When You Feel Like Giving Up

[Mike]

Posted by Valerie Villars (here)
Mike, the idea of giving a long, well thought out reply just gives me a headache.

But, the short answer to why we are more poor is that we are less mercenary than the rest of the population.

Take heart. Blessed are the poor for they shall inherit the earth.

I can hardly blame you!

I'm exhausted already...and the thread hasn't even reached page 2. Honestly there's a small part of me that hopes people will just stop posting here Then i'll stop too.. ..

I may change the title of the thread to "When A Non Intellectual Tries To Play The Intellectual' lol...it results in very disjointed, long, meandering posts that nobody really wants to read!

You made me laugh. Thx Val.

[ErtheVessel]

I think part of what happens is that self-reflection and self-responsibility are incredibly hard work. It can be very daunting to face one's inner broken places and slowly clear a path away from the well of ancient sorrows.

Jordan Peterson is a contributor to a website called Self-Authoring where there seems to be guidance provided (for a price) in the form of a program where people can rewrite the script of their life, which indicates to me he is also aware of the hard inner psychological work that most of us would benefit from doing. But there are as many paths to self-reflection and inner work as there are people. (And I am not promoting JP's site - I really know nothing about it other than the fact that it exists.)

The woo woo and conspiracy escapes that you speak of, Mike, can be so interesting, compelling and energizing exactly because they distract us from the exploration and the wrangling of one's own inner demons. And it is especially compelling because there is so very much real truth in the conspiracy frame of reality.

But I am a firm believer that the world around me changes only when I genuinely change from deep inside.

The alleged inscription over the Temple of Delphi, "Know Thyself" becomes more and more profound for me the older I get.

I hope all of this doesn't sound pompous, as I have not arrived at any exceptional heights, but I know for sure that I am slightly less nuts than I used to be, and that is quite a relief, for me, as well as for probably everyone I know.

[Bill Ryan]

Do please see my post #2, here on this new thread:

• When it’s Not your Body, but your Soul that’s Tired.

[Valerie Villars]

Posted by Mike (here)

Posted by Valerie Villars (here)
Mike, the idea of giving a long, well thought out reply just gives me a headache.

But, the short answer to why we are more poor is that we are less mercenary than the rest of the population.

Take heart. Blessed are the poor for they shall inherit the earth.

I can hardly blame you!

I'm exhausted already...and the thread hasn't even reached page 2. Honestly there's a small part of me that hopes people will just stop posting here Then i'll stop too.. ..

I may change the title of the thread to "When A Non Intellectual Tries To Play The Intellectual' lol...it results in very disjointed, long, meandering posts that nobody really wants to read!

You made me laugh. Thx Val.

Mike, I feel like a fish out of water here sometimes, because there are so many intelligent people who post incredible stuff. It's not that you aren't intelligent or I'm not. It's just a different kind of intelligence.

I remember thinking one day, shortly before I got laid off, "Why I'm smarter than they are" referring to the scientists I worked with, because they are generally not balanced. They have tunnel vision.

I'll stop posting so you can have a rest.

And as always Bill, you are a real gift from God. I can't think of another person like you.

[Bob]

Its interesting Val what you say about working with scientists with 'tunnel vision'. I got into a bit of a discussion with one of them in the medical field. He was indeed one of the best specialists, and the specialist vibrations causes them to be "compartmentalized", focused, and generally anti-social. He got so extremely pissed off when I was working a computer while he was jabbering about his view of the world, jumping on me in a huff, why wasn't I paying attention to him. (I was working with another fellow at the time, showing him something he was more interested in than the 'scientist's jabbering..) I responded, _______, my dear fellow, I can do 5 things simultaneously. I multi-task, not only have I been following what you are talking about, I've solved it and come up with a series of questions which will test your hypothesis, and then come up with solution and alternatives. I beg you to "chill".. And he stormed out in an arrogant huff.

That's the issue being forced into doing something that one is not interested in, especially a task given to one by another, who "knows best". Don't change if it works for you to suit another. Their issues are their issues, you have one's choice to view from a perspective of optimism, or pessimism, to "believe" that someone else has the "answers for you", or not.

A good question to ask oneself is this, "What is it that I have with-held from 'myself' and haven't communicated to ME". Communicate that and there is no more a "giving up feeling".. Giving up happens when one hasn't listened to oneself nor adequately communicated with oneself. One made goals at one time, was maybe told those goals are unachievable by others. If one believed that, one then was programmed by others to do another's wishes, thereby evoking frustration, "ole sarge feelings", feelings of powerless... Communicate. Starting with oneself..

[AutumnW]

What an amazing thread! Heartfelt thanks to all who opened up here.

Mike, you mentioned a few times that you were low on the dominance hierarchy? I think I have that right? I thought long and hard about that and about Jordan Peterson. Peterson is very articulate, a great thinker. He appears to be a realist and common sense guy.

Go clean your room! Certainly...this is so basic that people handily overlook the necessity of maintaining structure and order in the mundane world. We retain or acquire dignity by exerting our will in the most fundamental ways, in areas where nearly all of us can function.

You can tell whose lives are a complete (and largely unnecessary) mess by entering their homes. They live in chaos, over shop, over eat, over drink, start projects they never finish and are always embroiled in drama that is someone else's fault. If somebody has to kick an old empty pizza box out of the way to greet you at the door, their subsequent tales of woe are often their own creations.

But....as far as the Peterson video goes, it's really necessary to bare in mind that he is addressing Ivy League kids. If his prescriptions for a successful life aren't placed in the proper context, they feed delusions of the hard right.

--will submit this now and return to it later! Am very exhausted.

[Valerie Villars]

Posted by Bob (here)
Its interesting Val what you say about working with scientists with 'tunnel vision'. I got into a bit of a discussion with one of them in the medical field. He was indeed one of the best specialists, and the specialist vibrations causes them to be "compartmentalized", focused, and generally anti-social. He got so extremely pissed off when I was working a computer while he was jabbering about his view of the world, jumping on me in a huff, why wasn't I paying attention to him. (I was working with another fellow at the time, showing him something he was more interested in than the 'scientist's jabbering..) I responded, _______, my dear fellow, I can do 5 things simultaneously. I multi-task, not only have I been following what you are talking about, I've solved it and come up with a series of questions which will test your hypothesis, and then come up with solution and alternatives. I beg you to "chill".. And he stormed out in an arrogant huff.

That's the issue being forced into doing something that one is not interested in, especially a task given to one by another, who "knows best". Don't change if it works for you to suit another. Their issues are their issues, you have one's choice to view from a perspective of optimism, or pessimism, to "believe" that someone else has the "answers for you", or not.

A good question to ask oneself is this, "What is it that I have with-held from 'myself' and haven't communicated to ME". Communicate that and there is no more a "giving up feeling".. Giving up happens when one hasn't listened to oneself nor adequately communicated with oneself. One made goals at one time, was maybe told those goals are unachievable by others. If one believed that, one then was programmed by others to do another's wishes, thereby evoking frustration, "ole sarge feelings", feelings of powerless... Communicate. Starting with oneself..

They (and they did have some very nice ones who seemed to have a clue) for the most part were in a huff because I wasn't intimidated by them because they were "smarter" than me. One actually got very ugly because I addressed him by his first name in an email.

He very ugily explained to me that unless I had a doctorate, I had no right to do so and that when addressing his highness, I had to use the word Dr. in front of his name. He was actually a pompous idiot.

Sorry Mike for derailing.

[Bob]

I don't think it is derailing - the subject line for the thread talks about giving up.. Why one gives up comes from being badgered, being told one is nothing (and believing it), and to watch especially those with the "uniforms", the "labels" do that, with intimidation is how the alleged "authority" nails one to a cross to prove to themselves or "show off to others" that they are best. It is a sicko-alpha mentality that pushes one who is asking questions into submission.

No stinkin phD or other degree makes one any better than any other, nor does any suit, badge, uniform, stick or rock. It just defines how well they are adept at bullying, or lying that they are superior to others. After a while of a life of that, one "gives up", or one understands how to rebel against that effectively.

Or one is able to define that the "emperor has no clothes". It is falling for the programming, and feeling powerless. With the point about communicating with oneself, that rehabilitates ability for having goals identified once again, those suppressed or buried by 'other's' intimidations.

[Ernie Nemeth]

I chose to be poor. I chose to live life on my terms. I forgot I have no one to blame but myself.
Nobody dominates me ever. If I cannot reason with them I become combative. If that doesn't work I leave.
Sometimes that has cost me much. My most recent rebelliousness has cost me at least several hundred thousand dollars and a whole lot of needless stress.
Hey, not bad for phone pecking...

[AutumnW]

....continued.

As far as the dominance hierarchy goes, most millenials and many Gen X'rs are low on the hierarchy as there are political and economic forces at play here that the individual has little control over. The service industry has been the one sector where jobs are being created. The middle rungs of the class ladder have been sawed off, as those without money serve cocktails, lattes, croissants to those who do. This has to be taken into account, or those who are doing all the right things, can still be crushed under the weight of their own self contempt.

Through other Peterson videos I see he IS providing a valuable service. He is giving young men, in particular, a stern talking to, as males, not neutered beings forced to aquiesce to delusions that radiate from ivory tower academia. As much as the hard right are saddled with their own delusions, the radical academic left has morphed from being pro-feminist to an incomprehensible jabbering idiot. It's infantile. That's it. It has become pro- wailing infant.

Back to your point about power and dominance and where you fit in, Mike and this goes for others as well. You may lack financial power, but you are an intellectual force to contend with and you have something that many with power lack and that is natural authority and influence, through the written word.

By chance, I watched a movie on Netflix related to a lot of the ideas here called, "Brad's Status," and a documentary by one of the young members of the Johnston And Johnson dynasty. Think his name is Simon Johnson and the documentary is called, "Rich Kids." You can find it on YouTube.

[RunningDeer]

Posted by AutumnW (here)
By chance, I watched a movie on Netflix related to a lot of the ideas here called, "Brad's Status," and a documentary by one of the young members of the Johnston And Johnson dynasty. Think his name is Simon Johnson and the documentary is called, "Rich Kids." You can find it on YouTube.

Other episodes of “Rich Kids” around the world.

BRAD'S STATUS Trailer (2017)

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=HWx0PdOI98s

Rich Kids Of Instagram Full Documentary

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=ve78KJAY6qw

Richest Kids In The World!

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=s32t_vpaj10

♡

[AutumnW]

Running Deer,

You're the best!! Thanks. The Rich Kids video I was referring to was called just that, "Rich Kids." I will see if I can find it. These videos are enlightening, too.

[AutumnW]

"Born Rich" Children of the Insanely Wealthy. I was mistaken...again. Happening much more these days. Scary!

If you could provide a link I would much appreciate it!

[RunningDeer]

Posted by AutumnW (here)
"Born Rich" Children of the Insanely Wealthy. I was mistaken...again. Happening much more these days. Scary!

If you could provide a link I would much appreciate it!

Born Rich: Children Of The Insanely Wealthy

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=mQxYQmn62Qk

[AutumnW]

Muchos Grassy Ass, Running Deer!!!

[shaberon]

Posted by Mike (here)

I worry that 3d-reality-as-illusion is sort of like the new age's answer to the biblical 'rapture'. If the world isn't real (or in the case of the bible, is going to end at any moment) and nothing really matters, why do anything? Why even lift a finger? Apathy sets in. Nihilism. It tends to suck the motivation out of the room

...This is the concept of the "warrior" in the Castaneda material.

Yes exactly...that describes another error that will make you want to give up. By "illusion", there is no intent to say "non-existent", let alone "meaningless". 3D is simply not permanent, always changing; nothing is stable, and there is no lasting happiness ever to be found by looking at worldly affairs.

When you emphasize "experience", and as Foxie Loxie says in the next post, making consciousness primary right from the start, there is no escapism. Puts us in the warrior position. There remain things inside ourselves that simply must be destroyed, which is our own responsibility. Others may encourage us, but no one else can do it. There is no reason I should get angry today, but, I already have, simply because I am not strong enough to let go of certain impulses inside myself. Even though I know it buries the actual nature of consciousness, which is pure and blissful. That nature is permanent and real, but, aside from perhaps a few brief tastes, it is very, very difficult to keep it anchored in the brain, since the slightest disturbance will whisk it away. Any attachment to the illusion will do that.

In Bhagavad Gita, Arjuna slew some 250,000 of his own kinsmen without getting angry. He really wanted to give up and not do it. But it was his duty. Most of us are not Princes, but in some small way, we have a duty to protect the helpless just the same. Arjuna was not even a perfected soul. He simply gained the ability to sacrifice his apathy and face danger. This is the way to proceed, even though many times the helpless person we are protecting is our self.

[RunningDeer]

Posted by AutumnW (here)
Muchos Grassy Ass, Running Deer!!!

De nada, AutumnW.

[Foxie Loxie]

Hey, Val....You are a fish that jumped into the right pond!!(Hope that wasn't racist!) Isn't is wonderful when you discover there is nothing wrong with YOU?!!

If others are unable to "relate" to you, it's simply because they are operating on a different wavelength. I admire very much how you have come through all your "stuff" & how you have dealt with it! Kudos to you, Dear Girl!! Avalon IS the place for you....we all just keep learning as we go!

[Valerie Villars]

Foxie, you are such an angel.

In looking back over my life, I used to wonder why everyone else in my family got the cush job in the family business, when I had just as much of a right as they did.

But now I see how my inability to pretend the emperor had clothes on and my instinctive push for truth and meaning just made me stronger and stronger and stronger. I don't feel less than anyone but know learning is never ending.

I realize now, as hard as it was, taking the road less traveled was the way to go. Blessings to you little sister.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Posted by RunningDeer (here)

Posted by AutumnW (here)
"Born Rich" Children of the Insanely Wealthy. I was mistaken...again. Happening much more these days. Scary!

If you could provide a link I would much appreciate it!

Born Rich: Children Of The Insanely Wealthy

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=mQxYQmn62Qk

Well that was an interesting film. They are just as petty and silly as anyone else, but with more money.

[Billy]

Much love to everyone. All I have to say for the noo is "never give up".

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=98lNKjwYtaU