Richard Dolan (yes, Richard Dolan) talks about women, sex, and his fear of failure

[Bill Ryan]

Folks, this is REALLY REALLY interesting to listen to.

Great Kudos to Richard Dolan for having the courage and integrity to process these personal issues in public. (Who else ever does this?)

The piece in question is the last half hour of Richard's 15 Jan 2018 radio show, starting at 1:29:14.

Here's the show archive:

• http://kgraradioarchives.com/shows/r...c=2018#archive

Here's the whole 15 Jan show:

• http://kgraradioarchives.com/Shows/r...ion%20UFOs.mp3

And here's the half hour that's the subject of this thread.

• http://avalonlibrary.net/The_Richard...g_Personal.mp3

I guarantee that every man and woman listening to this will have opinions and reactions.

It'd be MOST interesting to hear everyone's views.

[Mike]

Bill posted this radio show episode in the mod chat yesterday and what you see below is my initial reaction(copied and pasted. I've only added paragraph breaks).

As I was saying to Bill today, I think I was a little triggered by Richard's comments at the end of his interview. I, perhaps erroneously, equated some of it to an ex girlfriend of mine who I felt was trying to change me all the time, and how I regret justifying all her attempts and how I played along and compromised my integrity and so forth. Richard's wife, on the other hand, has been infinitely patient with him and what she feels his flaws are, and he's embracing the opportunity to change into what he feels is a better man. I applaud it and I applaud his candor.

Bill rightfully pointed out that what Richard is doing is simply honoring his wife. Viewed from that angle it all takes on a very different meaning for me. But I still think there is some value in my initial reaction, so I'll include it here to maybe kick off the discussion a little...

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just finished listening to Richard..

I love Richard Dolan, but i think he's being a little hard on himself. and now maybe he's overcompensating by playing what i call "the noble knight". i don't know if it's any more authentic or dignified than any of his previous incarnations, which, on the whole, were never too bad to begin with!

of course no one should be ogling other women when they're with their wife or girlfriend; that's insensitive and just plain obnoxious. but, in and of itself, noticing other attractive people is quite normal. and healthy. i wouldn't label it 'objectifying'. and look, women ogle too! i would even argue that denying one's desire to recognize another's outward beauty is less authentic and further away from one's true self than actively suppressing it. when we're growing up, as kids, we naturally outgrow our toys. we set them aside because we have no desire to play with them anymore. but it has to happen organically. if you're forcing it, the obsession just jumps from the toys to the denial.

it sounds to me like Richard wants to be this new version of himself, and is trying to convince himself that this is the way to go...but hasn't quite left his old persona behind, for better or worse. so he's adopting a new mentality, a new meme, which is sort of like taking on another of the 'sub personalities' he's trying to rid himself of in the first place.

when i was 22, my 18 yr old self embarrassed me. when i was 25, my 22 yr old self embarrassed me. when i was 28, my 25 yr old self embarrassed me, and on and on it goes. one thing i've learned is, it never ends. There are posts i've written here less than a year ago that i've recently reread that literally caused me to sweat with embarrassment. but i had to write them to get them out of my system. if i were actively suppressing them in the name of propriety, i'd still be writing them now. i can't tell you how many times ive said to myself, 'i won't change much from here'..and sure enough, i did. it wouldn't surprise me one bit if Richard's saying something totally different in a year or 2.

[Praxis]

I have the upmost respect for Richard Dolan. He is a constant source of even handed analysis and opinion.
Even more than his UFO information, which is fantastic and unparalleled in the field, his analysis and opinions on political matters as well is always refreshing and insightful.

Looking is not a problem, lingering is, especially if it is unwanted.
To me, this was not a case of White Knighting, as another poster mentioned, but rather a public declaration to both himself and to his partner(I assume wife at this point).
It is difficult to admit something you dont like about yourself, and even more so to do it on a public forum.

I think the most important part of his admission was that every person is a being that is just like you and is not an object to be used in any way(either sexually or otherwise).
Far too often it is easy to abstract other people who are outside of your personal sphere and Dunbar number. If you do this, you become ok with allowing all sorts of things to occur around the world(war, trafficking, exploitation, abuse of rights, etc. . .)

What he did was not easy and should be supported.

I want to add that lust is a beast not easily tamed. I know that I personally struggle with it.

[Innocent Warrior]

Richard said, "women listening are saying whoopdeedo you finally got the memo". I'm not, I hope he sees this thread because I want to thank him for discussing that, I never, EVER thought I'd hear a man earnestly say that. I have thought exactly the same thing about men and that societal programming.

This society has taught me it's natural for men (also women but to a lesser degree) to look, regardless if one is a part of a devoted couple or not. I unfortunately never accepted such low standards to be true but I'm supposed to know better than to voice that or I'll be written off as damaged or insecure.

The way I see it is exactly how Richard explained it and I have a much grander vision than that of society's of what a man in his authentic state can be...gosh, how devine, I like my vision much more. Same with women, coz let's get real, so many chicks love that ****, oh a man is staring at me again, I'm so pretty. Pathetic. I've lost count of how many times I've told my female friends to get over themselves, that men look at everyone and it wouldn't matter how beautiful his wife or GF is, that they're beautiful because they simply are, not because men look at them. Where's your sense of sisterhood, give them a glare like I do. They never listen, it must feel as good to be looked at as it is to look, but hey, don't listen to me, I'm just damaged, it's not that the programming didn't work on me, right? (Rhetorical, I'm done caring what anyone thinks about me and this issue.)

I've imagined men without this programming, a partner I can thoroughly and utterly respect but I learned long ago that they likely won't exist for a very long time yet because too few people, both men and women, get what Richard was talking about.

But for the record, it hurt like hell every time someone I was in love with and who's supposed to be in love with me looked at another woman, because I was IN LOVE with him. And contrary to popular belief, not all women appreciate being looked at in that way. But hey, thanks to all the truly insecure women out there in the clubs with their girls out, I often walked close behind you knowing I'd become invisible while squeezing through the crowd.

[Mike]

Posted by Rachel (here)
Richard said, "women listening are saying whoopdeedo you finally got the memo". I'm not, I hope he sees this thread because I want to thank him for discussing that, I never, EVER thought I'd hear a man earnestly say that. I have thought exactly the same thing about men and that societal programming.

This society has taught me it's natural for men (also women but to a lesser degree) to look, regardless if one is a part of a devoted couple or not. I unfortunately never accepted such low standards to be true but I'm supposed to know better than to voice that or I'll be written off as damaged or insecure.

The way I see it is exactly how Richard explained it and I have a much grander vision than that of society's of what a man in his authentic state can be...gosh, how devine, I like my vision much more. Same with women, coz let's get real, so many chicks love that ****, oh a man is staring at me again, I'm so pretty. Pathetic. I've lost count of how many times I've told my female friends to get over themselves, that men look at everyone and it wouldn't matter how beautiful his wife or GF is, that they're beautiful because they simply are, not because men look at them. Where's your sense of sisterhood, give them a glare like I do. They never listen, it must feel as good to be looked at as it is to look, but hey, don't listen to me, I'm just damaged, it's not that the programming didn't work on me, right? (Rhetorical, I'm done caring what anyone thinks about me and this issue.)

I've imagined men without this programming, a partner I can thoroughly and utterly respect but I learned long ago that they likely won't exist for a very long time yet because too few people, both men and women, get what Richard was talking about.

But for the record, it hurt like hell every time someone I was in love with and who's supposed to be in love with me looked at another woman, because I was IN LOVE with him. And contrary to popular belief, not all women appreciate being looked at in that way. But hey, thanks to all the truly insecure women out there in the clubs with their girls out, I often walked close behind you knowing I'd become invisible while squeezing through the crowd.

I don't think you sound insecure or damaged Rach. You sound perfectly reasonable. I've been with girlfriends who have both blatantly and subtly noticed other men while in my presence, and it's pretty damn hurtful. That's not cool at all. I hear you!

It might be prudent to point out that there is a difference between noticing/appreciating someone's beauty and following them around panting with your tongue on the ground, right? I would describe one act as natural and the other as unnatural.

If I see an attractive woman dressed to impress and clearly begging for attention, I usually *won't* pay her any attention, because I don't want to give her the satisfaction. But sometimes there is a woman dressed very casually, and still standing out for one reason or another, and I can't help but notice. She may not even be what you'd call conventionally pretty, but there will be something about her that attracts me. And I have to say, I don't feel I've been societally programmed to notice this, nor do i feel ashamed or morally substandard. Then again, I'm happily single, and not sitting there gawking like some lunatic; I just sort of notice, inwardly appreciate, and keep it moving, ya know?

Of course the dynamic changes when one is coupled up. This conversation can go in all kinds of directions, right down to if monogamy is even natural. Marriage may be more accurately the result of societal programming than a single guy with a roving eye, if you think about it. I'm sort of a romantic, and an idealist, and I'm pretty traditional in many ways....so I'd like to believe monogamy is both possible and healthy; and I'd like to believe the woman I'm in love with is interested in me and only me, and all that. So i'm sort of caught between my ideals and my real world experiences. It sounded to me like Richard was too.

[Sunny-side-up]

Thank you for posting that Bill.
A very inspiring, refreshing and uplifting talk by Mr Doland.
He is looking into to his self and seeing the contamination that we all suffer from in one way or another, he is being his own Guru.

I wonder how we all might see the rest of the world if we could look through the eye's of 3 year old's.
Innocent 3 year old's playing together, just enjoying each others company with out any sexual bias towards each other, neither feeling visually or sexually inferior or superior, and not adding any sexual desires to their playing.
They see the real thing we don't, but they are children we we are supposed to be adults, things are not so simple for us
We as adults need to contain and remember what it was to be a child.
To be able to view the things of this world that we, as grown ups we think to be so important, we could see so much more, we are looking but not really seeing.
We become tangled parts of the Pandora box, engrossed in our own ans inposed mind games.

He had and took a great opportunity to look inwards so he could see how he looks and behaves outwardly, that helps put him on a good path to being enlightened.

Now if we had people like him helping to govern this world 0.o
What a great ambassador for any other world visitors ha.

[Praxis]

I really suggest a listen to his most recent show on 1/29.

I am so thankful to have a figure like him out there speaking about issues I find to be very important and are the basis for much of what and why i post on this site.

[Flash]

I have a simple question: why does it takes testosterone levels to go down (with age) for spirituality or simple humanity to go up? in men.. Regarding objectification of woman.

I am pretty sure that not only what Dolan's girlfriend is telling him about his behavior of lurking on other women but there is much more towards objectification(when a woman tells her man, it has become more than looking usually, because looking we got so used to it that we shut up, as Dolan said)

Why does it takes men to be 50 years old plus to realise what they do by putting their second brain in the first place? (second brain at the first place because it is quite often that second brain that guides their life - i call it brain because sex drive becomes their only reasoning capacity).

On the other hand, sex drive is so intense in humans that it is quite impossible to cure a rapist and still less a pedophile - when an habit of thinking/behaving is linked to sex, it is about impossible to undo. Same for lurking.

Canadians in general are not that obvous when they look (if compared to latin people for example). I had a very bright high level engineer friend from Turkey, where lurking is very obvious, who told me that when she immigrated in Canada, she felt much less pretty and not sexy, because she was not as harrassed any more lolll.

She realised that it was only the way men look that had changed, but that she had learned to evaluate herself based on their looks at her. She had to remake her own inner self esteem ways of thinking of herself as a woman. This is also ingrained in women the wrong way, them getting used to be objectified and basing their self esteem on something that is utterly on the surface.

And it is gettng worst with all the porn so easily accessible to teenagers where the objectification of woman is at ist upmost state.

Of course, objectification of any human beings will make us go much below whom we truly are. No better than Nazis or KKK. No better than using workers without taking into account their human needs, you can't produce, you are out.

I had a man tell me that he felt like he was in a candy store when he divorced, with all these women around. As if his previous wife, and women, were punishing men by asking some exclusivity and wanting intimate personal relationships.

I often felt that men would either want sex, or if not, put us in the mother role, quite unconsciously, both roles that are very unsatisfying to grown up women.

I remember one boyfriend years ago telling me that he first married his mother, his second time around he married his daughter, and that he hoped the third time he would marry his equal. He was slowly getting it, but not quite there yet, if he had been I would have stayed with him.

When women find sensitive males, when in their thirties over, who got it, they snap them and do not let go. They are a rare breed. For the others, we tell ourselves "ah.. not again".

Objectification of women / men touches the most important individual in our lives and it is directly damaging in a private, inner way that could be quite visible right away if we payed attention.

And this objectification is more damanging yet to very sensitive people, who can feel everything, those that we want to help into evolving or those we want as life partner.

Do women lurk, yes . But believe me, it is much less intense (in me and my friends at least). I persnnally learned to look in order to give it back to my boyfriend, so that he would finally feel what it was like not to be the first and foremost. And he still did not understand..... we just split, because when someone is at the step of giving back, the relationship is starting to be over.

At least, Dolan finally got it. I just wonder if his new girlfriend is about the same age as his, not 20 years younger... I see a lot a men in their sixties who haven't gotten it and most probably never will.

I know my text is not entirely coherent, it is images and thoughts I had here and there throughout life. Each one could be developed further.

Anyhow, this morning, this is it.... for my contribution to the thread.

[Baby Steps]

Nah, he's just demonising a natural male program- looking at potential partners is a genetic process of assessing them for procreation. Why get tortured about men's hard wiring that nature gave us? (and women too...)

Emits evil snigger through his Loki mask.

I came to the same point as RD on this issue, maybe by a different route. The leering at women felt demeaning. It was feeding the wrong wolf. Over feeding it made me lustful, frustrated, distracted, trivial, unsatisfied, and offensive to others.

Empathy got me thinking about how the other person was feeling.

Spirituality said: You are soooo lucky- look at your assets! No 1 is a good woman. Nurture and protect your assets.

A man is not complete unless his significant other is happy - and happy with him.

[Flash]

Posted by Baby Steps (here)
Nah, he's just demonising a natural male program- looking at potential partners is a genetic process of assessing them for procreation. Why get tortured about men's hard wiring that nature gave us? (and women too...)

Emits evil snigger through his Loki mask.

I came to the same point as RD on this issue, maybe by a different route. The leering at women felt demeaning. It was feeding the wrong wolf. Over feeding it made me lustful, frustrated, distracted, trivial, unsatisfied, and offensive to others.

Empathy got me thinking about how the other person was feeling.

Spirituality said: You are soooo lucky- look at your assets! No 1 is a good woman. Nurture and protect your assets.

A man is not complete unless his significant other is happy - and happy with him.

You got the point, why go above the nature's inprint for reproduction? Because if feels demeaning. Because it is not truly who we are. Because we ought to grow up. Because we can release the complete humanity, sex drive and empathy/heart with that partner of ours, make sex be sublime and as much fun as one can because it is in a trusting loving fulfilling relationship.

Believe me, when men do not grow through chasing around even if only by lurking, women react in consequence - i.e. she will have sex without love, or with some pain, or just to compete with other females. Men end up with a woman who is not full - not fully herself, the true intimate self.

And, there it is very fulfilling for a woman to know she is IT for her man, then she will start teasing her man about other women's beauty. She does not feel threatened anymore. For this, her man has to have matured passed mammalian programming.

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I wrote my post while you were writing yours Bill, we seem to agree.

[Bill Ryan]

Thanks and great respect to all for this important and very interesting discussion.

My $.02 (and it might just be $.01!): I'm wondering if one factor in this complex equation is the stability, maturity and mutual confidence/trust within the relationship.

Richard and his fiancée Tracey (they're not married yet) are relatively new together. And kudos to them both for being able to talk so openly about these things with each other. (Many couples never do, even if they've been married for 20 years.)

But there's another slant on this. One couple I know, who've been married for a while, and check all the boxes of stability, maturity and confidence/trust, just have fun with all this. Their mutual joke (and this is how they regularly tease each other) is:

"You can look, but don't touch."

[Daozen]

This civilization (such as it is) is built on the unbearable urges of testosterone. Pretty much everything men do is to impress some chick. Without women we would probably not build bridges or telephone boxes. Do you think I learned electric guitar to impress a roomful of sweaty men? hahaha. Ogling is wrong but who can't help noticing? A flash of legs puts a spring in your step, and inspires you to do more pushups. If you want us to stop looking, ladies, quit wearing leather boots.

Competition for prime females means everyone ups their game in their respective fields, and civilization benefits. Don't supress it, channel it.

Boys will be boys,

A demon ignored is a God born.

[seehas]

Posted by Daozen (here)
This civilization (such as it is) is built on the unbearable urges of testosterone. Pretty much everything men do is to impress some chick. Without women we would probably not build bridges or telephone boxes. Do you think I learned electric guitar to impress a roomful of sweaty men? hahaha. Ogling is wrong but who can't help noticing? A flash of legs puts a spring in your step, and inspires you to do more pushups. If you want us to stop looking, ladies, quit wearing leather boots.

Competition for prime females means everyone ups their game in their respective fields, and civilization benefits. Don't supress it, channel it.

Boys will be boys,

A demon ignored is a God born.

this post is a mirror of what *they* want you to be, a box labeled as MAN and how to be the MAN gets programmed in your head by television and society, your body is driven by hormons and everyone that is not working like is is a strange guy.

i was never part of this but, maybe my testosterone levels are unnatural low

everyone is different the box labeled as MAN or WOMAN does not exist for me.


dont get me wrong i love woman but i would never start to play the guitar to impress girls, but hej as i said everyone is different.

[Hervé]

Some wise person, way back when, said something like: "Give back to Caesar what belongs to Caesar..."

... in some other words, attribute to "body" what belongs to it... it was built for the survival of itself and its species... same for the "mind" and its malleable programming ability to interact with the environment... and then, same with "YOU" and one's ability to comprehend what's what and what belongs to what and guide what's appropriate to do or not do and correct obsolete perceptions as well as tweak old ones to correspond to current environment.

Acknowledging each for what they are and their purpose without judging seems like a good start, I think.

[Joe Akulis]

I'm going to get flamed and stomped on for pointing out an elephant here, but, dude, if my wife and I walk past a woman in a burka, you won't catch me checking her out.

Yes, I'm being slightly hyperbolic with that, but it should make the point. If women don't like their men stealing a glance, then confront all the women who are walking around in spandex and showing their stuff to the world and put a stop to it.

Otherwise, don't complain. :-)

I am interested in seeing the comparisons from one country to another, and I'm glad we can get some insights from different forum members. I've always felt in the US, it's a lot more difficult simply because of what women wear out in public. We kind of abandoned modesty in my country a while back.

If you take away the fashion factor from the situation, does the problem still exist? It very well could, but I wouldn't be able to tell you, alas...

Joe

[norman]

I'm confused about what Richard was trying to say. I'd probably have to have walked around a few supermarkets with him in his single days to know how seriously out of order he was with his oggling etc.

If I understand his point, as it stands, I think he's basically wrong. I say that because I think he's on a hiding to nothing if he's so intent upon refusing to actually live in his own body, as it is. I'm tempted to call it all romantic clap trap, but I like the guy, oh and I'm a hopeless single, too

[Sunny-side-up]

Just adding:
It's not all about testosterone.

I might well look at an attractive women but that dose not mean I looked in a sexual way/intent.
I love balance of form, style, beauty, not just in females but any gender or item.
If it looks good I like to look, but not as to cause discomfort in others.

[Bluegreen]

Posted by Flash (here)
Why does it takes men to be 50 years old plus to realise what they do by putting their second brain in the first place?

Youth is wasted on the young

Because I've become convinced that thoughts are real, physical things, my recent thinking has been similar to Mr Dolan's. But this wasn't always so. My late wife used to say, "Put your eyes back in your head", but she never held it against me. Her attitude was: Every man a pig, every woman a bitch, deal with it.

[Hervé]

...




...on the other hand...


... considering the"de-weathering " and polish of the brass in that area... not the first hand to have wandered around...


Some ritual from ancient times when fashion wasn't so revealing...

[Mike]

Herve I asked you politely to not post that pic of me. That was supposed to be between you and me. What the hell?