High Horses Out of the Art Bell Tribute Thread.

[A Voice from the Mountains]

[Mod Note: I have moved the following 8 posts out of the thread My Personal Tribute to Art Bell As a Very Long Time Listener Part 1 as being off-topic derailments, Hervé]

Posted by ArizonaSilver (here)
CONS FOR ART BELL:

But even in the zenith of my faith in Art Bell, I began to feel frustration. Why oh why did Art Bell keep showcasing Ed Dames, the so-called Remote Viewer who sold remote viewing instructional kits? The man reminds me much of David Wilcock today. So many wild stories, and always negative.

And always wrong, too, but I don't remember Art ever really calling him on it. And then when George Noory took over he kept inviting the guy back. He constantly made insane predictions that never came true, like an incoming virus from space that would soon turn people into zombies.

Ed claimed that the final apocalypse of humankind would come when gay people were legally allowed to marry in churches. This was an appalling attack on gay people, but Art let it slide without saying a word. Only in a later show did Art feel obligated to make a comment distancing himself from the earlier conversation

That's because the culture has changed enormously since the 1990's and early 2000's, and not necessarily for the better. Back then there was no need to apologize for such things being said because it was the cultural norm that most people did not see a necessity for gay people to have legal recognition for participating in a religious institution that had nothing to do with them. Today people can be very offended about it if they want, but you can't project today's morals back into the past where they did not exist. That's a cardinal violation of historical understanding of events. I understand that the legal arguments became convoluted but that's why it ended up coming down to a vote in many cases, until the Supreme Court weighed in. But consider, that now they are teaching Kindergarteners in Washington State that gender is purely a social construct and they can be whatever gender they want. Are Kindergarteners really prepared to hear this kind of thing, and do you really even believe that this is true in the first place? For boys, when they're old enough for this surgery (which can be done while they're still minors), we're talking about penises being cut off that can never be replaced if they happen to change their minds, and some other kind of bodily mutilation to give girls "penises" that can also cause irreparable damage. And there are enormous rates of regret and people wishing they had never gone through these surgeries, not to mention the insane suicide rates approaching 50%. To be honest I don't even like talking about such things because it makes me cringe even thinking about this stuff, but if we aren't clear about what is going on here then we can't have an intelligent discussion on if this is really the direction we want our society to go in, because there are some people out there with real mental problems and feeding them this stuff from an early age is causing a LOT of anguish. I realize that people think they are being compassionate and kind-hearted but really they are not. To me it seems exactly like spoiling a child with nothing but junk food and then being appalled when someone points out that the child is obese and dying from diabetes. It is not always compassionate to feed into obviously unhealthy behaviors. It is a sign of being way too soft and of our society collapsing from utter insanity.

Laura found this appalling and lashed out at him personally, lost over 22 sponsors and made a rather jaded apology to save her show.

Her viewership also increased by 20%. You are conflating the politically correct culture of corporate America with how the everyday American thinks and feels about these issues, and political correctness reached its high-water mark under Obama. It's trending a decline now and you can expect more of this.


I didn't see you mention Art's wife either. I don't remember all the details but they're out there, and they're suspicious. He was already talking to his next wife before his then-current one died under mysterious circumstances. The one he married next had all semblances of a mail-order bride from the Philippines. The only reason I would even have any interest in this aspect of his life is that it would fit with a certain pattern of blackmail/grooming, for which Art would have been an obvious target by the "deep state" given the topics he covered nightly. He was indeed a pioneer in many of those areas in talk radio, and that would be even more of a reason to have some form of control over him. So I'll just leave that idea dangling, because the guy is dead and gone at this point and I'll let him rest in peace.

[ArizonaSilver]

I don't want to start fighting with people the day I post something that meant a lot to me. But you equated CIVIL MARRIAGE before the LAW with religious marriage. Not the same. If a church does not wish to marry a gay couple, the church does not have to. This is not a religious matter, it is a civil rights matter. No religious organization is being forced to marry any gay people, but gay people can be married legally.

Secondly, there is no connection between gay people and transgenders except that both groups want equal civil rights in the USA. Transgenders believe that they were born the wrong sex. That is a very different issue from simply becoming sexually aware in adolescense and discovering that you only desire the same sex. Many gay people at that point commit suicide. This is not a joyous self discovery. But beyond repressing it, or marrying the opposite sex and then having secret gay affairs, there is not much choice except to accept and love yourself as you are and to then live an ethical caring life within that construct. As for your assertion that kindergardeners are being force fed transgender propaganda, all my grandkids live in the San Francisco Bay Area, which is very liberal. I checked with my daughter. None of the 4 are being taught such nonsense. Are you sure this isn't the wild imagination of some right wing fear monger? Parents would put up such a stink that such a program would be shut down immediately.

Thirdly, if you admire Laura Ingraham, that is your business. Many people in the USA are filled with hate. Did I ever think people in this nation would stoop so low to go after teens who survived a mass murder simply because these teens asked "adults" to do something meaningful (beside thoughts and prayers) to stop this madness? How can any moral compassionate decent person support Laura and trash the kids?

I also will not even debate the secret feelings of Art Bell for Ramona Bell. I find conspiracy theories on this subject reprehensible. But that's my right. The end.

[A Voice from the Mountains]

Posted by ArizonaSilver (here)
I don't want to start fighting with people the day I post something that meant a lot to me. But you equated CIVIL MARRIAGE before the LAW with religious marriage. Not the same. If a church does not wish to marry a gay couple, the church does not have to. This is not a religious matter, it is a civil rights matter. No religious organization is being forced to marry any gay people, but gay people can be married legally.

I'm not here to debate gay marriage. I was just pointing out that there is no logic in judging Art Bell for what he did or didn't say ~20 years ago by the cultural narrative of today. It's a form of anachronism that historians are taught to avoid. In other words you will not properly understand the past if you do not view it in the context of its own time. More has changed in the last 20 years than you may remember.

As for your assertion that kindergardeners are being force fed transgender propaganda, all my grandkids live in the San Francisco Bay Area, which is very liberal. I checked with my daughter. None of the 4 are being taught such nonsense. Are you sure this isn't the wild imagination of some right wing fear monger? Parents would put up such a stink that such a program would be shut down immediately.

Read:

By fall 2017 Washington state public schools will begin teaching gender expression to kindergarteners under newly-approved health education learning standards that designate sexual health a “core idea” of public K-12 education.

While some aspects of sexual health aren’t taught K-12 (HIV prevention begins in fourth grade), one component of sexual health titled “Self-Identity” begins in kindergarten, where students will be expected to “Understand there are many ways to express gender.”

The state’s health education glossary defines gender as “A social construct based on emotional, behavioral, and cultural characteristics attached to a person’s assigned biological sex.” Gender expression, meanwhile, is defined as “The way someone outwardly expresses their gender.”

These definitions differ from the state’s definition of “biological sex”: “Based on chromosomes, hormones, and internal and external anatomy.”

Nathan Olson, a communications manager for the statewide Office of Superintendent of Public Instruction (OSPI), told The Daily Caller that the glossary “was developed to support classroom instruction.” The new standards were finalized in March but OSPI has yet to issue a press release informing the public of the changes.

As part of an aspect of sexual health titled “Healthy Relationships,” kindergarteners will learn to distinguish between “safe and unwanted touch.” They will also learn to “Recognize people have the right to refuse giving or receiving unwanted touch.” OSPI did not answer a question from TheDC about whether this lesson plan amounts to teaching consent to kindergarteners.

By third grade, students will be expected to “Explain that gender roles can vary considerably” and “Understand [the] importance of treating others with respect regarding gender identity,” as part of the “Self-Identity” component of sexual health.

Gender identity is defined by the state as “Someone’s inner sense of their gender.”

“The standards don’t define ‘gender spectrum.’ But self-identity is a key component,” Olson said when TheDC asked whether learning that gender is a “spectrum” is considered part of learning about “gender identity.” Last month, Fox News’ Todd Starnes described a Virginia county’s lesson plans on gender spectrum as “the idea that there’s no such thing as 100 percent boys or 100 percent girls.”

http://dailycaller.com/2016/06/01/wa...indergartners/

You are right, there was major backlash against this kind of program. But these parents better be careful, because in 20 more years they may be seen as hateful bigots for opposing this curriculum.

Parents furious over school’s plan to teach gender spectrum, fluidity

One of the nation’s largest public school systems is preparing to include gender identity to its classroom curriculum, including lessons on sexual fluidity and spectrum – the idea that there’s no such thing as 100 percent boys or 100 percent girls.

Fairfax County Public Schools released a report recommending changes to their family life curriculum for grades 7 through 12. The changes, which critics call radical gender ideology, will be formally introduced next week.

“The larger picture is this is really an attack on nature itself – the created order,” said Peter Sprigg of the Family Research Council.

“Human beings are created male and female. But the current transgender ideology goes way beyond that. They’re telling us you can be both genders, you can be no gender, you can be a gender that you make up for yourself. And we’re supposed to affirm all of it.”

The plan calls for teaching seventh graders about transgenderism and tenth graders about the concept that sexuality is a broader spectrum --- but it sure smells like unadulterated sex indoctrination.

Get a load of what the kids are going to be learning in middle school:

“Students will be provided definitions for sexual orientation terms heterosexuality, homosexuality and bisexuality; and the gender identity term transgender,” the district’s recommendations state. “Emphasis will be placed on recognizing that everyone is experiencing changes and the role of respectful, inclusive language in promoting an environment free of bias and discrimination.”

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2015/...-or-girls.html


Just because there is backlash doesn't mean it will stop, though. They are also pushing "pedosexual" as a new add-on to the LGBTQ line-up:

Video Shows Toddlers Understand Consent

There are a lot of worthy efforts out there to help people understand consent by showing how simple it actually is. Maybe you've heard some of them: if you've ever ordered pizza you understand consent, if you drink tea you understand consent, if you understand stealing you understand consent. Those are just a few, but still we see court cases and studies that show people still don't really understand what consent is. Well, a new video from Lindsay Amer, who runs the YouTube channel Queer Kid Stuff shows exactly why there's no excuse not to grasp consent. Even toddlers understand it.

https://www.teenvogue.com/story/vide...rstand-consent

Do you support that too? Because you might have to.

Thirdly, if you admire Laura Ingraham, that is your business. Many people in the USA are filled with hate. Did I ever think people in this nation would stoop so low to go after teens who survived a mass murder simply because these teens asked "adults" to do something meaningful (beside thoughts and prayers) to stop this madness? How can any moral compassionate decent person support Laura and trash the kids?

First, I don't watch Fox News. Second, I believe that shooting was a staged false flag. Third, David Hogg's parents are an FBI agent and a CNN employee. What a coincidence right? Fourth, the kid has a foul mouth and has been trash-talking tons of people, gaining lots of publicity doing so. He isn't an angel that is beyond reproach. Fifth, Ingraham should have never apologized because she did nothing wrong and apologizing is only blood in the water to radicals like Hogg.

I also will not even debate the secret feelings of Art Bell for Ramona Bell. I find conspiracy theories on this subject reprehensible. But that's my right. The end.

Like I said, I don't care to get into the details of it either. I just thought it was worth at least a mention since there was some controversy around it and I noticed you were listing both "pros" and "cons" of his legacy.

[ArizonaSilver]

Posted by A Voice from the Mountains (here)

Posted by ArizonaSilver (here)
I don't want to start fighting with people the day I post something that meant a lot to me. But you equated CIVIL MARRIAGE before the LAW with religious marriage. Not the same. If a church does not wish to marry a gay couple, the church does not have to. This is not a religious matter, it is a civil rights matter. No religious organization is being forced to marry any gay people, but gay people can be married legally.

I'm not here to debate gay marriage. I was just pointing out that there is no logic in judging Art Bell for what he did or didn't say ~20 years ago by the cultural narrative of today. It's a form of anachronism that historians are taught to avoid. In other words you will not properly understand the past if you do not view it in the context of its own time. More has changed in the last 20 years than you may remember.

As for your assertion that kindergardeners are being force fed transgender propaganda, all my grandkids live in the San Francisco Bay Area, which is very liberal. I checked with my daughter. None of the 4 are being taught such nonsense. Are you sure this isn't the wild imagination of some right wing fear monger? Parents would put up such a stink that such a program would be shut down immediately.

Read:

By fall 2017 Washington state public schools will begin teaching gender expression to kindergarteners under newly-approved health education learning standards that designate sexual health a “core idea” of public K-12 education.

While some aspects of sexual health aren’t taught K-12 (HIV prevention begins in fourth grade), one component of sexual health titled “Self-Identity” begins in kindergarten, where students will be expected to “Understand there are many ways to express gender.”

The state’s health education glossary defines gender as “A social construct based on emotional, behavioral, and cultural characteristics attached to a person’s assigned biological sex.” Gender expression, meanwhile, is defined as “The way someone outwardly expresses their gender.”

These definitions differ from the state’s definition of “biological sex”: “Based on chromosomes, hormones, and internal and external anatomy.”

Nathan Olson, a communications manager for the statewide Office of Superintendent of Public Instruction (OSPI), told The Daily Caller that the glossary “was developed to support classroom instruction.” The new standards were finalized in March but OSPI has yet to issue a press release informing the public of the changes.

As part of an aspect of sexual health titled “Healthy Relationships,” kindergarteners will learn to distinguish between “safe and unwanted touch.” They will also learn to “Recognize people have the right to refuse giving or receiving unwanted touch.” OSPI did not answer a question from TheDC about whether this lesson plan amounts to teaching consent to kindergarteners.

By third grade, students will be expected to “Explain that gender roles can vary considerably” and “Understand [the] importance of treating others with respect regarding gender identity,” as part of the “Self-Identity” component of sexual health.

Gender identity is defined by the state as “Someone’s inner sense of their gender.”

“The standards don’t define ‘gender spectrum.’ But self-identity is a key component,” Olson said when TheDC asked whether learning that gender is a “spectrum” is considered part of learning about “gender identity.” Last month, Fox News’ Todd Starnes described a Virginia county’s lesson plans on gender spectrum as “the idea that there’s no such thing as 100 percent boys or 100 percent girls.”

http://dailycaller.com/2016/06/01/wa...indergartners/

You are right, there was major backlash against this kind of program. But these parents better be careful, because in 20 more years they may be seen as hateful bigots for opposing this curriculum.

Parents furious over school’s plan to teach gender spectrum, fluidity

One of the nation’s largest public school systems is preparing to include gender identity to its classroom curriculum, including lessons on sexual fluidity and spectrum – the idea that there’s no such thing as 100 percent boys or 100 percent girls.

Fairfax County Public Schools released a report recommending changes to their family life curriculum for grades 7 through 12. The changes, which critics call radical gender ideology, will be formally introduced next week.

“The larger picture is this is really an attack on nature itself – the created order,” said Peter Sprigg of the Family Research Council.

“Human beings are created male and female. But the current transgender ideology goes way beyond that. They’re telling us you can be both genders, you can be no gender, you can be a gender that you make up for yourself. And we’re supposed to affirm all of it.”

The plan calls for teaching seventh graders about transgenderism and tenth graders about the concept that sexuality is a broader spectrum --- but it sure smells like unadulterated sex indoctrination.

Get a load of what the kids are going to be learning in middle school:

“Students will be provided definitions for sexual orientation terms heterosexuality, homosexuality and bisexuality; and the gender identity term transgender,” the district’s recommendations state. “Emphasis will be placed on recognizing that everyone is experiencing changes and the role of respectful, inclusive language in promoting an environment free of bias and discrimination.”

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2015/...-or-girls.html


Just because there is backlash doesn't mean it will stop, though. They are also pushing "pedosexual" as a new add-on to the LGBTQ line-up:

Video Shows Toddlers Understand Consent

There are a lot of worthy efforts out there to help people understand consent by showing how simple it actually is. Maybe you've heard some of them: if you've ever ordered pizza you understand consent, if you drink tea you understand consent, if you understand stealing you understand consent. Those are just a few, but still we see court cases and studies that show people still don't really understand what consent is. Well, a new video from Lindsay Amer, who runs the YouTube channel Queer Kid Stuff shows exactly why there's no excuse not to grasp consent. Even toddlers understand it.

https://www.teenvogue.com/story/vide...rstand-consent

Do you support that too? Because you might have to.

Thirdly, if you admire Laura Ingraham, that is your business. Many people in the USA are filled with hate. Did I ever think people in this nation would stoop so low to go after teens who survived a mass murder simply because these teens asked "adults" to do something meaningful (beside thoughts and prayers) to stop this madness? How can any moral compassionate decent person support Laura and trash the kids?

First, I don't watch Fox News. Second, I believe that shooting was a staged false flag. Third, David Hogg's parents are an FBI agent and a CNN employee. What a coincidence right? Fourth, the kid has a foul mouth and has been trash-talking tons of people, gaining lots of publicity doing so. He isn't an angel that is beyond reproach. Fifth, Ingraham should have never apologized because she did nothing wrong and apologizing is only blood in the water to radicals like Hogg.

I also will not even debate the secret feelings of Art Bell for Ramona Bell. I find conspiracy theories on this subject reprehensible. But that's my right. The end.

Like I said, I don't care to get into the details of it either. I just thought it was worth at least a mention since there was some controversy around it and I noticed you were listing both "pros" and "cons" of his legacy.

Hoggs is one of thousands of kids demanding that adults do something about gun massacres in school. They believe in the current system and were taught that they had a right to protest. Yet they are being demonized for simply demanding that something more than the meaningless "thoughts and prayers" of the GOP be done to curb such acts. And for THIS, they should be personally attacked? I am stunned that you think so. She went after him on a personal basis like some snarling little teenager girl. It was indecent. Good Lord. If you think this was a false flag, then we have nothing more to say to each other. So no kids died, right? May God help you.

[KiwiElf]

Respectfully Arizona,

Point 1: David Hoggs is no "innocent kid" - he's in his twenties, as many posts on the subject of the "little dictator" have verified (see linked Thread below) - bit "old" to be in school, and his Deep State narrative/agenda is as transparent as glass & blatantly obvious for anyone with half a functioning brain, if you can get past the fakestream media narrative. He's part of a carefully orchestrated Deep State plan, (one I'm sure that Art Bell would have enjoyed exposing, bless him).

Point 2: a False Flag (hidden motives/truth) is vastly different from a "Hoax" - NO-ONE is suggesting those deaths didn't happen.

I'd recommend you check out this well-researched thread:

Mass Shooting in Parkland, Florida, High School: 14 Feb 2018
https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...light=parkland

Cheers

[A Voice from the Mountains]

Posted by ArizonaSilver (here)
Hoggs is one of thousands of kids demanding that adults do something about gun massacres in school. They believe in the current system and were taught that they had a right to protest. Yet they are being demonized for simply demanding that something more than the meaningless "thoughts and prayers" of the GOP be done to curb such acts. And for THIS, they should be personally attacked? I am stunned that you think so. She went after him on a personal basis like some snarling little teenager girl. It was indecent. Good Lord. If you think this was a false flag, then we have nothing more to say to each other. So no kids died, right? May God help you.

If you want to actually have a debate on gun control, or whether the intelligence agencies are too holy to kill kids and/or fake deaths, I'm all for it, but I don't want to clutter up a thread about Art Bell with it.


Instead, here's a remix of JC on Art Bell:

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=6t0U_TCrXtU

Whoever made this video is brilliant.

[DNA]

Posted by ArizonaSilver (here)

Hoggs is one of thousands of kids demanding that adults do something about gun massacres in school. They believe in the current system and were taught that they had a right to protest. Yet they are being demonized for simply demanding that something more than the meaningless "thoughts and prayers" of the GOP be done to curb such acts. And for THIS, they should be personally attacked? I am stunned that you think so. She went after him on a personal basis like some snarling little teenager girl. It was indecent. Good Lord. If you think this was a false flag, then we have nothing more to say to each other. So no kids died, right? May God help you.

You should stick around this forum for a little while Arizona Silver before getting mad and leaving.
I start off with this because, when you continue to parrot back the main stream media narrative folks around here are going to instantly want to inform you that the main stream media's only function is to lie.

[A Voice from the Mountains]

Posted by DNA (here)

This right here is why I wouldn't put it past the intelligence agencies to have something to hold over Art Bell to make sure he never stepped too far out of line.

"The CIA owns everyone of any significance in the major media."

If I worked in a "Mockingbird" type program in the CIA, and I heard Art Bell on the radio back in the day, talking about conspiracies or Area 51 or whatever, and I didn't already have something to keep him in line, he would become priority #1. He'd be too dangerous to just allow to have whatever guests on, or say whatever he likes. I would at least send a bunch of disinfo agents his way to try to get on as guests on his program. If the parts of the CIA in charge of counter-intelligence didn't prioritize that then they wouldn't have been doing their jobs very well.

I actually read through Arizona's post before I responded to it, so it's not like everything he typed out was in vain or something, unless I was expected to agree with all of it. The whole thing with Ramona really did seem weird to me when I read it, but that was years ago and the details are fuzzy now.

One thing has always irritated me though, about that "frantic Area 51 caller" that became famous. When Art came back on the air, and was asking the next caller how much he heard of what that guy said before it cut off, he never told us what all the guy was saying after he got cut off. He could have at least summarized the parts we missed while it was still fresh in his mind.

[ArizonaSilver]

Regarding the Area 51 caller, I assume you are aware that he called back at some later date.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FrUj3cV_To

[Tintin]

Posted by A Voice from the Mountains (here)

Posted by DNA (here)

This right here is why I wouldn't put it past the intelligence agencies to have something to hold over Art Bell to make sure he never stepped too far out of line.

"The CIA owns everyone of any significance in the major media."

If I worked in a "Mockingbird" type program in the CIA, and I heard Art Bell on the radio back in the day, talking about conspiracies or Area 51 or whatever, and I didn't already have something to keep him in line, he would become priority #1. He'd be too dangerous to just allow to have whatever guests on, or say whatever he likes. I would at least send a bunch of disinfo agents his way to try to get on as guests on his program. If the parts of the CIA in charge of counter-intelligence didn't prioritize that then they wouldn't have been doing their jobs very well.

I actually read through Arizona's post before I responded to it, so it's not like everything he typed out was in vain or something, unless I was expected to agree with all of it. The whole thing with Ramona really did seem weird to me when I read it, but that was years ago and the details are fuzzy now.

One thing has always irritated me though, about that "frantic Area 51 caller" that became famous. When Art came back on the air, and was asking the next caller how much he heard of what that guy said before it cut off, he never told us what all the guy was saying after he got cut off. He could have at least summarized the parts we missed while it was still fresh in his mind.

Yes, I followed up on that here: https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...=1#post1220469

[Justplain]

Just to clarify, the transgender 'gender fluidity' nonsense is also a part of Ontario's sexual education curriculum, being taught to young children in grades 1 and 3, i believe. The current provincial government has even prohibitted the provincial health plan from paying for psychiatric counselling for children with 'gender dysphoria' (confusion about which sex they are), although statistics show a huge percentage of those having gender change operations going on to commit suicide. The current provincial government has also threatened to take children away from families who object to a child's decision to change their sex.

There were never any mass protests in the streets in Ontario demanding that these strategies be adopted. If one does a little background research one will find that these ideas flow from the 'Comprehensive Sexual Education' program proferred by the Rockefeller funded Kinsey Institute. This should come as no surprise as the deep state's stated intention (see Georgian Guidestones) is depopulation, one method of which is the destruction of the nuclear family and the promotion of homosexuality and disfiguring transgenderism.

So, we see that this sex ed agenda has been peddled all across north america. No surprise that its sponsor is a deep state psychopath.

[ArizonaSilver]

Posted by Justplain (here)
Just to clarify, the transgender 'gender fluidity' nonsense is also a part of Ontario's sexual education curriculum, being taught to young children in grades 1 and 3, i believe. The current provincial government has even prohibitted the provincial health plan from paying for psychiatric counselling for children with 'gender dysphoria' (confusion about which sex they are), although statistics show a huge percentage of those having gender change operations going on to commit suicide. The current provincial government has also threatened to take children away from families who object to a child's decision to change their sex.

There were never any mass protests in the streets in Ontario demanding that these strategies be adopted. If one does a little background research one will find that these ideas flow from the 'Comprehensive Sexual Education' program proferred by the Rockefeller funded Kinsey Institute. This should come as no surprise as the deep state's stated intention (see Georgian Guidestones) is depopulation, one method of which is the destruction on the nuclear family and the promotion of homosexuality and disfiguring transgenderism.

So, we see that this sex ed agenda has been peddled all across north america. No surprise that its sponsor is a deep state psychopath.

Guaranteeing that gay Americans have the same rights as straight Americans is NOT promoting homosexuality. It is stopping the institutional persecution of gay people. Explaining to kids AT A SUITABLE AGE that homosexuality is a variation of human sexuality is NOT promoting it. This is fear mongering yet again. I have never seen the government say "Be Gay! Go Gay! Gays have a better life than straight people! We urge you all to try it".

[Flash]

In my opinion, You are grossly exagerating ArizonaSilver. Up to a point where it becomes useless to try communicating with you.

Justplain is talking about Canada, not USA to start with, he is explaining what is taught in schools at an early age (I would very much like to know how early it is Justplain),

Over and above, Justplain is talking about transgenderism, not homosexuality as you write.

He is also mentioning that psychiatry or psycholoy follow up has been refused to the those who do want sex change, when we know very well that people who suffered all their young life about their sex identity need therapeutic follow up to ease their pain.

this has nothing to do with having an existential crisis about forcing kids to become transgenre as you described.

Posted by ArizonaSilver (here)

Posted by Justplain (here)
Just to clarify, the transgender 'gender fluidity' nonsense is also a part of Ontario's sexual education curriculum, being taught to young children in grades 1 and 3, i believe. The current provincial government has even prohibitted the provincial health plan from paying for psychiatric counselling for children with 'gender dysphoria' (confusion about which sex they are), although statistics show a huge percentage of those having gender change operations going on to commit suicide. The current provincial government has also threatened to take children away from families who object to a child's decision to change their sex.

There were never any mass protests in the streets in Ontario demanding that these strategies be adopted. If one does a little background research one will find that these ideas flow from the 'Comprehensive Sexual Education' program proferred by the Rockefeller funded Kinsey Institute. This should come as no surprise as the deep state's stated intention (see Georgian Guidestones) is depopulation, one method of which is the destruction on the nuclear family and the promotion of homosexuality and disfiguring transgenderism.

So, we see that this sex ed agenda has been peddled all across north america. No surprise that its sponsor is a deep state psychopath.

Guaranteeing that gay Americans have the same rights as straight Americans is NOT promoting homosexuality. It is stopping the institutional persecution of gay people. Explaining to kids AT A SUITABLE AGE that homosexuality is a variation of human sexuality is NOT promoting it. This is fear mongering yet again. I have never seen the government say "Be Gay! Go Gay! Gays have a better life than straight people! We urge you all to try it".

[ArizonaSilver]

Posted by Flash (here)
In my opinion, You are grossly exagerating ArizonaSilver. Up to a point where it becomes useless to try communicating with you.

Justplain is talking about Canada, not USA to start with, he is explaining what is taught in schools at an early age (I would very much like to know how early it is Justplain),

Over and above, Justplain is talking about transgenderism, not homosexuality as you write.

He is also mentioning that psychiatry or psycholoy follow up has been refused to the those who do want sex change, when we know very well that people who suffered all their young life about their sex identity need therapeutic follow up to ease their pain.

this has nothing to do with having an existential crisis about forcing kids to become transgenre as you described.

Posted by ArizonaSilver (here)

Posted by Justplain (here)
Just to clarify, the transgender 'gender fluidity' nonsense is also a part of Ontario's sexual education curriculum, being taught to young children in grades 1 and 3, i believe. The current provincial government has even prohibitted the provincial health plan from paying for psychiatric counselling for children with 'gender dysphoria' (confusion about which sex they are), although statistics show a huge percentage of those having gender change operations going on to commit suicide. The current provincial government has also threatened to take children away from families who object to a child's decision to change their sex.

There were never any mass protests in the streets in Ontario demanding that these strategies be adopted. If one does a little background research one will find that these ideas flow from the 'Comprehensive Sexual Education' program proferred by the Rockefeller funded Kinsey Institute. This should come as no surprise as the deep state's stated intention (see Georgian Guidestones) is depopulation, one method of which is the destruction on the nuclear family and the promotion of homosexuality and disfiguring transgenderism.

So, we see that this sex ed agenda has been peddled all across north america. No surprise that its sponsor is a deep state psychopath.

Guaranteeing that gay Americans have the same rights as straight Americans is NOT promoting homosexuality. It is stopping the institutional persecution of gay people. Explaining to kids AT A SUITABLE AGE that homosexuality is a variation of human sexuality is NOT promoting it. This is fear mongering yet again. I have never seen the government say "Be Gay! Go Gay! Gays have a better life than straight people! We urge you all to try it".

My calm reply was in response to his insertion of "one method of which is the destruction on the nuclear family and the promotion of homosexuality...." There is no promotion of homosexuality going on in the government. Do I really have to tell you all that homosexuality is not transgenderism?

[Justplain]

Posted by ArizonaSilver (here)

Posted by Justplain (here)
Just to clarify, the transgender 'gender fluidity' nonsense is also a part of Ontario's sexual education curriculum, being taught to young children in grades 1 and 3, i believe. The current provincial government has even prohibitted the provincial health plan from paying for psychiatric counselling for children with 'gender dysphoria' (confusion about which sex they are), although statistics show a huge percentage of those having gender change operations going on to commit suicide. The current provincial government has also threatened to take children away from families who object to a child's decision to change their sex.

There were never any mass protests in the streets in Ontario demanding that these strategies be adopted. If one does a little background research one will find that these ideas flow from the 'Comprehensive Sexual Education' program proferred by the Rockefeller funded Kinsey Institute. This should come as no surprise as the deep state's stated intention (see Georgian Guidestones) is depopulation, one method of which is the destruction on the nuclear family and the promotion of homosexuality and disfiguring transgenderism.

So, we see that this sex ed agenda has been peddled all across north america. No surprise that its sponsor is a deep state psychopath.

Guaranteeing that gay Americans have the same rights as straight Americans is NOT promoting homosexuality. It is stopping the institutional persecution of gay people. Explaining to kids AT A SUITABLE AGE that homosexuality is a variation of human sexuality is NOT promoting it. This is fear mongering yet again. I have never seen the government say "Be Gay! Go Gay! Gays have a better life than straight people! We urge you all to try it".

Actually, ArizonaSilver, the government here is actively promoting the gay and transgender lifestyle through these insertions into the sexual education curriculum in this locale, and anywhere else the Kinsey Institute's comprehensive sex education is implemented. Some of us believe in the sanctity of heterosexual marriage, as the traditional and historic means for the propogation of the species, and strongly object to the definition of marriage being 'stretched' to include homosexual relationships. Some object to gay marriage on religious grounds. The sensibilities of these two groups has been completely trampled by overzealous courts. In the 1990's the Canadian Parliament passed a motion, in a free vote, that endorsed marriage as a hetereosexual institution. As if this declaration was respected by the courts, which were so quick to redefine this commonly held term.

These twisted redefinitions continue to this day with the Canadian federal government removing gender from passports. And now school boards identify parents as 'parent 1 and parent 2', another swipe at hetereosexual relationships.

The current Kinsey sex ed curriculum for grade 3, 8 year olds, tries to tell children that gender is 'fluid', a choice to be made. This is totally false based upon objective research, not rockefeller fake science.

In grade 5, age 10, children are told that gender is a 'social construct'. Again, unscientific manure based on fake science.

Other issues with this sex ed curriculum include the following. For instance, there is a blatant omission of the great dangers of sexually transmitted diseases. There is also a complete omission of the profound connection between love and sex, and marriage being the ultimate commitment to this bond. Instead sexual activity is trivialized into 'having fun' and 'exploring your body'.

I would say that by promoting a permiscuous and 'experimental' view of sex, and downplaying the dangers of sexual activity, and particlarly gay sexual activity, that indeed this sex ed curriculum is promoting homosexuality.

Of course i dont want gay people to be persecuted. I think that a gay civil partnership is a better term than 'marriage'. But i object strongly to the sexualization of young children, and misdirecting them with twisted terminology that raises confusion and stress. So, this curriculum has to be junked and replaced with a more age appropriate model that emphasizes the importance of relationship and safety.

Otherwise, the psychopathic deep state gets what it wants.

[ArizonaSilver]

Posted by Justplain (here)

Posted by ArizonaSilver (here)

Posted by Justplain (here)
Just to clarify, the transgender 'gender fluidity' nonsense is also a part of Ontario's sexual education curriculum, being taught to young children in grades 1 and 3, i believe. The current provincial government has even prohibitted the provincial health plan from paying for psychiatric counselling for children with 'gender dysphoria' (confusion about which sex they are), although statistics show a huge percentage of those having gender change operations going on to commit suicide. The current provincial government has also threatened to take children away from families who object to a child's decision to change their sex.

There were never any mass protests in the streets in Ontario demanding that these strategies be adopted. If one does a little background research one will find that these ideas flow from the 'Comprehensive Sexual Education' program proferred by the Rockefeller funded Kinsey Institute. This should come as no surprise as the deep state's stated intention (see Georgian Guidestones) is depopulation, one method of which is the destruction on the nuclear family and the promotion of homosexuality and disfiguring transgenderism.

So, we see that this sex ed agenda has been peddled all across north america. No surprise that its sponsor is a deep state psychopath.

Guaranteeing that gay Americans have the same rights as straight Americans is NOT promoting homosexuality. It is stopping the institutional persecution of gay people. Explaining to kids AT A SUITABLE AGE that homosexuality is a variation of human sexuality is NOT promoting it. This is fear mongering yet again. I have never seen the government say "Be Gay! Go Gay! Gays have a better life than straight people! We urge you all to try it".

Actually, ArizonaSilver, the government here is actively promoting the gay and transgender lifestyle through these insertions into the sexual education curriculum in this locale, and anywhere else the Kinsey Institute's comprehensive sex education is implemented. Some of us believe in the sanctity of heterosexual marriage, as the traditional and historic means for the propogation of the species, and strongly object to the definition of marriage being 'stretched' to include homosexual relationships. Some object to gay marriage on religious grounds. The sensibilities of these two groups has been completely trampled by overzealous courts. In the 1990's the Canadian Parliament passed a motion, in a free vote, that endorsed marriage as a hetereosexual institution. As if this declaration was respected by the courts, which were so quick to redefine this commonly held term.

These twisted redefinitions continue to this day with the Canadian federal government removing gender from passports. And now school boards identify parents as 'parent 1 and parent 2', another swipe at hetereosexual relationships.

The current Kinsey sex ed curriculum for grade 3, 8 year olds, tries to tell children that gender is 'fluid', a choice to be made. This is totally false based upon objective research, not rockefeller fake science.

In grade 5, age 10, children are told that gender is a 'social construct'. Again, unscientific manure based on fake science.

Other issues with this sex ed curriculum include the following. For instance, there is a blatant omission of the great dangers of sexually transmitted diseases. There is also a complete omission of the profound connection between love and sex, and marriage being the ultimate commitment to this bond. Instead sexual activity is trivialized into 'having fun' and 'exploring your body'.

I would say that by promoting a permiscuous and 'experimental' view of sex, and downplaying the dangers of sexual activity, and particlarly gay sexual activity, that indeed this sex ed curriculum is promoting homosexuality.

Of course i dont want gay people to be persecuted. I think that a gay civil partnership is a better term than 'marriage'. But i object strongly to the sexualization of young children, and misdirecting them with twisted terminology that raises confusion and stress. So, this curriculum has to be junked and replaced with a more age appropriate model that emphasizes the importance of relationship and safety.

Otherwise, the psychopathic deep state gets what it wants.

Marriage is the commitment to love and cherish one person the rest of your life. It is in the benefit of society to allow gay people to make this commitment. Not doing so is merely malice. Yes, children should be raised in the security and love of marriage, but my dad got married for the second time when he was 90 years old. Child bearing and rearing had no connection to his marriage. So please do not simplify things to rationalize a bronze age belief system. By the way, nowhere I could find in the Bible is the family values view of marriage and family supported. This is a Victorian construct. Marriage is sometimes both a religious and civil arrangement. Other times it is a civil arrangement without the blessing of old time religion. Stop conflating the 2 as 1. But so far this forum seems to be an echo chamber of narrow minded conservative view points "married" to conspiracy theories. I honor that but it is not what I had in mind. My progressive views on granting equality to ALL citizens of a nation seems unpopular here. But I do not agree with teaching small children about gender fluidity. But transgenderism is not "nonsense" as one person proclaimed. It is a serious problem for a subsection of the human family. Rather than misery and suicide, I would think the majority could open up a bit and allow these people to exist without malice and shame. But again I realize this is a shocking unheard of notion here. So I will take my leave of this thread, if not the actual forum. I am not here to try to get you to empathize with other human beings far different from yourselves.

https://www.docdroid.net/nHK4Fcu/an-...ccording-t.pdf

[Omni]

Posted by Justplain (here)
The current Kinsey sex ed curriculum for grade 3, 8 year olds, tries to tell children that gender is 'fluid', a choice to be made. This is totally false based upon objective research, not rockefeller fake science.

In grade 5, age 10, children are told that gender is a 'social construct'. Again, unscientific manure based on fake science.

This looks like the transexual social engineering I have heard about in the cybernetic networks. This type of curriculum offers the mkultra folks the opportunity to do heinous operations against youngsters with mind control. Using RF brain implants they invert or warp people's sexuality or personality (i have witnessed this), and I can notice the eugenics (procreation inhibitive) aspects of transexualism. It would be an effective mechanism for the black ops crime syndicate to induce to stop a target from procreating.

Overall the transexualism and homosexual agendas of the shadow government disgust me. However I agree that homosexuals should be able to essentially have the same legal construct that marriage provides, seems like basic human rights.

[Justplain]

Marriage is an ages old institution of the male and female dance. Family values are based on plenty of examples in the bible. Jesus refers to many, such as the prodigal son. The bible goes to great lengths to cite the lineage of prophets, etc.

Hetereosexual marriage is a cornerstone of civilization. Why does its definition need to be changed just to make some 'feel good about themselves'?! What's wrong with calling gay unions as something else? What has that to do with equal rights? Nothing in my humble opinion.

By blurring the concepts on sexuality, the government is now legislating 'hate speech' terminology that makes it a crime to call people by certain gender oriented terms. Then, its taken further to delete gender off passports, or parent's gender off school documents.

If you have no gender, you fall out of the dance of life. You miss a vital aspect of natural living.

And you become dependent upon technology for reproduction. Which means generally you become dependent on the government. And the deep state has a transhumanist agenda, to turn us into programmable cyborgs.

You may call this alarmist, or fear mongering. But, if you do background research, and see who is sponsoring the fake science that produces fallacies like 'gender fluidity', then perhaps you can connect some dots. Then maybe you'll connect a few other dots and see the same sponsors developed the poisoned gmo food that most people in the usa are consuming. Then the dots lead to a conclusion that the powers that be have no good intentions with the public. Its easy to see if you just open your eyes.

[Omni]

Posted by Justplain (here)
Marriage is an ages old institution of the male and female dance. Family values are based on plenty of examples in the bible. Jesus refers to many, such as the prodigal son. The bible goes to great lengths to cite the lineage of prophets, etc.

Hetereosexual marriage is a cornerstone of civilization. Why does its definition need to be changed just to make some 'feel good about themselves'?! What's wrong with calling gay unions as something else? What has that to do with equal rights? Nothing in my humble opinion.

I think you were talking to the other poster, right?

I understand Christians have major values towards a male and female bond, and I can agree it is a sacred duality. What I meant was homosexuals should have equal partner rights. That's all. I tend to agree call it something other than marriage for the Christians to not be denied their own ideology and the homosexuals to have equal partner rights.

[Justplain]

Yes, Omnisense, i was directing most of those comments to ArizonaSilver. I appreciate that you understand the differentiation between hetereosexual marriage and gay partnerships. Bermuda recently redefined these terms along these lines, which i strongly agree with.

I certainly dont want gay people to be persecuted. And i also dont see my views as 'neo-con'.

What is apparent is that the current sex ed is quite devious, eminates from the Kinsey Institute (now part of the U.of Indiana, i believe) which received a large part of its funding from a rockefeller foundation. That info explains it all.