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AlkaMyst
16th December 2010, 20:06
Hey guys check this out....I couldn't believe this but it's true, the car runs up to 45kmh and can run for about 220km.

http://www.instylecars.com/wp-content/gallery/367/2010-mdi-airpod.jpg (https://www.theavalonfiles.com/blog/)

what do you guys make of this?.....Do you think the can commercialize this vehicle?

I wrote a post on my blog if you want more in.....check it out! (https://www.theavalonfiles.com/blog/)

Anchor
16th December 2010, 22:24
I think I posted something on this in news and updates a while back, cant remember. Anyway it runs on very very compressed air (300bar) in a carbon fibre tank. As such I think describing it as "thin" air may be misleading :)

StephenW11UK
17th December 2010, 01:36
Thanks, AlkaMyst, here are a coule of YouTube links:

http://uk.reuters.com/news/video?videoId=84561

http://www.nowpublic.com/environment/japanese-invent-car-runs-water

AlkaMyst
17th December 2010, 02:17
You're right, I might have miss word it......but it still is very interesting, if someone can do that just imagine what our future holds!!!

Just trying to look at things from a positive angle instead of concentrating so much on all the negativity going on right now.

My apologies if you find it miss leading, for those were not my intentions! :o

AlkaMyst
17th December 2010, 02:31
Very much appreciated StephenW11UK.....but let me tell you a funny story. Did you know that the H2O idea to power your vehicle has been around for a very long time....even way before the Stan Meyer conspiracy, if you haven't heard of him check this link out.....click here! (http://green.autoblog.com/2007/05/29/conspiracy-stan-meyer-and-the-mysterious-elusive-electrolyzer/)

But if you really want to get in depth then check this here (http://waterpoweredcar.com/inventors.html), which shows you the list of inventors who have experimented with electrolysis since 1799.....very interesting stuff that I bet must people here don't know about!!!

Don't mind me if I talk too much, is just that I'm always on a quest for knowledge.....I try learning something new everyday!!! ;)

Anchor
17th December 2010, 03:23
You're right, I might have miss word it......but it still is very interesting, if someone can do that just imagine what our future holds!!!

Just trying to look at things from a positive angle instead of concentrating so much on all the negativity going on right now.

My apologies if you find it miss leading, for those were not my intentions! :o


No not at all, it is exciting technology and worth seeing again - thanks for posting the thread.

I see the main problem is how to compress the air so much. My farm compressor, a high end two stage compressor, only goes to 12 bar. You would need a very powerful compressor to refill it, so even though it is a good way to store energy you still have to get the energy from somewhere.

AlkaMyst
17th December 2010, 03:35
No not at all, it is exciting technology and worth seeing again - thanks for posting the thread.

I see the main problem is how to compress the air so much. My farm compressor, a high end two stage compressor, only goes to 12 bar. You would need a very powerful compressor to refill it, so even though it is a good way to store energy you still have to get the energy from somewhere.

I agree with you 100% John....what really interested me is that I have thought about this theory for quite some time and to see it out there already amazes me at the things that we can do already....what I would like to see done is a way where you can capture the oxygen from the air, convert it to H20 and have that pass through an electrolysis converter which will make the vehicle run on electricity that is generated from water which in terms come from thin air, literally!!! :cool:

Carmody
17th December 2010, 04:05
No not at all, it is exciting technology and worth seeing again - thanks for posting the thread.

I see the main problem is how to compress the air so much. My farm compressor, a high end two stage compressor, only goes to 12 bar. You would need a very powerful compressor to refill it, so even though it is a good way to store energy you still have to get the energy from somewhere.

300 bar is now common for nitrox mixes in diving. The carbon fiber tank slowly coming on line.

http://www.nigelhewitt.co.uk/diving/300bar.html

300 bar = 4350psi, approximately.

AlkaMyst
17th December 2010, 04:13
Thanks for the info Carmody.....very much appreciated cause I didn't know that, see learn something new everyday!!!

onawah
17th December 2010, 05:00
Can anyone tell me:
Are there any dangers inherent in compressed air vehicles?
Is the equipment needed to compress air expensive?

AlkaMyst
17th December 2010, 05:16
Can anyone tell me:
Are there any dangers inherent in compressed air vehicles?
Is the equipment needed to compress air expensive?

Really don't know, but I'll definitely try to find out!!

sjkted
17th December 2010, 05:27
The tank exploding. It's similar to running a vehicle on CNG or LNG. This is why you normally see it in large vehicles such as buses. If someone backends you, you might explode with the car.

--sjkted

AlkaMyst
17th December 2010, 05:30
Man that would really suck.....I guess it still has it's flaws and they need to be worked on. I wondering if there's a way that it could be protected?, you like they do with black boxes on planes!

sjkted
17th December 2010, 05:47
The problem is that most passenger cars have the structural integrity of fiberglass and tinfoil mixed together with a bit of bubble gum.

Seriously though, take a look at 1960's American cars and how they did in front end and side collisions vs. today's cars. The older cars would need a new fender and some paint. The new cars get totaled and replaced by the insurance companies. Can you say functional obsolescence?

It's hard to put something tough in the design when the design is to expire in 5-10 years one way or another, thus forcing the owner to buy another car, and generating demand for new cars.

--sjkted

Carmody
17th December 2010, 05:50
The problem is that most passenger cars have the structural integrity of fiberglass and tinfoil mixed together with a bit of bubble gum.

Seriously though, take a look at 1960's American cars and how they did in front end and side collisions vs. today's cars. The older cars would need a new fender and some paint. The new cars get totaled and replaced by the insurance companies. Can you say functional obsolescence?

It's hard to put something tough in the design when the design is to expire in 5-10 years one way or another, thus forcing the owner to buy another car, and generating demand for new cars.

--sjkted

Well, that has to end. (planned obsolescence)

It does end, but it tends to cost upward of $50kUS ++ per car. Think Mercedes, BMW, etc. They can last a long, long time -in the right hands. I was driving a BMW until a short time ago :( :cry::(, and I never did much in the way of service on it for 5 years straight.

sjkted
17th December 2010, 05:59
It does end, but it tends to cost upward of $50kUS ++ per car. Think Mercedes, BMW, etc. They can last a long, long time -in the right hands.


Actually, not even BMW or Mercedes any more. In the 1970's and 80's they were very simple mechanical cars with a lot of parts and could be worked on by the owner. Today, these cars require German specialty mechanics who own all of the expensive tools just for these cars and have all of the computer diagnostic equipment.

These new German cars are phenomenally expensive to service and become even more so after 5 years when the warranty is over. Consider how much the car has depreciated and how much it will cost to keep it on the road every year. Add to that these cars are no longer classics, so there is no pride of ownership. I know quite a few people who do this -- buy a new one, keep it for 5 years, trade it in and buy another new one -- or just lease which is pretty much the same thing. This would be unheard of with a classic Mercedes.

In addition, they have the same functional obsolescence design: no real bumpers, no more side door protection, etc. and lowered weight which means less protection in accidents. Nobody cares if you bump or rear end it. This was something Mercedes once cared about, but no more.

--sjkted

AlkaMyst
17th December 2010, 06:06
lmao.....:laugh:

The problem is that most passenger cars have the structural integrity of fiberglass and tinfoil mixed together with a bit of bubble gum.

I do have to agree with you on.....

Seriously though, take a look at 1960's American cars and how they did in front end and side collisions vs. today's cars. The older cars would need a new fender and some paint. The new cars get totaled and replaced by the insurance companies. Can you say functional obsolescence?

It's hard to put something tough in the design when the design is to expire in 5-10 years one way or another, thus forcing the owner to buy another car, and generating demand for new cars.


Is not about durability anymore, it's all about profitability!!!

Carmody
17th December 2010, 06:13
Mine.... was built like a tank. year 2000 model. Very thick body panel steel. A full 2 tons dry weight. (4000 lbs). I did all the service myself. Which most people cannot do. I can exorcise car demons and resurrect dead cars. I am the car zombie master/priest.

Regardless of all this, some form of a simple over unity device is needed for all these vehicles and the people in them.

got it. The perfect adjunct to an air powered car. the over unity pump-- to fill the tanks.

TWO-STAGE MECHANICAL OSCILLATOR - PENDULUM-LEVER SYSTEM - A Mechanical Amplifier of Clean Energy

http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Milkovic_Two-Stage_Mechanical_Oscillator#Official_Website

Anchor
17th December 2010, 10:27
I can exorcise car demons and resurrect dead cars. I am the car zombie master/priest.

Is that why you are car-mod-y ;)

BMJ
17th December 2010, 12:55
onawah,
Yes that would be very dangerous if as Carmody said ther is " 300 bar = 4350psi, approximately" of air pressure in the cylinder, if you were to have a car accident and the air cylinder ruptured it would go off like a bomb and you and the car would look like the aftermath of a Baghdad bombing.

Or if some how the cylinder fail in some way and the air started to leak out it would probably cut threw anything in its path in the same way as a comic book laser.

On a different note how much energy / money would you need to expend to fill the air cylinder. I mean 4350psi of pressure you would need some very heavy duty equipment to pump that amount of pressure. Is it really economical?

Carmody
17th December 2010, 16:16
If something like the mentioned system was used, it would be economical. Except for the titanium cage for the carbon fiber air tank. That would cost money. One has to build the thing so it does not provide advertisement (by the way of death stories) of it's potential deadliness, for any of the people who might want it to fail as an enterprise.

However, there are plenty of other overunity devices that can provide electricity on the fly from within the confines of the given vehicle, moving or stationary. The best might be a smaller over-unity device that charges it while parked, wherever that may be. I know I'm talking about another type of thing and device/car altogether, but that is the more likely scenario.

Toyota tried to bring into the US some cars that were run off of the "Minato Motor' . This, in the early 1990's. That's when the hammer came down on Toyota (directly threatened Toyota plants and threatened a 15-15% import duty on all Japanese cars) via Bush Senior and crew. http://www.rexresearch.com/minato/minato.htm

it was a way of killing US business and US lifestyle, while at the same time working the Japanese population to the bone with low profit margins and little return. And thus use the profits of both enterprises (running both banking systems) to create the nightmare of US cash surplus and US financial world dominance) and two destroyed countries (US and Japan) at the same time. But I am greatly digressing.

I mean it's ONLY 4300psi. Which is something akin to the muzzle energy of a very high powered rifle for each and every inch of the surface of that tank. :faint2:

sjkted
17th December 2010, 16:44
On a different note how much energy / money would you need to expend to fill the air cylinder. I mean 4350psi of pressure you would need some very heavy duty equipment to pump that amount of pressure. Is it really economical?


Many of the cars that were built with this tech were in the 1920s before we had any type of standard fuel or infrastructure. It is my understanding this is why compressed air cars did not get anywhere.

--sjkted

Anchor
20th December 2010, 03:46
It is interesting to work out how much that tank would weigh with all that air squashed in. At that pressure the air actually weighs a lot! Normally air "weighs" 1.229 kg per metre cubed, at 3000psi it is 240 kg per metre cubed! ( calculated at 21 deg Celcius )

Here is the original post I made on this http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?5665-Compressed-air-powered-car