View Poll Results: Is energy a 'thing'?

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Thread: There is no such 'thing' as energy.

  1. Link to Post #21
    United States Avalon Member Bo Atkinson's Avatar
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    Default Re: There is no such 'thing' as energy.

    Agreed about semantics/ meanings/ ontology/ …

    I take credibility-risks, tirelessly uprooting my collected learnings. I love extensively comprehensive books or ideas, where whole systems are promised. I have finally read through my first 20 hours of Hylozoics and offer an excerpt using some words relevant to the thread.

    From http://www.laurency.com/
    1.26 Material Energy
    1Energy in the scientific sense is matter in motion. All higher kinds of matter (atomic kinds, molecular kinds) are energy in relation to all lower kinds.
    2Matter does not dissolve into energy, but into higher matter.
    3When matter ceases to move, its quality of being energy ceases.
    4All forces of nature are matter. There are more than 2400 different kinds of forces of nature
    within the solar system. Every molecular kind contains 49 different layers of matter, which can all act as energy.
    1.27 The Cosmic Motion
    1The cosmic motion (in the 49 atomic kinds) is the result of a constant current of primordial atoms (primary matter) flowing down from the highest atomic world through the atoms of all the worlds unto the lowest world, then returning to the highest world to begin their circulation anew, and this continuing as long as the existence of the lower worlds is necessary. There are two kinds of atoms: negative and positive. In the negative (receptive) atoms, material energy flows from a higher atomic kind to a lower one; in the positive (propulsive) atoms, from a lower to a higher one. This current is the force that maintains the atoms, molecules, material aggregates in their given forms. As a result, all atoms in all worlds, and consequently all molecules and aggregates, radiate material energy, in doing which the aggregate always in some respect communicates something of its individual character. Therefore, every aggregate emits specialized energy.
    2Vibrations are the result of higher kinds of matter penetrating lower kinds. This fact has given rise to the saying that everything consists of vibrations.



    I like to map ‘things’ out for my mind’s eye and this one needs a Hylozoic follow up…( from my web blogs)…

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    Canada Avalon Member
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    Default Re: There is no such 'thing' as energy.

    Quote Posted by Hervé (here)
    If energy can be "harnessed," and follows ever unchanging physical rules... then it's a "thing," not a concept.
    I'm pretty sure energy has mass too. A quick google search says light doesn't have mass, but I'm not talking about light! Consider with a battery. Used up batteries weigh a LOT less than ones which are full of energy. If you were to look that one up, you'd find much debate - but personally I can tell the difference between a full battery and an empty one just by lifting it.

    Quote Posted by Anchor (here)

    Energy is not a thing.

    Thoughts though... are things
    Everything is a "thing", silly

    That's why it's called EveryThing =)

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    UK Avalon Founder Bill Ryan's Avatar
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    Default Re: There is no such 'thing' as energy.

    Quote Posted by PurpleLama (here)
    http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread1208085/pg1

    Same posts, word for word, from the OP, here. I don't know if this is of any interest.
    Yes. What Colin's doing is copying sections from his free online book, and posting them to both ATS and here.

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    Default Re: There is no such 'thing' as energy.

    I think you might find some answers in David Wilcock's work. I've read some of his books and I am now watching his Wisdom Teachings TV series. He actually goes into quite a lot of detail regarding this issue. From what I understand and also my own experiences, it would appear that we will have to resurrect the notion of aether. There appears to be some sort of aetheric substance that makes up the visible universe and every observable phenomenon is basically a form of motion in this transfer medium, which appears to be fluidic in nature. Energy in this framework would be movement in fluid. So you have various waves and vortices. A particle is a standing wave in fluid, the vibration creates a simple geometric pattern which then forms more complex geometric patterns called atoms, molecules, DNA molecules, living cells, living organisms and so forth. Galaxies, planets, even living things are spinning vortices in fluid, like a tornado or a sea current. This actually explains the chakras and kundalini as well. What we perceive as energy is simply movement. The faster it spins or vibrates, the higher the energy state and temperature. That is why when Yogis meditate heat is generated, sometimes immense heat, a function of how fast they can make their chakras and Kundalini spin and vibrate. The more energy or in other words motion they can generate, the higher the temperature.

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    Canada Avalon Member Ernie Nemeth's Avatar
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    Default Re: There is no such 'thing' as energy.

    Science is the study of the observable. Sometimes the observation is inferred based upon past conclusions and theory. So, for instance, neutrinos cannot be seen or observed but have been detected based on the theory of energy exchange.

    Much of theoretical science is merely the plumbing of current scientific models - getting in there and really testing in minute detail, using mostly mathematics, to determine the validity or extend the range of scientific models.

    Hands on observations require fundamental understanding of the observed. Observational science often precedes the theory, however, so that is why so many discoveries have been made accidentally by scientists. They were running experiments that had unexpected results, and got lucky.

    Often the best machines are thought up by scientists and theorists but it takes the genius of an engineer to actually bring it to market. You simply cannot escape the hands on part - the dirty part.

    Getting stuck on "things" is not very helpful. A thing is a concept. All concepts are valid. It is the model, the theory, the context, that determines which things are intrinsic and which are composite and reducible to other concepts.

    Energy is not understood, apart from the names for it. All energy has mass, all mass has energy, they are interchangeable and therefore not separate entities.

    What is real? What do you define as real? If I am "real" then energy is also very much real. Neither is it imagined - not here in this contextual place.

    Separate me from my body and if I remain sentient I might start rethinking what is real and what is truly a thing.

    Nice to have you on board, Colin, Chris.
    Last edited by Ernie Nemeth; 5th June 2018 at 22:26.
    Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless — like water...Now water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend. Bruce Lee

    Free will can only be as free as the mind that conceives it.

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  10. Link to Post #26
    United States Avalon Member Valerie Villars's Avatar
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    Default Re: There is no such 'thing' as energy.

    Quote Posted by Chris (here)
    I think you might find some answers in David Wilcock's work. I've read some of his books and I am now watching his Wisdom Teachings TV series. He actually goes into quite a lot of detail regarding this issue. From what I understand and also my own experiences, it would appear that we will have to resurrect the notion of aether. There appears to be some sort of aetheric substance that makes up the visible universe and every observable phenomenon is basically a form of motion in this transfer medium, which appears to be fluidic in nature. Energy in this framework would be movement in fluid. So you have various waves and vortices. A particle is a standing wave in fluid, the vibration creates a simple geometric pattern which then forms more complex geometric patterns called atoms, molecules, DNA molecules, living cells, living organisms and so forth. Galaxies, planets, even living things are spinning vortices in fluid, like a tornado or a sea current. This actually explains the chakras and kundalini as well. What we perceive as energy is simply movement. The faster it spins or vibrates, the higher the energy state and temperature. That is why when Yogis meditate heat is generated, sometimes immense heat, a function of how fast they can make their chakras and Kundalini spin and vibrate. The more energy or in other words motion they can generate, the higher the temperature.
    Chris, I actually understood that explanation so thanks. I have a hard time bending my mind around most scientifically explained physics. The more complex, the more my eyes roll back in my head.
    "The only true currency in this bankrupt world is what we share with someone when we are uncool." From the movie "Almost Famous""l "Let yourself stand cool and composed before a million universes." Walt Whitman

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  12. Link to Post #27
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    Default Re: There is no such 'thing' as energy.

    I agree, Valerie. The more I study this, the more I find that traditional explanations of how the universe works and what it's made up of are needlessly complicated and are generally just stabs in the dark. The beauty of this new physics, which has mostly been developed by Russian scientists, unbeknownst to most Westerners, is its simplicity. It turns out we don't need higher dimensions, exotic particles, dark matter or energy, vibrating strings, parallel universes, etc... All observable phenomena can be explained by vibrating patterns in a fluidic medium, which then create more complex patterns through geometry. This is where sacred geometry, numerology and astrology comes in and suddenly becomes fully explainable by science. It also explains things like telepathy, quantum non-locality, time travel, antigravity and faster than light travel. Once this becomes mainstream I think we can expect a melding of science and spirituality as they become one and the same.

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