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Thread: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    Quote Posted by Bob (here)
    The point of thread derailing is very clear - so is trolling to elicit an emotional response instead of a sane objective dialog.

    Point - the body and nerves are incapable of perceiving at the distances which people are using their products, either on their body or on their desk or in their room, or in their office or school, EM. That is documented. That people perceive such is described as nocebo's. Getting people hyped up on social media is a way to program people - documented. I don't buy into effects that are psychosomatic and I don't get psychosomatic effects. That is objective for me. I don't enjoy trolls and trolling concepts, it is disrespectful to the public and reduces the over-all credibility to a truth topic.

    What we are left with is going through the 20 questions if we care to analyze, why is a person believing that they can perceive non-perceivable phenomena? The first question would be, are you using drugs, have you used drugs, and which ones in particular? Do you have any nerve related disease, myelin sheath disease would be the most likely to ask about, then is there a history of any psychiatric disease in yourself or family, have you been treated for any form of such, then objective tests such as EEG and EKG, and blood workups.

    If there is only a desire as some have said that only conspiracy and not truth is to be discussed then it is useless to try to share objectivity, and the forum dives into reactivity.. there are plenty of sections for sharing reactivity and it's great that people can get off their chests what is bugging them. To attempt to slam science, and good objective analysis for hearsay pseudo anecdotal reporting in hopes to convince others to join in without understanding the mechanisms involved I feel is irresponsible or just plain unskilled dialogue in proper debate, or proper sharing.

    The thread topic one more time says personal observations - if that is to be tossed to the wayside, let's petition the thread to be something more like mudslinging, lets trash science and attempt to destroy progress - anyone with me? I bet we'd get a lot of interest, don't you think?
    I appreciate that you don't want beloved technology removed due to hysteria. But I don't discount people's reports that they can feel things science says that they can't. Science is a political and economic football and is probably not much more free than during Galileo's time. And I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss reports of accumulated damage, such as the claims of cell towers causing cancer in children in a CA central valley town.

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    I'm sorry if anyone has been hurt on this thread and I'm sure it was not intentional. I too, believe that technologically implemented emf's (esp.5G) are harmful, and that electrosensitivity does exist, but I cannot be 100% sure and I'm aware (on my side) it is a believe. I'd find it important to listen to Bob's voice, too.

    Once I said regarding a different topic: they don't have to bring ten million migrants into Europe, they just need to make people fear it. I cannot fully reject the possibility of being it similar with emf radiation. That would be devilish clever and it has probably already worked before. We should be allowed to consider that here, even if only as a hypothetical question. Maybe new insights can come out of it. So please, Paul or Constance, I ask humbly to let everyone speak.

    The consensus in alternative thinking (if I'm not misled) is that non-natural emf radiation is dangerous and questioning this certainty maybe has to be brought to the table very cautiously, I don't know. Something is putting human beings under such enormous pressure that they're not able to live together healthy and peacefully. What ist that! Following this trail, I guess, one has to move one level above (or below) the question whether wifi/5G is harmful or not. It does have an effect on me. What if the reason is not said radiation, but something else beyond it?

    I don't know if that makes any sense. I regret not being able to be more precise. At times things just go wrong and in hindsight noone can explain exactly how and why it happened.
    Last edited by Iloveyou; 9th May 2019 at 20:53.

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    I have found it to be true that what you focus on you can bring that to you. Once people feel the effects of EMFs then yes they do tend to focus on it not because of a belief system but because they actually feel it and yes it does make them feel unwell. We are electrical beings and are at our best in a natural environment. We no longer have that. The debate on whether electrosensitivity is real or not is unimportant to those that have it. They know it is real. If you have to experience it first hand to know then so be it. I would not wish it on anyone. Not feeling anything is absolutely not stopping the effects. Dark field microscope blood analysis will show what it does.

    There is incredulity when you ask someone to turn their phone off because it is affecting you. I have had people in my car and asked them to turn off their phones. They do and then sneak them back on. They are dumbfounded when you ask them again to turn it off because you can feel it. Then the idea that someone can feel something begins to penetrate. This is normal life for sensitised people. They are generally used to being labeled weird or reactive or any of the things mentioned on this thread unfortunately and they are certainly not believed. Remember that they cannot escape this environment should they want to go shopping or go to the cinema etc. Generally speaking they know it is pointless to say anything at all. The phone and tech addiction and disbelief overrides compassion and understanding and sensitised people are used to that reaction.

    However they are the very people who others could possibly learn from. These people will be looking for solutions and finding them. They will be avoiding the things that make them feel unwell and cut away from their natural selves. They have every reason to find the answers that others may be desperate to learn one day.
    Trisher

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    It definitely can be felt, it just depends on how sensitive each person is. Not even 5 regular senses work exactly the same for each person.
    Energy workers are definitely more prone to feel things "normal" folks are unable to feel.

    I for example, feel different "emanations" from my phone while I hold it in my hand, if network is set to 2g, 3g, or 4g.
    The "emanations" are even stronger when mobile internet is turned on.

    I can't prove this to anyone nor I want to, but one shouldn't discard something as "nocebo" just because he/she can't experience it.

    Being sceptic is ok, we are all sceptics in one way or the other. But there is a difference between being sceptic and being just ignorant..

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    Quote Posted by MorningFox (here)
    Bob, obviously you fail to understand the vast difference in frequencies between that of the sun and that of 5G. Just because they're both EMF doesn't mean they're the same thing.
    I seriously can't believe that some people compare Sun with man-made devices, like wtf?!

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    I want to emphasise that I have no doubt at all that the experiences of electrosensitive people are authentic and valid. I find them neither 'over'sensitive nor delusional or auto-suggestive, far from it. I, for one, am not a skeptic. I sometimes can feel a strange presence in a room or in a person. You should not have to justify or explain yourself. At first the suffering has to be stopped or at least minimized.

    In case full 5G rollout (and what will come after 5G!) will not be stopped, I feel we need to explore all possible and even the 'impossible' ways how to deal with it personally, even run through thought experiments. I imagíne arriving at a point where my whole spirit-body-mind-system, my entire being unequivocally knows: this shall not affect me. (I don't mean positive thinking or affirmations which work mostly on a very superficial level, if at all.)

    Once, long ago I read the story of an old Japanese man who, when he was a child, was in the midst of the horrors when the atomic bomb fell in 1945. He miraculously was the only one who survived without serious injuries. Later, when asked what had happened to him he answered: I don't know. I saw the fire and I knew that this will not affect me.

    I often tried to find that story again, maybe it is just a legend.

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    Quote Posted by Trisher (here)
    I have found it to be true that what you focus on you can bring that to you. Once people feel the effects of EMFs then yes they do tend to focus on it not because of a belief system but because they actually feel it and yes it does make them feel unwell. We are electrical beings and are at our best in a natural environment. We no longer have that. The debate on whether electrosensitivity is real or not is unimportant to those that have it. They know it is real. If you have to experience it first hand to know then so be it. I would not wish it on anyone. Not feeling anything is absolutely not stopping the effects. Dark field microscope blood analysis will show what it does....
    I am in agreement with almost everything you have said Trisher.
    The only line I would disagree with is this one:
    “I would not wish it on anyone” (not wish EMF sensitivity on anyone)

    Even amongst the EMF-sensitive individuals there is variation.
    Some may be extremely sensitive, others sensitive and still others mildly sensitive.

    I believe that those of us, like me, who are able to feel EMF’s but not be totally overwhelmed by them, are actually in a better situation than those who can’t feel EMF’s.
    The reasoning is simple; if you feel the EMF’s you can try to avoid them.
    Those who can’t feel them obviously won’t look to avoid them.

    In all cases when it gets to the point that I feel EMF’s from any source, I try to move to a location where I can’t feel them, or remove/turn off the device (if possible).

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    I’d just like to clear up a few points.


    Bob’s response to what I said is interesting.

    He stated he doesn’t believe I can feel EMF’s.

    He gave numerous examples how his environment is bathed in EMF’s and he says he can’t feel any ill-effects whatsoever.
    His conclusion up to this point was that EMF’s aren’t affecting his health.

    Yet, when I mentioned that people can come down with brain tumors from cellphone use he exhibited a distinct fear/concern reaction (both publicly and in a private message).

    Quote Posted by Bob (here)
    It bothers me immensely if you are going to tell me it is cumulative - there is nothing cumulative happening. I have had the time for "accumulation" well exceeded by anyone reporting that they got tumors from their cellphone in their breast pocket.
    He stated that he was not just bothered, but immensely bothered.
    Why would someone who was convinced that EMF’s can cause no harm elicit this fear reaction?

    He tried to assure us in the same post that EMF’s don’t scare him:
    Quote “BUT emf doesn't scare me, nor do my electromagnetic tools.”
    And yet in a subsequent post once again he revealed just how concerned he really is:

    Quote Posted by Bob (here)
    “To tell me that I am going to get tumors in my brain from WiFy was definitely a TRIGGER button to me.
    If he truly believes that EMF’s are harmless and can’t be sensed, why would he be “triggered” when the possibility of tumor development was mentioned?

    By the way, I had not singled out Bob specifically as a likely candidate for a brain tumor.
    I was referring to “many people”. This is what I wrote:

    QuoteMany people who like you Bob, thought their health was perfect and couldn't feel any ill-effects later came down with tumors in their brains and other parts of their bodies where they kept their cellphones stored.

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    Quote Posted by DaveToo (here)
    I’d just like to clear up a few points.
    FYI, Bob is apparently unable to respond in this thread (see this post). It would, therefore, seem appropriate for the discussion about Bob to stop, or at least to continue in private if it must.
    "Be a Light to Yourself" ~ J. Krishnamurti

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    Quote Posted by Bob (here)
    To tell me that I am going to get tumors in my brain from WiFy was definitely a TRIGGER button to me. I apologize to the GROUP, the PUBLIC, the MODS and DaveToo if I came across as being unsensitive. I am I believe the most SENSITIVE person that I know who goes above and beyond to help people and to come with with solutions.

    I PM'd @ILoveYou and @DaveToo to express my apology, and asked if I could assist, as I do have experience in diagnostics of background energy of all sorts.
    Had not seen Bob‘s update yet (thought he’d be able to respond again). I protest against barring people (well known and long-standing members) from a thread so quickly for no obvious reasons, and without explanation or even announcing it.

    DaveToo, please let‘s not turn to a personal hickhack of who is right and who is not. It is my experience, that in a controversy both opposite parties are important to listen to. Though I understand that in a situation where one ist heavily affected, it is not easy to take things not personal.

    Add:

    What could people do in case it once happens to be no longer possible to avoid artificially implemented emf radiation, or escape from it. That worries me. I‘m thinking along the lines: when you can‘t change the outside, turn your attention to what you can do from the inside. As that is the only place where we have the last say.

    It would require a huge leap. I‘m also aware it may sound somehow presumptious from someone who doesn‘t feel the ill effects. In the future there might come other things I’ll not be able to escape from. Is it pointless to think about that now?
    Last edited by Iloveyou; 11th May 2019 at 05:48.

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    Quote Posted by Iloveyou (here)
    Had not seen Bob‘s update yet (thought he’d be able to respond again). I protest against barring people (well known and long-standing members) from a thread so quickly for no obvious reasons, and without explanation or even announcing it.
    Hi there ILoveYou

    Apologies for not announcing something earlier. A decision was made to temporarily ban Bob from this thread for the original Ad hominem attacks he made on DaveToo. The moderators are still in discussion as to whether this ban should be made permanent. You can see Bobs original post and my response to Bob here.

    In the meantime, Bob is perfectly welcome to post on any other thread he likes or even start another thread as he suggested, on post # 72
    Last edited by Constance; 11th May 2019 at 09:49. Reason: corrected typos

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    Hi, All:

    I want to clarify some points here, about which I feel strongly.
    • The evidence is so overwhelming that some EMFs are damaging to humans that I regard this as a fact.
    fact
    /fakt/
    noun

    a thing that is known or proved to be true.

    • Some humans are more sensitive to EMFs than others.
    • Some EMFs have been weaponized for exactly the above reason.
    • EMFs are not the same as solar radiation.
    • If one looks up 'electrosmog' and also 'Barrie Trower' one can then start reading got a week. (Or maybe two!)
    • Anyone here who consistently and persistently arguing — or insisting — that EMFs are safe is actually causing harm to the community, whether intentionally or otherwise.
    • Bob is welcome to post his arguments (and has done so, extensively, on the above thread) but when he starts punching below the belt we have to draw the line.


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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    Quote Posted by Daozen (here)
    Searching Homemade Wi-fi blocker might bring up some useful results
    That would not be too wise I guess. I think its easy to determine what material can block wifi signal. But we need to do a trial and error therefore, its good if more will participate in the hunt for wifi blocker.

    So we have a wifi router at home and a laptop or any receiving device. What we need to do is encase or encapsulate the router with the material of choice. If we hit the correct material the connection should terminate. Then of course if you find that wonder material please report it here. Better on a new thread for everyone to see. I will probably start with mylar.

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    I have a few. One is called ethernet connection. A wired connection to the computer and the phone socket. Wifi permanently turned off. Another is the "off" button. Just use briefly or as needed and then turn off. Some people say that when wifi is turned off using the internal computer settings, that it is often turned back on by upgrades. A hunt on EMF sites will reveal a range of materials that would be useful. Some are advertised as blocking wifi but then you find out its only if they are thoroughly wrapped several times with the material. A paint blocker on a custom made box or screen would work but would be expensive. I have seen mesh used to block smart meters by 98%. The thick silver grounding sheet used under bed nets works well.

    The best is always not to have it at all and have the wired connection but I know that for some this would not work.
    Trisher

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    Quote Posted by Trisher (here)
    The best is always not to have it at all and have the wired connection but I know that for some this would not work.
    And if you don't want to run cable, get some powerline adapaters. That's what I do.

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    The first time I was near a microwave tabletop oven I could certainly feel it. That was a looong time ago .

    I was staying with friends and had barely heard of them at the time, but they had one and I could feel it several times during the weekend I was there. I started looking for information on it at the library and local health food store. Eventually I found an article that stated Russia considered microwaves to be a weapon and not to be used as a kitchen appliance. Both are some of the reasons I have never purchased a microwave oven.

    Microave ovens are better shielded now but I can still feel them when close.

    The first time I was around wi-fi I could feel it but didn't know what it was tho' I soon found out. Another time a few years later I was staying with friends in their vacation home. I could feel the difference and I was unable to sleep well those 5 nights. It felt like a heaviness, almost a pounding, an attack. It was a very strong signal for that time and could be picked up from about 30 yards away.

    Here on the island wi-fi is mostly available, but there are many areas where it is not. When I go there, OMG, I can certainly feel the difference. I feel lighter, better. I have wi-fi capability at home but use ethernet cable.

    When the UV radiation from the sun is high I can feel it. It's the most subtle but when I check the levels in my area it corresponds to what I suspect may be high UV.

    So, yes, some people can feel some of these energies.

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    Quote Posted by TomKat (here)
    Quote Posted by Trisher (here)
    The best is always not to have it at all and have the wired connection but I know that for some this would not work.
    And if you don't want to run cable, get some powerline adapaters. That's what I do.
    These adaptors do work to get connectivity wherever there is electricity but sorry to say that when tested with an EMF detector they show an increase in EMFs a few feet out into the room throughout the house.
    Trisher

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    Quote Posted by Trisher (here)
    Quote Posted by TomKat (here)
    Quote Posted by Trisher (here)
    The best is always not to have it at all and have the wired connection but I know that for some this would not work.
    And if you don't want to run cable, get some powerline adapaters. That's what I do.
    These adaptors do work to get connectivity wherever there is electricity but sorry to say that when tested with an EMF detector they show an increase in EMFs a few feet out into the room throughout the house.
    Trisher
    Thanks Trisher.
    In the "Generation Zapped" film that Bill linked to a couple of days ago they mentioned the Powerline adapters as a good alternative to straight WiFi.
    There were some other comments made in the film that I will address shortly in the 5G thread.

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    Quote Posted by Trisher (here)
    Quote Posted by TomKat (here)
    Quote Posted by Trisher (here)
    The best is always not to have it at all and have the wired connection but I know that for some this would not work.
    And if you don't want to run cable, get some powerline adapaters. That's what I do.
    These adaptors do work to get connectivity wherever there is electricity but sorry to say that when tested with an EMF detector they show an increase in EMFs a few feet out into the room throughout the house.
    Trisher
    Well that's a bit different to broadcasting a microwave signal..

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    Default Re: Link between WiFi and quality of life. Personal observations.

    "Our society is run by insane people for insane objectives."
    --John Lennon

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