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Thread: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

  1. Link to Post #41
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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Quote Posted by KiwiElf (here)
    Quote What is a "non-tabbed or non-blocked paragraph" ?
    I don't know what the technical term for it is, Paul, but without "tabbed" text, ie the Tab key (I should have said, "indented"), many people will "block" their paragraphs, ie, insert a hard "return" (2 x taps on the Return key after a paragraph), the way I formatted that post. It leaves a blank line between each paragraph (like this):

    Without either, we just get a "wall" of text, like this (it's pretty ugly, & difficult to read, especially a very long article!):
    Ah - I think I finally parsed your comment


    As RunningDeer illustrated, one can distinguish paragraphs a couple of ways:
    1. Put an extra blank line between each paragraph.
    2. Indent the first line of each paragraph a few spaces.
    If you do neither, you get the dreaded wall of text.

    Lesson for the day: use at least one of these two ways.

    Since the way that posts are formatted on forums such as Avalon, "indentation" is removed, so the second way, Indenting, doesn't work.

    That means there is only one practical way to separate paragraphs in a forum such as ours, and that is with an extra blank line between paragraphs.

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Sorry Paul, I just rewrote it - (no sleep, brain not working at the time = gobbledy gook - RunningDeer did it much better! - Please feel free to delete BOTH of my posts #36 & 38)

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Quote Posted by Flash (here)
    For God sake, I am university educated, I have taught different management and customer related courses to adults a large part of my life, and here, I feel like the reject because of language intolerance or lack of efforts thinking of others. The contrary to my own teachings.
    When you first learned English you no doubt had to learn a whole bunch of slang and other cultural stuff from the past. Maybe your cup has just become too full with this past stuff to make room for the rapidly-changing Internet culture. For me (and Daozen too it seems) the acronyms in the OP (original post, ie first post in the thread) are things that we can take for granted as understood by most now. Or at least we assume they are, because they are used so frequently.

    I notice that many forums and other online communities have their own peculiar language too, that doesn't extend far beyond their own circles. Halfchan, goats, lobsters, LARPs, and baking bread come to mind. But stuff like tl;dr is becoming fairly universal.

    Quote When I read all the post here I am p ss ed. It is enough to discourage many many non English writers and about all those with some language handicaps.
    Now imagine how the rest of us would feel if we had to take up the burden of learning to accommodate 50 different cultural styles of communication for a relatively small minority of posters.

    Look at it this way: your frustration is a small price to pay for the "collective good" of the rest of us.

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    As Voice From The Mountains says, I was not looking to alienate anyone or come off as an uber-hip hipster with all the TLAs and FLAs I used. hahaha. I honestly thought phrases like tl;dr were well known. Having ruminated extensively on the feedback I have toned down the orginal post. I write mainly for my own amusement. Phrases like leaning towers of html are fun to write.

    Look at it another way: Maybe there are advanced students of English who enjoy a little bit of slang now and then.

    Now... It is spring. We should be picking buttercups and cartwheeling in meadows. If not in body, at least in spirit.

    Good night Twilight Warriors!!!

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    well Daozen looks like the loooong writers win. However getting to the point is important if you are not practicing to be a writer.
    I've written many adds and it is important to get to the point quickly for clarity. It also works well on posts.

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  8. Link to Post #46
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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Quote Posted by RunningDeer (here)
    Quote Posted by Paul (here)
    What is a "non-tabbed or non-blocked paragraph" ?
    The standard practice for the manual typewriter was to return the carriage twice to create space between paragraphs and use the tab key for each paragraph. The tab was adjusted to five spaces, but you could change it like the sample below; either hit the tab twice or adjust the tab to 10 spaces. For formal business letters, some elected to use the block print method which there were no paragraph indentations.

    Word processors come with a variety of templates similar to what was used in the 1900’s for business, academics and the less formal writing styles.

    When I was in high school, it was a big deal when the business department upgraded to the electric typewriter. It took some getting use to from pounding the manual keys to a light touch, automatic return carriage and quicker typing speeds.


    Thank you Paula, I tend to be a visual person, so now I get it......

    Yes, If you do neither, you get the dreaded wall of text.

    Ok onward.

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Quote Posted by Daozen (here)
    As Voice From The Mountains says, I was not looking to alienate anyone or come off as an uber-hip hipster with all the TLAs and FLAs I used. hahaha. I honestly thought phrases like tl;dr were well known.
    That’s my point. Internet culture is not like reading business memos or something. I would have assumed they are well known too and I still do consider them well known. Also it would only take selecting the text, right clicking, and selecting “Search ___ for....” to figure it out in about three seconds in the case of not being familiar. Some of the internal lingo I see on other boards is more difficult to figure out and sometimes requires immersion in that particular community.

    What is slang today is in the dictionary tomorrow. We don’t speak Elizabethan English anymore. The Internet will change lots of things about our use of language, and already has. Adaptation is good and natural.

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Reading this thread and the acronyms, KISS comes to mind. "Keep it simple stupid".

    I think most can agree that there is one basic guideline that should be followed regardless of grammar or language differences: be generous in one's use of blank lines in large blocks of text.

    Maybe the mods could add something to the community guidelines. Something new members must read that nicely suggests that large walls of text be broken up with blank lines. Unless there's something like that already in the sign up form.
    Last edited by Universoul; 21st April 2018 at 21:35.

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Yes, lots of paragraph breaks and I like limited bold type. So, you know. LPB LBT.

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Running Deer...you had me laughing out loud with your typewriter explanation! In my H.S. class we only had 3 electric typewriters & I was afraid to even use one of them!!

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    I opened the thread to find out what radial power meant, but then my eyes just glazed over somewhere before the end of the first paragraph.

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Testing, testing, 1,2,3. There’s an image spacer used to indent the paragraphs in this post. It’d be cool if there’s a way for an administrative wizard to work their magic by turning the 'tab.gif' into a smilie for those that want to indent paragraphs.

    (white/almost invisible space bar added here)

    Also if possible here are three space bar images: black, grey, and white. Note above the white creates the space but appears almost colorless against the white background. It’s not uncommon for me to use the space bars. I usually center them. The beauty is they create a larger space than hitting the return key.


    Note: if the wizards can’t make the spacebars or indents into smiles, another method is type a repeating symbol such as an asterisk ************************** and change/color the asterisk to white rather than black.



    Last edited by RunningDeer; 22nd April 2018 at 04:21.

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  21. Link to Post #53
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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Quote Posted by A Voice from the Mountains (here)
    Quote Posted by Daozen (here)
    As Voice From The Mountains says, I was not looking to alienate anyone or come off as an uber-hip hipster with all the TLAs and FLAs I used. hahaha. I honestly thought phrases like tl;dr were well known.
    That’s my point. Internet culture is not like reading business memos or something. I would have assumed they are well known too and I still do consider them well known. Also it would only take selecting the text, right clicking, and selecting “Search ___ for....” to figure it out in about three seconds in the case of not being familiar. Some of the internal lingo I see on other boards is more difficult to figure out and sometimes requires immersion in that particular community.

    What is slang today is in the dictionary tomorrow. We don’t speak Elizabethan English anymore. The Internet will change lots of things about our use of language, and already has. Adaptation is good and natural.

    I would say adaptation is a necessity for survival, so for the adaptee it is certainly good, but I don't see this (a change in linguistic norms) as an adaptation. Quite frankly I see it as a degradation. A backward step. We, as a species, are literally becoming dumber. We were not ready for (so-called) smart technology and social media. It ran away from us and got ahead.

    Was it planned, merely accidental, evidence of absorbing? technolgy from elsewhere, or is it an agenda?

    Given the research, with frequently less than ethical methods, into human psycholgy and the brain carried out in the preceding decades it is not too difficult to imagine some of this is actually planned. Admittedly only in the minds of disfunctional sociopaths - for no rational, aware, human would desire to create such a situation.

    As the human capacity for rational thought degrades and the capacity for AI to operate with increasing lucidity? improves we are on a very dangerous downward spiral.

    two words above, italicised and with question marks immediately following, indicate uncertaintly over the choice of word; apologies.
    Last edited by Ewan; 22nd April 2018 at 07:52.

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  23. Link to Post #54
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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Quote Posted by Daozen (here)
    As Voice From The Mountains says, I was not looking to alienate anyone or come off as an uber-hip hipster with all the TLAs and FLAs I used. hahaha. I honestly thought phrases like tl;dr were well known. Having ruminated extensively on the feedback I have toned down the orginal post. I write mainly for my own amusement. Phrases like leaning towers of html are fun to write.

    Look at it another way: Maybe there are advanced students of English who enjoy a little bit of slang now and then.

    Now... It is spring. We should be picking buttercups and cartwheeling in meadows. If not in body, at least in spirit.

    Good night Twilight Warriors!!!
    Speaking for this Twilight Warrior…

    In the OP, I understood the web jargon such as 'HTML', because up until several years ago I had a small website designed business on the side. I created it before templates were available. Which meant I learned how to write code and custom designed sites.

    So while people were busy with ‘speaking in internet acronyms’, joining forums, snapchat, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, etc., I was busy with a full time profession, continuing with higher education, a side business and all the rest of what life brings.


    This Twilight Warrior has got a lotta light left.

    PS I agree with a lot of the formatting suggestions. Good thread.
    Last edited by RunningDeer; 22nd April 2018 at 14:13.

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Quote Posted by RunningDeer (here)
    "The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog" is an English-language pangram—a sentence that contains all of the letters of the alphabet. It is commonly used for touch-typing practice, testing typewriters and computer keyboards, displaying examples of fonts, and other applications involving text where the use of all letters in the alphabet is desired. Owing to its brevity and coherence, it has become widely known.
    There is also another text used in typesetting as a placeholder:
    Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrud exercitation ullamco laboris nisi ut aliquip ex ea commodo consequat. Duis aute irure dolor in reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint occaecat cupidatat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorem_ipsum


    Last edited by Michi; 22nd April 2018 at 00:02. Reason: added link
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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Quote Posted by devplan (here)
    Quote Posted by RunningDeer (here)
    "The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog" is an English-language pangram—a sentence that contains all of the letters of the alphabet. It is commonly used for touch-typing practice, testing typewriters and computer keyboards, displaying examples of fonts, and other applications involving text where the use of all letters in the alphabet is desired. Owing to its brevity and coherence, it has become widely known.
    There is also another text used in typesetting as a placeholder:
    Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrud exercitation ullamco laboris nisi ut aliquip ex ea commodo consequat. Duis aute irure dolor in reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint occaecat cupidatat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorem_ipsum


    Thanks, devplan. My educated guess-ta-mation is the forum software is limited in that respect.

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Quote Posted by RunningDeer (here)
    [...]It’d be cool if there’s a way for an administrative wizard to work their magic by turning the 'tab.jpg' into a smilie for those that want to indent paragraphs.
    [...]
    Right, it'd be cool indeed, but, before getting into complications, one could have a hand at these:

    Quote Posted by Hervé (here)
    [...]
    One way to distinguish the article from one's own thoughts or others' comments is to use separators like:

    --------------------------------------

    =============================

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    etc...
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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Quote Posted by Hervé (here)
    Right, it'd be cool indeed, but, before getting into complications, one could have a hand at these:
    --------------------------------------
    =============================
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    My goal was to provide options for those interested. They aren't complicated to me. But like ‘speaking in internet acronyms’ is no biggie for some, this is second nature to me.

    I've used your method, or as I explained above, color the black symbols white: &&&&&&&&&&&


    As for the paragraph indention, it's an image that's approximately 7ish spaces. If turned into a smilie, folks click it and it creates an automatic indention. I'm cool if no one is interested. I'll still use the graphic even if it's not turned into a smilie.
    Last edited by RunningDeer; 22nd April 2018 at 03:01.

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Quote Posted by devplan (here)
    Quote Posted by RunningDeer (here)
    "The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog" is an English-language pangram—a sentence that contains all of the letters of the alphabet. It is commonly used for touch-typing practice, testing typewriters and computer keyboards, displaying examples of fonts, and other applications involving text where the use of all letters in the alphabet is desired. Owing to its brevity and coherence, it has become widely known.
    There is also another text used in typesetting as a placeholder:
    Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrud exercitation ullamco laboris nisi ut aliquip ex ea commodo consequat. Duis aute irure dolor in reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint occaecat cupidatat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorem_ipsum


    Hehe... brings back some memories ... that used to be a handy plug-in feature of QuarkXpress (once the leading "desktop publishing" (page layout) program, toppled by InDesign). If the Copywriter hadn't finished writing the copy (text), you could add "greeked" gobbledy gook Latin copy to get the "look" for the design/layout and a reasonably accurate word count to fill the space until it was finalized. )

    I digress... (sorry Daozen...)

    Last edited by KiwiElf; 22nd April 2018 at 07:59.

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    Default Re: Overly wordy, lazily formatted or wall o'type posts will dilute the radial power of a thread.

    Quote Posted by Hervé (here)
    Quote Posted by RunningDeer (here)
    [...]It’d be cool if there’s a way for an administrative wizard to work their magic by turning the 'tab.jpg' into a smilie for those that want to indent paragraphs.
    [...]
    [...]
    Quote Posted by RunningDeer (here)
    Quote Posted by Hervé (here)
    Right, it'd be cool indeed, but, before getting into complications, one could have a hand at these:
    --------------------------------------
    =============================
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    My goal was to provide options for those interested. They aren't complicated to me. But like ‘speaking in internet acronyms’ is no biggie for some, this is second nature to me.

    I've used your method, or as I explained above, color the black symbols white: &&&&&&&&&&&


    As for the paragraph indention, it's an image that's approximately 7ish spaces. If turned into a smilie, folks click it and it creates an automatic indention. I'm cool if no one is interested. I'll still use the graphic even if it's not turned into a smilie.
    Sorry RunningDeer, I mistakenly assumed you were talking to us, forum "Admins"...

    One thing to keep in mind with Paula's creative solution if applied by anyone on this here forum is that such separators will be counted as one of the "9 (nine) Pictures/videos/smilies/emojis limit in a post.

    Happy page-layouts, all
    Last edited by Hervé; 22nd April 2018 at 14:54.
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