+ Reply to Thread
Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst 1 4
Results 61 to 79 of 79

Thread: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

  1. Link to Post #61
    Avalon Member Andre's Avatar
    Join Date
    9th July 2010
    Location
    Byron Bay Area
    Posts
    268
    Thanks
    113
    Thanked 1,013 times in 243 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    Quote Posted by Cidersomerset (here)
    Sergei Lavrov makes it clear this is western manipulation to set up rebels to
    create false chemical attacks to give the west an excuse to escalate on behalf
    of their proxies and keep the fighting going... He also talks about the Skripal case in the second part.

    Russia's Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov - BBC HARDtalk


    Published on 16 Apr 2018
    This is the full and unedited interview with Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov speaking exclusively to HARDtalk's Stephen Sackur in Moscow 16 April 2018. In recent days the world has been alarmed by the very real possibility of a direct
    military confrontation between the United States and Russia. Syria is of course where the current tensions are highest, and where missiles have been fired, but the hostility is deep-seated on a number of fronts. We’ve had diplomatic expulsions, sanctions, there’s talk of a new cold war. What is Russia’s next move?
    It is in one of the very last questions that Lavrov is asked if this new Cold War is worse than it was in the 80s and Lavrov very clearly says it is worse now because all the communications channels between Russia and the West have been closed by the West (including channels with the UK, NATO, the EU and the USA). What he's implying is that without communication, it can only get worse.

    Paul Craig Roberts tells Alex Jones essentially the same thing by stating "This is all leading to war" because the Deep State is attempting to provoke Russia into a military response with each of these false flags. So far, Russia has erred on the side of caution but, again, as Paul states, it was probably a mistake for the Russians not to respond this time because the false flag operations will continue and each time do more damage to Syria and embolden ISIS and other extremist groups which the Russians and Syrians have tried so hard to end. As Paul implies, the Russians will inevitably, have to respond and that, my friends, is where the war really begins exactly according to the warped desires of the psychopathic Deep State.
    Our destiny is in our hands. Let us visualise a world of truth, freedom and equality.

  2. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to Andre For This Post:

    Baby Steps (18th April 2018), Cidersomerset (18th April 2018), Foxie Loxie (18th April 2018), greybeard (18th April 2018), Hervé (18th April 2018), mountain_jim (18th April 2018)

  3. Link to Post #62
    Scotland Avalon Member greybeard's Avatar
    Join Date
    17th March 2010
    Location
    Inverness-----Scotland
    Age
    72
    Posts
    7,554
    Thanks
    19,157
    Thanked 40,744 times in 6,443 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    I can not see that this will lead to WW111.
    There must be some sanity somewhere.

    My reasoning is simple.
    Not possible to have a limited WW down to the nuclear weapons etc.
    There can be no winner.
    The price is just to high.

    Chris
    PS these thread are no doubt studied by so called deep state.
    To which I say--"Get a grip"
    Nothing except the soul lasts for ever.
    A charity to help African Children become self sufficient. :attention:

    http://www.learningtoolsforselfdevelopment.co.uk/

    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

  4. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to greybeard For This Post:

    Cidersomerset (18th April 2018), Foxie Loxie (18th April 2018)

  5. Link to Post #63
    UK Avalon Member Cidersomerset's Avatar
    Join Date
    16th May 2011
    Location
    Bridgwater somerset UK
    Age
    57
    Posts
    21,736
    Thanks
    32,002
    Thanked 75,017 times in 18,060 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    Quote can not see that this will lead to WW111.There must be some sanity somewhere.
    I don't think the deepstate want a global conflict , just 'proxy wars 'enough to keep
    the fear meme's going and the $/£ rolling in to cover the various covert and overt
    agendas they have been doing since WW11 and before.This covers many threads
    on the forum when you look at it like that as you all know but its still worth
    keeping an eyes on each one and connecting the dots.

    Trump put a spanner in this by saying he was going to pull out of Syria so
    this false flag forced him to over react because of the on going Russiagate
    enquiry which has found nothing so Mueller is trying to Clinton him by finding
    any crime. Trumps foreign policy seems chaotic and it is to a degree but
    with this possible upcoming meeting with North Korea he may get results by
    default. I think Trump told the Chinese that he may be the best chance to get
    commercial and military deal with him as he can act outside the total confines of
    the deepstate and is why China is putting pressure on Kim Jong Un to come to
    the table.

    Trumps latest suggestion of Arab/NATO type force would let him avoid sending
    combat troops into the theatre except advisor/contractors and special forces which
    are there already. Trump is using rhetoric and tweets to reset diplomacy at a
    faster pace which seems wreckless , but it does allow various actors to respond.
    Of course this can easily go pair shaped and the deepstate are trying to stop
    him with scandals, court cases , impeachment ,& false flags. If this does not slow
    him down in the mid terms I expect they will raise the stakes with a major event
    domestic or abroad killing many or a assassination attempt of some kind. Possibly
    a Russian nerve agent...


    Quote What he's implying is that without communication, it can only get worse.
    The promising thing about the allied attack last week was that the US & Russian
    military were in contact with each other all the way through.



    David has been discussing this since before 9/11 and has been exposing the global
    agenda ever since. He may not have it all correct but he's been pretty close over
    the years at researching and connecting this ti the 'hidden hand' and their
    deepstate minions...

    I am listening to his latest interview now and he lays it out from manipulating
    the Soviets into Afghanistan by Zbigniew Brzezinski in the 1980's through to Syria
    via a mountain of blood and carnage.


    The Middle East Explained - David Icke - Part One


    Published on 18 Apr 2018
    Last edited by Cidersomerset; 18th April 2018 at 18:01.

  6. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Cidersomerset For This Post:

    Foxie Loxie (18th April 2018), greybeard (18th April 2018)

  7. Link to Post #64
    France Administrator Hervé's Avatar
    Join Date
    7th March 2011
    Location
    Brittany
    Posts
    14,166
    Thanks
    46,921
    Thanked 73,640 times in 12,923 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    US 'think tanks' funded by defense companies that lobby for war - and how threats against Syria are good for the stock market

    Danielle Ryan
    RT
    Tue, 17 Apr 2018 11:42 UTC


    © Brendan McDermid / Reuters

    When US President Donald Trump fired a barrage of Tomahawk missiles at Syrian government targets last week, it was a good day for defense contractors, at least.

    In the aftermath of the strike, which Trump claimed was in retaliation for an alleged chemical attack by the Syrian government, stocks in Tomahawk missile manufacturer Raytheon surged. Raytheon stock has climbed more than 18 percent in 2018 so far. In fact, stocks in defense companies have been climbing in general since Trump entered office promising "historic" increases in military spending.

    Almost a year ago to the day, Trump delivered another bump to the defense companies after attacking Syrian government positions for the first time - also in response to an alleged chemical attack, evidence for which remains in question.

    After that strike Boeing, Lockheed Martin, Northrop Grumman and General Dynamics also rose, gaining nearly $5 billion in market value when trading began the next day, even as the wider market slumped.

    Quote
    Mike Dorning‏Verified account @MikeDorning

    "The Bolton Trade" -- For real. Defense and energy stocks rally as the rest of the stock market slips. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-03-23/-bolton-trade-triggers-rallies-in-defense-energy-etf-watch … @SarahPonczek via @markets


    11:36 AM - 23 Mar 2018
    0 replies 4 retweets 3 likes
    [...]

    Full article: https://www.rt.com/usa/424414-why-th...nks-lobby-war/
    "La réalité est un rêve que l'on fait atterrir" San Antonio AKA F. Dard

    Troll-hood motto: Never, ever, however, whatsoever, to anyone, a point concede.

  8. The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to Hervé For This Post:

    Baby Steps (19th April 2018), Billy (19th April 2018), Cidersomerset (18th April 2018), Foxie Loxie (18th April 2018), greybeard (18th April 2018), Jayke (19th April 2018), KiwiElf (18th April 2018), Searcher (19th April 2018)

  9. Link to Post #65
    Scotland Moderator Billy's Avatar
    Join Date
    27th January 2011
    Location
    Scotland
    Age
    63
    Posts
    5,266
    Thanks
    37,382
    Thanked 23,893 times in 3,903 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    Famed war reporter Robert Fisk reaches Syrian "Chemical attack site" concludes "They were not gassed

    https://www.mintpressnews.com/famed-...gassed/240660/


    Robert Fisk’s bombshell first-hand account for the UK Independent runs contrary to nearly every claim circulating in major international press concerning what happened just over week ago on April 7th in an embattled suburb outside Damascus:

    not only has the veteran British journalist found no evidence of a mass chemical attack, but he’s encountered multiple local eyewitnesses who experienced the chaos of that night, but who say the gas attack never happened.

    Fisk is the first Western journalist to reach and report from the site of the alleged chemical weapons attack widely blamed on Assad’s forces. Writing from Douma in eastern Ghouta, Fisk has interviewed a Syrian doctor who works at the hospital shown in one of the well-known videos which purports to depict victims of a chemical attack.


    Click image for larger version

Name:	fisk-syria.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	27.1 KB
ID:	37589
    The Independent: "Middle East Correspondent Robert Fisk in one of the miles of tunnels hacked beneath Douma by prisoners of Syrian rebels." (source: Yara Ismail via the Independent)


    Importantly, the report, published late in the day Monday, is causing a stir among mainstream journalists who–minutes after the Saudi-sponsored jihadist group Jaish al-Islam (Army of Islam) accused the Syrian Army of gassing civilians–began uncritically promoting the “Assad gassed his own people” narrative as an already cemented and “proven” fact based on the mere word a notoriously brutal armed group who itself has admitted to using chemical weapons on the Syrian battlefield in prior years. Also notable is that no journalist or international observer was anywhere near Douma when the purported chemical attack took place.

    Controversy ensued immediately after Fisk’s report, especially as he is among the most recognizable names in the past four decades of Middle East war reporting, having twice won the British Press Awards’ Journalist of the Year prize and as seven-time winner of the British Press Awards’ Foreign Correspondent of the Year (the NY Times has referred to him as “probably the most famous foreign correspondent in Britain” while The Guardian has called him “one of the most famous journalists in the world”). An Arabic speaker, Fisk became famous for being among the few reporters in history to conduct face-to-face interviews with Osama bin Laden, which he did on three occasions between 1993 and 1997.

    Fisk says he was able to walk around and investigate newly liberated Douma without Syrian government or Russian minders (in part this is likely because he has reported from inside Syria going back decades, in war-torn 1982 Hama, for example), and he begins his account as follows:

    This is the story of a town called Douma, a ravaged, stinking place of smashed apartment blocks–and of an underground clinic whose images of suffering allowed three of the Western world’s most powerful nations to bomb Syria last week. There’s even a friendly doctor in a green coat who, when I track him down in the very same clinic, cheerfully tells me that the “gas” videotape which horrified the world– despite all the doubters–is perfectly genuine.

    War stories, however, have a habit of growing darker. For the same 58-year old senior Syrian doctor then adds something profoundly uncomfortable: the patients, he says, were overcome not by gas but by oxygen starvation in the rubbish-filled tunnels and basements in which they lived, on a night of wind and heavy shelling that stirred up a dust storm.

    Fisk goes on to identify the doctor by name – Dr. Assim Rahaibani – which is notable given the fact that all early reporting from Douma typically relied on “unnamed doctors” and anonymous opposition sources for early claims of a chlorine gas attack (lately morphed into an unverified “mixed” chlorine-and-sarin attack).

    The doctor’s testimony is consistent with that of the well-known Syrian opposition group Syrian Observatory for Human Rights (SOHR), which initially reported based on its own pro-rebel sourcing that heavy government bombardment of Douma city resulted in the collapse of homes and underground shelters, causing civilians in hiding to suffocate.

    According to SOHR, which has long been a key go-to source for mainstream media over the course of the war, “70 of them [women and children] have suffered suffocation as a result of the demolition of home basements over them due to the heavy and intense shelling.”

    Though outlets from The Guardian to The Washington Post to The New York Times have quoted SOHR on a near daily basis throughout the past six years of war, the anti-Assad opposition outlet’s reporting of mass asphyxiation due to collapse of shelters has been notably absent from the same publications.

    Watch | Robert Fisk: There was no chlorine attack in Douma
    Watch video via link.


    Fisk details the Syrian doctor’s testimony, who is adamant in his emphasis that civilians were suffocating en masse, and were not gassed:

    It was a short walk to Dr Rahaibani. From the door of his subterranean clinic–“Point 200”, it is called, in the weird geology of this partly-underground city–is a corridor leading downhill where he showed me his lowly hospital and the few beds where a small girl was crying as nurses treated a cut above her eye.

    “I was with my family in the basement of my home three hundred metres from here on the night but all the doctors know what happened. There was a lot of shelling [by government forces] and aircraft were always over Douma at night–but on this night, there was wind and huge dust clouds began to come into the basements and cellars where people lived. People began to arrive here suffering from hypoxia, oxygen loss. Then someone at the door, a “White Helmet”, shouted “Gas!”, and a panic began. People started throwing water over each other. Yes, the video was filmed here, it is genuine, but what you see are people suffering from hypoxia–not gas poisoning.”

    In addition to interviewing a doctor while standing in the very hospital featured in White Helmets footage of the events, Fisk cites the testimonies of multiple locals in the following:

    Before we go any further, readers should be aware that this is not the only story in Douma. There are the many people I talked to amid the ruins of the town who said they had “never believed in” gas stories–which were usually put about, they claimed, by the armed Islamist groups.

    These particular jihadis survived under a blizzard of shellfire by living in other’s people’s homes and in vast, wide tunnels with underground roads carved through the living rock by prisoners with pick-axes on three levels beneath the town. I walked through three of them yesterday, vast corridors of living rock which still contained Russian–yes, Russian–rockets and burned-out cars.

    And further fascinating is that the veteran British war correspondent comes upon local Douma residents who have so long been trapped in an isolated ‘fog of war’ battlefield environment, that they are not even aware of the international importance that the town has played in the US coalition decision to bomb Syria:

    So the story of Douma is thus not just a story of gas–or no gas, as the case may be. It’s about thousands of people who did not opt for evacuation from Douma on buses that left last week, alongside the gunmen with whom they had to live like troglodytes for months in order to survive.

    I walked across this town quite freely yesterday without soldier, policeman or minder to haunt my footsteps, just two Syrian friends, a camera and a notebook. I sometimes had to clamber across 20-foot-high ramparts, up and down almost sheer walls of earth. Happy to see foreigners among them, happier still that the siege is finally over, they are mostly smiling; those whose faces you can see, of course, because a surprising number of Douma’s women wear full-length black hijab.

    …Oddly, after chatting to more than 20 people, I couldn’t find one who showed the slightest interest in Douma’s role in bringing about the Western air attacks.Two actually told me they didn’t know about the connection.

    But it was a strange world I walked into. Two men, Hussam and Nazir Abu Aishe, said they were unaware how many people had been killed in Douma, although the latter admitted he had a cousin “executed by Jaish el-Islam [the Army of Islam] for allegedly being “close to the regime”. They shrugged when I asked about the 43 people said to have died in the infamous Douma attack.


    Concerning the White Helmets, who have played a dubious role throughout the war while presenting themselves as “impartial” and “neutral” rescue workers and film-makers, though known to operate exclusively in al-Qaeda and other jihadist-controlled areas of Syria, Fisk reports the following:

    The White Helmets–the medical first responders already legendary in the West but with some interesting corners to their own story–played a familiar role during the battles. They are partly funded by the [British] Foreign Office and most of the local offices were staffed by Douma men.

    I found their wrecked offices not far from Dr Rahaibani’s clinic. A gas mask had been left outside a food container with one eye-piece pierced and a pile of dirty military camouflage uniforms lay inside one room. Planted, I asked myself? I doubt it. The place was heaped with capsules, broken medical equipment and files, bedding and mattresses.

    Of course we must hear their side of the story, but it will not happen here: a woman told us that every member of the White Helmets in Douma abandoned their main headquarters and chose to take the government-organised and Russian-protected buses to the rebel province of Idlib with the armed groups when the final truce was agreed.

    And Fisk further narrates the strangeness of some of the reporting now happening far outside of Douma which flatly contradicts the testimonies of civilians still inside Douma that he encounters:

    How could it be that Douma refugees who had reached camps in Turkey were already describing a gas attack which no-one in Douma today seemed to recall? It did occur to me, once I was walking for more than a mile through these wretched prisoner-groined tunnels, that the citizens of Douma lived so isolated from each other for so long that “news” in our sense of the word simply had no meaning to them.

    Syria doesn’t cut it as Jeffersonian democracy–as I cynically like to tell my Arab colleagues–and it is indeed a ruthless dictatorship, but that couldn’t cow these people, happy to see foreigners among them, from reacting with a few words of truth. So what were they telling me?

    They talked about the Islamists under whom they had lived. They talked about how the armed groups had stolen civilian homes to avoid the Syrian government and Russian bombing. The Jaish el-Islam had burned their offices before they left, but the massive buildings inside the security zones they created had almost all been sandwiched to the ground by air strikes. A Syrian colonel I came across behind one of these buildings asked if I wanted to see how deep the tunnels were. I stopped after well over a mile when he cryptically observed that “this tunnel might reach as far as Britain”. Ah yes, Ms May, I remembered, whose air strikes had been so intimately connected to this place of tunnels and dust. And gas?

    For a prime example of what Fisk references as refugees in Turkey “already describing a gas attack which no-one in Douma seemed to recall…” CNN aired a segment from one such refugee camp which is absolutely bizarre and stunning in its claims.

    During the segment which aired “hours after” the US-led airstrikes on Damascus, CNN’s Arwa Damon began sniffing a 7-year-old Syrian girl’s backpack while concluding, “I mean there’s definitely something that stings…” – with the implication that empirical proof had been found of government chemical weapons use against the little girl and her family.


    And in the full segment, Damon attempts to subtly introduce the idea of a nerve agent used against the family (though initial claims were widely reported to be chlorine) by awkwardly including the account of the girl’s escape from Douma: “She could barely breathe… she felt as if her entire nerves basically released.”


    Though it’s unclear what the strange phrasing of “her entire nerves basically released” actually means, CNN’s Arwa Damon is ultimately claiming to be able to safely and comfortably handle and sniff a backpack which contains residual sarin and chlorine agents, while simultaneously presenting the backpack as “proof” of a chemical attack which happened a week prior (to say nothing the clearly unscientific and bogus nature all of the above).

    Notably, in addition to Fisk’s bombshell report filed from ground zero of the claimed chemical attack in Douma, cable network One America News has also issued a report from on the ground in the newly liberated town, finding “no evidence” – in its words – that a chemical attack took place there.


    Robert Fisk’s report for The Independent and the One America News segment constitute the first major international media reports from the location of the alleged chemical attack. But it will be interesting to see the extent to which international chemical and weapons experts either validate or refute their conclusions once the site is inspected.

    Meanwhile, the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) Fact-Finding Mission (FFM) team arrived in Damascus on Saturday, April 14th – after the US-led overnight strikes which primarily hit government buildings in the capital.

    https://www.mintpressnews.com/famed-...gassed/240660/
    When you express from a fearful heart in the now moment, You create a fearful future.
    When you express from a loving heart in the now moment, You create a loving future.

    Have no fear, Be aware and live your lives journey from a compassionate caring nurturing heart to manifest a compassionate caring nurturing future. Billyji


    Peace

  10. The Following 11 Users Say Thank You to Billy For This Post:

    Baby Steps (19th April 2018), Cidersomerset (18th April 2018), Foxie Loxie (18th April 2018), greybeard (18th April 2018), happyuk (18th April 2018), Hervé (18th April 2018), KiwiElf (18th April 2018), latte (19th April 2018), Orph (18th April 2018), Searcher (19th April 2018), Tintin Quarantino (19th April 2018)

  11. Link to Post #66
    France Administrator Hervé's Avatar
    Join Date
    7th March 2011
    Location
    Brittany
    Posts
    14,166
    Thanks
    46,921
    Thanked 73,640 times in 12,923 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    Doing Assad's job: OPCW report says Syria planned to demolish building US missiles destroyed

    Marko Marjanović
    Checkpoint Asia
    Mon, 16 Apr 2018 12:14 UTC


    No protective gear — Apparently government soldier has no reason to fear sarin/chlorine release

    A 2017 OPCW report says Syrians were cooperating in the process of demolishing the Barzah facility -- the main target of Trump's attack. Instead Trump fired seventy-six $1.9 million Tomahawks at them (so says Pentagon).

    The main target of Trump's latest Syria strike that, according to the US no fewer than 76 of the 105 total cruise missiles, were fired at - was going to be demolished anyway:
    "In a report issued just in March of this year, OPCW confirms the Syrian government was cooperating in the process of demolishing the facility."
    Quote Will Porter‏ @WKPAnCap Apr 14

    [1/4] I'm finding some odd stuff in OPCW documents pertaining to the Barzah facility, part of Syria's Scientific Studies & Research Center (SSRC). Trump admin. officials said this facility was at the "heart" of Syrian CW program; it was included in last night's strikes.

    4 replies 50 retweets 49 likes

    Will Porter‏ @WKPAnCap Apr 14

    [2/4] Yet the OPCW inspected Barzah twice in 2017--most recently last Nov--and found nothing out of the norm. In a report issued just in Mar. of this year, OPCW confirms the Syrian govt was cooperating in the process of demolishing the facility. (p.2 of https://www.opcw.org/fileadmin/OPCW/EC/87/en/ec87dg21_e_.pdf …)

    1 reply 25 retweets 33 likes


    Will Porter‏ @WKPAnCap Apr 14

    [3/4] Of Syria's former 27 CW-related facilities, the Barzah and Jamrayah compounds were the last 2 standing (before last night). Deal in 2013 had all other declared facilities destroyed or decommissioned.

    2 replies 11 retweets 15 likes


    Will Porter‏ @WKPAnCap

    [4/4] So which is it? Was Barzah clean and set to be demolished with Syrian cooperation, or was it the heart of an ongoing rogue CW program?


    6:20 PM - 14 Apr 2018
    3 replies 11 retweets 22 likes
    Since Syria gave up its chemical weapons under a 2013 deal, Barzah lost its mission. The purpose of the complex could have been changed but the OPCW preferred demolition and Damascus said okay and cooperated.

    So not only was the building being inspected regularly but it was going to be torn down, shortly, by the Syrians themselves.

    Instead the US claims it fired $150 million worth of flying bombs at it.

    ==================================================

    I am very unsure if this is some kind of joke or a multilayered "Double Entendre"...

    Because it is highly reminiscent of other buildings that were slated for demolition and got bombed for maximum profits for a bunch of people... you know... 9/11 and Silverstein and people shorting on airlines stock/shares and the Deutsche Bank and the Military Industrial Complexes and...

    With that, I am having a hard time determining who's the joker: Trump? Assad? Both?

    Or, to put it in other words,: who is sending a message to whom?

    The conclusion that's being funneled in and out is that "they" are all in cahoots!
    Last edited by Hervé; 18th April 2018 at 15:27.
    "La réalité est un rêve que l'on fait atterrir" San Antonio AKA F. Dard

    Troll-hood motto: Never, ever, however, whatsoever, to anyone, a point concede.

  12. The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to Hervé For This Post:

    avid (18th April 2018), Billy (19th April 2018), Cidersomerset (18th April 2018), Foxie Loxie (18th April 2018), greybeard (18th April 2018), KiwiElf (18th April 2018), latte (19th April 2018), Searcher (18th April 2018), Tintin Quarantino (19th April 2018)

  13. Link to Post #67
    Scotland Avalon Member greybeard's Avatar
    Join Date
    17th March 2010
    Location
    Inverness-----Scotland
    Age
    72
    Posts
    7,554
    Thanks
    19,157
    Thanked 40,744 times in 6,443 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    Thanks for your posts Herve and the latest from Billy.
    Just maybe other journalists will get on board with the story published by The Independent.
    To go and bomb without waiting for evidence of Syrian guilt in this is madness.
    The Governments will of course be in denial.

    Chris

    Ps and of course Cidersomerset posts.
    Last edited by greybeard; 18th April 2018 at 17:24.
    A charity to help African Children become self sufficient. :attention:

    http://www.learningtoolsforselfdevelopment.co.uk/

    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

  14. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to greybeard For This Post:

    avid (18th April 2018), Billy (19th April 2018), Cidersomerset (18th April 2018), DNA (Yesterday), Foxie Loxie (18th April 2018), happyuk (18th April 2018)

  15. Link to Post #68
    Avalon Member
    Join Date
    5th January 2011
    Posts
    333
    Thanks
    372
    Thanked 2,400 times in 312 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    I have a question that i don't think has been asked here: how can over 100 cruise missiles in the middle of the night hit Syria and no one killed? Did everybody know it was going to happen?
    Last edited by ramus; 19th April 2018 at 16:00.

  16. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to ramus For This Post:

    Billy (19th April 2018), DNA (Yesterday), Hervé (18th April 2018), KiwiElf (18th April 2018), shaberon (18th April 2018)

  17. Link to Post #69
    UK Avalon Member Cidersomerset's Avatar
    Join Date
    16th May 2011
    Location
    Bridgwater somerset UK
    Age
    57
    Posts
    21,736
    Thanks
    32,002
    Thanked 75,017 times in 18,060 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    'Muddying the waters': BBC slams expert for questioning evidence of Douma attack



    Published on 18 Apr 2018...RT...
    The lack of concrete proof that the attack took place has been raised by some officials
    & academics. But such questions are often dismissed, for example, in the BBC interview.
    READ MORE: https://on.rt.com/93h3

    ================================================== ==

    Attacked staged by the rebels....

    US journalists find no evidence of chemical use in Syria

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4o7bdqgHqiI
    Published on 17 Apr 2018..RT...
    Chemical weapons inspectors from the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons
    have entered Douma, to investigate a reported chemical weapons attack in the Syrian town.
    Meanwhile, American journalists who visited the area have found no traces of poisonous
    substances. RT’s Yulia Shapovalova has this report.

    ================================================== =

    US, UK & France face backlash following Syria strike

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGW0cjX7Mzg
    Published on 17 Apr 2018
    London, Paris and Washington are facing tough questions following their strikes in
    Syria after an alleged chemical attack. Former democratic congressman Jim Moran
    joins RT America’s Ed Schultz to discuss the potential impact of the strikes ahead of
    the OPCW’s findings.
    Last edited by Cidersomerset; 18th April 2018 at 17:49.

  18. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Cidersomerset For This Post:

    Billy (19th April 2018), DNA (Yesterday), Foxie Loxie (18th April 2018), KiwiElf (18th April 2018), Searcher (19th April 2018)

  19. Link to Post #70
    United States Avalon Member Foxie Loxie's Avatar
    Join Date
    20th September 2015
    Location
    Central NY
    Age
    73
    Posts
    2,188
    Thanks
    51,922
    Thanked 11,666 times in 2,076 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    ramus....I guess we have to figure out exactly "who" was in cahoots!!

  20. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Foxie Loxie For This Post:

    Billy (19th April 2018), Cidersomerset (18th April 2018), DNA (Yesterday), KiwiElf (18th April 2018), ramus (18th April 2018)

  21. Link to Post #71
    UK Avalon Member Cidersomerset's Avatar
    Join Date
    16th May 2011
    Location
    Bridgwater somerset UK
    Age
    57
    Posts
    21,736
    Thanks
    32,002
    Thanked 75,017 times in 18,060 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    After visiting Douma, western media begin to question ‘gas attack’ narrative


    Published on 18 Apr 2018
    More doubts have been raised over this footage filmed by the White Helmets
    group in a local hospital. The video claims to show the aftermath of the chemical
    attack. But RT Arabic visited that very hospital in Douma and talked with doctors
    and locals as well. They described what happened on the 7th of April, claiming
    they saw no toxic agents used there. READ MORE: https://on.rt.com/93hh

    ================================================

    Won’t pass, won’t work, likely to make things worse’ – Ron Paul on military force limitation

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOYEipdeRYs
    Published on 18 Apr 2018
    Following the weekend bombing raids in Syria, a bipartisan group of US Senators
    has unveiled new legislation, aiming to limit the White House's power to continue
    its global war on terror. READ MORE: https://on.rt.com/93j5





    Sources: Pompeo secretly met with Kim Jong Un

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zf7yZQ_XVNU
    Published on 17 Apr 2018..CNN.
    CIA Director Mike Pompeo traveled to North Korea over Easter weekend for a
    meeting with leader Kim Jong Un, sources confirmed to CNN.
    Last edited by Cidersomerset; 18th April 2018 at 18:22.

  22. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Cidersomerset For This Post:

    Billy (19th April 2018), DNA (Yesterday), Foxie Loxie (18th April 2018), KiwiElf (18th April 2018)

  23. Link to Post #72
    France Administrator Hervé's Avatar
    Join Date
    7th March 2011
    Location
    Brittany
    Posts
    14,166
    Thanks
    46,921
    Thanked 73,640 times in 12,923 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    Quote Posted by ramus (here)
    I have a question that i don't think has been asked here: how can over 100 cruise missiles in the middle or the night hit Syria and no one killed? Did everybody know it was going to happen?
    Right, that's the question I ended up asking myself:

    Quote Posted by Hervé (here)
    [...]
    The conclusion that's being funneled in and out is that "they" are all in cahoots!
    "La réalité est un rêve que l'on fait atterrir" San Antonio AKA F. Dard

    Troll-hood motto: Never, ever, however, whatsoever, to anyone, a point concede.

  24. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to Hervé For This Post:

    avid (18th April 2018), Baby Steps (18th April 2018), Billy (19th April 2018), DNA (Yesterday), Foxie Loxie (19th April 2018), KiwiElf (18th April 2018), ramus (19th April 2018)

  25. Link to Post #73
    United States Avalon Member
    Join Date
    1st April 2016
    Posts
    841
    Thanks
    589
    Thanked 2,538 times in 705 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    Quote Posted by ramus (here)
    I have a question that i don't think has been asked here: how can over 100 cruise missiles in the middle or the night hit Syria and no one killed? Did everybody know it was going to happen?
    Yes, you are correct. This thing was simply "allowed" by Russia, who designated the targets. Over 70 of the missiles were intercepted. Nothing much happened, except profit for Raytheon and Boeing, who will return the favor by pushing for more use of their wares.

  26. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to shaberon For This Post:

    avid (18th April 2018), Baby Steps (18th April 2018), DNA (Yesterday), Foxie Loxie (19th April 2018), KiwiElf (18th April 2018), ramus (19th April 2018), Tintin Quarantino (19th April 2018)

  27. Link to Post #74
    UK Avalon Member Tintin Quarantino's Avatar
    Join Date
    3rd June 2017
    Location
    Trowbridge/Bath - UK
    Age
    48
    Posts
    411
    Thanks
    2,132
    Thanked 2,291 times in 398 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    If you can stomach it of course - and it would take an heroic effort indeed not to retch whilst reading it (think also 911 Commission report for a similar response, and that which the late George Carlin referred to as an 'involuntary protein spill') - Craig Murray presents the UK government's, whatever that is really comprised of, not- quite-as-legal-as-you-may-have-been-led-to-believe justification for the bombings (no mention of a request from Israel here then, to effect it, either I see ).

    Whilst reading it I am fairly certain that you, as I was, will be staggered at the mountainous pile of total JIC likely sponsored and drafted utter drivel this actually is. A closely related parlance would be 'cooking the books' or 'fiddling the figures' - lying in other words.

    If you'd prefer not to torture yourself with the deep-state's complete hogwash you can always skip to the good bits that follow on in this article.

    I am not sure enjoy is quite the right word to use here, but, nevertheless, here it is......

    (Tintin Q)

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    "So the British government sets up its own “three tests” which have no legal standing and are entirely a British concoction, yet still manages to fail them."

    The British Government’s Legal Justification for Bombing is Entirely False and Without Merit

    15 Apr, 2018 in Uncategorized by craig https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archi...without-merit/

    UPDATE Perhaps you will forgive me for pointing out that the argument in the legal opinion by Professor Dapo Akande of Oxford University, published today by the Labour Party, is identical in every respect and in detail to the analysis I published yesterday. So for all the trolls who claimed I do not know international law…

    I have published Prof Akande’s summary at the end of this post.

    Theresa May has issued a long legal justification for UK participation in an attack on a sovereign state. This is so flawed as to be totally worthless. It specifically claims as customary international law practices which are rejected by a large majority of states and therefore cannot be customary international law. It is therefore secondary and of no consequence that the facts and interpretations the argument cites in this particular case are erroneous, but it so happens they are indeed absolutely erroneous.

    Let me put before you the government’s legal case in full:

    1.This is the Government’s position on the legality of UK military action to alleviate the extreme humanitarian suffering of the Syrian people by degrading the Syrian regime’s chemical weapons capability and deterring their further use, following the chemical weapons attack in Douma on 7 April 2018.

    2.The Syrian regime has been killing its own people for seven years. Its use of chemical weapons, which has exacerbated the human suffering, is a serious crime of international concern, as a breach of the customary international law prohibition on the use of chemical weapons, and amounts to a war crime and a crime against humanity.

    3.The UK is permitted under international law, on an exceptional basis, to take measures in order to alleviate overwhelming humanitarian suffering. The legal basis for the use of force is humanitarian intervention, which requires three conditions to be met:

    (i) there is convincing evidence, generally accepted by the international community as a whole, of extreme humanitarian distress on a large scale, requiring immediate and urgent relief;

    (ii) it must be objectively clear that there is no practicable alternative to the use of force if lives are to be saved; and

    (iii) the proposed use of force must be necessary and proportionate to the aim of relief of humanitarian suffering and must be strictly limited in time and in scope to this aim (i.e. the minimum necessary to achieve that end and for no other purpose).

    4.The UK considers that military action met the requirements of humanitarian intervention in the circumstances of the present case:

    (i) The Syrian regime has been using chemical weapons since 2013. The attack in Eastern Damascus on 21 August 2013 left over 800 people dead. The Syrian regime failed to implement its commitment in 2013 to ensure the destruction of its chemical weapons capability. The chemical weapons attack in Khan Sheikhoun in April 2017 killed approximately 80 people and left hundreds more injured. The recent attack in Douma has killed up to 75 people, and injured over 500 people. Over 400,000 people have now died over the course of the conflict in Syria, the vast majority civilians. Over half of the Syrian population has been displaced, with over 13 million people in need of humanitarian assistance. The repeated, lethal use of chemical weapons by the Syrian regime constitutes a war crime and a crime against humanity. On the basis of what we know about the Syrian regime’s pattern of use of chemical weapons to date, it was highly likely that the regime would seek to use chemical weapons again, leading to further suffering and loss of civilian life as well as the continued displacement of the civilian population.

    (ii) Actions by the UK and its international partners to alleviate the humanitarian suffering caused by the use of chemical weapons by the Syrian regime at the UN Security Council have been repeatedly blocked by the regime’s and its allies’ disregard for international norms, including the international law prohibition on the use of chemical weapons. This last week, Russia vetoed yet another resolution in the Security Council, thwarting the establishment of an impartial investigative mechanism. Since 2013, neither diplomatic action, tough sanctions, nor the US strikes against the Shayrat airbase in April 2017 have sufficiently degraded Syrian chemical weapons capability or deterred the Syrian regime from causing extreme humanitarian distress on a large scale through its persistent use of chemical weapons. There was no practicable alternative to the truly exceptional use of force to degrade the Syrian regime’s chemical weapons capability and deter their further use by the Syrian regime in order to alleviate humanitarian suffering.

    (iii) In these circumstances, and as an exceptional measure on grounds of overwhelming humanitarian necessity, military intervention to strike carefully considered, specifically identified targets in order effectively to alleviate humanitarian distress by degrading the Syrian regime’s chemical weapons capability and deterring further chemical weapons attacks was necessary and proportionate and therefore legally justifiable. Such an intervention was directed exclusively to averting a humanitarian catastrophe caused by the Syrian regime’s use of chemical weapons, and the action was the minimum judged necessary for that purpose.

    14 April 2018


    The first thing to note is that this “legal argument” cites no authority. It does not quote the UN Charter, any Security Council Resolution or any international treaty or agreement of any kind which justifies this action. This is because there is absolutely nothing which can be quoted – all the relevant texts say that an attack on another state is illegal without authorisation of the UN Security Council under Chapter VII of the UN Charter.

    Nor does the government quote any judgement of the International Court of Justice, International Criminal Court or any other international legal authority. This is important because rather than any treatment, the government makes a specific claim its actions are justified by customary international law, which means accepted state practice. But the existence of such state practice is usually proven through existing court judgements, and there are no judgements that endorse the approach taken by the government in its argument.

    The three “tests” set out under para 3 as to what is permitted under international law are not in fact a statement of anything other than the UK’s own position. These “tests” are specifically quoted by Ola Engdahl in Bailliet and Larsen (ed) “Promoting Peace Through International Law” (Oxford University Press 2015). Engdahl notes:

    "The UK position, that it is permitted to take coercive action under a doctrine of humanitarian intervention when certain conditions are met, is a minority view and does not reflect lex data on the prohibition of the use of force in international relations as expressed in article 2(4) of the UN Charter."

    That is undeniably true, and as it is equally undeniably true that a minority view cannot be customary international law, the British government position is utterly devoid of merit.

    The Government argument is a classic statement of the doctrine of “liberal intervention”, which is of course the mantra adopted by neo-conservatives over the last 30 years to justify resource grabs. It is not in any way accepted as customary international law. It is a doctrine opposed by a very large number of states, and certainly by the great majority of African, South American and Asian states. (African states have occasionally advocated the idea that UN Security Council authorisation may be replaced by the endorsement of a UN recognised regional authority such as ECOWAS or the African Union. This was the Nigerian position over Liberia 20 years ago. The Security Council authorised ECOWAS action anyway, so no discord arose. The current Nigerian government does not support intervention without security council authorisation).

    The examples of “liberal intervention” most commonly used by its advocates are Sierra Leone and Libya. My book “The Catholic Orangemen of Togo” details my experiences as UK Representative at the Sierra Leone peace talks, and I hope will convince you that the accepted story of that war is a lie. Libya too has been a disaster, and it is not a precedent for the government’s legal argument as the western forces employed were operating under cover of a UN Security Council Resolution authorising force, albeit only to enforce a no fly zone.

    In fact, if the British government were to offer examples of state practice to attempt to prove that the doctrine it outlines is indeed customary international law, the most appropriate recent examples are Russian military intervention in Ukraine and Georgia. I oppose those Russian interventions as I oppose the UK/US/French actions now. It is not a question of “sides” it is a question of the illegality of military action against other states.

    The rest of the government’s argument is entirely hypothetical, because as the liberal intervention doctrine is not customary international law these arguments cannot justify intervention.

    But the evidence that Assad used chemical weapons against Douma is non-existent, and the OPCW did not conclude that the Assad government was responsible for the attack on Khan Sheikhoun. There is no evidence whatsoever that military action was urgently required to avert another such “immediate” attack. Nor is it true that the UK’s analysis of the situation is “generally accepted” by the international community, as witness China and Russia voting together in the Security Council yesterday to condemn the attack.

    So the British government sets up its own “three tests” which have no legal standing and are entirely a British concoction, yet still manages to fail them.

    Dapo Akande, Professor of Public International Law, Oxford University, gave this opinion for the Labour Party…

    In the opinion I reach the following conclusions:

    1. Contrary to the position of the government, neither the UN charter nor customary international law permits military action on the basis of the doctrine of humanitarian intervention. There is very little support by states for such an exception to the prohibition of the use of force. The UK is one of very few states that advocates for such a legal principle but the vast majority of states have explicitly rejected it.

    2. The legal position advanced by the government ignores the structure of the international law rules relating to the use of force, in particular, because a customary international law rule does not prevail over the rule in the United Nations charter prohibiting the use of force. To accept the position advocated by the government would be to undermine the supremacy of the UN charter.

    3. Even if there was a doctrine of humanitarian intervention in international law, the strikes against Syria would not appear to meet the tests set out by the government. The action taken by the government was not directed at bringing “immediate and urgent relief” with regard to the specific evil it sought to prevent, and was taken before the inspectors from the Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons were able to reach the affected area.

    4. If the position taken by the government were to be accepted by states globally, it would allow for individual assessments of when force was necessary to achieve humanitarian ends, with the risk of abuse. It is because of the humanitarian suffering that will ensue from such abusive uses of force, that other states and many scholars have been reluctant to endorse the doctrine of humanitarian action.
    Last edited by Tintin Quarantino; 19th April 2018 at 13:03.
    “If a man does not keep pace with [fall into line with] his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music which he hears, however measured or far away.” - Thoreau

  28. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Tintin Quarantino For This Post:

    avid (19th April 2018), Baby Steps (19th April 2018), DNA (Yesterday), Foxie Loxie (19th April 2018), Jayke (19th April 2018)

  29. Link to Post #75
    UK Avalon Member Tintin Quarantino's Avatar
    Join Date
    3rd June 2017
    Location
    Trowbridge/Bath - UK
    Age
    48
    Posts
    411
    Thanks
    2,132
    Thanked 2,291 times in 398 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    @Baby Steps: I'm taking the liberty of suggesting that folk absolutely do visit your excellent thread here: http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...ical-info-dump for some good earlier in the story information.

    I was particularly grabbed by the outline in your post #3 there relating to the banking infrastructure in Syria - very interesting indeed, and provides another of the many layers of 'reasons' why this is happening, at all.

    I notice that you also cite Vanessa Beeley, who I have done on many occasions as well, as she is just about the most reliable source 'on the ground'.

    She's been on the case for the best part of 4 years now and just about everything that she faithfully and honestly reports absolutely contradicts the mainstream narrative, several-fold
    Last edited by Tintin Quarantino; 19th April 2018 at 14:00.
    “If a man does not keep pace with [fall into line with] his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music which he hears, however measured or far away.” - Thoreau

  30. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Tintin Quarantino For This Post:

    Baby Steps (19th April 2018), Cidersomerset (Yesterday), DNA (Yesterday), Foxie Loxie (19th April 2018), Satori (19th April 2018)

  31. Link to Post #76
    UK Avalon Member Cidersomerset's Avatar
    Join Date
    16th May 2011
    Location
    Bridgwater somerset UK
    Age
    57
    Posts
    21,736
    Thanks
    32,002
    Thanked 75,017 times in 18,060 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    This weeks dot connector is mainly about Douma, Salisbury and gives his views on
    the BS....David has been commenting on this for years as well.


    The Warmongering Media - Spineless, Gutless, Clueless -
    The David Icke Dot-Connector Videocast



    Published on 20 Apr 2018
    Last edited by Cidersomerset; Yesterday at 18:02.

  32. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Cidersomerset For This Post:

    DNA (Yesterday), Foxie Loxie (Yesterday)

  33. Link to Post #77
    UK Avalon Member Cidersomerset's Avatar
    Join Date
    16th May 2011
    Location
    Bridgwater somerset UK
    Age
    57
    Posts
    21,736
    Thanks
    32,002
    Thanked 75,017 times in 18,060 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    ‘Optimistic’ to believe the truth on Syria will come out – former diplomat

    RT America


    Published on 19 Apr 2018
    RT America’s Ed Schultz is joined by former US diplomat Jim Jatras, to discuss the shifting
    narrative surrounding the alleged chemical attack in Douma, Syria. In the aftermath, Western
    and Eastern media are putting forward competing narratives. Meanwhile, Jatras points out a
    ‘deliberate decision was made’ for the resulting strikes by the United States, France, and the
    United Kingdom to result in a zero casualty count.

    ================================================== =
    ================================================== =

    'They gave dates & cookies to kids at Douma hospital' – father of ‘chem attack’ victim

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPFaEG9vJT4

    Published on 19 Apr 2018
    A correspondent from the Russia 24 TV channel claims to have found a Syrian boy
    seen in the White Helmets' footage, said to show the aftermath of an alleged
    chemical attack. READ MORE: on.rt.com/93lf

    ================================================== =
    ================================================== =

    Syrian Boy in White Helmets Video Reveals TRUTH

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rc3ZSNy3BVI
    Published on 19 Apr 2018 ..Lift the Veil ( 19 min segment)...
    Last edited by Cidersomerset; Yesterday at 21:20.

  34. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Cidersomerset For This Post:

    DNA (Yesterday), Foxie Loxie (Yesterday)

  35. Link to Post #78
    UK Avalon Member Cidersomerset's Avatar
    Join Date
    16th May 2011
    Location
    Bridgwater somerset UK
    Age
    57
    Posts
    21,736
    Thanks
    32,002
    Thanked 75,017 times in 18,060 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    Former UK Ambassador Reveals Truth About Syria - With Special Guest Peter Ford

    RonPaulLibertyReport


    Streamed live on 19 Apr 2018
    Former UK Ambassador to Syria Peter Ford joins today's Liberty Report to share his
    vast experience in the region. He has notably deviated from the government/media
    narrative about the alleged Assad gas attack. How likely is it that Assad used gas?
    Why are inspectors being prevented from visiting the site? How is the "official
    narrative" holding up to increasing scrutiny?
    Last edited by Cidersomerset; Yesterday at 21:37.

  36. The Following User Says Thank You to Cidersomerset For This Post:

    DNA (Yesterday)

  37. Link to Post #79
    UK Avalon Member Cidersomerset's Avatar
    Join Date
    16th May 2011
    Location
    Bridgwater somerset UK
    Age
    57
    Posts
    21,736
    Thanks
    32,002
    Thanked 75,017 times in 18,060 posts

    Default Re: Syria air strikes: US and allies attack [alleged] chemical weapons sites...14/4/18

    Despite Evidence To The Contrary, MSM Keeps Lying About Chemical Attacks In Syria



    Published on 19 Apr 2018

    Owen Shroyer reveals how the television news, AKA the Project Mockingbird
    media, has been lying to the American public for years to gain support for
    aggressive foreign policy implementation.

  38. The Following User Says Thank You to Cidersomerset For This Post:

    DNA (Yesterday)

+ Reply to Thread
Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst 1 4

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts