************************** ***********************************************

The whole ticket thing,, my first thought was, C'MON, aliens would not give out tickets. They would telepathically communicate the plan and follow through with it. A ticket? My other thought, immediately following was, that if there were indeed tickets given out, and a BLACCK limo came, I mean, you can kiss your A** goodbye, cause the MIB aren't taking you on a lovely tour of the galaxy.

Debra
6th February 2012, 01:48
Well, it would seem that solutions are offered up all the time, at least perspectives or opinions and we are just part of the conversation. The drama is nicely amped up at the moment, and I am positive that this is the agenda of those whipping it up to cause a number of dis eased feelings and swinging thoughts, are doing a sterling effort. Did anyone listen to Randy Maugans on Off Planet Radio this week - a live show in conjunction with Wolf Spirit Radio? The trolls were out, as Dave Corso said and speakers were butting ideologies left right and centre, especially on the finer points of handling infuriating callers. It was war. But compelling and a lesson, or rather a reflection to ponder on.

This is the time we live in. This is what we signed up for. Not only on this forum but also in life. All we are doing is our right to keep asking the questions if we are not clear. And what and how we ask or who and what we state, we must be who we are. Authenticity is absolutely essential in these times to get to the core of what is in us and certainly to what is holding us back, aside from our own self limitations.

Again, Kerry and indeed Bill Ryan in past interview choices, serve us with a hot and cold buffet of choices. Some great interviews, lest we forget! All have led to some insight. And some like the BW trilogy with assorted others joining into the discussion, has not all been clear. I think BW and his friend Eva are struggling to make sense of what the big picture is - and yes, I would prefer that they both had a more compelling way of telling their story and were more grounded and self confident in their subject matter. Had their content and context better nailed. However, after viewing all three opportunities for BW to bring his case to the public, and including some radio spots he has done with Kerry, I also appreciate the raw quality of him and his case. I am not convinced entirely of where he is going with it all. Far from it. And I also think Kerry became equally unclear in her framing of questions to focus him and Eva. Even if the point of this outing of BW is to help others wake up, I am concerned because we do need clear leadership to take us all forward. From all of this, I think we need to attend to our own backyards first, at least keep aware of and working on removing our own bull dust. And if that means triggering each other on this forum, over matters of discernment, then so be it. As for infiltrators who maybe amongst us to discredit this forum and other gatherings of conversation, well what do we do with them? I think they just expose themselves anyway. Let them talk to an empty house. Easy.

OnyxKnight
6th February 2012, 01:53
I have been discussing this on another topic (I think it was the one about the trip to Neptune) - but I'll say it again - Unless people learn to discern and filter what information they take in, process, and accept, that we're still going to be manipulated, more or less.

Discernment is not enough - learn about different subjects and domains of knowing so you can be even better at judging these things. Whether its physics, chemistry, biology, psychology etc., doesn't matter, as long as you start to gain some knowledge about it. Its going to help you not only in evaluating various types of claims of various types of people who are in this, 'alternative' community, but also any claims made by the mainstream. Educate yourself!

Use multiple sources, mainstream, alternative, in between, or even outright unbelievable claims, compare them too, check with the literature in library, reference with other books, present facts, your own common sense and gut feeling etc.

Its not an easy thing, and it won't be - you will probably waste more time than usual by doing this, but at least your level of certainty in something, or lack there of, will become more transparent. You will know if something is BS or not.

A lot of people think that whatever opinions I have, or details and insights about various things, are solely the product of interactions and exchange of information with extraterrestrials - but a lot of it is actually my own interest in becoming more knowledgeable in certain subjects so I can be better at analyzing materials of the alternative community. I had to re-learn many things because I got forcibly directed at one particular direction in school, and it wasn't one that explained a lot of things to me. I ended up with more questions than answers.

I tell you (all) this because, no offense, but many of you here are, in fact, are very ignorant of some important things that can be boiled down to the use of a handful of facts (that can be acquired easily, in a short amount of time) and common sense.

I saw this with Aaron McCollum (his following remains almost unchanged unfortunately), I saw this with Leo Zagami, I saw it again with Dan Burisch, and yet again with "Charles". The newest one being this funfair ride to the planet Neptune via tickets and shapeshifting black limmos.

If this last one is enough to convince not one, but four people of ths forumtake this seriously enough to actually risk everything and go ahead and apply to be one of the people to go on this trip, and make a huge mass following os supporters, then all of you need to seriously question your discernment skills, basic logic and common sense, because they seem to be heading down south, and it doesn't look like its going to stop anytime soon. In fact, as you can see the track record - things are going from bad to worse, when it comes to discernment in this 'alternative' community.

Lucky you this was only a hoax. The Avalonians that applied to take this trip could have ended up in who-knows-who's hands and with their life in serious danger. I don't know why people don't think before they jump? Think twice before you jump. Think ten times. For your own sake.

Even though clearly there is no Nibiru (at least not anymore - and I won't go into the details as to how, when, why etc. - because I have said it countless times by now), people still cling on to it as a magnet, and entertain the topic, instead of focusing more at the situation at home, and maybe themselves and how well are they able to evaluate and digest information. I'm sorry if some of you feel offended, but its true. And if you feel offended, then maybe its ripe time to take things into your own hands and start doing what I suggested, and maybe you will realize what I realized long time ago, when I was still a teenager, and understand why I say this, and the reason behind it.

I mentioned Nibiru, there's also the Elenin hype, and the 2012 doomsday event, all of which are beaten to death topics. Its 2012, if Nibiru was coming, it would be here by now, we would have seen it.

I always encourage objective (but cautious) look at what I disseminate as information - I did so on my threads - I'm not asking for people to believe in it - but just have it in mind, when coming across a different material, and make comparisons. I'm delivering information, you don't have to believe in it, just use it. Like a tool. When the time comes. Whether I'm right or nor is not that relevant, its important that you are just aware of it that its there.

I'll give you one more example - Billy Meier. He has probably the greatest following of all alleged contactees, and is believed to be genuine by many. The falsified evidence aside, his own claims and "facts" don't stand the power of logic. If he was who he said he was, for example, or claimed to contact who he claims to contact, he wouldn't have made dire mistakes in basic astronomical measurements.

Either he, or his extraterrestrial contacts - don't seem to differentiate between what is a planet, what is a star, what is a constellation, and what is a galaxy. And how each looks, or how big it is, how far it is, etc. Its basic knowledge. If he contacted aliens who provided more detailed information like the one he presents, he would have known the difference. And one would think the extraterrestrials at the very least, would be the ones to know these things, as they have interstellar travel capabilities and come from far, far away.

His claims are as though you confuse the length of a centimeter, a meter and a kilometer - and can't tell the difference between them. Or the difference between geometric shapes.

This is why I encourage people to read and learn, educate yourselves on topics you had no previous understanding about before - you never know when you might need the knowledge to help you in analyzing and evaluating things.

@ S-L

I commend you for opening such a topic, since in my opinion it is clearly needed. And I don't know why some have questioned the purpose of the topic, when its clear. To discuss how to become more discerning when we come across topics of the alternative (or mainstream too).

I do have an issue with you putting all positive voices from above in one basket - that of a backhand agenda.

Its true that there are agendas out there disguised as harmless and benevolent, when in fact they are a lot more sinister, but the problem I have is you seem to be very, very much generalizing here.

There is no way to verify at this point whether this is their planet or not. Documentation for proof is a human concept, it doesn't apply up there.

When it comes to the world, they don't need our permission to help - if indeed they can help, and this is what they do. I'm referring to ecological dangers, climatic dangers etc. - if they want to act, they will act, they won't consult with us (and I don't think they need to, unless it has a harmful effect on us or any other type of life on this planet).

If things remain unchanged and unchallenged - yes, we would destroy the planet slowly. Responsibility falls on us as well as the 1% who move the puppet strings, for not acting out on the information we had, and prevent it. I for one, am happy there are some out there that do help in serious and dire situations on Earth - I wouldn't put dirt on that myself - as they are very close to becoming annoyed with our stupidity to the point of leaving us to make one of these bad mistakes and then leave for us to clean the mess.

But I think you are pretty much right about the rest of your points.

As a comment to them from me:

* Benevolent extraterrestrials don't abduct - they invite you in, and don't affect your memory of the event;

* They don't mess with your DNA - we are slowly repairing that automatically since 10.000 years ago - rushing that process is not beneficial;

* They only explain you the concept of spirituality, the various aspects of it, and several tips on what direction you should go, the rest of the journey is your own - there is no "help to ascend";

* The concept of 'cosmic brother' is used usually to associate with the human-looking extraterrestrials, so it should be obsolete - because you would be more 'brother' with some of them than others - or we should apply it to every one of them out there, even if they have tentacles rather than feet;

* Religion pushers should bring up red alarm too;

Debra
6th February 2012, 02:07
I also think Randy Maugans is a fine interviewer within the truth movement. I also appreciate Henrik Palmgren over at Red Ice Creations. Both awesome journalists in my mind, and on equal footing to Kerry C and Bill R.
And Randy especially does not hold back and for the most part, keeps interviews on track, at the same time allows them to bloom. However, even amongst interviewers, you know that their choices of interviewees are selective, but that is why I think we need to just flow with where the microphone and camera go. There is no right way here. I would like to see all of these interviewers come together and have a forum of their own. To bring their own understanding of knowledge into a dialogue that will help the shift move markedly and collectively forward. Now that would be sensational.

Sirius White
6th February 2012, 02:18
I don't fall for any of it because I trust in myself, and trust in others only when established a connection. If that person violates that connection then the karma is on them, and we go our separate ways.

Discernment yes.

Intuition yes.

Balance most important.

onawah
6th February 2012, 02:27
I have no issues with anything else you've stated in this last post, but I do take issue to this:


they are very close to becoming annoyed with our stupidity to the point of leaving us to make one of these bad mistakes and then leave for us to clean the mess.

This doesn't sound to me at all like the attitude that benevolent ETs/EDs would take, given that they are probably much more aware than most of us are of how humankind on this planet has been used and abused by many hostile alien races who have made insane puppets of our so-called leaders, so that besides the ages long tradition of warring, raping and plundering, we now have brain numbing technologies from cell phones to HAARP, toxic, gene-altering threats from nuclear weaponry to GMOs, deliberate planet wide programs of mass genocide such as chemtrails and vaccines, and on and on and on.
It seems clear that it is a minority of humans who have sold their souls and sold out the rest of us.
You make no distinction there, however.
You say your ET friends think humankind is stupid? Is it any wonder we are stupid? It's a freaking miracle we can still function at all!
I'd say we deserve medals just for surviving as long as we have without going completely bonkers.
Your ET friends don't sound so benevolent to me.

Mike Gorman
6th February 2012, 02:33
Along with Kyra I too had a very bad reaction to 'Charles'instantly, as one of the posters on here who is very seldom recognized,
not a part of any personality clique, I am not out to try and influence or cajole anyone-I am simply appreciative of this forum
and have been 'awake' for a very long time. I was amazed that Charles gained such a hold of folks, it seems PA members are a mixed bag, and along with this comes a desperate need to believe, an open-ness to extraordinary claims. We need to remember the basic lessons of human life, Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, Caveat Emptor and all those cautionary fables we all learnt as little children from our cultural history (Fairy Tales and Fables?) Before you throw your lot in with the next Charming Mystic Gypsy-pull back
and think about it...dis-engage the arrogance and egotism from thinking you 'Know' so much more than the "Sheeple". Recent events demonstrate
forcibly that many on here are Naive and credulous to an alarming degree, no wonder these tricksters see us as such a ripe resource to plunder?
I am not saying I am wiser, or more knowledgeable-I merely request that we all grow up a bit and give matters a little Thought before bubbling over
like starry eyed debutantes.The universe is far stranger than any of us imagine...but there are legions of tricksters-whatever their origins.

Debra
6th February 2012, 02:37
You make some hard but needed comments starchild111. I agree, we need to be looking into ourselves, and be having these conversations with our nearest and dearest. Not only are they real, they are also with us for reasons that go beyond this lifetime, that I am convinced of. From within, or from out there, however, I know my own experiences to be real. Weird things have passed through and around me, but also I have had some amazing experiences, that were not planned with tickets and a limo, that is for sure.

However, who really knows? Until it happens to them, of course. On the surface, this recent event, non event - whatever - reminds me of Blossom Goodchild a few years back. The Galactic Federation of Light let poor Blossom down big time that night. Now, she may have or may not have been in contact with something out there, but what has transpired three years on is a proliferation of ufo sightings over major cities. It has almost become daily, and sure some of the evidence we see is fake etc.. Point is, Blossom pretty much outlined what would occur.

Are they ETs or our own? That is the question.

I like to stick to my own gut feelings, and discern for myself. Not concern myself where they are from, but can I trust them.

Flash
6th February 2012, 02:42
I have no issues with anything else you've stated in this last post, but I do take issue to this:


they are very close to becoming annoyed with our stupidity to the point of leaving us to make one of these bad mistakes and then leave for us to clean the mess.

This doesn't sound to me at all like the attitude that benevolent ETs/EDs would take, given that they are probably much more aware than most of us are of how humankind on this planet has been used and abused by many hostile alien races who have made insane puppets of our so-called leaders, so that besides the ages long tradition of warring, raping and plundering, we now have brain numbing technologies from cell phones to HAARP, toxic, gene-altering threats from nuclear weaponry to GMOs, deliberate planet wide programs of mass genocide such as chemtrails and vaccines, and on and on and on.
It seems clear that it is a minority of humans who have sold their souls and sold out the rest of us.
You make no distinction there, however.
You say your ET friends think humankind is stupid? Is it any wonder we are stupid? It's a freaking miracle we can still function at all!
I'd say we deserve medals just for surviving as long as we have without going completely bonkers.
Your ET friends don't sound so benevolent to me.

I truly disagree with you Onawah. We are led by a minority of human who have sold their soul because we want it, through acceptance, victimhood, lack of self responsibilities and lack of self respect. All those aquired by looking inside oneself first..

We may well have what we deserve when I think of it. When I see lots of people giving money to BW just because people high on the conspiracy pyramid (yes pyramid, this is where WE placed them) have asked to, this is no different that what we let ptb do through admiring them and giving in. Real stupidity if you want my opinion.

WE have a beautiful planet, full of life, capable of supporting all of us as long as we get along, stop war, and start creating wealth and health for everyone.

But we accept to go to the rat race to have an ever bigger house, ever nicer car, and all this while putting the blame on others, saying it is because we have been brainwashed. We accept and thrive for the pyramidal system. So the shark will get on top for sure.

Well now that we know we are brainwashed, we just have to say no to all this way of thinking, yet we don't.

I would have a tendency to err on the "good Aliens" side and think we are stupid and in need of a lesson.

Ouf, I have a cold and it may be the time for bed here, otherwise it is depressing.

Vitalux
6th February 2012, 06:45
we must never forget that this forum...like any other forum dealing with conspiracies is heavily infiltrated.



I find that most curious. Who, or for what purpose would someone wish to infiltrate this forum :confused:






In fact this forum may get more attention than most because of the work that Bill and Kerry have done over the years.

I don't want to keep harping on about infiltration but if you don't take this into account then you are not experiencing the reality of this forum.

It is a dynamic that has to be taken into consideration.

I am getting more than a strong feeling that there is a real push here at the moment to piss genuine members off, in various ways and to literally...bring the forum down.

This may be to do with 2012...I don't know.



I am not quite I am able to fully grasp your meaning, or whatever you may be inferring.

I tend to be pragmatic and just express myself based on facts, with out using much intuition or strong feelings.

From my understanding fear seldom causes rational thinking.
(Remember that if someone yells fire in a overcrowded movie theater.:flame:)




I have been taking a look at the Nexus2012 forum and it is astonishing what is being said by 'some' over there....did you know that the new Guru on the block Pila...could be Bill Ryan? Of course Pila isn't Bill Ryan....heaven knows who Pila is. But this is the sort of mind games that are being played with us.

The agents/spooks/mischief makers are going all out to bring down Project Camelot and Project Avalon...IMO.

In obvious ways and subtle ways. At what point do genuine members just disappear because of all the rubbish and the games?



I'm not really able to fully comprehend what you are attempting to convey.
But from my observation often the loss of membership in forums can be caused by a clique of individuals suffering from narcissistic personality disorder.




I feel a loyalty to Bill (R) and to Kerry...even though I don't think they are always right. 'Charles' and Brockbrader being two examples.

At what point do the fake members win? The reality is that they are practically unstoppable. They can work together and more or less control the forum. This is going to sound paranoid....and maybe it is...but it is what I honestly think.


rant over



It is good for you that you are loyal to both Bill Ryan and Kerry Cassidy.

Myself, I subject my loyalty to no one. However I pledge to be a good citizen in any forum or community which I belong to. :)

DNA
6th February 2012, 07:51
Channelled information is suppsedly done so because it is coming from a higher intelligence, so, with that in mind, if the work is not genius, it should be discounted because it fails to meet the criteria established for what channeled information is, and that being information from a higher intelligence.

Before 15 months ago, I may not have felt that the flowery channeled groups were dangerous or anything.
But, I had an experience in November of 2010.
I was having an extensive e-mail dialogue with a woman claiming to be chanelling the Plieadians. (For the record, I dig Billy Meier, but the beings this woman was chanelling were not the same folks in my opinion.)
When we disagreed on a few key points, I suggested we agree to disagree and move on, but she became fixated and wrote me incredibly long e-mails to support her points that were mute as far as I was concerned.(That there was a battle going on between angelic aliens(pleiadians) and satanic aliens (reptilians).) And that isn't why I'm mentioning it.
I personally don't buy the whole reptilian thing, but that is neither here nor there.
I'm mentioning it, because, I felt a psychic attack accompany the e-mails when I would read them.
Not so much from her, but I felt it was from the beings she channeled.
I don't want to get into it too much, but, I honestly felt it was dangerous for me to continue communicating with her.
I cease and disisted all communication with her.
And then I felt no more psychic molestation.

TargeT
6th February 2012, 07:56
Channelled information is suppsedly done so because it is coming from a higher intelligence, so, with that in mind, if the work is not genius, it should be discounted because it fails to meet the criteria established for what channeled information is, and that being information from a higher intelligence.

Before 15 months ago, I may not have felt that the flowery channeled groups were dangerous or anything.
But, I had an experience in November of 2010.
I was having an extensive e-mail dialogue with a woman claiming to be chanelling the Plieadians. (For the record, I dig Billy Meier, but the beings this woman was chanelling were not the same folks in my opinion.)
When we disagreed on a few key points, I suggested we agree to disagree and move on, but she became fixated and wrote me incredibly long e-mails to support her points that were mute as far as I was concerned.(That there was a battle going on between angelic aliens(pleiadians) and satanic aliens (reptilians).) And that isn't why I'm mentioning it.
I personally don't buy the whole reptilian thing, but that is neither here nor there.
I'm mentioning it, because, I felt a psychic attack accompany the e-mails when I would read them.
Not so much from her, but I felt it was from the beings she channeled.
I don't want to get into it too much, but, I honestly felt it was dangerous for me to continue communicating with her.
I cease and disisted all communication with her.
And then I felt no more psychic molestation.

could that be internal conflicts expressing themselves or are you sure its an external attack? I don't see how we can be attacked with out allowing it; and perhaps its all based on belief, if you think its possible it becomes possible?

DNA
6th February 2012, 08:19
could that be internal conflicts expressing themselves or are you sure its an external attack? I don't see how we can be attacked with out allowing it; and perhaps its all based on belief, if you think its possible it becomes possible?

I understand information that is shared from personal experience can and may conflict when folks are sharing thus. Me stating my assuredness will do nothing for your assuredness unless you have some kind of personal experience that would allow for something like this to be a reality. For me, this is small potatoes, and as such no big deal. For me, I came to grips with psychic attack and the reality of it twenty+ years ago.

For me the question would be, why do you think it is a negative extra-dimensional, and not the woman herself that you are communicating with?

To this I can only reply, it was the strength of the attack and the pervasiveness of it. Also the strange feeling, that I can only discribe as an upset stomach in the head. This was a completely unique form of psychic attack as far as what I am accostomed to experiencing. Also it seemed the woman I was talking to seemed to be experiencing an attack of sorts herself, for she felt the need to argue her point, not so much for my benefit, but for her own.

Tane Mahuta
6th February 2012, 08:30
I did not connect with Atticus....only made it 5mins in the video & fell asleep!!

I did listen to Brockbrader....discarded what didn't resonate!! The jury is not out yet.

Discernment(to me)...means reserarch!,research!,research! & more research!!

means reading lot of papers & ebooks from anything & anyone regarding the subject at hand.

means watching all the videos & movies that come out regarding the subject at hand.
(even hollywood is trying to tell us something)

Discernment(to me) means looking at the BIGGER picture!!...Looking for structure within the chaos!
(connecting the dots)

So we turn to these 2 Charles (who rocked P.A) & this John guy (who may do the same).

P.A lost a lot of good people to this "Charles fiasco". A lot of people got hurt!

I say...do your research, don't take it litterally... keep what resonates...discard what doesn't!

Now as regards to the subject of ET....

We all know the saying... "As Above, So Below"

There are beautiful, caring, Human Beings on this Planet...then there are some real nasty "buggers".

So it should be the same in the heavens!!...(shouldn't it?) ie "Yin & Yang"

So what of the Alien agenda?....that's easy!..2 words!

...............TOTAL CONTROL!!...........

how they get to that point is of no consequence...
(time is of no consequence too)

The best we can do as a human race is to spread the message...this message!...everywhere...

the message of P.A...P.C...Bill & Kerry & all the other whistleblowers that put their lives on the line everyday.

And to all the other websites that are dedicated to the cause!..spread the message!!

Lastly...

I too have noticed a lot of newcomers to the forum...(great!!) P.A is reaching more people than ever!

Some heavy posts from some.(these are not "newbies, I'm thinking)(must've come from another forum).

All are welcome!! to Project Avalon!!
("as above, so below")

Fellow Avalonians...there's been a saying that's been banging in my head for at least a year now....

.........."CONSTANT VIGILANCE"........

Fellow Avalonians we must be vigilant...of world events taking place, watch the Alternative

news media. These events are engineered!! Not random...never random.

So too within this forum...fellow members...I ask you to remain vigilant...

Speak up if you feel that the forum is being diverted!

Look after other members!

13495

nuff said

TM

elysian
6th February 2012, 09:09
[mod-edit]New readers: "Bill" is Bill Wood (William Brockbrader) and Charles is Atticus (Stephen Hodges)[mod-edit]

How many of us sent a dollar to Bill? How many of us joined Charles/Atticus' online forum? How many of us got a pass to board the mothership? How many of us defended people who manipulated us?

How discerning are we? Not as a group or community, but as individuals?

If we can't discern fellow human beings, then how can we discern the Alien Intervention? This is a time for radical self-honesty. Reacting defensively to these questions is not helpful.

If an intelligent and clever human being can sit down in a chair, tell us a story, and have us believe it, then how well can we possibly fare discerning the stories told to us by the Alien Intervention?


We are here to activate your DNA.
This world belongs to us as we seeded it with life.
We are your long lost brothers from a distant star, we merely want to help you grow spiritually.
We are here to help you ascend!
You will destroy this world without our assistance.
Etc...

We are dealing with other intelligent species that are more advanced and cunning than we are. They have demonstrated skill in telepathy, mind control, and brainwashing. Regardless of who your favourite author is on the subject - regardless of the story you wish to believe - take heed! If we have difficulty discerning fellow human beings, then we are doubly challenged in discerning an intelligent being from a distant star, someone who does not adhere to human psychology, human culture, human values, human history, etc.

No matter what your opinion is on the Alien Agenda, regardless of how many decades it took you to come to this understanding, be wary of the stories that they put out. Be cautious. Any story that seems to put us in a subservient role, or one of trust, or one of needing something from them, should be treated with extreme caution.

This is not being fearful or negative. This is being alert, aware, and cautious. This isn't a game. We couldn't even discern Bill and Charles. Be careful with Aliens. Be smarter. Accept that perhaps you're wrong. The stakes are too high to make a mistake here. They are abducting people left and right. Can you tell friend from foe? How certain are you? Are you willing to bet this planet on it?

Thanks S-L for making this point!
I believe that it is one of the most important ones on this forum.

A very important life lesson is to only fully trust what you know from your own experiences.

Regarding Bill and Charles or any other ones,
Yes, listen to them but don't take their word for it unless you have experienced their truth first hand. If what they say feels right to you, add that to a list of possible truths to consider but please keep a separate list of truths that comes from your own experience. We can use others information as a guide for direction for things to explore further. Do that on your own risk though as the direction a lot of the time is theirs. (We all have or own paths to get where we are going).

I believe that we all individually have it in us to find out the truth for our selves.

Daft Ada
6th February 2012, 14:13
Well One of the most important lessons Airline Pilots are taught is that the best decision is always made by the group. Every now and then I would have to attend a course where we would be given a scenario and asked to write our decisions about it on a sheet, then we were asked to discus the scenario between us all and to vote on the different aspects and write the decisions down. No matter how stupid or weird the scenario, it could always be clearly seen that the group decision was the best.
Now I'm not saying that there were never any occasions when the group decision didn't match the decision of any person in the group, or indeed myself, but it proved to me the group was wrong less often and with the support of the members of the group the decisions sat more comfortable.
Therefore I suggest that anything that comes up is best posted and discussed on here and between us all, and we will make the best, if not right decision.

9eagle9
6th February 2012, 14:51
You can't be attacked without allowing it.

Really reframe here for a second. Who would want to attack a forum where 90 percent of the membership if you observe --if YOU OBSERVE and are AWARE of what you are observing ....are emotional co dependents or emotional junkies.

Someone is always hurting their feelings. " I know I refer to myself as retard but I'll cry if you make me feel stupid"

If your not talking about something 'feel good' they're not getting their fix . And if like any other addict you don't hand them a needle , don't enable them, you are a 'hater. If you don't put the needle in your arm, your 'not-spiritual'

A forum where 'love' is represented as a feel good drug "I'm going to post a thread to tell total strangers I love them and they'll rush in and tell me they love me too and I'll have my fix for the day''''

When that mechanism gets old and even the people who actually do like them begin to see the patterns they are developing, walk away from their nonsense they have handy excuse of calling them 'haters' And all the other junkies will agree with them. And rush in to 'luv' them and give them another fix.

Or

"I'll behave like a victim, create a drama, based on my 'feelings' and someone will rush in pat me on the head because I behave like an idiot but you HAVE to love me anyway. "

If you don't you're a hater.

Where abilities are confused for wisdom.

"Feelings" are confused for abilities.

Disconnecting disconneting disconnecting from truth daily and calling it 'spiritual development". And their excuse is "Some people are more spritually developed as if spirit is something that can be developed like a housing project."

Creation of the 'lite' sociopath is revealing itself daily.

Love, namaste, and wisdom are daily perverted and corrupted. One is now a drug, the other a gesture that has been corrupted into catchy slogan to make the ignorant look hip and cool. It's perversion. Using something sacred for egotisitical reasons. Like the ptb do. These same people gasp outrage over the perversion of a child even as they TRY to corrupt what is pure. And they wonder why others are disgusted at their behavior.

Who out there, exactly, is going to be threatened by a forum whose membership is becoming mostly composed of all these quickly evolving lite sociopaths. Who hand out messages from outer space to replace the fact they have no true wisdom of their own.

Who take anything sacred, corrupt it and pervert it for their own self gratification to make themselves look or feel good without regard to what they are actually corrupting.

Who out there is going to be threatened by that? Threatened enough to attack? The powers that be?

PTB is about dark sociopathy. It has to imposed by corruption and pervsion, and conditions of co dependency are forced.

People couldn't be tempted to the obvious dark there so now we have lite sociopathy....here. At the bottom of the pyramid. Another choice was offered. Light perversion. Perversion and corruption of light, love, wisdom, and namaste. Using it for something it was never intended. Misrepresenting it so it can be expressed as something that would help the human condition? You can't call them out because they are so 'nice'. Like the Queen of England, such a nice old lady what could she possibly be doing to pervert and corrupt the pure?

The PTB knowing this, has those sorts of people right where they want them. Why would they need Bill Wood or Charles or anyone to come in here and manipulate people when they are busily hypnotizing themselves and each other. And you can't help them because denial is now the better part of spirituality and love.

With 90 percent of the forum content all about indulging in this addiction dream ...who really needs to attack this forum?

Not the PTB, people who choose to indulge and gratify themselves like that are the PTB's bricks in the wall. By their own denial of better choices.

Attacked? How does a pervert who stalks the innocent, to corrupt them, feel when the law collars them and slams them in the locker for the rest of their life.

When an authority reveals their perversion and corruption. Who are the persons that step forward to defend them? More perverts and more corupters.

Pedophiles think they have every 'right' to pervert and corrupt. If by word or deed one suggests they do not, how do you suppose the pervert feels? There's about 10 percent of this membership that isn't going to go there, isn't going to indulge or feed this 'lite sociopathy', isn't going to give it a comfortable crack den to pass the bowl around.

If people choose to pervert and corrupt Love, Wisdom, Spirit & Namaste--anything sacred for their own self indulgence ---how would they feel if something infiltrated that cycle with the determination 'that the buck stops here. ' Did we not really understand what 2012 means?

Because it's not just this forum the lite sociopathy is expressing itself and growing all over the place. And all over the place there's a handful of people still fighting to preserve Life (Love, Wisdom, Namaste and Spirit). For those who want to use those sacred things as toys ...they are gettting a wake up call from the real thing.

Should I be suprised that someone would 'think' its an attack, when its the genuine article that is saying, "You are not perverting and corrupting me anymore."






Channelled information is suppsedly done so because it is coming from a higher intelligence, so, with that in mind, if the work is not genius, it should be discounted because it fails to meet the criteria established for what channeled information is, and that being information from a higher intelligence.

Before 15 months ago, I may not have felt that the flowery channeled groups were dangerous or anything.
But, I had an experience in November of 2010.
I was having an extensive e-mail dialogue with a woman claiming to be chanelling the Plieadians. (For the record, I dig Billy Meier, but the beings this woman was chanelling were not the same folks in my opinion.)
When we disagreed on a few key points, I suggested we agree to disagree and move on, but she became fixated and wrote me incredibly long e-mails to support her points that were mute as far as I was concerned.(That there was a battle going on between angelic aliens(pleiadians) and satanic aliens (reptilians).) And that isn't why I'm mentioning it.
I personally don't buy the whole reptilian thing, but that is neither here nor there.
I'm mentioning it, because, I felt a psychic attack accompany the e-mails when I would read them.
Not so much from her, but I felt it was from the beings she channeled.
I don't want to get into it too much, but, I honestly felt it was dangerous for me to continue communicating with her.
I cease and disisted all communication with her.
And then I felt no more psychic molestation.

could that be internal conflicts expressing themselves or are you sure its an external attack? I don't see how we can be attacked with out allowing it; and perhaps its all based on belief, if you think its possible it becomes possible?

Unified Serenity
6th February 2012, 15:12
You can't be attacked without allowing it.

Really reframe here for a second. Who would want to attack a forum where 90 percent of the membership if you observe --if YOU OBSERVE and are AWARE of what you are observing ....are emotional co dependents or emotional junkies.

Someone is always hurting their feelings. " I know I refer to myself as retard but I'll cry if you make me feel stupid"

If your not talking about something 'feel good' they're not getting their fix . And if like any other addict you don't hand them a needle , don't enable them, you are a 'hater. If you don't put the needle in your arm, your 'not-spiritual'

A forum where 'love' is represented as a feel good drug "I'm going to post a thread to tell total strangers I love them and they'll rush in and tell me they love me too and I'll have my fix for the day''''

When that mechanism gets old and even the people who actually do like them begin to see the patterns they are developing, walk away from their nonsense they have handy excuse of calling them 'haters' And all the other junkies will agree with them. And rush in to 'luv' them and give them another fix.

Or

"I'll behave like a victim, create a drama, based on my 'feelings' and someone will rush in pat me on the head because I behave like an idiot but you HAVE to love me anyway. "

If you don't you're a hater.

Where abilities are confused for wisdom.

"Feelings" are confused for abilities.

Disconnecting disconneting disconnecting from truth daily and calling it 'spiritual development". And their excuse is "Some people are more spritually developed as if spirit is something that can be developed like a housing project."

Creation of the 'lite' sociopath is revealing itself daily.

Love, namaste, and wisdom are daily perverted and corrupted. One is now a drug, the other a gesture that has been corrupted into catchy slogan to make the ignorant look hip and cool. It's perversion. Using something sacred for egotisitical reasons. Like the ptb do. These same people gasp outrage over the perversion of a child even as they TRY to corrupt what is pure. And they wonder why others are disgusted at their behavior.

Who out there, exactly, is going to be threatened by a forum whose membership is becoming mostly composed of all these quickly evolving lite sociopaths. Who hand out messages from outer space to replace the fact they have no true wisdom of their own.

Who take anything sacred, corrupt it and pervert it for their own self gratification to make themselves look or feel good without regard to what they are actually corrupting.

Who out there is going to be threatened by that? Threatened enough to attack? The powers that be?

PTB is about dark sociopathy. It has to imposed by corruption and pervsion, and conditions of co dependency are forced.

People couldn't be tempted to the obvious dark there so now we have lite sociopathy....here. At the bottom of the pyramid. Another choice was offered. Light perversion. Perversion and corruption of light, love, wisdom, and namaste. Using it for something it was never intended. Misrepresenting it so it can be expressed as something that would help the human condition? You can't call them out because they are so 'nice'. Like the Queen of England, such a nice old lady what could she possibly be doing to pervert and corrupt the pure?

The PTB knowing this, has those sorts of people right where they want them. Why would they need Bill Wood or Charles or anyone to come in here and manipulate people when they are busily hypnotizing themselves and each other. And you can't help them because denial is now the better part of spirituality and love.

With 90 percent of the forum content all about indulging in this addiction dream ...who really needs to attack this forum?

Not the PTB, people who choose to indulge and gratify themselves like that are the PTB's bricks in the wall. By their own denial of better choices.

Attacked? How does a pervert who stalks the innocent, to corrupt them, feel when the law collars them and slams them in the locker for the rest of their life.

When an authority reveals their perversion and corruption. Who are the persons that step forward to defend them? More perverts and more corupters.

Pedophiles think they have every 'right' to pervert and corrupt. If by word or deed one suggests they do not, how do you suppose the pervert feels? There's about 10 percent of this membership that isn't going to go there, isn't going to indulge or feed this 'lite sociopathy', isn't going to give it a comfortable crack den to pass the bowl around.

If people choose to pervert and corrupt Love, Wisdom, Spirit & Namaste--anything sacred for their own self indulgence ---how would they feel if something infiltrated that cycle with the determination 'that the buck stops here. ' Did we not really understand what 2012 means?

Because it's not just this forum the lite sociopathy is expressing itself and growing all over the place. And all over the place there's a handful of people still fighting to preserve Life (Love, Wisdom, Namaste and Spirit). For those who want to use those sacred things as toys ...they are gettting a walk up call from the real thing.

Should I be suprised that someone would 'think' its an attack, when its the genuine article that is saying, "You are not perverting and corrupting me anymore."

Only you could drag me out today here Eagle my sister in love, truth, and light! I wanna take these words and engrave them on a plaque! Thank you and here's what I'm doing after I read your words! Preach it sister!

NLjXt7KxD4c

9eagle9
6th February 2012, 15:43
Lol...Oh i don't have to preach it when the real thing has arrived and is kicking arse and taking numbers all over the place. And the real article is beginning to know itself in others.

No one is going to mock or imitiate god, creator, goddess, love, wisdom, truth and light, from this point on without being confronted in some fashion. they can excuse it as some 'bad' karma further perverting what is occuring but it doesn't matter what its called. Like spirit is going to slink off and cry because someone called it a name..lol.

If people feel they are attacked its an internal energy , an internal expression of the real thing. Where did we think truth, love, wisdom, light was going to come from? the mailbox? We are the portals for it. It's imposing influence on the dreamers who percieve it as an attack. A nasty instrusion on the lite dream. Or cerrtainly their ego does. It causes physical, emotional and mental pain when the highest energy starts pushing against the corrupt attachments they have.

We know this because we have experienced it. All of us who see what is occuring do so because we have experienced and KNOWN this for ourselves. That we had to breakdown before we could grow up.

Complaining about energy shifts, and negative and postive and evil influences attempting to bring them down so they re-entrench in their light dream, and others help them dig the foxhole. It's actually coming from inside them and they are reisisting it. Resistance causes pain. Do I have respect for those people. I respect those who are feeling the pressure and doing what they can to alleviate their own blockages to allow the highest vibration in?.

For the rest who complain and pervert the real light into an 'attack'. No i dont. I'm not sure why I should when they do not resepct themselves and corrupt themselves choosing playthings to show how unwilling they are to mature into their spirit....and then like addicts and co dependents spreading it like a virus further corrupting their brothers and sisters. Making sure their kindred are addicts too so they are all comfortable in their addiction and no one around them will call them out on it.

Someone will pop up and say that I don't have the right to speak like this. Oh and I know they will because we know .....we know ..from our known experience.

I do though. You do. I am a human. You are a human. We are humans. Perversion and Corruption of the human race whether by light means or dark affects me , effects you, effects us, as humans there fore making it my business, your business, our business. For people who are getting into their spirit, wrapping themselves up in it like a warm coat do these people really think when they call me mean, and it means **** all to me at all? that's another part of their dream. That they have some sort of power like babbling namaste . That calling us 'mean' is going to 'do' something. Like this new power coming into the earth is just going to back off from a bunch emotional junkies and corrupters.

For all of us feeling the real article coming on in, if anyone ever says that you have 'no right' (isn't that what the ptb says), no right to call out their corruption, KNOW that you came into this world with that right. Because you are a human, and you are composed of truth, and light, and love, and wisdom, so you have every right to stand up and call this corruption out.

Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

They can't attack the truth, the real love, the real wisdom that you are beginning ot know and express ....so will they will attack you personally.

Dear perverts if you think you're angry now....just wait.

CD7
6th February 2012, 16:07
this is precisely why we hear YOU are the one to listen TO....EveryTHING outside of u is part of illusion... Once someone connects with your OWN knowledge base inside...it becomes much more CLEAR...I cannot tell u how to do this for yourself BUT just the simple desire of searching within will bring u there

Kelly
6th February 2012, 16:09
Hi Marique, yes, we both went through it together, and it was not nice!
Discernment does not equal negative, and the N word is thrown around far too much, its basically used just to oppose, subdue and bring discredit to valuable intelligent much needed questions.
Question everything is my new motto lol, and one i will be sticking by from now on!
By the way, sanada called today, and said he is up for brunch tomorrow if you are? ;) xxxxxxxxx

OnyxKnight
6th February 2012, 17:22
Maybe I didn't word myself the best I can.

Yes, we are innocent, you, me, the rest who entertain the 'alternative'. Or at least we think we are. What I was trying to say is that we know a lot, but we don't do anything about it - even forwarding information to other people has somehow stagnated recently.

Yes, the 1% that I was talking about, who control this world and the state it is in, are the real guilty people, but we also bear a degree of guilt. We know what we know, but we are not gaining larger following and acting out on the mistreat of us and the entire planet. Not taking responsibility for this planet makes us almost just as guilty as them. That's like witnessing a murder and doing absolutely nothing with the knowledge you have about it.

Even those who are not in the 'alternative' side, see the crimes being committed, how global problems are still here, how bad things have gotten, yet they do nothing, even though they are the majority. Most of them start to accept that this is just how things are.

Denying responsibility is almost equally bad. I wasn't comfortable with this, when I realized it, but I came to understand that it is in fact true. An inconvenient truth. Responsibility is a trait they value a lot more than us (some species even more than others), so you would understand why they would feel annoyed and/or disappointed to some point with us.

So why they might let certain things fly? So we can learn to react. And fix our own messes. They can't help about everything. That's like asking your teacher to do the exam for you. One way or another, we need to learn to take matters in our own hands, and learn to act!

You may think this is unlikely for somebody with good intentions - but I would trust less any species that puts itself in 'savior' status and offers to help with everything. This is a learning process we need to go through.

Probably the most unpopular opinion on the board, but I'll try to explain it away the best I can. I think we need another 9/11 event.

Yes, I said it, there you go. Have you looked at the positive results of that event? How many people starting asking questions, putting doubt where they never doubted before, many of them even joining this community? The event was not stopped - probably with a good reason.

The Fukushima disaster - another event not prevented. What happened? Many other disasters that were not covered outside the news media of the regions where they occurred inside the specific countries., started coming out on the open. So, apprently dealing with this type of energy is not as safe as it was thought , and by some, even guaranteed.

There was an international outcry against any more nuclear reactors being installed and considering shutting down those active at the moment. There hasn't been a consensus as of yet, but the skepticism and anti-nuclear campaigns are getting a larger voice now. One step closer to a safer environment.

A lot of people forget that these beings are expert calculators, and with their science they can predict events, and even being able to visually check the results before they occur - so they know the consequences of the events.

Another thing - a lot of these civilizations have went through problems similar in nature, or complexity, and through their own troubles and problems we may yet have to face one day, or may never face (considering our track record for solving problems of larger magnitude, I seriously hope we won't stumble upon on of them). Many of them have solved those problems ALONE, without any help from outside. If they can do it, so can we, even without their help (which is offered and in power since long time ago).

So I think leaving some problems open for us to solve, or some "negative" events to occur, that don't damage our survival as a species, is not a bad thing, since we will learn how to adapt, and better our understanding about certain things, as well as get better at problem-solving.

I dunno, I hope you understand my point, and why I said these things the way I said them. If you think this is not something characteristic for well-intentioned beings, I can't help that. I sure hope that at least in your own sense of morality, you at least are able to weigh them out as "evil" and "lesser evil".

All I'm saying is - our extinction will never occur as long as they are able to do something about that. Too much time, energy and resources has been invested in this planet, and us too, to let either one die (whether is our planet and environment, or us). That's good enough for me, personally. In order to bring this even more to light I'll have to get into the subject of xenopsychology, and its a tricky subject, especially since a lot of people have a preconceived notions of how ETs are supposed to behave and think. It would get in the way of understanding, and it would require a separate discussion.

There's a point in time where the "I was not aware of it / I was manipulated" stops being an argument, and starts to become an excuse. And they are not big fans of excuses, believe me. There is enough supporting material to bring to light the reality or various ill truths and "conspiracies", but the majority dismiss it, mock it or just accept it as "things just are the way they are". The latter most of which - is something they dislike the most. Accepting the role of a victim. How many of you know what you know, and you still don't do anything about it? Why is that? You feel helpless? We go back to the victim role.

I think its my fault for not making a clear distinction between us and those on top, but like I said before, we are all guilty, its just a matter of more or less.

When I said stupidity I meant things like "accepting the orchestrated reality the way it is, passively", "going along with the trends", "borrowing the ideals of politicians as your own", "cloning the values of the wrong people and forward them to others", "denying the orchestrated reality to feel more comfortable" etc.

I myself find this stupid - they have never used that specific term. I find it very dumb way to deal with things from our side. And I'm becoming more frustrated as time goes by because this international 'alternative' group of thinkers is way too passive. They just think this is an ..., well, I'll go ahead and use the term they used - "obstacle". I find this an understatement myself - I think its not an obstacle, its our downfall, waiting to happen. This way of thinking, that I described above.

Yes, we have survived this long. We went through a lot of BS as a species. But we don't deserve a medal, no. We are still in the same deep mess we were hundreds of years ago, only we are now aware of it, but do nothing about it other than chatter.

Some of them do deserve a medal, for solving the problems they faced with no external help whatsoever. We are far from earning a badge, let alone a medal.

I'm sorry if you feel this way about those I contact, but I can't help that, and I think truly well-intentioned beings wont help with everything but let you figure out how to solve your problems without actually them solving the problems for you.


I have no issues with anything else you've stated in this last post, but I do take issue to this:

This doesn't sound to me at all like the attitude that benevolent ETs/EDs would take, given that they are probably much more aware than most of us are of how humankind on this planet has been used and abused by many hostile alien races who have made insane puppets of our so-called leaders, so that besides the ages long tradition of warring, raping and plundering, we now have brain numbing technologies from cell phones to HAARP, toxic, gene-altering threats from nuclear weaponry to GMOs, deliberate planet wide programs of mass genocide such as chemtrails and vaccines, and on and on and on.
It seems clear that it is a minority of humans who have sold their souls and sold out the rest of us.
You make no distinction there, however.
You say your ET friends think humankind is stupid? Is it any wonder we are stupid? It's a freaking miracle we can still function at all!
I'd say we deserve medals just for surviving as long as we have without going completely bonkers.
Your ET friends don't sound so benevolent to me.

Why dig Billy Meier? When credibility is down to zero?



I was having an extensive e-mail dialogue with a woman claiming to be chanelling the Plieadians. (For the record, I dig Billy Meier, but the beings this woman was chanelling were not the same folks in my opinion.)

Why dig human ETs but not 'reptoid' ones?

The 'reptoid' looking ones are percentage wise a lot more plausible than the human looking ones.


When we disagreed on a few key points, I suggested we agree to disagree and move on, but she became fixated and wrote me incredibly long e-mails to support her points that were mute as far as I was concerned.(That there was a battle going on between angelic aliens(pleiadians) and satanic aliens (reptilians).) And that isn't why I'm mentioning it.
I personally don't buy the whole reptilian thing, but that is neither here nor there.

Selene
6th February 2012, 18:02
Your post (above) is one of the best and sanest I've read here in years, OnyxKnight. Absolutely spot on.

(And I must add that it's among many very, very thoughtful and articulate posts contributed by many wonderful people here!)

Write on, my friend.

Cheers,

Selene

Tarka the Duck
6th February 2012, 18:28
9eagle9 - I have to say a huge thank you for your sanity in the post above (nos 75 and 79).
I have been feeling increasingly marginalised and out of step here recently.
Kathie

PS I wonder...would this discussion warrant its own thread?

TargeT
6th February 2012, 19:01
Should I be suprised that someone would 'think' its an attack, when its the genuine article that is saying, "You are not perverting and corrupting me anymore."



so now I can twist this into an ego boost by saying "see, I've never been attacked I must be right!"


you know this whole thing reminds me of the sociopath thread on atticus1; I see the definition matching me because its how we were raised.. we (broad use of "we") are all sociopaths to one degree or another; the only separating factor is exactly HOW selfish you are... my recent foray into the "single world" has really brought this lesson home for me, what a weird dance THAT is!

I also find it funny that "charles" is held up as an example, all there was surrounding him was ego flares, confusion & hurt feelings.. Drama abounds! (not saying that I am for / against him but the absolute categorization I see is astounding... past projected on the present at its best) I've asked REPEATEDLY on this forum to be told otherwise; the "truth" of the situation... best I got was some retarded mp3 that was (IMO) taken out of context in regards to P.A...

/sigh

As I have no discernible "psychic" experience in my life (other than some mild/questionable intuition moments that benefited me, though I still would be hesitant to categorize them as anything) I often wonder at the seemingly large number that not only DO have these experiences, but profess to be "psychic" & experience attacks etc, is this just another avenue for internal conflicts to "get out"; since the belief that it is possible allows for this type of expression (belief being key).

if that's the case I'm glad with my lack of "gifts".


so bill, charles & alien agenda... do any of these topics even really matter? the first two are action less grandstanders (IMO) & the alien agenda has even LESS substance to it; I see these as interesting expressions that are probably fractal relevant (though I have difficulty separating circumstance from pure back story; so I don't see an architype right now..)


Probably the most unpopular opinion on the board, but I'll try to explain it away the best I can. I think we need another 9/11 event.

Yes, I said it, there you go. Have you looked at the positive results of that event? How many people starting asking questions, putting doubt where they never doubted before, many of them even joining this community? The event was not stopped - probably with a good reason.



Humans are mostly water, and water always seeks the easy path down hill, the path of least resistance.

this will not change with out a prompt, it CAN BE INTELECTUAL... but that requires a concentrated effort to re-educate the GLOBE... it can also be done through force & blatant actions like 9/11 but as a whole, that was far more evil than not..

I do not think 9/11 was what "awoken people" I think people were already started on this path & they simply saw through the same old tricks that have been used countless times on us before.

I do NOT think another 9/11 type event will do much to increase this unless its TERRIBLY botched (the sinking of the USS Enterprise would probably be a good example if it happens).

I won't profess to know the outcome of all of this, but I don't see the alternative community growing exponentially (like it should be were this world coming to a more "enlightened" state).

what if the Rapture is a good allegory for what is happening right now,,, only a few will be saved, perhaps the rest need more life lessons, more incarnation… who’s to say if this is good, bad, or just how it is suppose to be?

Godiam
6th February 2012, 19:37
Let's not start giving a rat's ass what people on Nexus think about anything. That's just a huge waste of time. May as well start caring what people at ABTS think. Don't even worry about it.


:focus:

Everyone is but a reflection of ourselves, another aspect of divinity, But that is what we get in a world of duality!

Sad, Really

HUGS......Godiam

Selene
6th February 2012, 19:44
Thank you 9Eagle9 for your superb comments as well. I’m sorry I somehow missed reading them first time, so thank you Tarka for pointing them out (posts # 75 & 79).

Indeed, any sense of “I’m under attack…” comes from within. Everything you see outside of yourself is a reflection of that within. But, of course, that’s exactly 9Eagle’s point. We are fortunate to have you here to elucidate this so nicely and so patiently.

Yeah, we’ve got a lot of spiritual newbies here. Many, many spiritually hungry souls have come to Avalon – and other websites - looking for something real, something true, simply because they have no other resource. Orthodox religions have failed them; they have become seekers by default, not from choice.

And when you are very thirsty, you will drink even from a muddy stream. That’s my take on the channeling phenomenon – it feeds the hungry, even very badly, until they can move on to better answers. It serves a purpose, albeit a limited one. You eventually outgrow it.

A lot of people were undoubtedly very surprised and disappointed by the latest GFL/Steven Beckow kerfuffel. That’s part of learning discernment, isn’t it, even if more experienced members shook their heads and walked quietly away at the outset. At least, no one was seriously harmed, I hope. Bruised egos will heal.

Thank you again, 9Eagle9, for all that you do. You are one very sane lady. And to the OP and other contributors to this thread, thanks as well for making this one of the more thoughtful and interesting discussions here.

Cheers,

Selene

9eagle9
6th February 2012, 19:58
Tegra it's not about being right even if you are right (chuckle) . We are making it about being right or wrong instead of just being. It's only about the truth. Is your message being attacked or are you being attacked? You said it yourself you don't get attacked because you are man and have a scar on your face....lol.

Seriously though, No one ever argues with my content they start slinging at me the voice. The messenger. They can't argue with the truth so they think they can do something to me. They can't do anything to me. No one has ever dissected what I say or found a convinincing argument against it. So they attack me. You can attack a bearer of the truth but you can't do anything to the truth. Are you right. Not about right or wrong it's about the truth. Are you standing in the truth. If you become part of the truth, integrate yourself in that truth energy they can't do anything to you ..can they? And that is where I observe you.

And if its' the truth their pissed off about why should I let them attack me? Why should I take the heat for how the truth made them feel? Neither should you, so you can know 'real' feel good , real peace by knowing you are standing in the truth. The truth is a peace breaker, but its only going break an artifical dream peace. If what I am saying isn't upsetting you than chances are you just seeing the same truth. People who hate the truth will attack you. People who are scared of it....? They won't come anywhere near you.

What did Bill Wood do to me? Nothing. Absolute lack of interest in the whole matter on this end. If he was making me 'feel good--right" I'd be interested. If he was making me feel bad-wrong- Id' be interested. He's done neither so I have complete total lack of interest in the matter.

The whole Charles thing. What did he do to me?

Nothing.

What COULD he do to me other than say something that would either make me feel good or bad? He' not lurking outside me door and jumping out of the bushes. Did he burn my house down? No. Did he DO anything? No. Did he give me a carton of ice cream or a new pony. No, didn't Do anything good, bad, or indifferent to me. Some people have said he makes them feel good. Okay good. Those same people don't get angry at me beause he didn't do anything to me understanding that we are all related (another perverted catchphrase) meaning how we interact in relatives terms to each other. Because Charles didn't make me 'feel' good , doesn't automatically allow me to say he's evil. By the same token because he didn't make me feel bad, I can't make something out of him other than what he is. I put him back into proper perspective.

Why I am not on the against Charles or For Charles platform waiting for the doom or desire to be realized.

I seen what he was doing to other people. Because they allowed it. They thought the next God was coming or they thought he was the original creeping evil, but he didn't do anything to me. He didn't harm me and he didn't 'save' me. He never said he was either one. I was only able to observe that because I struggled to keep my feelings out of it.

What do I have to get my knickers in a fuss about for?

To make someone else feel good? No I'm not pushing the needle in.

To make them feel justifiied in their feelings?. Nope not gonna create a safe space for their dream.

Has nothing to do with feelings, has everything to do with the truth.







Should I be suprised that someone would 'think' its an attack, when its the genuine article that is saying, "You are not perverting and corrupting me anymore."



so now I can twist this into an ego boost by saying "see, I've never been attacked I must be right!"


you know this whole thing reminds me of the sociopath thread on atticus1; I see the definition matching me because its how we were raised.. we (broad use of "we") are all sociopaths to one degree or another; the only separating factor is exactly HOW selfish you are... my recent foray into the "single world" has really brought this lesson home for me, what a weird dance THAT is!

I also find it funny that "charles" is held up as an example, all there was surrounding him was ego flares, confusion & hurt feelings.. Drama abounds! (not saying that I am for / against him but the absolute categorization I see is astounding... past projected on the present at its best) I've asked REPEATEDLY on this forum to be told otherwise; the "truth" of the situation... best I got was some retarded mp3 that was (IMO) taken out of context in regards to P.A...

/sigh

As I have no discernible "psychic" experience in my life (other than some mild/questionable intuition moments that benefited me, though I still would be hesitant to categorize them as anything) I often wonder at the seemingly large number that not only DO have these experiences, but profess to be "psychic" & experience attacks etc, is this just another avenue for internal conflicts to "get out"; since the belief that it is possible allows for this type of expression (belief being key).

if that's the case I'm glad with my lack of "gifts".


so bill, charles & alien agenda... do any of these topics even really matter? the first two are action less grandstanders (IMO) & the alien agenda has even LESS substance to it; I see these as interesting expressions that are probably fractal relevant (though I have difficulty separating circumstance from pure back story; so I don't see an architype right now..)


Probably the most unpopular opinion on the board, but I'll try to explain it away the best I can. I think we need another 9/11 event.

Yes, I said it, there you go. Have you looked at the positive results of that event? How many people starting asking questions, putting doubt where they never doubted before, many of them even joining this community? The event was not stopped - probably with a good reason.



Humans are mostly water, and water always seeks the easy path down hill, the path of least resistance.

this will not change with out a prompt, it CAN BE INTELECTUAL... but that requires a concentrated effort to re-educate the GLOBE... it can also be done through force & blatant actions like 9/11 but as a whole, that was far more evil than not..

I do not think 9/11 was what "awoken people" I think people were already started on this path & they simply saw through the same old tricks that have been used countless times on us before.

I do NOT think another 9/11 type event will do much to increase this unless its TERRIBLY botched (the sinking of the USS Enterprise would probably be a good example if it happens).

I won't profess to know the outcome of all of this, but I don't see the alternative community growing exponentially (like it should be were this world coming to a more "enlightened" state).

what if the Rapture is a good allegory for what is happening right now,,, only a few will be saved, perhaps the rest need more life lessons, more incarnation… who’s to say if this is good, bad, or just how it is suppose to be?

Borden
6th February 2012, 20:22
I'm starting to feel strongly that anything coming in a package we recognize is most likely phony.

I think if a real whistleblower stepped onto the stage many people here (no offense intended to anyone, this could easily include me) would frown and say, "well that doesn't sound very familiar ... what's he/she on about?" I think the secrets of this world - if revealed - would not conform to comic book standards, and would not hit all the familiar plot spots. I also think this has happened, and that those people emerged, had a say, and then sloped off the radar because their information just wasn't tasty enough for an audience that needs Stargates, greys, timelines, super-soldiers, etc. The only super-soldier I'm entertained by is Captain America! (And I say that as a limey!)

I listen to all of them. Well, I did. I lapped it all up, hungrily, but I still had my skeptical hat half on, and now I feel jaded at the whole business, and when I see some sensational new 'whistleblower' I click on the link with decreasing enthusiasm. I love 9eagle9's brilliant motto: "I don't have to believe everything I think", and it's stuck with me. It's now become one of my mottoes actually. I'm not some horrid little Randi type of person at all, and it galls me that I may have appeared to be so in some threads on this forum. It's my own fault I'm sure, because I tend to read a lot, and not post until something makes me angry enough, haha. I'm trying to be more positive in that sense. Whatever esteem in which I hold many of Kerry Cassidy's interviews, I love that in her shows she has John Lennon singing "all I want is the truth now". Me too.

9eagle9 ... thank you for those two brilliant and passionate posts. I agree with you so strongly, and the love and light brigade very often seem to me to be disingenuous, and when push comes to shove, very nasty beneath that thin and cheap veneer of beatitude. However, I think some of these people (in my opinion a minority) who use that sort of language are actually very lovely. It's not their fault they're in with a bad crowd. I take your point totally, and a recent skirmish in another thread really showed me the truly idiot malice often lurking beneath such pretensions. Hilariously so actually. But then I was quite floored by a completely different interaction I had, a private one. From someone I might have previously suspected (not strongly or anything, and actually probably more in a somewhat ignorant way of lumping in subconsciously because of forgotten previous posts, you know how it goes) to be of similar bent. Very nice and touching to be wrong sometimes.

Winston, if your thread title wasn't a gently humorous one ... I think we're actually stuffed. Look at us. Bill whatsisname and other disappointments make us look like credulous fools here, and I don't want us to be credulous fools here. Whether anyone likes it or not, there are credulous fools here and I'll just have to live with that. But even those credulous fools, even if they show their idiot malice at the drop of a disagreement ... they are at the very least attempting to disengage from the zombie sleep that paralyzes the greater part of our species. Yes, I know, they can so easily drift into another type of zombie sleep, but that's because they cared enough in the first place to want to see things differently, whatever their short-comings. This world is full of traps, and those who truly feel are very vulnerable to those various traps. God but they infuriate me, haha ... but as I've said elsewhere on this forum, I'd rather be stuck on a desert island with them than a bunch of reductionist, mainstream breadheads.

Borden.

Holy guacamole ... what an idiot I am. I got this thread confused with another one! Sorry S-L ... subjects are appearing to converge lately! How embarrassing. And here was I criticizing people who don't think clearly!

onawah
6th February 2012, 20:54
I'm sorry if you feel this way about those I contact, but I can't help that, and I think truly well-intentioned beings wont help with everything but let you figure out how to solve your problems without actually them solving the problems for you.

I don't know a single thing about the beings you contact, or whether you actually contact anyone at all, as all we have here to go on is your word about that.

Nor do I think that ETs/EDs should solve all our problems for us.
It's obvious we humans have a lot to learn and a lot to do.
But the first step in solving the problems is learning.
Stupidity is not the same thing as ignorance.

For me, the equation is quite simple.
In this school of planet Earth, we have had too many manipulators and controllers who have skillfully trained most of humankind to be their minions.
They have been manipulated, DNA has been tampered with for the purpose of dumbing down, they have beenbrainwashed , poisoned, scared out of their wits and beaten with every conceivable method into being willing, good slaves with little knowledge of their real potential or worth, and little hope for any escape for themselves or this planet.
Had we had more good, caring teachers who had taught us about our worth, helped us find the tools to live together harmoniously with Nature and each other on this beautiful planet, then our present state would be much different.
When you beat, enslave, torture, brainwash, poison, frighten children, what kind of results do you get?
Strong, enlightened, caring, intelligent, healthy champions?
Or beaten, hopeless, ignorant, deluded victims who who have no idea how to solve the gargantuan problems that face them?

It's easy.
Such people need to be rehabilitated, not delivered to more centuries of living on a prison planet, victimizing each other they way they have been taught to do by their controllers.
Prisons don't work, never have, never will.
Rehabilitation works.

If the beings you are in contact actually exist, and they are not interested in being good teachers and helping to rehabilitate this planet, then perhaps they should just step aside and allow those who do want to.
I am pretty sure there are some of those caliber out there, and those are the ones we need to be here.

Personally, I've had enough "tough love" and axe-grinding.
Though I agree Avalon has certainly been very slim on solutions and inspirational, ground breaking news of late.

And Borden, I think your post fits in quite well on this thread.
And I agree, I would make the same choice for my desert island companions as you.

9eagle9
6th February 2012, 21:26
I have to point this out and I think Tarka is correct we need our own thread on this. I was nudged over the weekend to start a post like this. And spirit said, Not necessary someone will open the door for you. And that is other spirits. You, Tarka whomever is feel that something is wrong but can't quite put their finger on it because we are 'seeing' it, being aware and awakened to it in a new way. That is spirit opening the door. We are just not quite knowing what we are seeing. That is why it feels new.

And that is the only difference between us. When we start to come out of the dream we see things for how they really are and we are sometimes not sure what we are seeing but....we KNOW we are seeing something that is error. We are used to the dream and now we only have to learn to see things a new way as reality becomes plainer. There is always something in the dream that reflects reality so I just show reality to people in ways that they are used to seeing it when they were in their dream.

One of the greatest lies told to us is we need to spirutally develop or we are new at this. We do not. None of us do.

Most of what we are offered as spiritual development is coming from outside of us. See this guru, read this book, do this, do that. If you see a hypnotist that is willing to do this, get your consciousness behind and beyond all these lies.... something is going to happen. And then when you are required to do nothing but just be in that space....you will know your SELF.


You came into this world exactly as I am. You and I have the same power in equal measure--infinite. We all came into the world with equal amount of spirit.. Unless we are outright sociopaths with no connect with spirit at all and the inablity to do so. Entities in human form but are not human. if you see my power and don't flinch from it...you are seeing own and not flinching from it. You may not be using it to capacity yet....but you are knowing it.

You came into this world just like and me everyone else. You came in here as spirit and flesh. More spirit than flesh, flesh is incidental just a means for spirit to express its' self here. We say we have to become more spiritual but no one ever says "I have to become more physical and grow another head or arm." Expand on physicality ...so why would have to expand our spirituality. Its as big as it every going to be right now same as it has always been--infinite and unlimited.

We're a tap on the faucet of spirit. You have the same unlimited potential of spirit as I and the next poster. We have been slowly enchanted away from that when all we have to do is find is go inside and remove what is blocking the tap -the pipe and the portal-....which is the enchantment. The dream becomes more real than the life because the living spirit is blocked by the very dreams that claim to represent it but it IS there. You are not new at this, no more than I am. We were only told we were.

Ask any Native American who uses the pipe in sacred cermoney. There will be five in ceremoney drawing on the pipe and thousand people Oh that's great look at them smoking the pipe and then turn around tell someone else that smoking is bad for them. What the pipe really means is connceting with spirit. And people think in their lie and their dream it's 'smoking'....lol.

I have had the same lies told to me.

Spiritual development really means some people have been less effected by the lies. or finally quit accepting them. Really has nothing to do with spirit other than we stopped accepting the lie and began accept our spirit.

I see this with people who think they 'know more than me' but when the truth can't be shifted they collapse and say WELL you have to excuse me I'm not as spiritually advanced as you.'

How can they 'know' more than me but be less spiritually advanced . That is crazy making ****. It's their excuse to hold on to the dream or the lies. Because they do not yet know what is on the other side of them. They have no common frame of reference. The roles that they play in the dream are not very well educated.

Then people starting using that lie that was imposed on them which is abuse to excuse themselves to keep perpetrating more lies against themselves, further corrupting themselves from spirit.

The only problem we have ....is that spirit has been misrepresented by the gurus. As if they knew your spirit when they do not know their own.

Spirit breaks down what is blocking it. Which is the dream. If people believe the dream more than they know their own unlimited spirit. They hurt. Breaking down something we are attached to hurts.

I just got of a healing session. As I use my living spirit to push out that dense 'lie' energy , pain is felt. The pain of the lie of when it was perpetrated. Pain is the dense energy and when you start moving it out of person's body pain is felt, then you make this space where the pain was and invite spirit's energy to fill it. the pain is brief though, a moment to a couple minutes, and then spirit comes in. To fill what me and recipient have facilitated together --creating a space. It's no different than taking out boxes of trash from a room so flowers, and pretty things can have space to flow in there. In the dream we've made healing all mystical but it is as simple as that. Those are healers that want to heal within the lie, repair the lie.

Spirit doesn't need to be developed its not old, its not new, it just needs a space to come into.

What we seein recently, the 'shift' are people creating a space for spirit--love, wisdom, truth, namaste--and other people who have no idea what their spirit is 'Trying' to push that dream back in to that space and we're saying No , you cannot push your lies here in the truth. The truth will not allow it. That is SPIRIT working, whenever you refuse to accept these lies. When you refuse a lie against yourself , whether it is a good lie or a bad lie , when you refuse a bad sounding lie or a 'feel good' lie that is your living spirit at work. No matter how nice that lie sounds its nothing compared to what spirit has.

Don't you know I'd LOVE to believe some of these lies out there but I can't..its a lie. I don't believe it anymore than when my empty says "you can't pay the rent this month."

We are noticing awakenign to the fact that the liars are getting angry because we're really looking at what we are seeing and talking about it. That's all we are doing is examinng the lie. And people are angry that we are 'just' looking at them. Why? As we if we do not have any right to examine the lies perpetrated on us.


Thank you 9Eagle9 for your superb comments as well. I’m sorry I somehow missed reading them first time, so thank you Tarka for pointing them out (posts # 75 & 79).

Indeed, any sense of “I’m under attack…” comes from within. Everything you see outside of yourself is a reflection of that within. But, of course, that’s exactly 9Eagle’s point. We are fortunate to have you here to elucidate this so nicely and so patiently.

Yeah, we’ve got a lot of spiritual newbies here. Many, many spiritually hungry souls have come to Avalon – and other websites - looking for something real, something true, simply because they have no other resource. Orthodox religions have failed them; they have become seekers by default, not from choice.

And when you are very thirsty, you will drink even from a muddy stream. That’s my take on the channeling phenomenon – it feeds the hungry, even very badly, until they can move on to better answers. It serves a purpose, albeit a limited one. You eventually outgrow it.

A lot of people were undoubtedly very surprised and disappointed by the latest GFL/Steven Beckow kerfuffel. That’s part of learning discernment, isn’t it, even if more experienced members shook their heads and walked quietly away at the outset. At least, no one was seriously harmed, I hope. Bruised egos will heal.

Thank you again, 9Eagle9, for all that you do. You are one very sane lady. And to the OP and other contributors to this thread, thanks as well for making this one of the more thoughtful and interesting discussions here.

Cheers,

Selene

OnyxKnight
6th February 2012, 21:45
True, and you sort of criticize beings you don't know.

I never said they are not good teachers - that's what you said about them. They've helped enough as it is, behind the scenes. But I feel I'm done speaking in their name and defending their actions, or lack there of. They've done much in helping us so far in my opinion, that to ask for more is just plain selfish I think.

And like I said before, that whole "we have it rough / we are manipulated / We were not aware" starts to become a very annoying excuse.

I don't want my instructor to pass my driving test for me. Same, I don't want them to solve our problems here on Earth - we need to. And instead of asking for more help from them (which is something what you seem to be hinting on behind your lines), you, and others, need to get around and start discussing solutions to these problems.

I'm tired of all the whining about how bad things are, and how hard would be to fix things, and how we all need for them to come down and fix things.




I don't know a single thing about the beings you contact, or whether you actually contact anyone at all, as all we have here to go on is your word about that.

Nor do I think that ETs/EDs should solve all our problems for us.
It's obvious we humans have a lot to learn and a lot to do.
But the first step in solving the problems is learning.
Stupidity is not the same thing as ignorance.

For me, the equation is quite simple.
In this school of planet Earth, we have had too many manipulators and controllers who have skillfully trained most of humankind to be their minions.
They have been manipulated, DNA has been tampered with for the purpose of dumbing down, they have beenbrainwashed , poisoned, scared out of their wits and beaten with every conceivable method into being willing, good slaves with little knowledge of their real potential or worth, and little hope for any escape for themselves or this planet.
Had we had more good, caring teachers who had taught us about our worth, helped us find the tools to live together harmoniously with Nature and each other on this beautiful planet, then our present state would be much different.
When you beat, enslave, torture, brainwash, poison, frighten children, what kind of results do you get?
Strong, enlightened, caring, intelligent, healthy champions?
Or beaten, hopeless, ignorant, deluded victims who who have no idea how to solve the gargantuan problems that face them?

It's easy.
Such people need to be rehabilitated, not delivered to more centuries of living on a prison planet, victimizing each other they way they have been taught to do by their controllers.
Prisons don't work, never have, never will.
Rehabilitation works.

If the beings you are in contact actually exist, and they are not interested in being good teachers and helping to rehabilitate this planet, then perhaps they should just step aside and allow those who do want to.
I am pretty sure there are some of those caliber out there, and those are the ones we need to be here.

Personally, I've had enough "tough love" and axe-grinding.
Though I agree Avalon has certainly been very slim on solutions and inspirational, ground breaking news of late.

And Borden, I think your post fits in quite well on this thread.
And I agree, I would make the same choice for my desert island companions as you.

Borden
6th February 2012, 21:54
9eagle9,

I think you should start a separate thread. I'm sure S-L will be one of the intelligent people here who contributes to it, and although I reckon what you say fits in perfectly well here, it probably warrants its own thread, merely so that people who see the title may join in. This has been an interesting thread and hopefully will continue to be so, but I think you've got some things to get off your chest. You certainly won't be alone.

Borden

9eagle9
6th February 2012, 22:10
I'll do that Borden. And if anyone else wants to express their 'irksome' becoming aware that is something is being corrupted by all means we'll create a space to talk about what we are seeing even if we are not quite knowing what we are seeing. we know something is not in alignment.

And know that for anyone who joins us in that space ....that you have every right do that. It is your divine right to look at perversion and corruption. The moment you do so, it no longer has a place to grow.

TargeT
6th February 2012, 22:16
It is your divine right to look at perversion and corruption. The moment you do so, it no longer has a place to grow.

Just be sure of your context when looking (and the context of what your looking at) as well as who gave you the definition of your words.. a perverse act to one is nothing to another etc... lots of blocks in that region as well to over come...

strive to be an iconoclast
:)

nothing is ever easy.. if it seems easy you better start questioning!

jaybee
6th February 2012, 22:26
I think if a real whistleblower stepped onto the stage many people here (no offense intended to anyone, this could easily include me) would frown and say, "well that doesn't sound very familiar ... what's he/she on about?"


Holy guacamole ... what an idiot I am. I got this thread confused with another one! Sorry S-L ... subjects are appearing to converge lately! How embarrassing. And here was I criticizing people who don't think clearly!

L O L


hey Borden.....here's a whistleblower for ya!......:p


DaRtoLp_adE

Cilka
6th February 2012, 22:40
SL would you seriously quit with your fear mongering? It's one thing to be skeptical, but seriously.

There's nothing fearful about the above! Accepting that perhaps the universe is a competitive environment is not fearful - it is realistic. It is cautious. It is being aware. Some of us are more trusting of Aliens and their agendas than we are of our next door neighbour. Do you see the problem here? Why should they have our trust? They are abducting thousands upon thousands of people.

What you call fear, I call critical thinking.
I do agree with you S-L. We all need to be extra vigilant these days. I personally do not trust anyone or anything I hear until I take the time to think about what agenda I am being sold. I look at it this way. ET's are excellent marketers. Human marketers are constantly finding ways to sell us all kinds of products, if one way does not get us to buy the product, then they will find another way to get the rest of us to buy it, or at least consider buying it. The ET's are also constantly finding ways to sell us 'their lies'. ET's are incredibly creative beings, just think about all the lies that we have been told. If the lie of ascending to a higher dimension does not work for all, then they find another way to get those people, especially those who are becoming aware of these different types of lies. How about getting a mother earth loving guru who will be more likely to attract the human tree huggers, maybe that would work for some humans. How about getting an angel loving guru out into the public who will be more likely to attract the angel seeking humans. And the list goes on and on and on. And it seems that the ET's never run out of ideas, their thinking abilities are limitless. And because of our primitive nature as humans, we fall for the lies, over and over again. Humans are constant seekers of pleasure, if it feels good emotionally or physically, then they will go for it, no matter what it is that is being offerend. Ascension to higher dimension, money, power, sex, communicating with beings from other dimensions, freedom from this enslavery etc. We are like little children stuck in adult bodies who are unable to grow up. We don't need anyone telling us what will be or what we should do, we are capable of making our own decisions. When will we get our planet back?

9eagle9
6th February 2012, 23:43
To answer your question Tegra. Anytime you use something other than for its intended purpose for one's own self gratification, one is perverting it. If you use a bicycle as a ramp to send our bad ass black Ford hurling into the air do you think possibly the bicycle may be too damaged to be used from that point on for it's intended purpose? You have to fix the bicycle.

The ptb has used us, sacred beings, for their own gratification. They are stealing our idenity to serve themselves. We know have to fix our own bikes. If you run over my bike with your bad Ford....in order for it to fucntion in the purpose it was created I have to fix. I won't be able to fix it if I deny that you and your Ford ran over it...lol.

And we are perpetrating this corruption and pervision in ways that 'are legion' by using things other than the purpose they were intended for.

This is what Tegra expressed : As I have no discernible "psychic" experience in my life (other than some mild/questionable intuition moments that benefited me, though I still would be hesitant to categorize them as anything) I often wonder at the seemingly large number that not only DO have these experiences, but profess to be "psychic" & experience attacks etc, is this just another avenue for internal conflicts to "get out"; since the belief that it is possible allows for this type of expression (belief being key).

But you have discernible psychic experience, I've seen you doing it in here. What we are doing right now by examining perversion is psychic. We start looking at what is projecting the lies we are going right into the ......

......................Psyche...................... ..... why are we doing that, what is the mechanims in us that cause that...etc

Psychic. The words says it all. A psychic is someone who adept at the inner workings of the psyche. The psyche is where the dream, the lies, the illusions are projected from. And imposed on. If somone lies to your hand , do you think it will effect you. If they lie to yoru psyche and you believe it....it may very well affect you. If you have expeience and knowledge of the psyche and see the behaviors it manifests...you're a psychic. How do we that. Become aware of what we are observing.

We were TOLD (lied to) that it was someone one who knew everything or could predict the future.

If you are good at knowing what the psyche is up to, how hard is it to make a prediction about the future based on those patterns of how the psyche is operating? The dream is all about time, so of course it seems that a future prediction has been made. A person good at the psyche can know everything about how it works. Of course these people are sneered at as 'know it alls.'...lol. A psychic can make a prediction because the dream has been recycled over and over. It's not hard at all--- your working within a constantly recycleing dream, constantly recycled patterns of behavior that all conclude in the same way. Its it hard to predict that you put your bad black Ford in drive, and it starts creeping forward/

No. No one knows their psychic ability because its been presented as something else, a false standard has been intiated, and I see marevelously talented psychics all the time that have no idea they are.

How hard is it for you to see someone getting behind the wheel drunk day in and day out until you one day your entire expectation about them came true. They were going to hurt themselves. Not hard was it. Not mystical, not air faery.

Who made psychism this mystical thing? The media and other people who 'thought' they knew what it meant when the word psychic pretty much sums it all up. They sensationalized psychic, corrupted it . So even if you have this ability you have false standard to compare it to. You wouldn't even know it for the lies told about it.

I'm a psychic . I see what is going on in people's psyches, the dream projector and because the dreams the illusions are recycled over and over I can make a prediction based on what is going to happen because I've seen it happen ten thousand times before.

Sounds boring? Yes. that's why it had to be sensationalized and perverted and corrupted. To sound more 'feel goody'.

I predict a hundred people who fancy themselves as great psychics , because being special makes them feel good, because they bought the lie, will get in an uproar now that I have made it more accessible for everyone. A 'real' psychic feels no more speical than the person who has watched the same movie over and over again and knows how it's going to end.

They are saying A psychic is different from everyone else--" they are speical they has some special insight into things".

As a psychic , I know this. I'm just saying you are a psychic, you are not in the least different from me in that respect, once you start having a clue to how people's psyches are working and see the wheel go round and round again, you've become a psychic. Aware of the workings of the dream projector. I SEE you doing this Tegra.

You are no different than me.

course its boring as hell as to describe it that way. I'm a great psychic, but I've been blacklisted from all media because I'm not supporting how the corruption of psychism has been perpetrated. I'd just bore everyone to death...lol. not good for ratings, not good for money, or a tv series...



It is your divine right to look at perversion and corruption. The moment you do so, it no longer has a place to grow.

Just be sure of your context when looking (and the context of what your looking at) as well as who gave you the definition of your words.. a perverse act to one is nothing to another etc... lots of blocks in that region as well to over come...

strive to be an iconoclast
:)

nothing is ever easy.. if it seems easy you better start questioning!

onawah
7th February 2012, 00:37
Deleted by OP

onawah
7th February 2012, 00:50
How can I criticize beings if I don't know whether they exist or not.
I never said you said "they" are not good teachers.
I didn't say "they" are not good teachers. Again, I don't know that "they" exist.
But as far as a method of teaching goes, if the method is having no direct contact with students and using anonymous spokespeople on forums such as this, whose credentials we know nothing about and who cannot prove if anything they say is true or not, then I think there is something left to be desired, yes.
And if "they" have been helping behind the scenes, I still have no way of knowing if "they" are here to help humanity, or if they just want the planet for themselves and so are willing to do a little clean up here and there.
But again, that is just an opinion about beings about whose existence I have no knowledge of.
I haven't asked for anything, I've merely expressed an opinion.
I find it annoying when people ask to be taken at their word and as authorities for sweeping claims that they have not proven.
There are plenty of people on the planet working on solutions.
You seem to think Project Avalon is representative of the entire planet.
This is just a forum; it's meant for discussion.
Though I agree there hasn't been much discussion here of late about solutions, which is too bad.
But I think that may be because people who have solutions just aren't being attracted here very much anymore.
And it's probably very unsafe to discuss real solutions on public forums, since TPTW are still quite capable of gutting such plans.
Lately, most of the discussion has been about issues of discernment and trust.
And I think these are big issues simply because we have been asked to take too much on faith.


True, and you sort of criticize beings you don't know.

I never said they are not good teachers - that's what you said about them. They've helped enough as it is, behind the scenes. But I feel I'm done speaking in their name and defending their actions, or lack there of. They've done much in helping us so far in my opinion, that to ask for more is just plain selfish I think.

And like I said before, that whole "we have it rough / we are manipulated / We were not aware" starts to become a very annoying excuse.

I don't want my instructor to pass my driving test for me. Same, I don't want them to solve our problems here on Earth - we need to. And instead of asking for more help from them (which is something what you seem to be hinting on behind your lines), you, and others, need to get around and start discussing solutions to these problems.

I'm tired of all the whining about how bad things are, and how hard would be to fix things, and how we all need for them to come down and fix things.




I don't know a single thing about the beings you contact, or whether you actually contact anyone at all, as all we have here to go on is your word about that.

Nor do I think that ETs/EDs should solve all our problems for us.
It's obvious we humans have a lot to learn and a lot to do.
But the first step in solving the problems is learning.
Stupidity is not the same thing as ignorance.

For me, the equation is quite simple.
In this school of planet Earth, we have had too many manipulators and controllers who have skillfully trained most of humankind to be their minions.
They have been manipulated, DNA has been tampered with for the purpose of dumbing down, they have beenbrainwashed , poisoned, scared out of their wits and beaten with every conceivable method into being willing, good slaves with little knowledge of their real potential or worth, and little hope for any escape for themselves or this planet.
Had we had more good, caring teachers who had taught us about our worth, helped us find the tools to live together harmoniously with Nature and each other on this beautiful planet, then our present state would be much different.
When you beat, enslave, torture, brainwash, poison, frighten children, what kind of results do you get?
Strong, enlightened, caring, intelligent, healthy champions?
Or beaten, hopeless, ignorant, deluded victims who who have no idea how to solve the gargantuan problems that face them?

It's easy.
Such people need to be rehabilitated, not delivered to more centuries of living on a prison planet, victimizing each other they way they have been taught to do by their controllers.
Prisons don't work, never have, never will.
Rehabilitation works.

If the beings you are in contact actually exist, and they are not interested in being good teachers and helping to rehabilitate this planet, then perhaps they should just step aside and allow those who do want to.
I am pretty sure there are some of those caliber out there, and those are the ones we need to be here.

Personally, I've had enough "tough love" and axe-grinding.
Though I agree Avalon has certainly been very slim on solutions and inspirational, ground breaking news of late.

And Borden, I think your post fits in quite well on this thread.
And I agree, I would make the same choice for my desert island companions as you.

Flash
7th February 2012, 03:44
I'm tired of all the whining about how bad things are, and how hard would be to fix things, and how we all need for them to come down and fix things.



Wait that you are fifty years old or more. With an infinite patience, you will be looking at a younger humanity in its teenager's crisis wanting everything, and you will be tired of it. But teenager hood had to go that way.

My thinking: we need to live up to 250 years old to be able to have enough adult time to be able to implement real change. And yet, I am not sure we would be wise enough.

9eagle9
7th February 2012, 05:16
Reality (divinity) is reflected into the dream. Ifinity mirrors.

Ever watch Lord of the Rings. There is so much reality in that 'story' I'm suprised its not censored. Well if people are not aware of their seeing i guess they'd not have to censor it.

Aragorn is us. So we have Lord Elrond riding Aragorns ass saying, become who you are.

Aragorn. NO. I'm afraid of what is inside of me. The same weakness , I'm scared, I can't, I'm "just a ranger'.

Boromeir "Yay yah he's just a Ranger. We don't need no King."

Arwen: What are you afraid of. YOU ARE WHO YOU ARE. It's not like just because your afraid of it , who you are will go away.

Aragorn. No, I'll pretend to be a Ranger.

The Audience: Aragorn, would you just pick up the ****ing broken sword it is just a reflection of your fragmentation, it is not YOU.

Then Aragorn realizing that the only way to save purity, what was real and eternal (Arwen) ahd to become who he really was inside. Meanwhile some busy body fear mongering 'you don't care about my feelings' elf lord had the fragmented sword reforged (re-integrated) and managed to slide it over to Aragorn so he could become who he really was.

Mean old fear mongering Elrond he did that to hurt Aragorn's Feelings!




Let's not start giving a rat's ass what people on Nexus think about anything. That's just a huge waste of time. May as well start caring what people at ABTS think. Don't even worry about it.


:focus:

Everyone is but a reflection of ourselves, another aspect of divinity, But that is what we get in a world of duality!

Sad, Really

HUGS......Godiam

Carmody
7th February 2012, 05:21
time for a monty python quote?

sffSw-et9UM

Or is this more appropriate?

qGFjrsfaatY

or is it this?

QI0RiqK3XJc

DNA
7th February 2012, 06:40
Wow 9eagle9 I can't say how much I agree with everything you say in post #75. I agree 100%. I find I take for granted that folks on a forum like this would have read and digested the tenents discusssed in the Celestine Prophecy, the drama types, and the charades folks perform for attention which is energy.
I find I am wrong again and again in this taking for granted.
I agree that people fall for these dramatic charades over and over again, and to be honest, it sickens me to the point of not wanting to participate here anymore.

If folks won't familiarize themselves with the concepts of energy and the cons folks perpetuate to gain it from others, I feel they can't truly understand spirituality.
I wish folks would admit they don't know something rather than assume things like it's all love and light,,,all the time, because it's not all love and light,,,,all the time.
Folks think you are either a pessimist or an optimist, and I find that hilarious, because both are forms of wishfull thinking, rather one should strive to be a pragmatist, and see things as they really are, rather than how you wish to see them.

Once again 9eagle9 you have shown what a pragmatist you are, and more than that, you have the balls to communicate your pragmatism.
Thank You

Carmody
7th February 2012, 06:41
apologies for the humour, which might be seen as a careless addition to this thread.

more along the lines of my real intent, would be this quote:


I maintain that Truth is a pathless land, and you cannot approach it by any path whatsoever, by any religion, by any sect. That is my point of view, and I adhere to that absolutely and unconditionally. Truth, being limitless, unconditioned, unapproachable by any path whatsoever, cannot be organized; nor should any organization be formed to lead or coerce people along any particular path. If you first understand that, then you will see how impossible it is to organize a belief. A belief is purely an individual matter, and you cannot and must not organize it. If you do, it becomes dead, crystallized; it becomes a creed, a sect, a religion, to be imposed on others.

This is what everyone throughout the world is attempting to do. Truth is narrowed down and made a plaything for those who are weak, for those who are only momentarily discontented. Truth cannot be brought down, rather the individual must make the effort to ascend to it. You cannot bring the mountain-top to the valley....

---Jiddu Krishnamurti, 1929

Truth is a Pathless Land (http://bernie.cncfamily.com/k_pathless.htm)

The point is that incarnation, as an experience, was designed that way -with full intent.

Collectively understand --individual path.


Or, the moment one tries to distill truth into a form that is simplified, it is hence bastardized by the conscious communication of inner truth and truth seeking. It slips into dogma and religion, and then becomes a weapon of entrainment that involves itself in the fears of the self and others. It is slowed into a human idealization of permanence and safety, which is a thing that it does not posess.

He further explains:

If an organization be created for this purpose, it becomes a crutch, a weakness, a bondage, and must cripple the individual, and prevent him from growing, from establishing his uniqueness, which lies in the discovery for himself of that absolute, unconditioned Truth.

Or, discern an untruth but you can't label truth. The moment one does, they halt their own advancement and slip into being stilled from further advancement. One will never hold truth, one will always seek it.

It is not a destination, it is a path. If one finds this alarming, then one has not grown past the state of human childhood. The point of realization is: that to seek..is to be. So one could be there..but not realize it.

Take words and thoughts into consideration, but do not own them, do not become them...flow into them, discern, and move on to the next.

Which I think that this forum is doing rather well at, don't you think?

Thus, those all important words: "Seek Detachment."

Anchor
7th February 2012, 06:46
@Carmody: That Krishnamurti speech is one of my favorite, profound, personally influential and most inspiring that I have ever read.

Its had some airplay on this forum (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?12377-Krishnamurti-Truth-Is-A-Pathless-Land), and its predecessor - and just about any other forum I am a member of :)

I recommend everyone reads the whole thing several times - it is really really good.

9eagle9
7th February 2012, 07:01
The truth is not approached its given when one gets in alignment. Is your truth different than mine? If it wasn't you'd be me.

Not so much what truth is....but confusing feelings for truth.


apologies for the humour, which might be seen as a careless addition to this thread.

more along the lines of my real intent, would be this quote:


I maintain that Truth is a pathless land, and you cannot approach it by any path whatsoever, by any religion, by any sect. That is my point of view, and I adhere to that absolutely and unconditionally. Truth, being limitless, unconditioned, unapproachable by any path whatsoever, cannot be organized; nor should any organization be formed to lead or coerce people along any particular path. If you first understand that, then you will see how impossible it is to organize a belief. A belief is purely an individual matter, and you cannot and must not organize it. If you do, it becomes dead, crystallized; it becomes a creed, a sect, a religion, to be imposed on others.

This is what everyone throughout the world is attempting to do. Truth is narrowed down and made a plaything for those who are weak, for those who are only momentarily discontented. Truth cannot be brought down, rather the individual must make the effort to ascend to it. You cannot bring the mountain-top to the valley....

---Jiddu Krishnamurti, 1929

Truth is a Pathless Land (http://bernie.cncfamily.com/k_pathless.htm)

The point is that incarnation, as an experience, was designed that way -with full intent.

Collectively understand --individual path.

DNA
7th February 2012, 07:05
Why dig Billy Meier? When credibility is down to zero?


I find that the folks who ussually have the biggest problem with Meier are folks who are selling a different story than he is. Or folks who profess to be contactees but don't have the evidence Meier has and as such feel threatened by it. I feel the preponderance of evidence in relation to the Meier case is enormously in his favor, further it has been testified by researchers such as Wendelle Stevens that the UK intelligence and the USA intelligence agencies gave immense attentions to Meier thus giving the claim of bait and switch being applied to some of Meier's proof being tampered with (such as photos) credibility in my opinion.



Why dig human ETs but not 'reptoid' ones?

The 'reptoid' looking ones are percentage wise a lot more plausible than the human looking ones.


First off, I have had some limited interactions with human aliens, as such for me they are real, where as I personally have never seen a reptillian, so I don't know for myself if they are legit or not.
Secondly, you are taking me a little out of context, in stating that I believe in human aliens and not reptillian ones.
What I stated was, I don't buy the whole reptillian agenda as far as human looking aliens being angelic and in a battle with evil reptillian aliens representing the demonic.
Aliens are neither angelic nor demonic in my opinion, they are just incarnating beings playing out karma as we ourselves are.

9eagle9
7th February 2012, 07:05
I should clarify. There is a certain truth of the dream mostly composed around 'patterns'. Not reality, not truth, just a sort of wave that repeats itself. You get out of the dream and its the pathless place.Anything goes then.

OnyxKnight
7th February 2012, 15:39
I find that the folks who ussually have the biggest problem with Meier are folks who are selling a different story than he is. Or folks who profess to be contactees but don't have the evidence Meier has and as such feel threatened by it. I feel the preponderance of evidence in relation to the Meier case is enormously in his favor, further it has been testified by researchers such as Wendelle Stevens that the UK intelligence and the USA intelligence agencies gave immense attentions to Meier thus giving the claim of bait and switch being applied to some of Meier's proof being tampered with (such as photos) credibility in my opinion.


1 - There is not one piece of evidence supporting his case, that hasn't been either debunked, or reproduced (and I'm solely talking about fellow UFO/ET researchers - not the mainstream debunkers);

2 - He declared all others as sharlatans or fake, and he is the only real contactee - because he was, as you put it, "selling a different story" than the rest;

3 - Yes, and there are reports of other people having being under the watchful eye of various intelligence agencies - this argument has no bearing here;

4 - Have you taken a look at the "evidence" he portrays now? Its laughable.




I don't have an issue with him personally. I have an issue with every single one like him. There is only evidence (sort of) that he initially did get contacted by humanoid, human-looking beings. This came through a testimony from a guy living in South Africa who got contacted by (funnily enough) the same beings Meier claimed later that he did, identical in appearance. This happened in the 50s. Long before Meier started spouting his Pleadian/Plejaren BS. Only these beings claimed they were from Alpha Centauri, a much more likely place for anything to be able to live, native or colonized (three stars, two similar to our sun, one almost identical, aprox. same age too, and waaay closer than the Pleiades who are some 450 ly away)

This guy confirms that Meier got contacted eventually, most likely by the same beings, but it doesn't support the rest of Meier's claims, as the materials of both people are quite different, and it seems that Meier's contacts have lesser astronomical knowledge than even our own astronomers. Maybe confirming the start of the contacts, but effectively debunking his special status of the "one and only contactee".

At the end of the contact, the ETs tell the S. African guy they will contact a one-armed man in Switzerland. I have the pdf of the case, if you are interested, I'm not making it up.

Meier on the other hand, probably didn't have a second encounter, so he started inventing the rest of his material, hence the falsified evidence, and ridiculous material.


Taken all into consideration, again - why Meier? And not somebody else?

9eagle9
7th February 2012, 15:58
The Celestine prophey is all about energy management.Our feelings. Our filters.That's the first thing people wave in my face, your not managing my feelings.

Do people really want me to?

It is exactly how we play charades. I'm going to pretend to be nice for my own self gratification. We play charades as a game. The difference is when we are done projecting our roles of playing out Charlie Chaplin and Groucho Marx even people who don't know a thing about spiritual endeavors have the ability to step out of that role and resume their regularly scheduled programming.



Wow 9eagle9 I can't say how much I agree with everything you say in post #75. I agree 100%. I find I take for granted that folks on a forum like this would have read and digested the tenents discusssed in the Celestine Prophecy, the drama types, and the charades folks perform for attention which is energy.
I find I am wrong again and again in this taking for granted.
I agree that people fall for these dramatic charades over and over again, and to be honest, it sickens me to the point of not wanting to participate here anymore.

If folks won't familiarize themselves with the concepts of energy and the cons folks perpetuate to gain it from others, I feel they can't truly understand spirituality.
I wish folks would admit they don't know something rather than assume things like it's all love and light,,,all the time, because it's not all love and light,,,,all the time.
Folks think you are either a pessimist or an optimist, and I find that hilarious, because both are forms of wishfull thinking, rather one should strive to be a pragmatist, and see things as they really are, rather than how you wish to see them.

Once again 9eagle9 you have shown what a pragmatist you are, and more than that, you have the balls to communicate your pragmatism.
Thank You

Carmody
7th February 2012, 16:26
One could say that sense and sensibility comes for humankind in the way that false paradigms raise the bar on ridiculousness to higher and higher levels....on a near daily basis. the reflection of the insanity is increasing at a near exponential rate, thus it slowly becomes obvious for everyone. How one reacts to what is in front of them is illustrative of their own particular point or position of this issue, as a point within a personal level of understanding.

The more ridiculous it becomes, the more people flip into a more correct sensibility. If it was always subtle, then far fewer would escape it's grasp.

Return to original point: It's a place where beings come to learn.


The point is that incarnation, as an experience, was designed that way -with full intent.

The level of 3d technology that humankind is launching itself into requires that a mirror of their lack of self realization move into a state of prominence. This, due to the danger that the 3d technology poses to their unfolding as a being connected to an avatar. Yet this is only one view, other views will be more useful to one who's mindset is different, regarding understanding emerging in one, due to the construction of the prior two sentences in this paragraph.

Thus it is important to have a view available.... of following the shoe, or to follow the gourd. Both are valuable false paradigms as reflections of a lack of self realization in the given self. Thus, collective understanding of an individual path. All they myriad ways.

Each incarnated being, if full of fear, will project their 'protective cocoon' of egoic and emotional safety and permanence out into the world, in an attempt to have the reflection comfort their emotions. One given 'dream of mother's safety' will possibly resonate well enough with another..that the other will pick it up and do the same. Hence the collective false paradigm..when in reality, when refined, the individual's given 'dream' is found to be slightly different.

As each incarnated being projects or advertizes their personal level of 'lack of clarity' or personal insanity or desire for permanence, they only serve to reflect this into others..who will be given the chance to see how incorrect such positioning could be and probably is. In other words, the collectively shouted and broadcast individual insanities of incorrect thinking, desires and positions, only serves to enable elevation of self into humankind.

Reflection exists as a system of enabling for the incarnated individual, it is not a curse, it is a clear advertisement of incorrect paths, for it is not a path... it is the body's animal desires for permanence in safety. Feelings. Not logic and forward motion. And so on.

DNA
7th February 2012, 16:38
1 - There is not one piece of evidence supporting his case, that hasn't been either debunked, or reproduced (and I'm solely talking about fellow UFO/ET researchers - not the mainstream debunkers);

I disagree. Are all of his photos debunked because a few of them have been shown to be false? No. It is easy to play the game when one declares the rules to be if one counterfiet bill is found in the bank then we must discount all the currency the bank is holding.

Meier has an amazing amount of quality photos that when examined by the debunkers they refuse to acknowledge as legit and instead they go to the photos that have been shown to be false. Again, I personally believe the alphabet agencies have inserted these into his stockpile as he retrieved them from the photo devoloper. Yes, that is right, he retrieved them from a local devoloper just like anyone else who has no idea how to devolop film in a dark room would.




2 - He declared all others as sharlatans or fake, and he is the only real contactee - because he was, as you put it, "selling a different story" than the rest;

I believe Meier to be suffering from delusians of grandeur. I gues this can discount his story for others, but for me, it doesn't take away from his enounters and the dialogue he maintained in those enounters.

Folks can maintain whatever they might in so far as how they would react to such a situation, but as far as I am concerned, a messiah complex and delusians of grandeur are very believable side effects of such an occurance. Par for the course in a lot of ways.


3 - Yes, and there are reports of other people having being under the watchful eye of various intelligence agencies - this argument has no bearing here;

You say it has no bearing here, but I believe it does. I think the more data and evidence one's case may have in terms of bringing about disclosure that folks from other planet's exist, the more involved these folks are going to become. The man has had various attempts on his life, and though he tells these tales with pinoche and polish, I do believe this to be true.

Also, the photos are not his only proof.
The man has made several predictions that have come true concerning celestial discoveries in the solar system, scientific discoveries including the year the first animal would be cloned and what animal it would be, he talked at length about the underground DUMBS in America churning out super soldiers, HAARP technology and bilogical weopons back when I believe the only other person who was stating this kind of stuff was Phil Schnieder.



4 - Have you taken a look at the "evidence" he portrays now? Its laughable.
Sure if your thumbing through the debunkers guide of faked Meier photographs. Yes, you are right, they are laughable. And how effective it would be if you were an intelligence agency to have data for your debunker stooges to sieze upon and extoll upon if you yourself "the alphabet agency" placed them there yourself.

I don't consider myself a guillable guy. I'm looking at the entire body of work here, and though I know it's easier for lazy armchair UFOlogists to read what other folks have said and as such make decisions the easy way, this is in fact what the alphabet agencies are banking on. Human laziness and the habit of discounting large quantities of data when a small portion of that data has been proven false.



I don't have an issue with him personally. I have an issue with every single one like him. There is only evidence (sort of) that he initially did get contacted by humanoid, human-looking beings. This came through a testimony from a guy living in South Africa who got contacted by (funnily enough) the same beings Meier claimed later that he did, identical in appearance. This happened in the 50s. Long before Meier started spouting his Pleadian/Plejaren BS. Only these beings claimed they were from Alpha Centauri, a much more likely place for anything to be able to live, native or colonized (three stars, two similar to our sun, one almost identical, aprox. same age too, and waaay closer than the Pleiades who are some 450 ly away)

This guy confirms that Meier got contacted eventually, most likely by the same beings, but it doesn't support the rest of Meier's claims, as the materials of both people are quite different, and it seems that Meier's contacts have lesser astronomical knowledge than even our own astronomers. Maybe confirming the start of the contacts, but effectively debunking his special status of the "one and only contactee".

At the end of the contact, the ETs tell the S. African guy they will contact a one-armed man in Switzerland. I have the pdf of the case, if you are interested, I'm not making it up.

Meier on the other hand, probably didn't have a second encounter, so he started inventing the rest of his material, hence the falsified evidence, and ridiculous material.


Taken all into consideration, again - why Meier? And not somebody else?



Again, I agree with you as far as his claims of being the lone contactee on the planet. Again, I think Meier has delusians of grandeur. I think all this contact stuff has gone to his head, and there is no way I would tell folks to believe everything the guy says. When taking in the Meier material I would suggest one use discernment and take what is usefull and discard what is not.

I don't believe everything Meier states.
But do I believe he was a contactee. Yes absolutely.

xbusymom
7th February 2012, 19:59
here is a question for ya...
How can a spiritual being discern 1)body language, 2) tone of voice, 3) vibrational intent, 4)eye "statements", 5) etc. when sitting at a computer half a world away from a living person?

RMorgan
7th February 2012, 20:40
here is a question for ya...
How can a spiritual being discern 1)body language, 2) tone of voice, 3) vibrational intent, 4)eye "statements", 5) etc. when sitting at a computer half a world away from a living person?

Hey mate,

Well, by analyzing a video, it´s indeed very possible to read a lot of fundamental subjective signs, including verbal, gestural and and eye movement. One can do it very precisely, if trained correctly to do so.

Of course, vibrational intent is another complete different subject and, personally, I´m not aware of any efficient method to analyze it (at least for regular/non medium persons).

Cheers,

Raf.

xbusymom
8th February 2012, 06:08
here is a question for ya...
How can a spiritual being discern 1)body language, 2) tone of voice, 3) vibrational intent, 4)eye "statements", 5) etc. when sitting at a computer half a world away from a living person?

Hey mate,

Well, by analyzing a video, it´s indeed very possible to read a lot of fundamental subjective signs, including verbal, gestural and and eye movement. One can do it very precisely, if trained correctly to do so.

Of course, vibrational intent is another complete different subject and, personally, I´m not aware of any efficient method to analyze it (at least for regular/non medium persons).

Cheers,

Raf.

true, ya got me there...
but my point was that there is not many videos to decipher on PA; and that a lot of the info passed around the forum is strictly WORD messages posted and responded to. Therefore people need to do their due dilligence and rely on their own way of intuiting descernment.. The title of this thread suggests that if you cant rely on your own internal guidance system, then you should just give up and go away?? That is not the point of this forum... You cant increase your discernment powers if you never have anything to make comparisons with and experience feeling the differences.

eileenrose
8th February 2012, 10:02
Hi S-L, anyone,
I've had a few thoughts over the last few years, after starting to read both PA and PC, it is that once Bill and Kerry stopped checking each other, then people like Charles started showing up. Of course that is probably what they, TPTB, had in mind when they broke the two up (or whatever had them go their separate ways...and mysteriously not find, each of them, another sleuthing partnership). And of course, Kerry and Bill have normal egos and like having guests to continue to keep some sort of employment they both seem to love. So they are willing participants in having these people on. And for reasons I don't know, I hated Charles from day one (and posted the day he was first promoted that maybe we shouldn't be talking to this man...I had a bad feeling about him) and the same still goes for Wood. And I never ask why I get these negative feelings about people. But I trust my gut. I always end up right.
I think lots of people get these feelings and are addicted to ignoring them (it is soo fun to jump on the latest gravy ship).

eileenrose
8th February 2012, 10:08
So what about the aliens and the ascension talk?
I do have some insights. But they arn't popular. So I have only just started to post them.
Yes, I was over at the site that was also involved, somewhat, in promoting channelings. I find that before I rush to judgement, especially over something lots of people
are invested in, I should try to find out everything about it first. No, I didn't sign up to go on a space craft.
Who do I feel was behind that? I know that TPTB were.
Is there ascension? No
Is it turning into a religious experience for these people (where they are so lost in their projections that they can't see reality anymore)? Yes. But I live with two Christians, so it is like the pot calling the kettle black.

That is all I have on this topic. That I discerned.

Carmody
8th February 2012, 15:25
they can stop the collective self via seeding of potential potholes and pits to fall into. This is due to the collective being a reactive animal. Ie, it is reaction to reflections.

Harder to do, is the collection of intent of the individual. for the individual is a autonomous being who can do as they please.

in that case the control paradigm is forced into being a step behind, ie, reactive.

thus, collectively..power or capacity for humankind, lies in the acts of individuation. The power and strength of 'the first move'.

Stay in the power of aware individuation and the first move will always belong to you. (if the light goes on for you, well....it means that you will always be the driver....!)

The 'problem' comes for the individual... when they finally appear on the radar of the control paradigm. At that point more resources are applied to controlling them, controlling their avenues of expansion.... and the corralling and interference begins in a more serious way.

The more people who act in individuation, the harder it is for the control paradigm to corral, as the resources that need to be dedicated to the individuals who they wish to control..well..it simply becomes an impossible task, very quickly.

Paul
8th February 2012, 16:23
The more people who act in individuation, the harder it is for the control paradigm to corral, as the resources that need to be dedicated to the individuals who they wish to control..well..it simply becomes an impossible task, very quickly.
Yup. I figure that the more of us who present potential challenges as individuals, each in our own way and in various organized ways, to the control paradigm, then the tougher it becomes for the controllers.

xbusymom
8th February 2012, 16:27
The more people who act in individuation, the harder it is for the control paradigm to corral, as the resources that need to be dedicated to the individuals who they wish to control..well..it simply becomes an impossible task, very quickly.
Yup. I figure that the more of us who present potential challenges as individuals, each in our own way and in various organized ways, to the control paradigm, then the tougher it becomes for the controllers.

yep, the bank teller was incensed when I refused to give a forwarding address as a 'standard' procedure when I closed out my account.

... don't blindly follow along with their script...

9eagle9
8th February 2012, 16:41
Because people divided along the love and hate lines with Charles is why THEY created so much consternation. It was created around him. Charles never said you must love me or hate me. People made their own choice and became a battle of feelings. I would someone why they love Charles (and I have) as much as I would ask they why they hate him. If you put your feelings of hate aside and then look at him what do you see?



Hi S-L, anyone,
I've had a few thoughts over the last few years, after starting to read both PA and PC, it is that once Bill and Kerry stopped checking each other, then people like Charles started showing up. Of course that is probably what they, TPTB, had in mind when they broke the two up (or whatever had them go their separate ways...and mysteriously not find, each of them, another sleuthing partnership). And of course, Kerry and Bill have normal egos and like having guests to continue to keep some sort of employment they both seem to love. So they are willing participants in having these people on. And for reasons I don't know, I hated Charles from day one (and posted the day he was first promoted that maybe we shouldn't be talking to this man...I had a bad feeling about him) and the same still goes for Wood. And I never ask why I get these negative feelings about people. But I trust my gut. I always end up right.
I think lots of people get these feelings and are addicted to ignoring them (it is soo fun to jump on the latest gravy ship).

jackovesk
8th February 2012, 16:45
The 'Alien Agenda' is only what you 'Know' it to be (Plain & Simple), not from what others tell you it is...:yes4:

Borden
8th February 2012, 16:53
here is a question for ya...
How can a spiritual being discern 1)body language, 2) tone of voice, 3) vibrational intent, 4)eye "statements", 5) etc. when sitting at a computer half a world away from a living person?

Here is an answer for ya ...

A lot more easily than when sitting in a room with that person. The whole subjectivity thing is a problem, and observation becomes keener when detached from it.

Borden.

pheonix
8th February 2012, 17:36
Not everyone is taken in by everything they are told just because that is what they want to hear. Not everyone is afraid to speak their mind when they feel/know that what they are hearing/seeing is almost certainly a load of tosh but most are afraid to speak up and stand alone when they know that all they will recieve is abuse from others ! Always say what you feel/believe and be your own judge. What would you choose :- A truth that draws a tear or a lie that creates a smile ?

I am free, I am spirit.

Delight
9th February 2012, 01:03
Discernment is a growing edge. Really, whom we should question first is us until we trust ourselves and then continue to question everything. Any one's agenda must be scrutinized.....

From revillusi0nz
http://www.youtube.com/user/revillusi0nz#g/a

Revelations radio show January 2012
William Henry metaphysical author and researcher,
http://williamhenry.net
Guest Randy Maugans, http://offplanetradio.com/

Subject: the truth movement undone! David Wilcock, Richard Hoagland...Project Camelot...Elenin, the fear fest, the crying game, the theatrical, and even plagaristic practices...? accountability, ? scruples, and ? substance...clever marketing or mass mind control?

-6-SRo6HtR8

iVRc3QjNBsY

vKa62Mi_Nr4

eileenrose
9th February 2012, 03:49
Hi 9eagle9,
I don't hide my feelings. I feel much hate over war topics. Charles had that 'air' around him. I felt 'war' when I tuned into him. I hate the war, the violence, that comes up....not the person permitting it to occur (or be in that energy wake or field).

And yes, on another topic, I look at all feelings as they arise. Even negatively charged ones (especially).

I can PM the rest of what I think to anyone who request it (don't feel like it is a good thing to publish outright).

eileen