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Thread: The problem with new UFO sightings

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    UK Avalon Founder Bill Ryan's Avatar
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    Default The problem with new UFO sightings

    Hello, All: this is ABSOLUTELY NOT in any way critical of anyone reporting new UFO sightings on this thread. Some of them are really very interesting. But I'd just like to offer a few thoughts.

    Over the years, there have been literally tens (maybe hundreds!) of thousands of sighting reports. They're known as 'cases'. Peter Davenport (from NUFORC, the National UFO Reporting Center), and of course MUFON, collect thousands between them every year.

    But here's the question: What difference does it make?

    I'm very critical of Tom DeLonge's To The Stars Academy, as many will know. But one thing that I do salute them for (actually, best articulated by Peter Levenda in several interviews) is their starting-point unquestioned assumption that UFOs are 100% real.

    The whole thing kicks off from there, asking:So then what?

    I totally agree with that approach. Grant Cameron, though I'm also critical of him in some aspects, actually states much the same thing. He says (my paraphrase):
    "Look, we're not going to learn much, or learn much more, by endlessly analyzing photos of lights in the sky. We have to go to abductee and contactee reports to find out what's really happening here."
    Veteran abduction researcher David Jacobs, who I strongly support, would agree. And to the above about contactee and abductee reports, I'd also add the evidence, such that it is, from crash retrievals. And from SOME military/intel whistleblowers.

    It's as if we're all endlessly trying to prove that the sky really is blue. Listen, we KNOW it's blue.

    But why is it blue?

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Thank you, Bill, well said, as always.

    I’ve felt this way for a while as well. These “objects/vehicles” are clearly real, but how to get beyond that simple fact to information of more substance?

    Once in a while I am intrigued and briefly distracted by details given regarding these craft, but it has always been behavior (of pretty much everything) that I’m really interested in. Sometimes, the behavior of these objects as reported by observers, seems to provide a little more info regarding what they are doing here, but..

    In order to really get at what’s going on, we’ve got to examine all the evidence provided by those who have been experiencing interactions with the occupants of many of these craft, both here in our dimension, and beyond as well..

    I feel the same about Sasquatch, they are obviously “real,” but what are they??

    My two cents..
    "Love is the only engine of survival.." Leonard Cohen

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    I absolutely agree with your summation Bill.

    The best way to tackle the whole phenomenon is to share our stories and just listen to one another without pointing fingers and calling people crazy.

    I don't understand the whole obsession with crafts when the bigger, more complex part of the why is the actual contact people are having. If we simply tell our stories of contact, all of us, at some point we may have a coherent or semi coherent answer.
    "The only true currency in this bankrupt world is what we share with someone when we are uncool." From the movie "Almost Famous""l "Let yourself stand cool and composed before a million universes." Walt Whitman

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Great point. I'm sure at least half the UFO sightings are planes or balloons and the real problem is that assuming some are genuine extra terrestrial craft they are never clear enough or proven genuine enough to change public opinion.

    So what's the point in another year's worth of ten thousand fuzzy blobs shaking around in a video? Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and so are UFOs.

    These days special effects in films are more real than real life and all we have are fuzzy blobs? It's also interesting that 50 years ago, UFOs looked like they did in comics (old fashioned) and now they look like modern UFOs!

    The value is more of a hobby and to keep enthusiasts content. Please, give me a sharp, high definition UFO, preferably with an alien stepping out and being interviewed...
    Last edited by 5th; 2nd January 2019 at 15:13.

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    UK Avalon Founder Bill Ryan's Avatar
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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Quote Posted by 5th (here)
    Please, give me a sharp, high definition UFO, preferably with an alien stepping out and being interviewed...
    Done. (But alas, no alien!)

    This photo was taken in Peru by an American friend of a friend, in 1960, when he was traveling in his 20s. He's now nearly 80 years old, and I corresponded with him a couple of years back to ask him a few more questions. It's absolutely real. There's an interesting thread about it here.
    The point is: how many more photos do we need?





    The original high-resolution photo (5.3 Mb, my scan of the original which I was shown personally) can be downloaded here:

    http://projectavalon.net/Peru_UFO.jpg

    Last edited by Bill Ryan; 2nd January 2019 at 15:30.

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    All reports of sightings - whether with clear pictures or not may seem trivial by now but perhaps patterns can still be derived from them hinting at possible intentions.

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Quote Posted by 5th (here)
    Please, give me a sharp, high definition UFO, preferably with an alien stepping out and being interviewed...
    Done. (But alas, no alien!)

    This photo was taken in Peru by an American friend of a friend, in 1960, when he was traveling in his 20s. He's now nearly 80 years old, and I corresponded with him a couple of years back to ask him a few more questions. It's absolutely real. There's an interesting thread about it here.
    :
    The shame is that if one of the windows had been open your friend could have told us what they were shouting out in German .
    I know you appreciate my underlying more serious point .

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Quote Posted by Did You See Them (here)
    All reports of sightings - whether with clear pictures or not may seem trivial by now but perhaps patterns can still be derived from them hinting at possible intentions.
    Yes, agree and might help to start identifying or delineating between different species out there. That would be a useful study as there is plenty of raw data available - shaky blobs and all - and also to set them up against faked or proven terrestrial examples to provide perspective.
    Last edited by Debra; 2nd January 2019 at 16:03.

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    I've come to the same conclusion that Jacques Vallėe came to all those years ago.

    Vallée proposes that there is a genuine UFO phenomenon, partly associated with a form of non-human consciousness that manipulates space and time. The phenomenon has been active throughout human history, and seems to masquerade in various forms to different cultures. In his opinion, the intelligence behind the phenomenon attempts social manipulation by using deception on the humans with whom they interact.

    Vallée also proposes that a secondary aspect of the UFO phenomenon involves human manipulation by humans. Witnesses of UFO phenomena undergo a manipulative and staged spectacle, meant to alter their belief system, and eventually, influence human society by suggesting alien intervention from outer space. The ultimate motivation for this deception is probably a projected major change of human society, the breaking down of old belief systems and the implementation of new ones.

    Vallée states that the evidence, if carefully analyzed, suggests an underlying plan for the deception of mankind by means of unknown, highly advanced methods. Vallée states that it is highly unlikely that governments actually conceal alien evidence, as the popular myth suggests. Rather, it is much more likely that that is exactly what the manipulators want us to believe. Vallée feels the entire subject of UFOs is mystified by charlatans and science fiction. He advocates a stronger and more serious involvement of science in the UFO research and debate. Only this can reveal the true nature of the UFO phenomenon.

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Hi Bill / Im a sky watcher and enjoy capturing things that somehow make themselves known to me. I have not been able to figure out if Im seeing them, or they're appearing for me?

    Regardless , I say, why not share them? If i capture something here on the east coast and share it, and someone else captures a similar object somewhere else, I think that comparison may have some value.

    I just enjoy knowing these unknowns are out there, whatever they may mean or be. Does it make a difference?? probably not, but not showing them, doesn't change anything either . cheers

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    [INDENT] "Look, we're not going to learn much, or learn much more, by endlessly analyzing photos of lights in the sky. We have to go to abductee and contactee reports to find out what's really happening here."
    I certainly agree with this. I have been saying this for years. "UFO" sightings tell us very little if anything and so I don't even bother with checking out the latest "UFO" sightings. If we want to know what's going on and perhaps even why, then we need to focus on abductee/contactee experiences.

    However, it needs to be said that abducting ETs not only create amnesia to block abduction memories they often cover up what actually occurred during the abduction by imposing false memories (also known as "screen memories") over the actual blocked memories. So if an abductee does start remembering the abduction, he or she will only remember the implanted false memory which usually portrays the abducting ETs as benevolent and that the experience was a "nice" one.

    Thus there are many reports by abductees that their experience was a positive one when in actuality it was anything but positive. Therefore, it is imperative that one learn how to address these false implanted memories when working with abductees.

    Another problem is the narrow scope of abduction research that will not go beyond societal belief systems to explore past life abductions, between lives abductions, time travel capabilities of ETs, etc. To do so limits the full context of the observed phenomena and therefore the ability to understand the "why" of abductions and contacts. I think that some researchers worry too much about their credibility in these regards. I think most of us want to know the truth about ET contacts so we would be best served if we leave the political correctness worries behind.

    The "why" of abductions is dependent upon context. Therefore, we have to look at the big picture for the "why". Unfortunately, the abducting ETs themselves have dumbed us down with their deceptions and secrecy over thousands of years so we don't see the big picture. This is intentional. They don't want us to know. But as I discovered it is indeed knowable.

    I think what is needed is more independent researchers using the same simple tools that I have used to reveal a much bigger picture. I have long since retired from abduction research but I am willing to help someone learn these simple non-hypnotic methods if they seriously want to become an abduction researcher.
    Last edited by TrumanCash; 2nd January 2019 at 16:34.

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

    Done. (But alas, no alien!)
    OK, possibly a 'real' UFO but that's the 60's comic book style and unlikely to be alien in origin!

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    I've always found the pictures from the Turkish UFO event to be pretty mind-boggling.

    Name:  Turk UFO.jpeg
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    Click image for larger version

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    Last edited by The Crimson Horse Blanket; 2nd January 2019 at 16:49.

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Quote Posted by The Crimson Horse Blanket (here)
    I've always found the pictures from the Turkish UFO event to be pretty mind-boggling.
    Sorry but I need more than a blur which only looks like an alien because it's in this thread for my mind to be boggled.

    Now, if it were in a brussel sprout thread...

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Quote Posted by 5th (here)
    Quote Posted by The Crimson Horse Blanket (here)
    I've always found the pictures from the Turkish UFO event to be pretty mind-boggling.
    Sorry but I need more than a blur which only looks like an alien because it's in this thread for my mind to be boggled.

    Now, if it were in a brussel sprout thread...
    Google is your friend!

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Anybody interested in the abductee phenomenon would do very well to carefully listen to Karla Turner's "Voices of the Taken" - recordings with four women who are simply and honestly sharing their experiences.

    The sound quality isn't terribly good - it was recorded in the early 1990s. It's a great starting point for those newer to the abduction research area.
    Last edited by Tintin; 2nd January 2019 at 17:13.
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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    More so nowadays the question is:

    Where are they from, man made, Earth made (not human) ET or other dimension?
    I'm a simple easy going guy that is very upset/sad with the worlds hidden controllers!
    We need LEADERS who bat from the HEART!
    Rise up above them Dark evil doers, not within anger but with LOVE

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Quote Posted by ripple (here)

    The shame is that if one of the windows had been open your friend could have told us what they were shouting out in German .
    I know you appreciate my underlying more serious point .
    One of the stories I have heard personally was from Germany and must have been from the 70s. I can't remember if it was a disk or a bell, but it was doing its normal thing, hovering quietly. However, it was part of Halloween or Oktoberfest, right in the middle of a town festival, right beside a castle, and probably quite close to Rammstein. I tend to be open-minded towards a likely man-made craft.

    With encounters, I am more skeptical. As a parallel, for instance the fey folk, clairvoyants sometimes say their real form is a ball of energy. It is the mind that dresses them up with the appearance of a gnome or other creature. And of course, these are sometimes credited with abductions as well. Without training, the brain is weak under these circumstances. In older cultures in the days of story telling, it was normal for people to visualize whatever was happening--if there were horses in the field, you saw the horses. This kind of ability is destroyed by television, etc.

    The yeti has never been viewed as anything other than an astral being capable of materializing a form.

    The underlying principle is that the astral plane will show you whatever you want, except, of course, the mind is likely full of millions of subconscious fears, and so more accurately it will show whatever is on your mind. Then it could either materialize or invisibly affect the physical world. So I can accept that the vast majority of planets are populated, but the interface is almost 100% unreliable, since we cannot even do this in our immediate environment. You'd be seeing and communicating with all the terrestrial ghosts, and other things, first. To me, the question is less "what's out there", than "what's right here". I cannot even answer this second part. I'm pretty sure there are several ghosts and elementals nearby, but actually, I have almost no sensitivity. One of our dogs got run over, and I kind of sensed him being around for about a year and a half, and now he is gone. That's as close as I got to seeing him. But if I had, it could have just been a good look at memory. If someone else saw it, they could have been seeing my memory.

    It is like when the camera disproved the rope trick. Nothing happens, the guys are just standing there, and the rope is on the ground. That does not prevent a hundred people from testifying they witnessed the same gruesome chain of events. You would never learn a single thing from a hundred rope trick witnesses. That seems to be what is going on here, with a slightly different field of interest.

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    Spain Deactivated
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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Quote Posted by The Crimson Horse Blanket (here)

    Google is your friend!

    It most certainly is not.

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    Default Re: The problem with new UFO sightings

    Crimson Horse B / was there ever a consensus on that Turkish sighting? I was always captivated by it. Then all sorts of counter comments came about it not being authentic or some mistaken ship on the seas in the distance. any final credible assessment ??

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