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Thread: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

  1. Link to Post #961
    United States Avalon Member Bluegreen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Why did you kick out Turiya (who was not mean-spirited and brought valuable information) for ONE relatively innocuous post on TOT and accept Aragorn despite many many MANY extremely mean-spirited and downright nasty posts on the same forum?

    And why do you accept the boring Numbers Guy and kick out the interesting Mars Guy?

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    I beg to differ. Turiya wrote some extremely mean-spirited things, and I had a PM to prove it until I deleted it.
    Boring and/or interesting are pretty much a matter of personal preference.
    Generally I've found the Mods have good reasons for the actions they take.

    Quote Posted by Bluegreen (here)
    Why did you kick out Turiya (who was not mean-spirited and brought valuable information) for ONE relatively innocuous post on TOT and accept Aragorn despite many many MANY extremely mean-spirited and downright nasty posts on the same forum?

    And why do you accept the boring Numbers Guy and kick out the interesting Mars Guy?
    Each breath a gift...
    _____________

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Quote Posted by onawah (here)
    Boring and/or interesting are pretty much a matter of personal preference.
    I think broadly speaking that is true, it's a very subjective state of affairs.

    Quote Posted by onawah (here)
    Generally I've found the Mods have good reasons for the actions they take.
    Based on my own observation of the time and deliberation that the moderators take on decisions, that's also true. There's time consumed on matters that other forums wouldn't spend two minutes on.

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    United States Avalon Member Bluegreen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Thank you Peter
    Last edited by Bluegreen; 5th January 2020 at 08:37.

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    UK Avalon Founder Bill Ryan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Quote Posted by Deneon (here)
    Hi Bill,

    I’ve always been curious about this, but somehow never thought to ask in this thread. Your comments about Daniel and his PDF papers in your recent post reminded me. You’re right in saying that his real name is not all that hard to find..

    As far as I can tell, some of the knowledge comes from nuts and bolts research, and not everything in his papers is necessarily from first hand knowledge because of his alleged involvement in the montauk project. His papers are very interesting, but i’m unsure how much of what he states is fact and how much is speculation.

    I’m curious what your thought are on the questions below:

    1. Have you ever met him in person? If so, can you share anything about that meeting?
    2. What is your opinion about his research in his papers? Do you think it’s mostly first hand knowledge?
    3. What are you thought about the events that supposedly happened at the montauk project in general?
    No, I never met with him, or corresponded with him at all. I figured out who he was, and then started reading his website. His name is Dr Bruce Peret. (No breach of confidentiality. It's easy to verify, all on public record. His website is here.)

    Interesting question about his research. I agree that some of it definitely seems to be speculation (some of which is pretty wild).

    I don't know as much about Montauk as some others do. I talked with Camelot witness 'Henry Deacon' (real name Arthur Neumann) extensively about this. He said a couple of interesting things:
    1. The term should really be the Montauk Projects (with an 's').
    2. Peter Moon's first two 'Montauk' books were quite accurate ('Henry' said), but after that the story told became more and more inaccurate.
    Possibly of interest, I have some information, unverified, that the original very advanced research that led to the Montauk Project(s) was started in the late 1940s at Brookhaven Labs. I do NOT know if that's correct or not.



    There's an existing thread here, and I'll copy these two posts over there to continue the interesting discussion.

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Quote Posted by Bluegreen (here)
    Why did you kick out Turiya (who was not mean-spirited and brought valuable information) for ONE relatively innocuous post on TOT [...
    Bill didn't ban turiya. It was Hervé who did that. Bill was not anywhere near his computer at the time, and as I gather, there had been a lot more going on between turiya and the mods here than that one post over at The One Truth.

    We have also banned turiya from The One Truth, because although you describe him as not being mean-spirited, he repeatedly and consistently ignored and defied the forum rules and the warnings from the staff. We do not allow propaganda at The One Truth ─ and especially not right-wing propaganda in which South-American immigrants to the US are referred to as a caravan of disease and pestilence ─ and turiya was repeatedly flipping us the bird whenever we put a halt to his incessant posting of propaganda. He would also hijack other threads for the posting of the same kind of propaganda, and he tried to manipulate the staff.

    Mean-spirited or not, but such a character is not desirable in any community that wishes to call itself alternative.

    Quote Posted by Bluegreen (here)
    ...] and accept Aragorn despite many many MANY extremely mean-spirited and downright nasty posts on the same forum?
    Apparently you hold grudges for very long, and just as apparently you're only doing half your homework while under the impression that it entitles you to casting a judgment. You'd be a poor choice as a jury member, let alone a judge. I even strongly suspect a political bias on your part as an influence in said judgment.

    People do change their minds over time, and most of the bad things I had said about Bill were essentially all regurgitated from what Corey Goode and a few other ex-Avalonians had been telling us. But a few years ago, a situation occurred over at The One Truth that necessitated that I contacted Bill about it in person, via email. Bill's response to me ─ and the followup exchanges ─ made me realize that I had been misjudging him.

    It was a slow but steady process of personal awakening, coupled to a strong and growing sentiment of shame over what I had been saying about Bill in the past. I have in the meantime ─ and if I'm not mistaken, repeatedly ─ offered Bill my apologies for my mistakes, and Bill has magnanimously accepted my apologies too, as well as that he himself apologized to me in the same breath over having banned me because of the Simon Parkes affair.

    There is a whole lot more to that, too, which involved a prophetic dream I had about Project Avalon and The One Truth being two physical campuses, separated by walking distance, and how I then ran into Bill on the fields in between both campuses, and we ended up washing down a few beers at the bar. And long before my account was restored here, I had already regularly been talking back and forth with Bill via email, on various things, including technical matters. I have even shared some of our scripting with Bill and the mods here, and I have done so gladly.

    Bill and I have forgiven each other, and Bill has himself offered to restore my account here at Project Avalon ─ an offer that I gladly accepted, although I have never requested that he would do so. I genuinely respect Bill, and I have the impression that Bill respects me too. If I were to run into him in the flesh ─ which is probably never going to happen, both because of the distance between us and my faltering health ─ then I'd shake his hand, give him a big hug and buy him a drink.

    If Bill could forgive me, then why can't you? There's a lesson in there somewhere, Grasshopper.

    Lastly, one more thing... I don't wish to hijack this thread, so if you don't like me, then just add me to your ignore list. It's what many others here have done as well. But this is Bill's forum, and it is up to him ─ not you ─ to decide who is welcome here and who isn't.

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Quote Posted by Bluegreen (here)
    Whatever happened to the transcription of the very first interview with Corey Goode and Christine that I laboriously and accurately wrote down with pencil and paper and typed out and submitted for the PA readership's benefit and never saw online?
    Hi there, and thanks for the question. For reference, here's the transcript:
    Yes, we really appreciated that at the time. If I never fully expressed that, then I really do apologize. Back then, which now feels about 100 years ago (Oct—Dec 2014), seven circles of hell were starting to break loose behind the scenes on several quarters.

    Soon after the video of the audio interview was published (28 Oct 2014), several things started to happen. There was an initiative to create a transcript, which (as best I can see) started here, in post #549 (and in the subsequent reply posts) on 29 Nov 2014.

    Quote Posted by Bluegreen (here)
    Quote Posted by Daozen (here)
    Quote Posted by Bluegreen (here)
    Quote Posted by Daozen (here)
    We could always try and crowdwrite a transcript of the bad quality audio mp3:

    http://piratepad.net/Aoq64wz3SR
    Please do. That would be a dream come true.

    I can help, but I can't do it on my own. So if Bill or GoodET don't give the go ahead and promote it, I'd be wasting my time. 20 of us could put in 5 minutes each and get it done.
    OK I'm in ...
    But that was on 29 November. In the month that had passed since the release of the interview, Corey had changed his demeanor markedly. He'd done a short second interview, but both the audio quality and the content quality were so poor that I told him I wouldn't publish it, recommending that the half-hour follow-up interview be re-done, a simple thing to do. (Ironically, I was merely trying to protect him from criticism, but he saw it as my censorship or attack.)

    And Stacy, his wife, had joined the forum as SilverPhoenix. That was all fine, till the following blew up big time all of a sudden on 15 December. That was just a couple weeks later, during which time I'd been gradually editing the transcript.

    Once it became clear that Corey had become an enemy (threatening to release a claimed 70-page FBI dossier on me that he said he'd received), closely followed by a stream of [now-deleted] blog posts about Avalon and myself in January 2015 that were hateful in the extreme, I declined to take the transcript matter any further.

    And, those longstanding members with elephantine memories may recall that at that same time, Christine, who'd done the initial interview and was at that time a diehard Corey supporter, was (with then-moderators karelia and Hazel) mounting a behind-the-scenes campaign against myself and the other mods, that was without exaggeration an attempted coup.

    Christine was my wife at the time, and she walked out the house on 14 December (the day before Stacy Goode's blowup), never to return. So — to put it mildly! — I and the other mods all had our hands rather full. I do hope all this helps to explain why the transcript was never completed or published.

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    I can vouch for the accuracy and preciseness of Bill's post.
    All the above is all and only my opinion - all subject to change and not meant to be true for anyone else regardless of how I phrase it.

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    UK Avalon Founder Bill Ryan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Quote Posted by Bluegreen (here)
    Why did you kick out Turiya (who was not mean-spirited and brought valuable information) for ONE relatively innocuous post on TOT and accept Aragorn despite many many MANY extremely mean-spirited and downright nasty posts on the same forum?

    And why do you accept the boring Numbers Guy and kick out the interesting Mars Guy?
    Thanks for that, too.... it's actually always been a little unexpected that members here haven't been asking any questions here about mods' decisions!

    I really can't add much more than onawah's and Aragorn's replies just above. Many members know that when a post is reported, it auto-generates a new thread that goes into a mods behind-the-scenes section called Reported Posts. (And mods can report posts themselves, of course, to bring things to the attention of the others if needed.)

    That whole section forms a detailed searchable archive, going back nearly a decade. That helps us all, and especially newer mods, to look up and see what might have happened with any member (in any way, for whatever reason, positive or not-quite-so-positive). That all simply helps us to provide the best support possible, and make the best decisions that we feel we can.

    So when I saw your question, I looked up the report threads featuring turiya. There were 36 (thirty-six) of them, all problematic (some seriously so), which has to be close to some kind of forum record.

    He was a serial offender in many ways, and upset many other members over a steady period of years. During that time, we always gave him a pretty long rope. And yes, it was Hervé who finally banned him, not myself.

    But I did 100% endorse his decision. He had gradually grown to become more and more strident, extreme, and critical — quite virulently and unpleasantly (and inaccurately!) so.

    One of the factors there (but one of many) was that he was a strong Trump supporter (see his thread Transition into Trump), and also a strong Qanon proponent.

    As some reading this will know, the whole Qanon issue (with several members, not all still here or active) seemed to generate strength of feeling, emotion, antagonism and sometimes even sheer unpleasantness (even behind the scenes among some of the mods) that was really hard to understand.

    Thankfully, that steadily-burning but erosively-destructive fire, that was extremely hard to control, has now died down and is pretty much cold out. We've even considered making the Q threads public again, as there's nothing happening any more that shows the forum in a poor light.

    We're very genuinely appreciative of that, taking the opportunity here to thank all those who are involved for their self-moderation and balance.

    Last edited by Bill Ryan; 5th January 2020 at 15:56.

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    United States Avalon Member Mike's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    if i may, just briefly...

    contrary to popular belief, Bill is not always responsible for bannings and retirements(as Aragorn's example with Turiya demonstrates). sometimes he's not even there for the decision. sometimes he steps aside and just lets the mods make the decision, even if he doesn't necessarily agree with what they've decided. and when he is involved in these types of decisions, his vote is just one of many, and holds no more weight than anyone else's( this applies 99% of the time. in my time as moderator, Bill might have made a solo decision once or twice, when he felt very strongly about something. or he might act as a deciding vote if the mods were at a standstill, but that was very rare).


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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Hi Bill. Do you have anecdotal or any other evidence of would-be Avalon members who have been prevented from joining this forum because of (say) the draconian censorship laws of that country. The most obvious to my mind is China and her Great Firewall. Ditto any other countries with deeply insecure governments that prevent the dissemination of information because of, well because nanny knows best. Thanks in anticipation.

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    UK Avalon Founder Bill Ryan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Quote Posted by happyuk (here)
    Hi Bill. Do you have anecdotal or any other evidence of would-be Avalon members who have been prevented from joining this forum because of (say) the draconian censorship laws of that country. The most obvious to my mind is China and her Great Firewall. Ditto any other countries with deeply insecure governments that prevent the dissemination of information because of, well because nanny knows best. Thanks in anticipation.
    Interesting question! And many thanks. But to our awareness, nothing like this has ever happened. We've had 29 active members from China, and none of them ever reported (even by email) they were prevented from participating.

    The greatest number of threads (16) posted by a Chinese member was by xidaijena, who lived in a really beautiful-looking commune which she posted extensively about. Here she is:



    The most interesting of those, from 2013 (with 374 posts) was
    She's not visited the forum since March 2019, but we know of no reason to suspect she was somehow barred from doing so.

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Quote Posted by Mypos (here)
    Which book or website would you recommend to get a peek inside what Scientology really is about?
    As best I know — and you may find this hard to believe — there are none at all.

    You'll find many websites (and Church of Scientology publications) that eulogize the entire thing. That's all distorted, often extremely so.

    You'll also find many other websites (and books, and documentaries, and TV series) that ridicule, criticize and dismiss the entire subject in often emotional and vitriolic terms. Much of that is distorted, too, or features major inaccuracies or omissions.

    It all has to be there in order to really understand the entire topic

    There's nothing that I know of that portrays the entire subject, and its history including that of Hubbard, in all its complexity, in an accurate and balanced way. That's a momentous task. It was only recently that I fully realized this has never actually been done.

    There are three books I'd recommend, but they only portray the history: the first book all the history, and the second two a very detailed part of it. Nothing at all about the processes and their application, which is a very major component.

    The books are excellent, and information about the processes is omitted because the authors truly weren't qualified or experienced to comment. So they just did an admirable job on the history alone. But that's only half the story.
    1. Bare-Faced Messiah: The True Story of L. Ron Hubbard (Russell Miller)
    2. Commodore's Messenger: A Child Adrift in the Scientology Sea Organization (Janis Gillham-Grady)
    3. Commodore's Messenger Book II: Riding Out The Storms with L. Ron Hubbard (Janis Gillham-Grady)
    I started a website myself, a few months ago, in an attempt to rectify all this — because I do have quite a good understanding of all of it (and I'm not sure that very many do). But the more I worked on it, the more it struck me that there was just more and more and more. It's extremely hard to compress and summarize. That's still a work in progress, and I don't know yet if it's possible.

    I found this book gives an interesting perspective on L. Ron and some of the Sci-Fi roots of Scientology:

    https://www.amazon.com/Astounding-Ca...s%2C193&sr=8-3

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    UK Avalon Founder Bill Ryan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Quote Posted by Dumpster Diver (here)
    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Quote Posted by Mypos (here)
    Which book or website would you recommend to get a peek inside what Scientology really is about?
    As best I know — and you may find this hard to believe — there are none at all.

    You'll find many websites (and Church of Scientology publications) that eulogize the entire thing. That's all distorted, often extremely so.

    You'll also find many other websites (and books, and documentaries, and TV series) that ridicule, criticize and dismiss the entire subject in often emotional and vitriolic terms. Much of that is distorted, too, or features major inaccuracies or omissions.

    It all has to be there in order to really understand the entire topic

    There's nothing that I know of that portrays the entire subject, and its history including that of Hubbard, in all its complexity, in an accurate and balanced way. That's a momentous task. It was only recently that I fully realized this has never actually been done.

    There are three books I'd recommend, but they only portray the history: the first book all the history, and the second two a very detailed part of it. Nothing at all about the processes and their application, which is a very major component.

    The books are excellent, and information about the processes is omitted because the authors truly weren't qualified or experienced to comment. So they just did an admirable job on the history alone. But that's only half the story.

    1. Bare-Faced Messiah: The True Story of L. Ron Hubbard (Russell Miller)
    2. Commodore's Messenger: A Child Adrift in the Scientology Sea Organization (Janis Gillham-Grady)
    3. Commodore's Messenger Book II: Riding Out The Storms with L. Ron Hubbard (Janis Gillham-Grady)

    I started a website myself, a few months ago, in an attempt to rectify all this — because I do have quite a good understanding of all of it (and I'm not sure that very many do). But the more I worked on it, the more it struck me that there was just more and more and more. It's extremely hard to compress and summarize. That's still a work in progress, and I don't know yet if it's possible.

    I found this book gives an interesting perspective on L. Ron and some of the Sci-Fi roots of Scientology:

    https://amazon.com/Astounding-Campbe.../dp/006257194X
    Yes, many thanks. But that's just one part of Hubbard's complex personal history, much more of which is covered in the other books, and mentioned in some of the documentaries. What doesn't yet exist is a book or film which actually covers the entire phenomenon in all its aspects. (There are quite a few other threads in which some of this is discussed.)

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    I am an old-timer and was involved with the church in the 1970’s, To the best of my knowledge, Bill is correct in that there is not a book or website that explains in a comprehensive way what happened with the church, nor is there a quick and easy explanation of Scientology as a whole beyond what Bill has so succinctly stated previously.
    I personally witnessed the departure from the basic teachings and benevolent philosophy of Mr. Hubbard and the expulsion of all top execs that were loyal to him and his original lofty aims of a world without war, crime or insanity.
    In my view the most important aspect of the church take over and transformation to an oppressive cult, was that it was originated and orchestrated by agents of the US government intelligence community. Scientology, with its proven techniques for recovering suppressed painful memories, was correctly viewed as a threat to keeping misdeeds of dark programs hidden, especially the mind control operations.
    I'm not sure how significant the details of the takeover are now since those who currently study or practice Scientology do so in small to in medium-sized operations (links below) not affiliated in any way with the church. In fact, most like Bill and my wife, have never been involved with the church at all. I hope that helps.

    https://ronsorg.ch/en/
    http://www.scientolipedia.org/info/L...%E2%80%99Alene

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    United States Avalon Member Denise/Dizi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Hi Bill..

    Could you give us a peek into the music that you listen to when you are alone? Perhaps 3 songs that move you? For any reason, just the beat, or they are touching in some way?

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    UK Avalon Founder Bill Ryan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Quote Posted by Denise/Dizi (here)
    Hi Bill..

    Could you give us a peek into the music that you listen to when you are alone? Perhaps 3 songs that move you? For any reason, just the beat, or they are touching in some way?
    Well, I don't 'sit and listen to music' — as many people do. And I don't have an iPhone or iPod, so I don't listen to anything when I'm hiking or driving.

    But I periodically spend a few minutes to listen to something in particular, maybe if someone recommends something or if I read or listen to (or remember!) a song or a piece that captures my attention. That could be any genre, of any kind at all. Here's an example:

    I was recalling a time when many years back, in my early 20s, I nearly accepted a job at a 'Free School' (like England's famous Summerhill, but in Scotland) where the music teacher there was one of the members of The Incredible String Band. And then I remembered The Hedgehog's Song.

    It's so catchy ('sticky', as a friend calls it) that ALL DAY on my long Christmas ridge hike I had the thing in my head. This is how it goes.... Enjoy. It's pure quirky genius.




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    Avalon Member avid's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    This is my one of my best friend’s albums, I donated it to him when his beautiful wife died.
    We went to art college in Carlisle together, Cher was a fashion student, and went on to work as a designer for a global company.
    His coverage of many music artists in the North West UK is exceptional.The album cover is so fantastic, so Jan Fialkowski, great photographer, has this album, an amazing album. Such a small world....

    He features it in his facebook presence. Wondrous piece of artwork of our time....
    https://facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10207812614936850&set=pob.178077843 3&type=3&theater

    Last edited by Bill Ryan; 17th January 2020 at 17:53. Reason: embedded the image :)
    The love you withhold is the pain that you carry
    and er..
    "Chariots of the Globs" (apols to Fat Freddy's Cat)

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    UK Avalon Member Sunny-side-up's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Hello there Bill.

    3 stage from me;

    Have you really no idea where, how your compus got reversed poled?
    it dose sound very strange/interesting to me.
    My imagination starts wondering.
    I know in your 'Haunted lake' vid, you say you haven't.

    MY wife loves animals, loves dog's, loves your dog
    She jokingly says to me can you ask Bill to do another vid trek but mainly focus on Mara as the star

    3rd can you, link all your vids I can't seem to find them, trying to find the one where you show us your new home, the vid with Mara in your yard.
    Hope all is great for you and Mara where you live,
    Alan
    I'm a simple easy going guy that is very upset/sad with the worlds hidden controllers!
    We need LEADERS who bat from the HEART!
    Rise up above them Dark evil doers, not within anger but with LOVE

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    United States Avalon Member Sammy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's personal Question-and-Answer thread. Pile it on. :)

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    I still do have recurring dreams of levitating. These are always very uplifting and a whole bunch of fun. Like a child, I often exclaim to the people around me — "Look, look!!"
    I have less now than when in my twenties (had a good dozen or so in my twenties) but I vividly recall one in particular where I had this incredible "knowing" of how to experience it which was, perceiving the floor below me dropping. In other words, I didn't "go up," the floor seemed to go down.

    In addition (and in all other cases), I was always with a group of people and I had that exact same sentiment though I don't recall expressing it verbally... but perhaps telepathically... "Loook! Look." I also recall feeling like this would be how I "get their attention." Attention to and for what? Me and my incredible wisdoms - haha. The messianic complex winking at me.
    All the above is all and only my opinion - all subject to change and not meant to be true for anyone else regardless of how I phrase it.

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