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View Full Version : Does Honesty and Integrity matter anymore? ( Patriots caught again!)



jagman
21st January 2015, 17:30
The New England Patriots were caught cheating in last Sundays
AFC Championship game. Each team brings 12 game balls and
11 out of the 12 game balls the Patriots used during the game
were found to be deflated. The reason this was done is because
it was raining and cold and it's much easier to throw and catch
a football if it's slightly deflated in those weather conditions.
This is the second time the Patriots have been caught cheating
in the past few years. A few years ago they had what you called
"Spy Gate" They were secretly recording other teams practices so
they could steal their game signals.

I know this is not a sports forum but this goes way beyond sports.
Most of our culture holds up Celebrities, Actors, Politicians and
Professional Athletes in almost a God like status. ( Pitiful IMO)

I had to take a test for the Rail Road yesterday during an interview.
During the test I was placed in a room alone and given the test on
a computer that had full net access. In school I always made an A
in Science & History but my math scores were always around a C-
During the math portion of the test, there was 4 algebra questions
I didn't know how to compute,So I just guessed B.lol I could have
easily opened another window and asked one of my friends here for
the answers but I'm not a cheater. I should have studied harder
before I took the test.

I've cut and pasted threads I've found on the net before because
I found them of interest and wanted to share but I've never tried
to take credit for writing them. I've also wrote many threads that
came straight from my own thoughts and ideas,One in particular
got thousands of views and many thanks. I was extremely proud
of it because I took the time to research my topic and put it in
a format, that IMO was really good. It was my creation.

I guess the point I'm getting at is honesty really does matter IMO!
If you want to win a football game or write a book or take a test
do your research, study, practice.

If Tom Brady ( The Quarterback for the Patriots ) wins the
Super Bowl and raises the Lombardi trophy it will be a hollow
victory for a shallow and deceptive man. Meaningless!

I just want to get your thoughts on this.

Peace of Mind
21st January 2015, 18:18
Treat others the way you would want to be treated. Victory is a subjective experience, what's worth it to you may not be for others... winning the superbowl or winning the heart of someone you actually respect? Football is a brutal/savage/violent past time, I'm not surprised to see anything negative associated with it.

Peace

Mike
21st January 2015, 18:42
I agree Jags.

I watched the game, though I had no dog in the fight. the irony is, the Pats didn't need to deflate the balls to win - they were clearly superior. it's so silly.

ive no idea what the punishment should/will be, but it will never be severe enough. if its indeed proven that they messed with the balls, I think they should have to forfeit the game and let the Colts go thru. I know that sounds severe, but without severe repercussions the Pats will continue their diabolical stunts.

MorningFox
21st January 2015, 19:18
Don't both teams use the same ball?

Though in answer to the question.... Honesty and integrity always matter.

Deega
21st January 2015, 19:21
Hi Jagman, honesty and integrity contribute to be happy with yourself!

If you're dishonest and lack integrity, you won't be able to develop trust with your friend, neighbour.

If one can't follow these rules, he will have difficulty trusting himself, then doubt set in.

These two attributes constitute your authenticity!

The best to you.

Jake
21st January 2015, 19:25
Sorry to be obtuse, but,,,, GO SEAHAWKS!!!

(Actually im a Buffalo Bills fan,,) I sorta wanted both the pats and colts to lose...

The NFL has gotten so far off base from what it was, I can hardly watch any more...

Playoffs??? PLAYOFFS???? Lol

Jake

[Edit] I do live in the Greater Seattle area, so I get to say GO SAEHAWKS!!!

donk
21st January 2015, 19:41
Good point fox, it is bizarre...hopefully Brady had no knowledge of it...but who knows? Andrew Luck is pretty good most days, and should have benefitted as well.

The thing is, cheating is the way in business/money, which it is to whoever made the decision to cheat. Just because you view it as game or the NFL as an institution...whoever is deciding to cheat is playing by business/corporate world rules...NOT playground sports.

Sportsmanship is frowned upon in that realm, whoever (Belicheck?) made the decision is a winner in his profession, in the eyes of peers--until he got caught--though how accountable will the mastermind be?....also, what makes the NFL any different than the WWE, besides the audience? It's an ententainment for the consumer on the surface, but is it really the driving force (**COUGH**---VEGAS--**cough**)

I'd be really surprised if that's the only case of cheating (even "caught" cheating), my mind is open enough to view it as a plot foil in the storyline that captivates the audience and gives a dozen ESPN and other networks material for days in the runup to the big game...

Shezbeth
21st January 2015, 19:42
Really? You're looking for honesty and integrity in a professional sports franchise? :doh: Moreover, you're surprised when you don't find it? :doh:

Keep staring into the magical box though, I'm sure your time won't be wasted,.... :rolleyes:

RUSirius
21st January 2015, 19:52
Whether its coaches, players, owners, or referees collegiate and professional sports are corrupt, lots of betting in sports.

Jake
21st January 2015, 20:06
Really? You're looking for honesty and integrity in a professional sports franchise? :doh: Moreover, you're surprised when you don't find it? :doh:

Keep staring into the magical box though, I'm sure your time won't be wasted,.... :rolleyes:

Wow, you really have a way with people there Shez... If you dont get it, then why bother posting? We dont need your approval to discuss integrity in sports. There are different angles and opinions, all worthy of discussion. No offense. Sports is about the only entertaining thing left on tv...

Silly ninjas...

Back to topic please...
Jake

Shezbeth
21st January 2015, 20:10
You're right, how silly of me to point out the inherent fallibility of the thread topic.

Do carry on expressing surprise and dismay at the lack of integrity in a franchise that is its self deliberately conditioning a lack of integrity in society,... because it's 'entertaining'.

rgray222
21st January 2015, 20:24
When it "appears" that honesty and integrity no longer matter to society that is precisely when it matters most.

Everybody stands for something even if they believe they don't.
Everyone has rules they live by even if they have never given it any thought
When you take the time to articulate who you are (physically and spiritually) you are provided with a clarity that makes life better, more understandable and much more meaningful.

Honesty and integrity matter

grannyfranny100
21st January 2015, 20:34
Innocent until proven guilty

Jake
21st January 2015, 20:38
You're right, how silly of me to point out the inherent fallibility of the thread topic.

Do carry on expressing surprise and dismay at the lack of integrity in a franchise that is its self deliberately conditioning a lack of integrity in society,... because it's 'entertaining'.

Thank you for your permission. I guess... Dude we r talkin a bit if football with regards integrity. You r the only one who has problem with it..

Your point is taken, and I may tend to agree. This, being a discussion forum, is not the worst place for DISCUSSION!! If it offends your sensibilities, then I do apologize. I didn't mean to pick a fight... Maybe pick a different topic to discuss, rather than stinking this one up...

Perhaps you are in a much more enlightened place in your life.. Maybe one day I can be like you and simply roll my eyes and smack mee forehead and laugh at the less evolved..

in the meantime,, im gonna talk a bit of football with regards the lack of integrity..

You r welcome to participate, good or bad... I am only pointing out that nobody needs your approval to discuss anything.

GO SEAHAWKS...
Jake

jagman
21st January 2015, 22:47
No. When your team is on offense you use one of the 12 balls your team brought.

Koyaanisqatsi
21st January 2015, 23:01
Their punishment will be a soul crushing defeat in the Super Bowl to a motivated and very physical Seahawk team. Their head coach, bill 'Bellicheat' has never been an honest competitor imo. Seattle wins 34-13 (I actually predicted that Seattle would play the Pats in the super bowl around week 12)

loc333
21st January 2015, 23:02
im a pats fan and have always been always will..what ever stupid thing they do. What i cant understand in this conversation is that football is a distraction for the masses. they are caught up in football and distracted from world events that could change their future.such as sending your kids to war because it was inconveniet to learn what russia was up to in the ukraine..i dont think we be should be talking football here.

Gatita
21st January 2015, 23:07
I agree with Mike. And despite living in Colorado, I'm even a native, I say Go Seahawks!

Cat

Tesla_WTC_Solution
21st January 2015, 23:11
Football bankrupts public school funds, ruins young kids' knees and backs, and causes insidious brain injuries that don't always present with symptoms until middle age.

Kids are effectively trading the best years of their later lives for a cheap thrill that makes money for the cabal of coaches milking the system and banging underage students on the side.

Not to mention locker room hazing, sexual assaults, racism, etc.
And the cheating we see going on between teachers and pet students who happen to perform well on the tennis court/football field but not the math exams.




I can see both sides of this.

But can we see the sad truth of what football has grown to become in UK/AUS/USA?



Does anyone here know what the old term "English Disease" refers to?

How about "Little brother of war"? (Natives are more honest)




Can anyone here tell me on average how many concussions a football player sustains before and after high school, college, and pro football?





Burning a book isn't much better than telling the person holding it to shove it up their butts.






Foot ball and sports in general isn't some damn religious sanctuary or hallowed ground.


If sports has taken the place of God in our lives, we need to really look inside ourselves!


And I don't mean some grey bearded person on a throne up in heaven.


I mean, "what is best in life"?


Are we still spouting the Conan line of violence and misery being the best in life,
or are we seeing a way thru that darkness yet?








I just wish if men wanted to kill and injure each other, that women and children didn't have to see it, think it's normal, etc., or be victimized by the card-carrying abusers who also happen to be great at football.


:P

Anyone watch the Oregon controversy, the protest stuff,
seeing that even from the inside the truly delicate fabric of football "culture" is already losing its integrity.



when a player is barred from a game for pointing out a criminal,
yet cheaters prosper,


altho I don't agree w/ the delivery I agree with Shez lol :(


and I am recently from Seattle too, and I can hate football.

F12? lol



p.s. does anyone here even remember who died last year on the Super Bowl day?
does anyone care? old hat, old news, you want new blood on the arena floor,


just like michael jackson warned us about

Joe Sustaire
21st January 2015, 23:18
"I could have easily opened another window and asked one of my friends here for the answers...." -jagman-

Of course if you had, the responses would no doubt involve aliens and milabs. And then where would you be? :eek:

loc333
21st January 2015, 23:20
the grays are rooting for new england

Ahnung-quay
22nd January 2015, 00:16
Being from Wisconsin, I have friends who are die hard Packer fans. The game last weekend against the Seahawks- 6 minutes to go, score 19 to 7. I told my friend, the Seahawks are going to win. Sure enough, they did.

I think to myself, when are they going to realize it's all fixed? The owners and leagues make a lot of money off from the betting especially by betting on the team that's not supposed to win. Then, surprise, surprise, they win.

Tesla_WTC_Solution
22nd January 2015, 00:21
Being from Wisconsin, I have friends who are die hard Packer fans. The game last weekend against the Seahawks- 6 minutes to go, score 19 to 7. I told my friend, the Seahawks are going to win. Sure enough, they did.

I think to myself, when are they going to realize it's all fixed? The owners and leagues make a lot of money off from the betting especially by betting on the team that's not supposed to win. Then, surprise, surprise, they win.

i'd consider looking into what sort of medical program mr allen is giving the boys.
i read a book in college about something along those lines.

and also, i'd like to know, during these practice sessions are the seahawks doing crazier stunts than in games?
i.e. superhuman performance?

anytime a team gets that much better that fast, should look at new drugs.

i could get my ass kicked for this one lol. XD

gripreaper
22nd January 2015, 00:50
I think they should call in the lawyers. I recommend Dewey Cheatham and Howe :)

LivioRazlo
22nd January 2015, 01:09
As a fan of the Green Bay Packers, a part of my heart sunk into my chest when we lost to the Seahawks. Yet at the same time I know that it's just a game and there are much more important issues that will occupy my time rather than dwell on a football scandal or discuss why the Seahawks should have lost (sorry Jake, you know this to be true. Haha.)

At any rate, I get where you're coming from. I too see the fall of civilized society right before my eyes. I feel so helpless, especially when I take on the task of spreading the truth and trying to enlighten others. When I ascend from this physical form in to my true form, I shall not have any regrets about my actions while I was here.

ghostrider
22nd January 2015, 01:52
I'll wager most all teams in every sport ,cheat , the patriots just get caught more than others IMO ... it's not really winning if you remove honesty ... Integrity always matters to people with a open heart ...

bearcow
22nd January 2015, 02:19
Defensive and offensive players are taught to covertly hold on every single play, most of the time they get away with it. The cheating in plain sight that goes as standard practice in all levels of football has much more of a effect on a game than deflating a football by 2psi.

What most pro athletes (and many fans) dont seem to understand is that they are ENTERTAINERS. There is no virtue in competitive endeavor that does not enhance the common good.

As the network executives say, the best reality TV program around is the NFL

grannyfranny100
22nd January 2015, 02:43
Honesty and Integrity. I think we are getting off track. Our society was founded upon innocence until proven guilty. You are making an assumption of guilt.

We are all aware of more troubles headed our way. We must be careful to not jump to conclusions when we need to be the most centered we have ever been.

Karma Ninja
22nd January 2015, 03:30
I would avoid using pro sports as a barometer for honesty and integrity. The list of cheaters and rats in sports is looooong! It happens in every sport too. False heroes and egotistical selfish idols.

The Pats have been caught before and for some reason the league likes to make an example of them. Every team cheats a little in sports and some cheat a little more. The Pats just get caught more often. (obviously I follow a little :p )

Why wonder if honesty and integrity matter anymore after hearing of balls being deflated? Look at politicians, business people,priests, police officers, and celebrities. And then look in the mirror and remember, and to me this is critical, these false idols are all merely a reflection of our society. Don't we all know someone who lies on their taxes, or cheats on their spouse, or tells little white lies, or doesn't report a missed item on a grocery bill, or helps their kids (a little too much) on their school project, or cheated on a test, or sneaks a grape from the produce department, or tells a homeless person they have no spare change.... the list is endless.

We are a society of cheats and liars and in an indirect way and sometimes directly we accept this in our midst. We let go of the handle of honesty and integrity a long time ago and it has rolled off down the hill, never to be seen again. Sad but true. Accept our failings and become a role model of honesty and integrity if we want to see it change. Let's be a role model to ourselves and our children and hope they carry it on.

That being said...Go Pats! (I'm a 49'ers fan so I can't root for the Seahawks)

jagman
22nd January 2015, 03:42
Honesty and Integrity. I think we are getting off track. Our society was founded upon innocence until proven guilty. You are making an assumption of guilt.

We are all aware of more troubles headed our way. We must be careful to not jump to conclusions when we need to be the most centered we have ever been.

Very true grannyfranny. It is innocence until proven guilty! But there
is always a but lol 11 out of 12 of the Patriots balls were found to be
deflated under the NFL Guidelines. Also this is not the first time the Pat's
have been caught cheating.
Tom Brady gave an interview on a radio talk show the day after the game.
The radio show brought up the "Deflate Gate" and Mr. Brady totally denied
it! I played football for years and I can tell you from personal experience.
It hurts to catch a football in the cold ( It feels like catching a brick lol)
Tom (The Quarterback and his Center handle the ball the most during a
game) Both of these men are Professional Football Players, So I submit
to you they both knew the balls were deflated. IMO
I also submit that Tom Brady has soft balls lol just a little joke

jagman
22nd January 2015, 03:48
I agree Jags.

I watched the game, though I had no dog in the fight. the irony is, the Pats didn't need to deflate the balls to win - they were clearly superior. it's so silly.

ive no idea what the punishment should/will be, but it will never be severe enough. if its indeed proven that they messed with the balls, I think they should have to forfeit the game and let the Colts go thru. I know that sounds severe, but without severe repercussions the Pats will continue their diabolical stunts.

Good to see you back Mike and I fully agree. Hey did you ever get that book
wrote? If so I would like to read it.

MorningFox
22nd January 2015, 11:20
No. When your team is on offense you use one of the 12 balls your team brought.

So teams don't use the same ball?

That's crazy.... and asking for cheating!

rgray222
22nd January 2015, 13:48
Funny Patriot Cialis Parody Commercial


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vd3D2gsPUR0

giovonni
22nd January 2015, 14:14
the end is near ... go seahawks ... :cheer2:

http://media.mnn.com/CenturyLinkField2010-m-0112.jpg

2-point conversion generated biggest Seahawks game quake (http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2025510398_dancequakexml.html)

Maia Gabrial
22nd January 2015, 14:45
Integrity will always matter. When the insanity of these times are over, honor and intregity will rebuild our world.

I say that holding onto your honor and integrity no matter what anyone else says, will save you from falling on your face with those lacking in them. There's nothing like the feeling of having a guilt-free conscience...Always do the right thing and you will avoid consequences later.

jagman
22nd January 2015, 15:50
Funny Patriot Cialis Parody Commercial


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vd3D2gsPUR0

I laughed so hard I damn near fell out of my chair
Thanks rgray222.

giovonni
23rd January 2015, 08:00
Former NFL QB Explains Deflated Footballs

"The NFL is investigating whether the New England Patriots used under-inflated footballs in the AFC championship game. Former NFL quarterback Hugh Millen says the footballs give quarterbacks a better grip and faster throws."
(Jan. 23)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2EstM14kCTA