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Phoenix1304
9th October 2013, 08:13
I’ve seen it mentioned in posts that there are a number of empaths on Avalon and I would like to invite you to this thread for some sharing and advice.

In my case empathy has been something of an affliction and I did not fully wake up to it until quite recently.

I was actually told I was an empath, in my twenties, following an incident in Sedona with a medicine woman (how new age can you get?) I will share if anyone wants to know, but I really didn’t get it, I didn’t really know what it meant. She said ‘if you don’t learn to control it, it will toss you about like a leaf in the wind”. I should have asked her how I could control it, but I suppose I was slack-jawed and still completely unaware that the roller-coaster of emotional turmoil I had lived until then was not all about just little ole mixed up me.

Fast forward thirty years and finally beginning to get it. I realised that I have been susceptible my whole life, starting with my parents and siblings. Thinking about it now, that was probably why I used to retreat to play the piano and seek to spend time alone. If I was a radio, I ‘d have a very loose dial, so whatever gets close to me draws the dial to its frequency and I start resonating to that, my personal frequency gets tuned out, drowned out.

I can also experience how someone was feeling from sitting in the same chair after them, I sense people’s energies in my home long after they’ve left and I’m also strangely aware of when people close to me have been with other people, like I sense their energies on them and how it influences their behaviour.

Once, a work colleague, put their hand on my back and I burst into tears, trying to control the sobs and feeling so embarrassed because I had no clue where it had come from or what was happening to me, but the deepest sorrow overwhelmed me and the tears flowed. I learned, the next day, that this individual had been experiencing deep inner sorrow. But not before spending the night deeply concerned about my sanity.

Another time, at a dinner party, I suddenly felt so pained that tears rolled down my face for another embarrassing hour of everyone looking askance at me, and of course I could offer no explanation for the endless stream of tears, or the twisting pain that engulfed me. Now it dawns that I was sitting next to someone whose daughter was dying of cancer at the time. It was a revelation. That’s why she watched me so fascinated as her pain rolled down my cheeks. Tears that I could do nothing to stop. Our eyes met deeply a couple of times, though at no time did I realise it was her pain, just further embarrassment that she had reason to be weeping, not I. There are no words, pictures, insights as far as I’m aware, only emotional pain. Perhaps if I wasn’t so concerned about why “I” was feeling this way, I might see why ‘they’ are feeling that way!

My preference for solitude is because, but for a rare few people, that are sane and well, I don’t really feel peaceful unless I’m alone and even then it’s hard to get away from the impact of others’ energies whether it be their car alarms, raised voices, or the thumps and clunks of neighbours going about their business, that I seem to find abnormally disturbing.

Sometimes I feel like screaming for peace! Sometimes I long to be among a cloister of peaceful silent nuns!, but I know I must be, and have been, very much a part of the world with all it’s madness and haste.

I imagine rage, for example, is in a frequency that may contain all the angry thoughts anyone ever had, despair and quieter, subtle emotions also have their loaded frequencies and once tuned in I put my own unique mental spin on it and expand the frequency. This is how I often ended up taking other people’s ‘stuff’ as my own. Making it my own in fact. It makes me wonder how many depressives are actually empaths and just don’t know it.

Given some extended time alone, a bit of yoga and meditation, I can find balance. But I’m still struggling in company. I frequently experience a smiling face and convivial behaviour as a mask to underlying anguish, the British can be so stoic which can be quite confusing for an unaware empath! I’m finding social interractions increasingly testing, now that I’m more aware of it and most everyone is in some kind of despair due to the vile leadership humanity is having to endure.

I am in the process of trying to find an effective way to close myself down or neutralise receiving the energetic imprints of others’ emotional states, or physical discomfort associated with illness, maybe they have stronger waves. Joy is strong too, but then that isn’t a problem! (or as common in adults, : ( ). Sending out light and love from my heart centre can be helpful, to stay in my own frequency and to try and positively effect theirs, but too often I’m already too ‘out of whack’ to even think of it. Smudging at home helps a lot too.

I’m getting better a recognising when I am being pulled out of my own frequency, but it’s often too late, as I say, for anything other than a deep breath, like trying to bolt the door after the horse has already bolted all over my chakra system and left me reeling like that proverbial leaf tossed in the wind.

I’ve visited some sites on the internet by young empaths that are busy turning their ‘gift’ into a business - I’m not inclined to pay anyone $120 to discuss it, as sad to say, the old ‘put a bubble around yourself’ and grounding exercises usually suggested have been of little use to me.

Also, I don’t know if it’s connected, but I often wake with a deep feeling of sadness and the desire to weep. Yesterday, I quelled it with ‘no, I’m not going there’, other times I just ‘let it go’ and have a good cry, to kind of purge it, but I’m so tired of the sadness and weeping as if for the world and feel emotionally exhausted a lot of the time.

Okay so that’s a bit about how I feel about it, I don’t think of it as an ability or a gift, it’s only ever been a problem for me. I’d appreciate the input of any ‘old hands’, and perhaps some sharing of your experiences and how it affects you, how you shield yourselves and hopefully any good positive use you have found for it. As far as I’m concerned, empathy with those that are suffering is of little use when you just feel as bad as they do.

Sérénité
9th October 2013, 08:40
Its easier once you learn to distinguish your own feelings from those being projected onto you, but its still hard isnt it!

I never get lonely being alone, im not a recluse by any means, but its just the only time Im truly myself. Its nice to just switch off and 'get lost' in your own thoughts and feelings, knowing for sure they are your own!
I do see it as a curse. People dont even have to speak, I know how theyre feeling just by being in their presence. You can see it in their eyes and aura. It makes it hard to be around certain people. Especially the angry ones or the energy vampires, they turn a simple coffee and chat into what feels like an hour in the ring with Mike Tyson.

I too have so far found no way of shutting off or putting the bubble around me. Thankfully Im naturally upbeat, so it doesnt take me long to snap out of it, but it can be so draining at times and it would be nice if anyone has any tips and techniques to share?

Tesla_WTC_Solution
9th October 2013, 08:43
A Spirit Journey for Tired Empaths

May you close your eyes, distance yourself from the clamor for a moment.
You are soaring, like a carefree bird, riding the wind toward a peaceful place. There is sand below you first, then water.
The air feels cool between your feathers and the sun feels warm upon your back. There is nothing holding you except the sky.
You can hear the other seagulls calling, but it's a non-intrusive, joyous sound. Your heart beats gladly.
The sad feelings dissolve when you hear the calling, like clouds breaking up in rays of sunlight after a storm.
Your brethren are restoring you. You hear pride and companionship in their cry, no sadness.
You are the king of the air and the sea. In your element nothing can harm you, because the storm has passed away over the horizon.
Your wings are strong and your heart is light. The other birds cry once more, and begin to scatter out over the ocean.
You descend toward the water in a wide, leisurely circle, and see the waves stretching out forever, light playing over them as far as the eye can see.
It seems to take a lifetime to reach the waves, but it's the best life. It's your life. And you are so proud to be alive. Your wings are strong.
Your feet want to feel the water. Suddenly you are skipping across the waves, strong wings holding you steady, feet pounding the surf.
And then, like the most graceful sailing ship with billowing white glory, you nest into the top of a wave and ride the ocean.
You can close your eyes again, and feel the waves carrying you from top to bottom, high and low. You are safe. There is no danger, no one to see.
There is the rich salty smell of the ancient waters of the whole world in one place. There is the sound of tiny fish leaping from the wavetops.
They have lived here for a million million years and will live here for a million million more. This is the place of plenty, the place of complete happiness.
You are so hungry. You have waited such a long time for this place. You have traveled so far and for so long to find it.
The salt of the ocean breeze, the taste of tender fish in your beak, the innocence of the tickling waves around your feet. It is wonderful.
It's as if you've known this place all your life. It was there before your life. It was there for the beginning of your life. And it is here now.
You don't have to search any more. There is no journey, no more waiting. All around you is the blue and the gold and the silver and white of purity.
Nature whispers its deepest secrets to you through the ripples, the lurching waves, the tiniest droplet of water hitting the surface of the sea.
Without words, you become wise. And the wisdom is letting go of what you knew before, to be yourself and to be everything noble.
There is no shame. There is no size. There is no "place" in this place except itself. The ocean welcomes you with arms eternally open.
When you are full and satisfied, you close your eyes. When you open them again, a storm has appeared on the horizon.
But you are a clever bird, and your strong white wings, like the sails of a great ship, lift you high and far.
You are safely gone before the storm has even thought of coming. It sleeps also, deep black cloud dreams rumbling in its head.
But you are awake. You know who you are. And over the thunder you hear the cry of a bird, the most beautiful sound. It is your voice.
Like a trumpet call to greet the setting sun flaring up in scarlet, your voice rises to heaven.
And find yourself standing at the edge of the ocean on human feet. And your feet carry you away from the edge of the water, through the warm sand.
And the storm is always behind you, with the dawn ahead of you. Your wings will wait until you need them again.
The ocean, our mother, whispers her secrets still, beneath the unquiet clouds. You can hear her wishing you well as your journey begins again.

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ____

I hope you are feeling better after reading this, :)
Your story -- you are not alone.

Shannow
9th October 2013, 09:11
I appreciate your post, can't offer a lot of help, but can tell you something that I found to be particularly distressing.

Back in the day (20 years ago), with people I cared about, and friends, I could do lots of that stuff, particularly identify on a sketch what they were feeling and where, and "purple" the pain away (my visualisation technique at the time), including some pretty massive migraines that my partner was prone to. Intense "purpling",and static would transfer too.

As a mechanical engineer, I was the go-to guy, as I could diagnose car issues during discussion...e.g. told one guy that his catalytic converter had disintegrated and was clogging his muffler. Point on a plan as to where to look for a failure on the plant.

Uncomfortable in large groups, as there was often a swirling, seething, rolling energy that was either too buoyant, or upsetting, and trying to follow five discussions at a time.

Mother in Law in terminal last days of Cancer was nearly my undoing. Walking into the hospital room, I could feel both her desperation to live (she was pretty well unconscious most times then), and my energy leaving. People took me as sulky/surly, but I could scarcely function. Honestly feel that I came close to succumbing at the time, and was blaming the woman posthumously for psychic vampirism (not intentionally on her part).

Took me a while to talk to my partner (couldn't tell her that I thought her Mum had nearly killed me), and she suggested that I was capable of delivering energy, and that she believed that there was a transfer taking place. Took a year + for it all to start to resolve.

Don't know what happened, whether something broke, I turned something off, but I can still "feel" machines, but not people.

Obviously, you'll never know what circumstances that you will come across, but please be careful of being around the dying.

Phoenix1304
9th October 2013, 09:14
A Spirit Journey for Tired Empaths

May you close your eyes, distance yourself from the clamor for a moment.
You are soaring, like a carefree bird, riding the wind toward a peaceful place. There is sand below you first, then water.
The air feels cool between your feathers and the sun feels warm upon your back. There is nothing holding you except the sky.
You can hear the other seagulls calling, but it's a non-intrusive, joyous sound. Your heart beats gladly.
The sad feelings dissolve when you hear the calling, like clouds breaking up in rays of sunlight after a storm.
Your brethren are restoring you. You hear pride and companionship in their cry, no sadness.
You are the king of the air and the sea. In your element nothing can harm you, because the storm has passed away over the horizon.
Your wings are strong and your heart is light. The other birds cry once more, and begin to scatter out over the ocean.
You descend toward the water in a wide, leisurely circle, and see the waves stretching out forever, light playing over them as far as the eye can see.
It seems to take a lifetime to reach the waves, but it's the best life. It's your life. And you are so proud to be alive. Your wings are strong.
Your feet want to feel the water. Suddenly you are skipping across the waves, strong wings holding you steady, feet pounding the surf.
And then, like the most graceful sailing ship with billowing white glory, you nest into the top of a wave and ride the ocean.
You can close your eyes again, and feel the waves carrying you from top to bottom, high and low. You are safe. There is no danger, no one to see.
There is the rich salty smell of the ancient waters of the whole world in one place. There is the sound of tiny fish leaping from the wavetops.
They have lived here for a million million years and will live here for a million million more. This is the place of plenty, the place of complete happiness.
You are so hungry. You have waited such a long time for this place. You have traveled so far and for so long to find it.
The salt of the ocean breeze, the taste of tender fish in your beak, the innocence of the tickling waves around your feet. It is wonderful.
It's as if you've known this place all your life. It was there before your life. It was there for the beginning of your life. And it is here now.
You don't have to search any more. There is no journey, no more waiting. All around you is the blue and the gold and the silver and white of purity.
Nature whispers its deepest secrets to you through the ripples, the lurching waves, the tiniest droplet of water hitting the surface of the sea.
Without words, you become wise. And the wisdom is letting go of what you knew before, to be yourself and to be everything noble.
There is no shame. There is no size. There is no "place" in this place except itself. The ocean welcomes you with arms eternally open.
When you are full and satisfied, you close your eyes. When you open them again, a storm has appeared on the horizon.
But you are a clever bird, and your strong white wings, like the sails of a great ship, lift you high and far.
You are safely gone before the storm has even thought of coming. It sleeps also, deep black cloud dreams rumbling in its head.
But you are awake. You know who you are. And over the thunder you hear the cry of a bird, the most beautiful sound. It is your voice.
Like a trumpet call to greet the setting sun flaring up in scarlet, your voice rises to heaven.
And find yourself standing at the edge of the ocean on human feet. And your feet carry you away from the edge of the water, through the warm sand.
And the storm is always behind you, with the dawn ahead of you. Your wings will wait until you need them again.
The ocean, our mother, whispers her secrets still, beneath the unquiet clouds. You can hear her wishing you well as your journey begins again.

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ____

I hope you are feeling better after reading this, :)
Your story -- you are not alone.

Made me weepy! LOL Mostly because you took the time to write that and for your compassion. Thank you.

Phoenix1304
9th October 2013, 09:26
Its easier once you learn to distinguish your own feelings from those being projected onto you, but its still hard isnt it!

I never get lonely being alone, im not a recluse by any means, but its just the only time Im truly myself. Its nice to just switch off and 'get lost' in your own thoughts and feelings, knowing for sure they are your own!
I do see it as a curse. People dont even have to speak, I know how theyre feeling just by being in their presence. You can see it in their eyes and aura. It makes it hard to be around certain people. Especially the angry ones or the energy vampires, they turn a simple coffee and chat into what feels like an hour in the ring with Mike Tyson.

I too have so far found no way of shutting off or putting the bubble around me. Thankfully Im naturally upbeat, so it doesnt take me long to snap out of it, but it can be so draining at times and it would be nice if anyone has any tips and techniques to share?

Thank you. Yes, making that distinction is the tricky bit, I have a clue when the emotion is extreme and sudden, but the subtler stuff is very difficult. Like you I'm naturally upbeat, but don't snap out of it easily. Energy vampires are attracted to me and tell me what fabulous energy I have! By which time I usually don't have any left. People offload their stuff on a regular basis. I don't see auras, but I know they're there! I never feel lonely either, in fact I long for solitude and can't get enough of it and am in serious danger of becoming a happy recluse.

Let's hope there's some empath adepts ready to share some solutions. I'm really hoping there is some beneficial use for this extraordinary and troublesome sensitivity.

Sérénité
9th October 2013, 10:09
Its funny you mention the vampires coming to you, its true I believe they are naturally attracted to sensitives, easy prey! I try to avoid them at all costs now, you can literally feel the energy being sucked from you and the headache appearing.
My christmas card list has decreased rapidly since I now swerve the vamp and negative people I'd manage to acquire over the years...certain family members are the ones I need the solutions for though, that or a long distance one way ticket ;)

Phoenix1304
9th October 2013, 10:12
I appreciate your post, can't offer a lot of help, but can tell you something that I found to be particularly distressing.

Back in the day (20 years ago), with people I cared about, and friends, I could do lots of that stuff, particularly identify on a sketch what they were feeling and where, and "purple" the pain away (my visualisation technique at the time), including some pretty massive migraines that my partner was prone to. Intense "purpling",and static would transfer too.

As a mechanical engineer, I was the go-to guy, as I could diagnose car issues during discussion...e.g. told one guy that his catalytic converter had disintegrated and was clogging his muffler. Point on a plan as to where to look for a failure on the plant.

Uncomfortable in large groups, as there was often a swirling, seething, rolling energy that was either too buoyant, or upsetting, and trying to follow five discussions at a time.

Mother in Law in terminal last days of Cancer was nearly my undoing. Walking into the hospital room, I could feel both her desperation to live (she was pretty well unconscious most times then), and my energy leaving. People took me as sulky/surly, but I could scarcely function. Honestly feel that I came close to succumbing at the time, and was blaming the woman posthumously for psychic vampirism (not intentionally on her part).

Took me a while to talk to my partner (couldn't tell her that I thought her Mum had nearly killed me), and she suggested that I was capable of delivering energy, and that she believed that there was a transfer taking place. Took a year + for it all to start to resolve.

Don't know what happened, whether something broke, I turned something off, but I can still "feel" machines, but not people.

Obviously, you'll never know what circumstances that you will come across, but please be careful of being around the dying.

Thank you for sharing. It's wonderful that you have this connection with machines, how very useful! I have it with animals too, I know what they want and have had many telepathic experiences with them. And like machines, they're not taking from you. It seems somehow you managed to shut it off for your own protection after the mother-in-law incident. Or your spirit guides did, though I'm not as sure as I used to be about the spiritual help, thanks to all the Archon talk, my confidence in the spiritual support system has been badly shaken as I now wonder why for every joy in life there seems to be some shattering disappointment or pain in hot pursuit.

I don't particularly care if we go off topic as this is a spiritual forum and nothing is really separate from anything else, so let me share this.

I had a dream I have never forgotten, not long after my leg was pretty badly smashed up in a motorcycle accident in my youth. It went like this:

I'm in a large hall where there is a multitude of figures in hooded robes, two arched doorways. A hooded figure on the podium points the finger at me and they all wheel round to look at me, hostile. "She doesn't BELIEVE', says the figure on the podium and I am suddenly swept up onto the shoulders of two massive, muscular men who race towards the wall and smash me into it. I am bleeding and stagger out the exit archway where a sneering individual that has no sympathy whatsoever orders me to drink a fluorescent pink liquid. Blood is pouring from my broken teeth and I beg him 'please, please, no more physical pain, as much emotional pain as you like, but no more physical pain'.

So did I ask for this? Certainly, since that time, I have been spared major physical pain, only minor cuts and so on. I've never even been stung by a bee. But emotionally, 'nuff said!

Just thought I'd share that in case anyone has a take on that dream, and also regarding the Archon thing, I would like to actually see the passages in the gnostic gospels that refer to them, couldn't find it at the website that has the texts on view, all I hear is interpretations of the alleged passages, I'd like to see for myself.

After more than 40 years of metaphysical study, practice and so on, I had 20 blissful years of confidence and certainty about the nature of life after death, but nowadays I'm less sure of everything. The beginning of wisdom Confucious might say, but it sure as hell doesn't feel like it.

I didn't quite understand your line 'intense purpling and static would transfer'. Can you elaborate, and also the purpling technique that may be useful to some of us perhaps?

Shannow
9th October 2013, 10:36
The purpling was what I used to call it when better half asked WTF I did to her migraine.

Breathe deeply, with closed eyes, and there's a patch of purple somewhere. Try to draw that into central vision, moving your closed eyes to get the effect, and when it's fairly central, concentrate on it, looking to infinity into the purple. Will "burst" into greens and oranges, and you keep trying to see the purple in the burst, centralise it, and focus through it, until it is nearly your whole field of vision, maybe a light blue fringe, but purple mostly.

When it's stable, you can use it. I used it as a kid to "hide" lying there and thinking my thoughts, I liked the colour. Later used it for making myself feel better.

Later still, thought that I could "send" purple into problems with people (e.g. partner's migraine). Not sure if it wasn't sending something else (e.g. pain) to the purple. Fevers dropped, children slept sort of thing...not sure which direction it travelled. Occasionally could generate electric like "sparks".

Better half could sometimes pick up that I was doing it when I felt that she was sad.

LOL, when looking for the colour, found this

http://www.rosco.com/spectrum/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/purple-just-too-awesome.jpg

Am only recently finding myself on weekend lie ins starting to get comfortable with purple again. Have a new job,and am not as connected to scarred energies as I was a month ago.

Phoenix1304
9th October 2013, 10:43
Thanks Shannow. It reminds me of St. Germain's 'violet flame'. It's a good vibration, I hadn't thought of using colours. Maybe a purple bubble will work guys! I'll be trying it.

Sérénité
9th October 2013, 10:49
Purple is a very strong and powerful colour, it is definitely good as a use for psychic and intuitive focusing tools. From shades of more relaxing lavender and lilacs its a great spiritual colour for inspiration and healing. Purple is linked to the crown chakra, connecting to universal energy.

It can also be overwhelming too when overly used, its the only colour our eyes dont adjust to as being 'natural'. It triggers receptors that other colours dont.

I think we all resonate with colours without realising and some colours are more favourable to us than others. I use gold for protection. I imagine sprinkling gold dust around love ones for protection, or a sparkling gold cloud around a place or person that needs help. Sorry Im going totally of topic here!

Never underestimate the power of colour :)

Maybe I should take my own advice here and use a purple or gold bubble? Worth a try Phoenix?! :)

4evrneo
9th October 2013, 15:48
Wow. I really feel like I am reading my own words Phoenix1304! Everything you are saying rings true with me too.
I cant tell you how many times I have crumbled from others pain and sadness.

The only thing I have found to work for me when I am around others or a big group of people is a glass of red wine. Seriously!

Other times I am just fine and it feels as if it is turned off but I have no idea how it was done. I am honestly so busy sometimes that it is hard for me to be aware of subtle nuances of how it is or isnt working.

The hardest part for me is that I lost the love of my life because of it. I think some people are intimidated by that ability to pick up on true emotions that they supress or try to keep to themselves. I guess in the past couple years I have learned who to talk to about it and who wouldn't handle it well. So for me, it's my kids and one best friend is the only ones that I talk to about it. It does make for some lonely times and a yearning for nature and solitude. But my compassion draws me to people so I guess it's a balancing act for sure.

I am like a magnet to most animals also. I am not able to see aura's but have been told my aura is a bright emerald green. Have also been told many times I should be a healer and would be a natural but I have no way to afford the classes to learn this.

I am just as lost when it comes to knowing how to handle it properly but It makes me feel a little better knowing there are others experiencing the same things.

Thank you all for sharing!

Bless,

4evrneo
9th October 2013, 15:51
Thank you Sérénité and Shannow!
I am going to try the color purple :)

Chip
9th October 2013, 16:18
Ok, I can relate to this
I have lived with the depressively lonely feeling and the frightening angst when I'm around people. Picking up on all the collective emotions and thoughts is overwhelming.
I learned that part of my discomfort was from fear of not knowing how to communicate in this environment. I became a reader and took notes about what I needed to learn in order to speak my thoughts that I found were very common "complaints" and "ignorances" that many had in common. The minor differences were their individualized egos but the majority had similar views "thoughts". I studied and read. After a while, I noticed that I had less issue in crowds simply because I knew that I could communicate all the issues and drama that I sensed. Even though I hardly ever had too.
Another thing I still practice is meditation. This you will find easy enough, as I did. I found out a long time ago the importance of physical disciplines in creating a better frequency or channel to communicate with "Self/Soul" or who you really are. So I started meditating during my morning jogs. I then started meditating during other activities that challenged me to reach a that "state", ie. in line at grocery store, stuck in traffic etc etc
I hope these ideas help you. I know the burden well. Stay strong and know that you are capable of anything.
Peace

Mercedes
9th October 2013, 18:26
Beautiful Tesla. Love it. Thank you.

CD7
9th October 2013, 18:53
I feel these 'things' around crowds or around an emotional charged individual--similar to what some have expressed already, and if a person gets good at focusing on the origins to understand and not to react there much better off.

However in addition to being sensitive outside of oneself, I also experience a sensitivity within. Its an internal 'feeling' that goes very deep. Sometimes it seems like feeling the (glue) connection behind it all which is like feeling the weight of a heck of ALOT MORE then just sensing one's own self. Am I confusing?? Trying to use the best werds!
At times...its like I feel the weight of millions and are talking through them--I know I am not the only one

To feel such a thing makes a person realeyes the gravity of the situation. It spans so much..like Ive said before--its so MASSIVE its invisible <------invisible ink


SO Cheers to being an Empath! May you feel untill the cows come home! :cheers: :cow:

scanner
9th October 2013, 19:16
I seem to see things that others cannot . I don't mean as in sight seeing if that makes sense . I mean as in feelings or intuition , some times I scare myself ,I can be very accurate .

Asyloth
9th October 2013, 19:17
Even though I know it's a precious gift, it feels like a burden in this world.
It is because our world is very sick and most of the people are wandering around with very sick feelings...
Whether it's jalousy, hatred, manipulation, rage, control, frustration, egocentrism, selfishness, greed and above it all, ignorance.

And we can either try to fight these feelings or try to ignore it, but one way or another, we're always the ones deeply affected by it.

TigaHawk
9th October 2013, 22:08
Yay i am not alone!

I have no clue how to focus it, tune it or controll it... It very much sucks at times as it feels like my moods and feelings are dependant on how everyone around me is feeling. Even moreso when i am with a friend whom i've gone out of my way to ensure are happy... only for them to get a phonecall which puts them in a horribly sour and upset mood... i am confuzed as to why i feel like that with no real reason to feel like that. It also leaves for me to be used and abused because of my kindness... i tend to focus alot on making other people happy to which some people definately take advantage of me with.

I thin i may be able to project my feelings back onto them, tho i'd have only done this twice. I think i have an idea on how to do it but it requires alot of focus and definately not something i'd be able to do on a whim, my mind and my heart have got to be in the right place if that makes sense? My heart can be the easy bit, but my brain is an entirely different story.

I think way too much, my brain is very overactive. At one point when i wasnt thinking about stuff it would turn into a jukebox and start playing random songs (which got annoying, tho i havent had much of that recently..) The best way to describe it would be a conversation or a thought as a straight line... as you talk/think about it i'll hear or think of one part of it, then branch off onto that, expand into it and branch off again on different posability's or ideas involving that, then something from the main conversation will snap it back to the main line. repeat many, many many times. I often forget things people say in conversations because of it, definately not because im not listening, but because i cannot focus on what they are saying becuase it's not just the conversation im processing, it's many many many things.

Back to the projecting my feelings onto someone - when i was focused and thinking/feeling on 1 person, i've had them react at the same time - once was extreme pain and sadness to which my mother left work immeditely to come and see me as she just knew something was wrong. The other was extreme love, to which the person responded with a text message to what i was feeling - an exact reply to what i was feeling, not a coincidance, it was specific.


tho i have had the thought i may be empathic i've dismissed it and just put it down to being a very emotional person whom wears their heart on their sleeve. Tho now i am reconsiddering this.


Another thing - how many of you have difficulty's expressing what you are feeling with words? This can seem an impossible task, as what im feeling combined with how my brain goes supercharged, i find myself trying to say something, but it feels like thousands of words are running through my head at once and i cannot pick or send what i want to express to my mouth. I often get quite frustrated, i start to get upset and angry because i cant get what i want to say out, then teary.. then i just give up and go silent.


Thankyou for your imput as well - it's put a different perspective on how i see things, like looking at a puzzell from a different angle and allowing you to see you allmost had the piece in the right spot.

Flash
10th October 2013, 03:08
I was at a restaurant with a friend of mine who is an empath. She was sitting beside me. She suddenly said "oh, that is painful, sorry christine, oh, that is real painful" I had to explain what I had, and told her to stop it, that I wanted to enjoy my lunch without thinking about the pain. We laugh and she stopped. I do not know how she did it, but usually she can stop.

In fact, I do think lots of us are empaths, but we stop it because of the pain involved, emotional or physical. Feeling somebody else, or seeing/hearing their thoughts may be quite frightful, and more when one is a child. I think many of us have blocked it in childhood.

Rahkyt
10th October 2013, 03:33
There are a couple of potentialities:

1) The solar plexus is where Will is projected. Breathing in, building up energy in that area and visualizing a golden ball, that then whooshes outwards when you breath out, into a protective bubble around you. Intent should be directed simultaneously, to shut out or mute incoming fields. The key is in actually feeling the ball building within you as a pressure at the bottom of your rib cage. So it may take a few series of breathes to do so. When you release it out into a bubble surrounding you, you should feel the release within and a simultaneous humming/vibratory forces that has now invigorated your aura effectively shielding you from external energy.

2) Heart-centered resonance to incoming energetics can get caught upon our own internal and psychological dysfunction when we have issues ourselves that are activated when incoming emotional fields interact with ours. It is difficult to tell them apart when there is something in us that acknowledges, accepts and owns that energy. This can be turned to the advantage of the empath because it can then bring these issues into focus, where they can be recapitulated, owned, processed and released, leaving one then clear of the energies that particular emotion gives rise to. Once this occurs, if one receives that same emotion from without, and you no longer have an emotional resonance to it in your own experience, you know it is not yours, and you can let it pass through like the visitor it is. Many empaths continue to own the same memory cycles and dysfunctions throughout a lifetime, without ever processing and releasing them, mistaking others issues for their own, thereby relegating themselves to a life of pain and heartache. Being able to hone in on where the emotion is coming from gives the empath, then, the ability to help others to process their own emotions and provide comfort and healing along the way.

Both ways can help or hinder, depending upon where an individual is in their own personal evolutionary process. The first way is useful when one is being bombarded, perhaps even attacked. It is not useful when one wants to reach out and help others. The second way is useful when one truly wants to deal with one's own personal emotional dysfunctions and move beyond them, helping others. It is not useful and can be dangerous, when one is being attacked.

Reirrac
10th October 2013, 04:34
Recently, I've found that awareness and some tools have helped keep me centered and grounded. While the tools are helpful, it's the awareness that is helping me transition and evolve.

Egg
I visualize a golden egg, large enough to comfortably hold me, perhaps extending 2-3 feet out all around me. I then place mirrors all over the outside of the egg. I was told it’s to bounce negative energy back.

I've tried brick walls and other impermeable objects, I don't recommend them. I found they break before bending; or they keep everything out and everything in. I've found that bottling up emotions didn't work well for me as I would be really depressed and then explode emotionally outwards when I couldn't take it anymore.

Grounding
I extend 3 chords, 2 from the bottom of my feet and the third from near the bottom of my tailbone down into the earth with a carabineer like clip/hook on the end. Around the center of the Earth I circle and knot a cord that extends upwards, also with a carabineer life clip/hook on the end. I clip both of them together. I feel more grounded and inside my body after doing this.

Cocoon
When I am around people that are metaphorically vomiting on the people around them, I wrap around them in a spherical cocoon. This lets them deal with their own stuff and it’s not getting on me.

Awareness
This one is a big deal for me. I now notice when I pull energy off of people. I give it back to them and wrap them in a cocoon to let them deal with it, to allow them the opportunity to heal it.

It's a past pattern of mine, that I would take their negative energy, their problems, and just hold it for them. I found that I was out of energy all the time, with low self-esteem/extremely depressed, basically like a trashcan, where people could dump their stuff and then feel strangely better without knowing why. I was told that by me taking other people’s problems, while they may feel better, they are losing out on the chance to learn from healing it.
This is just one set of tools that I’ve gained from my guides that continue to help me gain a deeper understanding of myself. I am grateful for my gifts.

TigaHawk
10th October 2013, 05:36
how does healing work as an empath?

My X had quite bad ulcerative colitis. Constantly had to take steroids when it flared up, and when it wasnt flared up some other pill to try and keep it in check. Within a period of 6mths when we first started dating, i got quite an upset tummy, which then setteld down. His UC stopped flaring up, after about 6months in the clear he stopped taking the salofalk? as well. 3 and a bit years later he's yet to have another flare up.

the freaky thing about that for me was when i was comforting him through the pains of his flare ups, i had it in the back of my head that i'd help make it better.

Phoenix1304
10th October 2013, 08:31
The empaths are coming out the woodwork! It would seem so far though, that more of us are struggling with it, than have it under control.

Oh for an X-men type school where we could hone these sensitivities under expert guidance!

When I had my new age shop I spent hundreds of hours unofficially ‘counselling’ others who would hang in the shop, drinking coffee and offloading, (usually). It didn’t seem to throw me off balance in those days, as if the intention to be of service was maybe the protection. As I said, I often used to generate a light/love field from my heart centre to enfold another, and more often than not, a noticeable change would come over them. A calming effect, a softening in the eyes as if trust had just been born. I need to get back to doing that. I never did it consciously as a protection, just really to ‘soothe’ others and diffuse awkwardness.

Something that happened almost daily in those days, but rarely now, was what I called the ‘juddering’. It was if energy was juddering through me, not smooth, and I was more than a little surprised when a psychic who came in said out of the blue ‘do you get a ‘juddering’ when you talk to people?”. As she had used that word precisely I pretty much accepted her explanation that it was spirit coming in close and working through me and she was not the only one that had said I heal through talking to others. And there, I’d spent half my life trying to shut up, be a better listener and not dominate conversations!

I have experimented with healing a little besides, but found ‘methods’ very restrictive. Spiritualists, for example, would say ‘ooh no, no, no, you must not actually touch a person’, whereas, those times I have done it, putting the hand to the flesh feels absolutely right, but I do have to go wash very soon afterwards. I did Reiki one but had no interest in pursuing it. Maybe I was turned off by all the Reiki ‘masters’ that would come in the shop having attained ‘mastership’ in a costly weekend but did not necessarily display much spiritual maturity. The ego is a tricky master...

Ah Rahkyt, knowing what is our stuff and what is others, that is the question. I’ve been in a constant state of self-analysis for as long as I can remember. Sometimes an emotion hits dramatically and suddenly and is clearly not mine, but if we feel that, then we are also sucking up like a sponge all the more subtle stuff that seems nigh impossible to filter. Pain and heartache? Oh yeah, but I wouldn’t want people to think I’ve sobbed my way through life, I have had plenty of joy and triumphs and good times too! I’m just realising that while dramatic empathic episodes are few and far between, it has been affecting me far more than I ever knew.

I wish I could turn it off like your friend, Flash. She seems to know what she’s doing. I was watching a healer spontaneously work on someone with very bad indigestion once, she did not lay her hands on him, but brushed the aura along the length of his body and then kind of ‘shook it off’ at the end of each pass, each time she did this I felt more and more uncomfortable and remember thinking ‘don’t throw it over here’. I FELT that energy, and the next thing I knew I was belching, burping and having bile come up my oesophegus. So this can very much manifest physically. I agree that all of us probably have empathic natures, some can turn it off and some of us just don’t seem able to.

TigaHawk, I would say you definitely are an empath and I’m glad this thread is helping to bring that in to focus. It is my hope it will be a useful resource for anyone struggling with this.

Asyloth, I just don’t see it as a precious gift, a gift that’s a burden, ain’t that the pits! I too am wondering if this sick state of the world and people’s emotions is not the cause of the grief I sometimes feel ‘out of the blue’ when alone, there is no reason in my own life for it, yet an overwhelming sadness prevails at times.

Reirrac, thank you for sharing your methods of containment! You do seem to have it under control now. I’m feeling that awareness is key too, it’s happened for so long without my conscious awareness, maybe now I’ll start finding ways to use it beneficially.

Thank you so much to everyone for your input.

markpierre
10th October 2013, 09:49
Oh for an X-men type school where we could hone these sensitivities under expert guidance!



Oh how I've wished for that. I'm afraid you're it. Your style, your language, your method, your assignments.
Your developing trust in your trustworthiness. It's a slowly developing memory. Everything else is hearsay. Ignore it.
You wouldn't have the job if you weren't up to it.

Wind
10th October 2013, 11:35
I'm definitely a very sensitive feeler, but I also have very deep thoughts. I can't even begin to emphasize how much my mind analyzes even the tiniest of details and makes patterns about everything... I care too much about everything and I doubt myself a lot. I very often think that other peoples negative feelings and thoughts are my own and I get so drained mentally and it also affects my physical well being. I didn't know that before, but now I do and that's why I prefer nature and tranquility and most of the time solitude. I'm able to get into a very deep connection with animals, but most humans are too much for my senses. I can interact with humans, but only for brief periods and then I need to reload my batteries. There are certain people who resonate very much with me, especially my mother. She's just like I am.

It's very tiresome to be sensitive to everything, but the loud sounds of the city are the worst part for me. I really haven't been able to utilize this "gift" of mine very well at this time so maybe that's why it so often feels like a burden. I don't really ever drink alcohol or take any other substances because my body is sensitive to them, but I have noticed that you can dim the sensitivity that way if you want... Meditation is relatively easy to do, but I don't really do it that often. Only when I feel like doing so... Nature and forests are just the best way for me to breathe and live... At times I hope that I would be a monk living in some kind of a monastery, far away from civilization. Actually I sense that I have actually had lives like that in my previous incarnations. This current life is a quite a test, but I chose it and I suppose that I'm here for a reason. It's funny to say that the best moments of my life have been when I have had no thoughts at all and I have experienced the moments just as they were, though only briefly. Pure bliss.

Here is a list of 30 empath traits. (http://theknowing1.wordpress.com/2011/07/01/at-a-glance-30-traits-of-an-empath/) Almost all of those traits fit me really well.

Tesla_WTC_Solution
10th October 2013, 21:16
28. Will not choose to buy antiques, vintage or second-hand: Anything that’s been pre-owned carries the energy of the previous owner. An Empath will even prefer to have a brand new car or house (if they are in the financial situation to do so) with no residual energy.

Wind, I LOVE the site you linked for Phoenix. It's a very comprehensive list with amazing insights into "the life".

28 made me laugh, though, because I am the opposite. I am a very lonely person IRL and LOVE collecting things owned by others.
Their energy is usually very serene, educated, and complete. I get a sense of joy from owning these objects.
Things like wooden statues, stone and plaster sculptures, signed prints, antique books(!), pieces of precious metal and/or strange rocks, in fact any object with a "Story".

As I absorb the energies from these objects, if that is what's happening anyway, I feel wiser, more educated, and get a sense of having put "something to rest", i.e. I am not really taking "ownership" of the property, I feel more like a curator if that makes any sense.

I never really thought about it that much. But I built an energy room for myself, putting lots of these older objects that have power around the walls and in places where they could be seen. My bedroom looked like a Gypsy caravan before we lost that house.

I am one of the types who feels naked without some of the clutter; my "ideal" home would look like a cross between Sherlock Holmes' office and a museum.


Don't feel guilty for enjoying the "reuptake" of energies from the property of the deceased. They would rather someone owned and loved their cast off valuables than if they were rotting in the grave or on a shelf.

I am sorry to prattle on about things rather than emotions. But it's very important to acknowledge the energies received from objects as well as directly from people.

CD7
10th October 2013, 21:31
I was at a restaurant with a friend of mine who is an empath. She was sitting beside me. She suddenly said "oh, that is painful, sorry christine, oh, that is real painful" I had to explain what I had, and told her to stop it, that I wanted to enjoy my lunch without thinking about the pain. We laugh and she stopped. I do not know how she did it, but usually she can stop.

In fact, I do think lots of us are empaths, but we stop it because of the pain involved, emotional or physical. Feeling somebody else, or seeing/hearing their thoughts may be quite frightful, and more when one is a child. I think many of us have blocked it in childhood.


Also in industrialized nations there's SO MUCH MORE going on when you factor in the electrical run a muck smuck!! This negatively effects our natural connections/antennae.

Ive experienced this other type of clarity living out of the electrical grid for an extended period of time. The clarity with which I HEARD MYSELF was amazing and empathic feelings heightened. When I came back to America, I literally felt my brain waves being altered and confused---so the task to 'get there' in a place like this is somewhat monumental as far as disciplining oneself to block out the noise

Wind
10th October 2013, 21:34
28. Will not choose to buy antiques, vintage or second-hand: Anything that’s been pre-owned carries the energy of the previous owner. An Empath will even prefer to have a brand new car or house (if they are in the financial situation to do so) with no residual energy.

Wind, I LOVE the site you linked for Phoenix. It's a very comprehensive list with amazing insights into "the life".

28 made me laugh, though, because I am the opposite. I am a very lonely person IRL and LOVE collecting things owned by others.
Their energy is usually very serene, educated, and complete. I get a sense of joy from owning these objects.
Things like wooden statues, stone and plaster sculptures, signed prints, antique books(!), pieces of precious metal and/or strange rocks, in fact any object with a "Story".

As I absorb the energies from these objects, if that is what's happening anyway, I feel wiser, more educated, and get a sense of having put "something to rest", i.e. I am not really taking "ownership" of the property, I feel more like a curator if that makes any sense.

Same here. Even though I do enjoy buying new things, there is something special about used stuff. It feels like that those things have a history to them and they have seen life... Perhaps even longer than I have.

Bob
10th October 2013, 21:50
Quote Posted by Phoenix1304 View Post

Oh for an X-men type school where we could hone these sensitivities under expert guidance!

As to a school, recalling the X-Men and Xavier's School, a couple points I have found very workable - a LOT was achieved by "working with objects", understanding how to interface with the historical aspect of the object, finally interaction with others (living folks) after understanding the "energies" was comfortable and very day to day.

Sharing this, Cairo Museum (Egypt) has about the most "psi active" (bio-energetic), historical objects on the planet. I certainly would recommend a trip there when things stabilize a bit politically - maybe that could be a goal..

A few pix below of objects that are "bio-active" and viewable, empathable into.. one can tune in and explore their history and present time energies. (I mention these because I was there physically and found these to be "active", '87-95' window - there are many many more there on the floors, easily one can spend a week there.)


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0e/The_famous_wooden_statue_called_the_Shehk_el-Beled,_in_the_Museum,_Cairo,_Egypt._(11)_(1904)_-_front_edited_-_TIMEA.jpg

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3297/3214520241_24dd9073b2_b.jpg

http://puzzles-games.eu/data/media/30/Tutankhamun-Golden-Throne-Museum-of-Antiquities-in-Cairo-Egypt.jpg
The two lions are especially bio-active and were used for protection. The Pharaoh was not only empathic but able to work with the energies X-Men style.. (great learning with this one)


http://donpugh.com/ABOUT%20DON/Wheelchair%20Nomad/Egypt/Cairo%20Museum%202/Cairo%20Museum%202_3649.JPG
(Same with these two cats, very bio-active)


http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1090/984682583_a62a81b7d3.jpg

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-3nLKa4MNX-A/TzyLAogRjhI/AAAAAAAAMrE/S8IwZwr3_FA/s640/Cairo+Museum+-+Rare+Photos+(11).JPG

Anyway, you get the idea - I do like the golden orb energy for centering - one can extend those to the corners of the room, create the golden orbs, then draw lines to the "you" where ever you are, and create some golden energy and push that into you for support - keep doing that until really happy, and glowing :)

enjoy

Phoenix1304
11th October 2013, 08:42
Here is a list of 30 empath traits. (http://theknowing1.wordpress.com/2011/07/01/at-a-glance-30-traits-of-an-empath/) Almost all of those traits fit me really well.

Interesting link, thank you, I'm exploring there as I hadn't seen that particular blog. I have 28 out of 30 of her list of traits but like you and Tesla I do not mind old objects, though second hand clothes are a no-no and eating out is less and less appealing as I seem to have notions about the state of mind of the chef. I know if food is made with love or not, so that does rather steer one to very expensive eateries where the chef takes his time and does not just 'slap it on the plate', I 'feel' it when that happens. At home I only eat organic and am sure to keep myself in a good place when I prepare it. If someone helps me in the kitchen and gets negative or angry over the food they are quickly despatched. 'Don't bring your bad vibes in my kitchen!'. They think I'm barmy of course. I'm quite certain I've had belly ache numerous times from food prepared by unhappy or stressed people.

Agreed, forests are fabulous! I get almost ecstatic around trees and feel a rather silly sense of loving them SO MUCH. I'm the archetypal tree-hugger!

Oh yes, absolutely desperate to withdraw from civilisation, live off the grid and be left alone to garden. Easier said than done.

Phoenix1304
11th October 2013, 09:30
[QUOTE]Quote Posted by Phoenix1304 View Post

- a LOT was achieved by "working with objects", understanding how to interface with the historical aspect of the object, finally interaction with others (living folks) after understanding the "energies" was comfortable and very day to day.



Hello Bob, thanks for your response and those extraordinary pics of 'bio-active' objects. This seems more akin to psychometry than empathy, but I would love you to to elaborate on the process.

Both Wind and Tesla connect to objects so it's perhaps a part of empathy that I just don't have. Sometimes, I go out with a friend that likes metal-detecting and when I found an old roman coin, I was quite enchanted by the idea that perhaps a roman centurion had been the last person to touch that. But beyond occasional flights of fancy, I do not get psychometric impressions.

I can sense that those are powerful objects, and sitting on that throne or the cat chair might be interesting, but when I pick up from furniture, the energy is usually recent or within a few months. Any exercises you used to connect to historical aspects would be of interest to all of us, I'm sure. Would love to hear your experiences with those objects.

I used to trade in crystals and was amazed by just how much others could 'feel' from the stones. I never experienced it personally, though I'm surrounded by crystals at home and am very drawn to them, the only stone I remotely 'feel' anything from is Larimar and then it is just a soft, gentle energy and very subtle. I used to go to Tuscon every year to the enormous Rock 'n Gem shows but started to withdraw from the business when I began to feel that I didn't want to support this 'raping' of the earth anymore. I would see these huge blocks of crystal that had been blasted out of the earth and felt quite ashamed, there is little respect for the rocks among traders, the crystal business is all about greed really.

I'd love a trip to Egypt! I've always been rather more drawn to the Americas and while I have travelled quite extensively, I haven't made it to Egypt yet, not quite sure why. Hey! Maybe you could organise an X-men type field trip for the Avalon empaths, wouldn't that be interesting! Maybe we could all hang out together in peace and harmony and hone some skills...

Thanks again for sharing.

Bob
11th October 2013, 18:47
Hi Phoenix1304 - thanks for sharing :)

I just find the psychometry skills lets one have a really good way to deal with the empathy as a first entry level.. In the pictures that I posted, I found there to be more than "objects" there, actually a being or beings that can be reached. So one's empathy skills can be used with that, and come to a very good stable and manageable skill. Find the being for instance in the CATS... very big hug :) Egypt is such an amazing place and doing a group event there would be most exciting..

Tesla_WTC_Solution
11th October 2013, 19:15
Hey you guys! My browser just shut itself down with no explanation. (after posting to a 9/11 thread lol)

I was trying to type a recommendation/caution for you guys.
Westminster Abbey is a wonderful place to get a taste of the supernatural.
I was about 17 years old when my senior class did a trip over there.
We went to a lot of stupid places, like Harrah's and Hard Rock Cafe, but we did schedule an hour or so at the Abbey.

I wandered away from my tour group during this time. For some reason, although I was personally happy to see many of the sights,
when I had been in Westminster for only about 10 minutes, I started crying. And I couldn't stop. I started happening next to the Handel and Shakespeare monuments.
I also wasn't far from Mary's interment site near the front, when the crying started, lol.

I tried walking out into the part where the stones were older and less fancy. But the crying kept on going forever.
A lady walking by passed me and asked if I was ok. I don't even remember what I said to her at the time. It was very strange to be crying in the first place.

I would imagine that people with an interest either in psychometry or empathy would enjoy visiting the Abbey at least twice.
And don't be stoic. Just open your mind like any other historical place, and see what happens.

There might not be enough room in that church for sentiments other than those of the residents...

!!!
I wandered away from that section toward the more rustic areas, thinking it would get better. But it wasn't! The crying just got worse.

p.s. the museum with the Rosetta Stone (at the time) wasn't too far away from here. It's doable. they had some very ancient mesopotamian stuff next to that.

Bob
11th October 2013, 19:44
All over UK there are YEW trees.. Usually at churchyards, I have some amazing pix of those, if one wanted to get "into" what the tree got into and find the spirits.. Psychometry and empathy - Ya I think go together, I recall the vibes I got from the last owner of a harp I had some years back.. her vibes were definitely in there, and contacting the last owner was amazing, feeling what she felt as she played the instrument -

Maybe try to tune into the Yew Tree here -


http://static.panoramio.com/photos/large/30689768.jpg

onawah
11th October 2013, 20:13
From a channeled message from James Tyberonn at:
http://www.earth-keeper.com/EKchronicles_82pdf.pdf

We tell you that the Giant Sequoia and Redwood were once hallowed by ancient more enlightened people, including those of Atlantis and LeMuria. Hallowed not as a commodity or resource, but as intelligent Divine beings, in much the same way in which the Druids revered the Oak, Holly and Yew. For these are among the highest expressions of the realm of Trees, indeed such trees have the capacity of not only collective energy, but are capable of individual awareness. Yet among all of the Kingdom of Trees, the Giant Sequoia retains perhaps the greatest field of awareness.

More about beautiful and amazing yew trees here:
http://www.ancient-yew.org/userfiles/file/Crowhurst,SurreyApril%202011.pdf
http://www.sacredconnections.co.uk/holyland/fortingallyew.htm

Phoenix1304
11th October 2013, 20:13
All over UK there are YEW trees.. Usually at churchyards, I have some amazing pix of those, if one wanted to get "into" what the tree got into and find the spirits.. Psychometry and empathy - Ya I think go together, I recall the vibes I got from the last owner of a harp I had some years back.. her vibes were definitely in there, and contacting the last owner was amazing, feeling what she felt as she played the instrument -

Maybe try to tune into the Yew Tree here -


http://static.panoramio.com/photos/large/30689768.jpg

Oh fun, I'll play! Definitely a tree spirit there in the upper trunk on the right. Curious that it looks just like me as a child sitting there! other than than I feel that the old one is being propped up, but really just wants to crash. Again, not unlike me! LOL!

Do you still own a harp? I had the great pleasure of spending a sweet afternoon with one some years ago, been hankering for one ever since.

Bob
11th October 2013, 20:20
Agreed Phoenix - love those trees, so many amazing ones in UK, I wish I had had more time when visiting last on my Tree and Garden and Sacred Site visiting experience. I want to try more spots on the Rose Line too.. I don't find any barrier in finding the beingness associated with an object. Probably as you mentioned with the coin that you worked with the last holder of the coin was the consciousness contacted. Hey that's time travel when you think about it, using an artifact to get to the moment that object was in contact with a living being..

The harp was so old, it was in need of repair, so I don't play it any more.. The wood dried out here in Colorado, it was from the East Coast of the US in a very moist environment.

I think if a trip can be arranged to visit many of the beautiful amazing sites in UK, Egypt, for the learning experience based on contacting the energy, the beings present and past, just so much opens up to perceiving how amazing our world is :)


http://static.panoramio.com/photos/large/5928319.jpg

Delight
11th October 2013, 20:20
There are a couple of potentialities:

1) The solar plexus is where Will is projected. Breathing in, building up energy in that area and visualizing a golden ball, that then whooshes outwards when you breath out, into a protective bubble around you. Intent should be directed simultaneously, to shut out or mute incoming fields. The key is in actually feeling the ball building within you as a pressure at the bottom of your rib cage. So it may take a few series of breathes to do so. When you release it out into a bubble surrounding you, you should feel the release within and a simultaneous humming/vibratory forces that has now invigorated your aura effectively shielding you from external energy.

2) Heart-centered resonance to incoming energetics can get caught upon our own internal and psychological dysfunction when we have issues ourselves that are activated when incoming emotional fields interact with ours. It is difficult to tell them apart when there is something in us that acknowledges, accepts and owns that energy. This can be turned to the advantage of the empath because it can then bring these issues into focus, where they can be recapitulated, owned, processed and released, leaving one then clear of the energies that particular emotion gives rise to. Once this occurs, if one receives that same emotion from without, and you no longer have an emotional resonance to it in your own experience, you know it is not yours, and you can let it pass through like the visitor it is. Many empaths continue to own the same memory cycles and dysfunctions throughout a lifetime, without ever processing and releasing them, mistaking others issues for their own, thereby relegating themselves to a life of pain and heartache. Being able to hone in on where the emotion is coming from gives the empath, then, the ability to help others to process their own emotions and provide comfort and healing along the way.

Both ways can help or hinder, depending upon where an individual is in their own personal evolutionary process. The first way is useful when one is being bombarded, perhaps even attacked. It is not useful when one wants to reach out and help others. The second way is useful when one truly wants to deal with one's own personal emotional dysfunctions and move beyond them, helping others. It is not useful and can be dangerous, when one is being attacked.

Beginning in massage school in 1996, I started an investigation of energetics as an underlying system.
My question is how do we know any of the descriptions are true?

I had a friend who also studies massage but at a famous school in California. His description of the way they learned to sense and intuite about energy (said 'about" because it was indirect approaches like exercises on how to feel what was occurring by how one felt. It was through the observer. There were generalizations in the curriculum concerning things like maintaining boundaries.

In this presentation above, you talked about the center aroiund the solar plexus "projecting energy" and elsewhere one could read about the solar plexus as the visual of a flower into which energy flows from Chi all around.

And where is one projecting the energy?
Is it to fill up the energy aura?

I have unintentionally seen auras. I feel people' emotions. I link the sensing of energy to be the reading of the whole field.
And there are various descriptions on this thread of how it feels to be entangled with others.

My thought is that the energy systems are run by the body and that it is not necessary to focus any attention on the various ways people describe what is experienced.

What i am really interested in is how we use energy. OK, so I can say from this thread that the difference between one's own energy as expressed by emotion etc.,becomes mixed up with others'. This to me talks about the usefulness of the boundary as a regulated filter. In a cell, the membrane is a brain that selectively lets in energy and information. It is a part of the neurochemical brain, the mind brain and the smaller "brains" of the cell.

It is a conscious interface.

Likewise, we receive energy like prana (OR sheild from it), let selected information cross from the collective to the personal, and interact with other persons having their energetic experience. I like to see us a bubbles in bubbles. We have a semipermeable membrane.

I am more able to imagine the chi energy more generally distributed and the chakras as creating certain frequency patterns. The energy that does not flow in the system constantly refreshing the field is in my opinion the failure to create a successful boundary condition.

So I am curious...what do I know about the way information can create my ability to allow the membrain of my interface with the world. How does my filtering work to increase and to decrease my allowing of chi flowing in the system?

Back to the body. I think the body was made to express the energy system. We have materialized and have the ability to keep physical blocks from flowing energy.
Back to body work. In massage school, one school is different than the other. The commonality is the body.

My thought is that body work is the best thing we can do to learn about boundaries.

We hold energy frequencies of 'others" in our taking in of information. The access to where we shoved the undigestable other is in the body.

I bet 2 massage therapy sessions a week would be a great plan for all empaths. Me too. Loving body thoughts, Maggie

Delight
11th October 2013, 20:50
here, I also want to reference something of the 'home frequency" individual energy signature.

I'd like to suggest that we listen for the inner sound. That individual sound that is our home frequency is always present. To me this is the value of emptying the mind. But no amount of meditation led me to hear my frequency. I found it in the body. After doing an exercise that I learned from tobias Lars, I began to hear the sound of the dense places in my body.

The exercise that set it off is simple. Sit or lie down with right hand outstretced fingers lying on a surface like th ethigh or bed. Feel the skin with the light touch of a dragonfly landing. The buzz, the warmth and the feeling will follow when one persists in feeling the OH S light touch like the tiny dragonfly landing.

For me the sounds came in places that hurt. I'd take the same gentle touch to the dense hard muscles. Then I'd sense a deep inner sound. I'd try to reproduce that sound inside. I'd sing inside that sound.

This has led to hearing my inner sound and when there is a mismatch and I feel out of step with energy around me, I can hear that...its a discernment. The work continues and it has helped me build my energetic boundary. I am also learning how to change the tune and feel more harmony because my range of sound is from my own inner harmonic that widens.
The tense build up of dissonant old sound goes with singing.

onawah
11th October 2013, 21:31
I do a kind of energy medicine work called chakra tuning using tuning forks which is subtle but really quite effective and very non-invasive, and one I can do without getting the energy of the people I'm working on into my space.
As long as I "tune" myself first, that is, which cleanses and replenishes my energy field and sometimes, tune myself again afterwards if the client was carrying a particularly heavy energy.
I pass on tuning people who are taking pharmaceuticals, however.
Just too toxic.
Something I do which helps ground the energy that I pull out of my client's energy fields with the forks, is touch the forks to the table between each "pass". Otherwise it collects around the forks and gets absorbed back into the client or into me.
When the forks touch the table, the energy passes into the solid material and then just disperses, losing its charge.

I know what you mean about Reiki.
People get the idea that it's some kind of magic that gets transmitted through the teachings, which is just silly.
I was channeling healing energy with my hands way before I ever took a Reiki class, but I got a certificate just so that people would have a handle to attach to what I was doing.

T

I wish I could turn it off like your friend, Flash. She seems to know what she’s doing. I was watching a healer spontaneously work on someone with very bad indigestion once, she did not lay her hands on him, but brushed the aura along the length of his body and then kind of ‘shook it off’ at the end of each pass, each time she did this I felt more and more uncomfortable and remember thinking ‘don’t throw it over here’. I FELT that energy, and the next thing I knew I was belching, burping and having bile come up my oesophegus. So this can very much manifest physically. I agree that all of us probably have empathic natures, some can turn it off and some of us just don’t seem able to.

onawah
11th October 2013, 21:54
This is a good site that a previous post gave us the link for, but slow to download (on my computer, anyway) so I've pasted the 30 traits here:
From:
http://theknowing1.wordpress.com/2011/07/01/at-a-glance-30-traits-of-an-empath/

At A Glance: 30 Traits of an Empath
Published July 1, 2011 by justpassingthrough
 1.     Knowing: Empaths just know stuff, without being told. It’s a knowing that goes way beyond intuition or gut feelings, even though that is how many would describe the knowing. The more attuned they are the stronger this gift becomes.
2.     Being in public places can be overwhelming: Places like shopping malls, supermarkets or stadiums, where there are lots of people around, can fill the Empath with turbulently vexed emotions that are coming from others.
 3.     Feeling others emotions and taking them on as your own: This is a huge one for Empaths. To some, they will feel emotions off those near by and with others they will feel emotions from those a vast distance away, or both. The more adept Empath will know if someone is having bad thoughts about them, even from a great distance.
 4.     Watching violence, cruelty or tragedy on the TV is unbearable: The more attuned an Empath becomes the worse it is and may make it so they eventually have to stop watching TV and reading newspapers altogether.
 5.     You know when someone is not being honest: If a friend or a loved one is telling you lies you know it (although many Empaths try not to focus on this because knowing a loved one is lying can be painful). Or if someone is saying one thing but feeling/thinking another, you know.
 6.     Picking up physical symptoms off another: An Empath will almost always develop the ailments off another (colds, eye infections, body aches and pains), especially those who they’re closest to, somewhat like sympathy pains.
 7.     Digestive disorders and lower back problems: The solar plexus chakra is based in the centre of the abdomen and it’s known as the seat of emotions. This is where Empaths feel the incoming emotion of another, which can weaken the area and eventually lead to anything from stomach ulcers to IBS (too many other conditions to list here). Lower back problems can develop from being ungrounded (amongst other things) and one, who has no knowledge of them being an Empath, will almost always be ungrounded.
 8.     Always looking out for the underdog: Anyone whose suffering, in emotional pain or being bullied draws an Empath’s attention and compassion.
 9.     Others will want to offload their problems on you, even strangers: An Empath can become a dumping ground for everyone else’s issues and problems, which, if they’re not careful can end up as their own.
 10.    Constant fatigue: Empaths often get drained of energy, either from energy vampires or just taking on too much from others, which even sleep will not cure. Many get diagnosed with ME.
 11.    Addictive personality: Alcohol, drugs, sex, are to name but a few addictions Empaths turn to, to block out the emotions of others. It can be a form of self protection in order to hide from someone or something (external emotions).
12.    Drawn to healing, holistic therapies and all things metaphysical: Although many Empaths would love to heal others, they can end up turning away from healing (even though they have a natural ability for it), after they’ve studied and qualified, because they take on too much from the one they are trying to heal. Especially if they are unaware of their empathy. Anything of a supernatural nature is of interest to Empaths and they don’t surprise or get shocked easily. Even at the revelation of what many others would consider unthinkable, for example, Empaths would have known the world was round when others believed it was flat.
 13.   Creative: From singing, dancing, acting, drawing or writing an Empath will have a strong creative streak and a vivid imagination.
 14.    Love of nature and animals: Being outdoors in nature is a must for Empaths and pets are an essential part of their life.
 15.    Need for solitude: An Empath will go stir-crazy if they don’t get quiet time. This is even obvious in empathic children.
 16.    Gets bored or distracted easily if not stimulated: Work, school and home life has to be kept interesting for an Empath or they switch off from it and end up daydreaming or doodling.
 17.   Finds it impossible to do things they don’t enjoy: As above. Feels like they are living a lie by doing so. To force an Empath to do something they dislike through guilt or labelling them as idle will only serve in making them unhappy. It’s for this reason many  Empaths get labelled as being lazy.
 18.   Strives for the truth: This becomes more prevalent when an Empath discovers his/her gifts and birthright. Anything untruthful feels plain wrong.
 19.   Always looking for answers and knowledge: To have unanswered questions can be frustrating for an Empath and they will endeavour to find an explanation. If they have a knowing about something they will look for confirmation. The downside to this is an information overload.
 20.  Likes adventure, freedom and travel: Empaths are free spirits.
 21.  Abhors clutter: It makes an Empath feel weighed down and blocks the flow of energy.
 22.  Loves to daydream: An Empath can stare into space for hours, in a world of their own and blissfully happy.
 23.  Finds routine, rules or control, imprisoning: Anything that takes away their freedom is debilitating to an Empath even poisoning.
 24.  Prone to carry weight without necessarily overeating: The excess weight, especially around the belly area, is a form of protection to stop the negative incoming energies having as much impact.
 25.  Excellent listener: An Empath won’t talk about themselves much unless it’s to someone they really trust. They love to learn and know about others and genuinely care.
 26.  Intolerance to narcissism: Although kind and often very tolerant of others, Empaths do not like to be around overly egotistical people, who put themselves first and refuse to consider anyone’s feelings or points of view, other than their own.
 27.   The ability to feel the days of the week: An Empath will get the ‘Friday Feeling’ if they work Fridays or not. They pick up on how the collective are feeling. The first couple of days of a long, bank holiday weekend (Easter for example) can feel, to them, like the world is smiling, calm and relaxed. Sunday evenings, Mondays and Tuesdays, of a working week, have a very heavy feeling.
 28.   Will not choose to buy antiques, vintage or second-hand: Anything that’s been pre-owned carries the energy of the previous owner. An Empath will even prefer to have a brand new car or house (if they are in the financial situation to do so) with no residual energy.
 29.   Sense the energy of food: Many Empaths don’t like to eat meat or poultry because they can feel the vibrations of the animal (especially if the animal suffered), even if they like the taste.
 30.   Can appear moody, shy, aloof, disconnected: Depending on how an Empath is feeling will depend on what face they show to the world. They can be prone to mood swings and if they’ve taken on too much negative will appear quiet and unsociable, even miserable. An Empath detests having to pretend to be happy when they’re sad, this only adds to their load (makes working in the service industry, when it’s service with a smile, very challenging) and can make them feel like scuttling under a stone.

Delight
11th October 2013, 22:28
Just too toxic.



I am going to use myself as an example of empathy refused.

I encountered the very climate that is most toxic for empaths.I was raised by those who exemplified the toxic environment of narcissm.
Lately I see my life more and more like a personal myth.

I learned how to shut narcissms down. I became a wall that defended my will from the personal violation of a toxic world.
Does this sound at all familiar?

Ad one ages, narcissm ages badly. I was a con all my life in defense of my integrity. i pretended to get along with a nonsensical reality.
But I didn't realize that by defending, i cut myself off from Source. My empathy was gone and in its place was an empty shell.
This has to do ins some way with a lawful "where attention goes energy flows". I created a wall and what keeps things out and cannot be discriminated with walls blockingness and nothing at all coming n.

Crude boundaries make one starve, become a vampire, become a narcissist and leads to death. But we discount the rebirth into empaths. This is to me why we are struggling very hard at the moment. The world feels like a hell to an empath.

My mythology tells me that i came to redeem the "narcissist" who is just what happens when we wall off from empathy.
I am that narcssit because I believe we create our own condition of walling off the Universe and may well undo the blockade.

I am not afraid of narcissm (the symptoms great and small.).
It just calls for Ghost Busters. I ain't afraid of no ghosts". These are the ghosts in the body of unimagnable cruelty felt.
Why do we find narcissists and empaths together? Like attracts like. The narcissist is a wounded empath in my book.

Why else would the coin have such different faces?

bluestflame
11th October 2013, 22:44
breathing helps , catching meself sometimes holding me breath

grannyfranny100
12th October 2013, 01:53
Don't confuse your intuition with being an empath. Use your intuition to develop fabulous skills to help others. That is quite an accomplishment.

Watch out for pitfalls in your growth. Pop lists of empath traits sound much like introvert traits. The coping mechanisms and meditations sound similar, too. All that can be helpful in anyone's spiritual growth but you don't need the latest status labels to assess your own personal growth.

Labeling yourself as an empath could be a low self esteem trap in your spiritual growth, so be careful not to derail yourself from your intentions.

Phoenix1304
12th October 2013, 08:56
Don't confuse your intuition with being an empath. Use your intuition to develop fabulous skills to help others. That is quite an accomplishment.

Watch out for pitfalls in your growth. Pop lists of empath traits sound much like introvert traits. The coping mechanisms and meditations sound similar, too. All that can be helpful in anyone's spiritual growth but you don't need the latest status labels to assess your own personal growth.

Labeling yourself as an empath could be a low self esteem trap in your spiritual growth, so be careful not to derail yourself from your intentions.

Fair caution granny, but I would like to chew the cud a bit over your comments.

The list, I felt was how that particular individual experiences empathy and certainly found 27 of the 30 traits bang on personally and I am no introvert, I don't think. An intuitive does not get indigestion by being around one with indigestion I assume. Or become overwhelmed with grief (unawares) physically by being close to one that is and hiding it, I assume.

In fact, I have zero faith in my intuition because, while I sometimes get a sense that someone is being dishonest, lying to themselves or hiding something they don't want known, a deliberate, manipulative liar can easily lead me right up the garden path and round the bend. Most recently I was conned by someone and had NO CLUE whatsoever at the time that I was being conned. In fact, I had a good feeling about him! And so also, did a very intuitive friend of mine. Later, I felt deeply disappointed that I had not picked up any sense of 'not right' about him, I had actually felt he was trustworthy. I was more upset about that than the loss of the $80, frankly, that we ultimately felt he must have needed far more than we did, because he lost his job over it. So that was pretty much the end of my relying on my 'intuition'.

I feel naive like a babe in the woods in this world, and heartsore at the the lack of honesty that seems quite acceptable to most. Noel Coward put it perfectly when he said 'why is it that so many are shocked by honesty and so few by deceit?".

Finally accepting the label of empath, in my case at least, has been somewhat liberating, the trap was in not knowing. Far from feeling derailed, I feel on track at last, having been on a plateau in terms of spiritual development for many years. I am only too aware, however, there are those that might feel proud of such a label, but I'm not one of them. I fail to find a beneficial use for it and recognise my own low self-esteem issues as the inverted vanity they are.

Many thanks for your input, nonetheless.

Phoenix1304
12th October 2013, 09:09
I do a kind of energy medicine work called chakra tuning using tuning forks which is subtle but really quite effective and very non-invasive, and one I can do without getting the energy of the people I'm working on into my space.


I see someone that started out as a chiropractor, turned to kinesiology (VERY effectively) and recently started using the tuning forks. She gave me a treatment for a shoulder problem that she didn't want to touch as a chiropractor and it was AMAZING! I felt that vibration go right through the shoulder and voila! Fixed. Vibrational and sound medicine are surely the way of the future.

I hear you about the Reiki, some years ago my indian yoga teacher told me it was time for me to teach and I did for a while, taking over his class and setting up small ones of my own, but I found that it's very difficult for others not to slip into doubt and suspicion unless you're holding a 'certificate'. They find that very reassuring. LOL! To be honest, I also felt invalid without one. Strange eh?

grannyfranny100
12th October 2013, 13:56
Phoenix1304, I hear you loud and clear. If one is born as an empath, one doesn't understand that this isn't the norm. It means operating at a level that often gets unexpected and debilitating responses and consequences. I am sure that it can be a real "aha" moment when one becomes aware of one's life-long empathic nature. It takes tremendous discernment to cope with this nature and years of experiences to apply it effectively (certificates be damned). Night time alone outside when the noise of the world quiets down can be quite restorative. Be well.

kenaz
12th October 2013, 14:18
Where there is pain and sadness there is also joy and laughter. When I see/feel someone I tap into the
latter and expand it to the surface. I help to remember. It is all perspective. So when a person crosses
my path they leave feeling better from within as I experience from way over here.

onawah
12th October 2013, 18:20
I agree that non-resistance is necessary, but narcissism and chemical toxicity are two very different things.
I avoid doing energy work on people who take pharmaceuticals out of necessity.
Before I realized it was just too much for me to take on, I worked on a few people whose energy made me so sick, all I could do was succumb.
I was weak and ill for hours, even days, afterwards.
It wasn't that I set a boundary-- I just realized what my limits are.
Also two very different things.





Just too toxic.



I am going to use myself as an example of empathy refused.

I encountered the very climate that is most toxic for empaths.I was raised by those who exemplified the toxic environment of narcissm.
Lately I see my life more and more like a personal myth.

I learned how to shut narcissms down. I became a wall that defended my will from the personal violation of a toxic world.
Does this sound at all familiar?

Ad one ages, narcissm ages badly. I was a con all my life in defense of my integrity. i pretended to get along with a nonsensical reality.
But I didn't realize that by defending, i cut myself off from Source. My empathy was gone and in its place was an empty shell.
This has to do ins some way with a lawful "where attention goes energy flows". I created a wall and what keeps things out and cannot be discriminated with walls blockingness and nothing at all coming n.

Crude boundaries make one starve, become a vampire, become a narcissist and leads to death. But we discount the rebirth into empaths. This is to me why we are struggling very hard at the moment. The world feels like a hell to an empath.

My mythology tells me that i came to redeem the "narcissist" who is just what happens when we wall off from empathy.
I am that narcssit because I believe we create our own condition of walling off the Universe and may well undo the blockade.

I am not afraid of narcissm (the symptoms great and small.).
It just calls for Ghost Busters. I ain't afraid of no ghosts". These are the ghosts in the body of unimagnable cruelty felt.
Why do we find narcissists and empaths together? Like attracts like. The narcissist is a wounded empath in my book.

Why else would the coin have such different faces?

schneider
12th October 2013, 18:29
I have been listening to a healer called Ron Amitron. He says we have 108 "bodies" that surround our physical bodies that are to protect us from outside forces. When these ethereal bodies are full they can no longer protect us and we start engaging and are negatively affected by our environment. Some of the more common bodies are; mental body, emotional body, feeling body, empathic body and so on. He has healings on his website that clear out the different bodies. I have cleared out my emotional body and it was very noticeable after the clearing. He also has a technique which is very easy. You simply tell your body out loud to shrink wrap your aura so it is close to your body. The shrink wrap pulls in the aura and chakras so you don't get connected with everyone else's energy, which he says is not good. You don't want a big aura extending way out into everyone else's stuff. His website is www.creationlightship.com

onawah
12th October 2013, 19:18
I think that being empathic may be rooted to a large extent in natural curiosity.
We want to learn about the world first hand by feeling it.
So we develop our ability to take in energies,and the more curious we are, the more inclined we are to do that.
But if we become very conscious of that mechanism, I think we can learn to have more control over it.
What I notice when I am giving myself a chakra tuning, is that my energy is running in a very different way than normal.
Normally, there is this sort of hungry taking in of energies and a focus on one particular thing, though I counterbalance that with Lightwork, ie giving out Light.
But when I'm using the forks on myself, I get connected up with Earth and Cosmic energies in such a grounded and nurturing way, that hunger is replete and the flow of energies coming in and through and out again is very much magnified and much more wholistic.
I am focused in a very different way--on my entire being, which feels very expanded.
It's the opposite of one-pointed concentration.
Like most healers, I need to be sure that I feed myself with the energies I need to feel whole, as well as give to others to feel that I am being of service.
It's the only way to stay in balance.

LahTera
12th October 2013, 19:29
How awesome that there are folks here that understand!

I won't go to hospitals because of this.

I don't really have time right now to explain -- just realized I'm running late for a job. Just glad you posted this!!!

onawah
12th October 2013, 19:35
So true! I have a strong tendency to be a night owl, as I find it so relaxing and easy to focus when everyone else is asleep.
Though it's healthier in other ways to be more attuned to the natural cycles, certainly.
If I lived far out in the country, that would be much easier for me.
It's the noise and physical and mental activity of other people, vehicles, etc. around me that I seem to need a break from, and not just when I'm sleeping.
A study was done somewhere that I read about which concluded our time of birth determines what time of day we prefer to be awake, and if one was born in the wee hours, as I was, one is more likely to be a night owl.
I don't know how true it is, but at least I didn't feel quite so much like an oddball after discovering that possibility.


Night time alone outside when the noise of the world quiets down can be quite restorative. Be well.

Phoenix1304
13th October 2013, 09:39
So true! I have a strong tendency to be a night owl, as I find it so relaxing and easy to focus when everyone else is asleep.
Though it's healthier in other ways to be more attuned to the natural cycles, certainly.
If I lived far out in the country, that would be much easier for me.
It's the noise and physical and mental activity of other people, vehicles, etc. around me that I seem to need a break from, and not just when I'm sleeping.
A study was done somewhere that I read about which concluded our time of birth determines what time of day we prefer to be awake, and if one was born in the wee hours, as I was, one is more likely to be a night owl.
I don't know how true it is, but at least I didn't feel quite so much like an oddball after discovering that possibility.


Night time alone outside when the noise of the world quiets down can be quite restorative. Be well.

Onawah, I don't remember it, but maybe I came across that study because I did a mini study of my own amongst my acquaintances some years ago, those that are bouncing at dawn and the night owls, there was an exception (that proves the rule?), but other than that all the day babies were 'morning people' and the wee hours babies, night owls.

Like you, I also love the peace of the night, for the very same reasons, plus being born at 1am I guess!

Flash
13th October 2013, 14:14
So true! I have a strong tendency to be a night owl, as I find it so relaxing and easy to focus when everyone else is asleep.
Though it's healthier in other ways to be more attuned to the natural cycles, certainly.
If I lived far out in the country, that would be much easier for me.
It's the noise and physical and mental activity of other people, vehicles, etc. around me that I seem to need a break from, and not just when I'm sleeping.
A study was done somewhere that I read about which concluded our time of birth determines what time of day we prefer to be awake, and if one was born in the wee hours, as I was, one is more likely to be a night owl.
I don't know how true it is, but at least I didn't feel quite so much like an oddball after discovering that possibility.


Night time alone outside when the noise of the world quiets down can be quite restorative. Be well.

Onawah, I don't remember it, but maybe I came across that study because I did a mini study of my own amongst my acquaintances some years ago, those that are bouncing at dawn and the night owls, there was an exception (that proves the rule?), but other than that all the day babies were 'morning people' and the wee hours babies, night owls.

Like you, I also love the peace of the night, for the very same reasons, plus being born at 1am I guess!

This wee hours babies and night owls and vice versa certainly does not work with me and my sister. I am a night owl, she is a morning person, yet we were born 10 minutes apart in late afternoon, just before dinner lol.

As for empath, I do think that most of us do have these abilities, but we either cannot differentiate between our own and someone's else inner state, therefore we think the feeling/state of mind/physical ailment is ours, in which case we just have to learn to do it, or it is sometimes so painful to read someone else that we shut off at an early age. Shut off people in turn will become less sensitive and will hit on other young sensitives who will now shut off as well, because of pain.

The solution???? Learn early to differentiate between our own and other's for one, then learn to focus of joy and/or love and generate it as we encounter suffering, fright or dark, to project good instead of keeping projecting the pain that we just got from someone else. first step always being the acknowledgement of what we encounter. Training is needed it seems.

onawah
14th October 2013, 05:15
Training, yes, in learning how to stay grounded and building a stronger aura that doesn't allow so much of the harmful energies in, as well as learning to differentiate what is ours from what isn't.
Also finding useful tools that help in that process, such as crystals and semi precious stones, tuning forks, right diet, exercises, spending time in Nature, supportive community, etc.

One other factor in this night owl business--I have fibromyalgia and chronic fatigue syndrome, originally caused by the SV40 polio vaccine I got as a child, though there have certainly been other contributing factors.
These conditions are known for throwing off one's natural bio rhythms, causing irregular sleeping patterns, etc.

Wind
14th October 2013, 09:30
One other factor in this night owl business--I have fibromyalgia and chronic fatigue syndrome, originally caused by the SV40 polio vaccine I got as a child, though there have certainly been other contributing factors.
These conditions are known for throwing off one's natural bio rhythms, causing irregular sleeping patterns, etc.

Nearly all my life I too have been suffering from fatigue syndrome and other physical ailments. I suspect that it has something to do with vaccines, because I wasn born relatively healthy. I've had a lot of troubles with my immune system and I'm now in the process of finding about more of my condition. I've always been a night owl and my sleep patterns are quite irregular... I think that also the growing full Moon always affects me very strongly.

Carla L. Ruckert's A Wanderers hanbook also tells how most of Wanderers (or starseeds) have a fatigue syndrome and other problems too with their health, in part "Physical Illness" (page 52). I highly recommend that book. Indigo children and adults are a different story, they have even excess of energy. They should not be put on ADD/ADHD medications, but instead they should be guided how to project their energy. Most of them seem to be very active physical people and they will change the world in years to come. We wanderers change the world by our own ways which are somewhat different. We act as beacons of light.

http://www.llresearch.org/library/a_wanderers_handbook_pdf/a_wanderers_handbook.pdf

onawah
14th October 2013, 17:29
For anyone suffering from stealth viruses (created by vaccines, among other causes) I highly recommend Dawn's thread:
http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?43548-The-gut-of-most-disease...-NOT-what-you-think-

GloriousPoetry
14th October 2013, 21:15
Love this thread.......I ran into something Alex Collier said regarding empathy a few years ago and it had something to do with healing...I will find it because it is relevant to this thread.... In the meantime, I want to say that yes I can totally relate to being extra sensitive to energies around me. I grew up in a large dysfunctional family like many people out there....I feel I played the cleansing machine in the exchange of negative energies. I did something radical in 2007...I stopped all communication with my family for 4 years. After 4 years the universe presented me with the opportunity to reconnect with my family again.....after the 4 years apart I cleared the energies and now I have an objective perspective on my empathetic nature.

Phoenix1304
14th October 2013, 22:21
Love this thread.......I ran into something Alex Collier said regarding empathy a few years ago and it had something to do with healing...I will find it because it is relevant to this thread.... In the meantime, I want to say that yes I can totally relate to being extra sensitive to energies around me. I grew up in a large dysfunctional family like many people out there....I feel I played the cleansing machine in the exchange of negative energies. I did something radical in 2007...I stopped all communication with my family for 4 years. After 4 years the universe presented me with the opportunity to reconnect with my family again.....after the 4 years apart I cleared the energies and now I have an objective perspective on my empathetic nature.

Hola! I'll look forward to that Alex Collier piece when you get the chance. I'm glad you reconnected with your family. I felt I did much healing of negativity with my own mother, it had to wait until I was mature enough to not have my buttons pressed and gladly, before she died, all the charge had gone out of our interactions, only love was left. I'm so grateful for that. By the way, would the correct word be Empathic? I feel pathetic enough! LOL

Muchas gracias por sus comentarios! Si, estoy aprendiendo Español.

onawah
18th October 2013, 04:16
I think this is the best thing that I've heard Bashar say so far:
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I intentionally disconnected for awhile from my mother and later from my only sibling at different points in time, and both were very powerful healing experiences for me as well.

Delight
21st October 2013, 17:27
This video is very good and I highly recommend it and the channel that the interviewer has created

http://www.youtube.com/user/EdwinRutsch?feature=watch

Karla Mclaren on Empaths and Empathy: The Language of Emotion

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grannyfranny100
21st October 2013, 19:23
Delight, a delightful interview!! Thanks.

Wow, how do we build a culture of empathy? That is the opposite of the transhumanist training currently happening to turn us into docile robots. IMO Bill has done a tremendous job of that with this forum and his previous consulting work. I would love to hear his views!!!

Delight
21st October 2013, 20:25
Delight, a delightful interview!! Thanks.

Wow, how do we build a culture of empathy? That is the opposite of the transhumanist training currently happening to turn us into docile robots. IMO Bill has done a tremendous job of that with this forum and his previous consulting work. I would love to hear his views!!!

You and I are mind reading! I just listened to a strong interview that is Very ON concerning your question. And the phrase "culture of empathy" was running trough my mind. The article they are addressing is Paul Bloom in the new Yorker

http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critics/atlarge/2013/05/20/130520crat_atlarge_bloom


A Narcissistic Psychopath Responds to Paul Bloom Against Empathy article. Sam Vaknin & Edwin Rutsch

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MaroonLagoon
21st October 2013, 23:17
Delight, thank you so much for posting the Karla Mclaren interview, I'm making some important connections thanks to this. I appreciate it a lot.

Phoenix1304
22nd October 2013, 12:31
Delight, a delightful interview!! Thanks.

Wow, how do we build a culture of empathy? That is the opposite of the transhumanist training currently happening to turn us into docile robots. IMO Bill has done a tremendous job of that with this forum and his previous consulting work. I would love to hear his views!!!

You and I are mind reading! I just listened to a strong interview that is Very ON concerning your question. And the phrase "culture of empathy" was running trough my mind. The article they are addressing is Paul Bloom in the new Yorker

http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critics/atlarge/2013/05/20/130520crat_atlarge_bloom


A Narcissistic Psychopath Responds to Paul Bloom Against Empathy article. Sam Vaknin & Edwin Rutsch



Hello Delight

I tried to write a response to your earlier post in which you linked narcissism and empathy (that I found outlandish) and got rather bogged down, because parts of your post, I have to admit, I had difficulty understanding.

Seeing the videos you posted, I now have a better idea of where you are coming from. The pyschological and psychiatric adoption of the concept of empathy is quite radically different from my concept of empathy.

It seems to me now that there should be another word altogether for what I am describing and experiencing. (‘emotiopath’ or ‘sensopath’ maybe). Learning from the vids that the etymology of the word empathy is from the german einfelung, which was used to describe the ability to project one’s personality into the viewed object, I see that it is quite inapplicable to my experience. Even though the current dictionary definition of ‘the ability to understand and share the feelings of others’ has been acceptable until now as it allows for the experience devoid of volition.

While the discussions in both videos are quite interesting, I found myself wanting to interject with ‘yes, but what if’. That ‘what if’ is what if it is an involuntary energetic experience, therefore, there is no possibility of refusing it, as you did, it just is. I feel they’re discussing something else, not empathy as I know it. Psychiatry or psychology is attempting only to deal with the fallout. The cause is a great unknown it seems.

I am not projecting or introjecting the experience, say, of someone’s grief. I feel it just the way they do. Very often with no visual clues whatsoever, the individual may even be smiling or laughing and covering up most expertly. It is not a subjective projection based on my own experience of grief, it is ‘their’ grief and, I believe, just the way they feel it. So the philosophical questions are definitely moot. If empathy has become a buzzword that is bad news as it’s definition becomes ever more woolly and people think it’s cool to be one. It’s not.

We can talk about the ‘mind’ and how everything originates there, but I believe there is another element involved here and that is energy. Vibrations, call it what you will, but it is separate from my mind though affects the mind and body, but my mind did not initiate the energetic frequency I experience from the other in the first place.

Do you see what I’m trying to get at here? That this is not some psychological condition, but a sensitivity to energetic vibrations quite separate from the mind initially.

With my mind, I try to shield myself, but without much success. All I can do is observe how it impacts my mind and try to get my emotional energetic body back into balance by using the mind to try and sort out what’s mine from what’s not.

I’m all for an empathic culture where everyone respects, understands and sympathises with others, this would be tremendous spiritual progress, but ultimately I feel it has little to do with experiencing others emotional states involuntarily, neither for their benefit or my own it seems to me.

This last full moon with lunar eclipse was absolute hell for me, I felt utterly crazed and knew why, when neighbours errupted into raging arguments and I had a policeman at my door asking what I’d heard. I just told him to expect a busy night as it was a full moon, I didn’t like his vibe either, ‘answer all my questions but don’t ask any’.

Bah. I’m very tired of the energy vortices I seem to be endlessly caught up in, awareness of it has been the only small step forward.

Many thanks for your input.

Delight
22nd October 2013, 15:40
Delight, a delightful interview!! Thanks.

Wow, how do we build a culture of empathy? That is the opposite of the transhumanist training currently happening to turn us into docile robots. IMO Bill has done a tremendous job of that with this forum and his previous consulting work. I would love to hear his views!!!

You and I are mind reading! I just listened to a strong interview that is Very ON concerning your question. And the phrase "culture of empathy" was running trough my mind. The article they are addressing is Paul Bloom in the new Yorker

http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critics/atlarge/2013/05/20/130520crat_atlarge_bloom


A Narcissistic Psychopath Responds to Paul Bloom Against Empathy article. Sam Vaknin & Edwin Rutsch



Seeing the videos you posted, I now have a better idea of where you are coming from. The pyschological and psychiatric adoption of the concept of empathy is quite radically different from my concept of empathy.

It seems to me now that there should be another word altogether for what I am describing and experiencing. (‘emotiopath’ or ‘sensopath’ maybe). Learning from the vids that the etymology of the word empathy is from the german einfelung, which was used to describe the ability to project one’s personality into the viewed object, I see that it is quite inapplicable to my experience. Even though the current dictionary definition of ‘the ability to understand and share the feelings of others’ has been acceptable until now as it allows for the experience devoid of volition.

While the discussions in both videos are quite interesting, I found myself wanting to interject with ‘yes, but what if’. That ‘what if’ is what if it is an involuntary energetic experience, therefore, there is no possibility of refusing it, as you did, it just is. I feel they’re discussing something else, not empathy as I know it. Psychiatry or psychology is attempting only to deal with the fallout. The cause is a great unknown it seems.

I am not projecting or introjecting the experience, say, of someone’s grief. I feel it just the way they do. Very often with no visual clues whatsoever, the individual may even be smiling or laughing and covering up most expertly. It is not a subjective projection based on my own experience of grief, it is ‘their’ grief and, I believe, just the way they feel it. So the philosophical questions are definitely moot. If empathy has become a buzzword that is bad news as it’s definition becomes ever more woolly and people think it’s cool to be one. It’s not.


Thank you very much for looking at my post. I appreciate that it may have made not much sense. I called my own condition empathy refused because I am positive I have used the defense of intellectualization and numbing and plain severing to survive.

I don't really believe in the psychiatric models as the truth. There is some kind of experience.
What you seem to be describing sounds very much a state of receiving that could be terrible.
Maybe in such sensitivity, someone else would DO ANYTHING to shut off it off, especially if one were in an environment so terrifying and dangerous.
Given the worst case scenarios, the being would fracture. There might be an empath and a narcissist both in the being due to splitting? There may be deliberate intentions to use the fracture of sensitive beings as it suits the insane culture of the present.

Whatever an empath "really" is experiencing makes "normal" life a nightmare given the environment I grew up within. Investigating the question about "narcissm" and is it possibly the tuning of a conditioning from trauma is important to me? It is my mix up about boundaries, empathy, the self and responsibilities that is the crux of MY problem.

Karla Mclaren describes the empath is accessing a "body skill". If we misunderstand our own sensations, feelings, boundaries we cannot feel the signals "well". They are absent or overwhelming?

That also exchoes what others say that we make a great deal of the "psychic" but its really "physic" and natural. As she shows, boundaries are to be developed, emotion is to be understood and the "empath" skills utilized along with communication. I sincerely believe healing "narcissm" is healing the same mechanism that causes empaths to suffer.

Delight
22nd October 2013, 15:48
Posted twice....

Sammy
22nd October 2013, 16:02
I learned the hard way regarding empathy that though it is fine for me to experience empathy and even experience it intensely, it has proven unwise for me to then cast intentional thought generated outcome scenarios for what has been the source of a specific empathetic experience. Why? Because I no longer hold the opinion my judgment of a specific situation nor the potential magical solution I might derive could ever be as good as what the unmolested Wisdom of the Universe will provide.

I do apply the serenity prayer in a real way. Meaning if I am able to become involved with another on terms they can understand and trust in and that person then gives me permission to act then I sometimes do, but never in a magical way. I do what I can do within the confines of the physical universe.

Example, my son got in trouble. He asked if I could help him. I asked a friend who is a lawyer if he would help my son and he did. My son got probation.

What I did not do was focus my will into the situation. I am not saying I did not hope he would get probation. But I did not "pray" that he would. I left it up the the Wisdom of the Universe to generate the outcome.

He got probation and he lasted only a short while. Now he is on the run and his fate is in the hands of the system in this physical world but ultimately in the hands of the Wisdom of the Universe.

Because I handled this all in this way, though it saddens me the current situation, I avoided obtaining the emotional ball and chain I so much of my life when younger would acquire.

No wonder I was such an alcoholic/drug addict for so much of my life.

No wonder I am sober two years now.

grannyfranny100
22nd October 2013, 19:56
Phoenix1304, the words "energy" and "vibration" resonate since those words are not necessarily related to people but to something much greater. It rides the currents of the ether. At times it manifests as a dream story of non-words composed of abstract color patterns. For animals, as a tsunami warning and for a bum knee person a coming weather pattern change. One can jump from one energy vortex to the lily pad of another vortex.

In a discussion of the fashionable meme of empaths, all these seem possible as does the idea of "reading" people's emotions and debating the source as an empath reading oneself or another person. But what separates the label "empath" from a skill set related to intuition and in what way? Or from good training at the rare home that honors manners and politeness as communication skills and hones those skills in their off spring.

What I am hearing is the intensity of pain one can experience and that one is uniquely sensitive to the pain of other individuals. Are we saying that what defines being an empath means one suffers more than others?

Delight
22nd October 2013, 21:29
Phoenix1304, the words "energy" and "vibration" resonate since those words are not necessarily related to people but to something much greater. It rides the currents of the ether. At times it manifests as a dream story of non-words composed of abstract color patterns. For animals, as a tsunami warning and for a bum knee person a coming weather pattern change. One can jump from one energy vortex to the lily pad of another vortex.

In a discussion of the fashionable meme of empaths, all these seem possible as does the idea of "reading" people's emotions and debating the source as an empath reading oneself or another person. But what separates the label "empath" from a skill set related to intuition and in what way? Or from good training at the rare home that honors manners and politeness as communication skills and hones those skills in their off spring.

What I am hearing is the intensity of pain one can experience and that one is uniquely sensitive to the pain of other individuals. Are we saying that what defines being an empath means one suffers more than others?

This has a very good discussion of highly sensitive people and empaths and the way they often become involved with "narcissists".


Tuesday September 10th, 2013 4pm PT: The Empath and the Narcissist

The title, “The Empath and the Narcissist” may sound a bit like a fairytale of two opposites and a relationship between an Empath and a Narcissist may very well begin like a fairytale; but it often ends more like a nightmare. Why is one who is highly empathic so frequently attracted to one so lacking in empathy?

In this episode of Pandora’s Box Kaleah will talk about the Empath, his/her draw to the narcissist and how he/she can reconcile the ending of a painful relationship with someone who cares nothing for her feelings. http://www.blogtalkradio.com/dispelling-the-myths/2013/09/10/the-empath-and-the-narcissist

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/dispelling-the-myths/2013/09/10/the-empath-and-the-narcissist.mp3

Delight
22nd October 2013, 23:45
Sam Vaknin is a self identified narcissist with psychopathic tendencies. This is an interview with his wife with whom he has a professional relationship writing and publishing his books. From 47 minutes, Sam talks about his behavior in the relationship. In what he says, he shows how "sensitive" he is to others. He has the ability to mirror people to themselves and he does this well. People including his wife value this ability in him.

http://archive.org/details/AudreyMichelleTalksToLidijaRangelovskaWifeOfNarcis sistAndNarcissism

I had a relationship with someone able to do this also which did hook me into believing he had some "special" role in my life. What a very confusing, painful experience which led me to be wiser and stronger. The main point stressed frequently is that the narcissist is not interested in others except for what they may provide the narssicist. The intention is "PROTECTION" of the deeply wounded self. "Being real" is deliberately rejected through the person's own devaluation. That is a a fundamental of the cultural system where people are objects, problems/reaction/solution system wide, basic inhumane treatment "normal" and "good causes" only conduits for "energy" to a group.

The personal "charisma" and ability to read others is attractive. Leaders in politics can read others. In "religion", the ability of a charismatic leader to have insight into others is often touted as "spiritual" (leading to cults). What I suggest is Empathy is natural. Empaths must develop a protective strong sense of self and boundaries. It is our capacities to refuse to dance with the energies" that will be our salve.

THIS ability that narcissistic people have to psych others out is also an epathic skill. An empath may well believe her motivations are the same in the other person and finally there is understanding?

I am really certain that narcissm is a cultural expression of a deep fear of facing self as less than perfect. The person in a very vulnerable relationship is valued not for the real self but for an idealized image. Devaluation for the real person wounds.

It is fear derived from abuse as a child, PROBABLY in part from the empathic ability that is likely to threaten the people in one's life, leads to punishment. Punishment is extended to the empath for her emotional expression, speaking out loud of "secrets", embarrassing reflecction to the "culture" of narcissism. Shunning from the very people depended upon is threatening.

I wonder if in an attempt to gain control, the empath may take on the same strategies to defend. One other aspect is that empaths DO know what they sense. They are consistently told to distrust the knowing but this is actually not really possible. We know we know. We can be handle this cognitive assault from the others in various ways but it will not change the truth

Our knowing can become a tool to use against others as the "control" against pain becomes "the best defense is a good offense". I do not think that the capacity to feel deeply "means" the sensitive becomes necessarily a "good" person. This is iF one is hurt by that sensitivity. This is why I think narcissm IS the other side of an expression of the ability to "feel" empathically.

Ok, so we come to the presing empahsis on the emotional energy and learning how to heal at the level of energy, in the emotional body especially. I believe a narcissitic wound can be healed only by the person with the wound.

I keep thinking about strategies of how we must insist others behave. That is why I say no contact may be all we who have not learned good boundaries in a relationship may stand to share with "empaths turned narcissist" most of the time. The funny Universal truth may be that if the Empath is healed to have the confidence of strong self and effective boundaries, no doubt there few narcissist characters will be lurking?

Flash
23rd October 2013, 01:49
Justonman wrote: I learned the hard way regarding empathy that though it is fine for me to experience empathy and even experience it intensely, it has proven unwise for me to then cast intentional thought generated outcome scenarios for what has been the source of a specific empathetic experience. Why? Because I no longer hold the opinion my judgment of a specific situation nor the potential magical solution I might derive could ever be as good as what the unmolested Wisdom of the Universe will provide.

I do apply the serenity prayer in a real way. Meaning if I am able to become involved with another on terms they can understand and trust in and that person then gives me permission to act then I sometimes do, but never in a magical way. I do what I can do within the confines of the physical universe.

Example, my son got in trouble. He asked if I could help him. I asked a friend who is a lawyer if he would help my son and he did. My son got probation.

What I did not do was focus my will into the situation. I am not saying I did not hope he would get probation. But I did not "pray" that he would. I left it up the the Wisdom of the Universe to generate the outcome.

He got probation and he lasted only a short while. Now he is on the run and his fate is in the hands of the system in this physical world but ultimately in the hands of the Wisdom of the Universe.

Because I handled this all in this way, though it saddens me the current situation, I avoided obtaining the emotional ball and chain I so much of my life when younger would acquire.

No wonder I was such an alcoholic/drug addict for so much of my life.

No wonder I am sober two years now.

Wow. This is an outstanding example of self mastery. The hardest thing to get under control is the emotional input we put into ou children, as parents. And you are achieving it. Thank your son to have provided you with the opportunity. This is great Chester, i am not there yet personnally, i think.

I am sorry though for yor son and what he is inflicting on himself, for the moment and i do have empathy for both of you.

Love
Flash

onawah
23rd October 2013, 04:27
This thread gets better and better.
The concurrent Exceptional Abilities thread is a good companion study too, at:
http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?64028-Exceptional-psychic-abilities-in-exceptional-people
:bump:

Phoenix1304
23rd October 2013, 09:26
Phoenix1304, the words "energy" and "vibration" resonate since those words are not necessarily related to people but to something much greater. It rides the currents of the ether. At times it manifests as a dream story of non-words composed of abstract color patterns. For animals, as a tsunami warning and for a bum knee person a coming weather pattern change. One can jump from one energy vortex to the lily pad of another vortex.

In a discussion of the fashionable meme of empaths, all these seem possible as does the idea of "reading" people's emotions and debating the source as an empath reading oneself or another person. But what separates the label "empath" from a skill set related to intuition and in what way? Or from good training at the rare home that honors manners and politeness as communication skills and hones those skills in their off spring.

What I am hearing is the intensity of pain one can experience and that one is uniquely sensitive to the pain of other individuals. Are we saying that what defines being an empath means one suffers more than others?

Greets Grannyfranny

What separates an empath from an intuitive? I assume the actual sensations of pain, emotional or physical, rather than just awareness of them. But I really don't know, I'm still grappling to understand the whole thing myself. I'm not psychic, I wish I was, I'd love to chat to the dearly departed and guides, guardians and angels! I'll tell you what I am certain of. Absolutely nothing.

I had to visit an old house yesterday and immediately got the impression it was haunted. I had an interview with the owner (that lasted an unexpected hour and a half) and it emerged that it is indeed haunted and she has been under heavy psychic attack by a spirit in limbo as I would have understood it in the old days. She also ended up completely falling apart, weeping and offloading her sadness about her failure to conceive. Now I picked up the 'black energy' that enveloped the house, but did not pick up her overwhelming sadness. Go figure. As ever, this ended up not being about my getting a badly needed job, but about being there for her and the long conversation in which I had the familiar old 'juddering'. I don't want the job, even if offered to be honest as I never want to go back there. But if offered I feel I must offer to go and smudge the house as I'm only too aware that my refusal to take it will deepen her fear and sadness, as the invisible tenants are clearly (to me) the cause of her revolving door of staff. I suggested she got a good psychic to come in and talk them out of the house, but really feel quite ill-equipped to deal with her problem other than soothe her and ease her fear somewhat.

I don't really know what you mean by what separates an empath from good manners. As for suffering more than others, empaths suffer as much as others I suppose, with the added weight of occasionally feeling others pain in addition to one's own.

The only bright spot yesterday, was her young labrador that constantly licked me and tried to get on my lap incessantly. She said the nightime visitations had stopped since she'd got him, (though it's news to me that a dog can see off a ghost caught in a loop), he was quite adorable and wouldn't leave me alone, until I got up to leave when he lay on his bed looking up at us with sad eyes. 'He's sad you're leaving' she said. I think he was too. I'm wondering if I hadn't had his boisterous and joyous distraction, whether I might have picked up her sadness, but it came as a surprise to me, as did the validation of my almost idle thoughts about it being haunted. I felt 'sticky' when I got home and thoroughly smudged myself, it took a few hours for the juddering to subside.

So I struggle on, trying to make sense of it all.

Phoenix1304
23rd October 2013, 09:42
Phoenix1304, the words "energy" and "vibration" resonate since those words are not necessarily related to people but to something much greater. It rides the currents of the ether. At times it manifests as a dream story of non-words composed of abstract color patterns. For animals, as a tsunami warning and for a bum knee person a coming weather pattern change. One can jump from one energy vortex to the lily pad of another vortex.

In a discussion of the fashionable meme of empaths, all these seem possible as does the idea of "reading" people's emotions and debating the source as an empath reading oneself or another person. But what separates the label "empath" from a skill set related to intuition and in what way? Or from good training at the rare home that honors manners and politeness as communication skills and hones those skills in their off spring.

What I am hearing is the intensity of pain one can experience and that one is uniquely sensitive to the pain of other individuals. Are we saying that what defines being an empath means one suffers more than others?

Wow. This is an outstanding example of self mastery. The hardest thing to get under control is the emotional input we put into ou children, as parents. And you are achieving it. Thank your son to have provided you with the opportunity. This is great Chester, i am not there yet personnally, i think.

I am sorry though for yor son and what he is inflicting on himself, for the moment and i do have empathy for both of you.

Love
Flash

Hi Flash

I assume you meant to quote Justoneman's post. Regarding your last sentence, I would say that you have sympathy with both of them, not empathy. I think there is an increasingly blurred line about what empathy actually is. Sympathy and compassion are not empathy as I understand it. Though both virtues inevitably go along with empathy at the end of the day. Tell me if I'm wrong and you viscerally feel both of their emotional states. Otherwise, please let's not deepen confusion on the matter by using the word as a 'fashionable meme' as grannyfranny so succintly put it.

Thanks.

grannyfranny100
23rd October 2013, 12:16
It sure is difficult to create a vocabulary for "empath." Doing so when we also discuss narcissism to help in this "adventure" has one caveat I want to mention.

Narcissism is longer a term in the "Bible" of mental disorders: fifth edition of the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DMS-5). The rational was comorbidity with other personality disorders. In other words narcissism isn't as clear cut a disorder as previous thought. Instead such a personality type is now considered a mixture of disorders.

I don't mind us using the term in our search to understand and describe empathy. I do think we should be aware of the raging battle by professionals. When we review videos, it can be a clue as to the presenter's awareness of the latest debates in the field. If they don't mention the DMS-5 change and discuss how it influences their views and theories, we should consider that the person may not be incorporating the latest ideas about it. Are they a credentialed professional or a layperson. Then make a personal judgement about whether that matters or not.

grannyfranny100
23rd October 2013, 12:55
Phoenix, OMG, exposing your sensitivity to a haunted house! Did see an article, interview, whatever that this is risky business. I don't even want to go to Halloween Haunted Houses as a charity venture. My neurochemistry gets too jumbled up over much simpler things. Ugh! I am just glad that you used it as an opportunity to discover more about yourself and what is appropriate for you.

As for the work issue, do you have some training in a field to help your money crunch? You mentioned the dog. Could you get work helping at a vet's office or a kennel. Sounds like you can "talk' to animals and it could be quite rewarding. I have always enjoyed "talking" telepathically to animals mainly dogs and cats. The loving ones not the guard dog types.

grannyfranny100
23rd October 2013, 15:07
When I mentioned manners, here is what I was getting at. I remember the old days of putting on black patent shoes, a hat and a dress to go to Sunday school. It was a more formal situation than how people dress for church and Sunday school these days. Good manners were important. It was a good training ground to learn when you were unintentionally impolite. One teacher was particularly good at helping me when I caused distress or someone caused me distress. She was quite empathic, intuitive, loving.

I feel that "good manners" is the kindergarten for honing empathic skills. If parents could get beyond the usual basic stuff: "because I say so" or because that's how life is." If they could encourage family meal time without cellphones and TV, I think they might be able to help their children's skill sets. They could dissect a conversation that got nasty to make the entire family more sensitive to the subtext. Empaths would blossom in such an environment.

Of course many parents are not any better at it than their kids and need to go to "charm school" themselves. Now there you go, Phoenix. Open up an old fashioned "charm school," or in today's terms an after school child care center. Forget the emphasis on silverware table locations and how to ask and accept a dance. Just let'em play with the understanding that play time stops and discussion begins when problems occur. Help them learn to understand themselves and others at a deeper level. You would be fabulous at it!!! Call it "Insightful Childcare" or whatever seems right to you. This dovetails with the current approach to schoolyard bullying.

Here is an example from my life of the meanness I could have done if I hadn't kept it as a fantasy. I guess I mention it because my honest feelings still haunt me. I guess this is a confession because I can be very explosive. I sometimes get sick of all the sympathy that can be given in some threads when I think the person wants sympathy rather than insight. That is the down side of being an empath- too much nice, nice. On the other hand, some empaths are fantastic at giving sympathy and topping it with insight- Ulli is an excellent example. But sometimes empaths may be too subtle. This seems to be an approach one must develop with experience.

Here is my "confession." I was at Sunday Fellowship. A waddling, early twenties babe walked in dressed like a whore from my perspective: boobs flopping almost out and her bottom barely covered in some flimsy, see through fabric- a tampon string would have shown.

Now people don't do an "I am dressed better than you" number at this fellowship; jeans are pretty standard for most folks. But this gal looked like she was headed to a pick up bar even by today's loose dress codes. All she needed was a sign that said, "I'm ready and I promise I won't give you AIDS."

Now I come from an age when I didn't want to be approached as a "hot tottie" (spelling right?) because I had big boobs, red hair and a tall hourglass figure. I hated being a sex object. I wanted to be respected and liked because I had a brain. I worked hard to be something other than the standard non-decision making positions available to women. Even when I did gain some power, my boss's boss who was divorced by an early women's libber managed to embarrass our client's representatives. He announced that lunch would be at a private men's only club. Being a European international organization they had better manners than that and felt awkward. I doubt that lunch went as well without me but so be it.

Now I mention that story because it is typical of many stories that women went through to gain some respect in the work place. So when I see young women today acting trashy, I feel pissed that they act like the sex objects Hollywood want them to be rather than building on the progress that has been made.

So I had my little fantasy during the fellowship service. I wanted to approach this gal after the service and with all phony sweetness and light engage her in conversation and after delivering the perfect segue, ask her if I could offer her a few bucks to get something more appropriate to wear than a pick up bar outfit. I really savored the thought of her freaking out at my distain. So I had my fantasy and left it at that but I don't feel too good about what I was feeling.

I don't have some need or desire to help tons of people (been there, done that often to my own travail). My experience seems to be more on knowing the source of empathy- the energy field, the vibrations out there that can be used by empaths and the messages that come through to me often as a language of color.

I really can't be a nice, nice, empath like so many of you can. Bill Ryan, empath or not, is a genuine master of presenting the right tone. One can tell he carefully crafts his messages in his posts and in his interviews. Occasionally some genuine frustration comes through but never meanness. He doesn't get into power tripping as so many forum owners do. This forum is a wonderful canvas of his talents. I really admire those that can do what he does so deftly and those who aspire to become as accomplished as he is.

4evrneo
23rd October 2013, 16:46
Thank you all for this dialog. It has been helpful to see others perspectives. In the interview that Delight posted about the Narcissistic psychopath, he said something that I didnt quite agree with, about empathy being an aquired learning. Well, he said there is some debate about this. From my own experience, I can remember as a young child, watching my mother heavily drinking and laughing with company but I could feel deep sorrow and pain coming from her. I remember it was confusing to me at first but as time went on, I realized it was a coping mechanism for her to drink and try to hide her pain.

I actually remember many other instances where out of nowhere, I would feel deep pain, or anxiety and look around me to see where it was coming from. This was a very confusing time for me as a child or young teen to suddenly be experiencing something that after a couple minutes would realize it wasnt coming from me. I never talked about these experiences with anyone, I was pretty much alone growing up and I somehow knew that it would be pointless to try to talk to my mother as she was already overwhelmed with things that neither she or I knew how to fix.

Of course today is a different story, although I still have a mother who is lost and constantly in emotional pain, I have run a self course over the years so to speak on learning who not to approach and who I can approach with what I feel from them, some have responded well and some dismiss or deny it and even my ex-boyfriend got upset and offended as if I had tapped into his mind and heard his thoughts. It's crazy, one year later after we had broke up, he has confirmed what I originally felt from him and he is now comfortable telling me I was right.

It is great to see all of you here discussing this subject, it's not something I have been able to discuss before.

Phoenix1304
24th October 2013, 11:33
Greets Grannyfranny. Thank you for elaborating. I love this kind of sharing.

Too much nice. Oh I hear ya. I call it 'terminal niceness' that I had beaten into me. Well at worst, a strap round the back of the legs, there was no rudeness or self-indulgent displays allowed in my upbringing. I later felt that it gave me an obstacle as it prevented me from setting boundaries. Too many times I've resisted offending someone that was offensive to me. How do you tell a close friend they stink of BO? Or worse, when I was unable to simply say "get lost” to the endlessly harassing young males in Greece, I ended up getting raped. It's interesting to consider that empathy was honed by having ‘niceness’ drummed into me, I’ll chew over that for a few days.

I'm not nearly so nice now, but my heart still races when I try to set boundaries. That said, I mourn the loss of manners in our culture. The success of TV series like Downtown Abbey, imo, has a lot to do with the old-fashioned respect, values and good manners of both upstairs/downstairs that people wistfully long for. It's complete pulp drama of course as nothing is ever so black and white in life, my own experience with the wealthy and powerful are that they are generally spoilt, degenerate with a completely false sense of superiority, but Downtown is an uplifting escape from the general depravity of present day society. I am regularly saddened to see men's magazines that objectify women (airbrushed and bearing no resemblance to real women either) boldy displayed at child eye level even in the local supermarket. It damages both men and women. Witness the porn problem in the U.S. where addiction to it is now identified as a problem. To anyone that thinks it's cool I say 'programmed moron'.

I had to laugh at your description of the tarty gal, and your preoccupation with how you might get her to change. I fully understand your being pissed at women that set back the liberation of women with their behaviour, I doubt that any of them will have even heard of Emily Pankhurst, but I just feel they don't stand a chance, the mainstream media actively sexualises children from a very young age (and those child beauty pageants in the US are quite sickening) and the programming is such that young women don't even know how they've been had. All women have been had, actually, feminism became misappropriated as a cover for sending us out to work long hours and pay taxes in addition to cooking, cleaning, homemaking and having babies! Which really should be a vocation in itself. Gone are the days when a man had to win a women's love, and she made a God of him as he honoured the Goddess in her. Spiritual pairings of that kind must be rare. Lack of respect for women has a lot to do with the mess we're in, as do the women that do not deserve, expect or demand respect.

The boys have it just as bad in different ways and secretly despise the whorish behaviour of girls, take all they can get then treat them badly and are reluctant to take them home to see their mothers, from what I can tell, demure girls with self-respect are considered weirdos and will find themselves left out in the cold from their contemporaries if they're not swilling vodka and falling about with their arse in the air. It's tough on them all. I wouldn't know what to say, I personally detest veiled messages and prefer people to be frank, but that's like asking for the moon. If she crossed my path I'd probably say 'don't you find that dressing provocatively is asking for trouble?" and move on to self-respect if she engaged.

Agreed about Bill and I’m grateful to our host for this place where decent, intelligent people can gather to discuss the bigger picture. I admire his honesty and how he handles the sometimes completely unjustified attacks. I think he recognises they are mostly cries for attention, but it must be very tiresome. I wouldn’t know about other forums as there aren’t enough hours in the day for me to keep up with this one!

Maybe I should start a private forum the Granny Channel where the elders can have similar rants to this one, but it doesn't really achieve anything, so I won't. Forgive me for opening the pressure valve a tad and straying off topic.

Flash
24th October 2013, 12:28
Phoenix1304, the words "energy" and "vibration" resonate since those words are not necessarily related to people but to something much greater. It rides the currents of the ether. At times it manifests as a dream story of non-words composed of abstract color patterns. For animals, as a tsunami warning and for a bum knee person a coming weather pattern change. One can jump from one energy vortex to the lily pad of another vortex.

In a discussion of the fashionable meme of empaths, all these seem possible as does the idea of "reading" people's emotions and debating the source as an empath reading oneself or another person. But what separates the label "empath" from a skill set related to intuition and in what way? Or from good training at the rare home that honors manners and politeness as communication skills and hones those skills in their off spring.

What I am hearing is the intensity of pain one can experience and that one is uniquely sensitive to the pain of other individuals. Are we saying that what defines being an empath means one suffers more than others?

Wow. This is an outstanding example of self mastery. The hardest thing to get under control is the emotional input we put into ou children, as parents. And you are achieving it. Thank your son to have provided you with the opportunity. This is great Chester, i am not there yet personnally, i think.

I am sorry though for yor son and what he is inflicting on himself, for the moment and i do have empathy for both of you.

Love
Flash

Hi Flash

I assume you meant to quote Justoneman's post. Regarding your last sentence, I would say that you have sympathy with both of them, not empathy. I think there is an increasingly blurred line about what empathy actually is. Sympathy and compassion are not empathy as I understand it. Though both virtues inevitably go along with empathy at the end of the day. Tell me if I'm wrong and you viscerally feel both of their emotional states. Otherwise, please let's not deepen confusion on the matter by using the word as a 'fashionable meme' as grannyfranny so succintly put it.

Thanks.

Yes you are right, I meant to quote Justeoneman post.

You are wrong, i meant empathy - I had many chats with Chester and can truly sometimes feel him, as well as put myself in his shoes, somehow. I do not usually blurr both, empathy and sympathy.

I would add that to me, narcissism and empathy are not both end of a Spectrum, as it seems to have been mentioned in other posts. Having lived with a narcissist for years, I do know how this one thought and behaved. They are excellent "empathy" imitators, but everything, absolutely everything, has to do with themselves, the other is not important, even if they will show imitation of giving importance.

In fact, I would have much to say on the topic, but right now i am studying for exams and have no time.


Edit: I corrected my post by putting in the right quotes from Justoneman. Thanks for the corrective you brought Phoenix.

grannyfranny100
24th October 2013, 13:11
Justoneman, you said, "What I did not do was focus my will into the situation. I am not saying I did not hope he would get probation. But I did not "pray" that he would. I left it up the the Wisdom of the Universe to generate the outcome."

I feel this is a very wise observation. The "give me, give me what I want" praying was always a difficult one for me. Somehow that instinctively always seemed wrong. I like the distinction you made of hope and leaving it up to the Wisdom of the Universe. This must be a very painful event in your life but I hope your "reading" of it brings you some comfort. You have not interfered with your son's sovereignty and his need to follow his own path. Meanwhile you certainly have left the door open for a future reunion when he gets his act together.

Kudos to you on your two years of recovery. This event was quite a "final exam" about your recovery and you seem to have passed it with flying colors! Congratuations.

The closest I have been to such an incident was with my dog since I was childless. After eleven years together, Tiger Lily had a fatal blood disorder and went into remission when I went through my demanding prayers. Of course the disease came back and this time, I had one of our telepathic conversations with her. I told her, it was okay for her to leave if she must. That I understood. I told her I would miss her but I was just happy that we had gotten to be together again in this lifetime (she was a monkey like creature who wrapped her arms around me in a previous lifetime). I felt much better about giving her the chance to leave without feeling guilty. After she died and I buried her, I went to our favorite hiking spot and summoned my deceased husband (I was widowed at 32 years old when he was 35 years old. The dog was with me before and after the marriage). I wordlessly asked him to take care of her and they trotted off together. I was fortunate to have someone on the other side to intrust her to.

Justoneman, you had the "Wisdom of the Universe" to intrust your son to and that is even better. Your faith is so sparkling clear!!! Thank you for sharing, I like that phrase, "Wisdom of the Universe."

grannyfranny100
24th October 2013, 14:48
Flash, I am curious what you studying? Several times you have checked into a thread (a nice break from the books, I bet) and mentioned being rushed because of exams. I look forward to eventually learning more about what is going on.

grannyfranny100
24th October 2013, 14:54
Well I just fried my brain. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empathy. Too much for me to absorb but at least I scanned it and now know there is lots there that we could spend months dissecting. Be forewarned, it is written at an exhausting machine gun speed.

Flash
24th October 2013, 15:30
Flash, I am curious what you studying? Several times you have checked into a thread (a nice break from the books, I bet) and mentioned being rushed because of exams. I look forward to eventually learning more about what is going on.

I am doing a master degree in Orientation advisory (I do not know the title in English, sorry). Not only do we learn all the stats, psychometry used all over, but also we learn psychotherapy and consulting.

I most probably am the eldest of the 200 students at the bachelor level, and amongst the eldest at the master levels.

I have worked a great part of my life as a consultant and trainer, first for a firm, in the Customer relations field, then with my own small firm. I always have been in th businesses fields, working with businesses.

Which means that I do not have the money put aside for retirement and no funds from any firm.

Although my income was more than excellent, I could not put much aside due to a bad narcissist husband who left with much money (I let it go to get rid of him), and also because I had a young daughter that was dysphasic, had motor skills impairments and autistic tendencies. Narcissist dad helped very little.

So my thinking was "how much do I have to make to pay her the best thérapies in North America", which I did. She is now fine, a beautiful bubbly 16 years old, out of the bush. The only remaining tint of problems is with the language, sometimes a bit awkward, but English speakers think it is because she is French, and French speakers think it is because she is English - she is bilingual - lol (we both know the truth, her and I, lol).

When I realised she was out of the bush and would manage her life well, I went into depression. I had work 70 hours a week for so long, plus taking care of her and going to excessive sports (gross motor skills improvement for her) and all kinds of therapies, that once the pressure was off it showed how I had not taken care of my own needs. I knew I could not keep working in this line of work and had to find something to work well into my seventies.

So I decided to go back to my first career thinking (b.a. in psychology, Neurolinguistic training, help relations training, etc) and to do psychotherapies as I grow - lol - into my sixties and seventies. And i love working with people.

So that master degree leads to the possibility of doing psychotherapies within the order of psychotherapists. Therefore my interest for empathy, empaths, special abilities and and and special needs.

So now, you have it all.

grannyfranny100
24th October 2013, 16:43
Well Flash, thanks for the Readers Digest version of a colorful life. I really admire your ambition, problem solving skills and devotion to your daughter. And I salute your willingness to give up the money to "disappear" the narcissist in your life. That was very brave!! The depression was an understandable reaction and need for some well deserved down time. I am glad to hear you are on target and have regained your verve.

Although I am childless, I, too, went back to school later in life and got my master's degree in my fifties because of a bad recession (is there ever a good one) and a bad career move I made. Not an easy step to take so I understand some of what you are going through.

Unfortunately I had accolades from my first career that scared potential thirtieths bosses that I would have their job in months. Even when I started lying about my accomplishments on my resume, I had to move out of state where the recession wasn't so bad. But you got that covered because you know how to run your own successful business!!! Will you go it alone or join a group practice to build your practice quickly and how soon will you complete your credentials?

Please ignore my questions if you don't have time right now. I understand that you have a full plate and I wish you well. Cramming two lifetimes of careers in one lifetime isn't easy. Eventually I am sure you can add lots to this thread and I look forward to that!

Phoenix1304
28th October 2014, 08:44
Last night I stumbled on a series of videos about empathy, and I wasn't even looking! I thought I'd post the link here, particularly for any of our younger members that are probably empathic and don't know it, I wish I'd 'got it' in my youth, it would have saved years of unnecessary anguish. For the old hand empaths you might find them interesting too, using the solar plexus chakra to flush the emotions and let them 'pass through' and seeing the ability as a precursor to clairsentience, I found much of interest in the whole series.

o-OJjXCWkEs

ulli
28th October 2014, 09:30
Well Flash, thanks for the Readers Digest version of a colorful life. I really admire your ambition, problem solving skills and devotion to your daughter. And I salute your willingness to give up the money to "disappear" the narcissist in your life. That was very brave!! The depression was an understandable reaction and need for some well deserved down time. I am glad to hear you are on target and have regained your verve.

Although I am childless, I, too, went back to school later in life and got my master's degree in my fifties because of a bad recession (is there ever a good one) and a bad career move I made. Not an easy step to take so I understand some of what you are going through.

Unfortunately I had accolades from my first career that scared potential thirtieths bosses that I would have their job in months. Even when I started lying about my accomplishments on my resume, I had to move out of state where the recession wasn't so bad. But you got that covered because you know how to run your own successful business!!! Will you go it alone or join a group practice to build your practice quickly and how soon will you complete your credentials?

Please ignore my questions if you don't have time right now. I understand that you have a full plate and I wish you well. Cramming two lifetimes of careers in one lifetime isn't easy. Eventually I am sure you can add lots to this thread and I look forward to that!

Flash probably never saw your reply. Unless she was notified, but unless one clicks on the "Reply With Quote" button, such notification would not happen.