Abusive Men's "How to Be a Man... again " thread.

[Nanoo Nanoo]

The following is meant for support of men who find their lives difficult in the light of required change. Change often causes confusion especially when it seems like a mixed signal is imbed in the information.

Men need to get back to being men , not what other people think men shouldbe.

The mixed signals these days are generally what causes confusion and identity chrisis.

Male agression is heightened when we cannot be men and have to push down our right to be men. In any gender when a person decides not to express them selves wether it be happiness , frustration, love , fear or other these emotions end up inside and WILL eventually pop out when the cork is pushed from inside.

Its easier to deal with a small soda pop spill rather than a bulky TNT explosion . im sure you get what i mean.

I will kick this off with a video that very much says it all. The material in this thread may be offensive to some .. and im sure opinions will be voiced , and thats fine , in fact i encourage it , however Men need support and Men need to be heard. And this thread is in responce to Men's Rights.

All are welcome


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgV40vQSObQ


Hugs


Naniu

[RunningDeer]

I’d think it’s hard to be a man. Damn if you do, damn if you don’t.

I am in full support for who you are.

You and I will open the door for each other because I like it when you do it for me. And I want to share in that feeling. Why? No why’s needed. We don’t have to make it all complicated. It’s just a damn door.

Smoochy kisses to all the guys out there, http://emoticoner.com/files/emoticons/smileys/wet-kiss-smiley.gif?1292867699

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Paula , if i wasnt taken i would sweep you off your feet ! thank you for your encouragement and love x

Men love smoochy kisses ! and women love big men huggy bear hugs back !

Men and Women rule !

Woo Hoo !


N

[TigaHawk]

i think it's far harder to be a woman than it is to be a man....

swap ya. seriously.

[Nanoo Nanoo]

For Men the idea of love is so important. I see it everywhere in society , mens expression or wish to attract love.

It is true that a lack of love will cause all means to ends as Love IS the most powerful force in our known universe. It is what creates , destroys and experiences us as an energy. We are at the hands of the reception and reciprocation of love.

So Men need not to express it more than they already do , they just need to know its ok to express it in a way that feels natural to them and their identity, without confusion.

N

[Nanoo Nanoo]

i think it's far harder to be a woman than it is to be a man....

swap ya. seriously.

I dont doubt you Tigahawk .. being a man i know, i would not want to be a woman. But i guess there are plenty of women that love being women and men love being men and some men wish they were women too. If i were i woman i wonder would i prefer to be a man ? or would i be happy being a woman ? i guess that would be dependant on wether i am happy with the way i was born.. and yes many people are gender confused.

Thats not a problem Tigahawk , we love you just the way you are ! you have a place here with us : 0 )

Hugs


N

[mosquito]

Thanks for this Nanoo.

It seems I'm going to be one of the first to attempt to express my feelings about this, GULP !!

I've just come out of a 36 hour fast and silent vision quest. It was supposed to be for 3 days, but my stomach couldn't take it any more. Oh well.

One of he things which came up, as I expected was - maleness. I have absolutely NO IDEA how to be a man in today's world. All the practical or macho types are probably pissing themselves when they read that, but it's true, I have no idea. I've never had any positive male role models - I had no relationship with my father (mother's emotional manipulation, but that's a whole different topic), I haven't seen him since I was 12 and he doesn't want to know me. By brother was a bully, I was bullied at school, by boys and girls, the male teachers were all bullies, perverts or idiots or a combination thereof and I grew up not really knowing how to be part of male company. And I could never for the life of me understand violence and aggresion. I still can't.

I've always been very much in touch with my own feminine nature, and the only way I know how to express any form of maleness is through loving, and I don't just mean through sexual loving, there are a million and one ways to love a woman. As for "sex" itself, for me it's an act of adoration and love, gentle and mutually empowering. Which is why I just don't understand why there are so many women out there seemingly sexually unfulfilled. I don't get it - women have multiple, full-body orgasms naturally and with ease ! How can there be any woman who isn't fulfilled and happy ? I never used to believe that rape was real - I mean, how on Earth can any man be turned on by the thought of rape ?? It was only when I talked to women who'd been raped that I believed it. But again, I just don't get it. And judging by what I read on this forum and what I hear from others, it seems there are an awful lot of men who have a totally different view of the "sex" act than I do.

I don't want to dwell on "sex", but the same violent, aggresive attitudes predominate in our world. Why ? The more I see of human nature, the more I believe I'm a different species.

My life at the moment is very uncertain. I have no resources, no home and absolutely no idea how to create a stable base for myself (and a loved one, should she come along). I've just finished with my Filipina girlfriend, who I was with for 19 months (still a virgin, so those women who feel inclined to pounce on me with their usual implied accusations can get lost). I saw no future in the relationship, either for me or for her. The only way for me to make a marriage with her comfortable and happy is to become a provider, and the only way I know to do that is to join the system and play the game, which I DO NOT wish to do.

So there you have it, one 55 year old, well used and abused male, loving, devoted, totally supportive and empowering, but an utter failure at the game of life !!;)

[Orph]

I am me. I don't play games. I don't try to embrace my feminine side just to please women or society or whatever. I embrace my feminine side because it is part of me. It has been a part of me since the day I was born. It is a part of me that I enjoy and I'm not going to turn my back on it. But apparently, to the speaker in this video, and to many, that makes me a sissy.
I also enjoy my masculinity. Think about that statement for a moment. "My" masculinity. I don't need anybody telling me what it means to be masculine. I don't need to live up to anybody's else's idea of what a "man" is. That's all part of a game people play. Like I said, I don't play games. I am me and I'm happy with that. Don't care what anybody else thinks. :yo: :)

Edit: Mariposafe, are you my long lost brother? :sarcastic: You're not a failure just because you don't fit in.

[RunningDeer]

Ugg boots, yes. High heels, nope. Fashionista-of-another-kind. There’s blends and shades of yin/yang in us all. This is me and I like me and I wish that for us all:


I ran into the house, at 12 years old, choking back the tears. The boys teased me while we played baseball. They called me a "tomboy". I didn't know what it was but knew it wasn't meant as a compliment.


Mom, who had the gift of few words, just said, “You’re not a tomboy, your athletically inclined.”

I repeated in agreement, “Yeah, I’m athletically inclined.”


I had no clue what it meant, but it just felt right. I ran back out and yelled at the boys, “I’m not a tomboy, I’m athletically inclined.”


It fixed the problem. They never called me a tomboy again, probably because they didn’t know what athletically inclined meant either.

Hear, hear, for fashionista-of-another-kind.


New Seekers - Free to be you and me
8mU8gDKN5sE

[Hazel]

Hats-off to all the posts in this thread :cheer2:

We should not be defined by our gender and the societal roles imposed upon us all.
Are we not all on a spectrum hormonally, and each of us unique... the rainbow emblem describes this beautifully.
And I for one really appreciate men that flow with their feelings/needs/wants in an unselfconscious and respectful way, in fact theres no better company than a man being true to himself, while honouring the
same in a woman.

Ultimately its being in touch with our true nature and our humanity that holds the most value..
And YES.. I'll have some of what Paula was having/giving.. massive fully embodied hugs to all you guys (n' gals) from me.

xoox

[Nanoo Nanoo]

I am very encouraged by the responces from you all ! it feels nice to have a place to talk does it not ?

Mariposafe , i think every man goes through what you are experiencing and its normal however un natural in life to feel out of place dosent it ? But does that mean you are bad ? No .. it just means you are aware : 0 ) and thats the best thing you can do ! its exciting to sift through life and challenge our selves and thats ok.

the confusion in being a Man is always wanting to please everybody and you eventually learn that its not healthy, what is healthy is to listen to your instincts and be who you are. That dosent give you license to be rude or abusive. Abuse in all forms are usually caused by rebounding repressed emotions.. un able to express ones self naturally and feeling ashamed or not having anyone to talk to .. to understand what is happening .. what does this mean ? A lot of nasty things happen as children , we are cruel to each other .. i never understood it my self but i was picked on by everybody at school from the age of 5 to the age of 17 by school kinds family , teachers ! i had to actually defend my self against 2 teachers at school where i hit them to defend my self ... its shocking that can happen ..

So much i thought if since and i just didnt understand why it happened to me .. it made me sad .. it made me feel like i was a mis fit. But i realise now what these people were all missing. It was Love. People who feel and express love generally have abetter and more balanced life.

Every mean creature is desperate for the feeling of love.. to feel nurtured , cared for and respected and you can see how the lack of love in our youth and even today in our 30's 40's and 50's how love plays such an important part.

I can honestly say , love happens everywhere and its just a matter of tapping into it. If i just stop for a minute from all the confusion , and stepp off the conveyor belt .. there is a myriad of love everywhere.

Regarding our beautiful women being abused .. it is a disgrace but its something that is niot being dealth with properly. It dosent matter if you are male or female you do not deserve to be abused and abusers do not obviously consider peoples rights. SO its more a matter of " Preventative Protection " than rights.

The only way to curb this is to educate people on how to be strong, to avoid potential harm , what to look out for as early signs and self defense methods in protecting themselves when the need arises. Men its your job to make sure your women are safe ,this is the task of a Man and as fathers and partners it is our duty to encourage our women to learn self defence , to empower them with the tools to navagate life with us. Its our Manly duty to serve and protect as that is our task.

Its not always going to work however weak people who do not respect others rights are weak in them selves , they need help but before they get help sometimes they need to be shown itsnot ok to abuse the rights of others .. this needs to happen when we are young. This needs to be instilled asap from age 5 at least.

If both sexes understand the dangers and respects of being in society from a young age we may have a better chance at curbing whats happening to us.


And Paula , personally i really love tom boy girls , they are fun ! and i think i speak for most guys , we love tomboys .. Kids have such strange ways of showing they like you .. normally they pick on you .. hmmm



N

[Sérénité]

I think its hard to define what should a man be like, what should a woman be like?

You know one of the things that I really love about this forum, something that makes it stand out and feel comfy?
It's the fact that there are virtually no stereo types. Both sexes blend equally and comfortably, almost seamlessly.

Thanks to the non defining avatars that most use, Time and time again I have been totally amazed that someone who came across as so in touch with their feminine side and so openly caring and emotional infact turned out to be a man...and vice versa!
I've had a few shocks that so many I thought were 'she's are actually he's and just as many I thought were guys are girls! And that's amazing!

I totally agree with you Recap1!
I have never been able to define anyone by gender alone.
I'm attracted to both men and women. I'm attracted to overly masculine men equally as much as I am to gay men.
While I would consider myself quite a feminine girly girl there is also a side of me that loves things like fast cars and things that would be considered not so feminine.

I love a guy who can show his strong male side yet still open his heart and mind...I love girls who are feminine yet can handle themselves. Anyone who is true to themselves and has the confidence to just be...
We should all be just ourselves and let those who think we should all fit into a category go work out there own -ism issues quietly :)

[sheme]

http://youtu.be/p1Ahy6m4wHM

Teal scott and a friend talks about "Divine Masculinity" We are all needed now.

[Tesla_WTC_Solution]

I would not want to be a woman

I think I've read enough :(

[Flash]

i think it's far harder to be a woman than it is to be a man....

swap ya. seriously.

It is because men do not perceive how hard it is for them too. When half humanity is not accounted for in décisions, the other half suffers immensely too, but more at the uncounscious level.

This thread is a very good idea me think. It is positive and may be helping both sexes.

[kenaz]

Here's an excellent interview with Lana at Radio 3Fourteen.
avoiceformen.com

http://www.redicecreations.com/radio3fourteen/2013/R314-130807.php
Paul Elam, founder of avoiceformen.com discusses the biggest issues men currently face, namely feminist ideologies and the psychological war against men. Paul explains how he woke up to anti male sentiments in politics. He points out areas where men are victims of discrimination and in which female abuse of men is facilitated by law. We converse on egalitarianism and the notion that government should resolve our conflicts. We'll also discuss the early days of feminism and what they were after verses the feminists of today. He talks about feminist ideological agendas that are contradictory. In early human survival it was considered that men were disposable and women were a rare resource, due to their reproductive ability. This old view of gender roles is still in play today and men are considered disposable. We address male (and female) violence, rape accusations, and the idea that the patriarchy has been responsible for all evils against women. We discuss more areas where men are demonized by feminist propaganda, including within academia, which is at the root of the problem. We'll continue on violent feminist groups and how consumer society is catering to please women. Later, we'll discuss healthy relationships, the family unit and individual responsibility. What is real and what is an artificial construct in our male/female relationships? Paul explains how the lack of male role models in young children's lives is leading to an extraordinary level of psychological problems. Also, we address circumcision, the mutilation of male genitalia. We end the hour on violent patriarchal Gods.

[Tesla_WTC_Solution]

Of all the issues in the world to waste time on, no offense -- people could advocate for Gitmo prisoners or save the whales,
but they have to save their ego first.

LOL not a very Christlike image.

Someone want to post something anti-Black or anti-Kentucky, or something similarly stupid?

:(

but anti fem is fine, apparently

Wowee, I sure am glad I have the right to vote, because I didn't realize the "movement against empowered women" was so motivated to put us all back "in our place"...

Quick, someone post a 4Ks German video so women also know how to be women.
Kuchen Kinder Kirche and what? hmm... oh wait, I forgot that clothes have lost their sex appeal in modern times.

[RunningDeer]

http://youtu.be/p1Ahy6m4wHM

Teal scott and a friend talks about "Divine Masculinity" We are all needed now.

How to add a YouTube video:

"copy and paste" the address to your post
highlight it
click on the YouTube icon
http://i1262.photobucket.com/albums/ii610/WhiteCrowBlackDeer/menu_zps61ae24c0.png

The computer changes the address format from http://youtu.be/p1Ahy6m4wHM to this: p1Ahy6m4wHM[//youtube]
Note: use only one "/", here I added "//" to compare addresses, otherwise you'd see a second video.



The Divine Masculine (Ask Teal: How To Awaken The Divine Masculine Within You)
[youtube]p1Ahy6m4wHM

Published on Jun 8, 2013

Ask Teal Website - http://www.askteal.com
The divine masculine is what is going to support the birth process of the new earth, which is being brought into manifestation by divine feminine. Thus, the new earth is a co-creation that depends on divine feminine and divine masculine both coming into its full respective power.



In our modern society, masculinity has been seen as a problem rather than something that should be embraced, because it is rare that any man exhibits true masculinity.



The only example of masculinity we currently have is the shadow side of masculinity. This shadow side of masculinity fuels the societal idea of competitive hierarchy. In other words, it fuels the idea that one person on top of another person.



The shadow side of masculinity perpetuates vertical thinking. Vertical thinking is comparative thinking; where it is possible to be better than or less than someone else. And so, the power struggle was born.



Divine masculine represents action, direction, movement, responsibility, strength, focus, fatherhood, the sun, generosity, encouragement, material abundance, clarity, intellect, transformation and growth.



The divine masculine is what is going to support the birth process of the new earth, which is being brought into manifestation by divine feminine. Thus, the new earth is a co-creation that depends on divine feminine and divine masculine both coming into its full respective power.



You need to be willing to heal your negative emotions relative to anything you identify as male to set the masculinity within you free. It is exhausting suppressing the essence of who you are. And so, it is time to quit suppressing who you are.

In this episode, Teal explains how men can open up to the divine masculine within themselves.



Kuan Yin's Mantra (c) 2002 Lisa Thiel - used by permission http://www.sacreddream.com

[RMorgan]

Hey folks,

Well, I believe that during most part of my days, I'm simply a person; not a man, not a woman.

I just remember my sexuality when sexual situations or thoughts are involved, which probably happens to occupy 10% or less of my days.

It's a waste of time to keep insisting in labeling ourselves as this or that...All this thing does is to fragment our personalities even further.

I know, people like to play these little games of categorizations, of fitting themselves in all sorts of groups and sub-groups.... I was never interested in this stuff.

I find it to be extremely irrational to try to find who you are by breaking yourself in countless chaotic pieces of nothing...It's just like finding a strange unknown complex object in the street and breaking it in pieces to find out what it is; chances are you'll never know what it is and worse, you'll never be able to put the pieces together again.

People play these games and then complain about all sorts of "isms"...Machismo, Feminism, etc... That's plain stupid.

Living in society is not that hard once you realize that you actually don't need to play any pre-expected role...Most of the pressure to be this or that, or act accordingly to this or that, comes from ourselves, not from others.

It's very liberating to realize that you can simply be who you are and people don't even care, because they are already very busy trying to act accordingly to what they believe other people expect from them.

Life is easy. We just need to get rid of this annoying tendency of complicating it...It's surprisingly easy; no doctors, no pills, no self-help books and no special techniques required.

Raf.

[minkton]

i think it's far harder to be a woman than it is to be a man....

swap ya. seriously.

No doubt about it.

¤=[Post Update]=¤




Someone want to post something anti-Black or anti-Kentucky, or something similarly stupid?

:(

but anti fem is fine, apparently

Wowee, I sure am glad I have the right to vote, because I didn't realize the "movement against empowered women" was so motivated to put us all back "in our place"...
.

It's very sinister. It's a power game that will attract like flies all unconscious mysogyny.

[Jake]

I was expelled from high school in the 11th grade because I would not participate in 'celebration of women' week. The level of immaturity surrounding the 'experiment' was repulsive. I say 'experiment' because it was the most unsuccessful attempt to educate young people that I had ever witnessed. I had to sit through hour after hour after hour after ignorant hour,, listening to very disturbed lesbians lash out against men. There was not a single 'celebratory' moment. Just HATE men!! Government resources for women, law libraries for women, free counseling for girls. I was excited and supportive at first.. I love women. I am from the South (originally),,, I grew in a family that had a particular lament for any disrespect toward ANY female in ANY way. The women in our family have always been loved and treated like a special kind of Royalty, that only they deserved. We have, and still do, treat each other like this.

I endured my last speech about how boys were nothing but predators,,, murdering, raping, lying, deceitful, diseased, evil, masturbating, deviants. "If you find yourself pregnant, it is because some predator DID THIS TO YOU." As a young man, I watched the young girls around me change. I spent the rest of high school speechless, because I had been turned into a monster by these militant lesbians. I felt for them. I could sense their pain. And there is a lot of pain. I know it!!!

Transferring your pain to little boys,, is NOT going to create the type of man that you would like men to become. Being turned into monsters by liars will only degenerate the problem!!! It was about this time when I began to notice that instead of 'standing up for ourselves',,, most,,, MOST of my peers just accepted it.... And became the monsters that had been demanded manifest. I watched it happen in front of me!!! All of the sudden,,,,, date rape, gang rapes, beatings,,,, One conversation I had with a buddy of mine about it put me in a corner. I was suggesting that we don't get trapped into the confusion, and that we should try and lead by example, being the best person that I/we could be. I was lambasted,,,, "You are fu#$%ng stupid, J.R.,, There isn't a single female here that would stand up for you,, why would you give a **** what they think?" (This person is in jail for domestic violence now.) It became the mantra for young teenage boys in my area. They GAVE UP!!! And a pattern of abuse was created. The icing on the cake was when me and my girlfriend broke up.. I left her house at about 7:30 pm. It was sad, yes, but we agreed that we were not meant to be. The next day, I was greeted at the door to my homeroom by 6 cops. (yeay cops) I was handcuffed, thrown to the ground, picked up by my arms that were behind me (bruised shoulders for weeks) and marched TO THE OFFICE by armed police, in front of the whole school. Apparantly, after I had left her house, her mom asked her what happened and she told her that I RAPED HER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! DO YOU SEE WHAT IS HAPPENING????? **** sticks to everyone... Of course nothing like that happened. I was able to convince the cops, the high school admins and some of my close friends of the truth, but the damage was done. Despite my being one of the only ones in that school who championed the empowerment of women,,,, POOF now the world sees me as a rapist.

Here is the crux,,,, I do NOT blame women for this... I blame ignorance. I rarely meet a woman who blames ignorance. Simply blame men...

Clearly this is an extreme case. Yet it shaped my life and outlook for YEARS.. If I hadn't embraced other, more positive aspects of myself,,, perhaps I would have given up too,,,

Even now,, I expect to be demonized by my words here....

It does not wash off.... I was victimized by the irresponsible use of power, when it came to educating the youth of America. I was victimized by lying females being supported by ignorant people.

I am all for empowering women. It is going to have a COST, if all we can do is demonize men,,, not men, really,,, Look at what is happening to young boys. I had a young boy at my daughters church come up to me and say, "Hey, you are the deadbeat!" The best way to keep this cycle running is to continue to demonize men. The kid did not even know what a 'deadbeat dad' was. He likes me, and wants to be a deadbeat!!! Do you see how that works.?

As a man, I cannot answer for the crimes of tens of thousands of years of abuse by men. As a woman, you should realize that. I cannot heal you. All I can do is nurture any relationship that I have with anyone.

I love all people,,,, black, brown, yellow, green, blue, red, male, female, gay, straight, tall, short, yuppy, hippie, nun, monk,,, etc... I apologize from my soul,,, for anything I have ever done, this life or past life, to create the imbalance we have between our genders.



I love you all,,,
Jake.

[sheme]

I know you are a beautiful person Jake .

[RunningDeer]

I was expelled from high school in the 11th grade because I would not participate in 'celebration of women' week. The level of immaturity surrounding the 'experiment' was repulsive. I say 'experiment' because it was the most unsuccessful attempt to educate young people that I had ever witnessed. I had to sit through hour after hour after hour after ignorant hour,, listening to very disturbed lesbians lash out against men. There was not a single 'celebratory' moment. Just HATE men!! Government resources for women, law libraries for women, free counseling for girls. I was excited and supportive at first.. I love women. I am from the South (originally),,,

love you all,,,
Jake.

Jake, I loved that you stood up for what you believe. That takes immeasurable courage especially at a tender age of 16, 17, 18, and surround by peer pressure and the subtle pressure of mind programing.

It demonstrates the Big Spirit it took to help those silent ones. You may never meet them again, but you’ve added quality and dimension to their lives. And still it continues on with me today.

Much Love,
Paula

[Jake]

Thank you, Both. Before I head off to worky,,, I have to include this point. The only thing that saved me, really was having my Mom and Sister and Grandmother to explain it all to me. (very gifted ladies, very special) The main thing was that I could not blame anyone for it. That greed and jealousy and ignorance are to blame, and we have to love each other, no matter what!!! It was nothing that my father would have ever told me. It was the sacred feminine that was able to walk me through it. As a man, I wish we had something like that!!! :) (sacred masculine,, lol) :):)

Love to all.
Jake.

[Tesla_WTC_Solution]

Thank you, Both. Before I head off to worky,,, I have to include this point. The only thing that saved me, really was having my Mom and Sister and Grandmother to explain it all to me. (very gifted ladies, very special) The main thing was that I could not blame anyone for it. That greed and jealousy and ignorance are to blame, and we have to love each other, no matter what!!! It was nothing that my father would have ever told me. It was the sacred feminine that was able to walk me through it. As a man, I wish we had something like that!!! :) (sacred masculine,, lol) :):)

Love to all.
Jake.

Jake, I wish my family had been like yours.

My father and one of my uncles were child molesters.
We didn't find out soon enough to avoid the trouble that inevitably comes with this problem.
They pretty much destroyed my life, my sister's life, etc.

I had a foot in the door of a successful Christian ministry, only to come home from Asia to Texas CPS interviewing me and my siblings.
In fact my then-Texas-based uncle coached us first, before we talked to CPS, and my dad got off pretty much Scott-free.

However, when I had my first major problem with my husband, I was the one who got arrested.
It really seems strange that a society of "good guys" would ignore the child molesters but punish upset wives.

Not to mention, my mom's father started molesting her when she was 8 years old.
On the other side of the family, my dad's dad, well, I don't want to say what happened there.
Let's just say someone had a liaison with a 16 year old foster child and we didn't find out until much later.
And he wasn't even the chronic abuser -- most of that was on his wife's side of the family...

I just got done reading about the captivity of Elizabeth Smart.
It's very hard to read the QQ from the men, the total T_T, without thinking,
"Gee I almost bought in to Stockholm syndrome" too.

I will never apologize for supporting women's rights.
Unfortunately for some egos, those rights include freedom of speech.

It's really sad that militant lesbians and the like had the opportunity to mess up young boys in your school.
But I'd like to point out, the US Marines and other garbage (no offense but I am fed up with war) came straight into my own high school and ruined many of our lives, too.

It was a lot more serious than having to sit through some uncomfortable lectures.

Follow the male pattern too far and you will end up dead.
It's kind of hard to recover from the war between the sexes then.


By the way, in case people here don't know this already,
Western religions symbolize male sexuality and ego with the Sun.
So anywhere you see an idealized "Sun God", cupola, cross, lingam, etc,
you are pretty much seeing the sun perverted into a dick.

Now, educated people know that there are not just Moon goddesses and Sun gods.
there are also Sun Goddesses and Moon Gods.


Someone got very confused when they made the sun a "male only" gentleman's club kind of symbol.

I hate it every bit as much as any rainbow flag -- in fact, much more so.

It was Carl Jung himself who dreamed of the misuse of the male ministry, when he was only 3 years old or so!

He dreamed of the giant penis sitting on a throne, and heard a voice saying, "this is the man eater".

________________________________________________________________________


Our reality is not the only reality.
And family's job isn't just keeping things in the family.
We're supposed to educate our family and prepare them for the world outside.

And there are many sexual predators out there who would love to blame their victims for every filthy deed.

I just can't buy in to this.

[Bubu]

To be a man or a man is to do whatever you feel you need to.
I agree with Raf categorizing is dividing. I grow up hanging with boys and sometimes girls but more with the boys and I don't mind any. It's different when I hang up with girls than boys and love both of them. Just be yourself.

[Nanoo Nanoo]

I was expelled from high school in the 11th grade because I would not participate in 'celebration of women' week. The level of immaturity surrounding the 'experiment' was repulsive. I say 'experiment' because it was the most unsuccessful attempt to educate young people that I had ever witnessed. I had to sit through hour after hour after hour after ignorant hour,, listening to very disturbed lesbians lash out against men. There was not a single 'celebratory' moment. Just HATE men!! Government resources for women, law libraries for women, free counseling for girls. I was excited and supportive at first.. I love women. I am from the South (originally),,, I grew in a family that had a particular lament for any disrespect toward ANY female in ANY way. The women in our family have always been loved and treated like a special kind of Royalty, that only they deserved. We have, and still do, treat each other like this.

I endured my last speech about how boys were nothing but predators,,, murdering, raping, lying, deceitful, diseased, evil, masturbating, deviants. "If you find yourself pregnant, it is because some predator DID THIS TO YOU." As a young man, I watched the young girls around me change. I spent the rest of high school speechless, because I had been turned into a monster by these militant lesbians. I felt for them. I could sense their pain. And there is a lot of pain. I know it!!!

Transferring your pain to little boys,, is NOT going to create the type of man that you would like men to become. Being turned into monsters by liars will only degenerate the problem!!! It was about this time when I began to notice that instead of 'standing up for ourselves',,, most,,, MOST of my peers just accepted it.... And became the monsters that had been demanded manifest. I watched it happen in front of me!!! All of the sudden,,,,, date rape, gang rapes, beatings,,,, One conversation I had with a buddy of mine about it put me in a corner. I was suggesting that we don't get trapped into the confusion, and that we should try and lead by example, being the best person that I/we could be. I was lambasted,,,, "You are fu#$%ng stupid, J.R.,, There isn't a single female here that would stand up for you,, why would you give a **** what they think?" (This person is in jail for domestic violence now.) It became the mantra for young teenage boys in my area. They GAVE UP!!! And a pattern of abuse was created. The icing on the cake was when me and my girlfriend broke up.. I left her house at about 7:30 pm. It was sad, yes, but we agreed that we were not meant to be. The next day, I was greeted at the door to my homeroom by 6 cops. (yeay cops) I was handcuffed, thrown to the ground, picked up by my arms that were behind me (bruised shoulders for weeks) and marched TO THE OFFICE by armed police, in front of the whole school. Apparantly, after I had left her house, her mom asked her what happened and she told her that I RAPED HER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! DO YOU SEE WHAT IS HAPPENING????? **** sticks to everyone... Of course nothing like that happened. I was able to convince the cops, the high school admins and some of my close friends of the truth, but the damage was done. Despite my being one of the only ones in that school who championed the empowerment of women,,,, POOF now the world sees me as a rapist.

Here is the crux,,,, I do NOT blame women for this... I blame ignorance. I rarely meet a woman who blames ignorance. Simply blame men...

Clearly this is an extreme case. Yet it shaped my life and outlook for YEARS.. If I hadn't embraced other, more positive aspects of myself,,, perhaps I would have given up too,,,

Even now,, I expect to be demonized by my words here....

It does not wash off.... I was victimized by the irresponsible use of power, when it came to educating the youth of America. I was victimized by lying females being supported by ignorant people.

I am all for empowering women. It is going to have a COST, if all we can do is demonize men,,, not men, really,,, Look at what is happening to young boys. I had a young boy at my daughters church come up to me and say, "Hey, you are the deadbeat!" The best way to keep this cycle running is to continue to demonize men. The kid did not even know what a 'deadbeat dad' was. He likes me, and wants to be a deadbeat!!! Do you see how that works.?

As a man, I cannot answer for the crimes of tens of thousands of years of abuse by men. As a woman, you should realize that. I cannot heal you. All I can do is nurture any relationship that I have with anyone.

I love all people,,,, black, brown, yellow, green, blue, red, male, female, gay, straight, tall, short, yuppy, hippie, nun, monk,,, etc... I apologize from my soul,,, for anything I have ever done, this life or past life, to create the imbalance we have between our genders.



I love you all,,,
Jake.

Hey Jake

i can relate to everything you said ! i have experienced things very similar. and perhaps if i told you what exactly i had experienced you would not believe it .. but im still here , i truly want honesty to prevail here. I think honesty is the antidote to mis understanding.

On 2 sepperate occasions i have been hand cuffed and taken away at the beckoning of an ex girl friend .. both times just after a break up , both time s they had lied through the teeth to get the police to take me away .. both times i had to go to court to defend my self and when the judge saw it was just thin air there was no slap on the wrist for them .. they just walked out of the room .. whats up with that ? hmmm

one of them said i had beaten her , it was the day after we broke up .. she had her wisdom teeth out and her face was swollen .. so she used that and told the police i hit her ... it was hilarious .. especially when i produced her medical report in court. She hd no where to look .. the judge screamed at her for wasting everybodies time.

And it gets worse .. after another break up i noticed a lot of my friends not returning calls , not inviting me out .. and for years this plagued me but thought they took sides as it goes when people break up. Some years later i dated a girl dowm my street who was friends with the girl next door who happened to be friends with my ex. When she found out i was dating her friend they had a pow wow .. The girl wanted to warn her that i was a woman beater ! yep ! me a woman beater !

my girl friend at the time laughed so loud when she sid this .. she repeated what she was told ... and i worked out why all my friends turned their back on me. i also worked out why the tail shaft of my car had 2 bolts missing .. this as you realise could have killed innocent people.

I worked it out eventually but when i was with this girl she gave me 2 stories of how she was date raped by an ex and her fancee ... now this filled me with rage , i wanted to find those guys and literally torture them. but then i recalled a strange thing happening .. one of them was in town and called her to meet up for lunch. She asked me if it was ok to go to lunch with her ex ... that raped her ... ummm ( insert alarm bells here ) what ? you want to go to lunch with a man that apparently raped you ? hmmm I said no , i dont think thats a good idea but he can come here and have lnch with us.

SO he did ... my idea was when he turned up i would grab his arse and throw him off the balcony.. but you know what ... when i saw him he seemed like a really lovely peaceful man ... and she was excited to see him .. and then years later i remembered this story of how i was a woman beater .. how all her ex boyfriends raped her .. or beat her ... and there was a pattern starting..

So i decided to find the other guy she said had raped her .. it took some time but i knew people he knew. Firstg i interviewed his friends and then a spoke with him as well.. he too had the exact same story .. and i mean this guy was a pussy cat.. And i knew his ex girl friend as well as it turned out .. i also interviewed her abiut him and she assured me he was a complete gentleman.

So .. where does this leave me ? with sadness it happened but with humility i learn from this and a feel for people who go to such lengths to get revenge.

And this happens a lot but idont want to harp on this stuff .. im over it but its important to share these feelings.

As a net result i must say i dont regard relationships as i used to when i was younger .. i used to believe in chivalry and forever and being in love .. and whie thats still at my core i relaise it can only happen with that special someone .. the difference is im not looking anymore .. im not looking to fulfill my self as a man by having a family .. i am happiest being free now ( i think i talked my self into it ) Do i really need a partner ? hmmm i am a loner i must say , i adore solitude .. and as it goes i am a camel when it comes to being self sufficient ..

Can you fix me ? if you tried id let you... till you realised i wasnt broken, but by then it would be too late and rude of me not to let you try.


N

[Nanoo Nanoo]

http://youtu.be/p1Ahy6m4wHM

Teal scott and a friend talks about "Divine Masculinity" We are all needed now.

I have given this video a go .. and i get a deep sence of pain and regret from Teal .. im not sure if this video is a s useful to teach men as opposed to her expressing her opinion of men based on her experiences. It seems she still harbours anger with her choice of expression.

What do you guys think ? reading between the lines does the Divine Masculine ring true ? Im not a big fan of Teal admittedly .. after seeing some of her videos where she has taken liberty to completely lie about evolution i am now reluctant to give creedence to anything else she says.

I think there are better examples to choose from.

N

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Of all the issues in the world to waste time on, no offense -- people could advocate for Gitmo prisoners or save the whales,
but they have to save their ego first.

LOL not a very Christlike image.

Someone want to post something anti-Black or anti-Kentucky, or something similarly stupid?

:(

but anti fem is fine, apparently

Wowee, I sure am glad I have the right to vote, because I didn't realize the "movement against empowered women" was so motivated to put us all back "in our place"...

Quick, someone post a 4Ks German video so women also know how to be women.
Kuchen Kinder Kirche and what? hmm... oh wait, I forgot that clothes have lost their sex appeal in modern times.

I dont think anti fem is the way to go .

I think an adjustment is in order now .. we have gone down this road together so far and its made us look at things , moving forward we need to drop the anger to see our best roads to recovery. Its not easy to let go of the past but it should fuel us to educate our future , not drag anger into it.

i see you still have so much anger and i do not blame you. I have no answer for that .. but to let it fuel positive education to the future of our childern. We may be the disposable generation, the reminants of turmoil in who we are.. identities challenged .. rights stripped away , taken away ! when the dust settles what is left ?

just a line of code .. a memory ... how will we use that to make it better for others ? do we truly care about others or just our selves ?

N

[sandy]

Hi Everyone :)

For me I think that it really hasn't a lot to do with gender but more so to do with entrainment, power and control.

For those individuals who have not been afforded the opportunity or experience of having personal power as they grow up, there is no understanding of how to handle it when the opportunity arises.

For many it remains polarized at opposite ends of the stick, so to speak, and they never learn that finding the balance is where peace and contentment lie, versus victim or perpetrator.

At least this has been my experience from a victim or perpertrator stance for many years of my life :)

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Hi Everyone :)

For me I think that it really hasn't a lot to do with gender but more so to do with entrainment, power and control.

For those individuals who have not been afforded the opportunity or experience of having personal power as they grow up, there is no understanding of how to handle it when the opportunity arises.

For many it remains polarized at opposite ends of the stick, so to speak, and they never learn that finding the balance is where peace and contentment lie, versus victim or perpetrator.

At least this has been my experience from a victim or perpertrator stance for many years of my life :)

very insightful post , thank you : 0 )

N

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Insights of a deeper nature , challenging norms of thinking.

I like this video as it truly goes into analytical strains of thinking. I like Karen Straughan and her views because she is intelligent and deeply alalytical.

she does a lot of research and prepares what she says. It has substance and is a good edcucative tool without the anger.


please enjoy


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlvMAS_20K4


N

[Marianne]

Thank you, Both. Before I head off to worky,,, I have to include this point. The only thing that saved me, really was having my Mom and Sister and Grandmother to explain it all to me. (very gifted ladies, very special) The main thing was that I could not blame anyone for it. That greed and jealousy and ignorance are to blame, and we have to love each other, no matter what!!! It was nothing that my father would have ever told me. It was the sacred feminine that was able to walk me through it. As a man, I wish we had something like that!!! :) (sacred masculine,, lol) :):)

Love to all.
Jake.

Jake, there IS a Sacred Masculine!!!!!! It is coming through now ... I think you are one who is bringing the Sacred Masculine into the world of form now. There are others too, on this forum and in the world. There will be more. The best thing is that the two polarities will be balanced now. It's time for this to happen.

I have been working with the archetype Divine Feminine for a little while now, because that's what I can do for the collective and for myself. I so want to see men do the same for the Divine Masculine, and when I read what you had written, it felt very balancing to me, as evidence of a deep change happening now. You, and all men, have my love and support in this work.

[Flash]

I was expelled from high school in the 11th grade because I would not participate in 'celebration of women' week. The level of immaturity surrounding the 'experiment' was repulsive. I say 'experiment' because it was the most unsuccessful attempt to educate young people that I had ever witnessed. I had to sit through hour after hour after hour after ignorant hour,, listening to very disturbed lesbians lash out against men. There was not a single 'celebratory' moment. Just HATE men!! Government resources for women, law libraries for women, free counseling for girls. I was excited and supportive at first.. I love women. I am from the South (originally),,, I grew in a family that had a particular lament for any disrespect toward ANY female in ANY way. The women in our family have always been loved and treated like a special kind of Royalty, that only they deserved. We have, and still do, treat each other like this.

I endured my last speech about how boys were nothing but predators,,, murdering, raping, lying, deceitful, diseased, evil, masturbating, deviants. "If you find yourself pregnant, it is because some predator DID THIS TO YOU." As a young man, I watched the young girls around me change. I spent the rest of high school speechless, because I had been turned into a monster by these militant lesbians. I felt for them. I could sense their pain. And there is a lot of pain. I know it!!!

Transferring your pain to little boys,, is NOT going to create the type of man that you would like men to become. Being turned into monsters by liars will only degenerate the problem!!! It was about this time when I began to notice that instead of 'standing up for ourselves',,, most,,, MOST of my peers just accepted it.... And became the monsters that had been demanded manifest. I watched it happen in front of me!!! All of the sudden,,,,, date rape, gang rapes, beatings,,,, One conversation I had with a buddy of mine about it put me in a corner. I was suggesting that we don't get trapped into the confusion, and that we should try and lead by example, being the best person that I/we could be. I was lambasted,,,, "You are fu#$%ng stupid, J.R.,, There isn't a single female here that would stand up for you,, why would you give a **** what they think?" (This person is in jail for domestic violence now.) It became the mantra for young teenage boys in my area. They GAVE UP!!! And a pattern of abuse was created. The icing on the cake was when me and my girlfriend broke up.. I left her house at about 7:30 pm. It was sad, yes, but we agreed that we were not meant to be. The next day, I was greeted at the door to my homeroom by 6 cops. (yeay cops) I was handcuffed, thrown to the ground, picked up by my arms that were behind me (bruised shoulders for weeks) and marched TO THE OFFICE by armed police, in front of the whole school. Apparantly, after I had left her house, her mom asked her what happened and she told her that I RAPED HER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! DO YOU SEE WHAT IS HAPPENING????? **** sticks to everyone... Of course nothing like that happened. I was able to convince the cops, the high school admins and some of my close friends of the truth, but the damage was done. Despite my being one of the only ones in that school who championed the empowerment of women,,,, POOF now the world sees me as a rapist.

Here is the crux,,,, I do NOT blame women for this... I blame ignorance. I rarely meet a woman who blames ignorance. Simply blame men...

Clearly this is an extreme case. Yet it shaped my life and outlook for YEARS.. If I hadn't embraced other, more positive aspects of myself,,, perhaps I would have given up too,,,

Even now,, I expect to be demonized by my words here....

It does not wash off.... I was victimized by the irresponsible use of power, when it came to educating the youth of America. I was victimized by lying females being supported by ignorant people.

I am all for empowering women. It is going to have a COST, if all we can do is demonize men,,, not men, really,,, Look at what is happening to young boys. I had a young boy at my daughters church come up to me and say, "Hey, you are the deadbeat!" The best way to keep this cycle running is to continue to demonize men. The kid did not even know what a 'deadbeat dad' was. He likes me, and wants to be a deadbeat!!! Do you see how that works.?

As a man, I cannot answer for the crimes of tens of thousands of years of abuse by men. As a woman, you should realize that. I cannot heal you. All I can do is nurture any relationship that I have with anyone.

I love all people,,,, black, brown, yellow, green, blue, red, male, female, gay, straight, tall, short, yuppy, hippie, nun, monk,,, etc... I apologize from my soul,,, for anything I have ever done, this life or past life, to create the imbalance we have between our genders.



I love you all,,,
Jake.


Love to you Jake and to all the wonderful men, women, beings (who knows:p we may have ETs) here.

I commend you and appreciate your stance on malehood Jake. You were completely right to react this way.

And I will tell you more. I would listen to these speeches of the very loud women lib movements, mostly lead by lesbians, and I would paradoxically understand the speeches and the reasons beneath it, and a the same time not be able to participate or be comfortable with those attitudes.

It was litterally hateful towards men, and I did not agree with it.

At the full blast of the movement, I was a teenager and you see, I loved my dad with his tiny machism. He was a caring and loving men and I could not agree with what I was hearing from those lesbians.

I do think that women often became castrating towards men when, in my idea, while their role should have been supportive in the direction young boys could take. Some women are supportive of undue machism and segregation or wrong concepts towards women, and this is truly wrong. But supportive of the chivalry side men can develop towards life, women and children, this is great, in my idea. Lots of men have this chivalry side if we, as adults, encourage it when they are boys.

Chivalry, the wonderful knight, seems, in my idea, to be the most equilibrating attitude in men and also the sexiest.

For this, men and boys need to be appreciated when they are doing the right things, when they are loving and protective, when they are fighting for their ow and their families rights, when they are knights.

And it does start with the dad, showing nightood, and the mother showing her appreciation for it in her partner and in her son.

However, I would share the blame here on both sexes. Much too many fathers abandon their children litteraly, physically, and give no knightood models to their sons, daughters, and wifes. When they do not leave physically, they often abandon morally and mentally their children. Men do need to get involved in raising their children, in being the knight, protective and loving.

====================

Edited: quite a few men seem to have, here on Avalon, this very much appreciated (at least by me) chivalry aspect in them.

[Nanoo Nanoo]

However, I would share the blame here on both sexes. Much too many fathers abandon their children litteraly, physically, and give no knightood models to their sons, daughters, and wifes. When they do not leave physically, they often abandon morally and mentally their children. Men do need to get involved in raising their children, in being the knight, protective and loving.


How can women help men achieve this ?


N

[TigaHawk]

i think it's far harder to be a woman than it is to be a man....

swap ya. seriously.

I dont doubt you Tigahawk .. being a man i know, i would not want to be a woman. But i guess there are plenty of women that love being women and men love being men and some men wish they were women too. If i were i woman i wonder would i prefer to be a man ? or would i be happy being a woman ? i guess that would be dependant on wether i am happy with the way i was born.. and yes many people are gender confused.

Thats not a problem Tigahawk , we love you just the way you are ! you have a place here with us : 0 )

Hugs


N


Haha, am perfectly fine the way i am. When i was a child tho, i wanted to be a man purely because i was sick of getting told i could not, or should not be doing things because it's stuff that men did. Like prefer transformers and ninja turtles to barbie, climb trees and play soccer. As an adult the idea that men should act one way and women another is still very prevailant. It does still come across to me that guy's get it easier and alot more relaxed with their expectations in comparison to women.

[Nanoo Nanoo]

i think it's far harder to be a woman than it is to be a man....

swap ya. seriously.

I dont doubt you Tigahawk .. being a man i know, i would not want to be a woman. But i guess there are plenty of women that love being women and men love being men and some men wish they were women too. If i were i woman i wonder would i prefer to be a man ? or would i be happy being a woman ? i guess that would be dependant on wether i am happy with the way i was born.. and yes many people are gender confused.

Thats not a problem Tigahawk , we love you just the way you are ! you have a place here with us : 0 )

Hugs


N


Haha, am perfectly fine the way i am. When i was a child tho, i wanted to be a man purely because i was sick of getting told i could not, or should not be doing things because it's stuff that men did. Like prefer transformers and ninja turtles to barbie, climb trees and play soccer. As an adult the idea that men should act one way and women another is still very prevailant. It does still come across to me that guy's get it easier and alot more relaxed with their expectations in comparison to women.

I used to think the same thing of women , that life is easier as a woman but the ideas that gave me these impressions were opposed by gender responsibilities that countered the percieved advantage , so when i explored it deeper i found no real advantage other than personal preference.

Perhaps you just need to let your Divine Tomboy flow : 0 )

aaah


lol


N

[Tesla_WTC_Solution]

Nanoo Nanoo is a champ. I think I offended Jake.

Believe me, if you had lived my life, you'd feel weird about guys too, lol :(

p.s. you mentioned Knighthood -- here is a poem written by Alfred Lord Tennyson, set to music by talented singer Lorena McKennitt

ttv0ljOiPSs

Uploaded on Mar 29, 2011
On either side of the river lie
Long fields of barley and of rye,
That clothe the wold and meet the sky;
And thro' the field the road run by
To many-towered Camelot;
And up and down the people go,
Gazing where the lilies blow
Round an island there below,
The island of Shalott.

Willows whiten, aspens quiver,
Little breezes dusk and shiver
Thro' the wave that runs for ever
By the island in the river
Flowing down to Camelot.
Four grey walls, and four grey towers,
Overlook a space of flowers,
And the silent isle imbowers
The Lady of Shalott.

Only reapers, reaping early,
In among the bearded barley
Hear a song that echoes cheerly
From the river winding clearly
Down to tower'd Camelot;
And by the moon the reaper weary,
Piling sheaves in uplands airy,
Listening, whispers "'tis the fairy
The Lady of Shalott."

There she weaves by night and day
A magic web with colours gay,
She has heard a whisper say,
A curse is on her if she stay
To look down to Camelot.
She knows not what the curse may be,
And so she weaveth steadily,
And little other care hath she,
The Lady of Shalott.

And moving through a mirror clear
That hangs before her all the year,
Shadows of the world appear.
There she sees the highway near
Winding down to Camelot;
And sometimes thro' the mirror blue
The Knights come riding two and two.
She hath no loyal Knight and true,
The Lady Of Shalott.

But in her web she still delights
To weave the mirror's magic sights,
For often thro' the silent nights
A funeral, with plumes and lights
And music, went to Camelot;
Or when the Moon was overhead,
Came two young lovers lately wed.
"I am half sick of shadows," said
The Lady Of Shalott.

A bow-shot from her bower-eaves,
He rode between the barley sheaves,
The sun came dazzling thro' the leaves,
And flamed upon the brazen greaves
Of bold Sir Lancelot.
A red-cross knight for ever kneel'd
To a lady in his shield,
That sparkled on the yellow field,
Beside remote Shalott.

His broad clear brow in sunlight glow'd;
On burnish'd hooves his war-horse trode;
From underneath his helmet flow'd
His coal-black curls as on he rode,
As he rode back to Camelot.
From the bank and from the river
he flashed into the crystal mirror,
"Tirra Lirra," by the river
Sang Sir Lancelot.

She left the web, she left the loom,
She made three paces taro' the room,
She saw the water-lily bloom,
She saw the helmet and the plume,
She looked down to Camelot.
Out flew the web and floated wide;
The mirror cracked from side to side;
"The curse is come upon me," cried
The Lady of Shalott.

In the stormy east-wind straining,
The pale yellow woods were waning,
The broad stream in his banks complaining.
Heavily the low sky raining
Over towered Camelot;
Down she came and found a boat
Beneath a willow left afloat,
And round about the prow she wrote
The Lady of Shalott

And down the river's dim expanse
Like some bold seer in a trance,
Seeing all his own mischance -
With a glassy countenance
Did she look to Camelot.
And at the closing of the day
She loosed the chain and down she lay;
The broad stream bore her far away,
The Lady of Shalott.

Heard a carol, mournful, holy,
Chanted loudly, chanted lowly,
Till her blood was frozen slowly,
And her eyes were darkened wholly,
Turn'd to towered Camelot.
For ere she reach'd upon the tide
The first house by the water-side,
Singing in her song she died,
The Lady of Shalott.

Under tower and balcony,
By garden-wall and gallery,
A gleaming shape she floated by,
Dead-pale between the houses high,
Silent into Camelot.
Out upon the wharfs they came,
Knight and Burgher, Lord and Dame,
And round the prow they read her name,
The Lady of Shalott.

Who is this? And what is here?
And in the lighted palace near
Died the sound of royal cheer;
And they crossed themselves for fear,
All the Knights at Camelot;
But Lancelot mused a little space
He said, "She has a lovely face;
God in his mercy lend her grace,
The Lady of Shalott."

[wolf_rt]

I am for equality, for all PEOPLE. 'Womens rights' is part of the problem... Human rights are what is necessary.

It irritates me when people speak about 'Masculinity' as if having a penis automatically makes you a violent person, or in need of some sort of adjustment.

Many men are violent and abusive, Many women are violent and abusive, many PEOPLE are violent and abusive, its the violence and abuse that is the issue, not our sex.

If a woman punches the crap out of somebody, she is showing a 'masculine' trait... Why? Yes, statistically men commit more physical violence, but if we start throwing statistics around, we can 'prove' all sorts of things about any minority you name.


The fact that our culture has different expectations of men and women while at the same time espousing 'equality of the sexes' leads to much confusion.

Do I hold the door for a lady?
Should a man pay for dinner?
Questions like this are numerous and up to the man to answer on a minute by minute basis. if the man makes the wrong decision he is despised for it, but either way could be appropriate depending on the girl. (he didn't make me feel special/he was patronising)

If everyone treated everyone else like a PERSON, we would be in a lot better shape.

On Bill's thread he seemed to suggest that the world would be a better place without men, i have heard this sentiment expressed by both men and women.
To do away with men is a violent action (toward the species)... I have never heard a man suggest that we should do away with women.

Is this really because males are 'worse'? is there any way to tell? Females of other species are often the violent ones. Perhaps the 'male violent disposition' is learned rather that coded in our DNA?

And finally, lets talk more about 'equality of the sexes' when men can carry babies.

[minkton]

Here is the crux,,,, I do NOT blame women for this... I blame ignorance. I rarely meet a woman who blames ignorance. Simply blame men...



Can you think of anything at all that is undesirable, that isnt caused by ignorance?

There isnt a single bad thing amongst humans that has it's germination in any other locale.

Ignorance is the root of all evil.

I think this discussion is is useful to shed light on how to dispel ignorance. In oneself first of all.

Like with AA, or any scheme for overcoming addiction, the first step is to admit the ignorance and admit the trespasses one has committed under the umbrella of ignorance.

Unfortunately strident punitive feminism is such a force that in those whose buttons are being pushed, it sets up automatically a strong counter force, and many get flipped straight into a degree of resistance which blinds and deafens them so much that no pain and grievance of others can be heard and acknowledged.

This is the plight of the strident feminist.. if their voices were able to express the agony and depression they feel on behalf of their gender, on behalf of their mothers sisters and grandmothers and the feminine principle.. if their voices could express the profound cries of anguish and if they coud cry like banshees for the trespasses against them.. maybe more compassion would spark into life for them. As it is, they receive very little love. And tons of resistance, which seeks essentially to negate and nullify their expression.

The old saying 'its not what you say, its the way that you say it.. '.. well, the old sayings are the best ones..

[Jake]

Nanoo Nanoo is a champ. I think I offended Jake.



:) No, not at all. I've been quite busy, but this discussion has been on my mind continually. I have been contemplating the idea of Divine Masculine, and what it would take to fulfill something like that in my own life, and my own community. There is still a lot of pain. One of the untold (and very ugly) truths in our country is the violent abuse and rape of our young girls. Growing up, I went to 4 different high schools. Before that I had gone to about a dozen different schools in 5 different States. I moved around a lot, and was able to learn from the diverse 'samplings' of the different communities/towns I had lived in, and been a part of. One of the un-talked about things in every place that I remember (ever since I first heard about it,,) was rape and molestation. I have always been a good 'listener' type, and have been able to see a devastating and unchecked truth about pattern abuses toward women. Specifically Molestation/Rape. I have heard many stories, and I have confronted entire families about it. There is an ugly 'stain' in the air, when it comes to being a Man, and standing up for ourselves.

My grandfather once told me that if I wanted to become a man,, I would have to throw away everything I knew about being a man.

There was no grace or elegance to it for me,,, not for a long time.

There is no grace or elegance in being a man. I don't say that with a heavy heart. :) The best things that I have ever done for my family was to make sacrifices... Does that make me a man? There are many aspects of 'manhood' that can be embraced. The only thing that I ever saw my grandfather, or father ever do, was to honor and hold most sacred, my Mother and Grandmother(s). That was what I thought the whole world was doing! I was in for a rude awakening. Yet, it does not change the fellow that I am today. In fact,,, I know exactly what to nurture in the young men in my community. My daughters are 15 and 16, and every little dude I meet, I have a BIG impression on. When I give mee wee speeches to them, they always 'get it'... And are excited to here practical and responsible things coming from an adult. I mentor wherever I go.. I was involved in a local Food Bank for a couple of years. Many people, adult and teenage and even the old timers are delighted to listen to me talk to one of the youngsters about becoming an adult, and yes, becoming a man. Fathers don't talk about this kind of thing to their sons much anymore.

I am surrounded by AMAZING Females. My mom, mee sis, my wife, my daughters. Whenever I forward think about a better world, I am thinking about them. All generations of women should be put on a pedestal and treated like the Heroes that they are!!! That is the future that I would create!! I am surrounded by AMAZING females.

(wow, that was almost a poem :))

I think that we are to recover an identity as men, we are going to need you (women) to walk us through it. Maybe, lead by example. I see it everywhere I go. It is NOT a lost cause.

I love you all,,,
Jake.

[CD7]

Ummmmm WHY CANT WE ALL JUST BE WHO WE ARE AS A BEING?

This video to me seemed divisive. The camps between male and female separated-- expectations between certain type of genders--- We FALL for these roles hook, line and sinkher!

As a female, I have never followed my expected role...because what was expected of me---WAS NOT ME and I would suspect this swings the other way for some men too...

We should be opening the door for EVERYONE....that's what loving beings to for one another regardless of age, sex, class species--ya know we can open the door for a dog too :)

[RunningDeer]

On Bill's thread he seemed to suggest that the world would be a better place without men, i have heard this sentiment expressed by both men and women.
You bring up a lot of good point here, wolf_rt. With the exception of: "On Bill's thread he seemed to suggest that the world would be a better place without men.." That wasn't my read at all.

And just in case and for the record, I dig diversity. I'm not one of those that as you put it: "i heard this sentiment expressed by both men and women."

If you feel strongly about what Bill seems to suggest, then state that on his thread. It's lost here.

[Nanoo Nanoo]

On Bill's thread he seemed to suggest that the world would be a better place without men, i have heard this sentiment expressed by both men and women.
You bring up a lot of good point here, wolf_rt. With the exception of: "On Bill's thread he seemed to suggest that the world would be a better place without men.." That wasn't my read at all.

And just in case and for the record, I dig diversity. I'm not one of those that as you put it: "i heard this sentiment expressed by both men and women."

If you feel strongly about what Bill seems to suggest, then state that on his thread. It's lost here.

Some of the comments on that thread were more of a " carnival barker " origin, as opposed to true opinions .. hmm

N

[panopticon]

It irritates me when people speak about 'Masculinity' as if having a penis automatically makes you a violent person, or in need of some sort of adjustment.

Many men are violent and abusive, Many women are violent and abusive, many PEOPLE are violent and abusive, its the violence and abuse that is the issue, not our sex.

If a woman punches the crap out of somebody, she is showing a 'masculine' trait... Why? Yes, statistically men commit more physical violence, but if we start throwing statistics around, we can 'prove' all sorts of things about any minority you name.


The One in Three Campaign was initiated in Australia to acknowledge that 1 in 3 cases of domestic violence in Australia is perpetrated by a female on a male and that 'male victims are more likely to suffer serious injuries, while female victims are more likely to suffer minor injuries' (source (http://www.oneinthree.com.au/faqs/)).

For more information on the One in Three Campaign visit their website:
http://www.oneinthree.com.au/
Kind Regards, :yo:
Panopticon

[Nanoo Nanoo]

It irritates me when people speak about 'Masculinity' as if having a penis automatically makes you a violent person, or in need of some sort of adjustment.

Many men are violent and abusive, Many women are violent and abusive, many PEOPLE are violent and abusive, its the violence and abuse that is the issue, not our sex.

If a woman punches the crap out of somebody, she is showing a 'masculine' trait... Why? Yes, statistically men commit more physical violence, but if we start throwing statistics around, we can 'prove' all sorts of things about any minority you name.


The One in Three Campaign was initiated in Australia to acknowledge that 1 in 3 cases of domestic violence in Australia is perpetrated by a female on a male and that 'male victims are more likely to suffer serious injuries, while female victims are more likely to suffer minor injuries' (source (http://www.oneinthree.com.au/faqs/)).

For more information on the One in Three Campaign visit their website:
http://www.oneinthree.com.au/
Kind Regards, :yo:
Panopticon

Very good site , i am surprised really. Its almost ominous hearing of groups that support men. Wow nice

thank you

M

[Jake]

Ummmmm WHY CANT WE ALL JUST BE WHO WE ARE AS A BEING?

This video to me seemed divisive. The camps between male and female separated-- expectations between certain type of genders--- We FALL for these roles hook, line and sinkher!

As a female, I have never followed my expected role...because what was expected of me---WAS NOT ME and I would suspect this swings the other way for some men too...

We should be opening the door for EVERYONE....that's what loving beings to for one another regardless of age, sex, class species--ya know we can open the door for a dog too :)

What is expected of us is generally, flawed.
As a female, I have never followed my expected role...because what was expected of me As a human,,, I can react opposite of what is expected of me,,,, But if what is expected of me is flawed, and I act opposite,,, well, then I am still lost. You bring up a valid point. We will all have to be ourselves, in the end...

I suspect that in these times,, I cannot be who I AM,, if YOU are not who YOU are... It all comes full circle to standing in our own powers and truths.. I know that I cannot hold myself together, as a man,,, if you cannot hold yourself together as a woman. There is a duality,,, I inspire you,,, you inspire me... And that's it!!!!

Love to you CD7
Jake

[Nanoo Nanoo]

As a man trying to survive Post Femminism it took me quite a few years to realise some intrinsic things but only after i realised after an almost 2 year stint of celibacy that i was very happy without sex and without a woman in my life at all. In that 2 years i realised there was so much more to life than being dependant on someobdy being my partner and sexual buddy. I looked at women differently , without the need to pro create which was not really my desire at all anymore. In reality what do i need to be with a woman for ?

The reason for my stint, as requested , was to re define to my self what was important in resonating to a higher cause. Reading philosophy for expample i found so soothing and it enriched my imagination. So when it came time to get back into a relationship ie i felt i was ready, I found my self in the same quandry of having to open my trust and emotions to someone ,slowly letting them in as they earned my trust. It was true id learned nothing for reading philosophy other than to look further into the self.

But in this i found a fatal flaw... giving such trust and then having the notion/ assumption that your partner shares the same values at such an early stage was a silly move on my part ... again ! .. this was a complete blow to me as i found my trust was , in a minor way , mishandled. Moving forward now i see that perhaps i was holding onto a notion of love that is getting harder to achieve or maybe it was an ideal placed in our society that we all aspire to but without the proper training to negotiate it. Regardless of all this where was my place in taking responsability for my own demise ? It was under the rose coloured glasses... I think that the " In Love " stage of relationships can be dangerous and perhaps where most of the mistakes are made. Guys and Girls dont assume that because you are in love that your partner has the same values as you ! get to know them !


The selection process seems to hinge on some basics that dont serve in the long run and thats distorted by the "In Love" period.

Now getting back to Post Feminism , for men now and i say this mostly for the benefit of women who are confused now , whats happening to all the good men? I have to say the femminist movement is creating " Yes Boys " in that its still happening and women like yes boys to order around but they dont inspire any passion do they ? The Femminist movement was needed and i think it was a good thing, back then when it started, but ladies , we get it , can you just be happy you achieved your goals ? because the relentless brow beating for everything wrong in the world boils down to a mans fault is a moot point when you take into account we have been running the place for since forever... of course we are going to look bad .. but is it a male thing or a thing that both men and women share but men have had longer to exploit it ? It seems now that the powers are equal that women too are abusing their power and it seems they are not the virtuous innocents they reletlessly paint them selves as.

Whats ever is going on the greater problem for women now as a back last of, " Not Calling It a Day ", on men bashing, is this. Men have realised we dont need you.

This is why we are not marrying any more.. Look at the divorce rise and marriage rate falls since the inception of the femminist movement. There are a few things at play here.

Fistly it took us 50 years but we now realise there is no more benefit to being married, in fact its down right dangerous for an elligeble bachelor to marry. So we have been making ajustments to this. And as men have done for so long we can live quite happily on our own in fact we are happier without all the responsabilities and limitations that come with marriage not to mention the heavy financial burdons.

So the Post Femminist Man is living a better life style. Cooking and Cleaning arent that hard, in fact i quite enjoy it and if it gets hard hire a maid, for $120 a week you can have your house cleaned and clothes washed and ironed and after 10 years you dont have to give her your house! Then what do you do with the rest of your time and money ? well thats up to you ... its up to you ? wow, you choose what to do when and with whom ... most femminists will be offended by this ... and that just serves to proove how much they depend on us. They dont want us to be indipendant , they want to assert control and thats dangerous as a society of women to grow up in that sort of clture, they become prickly and we dont find that attractive so we can just live on our own and date girls and live a happy life style. I mean if thats what you aspire to .. personally i prefer to ride a bike or read a book instead of fishing for a date..

I bet there are men her that are even afraid to agree with me and so to keep the peace will not comment or press the thank you button.

Men are living in fear and as a result becoming Yes Boys, and thats what you women now have to date ... For those men out there who want marriage i say go for it ! its a beautiful institution and one i wish i could have faith in. But to be honest im not obligated to get married , its not a test of man hood , no actually its just a choice and i choose to enjoy my life and not breed more children in an over populated world where kids stave on the street without caring parents.

What men are confused about is the double standards of women. They want equality yet they endorse skewed laws that are not about equality. Men have become a cash cow, a support system to a standard of living and why is it that we owe you a standard of living ? one you are accustomed to ? Do you not realise we were acustomed to a standard fo living too ? But why dont you care about that ? We are confused , its either one way or the other.


What needs to change now in order to complete the femminist wish is

Remove Alimony Entitlement. Whish is enlisting fear in men to getting married.
Remove Custody Laws. Which makes kids into cash cows.
Open and Close your own doors.
Pay for your own way.

Thats egalitarianism.


Men are self sufficient and the writing is on the wall that we are happier in this life style that feminism has given us. So i endorse feminism whole heartedly. Its a good system.

What do you think was going to happen ? or is accountability not part of your agenda ?

N
N

[Nanoo Nanoo]

I Love this song !


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Qa28ZrHPcc

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Heres another one of my faves !


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGjElvt4nP8

[mosquito]

As a man .....

Yes to everything. Thank you for having the courage to actually say it. Your truth will help us ALL, men and women, heal our wounds.

[Nanoo Nanoo]

As a man .....

Yes to everything. Thank you for having the courage to actually say it. Your truth will help us ALL, men and women, heal our wounds.

thank you Mariposafe , I know i went a little out on a limb with that post.. and i am a little put out that our beautiful and supportive women have not come in to make comment or support us ... thats a shame.

I wanted to share something with you today, Just recently i was invited to speak to a women's forum live. It was a small group of women , about 20 .. And the first thing they said when i stood up to talk is " you are very brave coming here to talk to us " which i replied .. " I could not think of anything better than to be endangered by such a beautiful audience " You can imagine the response i got.

Whats even more interesting, this group had invited two other male speakers to talk about relationships and address the question of " where have all the good men gone " and none responded to their request... I personally chomped at the bit to get in there. As it turned out is was a fantastic talk and i really enjoyed their company .. the talk was supposed to be 2 hours .. it ended up going on for 6 hours !

What i deduced is that when women get insight , delivered in the right way , they truly get it and they truly take it on board. Women are so willing to try things and improve, they are really very inquisitive creatures bound by mental stimulation. So Men , if you are reading this for gods sake try to speak to women in a way that gets their curiosity and meditate on what you want to say , from the heart. Remember its a two way street .. we need to re integrate just as much as they do.

N

[mosquito]

Fantastic ! Thanks for sharing.

PS - Yes it is a shame that the many loving and supportive women don't come here. Oh well, c'est la vie, for now.

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Here is a top video : 0 )


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QlvuatQH12E


www.alimonyreform.org

For those who want to take it a step further , call and have alimony abolished once and for all !

Support feminism in getting equality ! instead of these barbaric laws treating women like weak in capable second rate citizens ! We know women can do it ! we need to support them by letting them stand on their own two feet and show us how they can support them selves. This is true equality : 0 )

Hugs

N

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Yes but who was it telling you not to play with boys toys ?



Quote Posted by Nanoo Nanoo (here)
Quote Posted by TigaHawk (here)
i think it's far harder to be a woman than it is to be a man....

swap ya. seriously.
I dont doubt you Tigahawk .. being a man i know, i would not want to be a woman. But i guess there are plenty of women that love being women and men love being men and some men wish they were women too. If i were i woman i wonder would i prefer to be a man ? or would i be happy being a woman ? i guess that would be dependant on wether i am happy with the way i was born.. and yes many people are gender confused.

Thats not a problem Tigahawk , we love you just the way you are ! you have a place here with us : 0 )

Hugs


N

Haha, am perfectly fine the way i am. When i was a child tho, i wanted to be a man purely because i was sick of getting told i could not, or should not be doing things because it's stuff that men did. Like prefer transformers and ninja turtles to barbie, climb trees and play soccer. As an adult the idea that men should act one way and women another is still very prevailant. It does still come across to me that guy's get it easier and alot more relaxed with their expectations in comparison to women.

[MargueriteBee]

Well my neighbors are getting divorced. He looks down on all women and talks to them like they are ALL stupid. Good for her, she put her foot down and took her power back. Him, he is 80 years old and homeless. What goes around, comes around.

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Lovely stuff Margurite ! sounds like you got the whole story there : 0 )

now on to some less angry stuff , an ask mens forum with some stats ! actual men being interviewed and men telling us what they are up to !

http://www.askmen.com/specials/2009-great-male-survey/

N

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Most Influencial man as voted by Men , Mr Elon Musk... Elon ? Musk ? Yes gents and gents the leader in charge of Tesla and the Hyperloop.

more info here

http://au.askmen.com/specials/2013_top_49/1-elon-musk.html


N

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Alpha Male Training http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ViIASd-j1s

The Problem with giving power to women http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqPcugvL0T0

Abuse that leads to fatherless children http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_Ng84CoFDs

Illustration of this problem http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gF628DbcJbA

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Guys

if you want to find good women you need training

This is good advice here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sv4dlDPSQGA

Girls night out ? Beware ! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMNqVWuwMyo&feature=c4-overview-vl&list=PLuSPW3m3l8ww9AsN71gSMEbjZiCCv1RhC

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Why men are not marrying

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BoXQf2f2Yxo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlvMAS_20K4

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Hey Guys

I have been reading up on useful tips to try to understand women and indeed re integrate with them. Its true we have kinda lost our way and if we were to read magazines and articles to get back to being in control of our affairs we may end up even more confused.

One thing i have learned is this , we need to get back to basics if we are going to survive Post Femminism ( i say post because its run its course )

I tend to notice when i speak about these issues i get sort of , well , sometimes abused , because women generally take this as an attack on their femminism but if they dig a little deeper they will see this information is something to actually help bring us together. I also notice men are afraid of responding or having a say soemtimes ... well im not : 0 ) why ? because ultimately thats what it takes to tackle un desirable issues. Mind you im sure if i was a bit more pc in my communications id probably avoid most of it .. i have to admit , being pc is not my forte .. in fact i kinda get my kinks out of being the opposite .. cruel ? meh .. i have my reasons.

One thing only few guys get is how women work and vise versa .. these people have very succesful dating and fun with the opposite sex, Why ? because they didnt stop playing the age old game ... the age old game is something natural that just happens , the new game has been re written by a myriad of womens magazines and its not only confused men but its confused their readers as well.

Womens magazines tend to try to tip the balance of power and possesion to the woman .. this is the new age of Self Empowerment that women have lovingly taken on as part of their consumeristic self congratulation. I have seen this and its demise , when women reach the end of their spending dollar , they become saddened and dont know why ... this i find sad. The rush of that new pair of shoes or that bracelet or dress only lasts one day , if that ... mind you diamonds are forever ( and so is the repayment plan ) ...

SO before you take this as a beat up on women , guys realise its up to us to take control of the situation before it gets out of hand. One thing i would definitely do is not bow down to un reasonable demands. I spent the last 15 years watch my older brother get pummeled by women in relationships... why ? because he dosent appreciate a good woman. Yeah thats why , he has had at least 2 that were awesome women and he flaked on them because he lost interest.. after this ( asif to serve his karma ) he took on an un fortunate soul that was abused .. he wanted to repair her , he was there for the wrong reasons and he paid for it for 12 years ... the scars he has now are probably un fixable.. He is more like her now than him self.. he took on her defensive behaviour to counter act and survive. But this clearly didnt work.

Now he has found another lady thas pummling him again and pushing him around .. its so sad , he is constantly apologising for even being kind or wanting to be a gentleman,... Its not her fault , its his fault. And i defend the ladies here in that men should not endure this , you should let men that like this endure this. The amount of frustration this causes him is ghastly ... and he endures it why ? because of a pointless idea planted in his head about an ideal that he has been groomed to live up to that has no bearing on reality.

So whats the answer ? well i know what i would do ... but im not here to tell you that .. im here merely to show you the rebounded effects that our state of abuseive traits combined with a femministic rebellion all of which are misguided and reactionary.. the end result is nothing short of a mess.... and now we have to sift through it all to make up.

here is an article i found that truly made sense and i can tell you now , it works. Its a good read for men ( women dont read it , we dont want you learning too much ; )


http://stagetwo.wordpress.com/2009/01/27/why-do-women-flake-and-how-should-we-respond/

Its called Why Do Women Flake , and if you didnt read this you would be a frustrated man , unless you knew instinctively how women work, and i get it .. i think women have a handle on their feelings and how to really reach in , how to cultivate the essense of romance .. we need to take a leaf out of their book here guys and re learn romance. Romance is about a MAN being with a WOMAN , not a new age poofter with a demanding bitch. There goes that pc thing ... sorry i just think it illustrates my point more effectively : 0 )

I hope you enjoy the read , its awesome

Hugs

Naniu

[Nanoo Nanoo]

One of my most favorite women figues of this century Ayn Rand , a beautiful and pensive woman whose nature and mind totally get me every time i see her.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3u8Jjth81_Q

Enjoy

[Nanoo Nanoo]

How to avoid alimony.

Men who are married and thinking of divorce should read up.

http://www.ask.com/question/how-to-avoid-paying-alimony

N

[dianna]

How to avoid alimony.

Men who are married and thinking of divorce should read up.

http://www.ask.com/question/how-to-avoid-paying-alimony

N

Sometimes there is a reason for alimony … and a very good one at that …

[pugwash84]

In some places in the world men and women are equal, split the dinner cost on date etc which I like that idea. Some places women are not seen as an equal to men but in other places women seem to be so obsessed with being as good as men that men do not want to help women incase it is deemed offensive.
I think men should not be worried to help a woman or a man. I think humans should all be equal no matter what gender, religion, sexuality etc. It would be nice to live in a world where everyone loved and helped each other and it would be nice to live in a world where women can freely express their femininity and men can express their masculinity.

[Nanoo Nanoo]

In some places in the world men and women are equal, split the dinner cost on date etc which I like that idea. Some places women are not seen as an equal to men but in other places women seem to be so obsessed with being as good as men that men do not want to help women incase it is deemed offensive.
I think men should not be worried to help a woman or a man. I think humans should all be equal no matter what gender, religion, sexuality etc. It would be nice to live in a world where everyone loved and helped each other and it would be nice to live in a world where women can freely express their femininity and men can express their masculinity.

Thank you Pugwash, beautifully said :-) i couldnt agree more.

Hugs

N

[Alexander]

Check this out -


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKaNl2QKXwE

This lady is rather elegant, honest, and fair towards men in her discussion. Redice Radio is also a great alternative media outlet for those unfamiliar with it.

[Nanoo Nanoo]

How to avoid alimony.

Men who are married and thinking of divorce should read up.

http://www.ask.com/question/how-to-avoid-paying-alimony

N

Sometimes there is a reason for alimony … and a very good one at that …


Well yes and no. In times previous to this when a marriage ended the man was obliged to pay to support his ex wife for a period of 3 months while she re gains employment. The children were not batered off as a bargaining tool as it is in modern divorce. So what i object to is the rifling of assets and wedging the children as a bater tool for more money and continued alimony. Thats criminal and absolute evil in my eyes.

The use of alimony has been corrupted into a glorious money game where there is 9 times out of 10 only one beneficiary. This furthers its use as a tool of evil as the woman is made to go beyond her normal perameters at the beckoning of lawyers to

Kick out the man
Turn the children against the father to ensure custody ( which in its self is wrong )
Then blame the man for not being a father figure after he has been stripped of all assets and rights.

This is where alimony ultmately leads. So the smart man is not marrying he is not commiting. Yes and we hear that mean are comitaphobes and all this by the ones creating the problem in the first place.

Because this is a basic premise of womens natural state, to be provided for, it is the most fearful thing they can face and that is having to fend for them selves. To wake up and go to work and complain they have to look after the children because the father has gone, all because she kicked him out and bakrupted him, turned the kids against him etc etc, can you see the hypocricy ?

Alimony is a great supporter of this bankrupted evil system.

Look at divorce rates since this was introduced, its a tell as to what is a prime motivater for the benefactor. This is not a good look for women and it needs to be said. No women dont like hearing it, anything that threatens their golden egg is slandered an mysoginy.

But how is all this going to help us get closer? As you can see we men have been toted as evil, but when you put the free will and carrot of corruption out there we see women dive right in without even a thought to the health and raising of their chldren.

In ten years time we will see the horrible back lash of this behaviour.

N

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Thank you alexander, there are a lot of intelligent women speaking up against femminism in spport of men. They see where its headed and speak beautiful wisdom. I must say women have a way with expression. I often find them more pleasing to listen to.

N

[mosquito]

... I think humans should all be equal no matter what gender, religion, sexuality etc. It would be nice to live in a world where everyone loved and helped each other and it would be nice to live in a world where women can freely express their femininity and men can express their masculinity.

Yes. Yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes !!