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Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
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Hi, All:
This new video, with author, teacher, mystic, and woman's activist Lucia René, is an intriguing discussion about the role of women - and men - in today's world: essentially an esoteric perspective on what could be called the depth psychology of power.
Lucia states that the days of the Patriarchy - which has been in command on Planet Earth for thousands of years - are coming to an end. Women are now beginning to stand in their own power... and with it, the role of men is being redefined.
Whatever gender you are, this is a timely and deeply interesting interview. Lucia's book is an important one for our changing times, and as a man - apologizing for the abusive attitudes and actions of many of my fellow men for countless generations - I'm delighted to be giving it the prominence it deserves.
Enjoy. :)
http://unplugfromthepatriarchy.com
MP3 download: http://projectavalon.net/Lucia_Rene_...March_2011.mp3
Video download: http://projectavalon.net/Lucia_Rene_...March_2011.mp4
http://youtube.com/watch?v=e4vPyClAHqs
https://youtube.com/watch?v=e4vPyClAHqs
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Why would you apologise for something that other people did Bill?
That is part of the guilt complex they put into us, reject it.
We will accumulate enough guilt for the things we do ourselves without taking onboard more.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Quote:
Posted by
Lord Sidious
Why would you apologise for something that other people did Bill?
That is part of the guilt complex they put into us, reject it.
We will accumulate enough guilt for the things we do ourselves without taking onboard more.
As a man, I was apologizing for the things that men have done to women over the last several thousand years.
Saying "I don't have to apologize, it was nothing to do with me" is exactly the kind of thing that men do. :)
You may not have had time yet to watch the entire interview. At one point I talk about Truth and Reconciliation, citing the Commission established in South Africa in 1995 after the end of Apartheid.
The objective was not to establish guilt or to apportion blame: it was to tell the truth so that a chapter could be ended.
That was the sense in which I apologized: a recognition that these things have been happening.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Quote:
Posted by
Lord Sidious
Why would you apologise for something that other people did Bill?
That is part of the guilt complex they put into us, reject it.
We will accumulate enough guilt for the things we do ourselves without taking onboard more.
I know it might sound strange...
I very much loved reading that Bill apologized (I would rather say: ask for forgiveness) for things others did. (The words are used a bit differently in German though...)
Imagine you have experienced something terrible (most of us have in one way or the other) and I'd listen to your experience very closely with all my love and compassion, and then I would honestly bend my head and hold your hands saying:
"I apologize with all my heart for what was done to you." -
In this way I would give your pain and grief a space within my own compassion, within my love - and this can allow you to let go of it.
Try it: I honestly, honestly ask you for forgiveness for what was done to you.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
For those of us who believe in reincarnation ... I expect we have all made contributions to patriarchy over the last couple thousand years. Most familiar with past life regression also say we experience both genders as well as a wide variance of social conditions.
That said, as others suggest, this should not be about blame but rather forgiveness, healing and moving forward.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
It was an exellent inteview with a most charming, knowledgeable and powerful woman.
I really liked it. I hope you apologized on my behalf too, Bill. Thank you. :thumb:
This world is filled to the brim with feminin energy. So ladies and
gents supply your self for next stage of the journey.:kiss:
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
hey bill is the video available for download?
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Quote:
Posted by
bennycog
hey bill is the video available for download?
Yes: http://projectavalon.net/Lucia_Rene_...March_2011.mp4
The audio download is the same URL, but with .mp3 as the suffix.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Quote:
Posted by
Bill Ryan
Quote:
Posted by
Lord Sidious
Why would you apologise for something that other people did Bill?
That is part of the guilt complex they put into us, reject it.
We will accumulate enough guilt for the things we do ourselves without taking onboard more.
As a man, I was apologizing for the things that men have done to women over the last several thousand years.
Saying "I don't have to apologize, it was nothing to do with me" is exactly the kind of thing that men do. :)
You may not have had time yet to watch the entire interview. At one point I talk about Truth and Reconciliation, citing the Commission established in South Africa in 1995 after the end of Apartheid.
The objective was not to establish guilt or to apportion blame: it was to tell the truth so that a chapter could be ended.
That was the sense in which I apologized: a recognition that these things have been happening.
I recognise your motives, that isn't a problem.
The thing is, we are being conditioned to apologise for things that we have not done ourselves and more importantly, would not do.
Take Australia for example. We have sorry day where we are expected to say sorry every year for the things that the alleged authorities did to the aborigines.
I would not have ever thought of any of what they did do, let alone do it.
Guilt is a funny thing, it can form a roadblock on our spiritual path, one that can be hard to circumvent.
Trust me on this, I have struggled with it for years.
That is why I make the comments.
Quote:
Posted by
sepia
Quote:
Posted by
Lord Sidious
Why would you apologise for something that other people did Bill?
That is part of the guilt complex they put into us, reject it.
We will accumulate enough guilt for the things we do ourselves without taking onboard more.
I know it might sound strange...
I very much loved reading that Bill apologized (I would rather say: ask for forgiveness) for things others did. (The words are used a bit differently in German though...)
Imagine you have experienced something terrible (most of us have in one way or the other) and I'd listen to your experience very closely with all my love and compassion, and then I would honestly bend my head and hold your hands saying:
"
I apologize with all my heart for what was done to you." -
In this way I would give your pain and grief a space within my own compassion, within my love - and this can allow you to let go of it.
Try it: I honestly, honestly ask you for forgiveness for what was done to you.
I know full well the power of empathy and I get it, I just don't believe in the guilt spreading.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Quote:
Posted by
Lord Sidious
I recognise your motives, that isn't a problem.
The thing is, we are being conditioned to apologise for things that we have not done ourselves and more importantly, would not do.
Take Australia for example. We have sorry day where we are expected to say sorry every year for the things that the alleged authorities did to the aborigines.
I would not have ever thought of any of what they did do, let alone do it.
Guilt is a funny thing, it can form a roadblock on our spiritual path, one that can be hard to circumvent.
Trust me on this, I have struggled with it for years.
That is why I make the comments.
Dear Lord Sid:
This is not a push-back. Take a pause and read again what Sepia and I were both saying (different views of the same elephant).
When you wrote
Quote:
Trust me on this, I have struggled with it for years.
... may I say: that's evident. You're reading guilt (ask yourself if this is your projection...) where neither Sepia or I were talking about guilt at all. We're talking about acknowledgement. That's entirely different.
Trust me on this - I do not feel guilty. And neither should you. But I still acknowledge the wrongdoing.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
I think Lord Sidious on the one hand, and Sepia and Bill on the other hand, are speaking from two different perspectives.
From the point of view of someone who takes responsibility for their actions as a separate individual, you don't apologize for the acts of another. You just don't. I can well understand where you're coming from, Lord Sidious, if that's what you're saying.
But from a more caring, more connected perspective, apologizing as was done above is -not- saying "I did it and I should not have", but rather saying to the other person "You are not to blame for what befell you, I acknowledge the pain it caused, and I reach out to you with a healing touch." To be honest, I don't understand that view myself as well, but that's what I heard Bill and Sepia speaking of, and I treasure it.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Simply put ... when my wife, child or whomever says "I have a headache ... or hurt my elbow ... (etc) I say "I am sorry" or "I am sorry to hear that" showing empathy for their pain.
I am certainly *not* showing guilt or taking responsibility (athough my wife having a headache could be debatable :) )
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Quote:
Posted by
Lord Sidious
Take Australia for example. We have sorry day where we are expected to say sorry every year for the things that the alleged authorities did to the aborigines.
I would not have ever thought of any of what they did do, let alone do it.
I don't know of that practice (sorry day) personally, but from what you say it sounds like a rather sorry state of affairs to me too, Lord Sidious.
It sounds not like personally giving another person acknowledgment, caring and reassurance that they are not to blame for what befell them, but rather like another sort of bad mind trip that TPTB send us on, to weaken each of us with guilt and set one against the other.
It does not sound like what I heard Bill and Sepia speaking of.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Wonderful woman, super information and Bill... you're the nuts mate :cool:
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Quote:
Posted by
Bill Ryan
Dear Lord Sid:
This is not a push-back. Take a pause and read again what Sepia and I were both saying (different views of the same elephant).
When you wrote
Quote:
Trust me on this, I have struggled with it for years.
... may I say: that's evident. You're reading guilt (ask yourself if this is your projection...) where neither Sepia or I were talking about guilt at all.
We're talking about acknowledgement. That's entirely different.
Trust me on this - I do not feel guilty. And neither should you. But I still acknowledge the wrongdoing.
Bill, I know you too well to take offense at your posts.
You are right about me and projecting guilt, but you already knew that.
I have no problems with acknowledging wrong doings, that is only fair and natural.
It isn't so much you guys and the guilt, I suppose I did it again, I know the context of what I meant, but didn't think about it when I posted, no one else does yet.
It is the others, the ones that are the distractors, the ones paid to make us do anything negative, that is how they operate.
Whether it is the feminists getting women to hate men, the communists getting workers to hate the middle class, whatever flavour we like to show, that is their modus operandi.
Quote:
Posted by
Paul
I think Lord Sidious on the one hand, and Sepia and Bill on the other hand, are speaking from two different perspectives.
From the point of view of someone who takes responsibility for their actions as a separate individual, you don't apologize for the acts of another. You just don't. I can well understand where you're coming from, Lord Sidious, if that's what you're saying.
But from a more caring, more connected perspective, apologizing as was done above is -not- saying "I did it and I should not have", but rather saying to the other person "You are not to blame for what befell you, I acknowledge the pain it caused, and I reach out to you with a healing touch." To be honest, I don't understand that view myself as well, but that's what I heard Bill and Sepia speaking of, and I treasure it.
Yeah, Paul, you got what I meant.
You got both sides and you figured out the crossed wires.
Thanks for your input.
Quote:
Posted by
Paul
Quote:
Posted by
Lord Sidious
Take Australia for example. We have sorry day where we are expected to say sorry every year for the things that the alleged authorities did to the aborigines.
I would not have ever thought of any of what they did do, let alone do it.
I don't know of that practice (sorry day) personally, but from what you say it sounds like a rather sorry state of affairs to me too, Lord Sidious.
It sounds not like personally giving another person acknowledgment, caring and reassurance that they are not to blame for what befell them, but rather like another sort of bad mind trip that TPTB send us on, to weaken each of us with guilt and set one against the other.
It does not sound like what I heard Bill and Sepia speaking of.
You are correct in saying what it is and what it isn't.
I have to remember to make sure I explain my context before I hit the post button.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
bill:
Quote:
As a man, I was apologizing for the things that men have done to women over the last several thousand years.
Saying "I don't have to apologize, it was nothing to do with me" is exactly the kind of thing that men do.
polarising this issue using male/female assumed distinction doesn't begin to make a good premise from which to start a discussion..
what is that that "males" did to females that didn't take females' buying into and making it possible? (and for the root causes of women's discrimination in society, maybe refer to clara zetkin and other early 20th century female political activists)
in my understanding, crossing the boundaries of the old paradigm is about recognising that both male and female dwell in each and every one of us..also acknowlidging lethal tendency to give aggresive/competitive impulses an undeserved legitimacy...the resolution therefore has to lie in surpassing that mentality as whole - it cannot be confined to males alone..
the way i see it: humility is good - apologies work when lovingly targeted...or else, things may begin to sound as if from a confession box...best wishes :wink: l
.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Hello Everyone,
Seems like guilt and blame is a touchy subject here and just not with regards to women. Interesting..., I think it's opened up a can of worms in more ways than one.
One of my ancestors was an early pioneer in Oz and lived with the Aboriginals, treated them well and with utmost respect and was ostrosized and destroyed personally by another well-known Australian pioneer for doing so. As well my ancestor provided the foundation for the oldest company in Australia, still going strong today. Long story. He was an 'elite'. You never see him in the history books of course.
I personally have no guilt over the treatment of our Aboriginal people, certainly not from my ancestor, nor from anything I have ever done. But do I apologise and say sorry for what has happened to our Aboriginal people in our short history. Of course I do! It's a no-brainer, it has nothing to do with guilt, it has everything to do with empathy and compassion. Guilt is a personal thing. Empathy is for the whole. You don't have to feel guilt to feel empathy.
Studying Aboriginal history has also deepened my sadness and sorryness. I will never be sorry for saying sorry.
Kind regards,
Lily
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
I think it is high time that Avalon start a Sorry Day for what's been done to women around here.
Pick a date, everyone.
How about 11/11/11?
;)
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Oh, by the way, speaking for myself here as a woman, Bill, apology accepted.
Lord Sid, for the next 24 hours you will be reliving all your female past lives in all parallel universes....
Meet you here tomorrow and see what you have to say for yourself then....
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Well I'll try and be as quick as I can here. We as men (remember there's only one of us here as DW says) have done some pretty awful things to others including fellow men, women , indiginous races etc... over the eons.
I have been told by someone I greatly respect I have killed and been killed in previous lives. I am pleased to say this time around I have neither harmed women , children or animals. I have however given a couple of thrashings to some bullies, thugs call them what you will. No I'm not proud of it but seek and you shall find and that is precisely what they did.
Yes us skinny white guys are the ones to watch out for- As said in Batman ! ' it's the willigness to take action'.
Women's time has come and I'm all for it. Not because they are women but because they can do the task at hand as good as anyone else.
That is only 'some' women. just because you are a woman does not make you in the same league as another that has proven herself. Same goes with anyone, men included.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Beautiful Bill, thank you for a great interview with an inspiring lady.
I was never eloquent enough to express the power of the patriarchy in a way that was socially acceptable and I am happy to know other women are.
Although I like George Kavassilas manner of apologising; he kneeled before his wife-to-be and poured his heart out, your apology is accepted.
hug form Anna
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Look at those countries where women aren't considered equal with men....just LOOK at them!
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Its a two way street, I have suffered mentally, emotionally, physically at the hands of women including my late mother whom I love very deeply.
I accept that it is my karma.
I was probably getting paid back for past life actions.
There is no person in my life (past and present) male or female that I would not be happy to see and they would be pleased to see me.
I have no problem with personally extending love and accepting that women have been mistreated in the past and present by men in general.
I have no difficulty in apologizing for any offense I have give anyone male or female.
When I was a child, in Scottish Culture women were venerated, respected, highly thought of, the mistress of the house, first teacher for the child.
Men stood up when women entered the room tipped their hats opened doors and more.
Now Im afraid to open a door for a woman or be protective in case I get accused of being patronizing which would be the furthest thing from my mind,
Its natural for me, my early conditioning.
I honestly think that the media has a lot to answer for in the downgrading of women.
Their sexuality is used to sell every kind of product.
Music videos are soft porn.
Its not enough to be a good singer with a good song, it has to be the total package, which is disposable.
Respect has gone for both men and women.
Women are rarely feminine now, men rarely, truly male, both need to support each other not be in competition.
As far as spirituality goes we are a soul which is neither male or female yet both.
So within us individually we need to balance the male and female energies to bring out the best in us..
Chris
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Quote:
Posted by
ulli
Look at those countries where women aren't considered equal with men....just LOOK at them!
Don't worry about the nuggets, that attitude is almost ready for the scrapheap.
I never understood that mindset.
Women are secondclass, but our mothers, sisters, our soulmates are women.
I don't even want to comprehend the paradox, I am content to see it extinct.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
"both need to support each other not be in competition."
amen brother!
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
To put my posts in context, wax on, wax off.
I am not there yet, still learning.
Still projecting too, by the looks.
Gonna have to be REAL careful around these here parts.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
What a superb interview!!! I hope everyone takes the time for it.
Lucia presents vital information for the world in a powerful and lucid manner (love her laugh) and Bill does the dance as the interviewer as well as ever.
Positive, postive energy here! Very uplifting.
Will get the book (yet another read) and this is one I would never have picked up without some help pointing me in that direction.
For that thank you sincerely :hail: :first:
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Quote:
Lord Sidious
Gonna have to be REAL careful around these here parts.
No you dont, hiding is not the way.
Shine your truth and it can be transformed if it is off line.
When i met Jorr the first time He told me something that was the opposite of what I belived and understod.
I kindly told him that I accepted his way of seeing it but it was not my way and it didnt fit to my knowledge of the subjekt.
I was very anoied and could not let it go.
Then it suddenly struck me...... he was absolutly right.
Speak your truth even if it is the opposite of what all others say/think/belive.
It takes kurage to speak ones truth and that is the warrior mission.
Namaste
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Quote:
Posted by
ulli
Look at those countries where women aren't considered equal with men....just LOOK at them!
They are as they are !
We will change all by doing the right thing to our self and speak up.
When the tiime is right they will be able to change.
Namaste
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Thank you, Bill, for the interview. It was a very interesting insight.
My understanding is that all that is feminine was being addressed and that is natural maybe to take it in on a personal level, and I took your apology to a deeper level and thank you for it as a role leader that you are, made on behalf of all that is male.
You may remember Ike Turner who was crucified for years after his marital violence became public. The impact on him was overwhelming. Even years later all sorts of material was being launched on that violence, and a whole lot of money was made. I do not condone violence of any kind, but I did feel the hypocricy that was displayed as a result of it. It was like Ike was the villain in the entire world, when it was always a worldwide problem, much more common in most cultures. Ike did apologise for his actions.
So, yes, your apology is very much appreciated and I thank you on my own behalf.
I would be so grateful if Bill reports on the book, once he has read it.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Thank you Bill this has been by far one of the best interviews i have ever seen right along the Marcel Messing one,she drove me to tears more then once during my viewing,i am glad to say i have always been different from the norm when it comes down to being connected with my emotional body more then most guys out there,although sometimes there is a downside to it but i am not afraid to cry like a baby when i feel liberated and i get that lump out of my throat by doing it so,what an amazing being of light she is,would love to meet her in person loved it,once again thank you!
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Excellent interview. It is spot on.
Interesting sync of note: At the very end she says "We've got the tsunami coming in..." "...we've got to surf the wave..." and this was on March 10th...
She mentions, during the interview, riding right up the to edge of the cliff as it were. I feel we're at the beginning of that arrival at the edge right now, marked by March 11th's events.
I don't like following any doctrines whatsoever, but there is a Zen kōan I dig which is quite apropos at the moment:
"The light of the eyes is as a comet,
And Zen's activity is as lightning.
The sword that kills the man
Is the sword that saves the man."
Rehearsal is over. Time to mount up. :crazy_pilot::neo::crazy_pilot:
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
There is such a thing as the 'collective consciousness' in which we all share the 'all of everything'. It seems that somewhere in the collective psyche we are touched in many ways over many incarnations and have lived the entire spectrum in human evolution.( i. e. we have killed and been killed, loved and been loved). We are in a school (planet earth), learning how to be more conscious and loving...learning from our collective mistakes...and moving forward. I do not feel we have to justify, explain, or rationalize, guilt or no guilt....for all of our past exists/is recorded. And who knows how often we are tapping into, and coming from such imprints.
How do we know we are not healing our collective and individual past mistakes by a heartfelt "apology'.
Whether said aloud or just inside, a statement from the HEART of our individual self expression could be coming from an unfathomable depth of inner knowing. Let each of our hearts speak for both the collective and individual soul threads of our collective and individual selves and lives.
We are so much more than these little minds and bodies, living linear lives. I feel Bill was coming from this inner Self , inner knowing, and inner feeling and speaking to and for all of us....thanks, Bill. "we're connected' quantum-ly w/love
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Quote:
Posted by
Maria Stade
Quote:
Lord Sidious
Gonna have to be REAL careful around these here parts.
No you dont, hiding is not the way.
Shine your truth and it can be transformed if it is off line.
When i met Jorr the first time He told me something that was the opposite of what I belived and understod.
I kindly told him that I accepted his way of seeing it but it was not my way and it didnt fit to my knowledge of the subjekt.
I was very anoied and could not let it go.
Then it suddenly struck me...... he was absolutly right.
Speak your truth even if it is the opposite of what all others say/think/belive.
It takes kurage to speak ones
truth and that is the
warrior mission.
Namaste
That was one of my little jokes.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Brilliant interview - most excellent!!
'Extended' thanks from here!
Once again, someone real voicing what i have felt for years, that's very reassuring - am very grateful for this.
Can't tell you how much this resonates.
The old windup egg-timer is ticking still... but the bell has rung already some time ago.
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Quote:
Lord Sidious
That was one of my little jokes.
Oh Lord do ya think a little nugget can grasp that LOL
:kiss:
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Take it easy. Its all about balance. The end of patriarchy doesnt mean a start
of a matriarchy. The balance is to be inside every human being, masculine and
feminine energy in balance inside each and every one. We arrived on this planet
where patriarchy was the model of the era. We could not choose between patriarchy
and matriarchy. We have all done our best to act out the roles handed to us. Now it
is important to acknowledge the women for their suffering during this era. And I
think its as important to acknowledge the men for the role they have been forced to play.
If anyone imagines it is always a pleasure to have to act as the strong one when your
soul just want to cry out in despair, please think again. Lets hope we all will make this
transition without to much tumult. :horn::kiss:
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Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene
Quote:
Jorr
acknowledge the men for the role they have been forced to play.
:grouphug: Yes the programe have hurt both sides !
There is a lot to heal before balance can be.