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Unicorn_Wrath
15th September 2015, 19:46
This is my first thread, so please be forgiving!

I am curious as to how many here, like myself, are living in or have grown up in abusive or turbulent households with narcissistic family members, how you handled it, and how it has affected you, including your relationships with others.

Do you think these challenging experiences are something we choose before birth (I personally do), and how might we best overcome the often long-lasting effects they have on our psyche?

moekatz
15th September 2015, 20:22
I found that a few times of regression therapy plus clarification through Tarot helped. I too think we have contracts, if you will, drawn up before our birth and we intuitively "know" when we stumble upon them in our lives. When you have utter frustration in trying to figure out the whys of your existence, turn immediately to those most closely associated with you and in a calm and loving intent, ask for help to discern who they are and dare to ask why. When you feel the victim emotions then you are at step one. Each choice from that point can serve to enlighten and "lighten" your burden. I was lucky enough in my senior year of high school to meet a mental health counselor who helped me to unravel my personal questions about my family members and their chosen ways of dealing with me. Patterns of behavior always link to those around us. It takes a mighty struggle to remember your contracts and to then do something about them. Blame and shame do not comfort us.
Choose to know.

Selkie
15th September 2015, 20:31
This is my first thread, so please be forgiving!

I am curious as to how many here, like myself, are living in or have grown up in abusive or turbulent households with narcissistic family members, how you handled it, and how it has affected you, including your relationships with others.

Do you think these challenging experiences are something we choose before birth (I personally do), and how might we best overcome the often long-lasting effects they have on our psyche?

The only thing that ever worked for me is to just stay away from them, and not let them come around me.

ulli
15th September 2015, 20:44
This is my first thread, so please be forgiving!

I am curious as to how many here, like myself, are living in or have grown up in abusive or turbulent households with narcissistic family members, how you handled it, and how it has affected you, including your relationships with others.

Do you think these challenging experiences are something we choose before birth (I personally do), and how might we best overcome the often long-lasting effects they have on our psyche?

It's a tough position to be in, at least until you find your true home.
I now see my abusive family members as a springboard.
Showing me indirectly where I really belonged.
Had they been more loving I might never have left my country (Germany)

Because this age is different. Nowadays it's no longer about blood relations,
but waking up to higher reality where there are others who are your true family.
The search then is about finding your "tribe".
In the end the others might come around to seeing things your way, and the error of their own mistakes.
Because bullying and hounding the oddball family member is not a soul saving pursuit.

But then again, perhaps they won't come around in this life. Some apples still ripen after they dropped from the tree.

One Avalonian once told me after contacting my deceased mother that now she saw things differently,
having arrived in the hereafter.

Ted
15th September 2015, 20:58
This is my first thread, so please be forgiving!

I am curious as to how many here, like myself, are living in or have grown up in abusive or turbulent households with narcissistic family members, how you handled it, and how it has affected you, including your relationships with others.

Do you think these challenging experiences are something we choose before birth (I personally do), and how might we best overcome the often long-lasting effects they have on our psyche?

Careful, honest examination of the issues affecting you has a mitigating effect on their influence. However, I think that true forgiveness is the best remedy for any past trauma you've experienced. I have found it to be the most effective way to dissolve the cords of bitterness and resentment. Why carry a bunch of toxic baggage through life when you can easily cut it loose? When it's gone you feel so much lighter.

Selkie
15th September 2015, 21:02
This is my first thread, so please be forgiving!

I am curious as to how many here, like myself, are living in or have grown up in abusive or turbulent households with narcissistic family members, how you handled it, and how it has affected you, including your relationships with others.

Do you think these challenging experiences are something we choose before birth (I personally do), and how might we best overcome the often long-lasting effects they have on our psyche?

Careful, honest examination of the issues affecting you has a mitigating effect on their influence. However, I think that true forgiveness is the best remedy for any past trauma you've experienced. I have found it to be the most effective way to dissolve the cords of bitterness and resentment. Why carry a bunch of toxic baggage through life when you can easily cut it loose? When it's gone you feel so much lighter.

This is true, but if one doesn't protect oneself from narcissists, they will keep re-wounding one. It takes both forgiveness and self-protection, I think.

Ted
15th September 2015, 21:54
This is true, but if one doesn't protect oneself from narcissists, they will keep re-wounding one. It takes both forgiveness and self-protection, I think.
The trick is not getting wounded no matter what they do. We can only get hurt if we buy into their judgement. Seeing their judgement as untrue or unreal takes the power away.
I know this is especially difficult with anyone we have had an emotional investment with (parents, siblings, spouses...), but it is very liberating if you get the hang of it.
If forgiving them once doesn't work, do it again. It's all about breaking the cycle so you can have some peace and happiness. It's like taking a karmic shower.

Bubu
15th September 2015, 22:37
"This is my first thread, so please be forgiving!"

dont worry here welove people not abusing. Sometimes there are poke jokes but no abuse.:bigsmile: trolls are abound but no abusing:blushing:

seah
15th September 2015, 22:59
This is true, but if one doesn't protect oneself from narcissists, they will keep re-wounding one. It takes both forgiveness and self-protection, I think.
The trick is not getting wounded no matter what they do. We can only get hurt if we buy into their judgement. Seeing their judgement as untrue or unreal takes the power away.
I know this is especially difficult with anyone we have had an emotional investment with (parents, siblings, spouses...), but it is very liberating if you get the hang of it.
If forgiving them once doesn't work, do it again. It's all about breaking the cycle so you can have some peace and happiness. It's like taking a karmic shower.

all well and good...but there is always that one bad day, they catch you at, when your guard is down, your energy low, what have you...and the attack seemingly comes out of nowhere.

distance is sometimes the only way. Forgive, yes...but in some cases distance is the only way to protect yourself.

Selkie
15th September 2015, 23:13
This is true, but if one doesn't protect oneself from narcissists, they will keep re-wounding one. It takes both forgiveness and self-protection, I think.
The trick is not getting wounded no matter what they do. We can only get hurt if we buy into their judgement. Seeing their judgement as untrue or unreal takes the power away.
I know this is especially difficult with anyone we have had an emotional investment with (parents, siblings, spouses...), but it is very liberating if you get the hang of it.
If forgiving them once doesn't work, do it again. It's all about breaking the cycle so you can have some peace and happiness. It's like taking a karmic shower.

all well and good...but there is always that one bad day, they catch you at, when your guard is down, your energy low, what have you...and the attack seemingly comes out of nowhere.

distance is sometimes the only way. Forgive, yes...but in some cases distance is the only way to protect yourself.

I really have to agree with this. Narcissists are of the school of "kick 'em when their down." They have very good predatory instincts, and have an unerring way of sensing low energy, unguarded boundaries, etc.

That said, I fully agree with you, also, Ted, and really have to say that what you have articulated is very fine, and probably the ideal of human unconditional love :) , but I am not capable of it...at least not in this life...and I do not fault myself for that.

Hazelfern
15th September 2015, 23:34
This is my first thread, so please be forgiving!

I am curious as to how many here, like myself, are living in or have grown up in abusive or turbulent households with narcissistic family members, how you handled it, and how it has affected you, including your relationships with others.

Do you think these challenging experiences are something we choose before birth (I personally do), and how might we best overcome the often long-lasting effects they have on our psyche?

You are not alone UW!! Good question(s) I will weigh in later.

RunningDeer
15th September 2015, 23:52
One book that's priceless: “The Gaslight Effect (http://www.amazon.com/Gaslight-Effect-Survive-Manipulation-Control-ebook/dp/B000QCQ8X0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1442359566&sr=8-1&keywords=The+Gaslight+Effect),” by Robin Stern Ph.D. The layout makes it an easy read: bullet points, charts, summaries, check lists, solutions and more.


http://i1262.photobucket.com/albums/ii610/WhiteCrowBlackDeer/gaslight_zpsvhn9l04w.jpg

Some of the bullet points to the question, “Are You Being Gaslighted?”


Your husband crosses the line in his flirtations with another woman at a dinner party. When you confront him, he asks you to stop being insecure and controlling. After a long argument, you apologize for giving him a hard time.

Your boss backed you on a project when you met privately in his office, and you went full steam ahead. But at a large gathering of staff—including yours—he suddenly changes his tune and publicly criticizes your poor judgment. When you tell him your concerns for how this will affect your authority, he tells you that the project was ill-conceived and you’ll have to be more careful in the future. You begin to question your competence.

Your mother belittles your clothes, your job, your friends, and your boyfriend. But instead of fighting back as your friends encourage you to do, you tell them that your mother is often right and that a mature person should be able to take a little criticism.


Gaslighting is an insidious form of emotional abuse and manipulation that is difficult to recognize and even harder to break free from. That’s because it plays into one of our worst fears—of being abandoned—and many of our deepest needs: to be understood, appreciated, and loved.

Other references:

Identify "The Gaslight Effect,” and take back your reality! (https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/power-in-relationships/200903/identify-the-gaslight-effect-and-take-back-your-reality)
Quick bullet lists of - How to Prevent Emotional Abuse (http://www.wikihow.com/Prevent-Emotional-Abuse)
Controlling Behavior – 6 Keys to Avoid Gaslighting Psychological Abuse (http://www.preventabusiverelationships.com/articles/gas_lighting_215.php)



RunningDeer
16th September 2015, 00:03
Defense Against the Psychopath
Gd6P1Ue2aGg

Valuable information in the video. Here's an outline and I'd encourage others to watch. If there are time constraints one can jump to a specific section.

Tom Montalk’s article compliments the topic, “The Art of Hyper Dimensional War (http://montalk.net/matrix/67/the-art-of-hyper-dimensional-war)”


“Knowledge protects, ignorance endangers.
Always use love: kind love for the kind, tough love for the tough.”

Defense Against the Psychopath
Part One:

Key Characteristics (http://youtu.be/Gd6P1Ue2aGg?t=1m45s) @ 1:45

Lack of Empathy
Lack of Remorse
Superficiality
Grandiosity
Irresponsibility
Impulsive Behavior
Compulsive Lying
Manipulative
Anti-Social Behavior


Part Two:

Common Types of Psychopaths (http://youtu.be/Gd6P1Ue2aGg?t=10m31s) @ 10:30

Narcissists
The Victim
Con Artists
Malevolent Psychopaths
Professional Psychopaths
Secondary Psychopaths


Part Three:

Method of Operation (http://youtu.be/Gd6P1Ue2aGg?t=24m40s) @ 24:40 minutes

The Interview
The Seduction
Divide and Conquer
Fear and Tyranny

Defense Against a Psychopath (http://youtu.be/Gd6P1Ue2aGg?t=30m10s) @ 30:10 minutes

Facing Evil
Recognition
What Not To Do
Attack
Evade

Selkie
16th September 2015, 00:05
One book that's priceless: “The Gaslight Effect (http://www.amazon.com/Gaslight-Effect-Survive-Manipulation-Control-ebook/dp/B000QCQ8X0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1442359566&sr=8-1&keywords=The+Gaslight+Effect),” by Robin Stern Ph.D. The layout makes it an easy read: bullet points, charts, summaries, check lists, solutions and more.


http://i1262.photobucket.com/albums/ii610/WhiteCrowBlackDeer/gaslight_zpsvhn9l04w.jpg

Some of the bullet points to the question, “Are You Being Gaslighted?”


Your husband crosses the line in his flirtations with another woman at a dinner party. When you confront him, he asks you to stop being insecure and controlling. After a long argument, you apologize for giving him a hard time.

Your boss backed you on a project when you met privately in his office, and you went full steam ahead. But at a large gathering of staff—including yours—he suddenly changes his tune and publicly criticizes your poor judgment. When you tell him your concerns for how this will affect your authority, he tells you that the project was ill-conceived and you’ll have to be more careful in the future. You begin to question your competence.

Your mother belittles your clothes, your job, your friends, and your boyfriend. But instead of fighting back as your friends encourage you to do, you tell them that your mother is often right and that a mature person should be able to take a little criticism.


Gaslighting is an insidious form of emotional abuse and manipulation that is difficult to recognize and even harder to break free from. That’s because it plays into one of our worst fears—of being abandoned—and many of our deepest needs: to be understood, appreciated, and loved.

Other references:

Identify "The Gaslight Effect,” and take back your reality! (https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/power-in-relationships/200903/identify-the-gaslight-effect-and-take-back-your-reality)
Quick bullet lists of - How to Prevent Emotional Abuse (http://www.wikihow.com/Prevent-Emotional-Abuse)
Controlling Behavior – 6 Keys to Avoid Gaslighting Psychological Abuse (http://www.preventabusiverelationships.com/articles/gas_lighting_215.php)




Thank you, Paula. That one is going on my "to get" list.

Also, Traumatic Narcissism: Relational Systems of Subjugation, by Daniel Shaw.

http://www.amazon.com/Traumatic-Narcissism-Relational-Subjugation-Perspectives/dp/0415510252

I have read this one several times. The man knows whereof he speaks.

Ted
16th September 2015, 00:27
This is true, but if one doesn't protect oneself from narcissists, they will keep re-wounding one. It takes both forgiveness and self-protection, I think.
The trick is not getting wounded no matter what they do. We can only get hurt if we buy into their judgement. Seeing their judgement as untrue or unreal takes the power away.
I know this is especially difficult with anyone we have had an emotional investment with (parents, siblings, spouses...), but it is very liberating if you get the hang of it.
If forgiving them once doesn't work, do it again. It's all about breaking the cycle so you can have some peace and happiness. It's like taking a karmic shower.

all well and good...but there is always that one bad day, they catch you at, when your guard is down, your energy low, what have you...and the attack seemingly comes out of nowhere.

distance is sometimes the only way. Forgive, yes...but in some cases distance is the only way to protect yourself.

I really have to agree with this. Narcissists are of the school of "kick 'em when their down." They have very good predatory instincts, and have an unerring way of sensing low energy, unguarded boundaries, etc.

That said, I fully agree with you, also, Ted, and really have to say that what you have articulated is very fine, and probably the ideal of human unconditional love :) , but I am not capable of it...at least not in this life...and I do not fault myself for that.I'm not against distancing oneself from undesirable individuals (I do it all the time), I'm thinking more of family which is harder to avoid. How to cope with those family get-togethers when your least favorite relative is sitting right next to you at dinner, or has you cornered in the kitchen. That's when the last three beers I drank are usually screaming at me to let 'em have it, but I know that will just make it worse. I've had to find a way to cope.
I'm certainly no saint, and probably wouldn't know unconditional love if it bit me, but I've tried just about everything else and nothing seems to work. I'm tired of feeling depressed, regretful, guilty and especially angry.
I'm making a very imperfect, feeble little effort to go in the other direction, and all I can say is I'm starting to feel better. Better about myself and better about the future. Maybe if it helps a hard case like me it might help someone else. Doesn't hurt to try anyway.

OBwan
16th September 2015, 00:29
This is my first thread, so please be forgiving!

I am curious as to how many here, like myself, are living in or have grown up in abusive or turbulent households with narcissistic family members, how you handled it, and how it has affected you, including your relationships with others.

Do you think these challenging experiences are something we choose before birth (I personally do), and how might we best overcome the often long-lasting effects they have on our psyche?

For me addressing the fear aspect made the biggest impact. Once I started making inroads to the core fears things changed in my life. The following is an example of a way to remove fear in my life.

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?76245-How-to-Remove-Fearful-Feeling-from-Past-Memories

Be In Peace,
OBwan

Selkie
16th September 2015, 00:43
This is true, but if one doesn't protect oneself from narcissists, they will keep re-wounding one. It takes both forgiveness and self-protection, I think.
The trick is not getting wounded no matter what they do. We can only get hurt if we buy into their judgement. Seeing their judgement as untrue or unreal takes the power away.
I know this is especially difficult with anyone we have had an emotional investment with (parents, siblings, spouses...), but it is very liberating if you get the hang of it.
If forgiving them once doesn't work, do it again. It's all about breaking the cycle so you can have some peace and happiness. It's like taking a karmic shower.

all well and good...but there is always that one bad day, they catch you at, when your guard is down, your energy low, what have you...and the attack seemingly comes out of nowhere.

distance is sometimes the only way. Forgive, yes...but in some cases distance is the only way to protect yourself.

I really have to agree with this. Narcissists are of the school of "kick 'em when their down." They have very good predatory instincts, and have an unerring way of sensing low energy, unguarded boundaries, etc.

That said, I fully agree with you, also, Ted, and really have to say that what you have articulated is very fine, and probably the ideal of human unconditional love :) , but I am not capable of it...at least not in this life...and I do not fault myself for that.I'm not against distancing oneself from undesirable individuals (I do it all the time), I'm thinking more of family which is harder to avoid. How to cope with those family get-togethers when your least favorite relative is sitting right next to you at dinner, or has you cornered in the kitchen. That's when the last three beers I drank are usually screaming at me to let 'em have it, but I know that will just make it worse. I've had to find a way to cope.
I'm certainly no saint, and probably wouldn't know unconditional love if it bit me, but I've tried just about everything else and nothing seems to work. I'm tired of feeling depressed, regretful, guilty and especially angry.
I'm making a very imperfect, feeble little effort to go in the other direction, and all I can say is I'm starting to feel better. Better about myself and better about the future. Maybe if it helps a hard case like me it might help someone else. Doesn't hurt to try anyway.

My family consists entirely of undesirable individuals, lol. I have not been to a family get-together in years, and did not even go to the funeral of my mother's mother. I carried their baggage for years, until I put it down and started to carry only my own. That was enough work, let me tell you. But weirdly, my own baggage has gotten much lighter in the last few months.

So long story short, I don't feel like I owe those bastards who birthed me anything. They can go f*** themselves because I am through letting them f*** me.

addition Btw, I say this entirely without a sense of bitterness, but simply as unvarnished fact.

Meggings
16th September 2015, 02:07
UnicornW, I have read all the posts responding to your query. From my own personal situation, I offer my soul’s perspective. I agree as you write that “these challenging experiences are something we choose before birth.” Moekatz also says “we have contracts.”

When I met my husband over 40 years ago, my heart sank into my boots. I “knew” I was to marry him and did not want to. Because of my relatively open soul communication, I knew this was something my soul had planned. It was 20 years after this that I learned the term ‘verbal abuse’. Through observation I saw it came from an unbalanced ego that believed it was never wrong. Ego feels taller by making another smaller. It may not be that many choose to stay as I have done. Often I would chafe because I had chosen this. It often has not been easy. But I am determined to rise up over, being a stubborn cuss.

Running Deer writes about “gas lighting”. This term comes from a 1944 movie with Ingrid Bergman and Charles Boyer called “Gaslight”. When I saw that movie, I understood that cognitive dissonance comes when what one knows as true is systematically refuted by the other. It might be helpful to view that movie, for when I saw it I recognized many dynamics in my marriage – and with understanding comes a broader perspective, a rising up almost over the “battlefield terrain”. As Ted wrote, “the trick is not to let yourself be hurt" and "forgiveness is the key."


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFfBB4WCFJY&list=PLgwgn4hI8wayJeHu2Oa5eRB79Yw-t3T2P

Not long ago a message clear as spoken words came into my mind: “He came to outrage you. You came to forgive him.” That may sound corny, but it is basically the pattern of 40 years. My forgiveness is imperfect, because I allow myself to fall in frequency. When I rise up towards unconditional love, there is no pain and compassionate understanding prevails - an embracing of the woundedness of the other. When I fall into the dark abyss, as I do periodically, I do poorly. In the final analysis it is all about what grace I can achieve and maintain within myself. (And man alive, imperfection describes a lot of our human condition.)

At times it has been difficult to stay, but again and again I chose to return, for I would not abandon as I have been abandoned. I used to keep journals, and in one I wrote: "Love is the main rule."

Often there is the blessing of compassion that comes through the heart. And I hear my Mark's words spoken quietly to me that "Someone has to care." I would not give up caring, nor give up on family. For a time I “lived in the light”, and in that state unconditional love operates, and great compassion pours out to the one who is in such pain that they attack in anger.

Besides, I am a stubborn cuss. Under the old lady-toothless hag exterior is a certain steel that does what it deems morally right. I have been counselled by the best to leave, but it does not sit well with me. And leaving because of pain – though often tempting – is not a legacy I wish to stamp upon my soul.

Each must make their personal decision about staying or going. Forgiveness is needed whatever is chosen. And as Selkie so wisely says, “It takes both forgiveness and self-protection.” The self-protection part I fell down in...yet how am I to judge? It may have been my soul plan for me to lose everything after a lifetime of hard work, prudence, and wisdom.

One aspect that affects the position I have taken is that this is the last go-around. I have chosen over and over again consciously to extend opportunity to husband to “do better” this time. (To avoid confusion, husband is not Mark, though husband FOUND Mark and brought him into the family structure without consulting with me. Shows you that major things are agreed upon and scripted beforehand.)

I saw this in my partner Mark as well, and understood he was extending one last opportunity to his grown children to "do better" this time around. He nurtured his son in this life, this son whose soul once expressed as Brutus, who stabbed Caesar in Rome even though he was Caesar’s natural son. This may appear a sidetrack, but I include it because every situation contains within it threads of energy linking many situations, lifetimes, and relationships.

I learned greatly from Patricia Evans book “Verbal Abuse”. Three times I bought it, and three times I threw it out – you will laugh at this reason – because I did not want to hurt, or enrage, husband should he see it. That is how screwed up one can become from major psychological abuse. The upside is the strength that comes with understanding the mechanisms in play.

Relationships extend through all time, and I am balancing my own ledgers here, often with awareness. One of the earliest other lifetimes I became aware of (I was 8 years old at the time) was a well known woman who was severely hurt by her husband. I know her life quite well. She stuck it out and did the best she could each day. I have no choice but to do the same, and the best way for me is to follow what my soul directs me to do.

I read all the posts here more than once, UnicornW, and a feeling of love welled up in my heart for each and every person. I hope my meanderng might help you see more aspects of this multifaceted question you have raised. There is no one right answer to it.

ghostrider
16th September 2015, 02:44
if there is an upside , it taught me to take charge of my life ... things will only change when you change them ... too often we wait for someone else to fix everything ...

Virma De Ris
16th September 2015, 02:55
Hi Unicorn_Wrath,

Curiously, I am currently in a similar situation as yours (recently found out many things about my mother that have left me floored). Anyway, my mother is narcissistic (clinical narcissism) and the discovery has dealt me a great deal of pain. I've been looking around for books that can help me to better understand the situation. Now, you don't mention particulars, just family members, so I'm not going to assume who in your family is giving you a hard time. The book Will I Ever Be Good Enough? (http://www.amazon.com/Will-Ever-Good-Enough-Narcissistic/dp/1439129436/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1442370791&sr=8-1&keywords=will+i+ever+be+good+enough) is proving to be a great help. The info in the book helps daughters to understand and to cope with having narcissistic mothers, but this info can also be applied to any narcissistic females that a person encounters in their daily lives.

May you find the answers to your questions.

Blessings,

Virma de Ris

Virma De Ris
16th September 2015, 03:00
Defense Against the Psychopath
Gd6P1Ue2aGg

Valuable information in the video. Here's an outline and I'd encourage others to watch. If there are time constraints one can jump to a specific section.

Tom Montalk’s article compliments the topic, “The Art of Hyper Dimensional War (http://montalk.net/matrix/67/the-art-of-hyper-dimensional-war)”


“Knowledge protects, ignorance endangers.
Always use love: kind love for the kind, tough love for the tough.”

Defense Against the Psychopath
Part One:

Key Characteristics (http://youtu.be/Gd6P1Ue2aGg?t=1m45s) @ 1:45

Lack of Empathy
Lack of Remorse
Superficiality
Grandiosity
Irresponsibility
Impulsive Behavior
Compulsive Lying
Manipulative
Anti-Social Behavior


Part Two:

Common Types of Psychopaths (http://youtu.be/Gd6P1Ue2aGg?t=10m31s) @ 10:30

Narcissists
The Victim
Con Artists
Malevolent Psychopaths
Professional Psychopaths
Secondary Psychopaths


Part Three:

Method of Operation (http://youtu.be/Gd6P1Ue2aGg?t=24m40s) @ 24:40 minutes

The Interview
The Seduction
Divide and Conquer
Fear and Tyranny

Defense Against a Psychopath (http://youtu.be/Gd6P1Ue2aGg?t=30m10s) @ 30:10 minutes

Facing Evil
Recognition
What Not To Do
Attack
Evade


Thank you, RunningDeer. I will watch this soon.

~Virma De Ris

RunningDeer
16th September 2015, 03:46
Thank you, RunningDeer. I will watch this soon.

~Virma De Ris
You're welcome Virma De Ris. It helped to clarify some 'frenemies' in my life.


Bubu
16th September 2015, 04:34
Defense Against the Psychopath
Gd6P1Ue2aGg

Valuable information in the video. Here's an outline and I'd encourage others to watch. If there are time constraints one can jump to a specific section.

Tom Montalk’s article compliments the topic, “The Art of Hyper Dimensional War (http://montalk.net/matrix/67/the-art-of-hyper-dimensional-war)”


“Knowledge protects, ignorance endangers.
Always use love: kind love for the kind, tough love for the tough.”

Defense Against the Psychopath
Part One:

Key Characteristics (http://youtu.be/Gd6P1Ue2aGg?t=1m45s) @ 1:45

Lack of Empathy
Lack of Remorse
Superficiality
Grandiosity
Irresponsibility
Impulsive Behavior
Compulsive Lying
Manipulative
Anti-Social Behavior


Part Two:

Common Types of Psychopaths (http://youtu.be/Gd6P1Ue2aGg?t=10m31s) @ 10:30

Narcissists
The Victim
Con Artists
Malevolent Psychopaths
Professional Psychopaths
Secondary Psychopaths


Part Three:

Method of Operation (http://youtu.be/Gd6P1Ue2aGg?t=24m40s) @ 24:40 minutes

The Interview
The Seduction
Divide and Conquer
Fear and Tyranny

Defense Against a Psychopath (http://youtu.be/Gd6P1Ue2aGg?t=30m10s) @ 30:10 minutes

Facing Evil
Recognition
What Not To Do
Attack
Evade


seemed a good article to read but when I click it says It was block by videocanal in your country. thanks RD

RunningDeer
16th September 2015, 04:46
seemed a good article to read but when I click it says It was block by videocanal in your country. thanks RD
See if this works, Bubu. I found the videos in three parts and I added a link to his book.

Summary:

Defense Against the Psychopath is a three part documentary excerpted from chapter one of my book; The Art of Urban Survival (http://www.amazon.com/Art-Urban-Survival-Family-Defense/dp/0986951501/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1442378484&sr=8-1&keywords=The+Art+of+Urban+Survival). This chapter teaches people how to recognize and defend against our society's most dangerous predators, psychopaths.

Part One teaches how to recognize psychopaths by their Key Character traits.

Part Two describes the different psychopathic archetypes that inhabit different levels of society.

Part Three teaches how to recognize the psychopath's typical Modus Operandi and how to deal with the psychopaths you will inevitably encounter in life.


Defense Against the Psychopath: Part One
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Key Characteristics

Lack of Empathy
Lack of Remorse
Superficiality
Grandiosity
Irresponsibility
Impulsive Behavior
Compulsive Lying
Manipulative
Anti-Social Behavior


Defense Against the Psychopath: Part Two
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Common Types of Psychopaths

Narcissists
The Victim
Con Artists
Malevolent Psychopaths
Professional Psychopaths
Secondary Psychopaths


Defense Against the Psychopath Part Three
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Method of Operation

The Interview
The Seduction
Divide and Conquer
Fear and Tyranny

Defense Against a Psychopath

Facing Evil
Recognition
What Not To Do
Attack
Evade



Jhonie
16th September 2015, 06:30
Lately I have been able to appreciate that they taught me what not to be.

When we heal ourselves, we can heal the world. Recognizing that we have been abused is a start. I know people in complete denial that they suffer from it.

pugwash84
16th September 2015, 07:19
I have learned that the way they are, is their problem. I get judged for being a woman (Some people think I should stay in the kitchen), I get judged for being a working mother, I get judged for having a disabled son and I get judged for many other things. I have just grown to have a thick skin and the only judgement I care about is how I see myself. xx
If someone is putting you down and trying to upset you tell them how you feel. Say your hurting my feelings and I don't want to continue with this conversation as sometimes people are not direct enough with conversations, at times I am too blunt but I get the message across xx I hope this helps xx

betoobig
16th September 2015, 09:20
Hello UnicornW. There are different types of abuse. It is very hard to deal with the tough ones, i know. The first advise from moekatz worked for me a lot. The technic used in regresions is to go back to the moment of the abuse and dis-associate from it... meaning wacht it as if it were done to another person. You´ll get a high relieve... now from there you can apply the others advises which i found all perfect.
There is another quantum technic which is very simple and works. As quantum phisics teach us we create our reality, with that priciple find a picture of the member/s of the family who abuse you and write in the back the positive things you know about him/her... you´ll be amaze when ever you met them becouse they´ll behave like what you wrote in the picture. Give it a try please, you can also do it mentally but i advise you to, first, do the writing thing.
I wish you all the best and please accept some loving energies to fill you as as you read.
@Runningdeer: You are such a lovely woman treating us all like a good mother. Love you so much.
Love...Evol

¤=[Post Update]=¤

If you don´t know any hypnotist in your area for a regression, for sure, some member here near your area will put you in contact with one. Love

Lifebringer
16th September 2015, 13:02
Well for me, I had to learn to treat them like a satelite or completely get away from their negativity until they matured enough to be around them. In short, since I could not change them, and some of them I loved, "I let go and let God" handle them.

Best saying for this soul is: "God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things I can, and the (wisdom,) to know the difference.":coffee:

God speed on your awakening and I hope this was helpful.

Citizen No2
16th September 2015, 13:08
I can't thank the o/p, UnicornW, enough for this thread and all the replies. Thank you all.

And a special thank you to Running Dear for the excellent video.

I do not think "what a coincidence' any more, these event's are happening on a daily basis.......... my thought's manifest within hours. Have to be so careful of what I think now.

All of my family relationships are no more. All of them. I am down to my partner and grown children, and one of those is is on a very rocky shore. I must admit that when these relationships started breaking down it was freaking me out a bit, it was making me question, "am I a good person?". Now though, now I realise..... I understand what is at play here, I can see what is going on. It saddens me a little at times, even angers me now and then, but not much. I am responsible for me, not for them, not for her, not for him........ just me. And I am cool with that. Little remnants keep intruding upon my life, it seems to me that these are last ditch attempts to either try and pull me back in, them trying to get the hooks in again.

You just gotta let it go.

Easy to say............ Much harder in practice.

I have absolute love and respect for you all, and especially those of you among us that are at this stage. You must smile through your tears, and keep on, keep on moving.

Sincerest regards.

Unicorn_Wrath
16th September 2015, 13:09
The search then is about finding your "tribe".
In the end the others might come around to seeing things your way, and the error of their own mistakes.
Because bullying and hounding the oddball family member is not a soul saving pursuit.

But then again, perhaps they won't come around in this life. Some apples still ripen after they dropped from the tree.

One Avalonian once told me after contacting my deceased mother that now she saw things differently,
having arrived in the hereafter.

Just getting the hang of this quoting process (I think!)
I could have quoted so many of you. Each of you has contributed such insightful information, thank you ever so much.

RunningDeer, thank you for the book recommendation. I have secured it in PDF form.
I did notice the location issue with the video you shared, and I managed to secure an alternative lastnight, which I shall view when I have time. You are a credit to the Avalon community. ♡

Ulli, I have been labelled an oddball in the past, so your statement resonated immediately, and I've been tempted to feel that because there is such a huge chasm even in terms of basic beliefs, between the 'offending' family members and I, that there is very little room for change.

To clarify, this post was made in reference to my father (who exhibits narcissistic traits at times, and has consistently been emotionally and verbally abusive over the years, particularly to my mother, then openly starting on me when the marriage broke down for a period in 2006, when I was 16), and my 18yr old brother (whom my father's attitude has rubbed off on to a certain extent.) They are two highly judgemental, by-the-book individuals. Interestingly, my father is not even my brother's biological father, yet has 'inherited' many of his traits. Go figure.

I am unsure how many of you are familiar with the MBTI Scale, but I am an INFP, my Mother & 13yr old Sister are ISFP, my brother and father present as ISTJ & ESTJ respectively. Needless to say, chalk and cheese. Two against three!

This causes friction, many arguments, and yesterday a physical dispute, when my brother slapped my mother twice, once across the face. To cut a long story short, he has a superiority complex and neurotic tendencies. Any attempt to 'discipline' and he will make threats, and call my father a hypocrite, as he has been forceful and pushy (but not directly violent) in the past.

This is a complicated situation, and like I stated, there is such a shortage of common ground in basic beliefs that I do not feel any form of therapy may work. I was speaking to an acquaintance online yesterday (who is a counsellor) and he surmised that my brother needs to grow out of this naive mentality and get on with his life. I tend to agree. In the meantime, I feel he must realize that verbally bashing members of the household is unacceptable.

Anyway, thanks again to all if you reach the end of this post!
I will address further topics some of you have raised when I have more time later on.

Phoenix (UW)

bogeyman
16th September 2015, 13:13
This is my first thread, so please be forgiving!

I am curious as to how many here, like myself, are living in or have grown up in abusive or turbulent households with narcissistic family members, how you handled it, and how it has affected you, including your relationships with others.

Do you think these challenging experiences are something we choose before birth (I personally do), and how might we best overcome the often long-lasting effects they have on our psyche?


It affects everything from self esteem, ability to socialise, relationships, trust, emotional turmoil, education, self worth, negative thinking, isolation, physical appearance and so forth it has long term ramifications, and you don't get over it has such, for it is a part of who you are. Yes your spiritual side is asked to come here knowing all this, it is how you respond to it that is the lessons you need to learn. Long last effects, you can make a life for your self, if you find the right people, break cycles, move forward in your life, find out who you really are all this helps and it distances your self from the past. All this is from personal experiences, I have been through the mill worse than what I am saying here.

bogeyman
16th September 2015, 14:34
I will say also that there is a bitterness, like why me, why is my childhood and life been destroyed? You cannot blame other people for something they are not responsible for, I did for some time, and you may go through this. The lack of intervention by authorities is also a problem, good or bad I do not know, for me there was one person I could turn to unfortunately that decision was not a good one, for one form of abuse was replace by another. Psychological abuse was also a massive problem for me and other members of the family, so they repeated this abuse, I broke the cycle, and I paid a very heavy price, but it was the right decision to make.

Michelle
16th September 2015, 15:03
Ah narcissists. My mother is one. With a true Narcassist you practice "no contact". Some people will practice "minimal contact". That implies that if your going to be in a relationship with the Narcassist, you don't give out much information about yourself to them.
In my case the abuse was severe. No contact was best for me. After the grieving process of letting the person go, healing was to follow.
Thank you runningdeer. I will look at your videos as well. You are very kind and helpful to everyone here.

Bubu
16th September 2015, 16:05
thanks RunningDeer watching now

Unicorn_Wrath
16th September 2015, 17:38
@betoobig I can see how that quantum technique you mentioned could be effective..I dropped any kind of victim mentality a long time ago, but on days where my mood would plummet, either that very night or the next morning, conflict erupted in the house that somehow involved me. I always suspected that my internal discord manifested outwardly. Similarly, a bright, sunny outlook would either serve to unconsciously uplift those around, or lend me the resolve to push through difficulties unaffected.

When happiness no longer depends on the actions of others, there is a great inner peace. Unfortunately, this strength comes in waves, and sometimes I am gradually worn down to mild despair/anxiety. But I am getting better. I was an extremely shy child (and very quiet adolescent) and was basically trodden upon. This is something that Simon Parkes seemed to believe was a pattern of my earth incarnations.
I'd like to see if I can overcome it in this lifetime..

I also read the hypnotherapist Dr. Michael Newton's books, hence how I came to take soul contracts seriously. There are few regression therapists in my area, and the cost is rather prohibitive to be honest, but it is something I definitely have earmarked for the future. I wonder if everyone had a basic awareness of their individual soul contracts, would life become banal or predictable? Or would it serve to enlighten people about the long-term effects of negative behaviours? Sometimes can't help feeling like we are mere actors in a gigantic soul growth experiment, climbing the ranks of development.

RunningDeer
16th September 2015, 18:08
Thank you runningdeer. I will look at your videos as well. You are very kind and helpful to everyone here.

And a special thank you to Running Dear for the excellent video.

You're welcome, Michelle & Citizen No2, and thank you. http://www.picgifs.com/smileys/smileys-and-emoticons/hugs/smileys-hugs-765537.gif

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg149/autumn59/hat_tip.gifHats off and thanks to Phoenix (Unicorn_Wrath) for the thread and All who’ve shared. It awakens and/or reinforces our inner knowing that we’re sovereign, empowered Lovelys.

Here’s one of my favorite videos that says, “Busted. Nope. No more.”


Ending of One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest
mCVdVocHe18



RunningDeer
16th September 2015, 18:55
RunningDeer, thank you for the book recommendation. I have secured it in PDF form.
I did notice the location issue with the video you shared, and I managed to secure an alternative last night, which I shall view when I have time. You are a credit to the Avalon community. ♡

I am unsure how many of you are familiar with the MBTI Scale, but I am an INFP, my Mother & 13yr old Sister are ISFP, my brother and father present as ISTJ & ESTJ respectively. Needless to say, chalk and cheese. Two against three!

Phoenix (UW)


You are a credit to the Avalon community.

Thank you, Phoenix. I like you, I’m one of the countless here.


I am unsure how many of you are familiar with the MBTI Scale, but I am an INFP

For those new to the MBTI Scale, there’s a thread, “Free Personality Test and Type Description (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?58489-Free-Personality-Test-and-Type-Descriptions&p=665299#post665299)s”. Crossing fingers that all the links work.


Citizen No2
16th September 2015, 21:04
ESFP.

That's quite something, that personality test.

Regards.

Selkie
16th September 2015, 21:08
I am an ENFP. I have taken different versions of the test over several years, and it always comes out the same.

If I was a dog, I would probably be a golden retriever.

Selkie
16th September 2015, 21:18
Ending of One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest
mCVdVocHe18




Just one chance...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjX9kg4uB3M

Tyranny is tyranny. It doesn't matter if it is the tyranny of government or of family.

RunningDeer
16th September 2015, 21:40
@Runningdeer: You are such a lovely woman treating us all like a good mother. Love you so much.
Love…Evol
Ran out of time, betoobig… I’m back to pass along that the feeling’s mutual. AND...

Mother Earth’s the Good Mother. She wears many faces. She’s birthed a playground for us to co-create. The Big Mama…tough love to tenderness. It’s all here for us to be mapmakers of our choosing.

Love,
RunningDeer ♡

PS Unicorn Wrath, the Unicorn is for you.

:focus:


http://avalonlibrary.net/paula/Love/Good-Mother_zpstmpwjux1.JPG

vano915
17th September 2015, 19:56
I, too, come from an abusive and totally crazy family. My mother was a closet alcoholic with zero boundaries; she didn't want a second child (me), and I paid dearly for that. My father was a dear but weak man who chose to look the other way. The thing that brought me the most peace once I got into therapy was finding out how my parents got so crazy in the first place. I actually have photos of my parents as children on the wall with my kids' baby pictures, to remind me that they didn't start out evil. Once upon a time, both of them were victims, too. The fact that they chose to carry on the family tradition of abuse and dysfunction is on them, but based on all the family history I've managed to compile, they may not have had much choice. I was so ignored and neglected as a kid that I was free to find a better way -- I was not compelled to "toe the line", and I certainly had no sense of loyalty to them. There is an excellent book called "Family Secrets" by John Bradshaw -- I found it very helpful. It really showed me what to look for in all the old family stories-- well worth reading!

I started playing Nancy Drew at all the family gatherings -- looking for clues to past dysfuntion in the family -- which gave me a pretty good shield, since it put me outside-looking-in instead of inside-and-part-of-the-craziness.

The most important thing is to stay safe, though. If you can't make the crazies respect your boundaries, then keep your distance.

Siren Master
18th September 2015, 00:57
I belong to a group on FB titled, "After Narcissistic Abuse there is light, life and love". Lot's of information there. A life saver for me. I wrote the narc a letter warning him that if he came after me in any way again, I would respond in kind. He did. I did. And it was all blamed on me. The family now thinks we just 'don't get along'. I counter crossed and evaded for years but finally it was showdown at the ok coral. I lost. (Depends how you look at it.)

I can't see him in any way, for too much has happened. I now can NOT prevent my lip from curling, and my physical presence from going into defend mode. He's charming to everyone else, but turns into a monster when he goes after me. I'm stronger, and can verbally clobber that creep. Better to stay away. There is no resolve with a narc. They don't know how to take responsibility, apologize, make amends.

Siren Master
18th September 2015, 17:38
https://afternarcissisticabuse.wordpress.com/2015/09/18/what-happens-when-targets-arent-believed/

Unicorn_Wrath
18th September 2015, 20:03
Thanks for the link, SirenM. I just found the FB page you were referring to (among others) also. Very helpful tips. :)

Vano915, I will check out that book, TY. Serious amount of reading to do at this point!

RunningDeer, thank you for the pinto Unicorn. I can never have too many. :D

As far as resolution goes...Many a time, wit and disarming with humour has been relatively successful, but ultimately things remain the same. The individual never drops their pre-conceived notions about you. No matter what you do to prove yourself to them. One day you're brilliant, next day you're stupid.

The funny thing is, for someone with narcissistic manipulative traits, he (my father) becomes incredibly self-conscious, defensive, and has a real chip on his shoulder (due to his obesity.) His own lack of self-esteem and belief in a methodical approach to life leads him to berate others who deviate from the beaten path. He is also a closet racist/homophobe and hypocrite. Not essentially a 'bad' person at heart, but someone who should seek help. Unfortunately, he has manipulated a therapist before.

Therefore, the eventual solution will be to cut ties, like so many of you have said, and work on establishing boundaries/maintaining my sanity(!) until such times.

Thanks for all the support, much appreciated, and I hope this thread will serve to assist others caught up in similar situations.
I would love to make helping others heal from these circumstances a part of my life someday.