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Thread: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Quote Posted by Jake (here)
    Furthermore... the-six-figure-price-tag-for-selling-a-two-dollar-hot-dog.

    Corporations are not the cause... GOVERNMENT is the problem... it's already really bad. AOC vows to make it worse...

    Jake.
    corporations runs government. IMO they are actually one and the same in most countries.

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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Quote Posted by Bubu (here)
    Quote Posted by Jake (here)
    Furthermore... the-six-figure-price-tag-for-selling-a-two-dollar-hot-dog.

    Corporations are not the cause... GOVERNMENT is the problem... it's already really bad. AOC vows to make it worse...

    Jake.
    corporations runs government. IMO they are actually one and the same in most countries.
    So what does US INC mean or USA INC. or many other names that designate a corporation. Searching Dunn and Bradstreet brings up all kinds of incorporated entities and one can find a single politician listed. I searched my County and City Governments and found that every aspect of them is incorporated at Dunn and Bradstreet. Based in Philly I do believe. So to say, Government is just a smoke screen for the giant corporations. Okay Government/Corporations are the cause of most of the crap we live with on this world.

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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Opinions aside,,, it's government meddling that creates these regulations. We can ACTUALLY POINT TO taxes, regulations, laws, fees,etc,,, that ACTUALLY create hardship for PEOPLE. I don't have a half a million dollars for a hotdog startup... the gubmint makes things much worse.

    I am not going to jump on the EVIL CORPERATIONS band wagon... not today. If you think putting gubmint in charge of taking over ALL OF INDUSTRY will result in better wages, better jobs, less homelessness, less greed, happier hippies,,, then it may be time to jump on a unicorn and take the majic rainbow bridge to the land of lollipops and skittles.

    Socialism PROMISES to take away my own ability to make my own decisions, and hand them over to government... I don't effing think so...

    If that is what folks want, then go ahead and make that decision for YOURSELF... Don't take away MY freedom, or MY liberty because YOU need to be taken care of...

    I don't mean YOU, Bubu... I'm only ranting at this point...

    AOC lands her a six figure GUBMINT job. Complaining the ENTIRE TIME,, whilst chasing away good jobs for others... TRULY pathetic.

    Jake
    Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. Yoda....

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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    YYou really can't make this up...

    After landing a fat cat gubmint job, She immediately announced that she is cutting wages of senior staffers to increase the pay of entry level staffers. Not based on qualifications. Look how quick she turned into a little rich girl...

    She, literraly,, created awesome paying jobs for government staffers and politicians, while DENYING good jobs for citizens... To what end?

    Seriously... To What End??

    Jake
    Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. Yoda....

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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Quote Posted by Jake (here)
    Opinions aside,,, it's government meddling that creates these regulations. We can ACTUALLY POINT TO taxes, regulations, laws, fees,etc,,, that ACTUALLY create hardship for PEOPLE. I don't have a half a million dollars for a hotdog startup... the gubmint makes things much worse.

    I am not going to jump on the EVIL CORPERATIONS band wagon... not today. If you think putting gubmint in charge of taking over ALL OF INDUSTRY will result in better wages, better jobs, less homelessness, less greed, happier hippies,,, then it may be time to jump on a unicorn and take the majic rainbow bridge to the land of lollipops and skittles.

    Socialism PROMISES to take away my own ability to make my own decisions, and hand them over to government... I don't effing think so...

    If that is what folks want, then go ahead and make that decision for YOURSELF... Don't take away MY freedom, or MY liberty because YOU need to be taken care of...

    I don't mean YOU, Bubu... I'm only ranting at this point...

    AOC lands her a six figure GUBMINT job. Complaining the ENTIRE TIME,, whilst chasing away good jobs for others... TRULY pathetic.

    Jake
    It depends what kind of government and how your government chooses to use its own legal system. Large corporations prefer government regulations and lots of them as it makes it impossible for small businesses to gain entry and medium sized businesses can't compete. What you end up with is state sponsored (for lack of better terms) oligarchic corporate control.

    Governments need to just generally back off, unless they can easily justify all of their rules and regulations as truly in the public interest. Big corporations won't like it, and on a more local level the bureaucrats won't like it as it would interfere with their Kafkaesque approach to life and endanger their jobs.

    Observe those poor sods trying to build a house and all of the unnecessary hoops they have to jump through to get the thing built. So much of this is pork on a local level. The hot dog stand you mention is subject to the same kind of process. The complexity makes it difficult and expensive for individuals to navigate around. It serves those who are already making it big.

    The government encourages corporate consolidation of power by failing to enforce their own federal anti-combines act as well. Most mergers and acquisitions that have taken place are not legal by the standards of these laws.

    Large corporations have taken over. Make no mistake.

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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    I AM a poor sod, jumping through hoops to make it work. It's not CORPERATION fees and permits and regulations. It's GUBMINT. You can argue that corporate interests do their best to meddle, but ultimately it's the GUBMINT/s (local, state, federal) that enact laws. No?

    Even if big business Has taken over. (Not buying it, but just for funzeez..) I still have opportunities, jobs, I vote, I take part in my community, etc.. all of those things are still MY choice, My opportunity. I'd rather deal with that than counting on GOVERNMENT AND POLITICIANS making decisions for me.
    Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. Yoda....

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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Quote Posted by A Voice from the Mountains (here)
    Quote Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
    "She's right about this one issue, but she's an insane idiot on _______________ "<---("everything else", or "these particular issues: ...") would be a lot more persuasive to me.
    That would make sense, considering it would probably take a socialist to make that argument in the first place, and then no persuasion would be required.
    Really? So, only a "socialist" could make the argument that pillorying Cortez (that almost every response is in this thread has done) is a separate subject, rather than just examining the actual statements she made in the video in the opening post? This is truly astounding, because I made that very observation, and I'm not what any Marxist or political socialist would consider a "socialist." So, I guess you're wrong, and your first sentence appears to simply be an ad hominem.


    Quote Posted by A Voice from the Mountains (here)
    The risk of corruption is a problem in any system.
    Well, this is yet another topic that deserves its own thread. Ponder this:
    • Option 1: Allow the crime syndicate to control the mechanisms (political parties, elections) to fill vacant seats of governance. Result: Virtually everyone in the system is a corrupt mobster, within a syndicate of mobsters. Self-fulfilling "prophecy." Loaded dice. Risk of corruption: 100%.
    • Option 2: Apply a filtering mechanism to prevent corrupt mobsters from gaining office. Result: The highest-level syndicated corruption is broken. Individuals can be corrupted, (but if we the people were smart, we'd apply additional filters to prevent or minimize the corruptible from being corrupted.) The end result would be vastly less corruption, and critically, not syndicate-wide.
    Quote Posted by A Voice from the Mountains (here)
    But what is supposed to be the horrible evil of a congressman who, for example, wants legislation to help an industry and personally invest in that industry too? If it was to benefit a specific company, as often happens, then that's undermining competition. But if it's encouraging progress across a whole field, then how would that be bad exactly?
    Um, conflict of interest? Are you familiar with the concept of someone "recusing" themselves? It's a high integrity move that publicly admits a conflict of interest or prejudice or inability to be objective, and fair.

    If you cannot see that congresspersons owning stock in the military industrial complex corporations and then voting (non recusing themselves) for bills that enrich the congressperson via enriching the military industrial complex corporations is a bad idea, I doubt that any other example would help you understand it. It's called war profiteering in this context, but is basically simply stated as conflict of interest and sociopathic self-enrichment.


    Quote Posted by A Voice from the Mountains (here)
    It's the same as with Trump owning businesses, and then people say, oh, he's only doing this or that to help his own businesses. By implication, it seems that he's supposed to do things that would hurt his sector of the market, just in order to... what, exactly? Virtue signal to socialists who aren't going to vote for him anyway?
    No, you don't understand the concept of conflict of interest and holding elected officials to a standard of integrity beyond sociopathic self-enrichment. trump is a poor example for you to use - there's not going to be any "Trump Tower Tax Exemption Law" or whatever. Cortez did mention that presidents have even less checks and balances on them and a greater opportunity for corruption, but I would generally disagree with the implications of that statement. I would think that it's a lot easier and sneakier for congresspersons than presidents to get away with insider trading, as one example of corruption. (They legalized insider trading for themselves, so now, is it still corruption to you? To me it is. If they make a law that congresspersons can legally rape children, it might be "legal" but certainly corrupt.)


    Quote Posted by A Voice from the Mountains (here)
    Wanting a 70% income tax on the upper class is equally, if not even more stupid. I would prefer we left such policies to Europe, so we can suck all of the industry they have left off of their continent. I read articles in French economics all the time about some European company getting the shaft, and being undercut by some American contractor, on anything from tech services to military hardware. I think it's beautiful. But we don't enjoy that competitive supremacy by punishing our entrepreneurs by putting a ceiling on their returns.
    "Entrepreneurs" is a disingenuous word to use for multinational corporate heads, military industrial complex corporation heads, and their major stockholders. I know a lot of entrepreneurs, (none of whom are ever going to get within a light-year of the ultra-rich that you mischaracterize as the upper class.) Multimillionaires and billionaires are so far above the upper class in wealth that there is no comparison. Like (Republican, maybe the last real one) Eisenhower did with a 90% top tax bracket - none of the people affected by that tax rate became "middle class" or even "upper class", nor did they stop innovating or lose their entrepreneurial spirit. I think a huge part of the problem in understanding this issue is when a false equivalency is applied to small business owners and multimillionaire/billionaire major corporate investors and heads.

    We're at the end of the Monopoly game, and unlike the board game, the ownership of the "hotels" and property is real, and 0.01% own it. Some sort of economic/wealth/property/resources distribution is going to happen. Taxation is the nice way, the guillotine is the not so nice way, but it is going to happen. The ultra rich know it too, and have been guarding and fortifying themselves against it since at least the 1950s in the US (and centuries or even millenia before that around the world.)


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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Quote Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
    Really? So, only a "socialist" could make the argument that pillorying Cortez (that almost every response is in this thread has done) is a separate subject, rather than just examining the actual statements she made in the video in the opening post? This is truly astounding, because I made that very observation, and I'm not what any Marxist or political socialist would consider a "socialist." So, I guess you're wrong, and your first sentence appears to simply be an ad hominem.
    No, I was commenting that the idea that someone would have to incorporate more socialist ideas into their posts in order to better convince you that she's nuts, would not result in any real persuasion, because you obviously already agree with those positions that you want to see more of.

    Quote Well, this is yet another topic that deserves its own thread. Ponder this:
    • Option 1: Allow the crime syndicate to control the mechanisms (political parties, elections) to fill vacant seats of governance. Result: Virtually everyone in the system is a corrupt mobster, within a syndicate of mobsters. Self-fulfilling "prophecy." Loaded dice. Risk of corruption: 100%.
    • Option 2: Apply a filtering mechanism to prevent corrupt mobsters from gaining office. Result: The highest-level syndicated corruption is broken. Individuals can be corrupted, (but if we the people were smart, we'd apply additional filters to prevent or minimize the corruptible from being corrupted.) The end result would be vastly less corruption, and critically, not syndicate-wide.
    Both of these solutions rely on government to fix the government, yes?

    Think outside of the box, Dennis. The founders had some different ideas about this. Have you ever read them?

    Quote
    Quote Posted by A Voice from the Mountains (here)
    But what is supposed to be the horrible evil of a congressman who, for example, wants legislation to help an industry and personally invest in that industry too? If it was to benefit a specific company, as often happens, then that's undermining competition. But if it's encouraging progress across a whole field, then how would that be bad exactly?
    Um, conflict of interest? Are you familiar with the concept of someone "recusing" themselves? It's a high integrity move that publicly admits a conflict of interest or prejudice or inability to be objective, and fair.
    Where is the crime in facilitating whole sectors of industry? Like I said, make a distinct here between helping one company, which is corruption, and helping a whole sector of the economy. According to your way of thinking, helping competing businesses all prosper, without distinction of one company over another, is somehow immoral or something.

    Quote If you cannot see that congresspersons owning stock in the military industrial complex corporations and then voting (non recusing themselves) for bills that enrich the congressperson via enriching the military industrial complex corporations is a bad idea, I doubt that any other example would help you understand it. It's called war profiteering in this context, but is basically simply stated as conflict of interest and sociopathic self-enrichment.
    I think you missed the part of my posts about not enriching specific companies, which is cronyism. If your argument here is too broad, it would mean that improving the economy at all can be construed as Trump having a conflict of interest. You realize that, right?

    Quote I would think that it's a lot easier and sneakier for congresspersons than presidents to get away with insider trading, as one example of corruption.
    The reason insider trading is illegal is because it screws over the other stockholders investing in those companies, not because evil capitalists made money. It's a completely different issue from our most prominent citizens being allowed to make money from honest transactions while in office, and even vote on business-friendly legislation that would help others as well as themselves.

    Remember the old dichotomy of "service to self" vs. "service to others"? I once saw a very good argument that "service to others" should really state "service to all," because it's not the point to abuse yourself just to show everyone else how great you are.


    Quote
    Quote Posted by A Voice from the Mountains (here)
    Wanting a 70% income tax on the upper class is equally, if not even more stupid. I would prefer we left such policies to Europe, so we can suck all of the industry they have left off of their continent. I read articles in French economics all the time about some European company getting the shaft, and being undercut by some American contractor, on anything from tech services to military hardware. I think it's beautiful. But we don't enjoy that competitive supremacy by punishing our entrepreneurs by putting a ceiling on their returns.
    "Entrepreneurs" is a disingenuous word to use for multinational corporate heads, military industrial complex corporation heads, and their major stockholders.
    It would be disingenuous if that's who I was talking about, but those people don't pay taxes, so they obviously aren't who I was talking about, are they?

    Small business owners are the ones that get screwed by high taxes. Start-ups, mom-and-pop businesses, etc. Those are the ones you stab in the gut with these 70% tax rates, not the bankers or military contractors, who use loopholes and offshore tax havens.

    So what happens when you stick small business owners and entrepreneurs with 70% tax rates? Remember my thread on increasing unemployment and inflation in NY?

    Quote I know a lot of entrepreneurs, (none of whom are ever going to get within a light-year of the ultra-rich that you mischaracterize as the upper class.) Multimillionaires and billionaires are so far above the upper class in wealth that there is no comparison.
    I didn't equate these two groups anywhere in my posts. If you read more carefully it's been very clear for a long time on here that I don't equate entrepreneurs and most business owners with the people who run the world.

    You think your policies are aimed at Rothschilds and Rockefellers, and yet the only people you would end up destroying are employers and thereby the middle class. This is why socialist utopias don't have middle classes: only ultra-rich and ultra-poor.

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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Quote Posted by A Voice from the Mountains (here)
    Quote Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
    Really? So, only a "socialist" could make the argument that pillorying Cortez (that almost every response is in this thread has done) is a separate subject, rather than just examining the actual statements she made in the video in the opening post? This is truly astounding, because I made that very observation, and I'm not what any Marxist or political socialist would consider a "socialist." So, I guess you're wrong, and your first sentence appears to simply be an ad hominem.
    No, I was commenting that the idea that someone would have to incorporate more socialist ideas into their posts in order to better convince you that she's nuts, would not result in any real persuasion, because you obviously already agree with those positions that you want to see more of.

    Quote Well, this is yet another topic that deserves its own thread. Ponder this:

    • Option 1: Allow the crime syndicate to control the mechanisms (political parties, elections) to fill vacant seats of governance. Result: Virtually everyone in the system is a corrupt mobster, within a syndicate of mobsters. Self-fulfilling "prophecy." Loaded dice. Risk of corruption: 100%.
    • Option 2: Apply a filtering mechanism to prevent corrupt mobsters from gaining office. Result: The highest-level syndicated corruption is broken. Individuals can be corrupted, (but if we the people were smart, we'd apply additional filters to prevent or minimize the corruptible from being corrupted.) The end result would be vastly less corruption, and critically, not syndicate-wide.

    Both of these solutions rely on government to fix the government, yes?

    Think outside of the box, Dennis. The founders had some different ideas about this. Have you ever read them?

    Quote
    Quote Posted by A Voice from the Mountains (here)
    But what is supposed to be the horrible evil of a congressman who, for example, wants legislation to help an industry and personally invest in that industry too? If it was to benefit a specific company, as often happens, then that's undermining competition. But if it's encouraging progress across a whole field, then how would that be bad exactly?
    Um, conflict of interest? Are you familiar with the concept of someone "recusing" themselves? It's a high integrity move that publicly admits a conflict of interest or prejudice or inability to be objective, and fair.
    Where is the crime in facilitating whole sectors of industry? Like I said, make a distinct here between helping one company, which is corruption, and helping a whole sector of the economy. According to your way of thinking, helping competing businesses all prosper, without distinction of one company over another, is somehow immoral or something.

    Quote If you cannot see that congresspersons owning stock in the military industrial complex corporations and then voting (non recusing themselves) for bills that enrich the congressperson via enriching the military industrial complex corporations is a bad idea, I doubt that any other example would help you understand it. It's called war profiteering in this context, but is basically simply stated as conflict of interest and sociopathic self-enrichment.
    I think you missed the part of my posts about not enriching specific companies, which is cronyism. If your argument here is too broad, it would mean that improving the economy at all can be construed as Trump having a conflict of interest. You realize that, right?

    Quote I would think that it's a lot easier and sneakier for congresspersons than presidents to get away with insider trading, as one example of corruption.
    The reason insider trading is illegal is because it screws over the other stockholders investing in those companies, not because evil capitalists made money. It's a completely different issue from our most prominent citizens being allowed to make money from honest transactions while in office, and even vote on business-friendly legislation that would help others as well as themselves.

    Remember the old dichotomy of "service to self" vs. "service to others"? I once saw a very good argument that "service to others" should really state "service to all," because it's not the point to abuse yourself just to show everyone else how great you are.


    Quote
    Quote Posted by A Voice from the Mountains (here)
    Wanting a 70% income tax on the upper class is equally, if not even more stupid. I would prefer we left such policies to Europe, so we can suck all of the industry they have left off of their continent. I read articles in French economics all the time about some European company getting the shaft, and being undercut by some American contractor, on anything from tech services to military hardware. I think it's beautiful. But we don't enjoy that competitive supremacy by punishing our entrepreneurs by putting a ceiling on their returns.
    "Entrepreneurs" is a disingenuous word to use for multinational corporate heads, military industrial complex corporation heads, and their major stockholders.
    It would be disingenuous if that's who I was talking about, but those people don't pay taxes, so they obviously aren't who I was talking about, are they?

    Small business owners are the ones that get screwed by high taxes. Start-ups, mom-and-pop businesses, etc. Those are the ones you stab in the gut with these 70% tax rates, not the bankers or military contractors, who use loopholes and offshore tax havens.

    So what happens when you stick small business owners and entrepreneurs with 70% tax rates? Remember my thread on increasing unemployment and inflation in NY?

    Quote I know a lot of entrepreneurs, (none of whom are ever going to get within a light-year of the ultra-rich that you mischaracterize as the upper class.) Multimillionaires and billionaires are so far above the upper class in wealth that there is no comparison.
    I didn't equate these two groups anywhere in my posts. If you read more carefully it's been very clear for a long time on here that I don't equate entrepreneurs and most business owners with the people who run the world.

    You think your policies are aimed at Rothschilds and Rockefellers, and yet the only people you would end up destroying are employers and thereby the middle class. This is why socialist utopias don't have middle classes: only ultra-rich and ultra-poor.
    Respectfully, Voice, I'm not going to take the time to reply to your replies. Your replies show me you are paying no attention to the substance of what I have written. You sidestepped every point I made, throw in another jab that you think I'm socialist, and offer strawman points (such as levying 70% tax on small business, an utterly ridiculous notion.) This isn't a conversation. You have to use ears, not just a Voice, to have a conversation.


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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    not going to reply to the reply was the reply? Wow... I really thought I had the inside track on being obtuse in this thread...
    Last edited by Jake; 25th February 2019 at 16:37.
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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Quote Posted by Jake (here)
    not going to reply to the reply was the reply? Wow...
    Well, read what I wrote and what was replied, and see if you think it's a dialog, or if it is something else. Even what little was on-point in his reply was excusing insider trading by corrupt elected officials, not even grasping the concept of conflict of interest directly resulting in sociopathic self-enrichment at the expense of the nation and we the people being corrupt.

    I'm not discussing theoretical forms of governance or anarchy in this thread. The thread is about remarks made by a person. The remarks are true, even if the person is the stupidest meat suit ever to have attained a high office (which would be a different thread.) Cortez is talking about the actual government that the USA has right now, and pointing out obvious corruption. Why isn't the corruption (that the despised person is pointing out) the topic? My guess is that many people were triggered by having it be Cortez (identity politics) speaking the truth about systemic corruption. Thus my comment, "live and learn from fools and from sages."


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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Quote Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
    Quote Posted by Jake (here)
    not going to reply to the reply was the reply? Wow...
    Well, read what I wrote and what was replied, and see if you think it's a dialog, or if it is something else. Even what little was on-point in his reply was excusing insider trading by corrupt elected officials, not even grasping the concept of conflict of interest directly resulting in sociopathic self-enrichment at the expense of the nation and we the people being corrupt.

    I'm not discussing theoretical forms of governance or anarchy in this thread. The thread is about remarks made by a person. The remarks are true, even if the person is the stupidest meat suit ever to have attained a high office (which would be a different thread.) Cortez is talking about the actual government that the USA has right now, and pointing out obvious corruption. Why isn't the corruption (that the despised person is pointing out) the topic? My guess is that many people were triggered by having it be Cortez (identity politics) speaking the truth about systemic corruption. Thus my comment, "live and learn from fools and from sages."
    I thought you were both making decent points. Forum conversations are, many times, quite Spotty. I didn't think that the substance of your post wasn't understood. I LOVE giving backhanded jabs in my plethora of wordings. Therefore, I know them when I see them.

    Voice. Of course you listen... I can See that.

    To me, AOC is the village idiot. Pointing at the village idiot, and saying "hey, there's an idiot." Is perfectly accaptable. It's not being triggered, it's pointing out the obvious...

    I'm probably wrong...
    Jake
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  22. Link to Post #93
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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    I'm gonna check out of this discussion. If the thread is about things AOC has said,,,, then it will become quite impossible to not point and laugh. I took the time to read the Green New Deal. (Raspberry)

    She proposes a plan that (admittedly) will have little effect in by 2050,,, to fix a problem that (admittedly)will DESTROY us within a span of TWELVE years...

    Again,, if this thread is about what AOC "ACTUALLY SAYS",,, then there WILL BE finger pointing and carrying on.

    I would be ALL FOR sending her to MARS, to deal with the OBVIOUS climate change there...
    Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. Yoda....

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  24. Link to Post #94
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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Quote Posted by Jake (here)
    then it will become quite impossible to not point and laugh
    Yup....




    She has interesting ways of speaking in front of cameras....
    Last edited by TargeT; 26th February 2019 at 19:41.
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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Quote Posted by Jake (here)
    I'm gonna check out of this discussion. If the thread is about things AOC has said,,,, then it will become quite impossible to not point and laugh. I took the time to read the Green New Deal. (Raspberry)

    She proposes a plan that (admittedly) will have little effect in by 2050,,, to fix a problem that (admittedly)will DESTROY us within a span of TWELVE years...

    Again,, if this thread is about what AOC "ACTUALLY SAYS",,, then there WILL BE finger pointing and carrying on.

    I would be ALL FOR sending her to MARS, to deal with the OBVIOUS climate change there...
    Obviously, an "AO Cortez's idiotic statements" or "The Green New Deal is crap", and other variants would be hot topics at Avalon.

    Quote "Again,, if this thread is about what AOC "ACTUALLY SAYS",,,"
    But the thread title, the opening post, and the video in the opening post are all about exposing the dark side of politics, with specific types of governmental corruption highlighted. It's a good topic, I think, but even if I didn't think so, it's still the topic that was posted.

    The Avalon mods routinely split a topic, like this current thread, when it becomes obvious that there is a fork in the road resulting in 2 different topics and not just different sides to a topic. This topic has split into
    "AOC is a moron"
    and
    "Exposing the Dark Side of Politics"

    They are both valid topics.

    Someone should start a topic on the Green New Deal itself, and examine it, too. Maybe there is one really intelligent idea in the GND surrounded by 500 bad ideas - I don't know, I don't read partisan propaganda until it seems like it might actually be important to do so. So, I'd be a poor choice to start that thread.

    I have personally tried* not to get sucked-in to what is referred to as "identity politics", for several reasons, including that I believe that at least 90% and probably closer to 100% of politicians in the US government - elected and appointed positions - are agents of Empire. So, all I would do is rail at ALL of them, Ds and Rs. Plus, they are all temporary.

    After taking 3 steps back and trying hard to focus simply on the issues and policies and laws rather than the people/personalities/celebrities - which made a lot of sense to me because the people come and go but the policies and laws (such as the 'Patriot Act') are in place until overturned or modified - I realized that for me, even that isn't far enough back in the flow chart. I'm focused on how to wipe the chessboard clean of Empire's agents and Empire's mechanisms of control, and to not just allow the same powerful misanthropes to regain power. I encourage Avalon members to create topics about the personalities that they feel need public dissection. I encourage Avalon members to create topics about the issues that they feel need public dissection.


    *(and I failed miserably when it came to hillary, bernie, mccain, haley, trump, netanyahu, bolton, etc. I get it - when the personalities are making evil policies and laws, it's near impossible to ignore them or not be triggered by them. I have blasted all of these personalities elsewhere, and I see Avalon as a place for more in-depth discussion than drive-by memes - which is how places like faceboog operate.)


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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Posted by Dennis
    Quote The thread is about remarks made by a person. The remarks are true, even if the person is the stupidest meat suit ever to have attained a high office
    Ahem..

    Again, if this thread is about "remarks made by a person... etc.." AND i can't point and laugh at "the stupidest meatsuit ever" then I have to check out.

    Cheers
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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Frankly, Many of the videos and comments about Cortez seem to be part of an organized smear campaign, albeit unwitting on the part of many who believe everything that the Alt right comes out with. God forbid Americans have their massive military budget cut and replaced by universal healthcare.

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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Quote Posted by AutumnW (here)
    Frankly, Many of the videos and comments about Cortez seem to be part of an organized smear campaign, albeit unwitting on the part of many who believe everything that the Alt right comes out with. God forbid Americans have their massive military budget cut and replaced by universal healthcare.
    what is the alt right?

    Is that a real thing? I pay a lot of attention to this stuff, if ever there was an organized smear campaign; it was anything that involved the nebulous term "alt right".


    seriously, these videos are criticizing things she has said, and very very recently. I don't know how this can be seen as a smear, it's commentary on what this newly elected individual has said.


    for example (look at her recent tweets!!!):
    There was a 1: 400,000,000,000,000 chance of you being born: what have you done with your miraculous life today?

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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes



    (Don't wanna hurt anyone's little feelings.)
    Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. Yoda....

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    Default Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Exposes The Dark Side Of Politics In 5 Incredible Minutes

    Quote Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
    Quote Posted by Jake (here)
    I'm gonna check out of this discussion. If the thread is about things AOC has said,,,, then it will become quite impossible to not point and laugh. I took the time to read the Green New Deal. (Raspberry)

    She proposes a plan that (admittedly) will have little effect in by 2050,,, to fix a problem that (admittedly)will DESTROY us within a span of TWELVE years...

    Again,, if this thread is about what AOC "ACTUALLY SAYS",,, then there WILL BE finger pointing and carrying on.

    I would be ALL FOR sending her to MARS, to deal with the OBVIOUS climate change there...
    Obviously, an "AO Cortez's idiotic statements" or "The Green New Deal is crap", and other variants would be hot topics at Avalon.

    Quote "Again,, if this thread is about what AOC "ACTUALLY SAYS",,,"
    But the thread title, the opening post, and the video in the opening post are all about exposing the dark side of politics, with specific types of governmental corruption highlighted. It's a good topic, I think, but even if I didn't think so, it's still the topic that was posted.

    The Avalon mods routinely split a topic, like this current thread, when it becomes obvious that there is a fork in the road resulting in 2 different topics and not just different sides to a topic. This topic has split into
    "AOC is a moron"
    and
    "Exposing the Dark Side of Politics"

    They are both valid topics.

    Someone should start a topic on the Green New Deal itself, and examine it, too. Maybe there is one really intelligent idea in the GND surrounded by 500 bad ideas - I don't know, I don't read partisan propaganda until it seems like it might actually be important to do so. So, I'd be a poor choice to start that thread.

    I have personally tried* not to get sucked-in to what is referred to as "identity politics", for several reasons, including that I believe that at least 90% and probably closer to 100% of politicians in the US government - elected and appointed positions - are agents of Empire. So, all I would do is rail at ALL of them, Ds and Rs. Plus, they are all temporary.

    After taking 3 steps back and trying hard to focus simply on the issues and policies and laws rather than the people/personalities/celebrities - which made a lot of sense to me because the people come and go but the policies and laws (such as the 'Patriot Act') are in place until overturned or modified - I realized that for me, even that isn't far enough back in the flow chart. I'm focused on how to wipe the chessboard clean of Empire's agents and Empire's mechanisms of control, and to not just allow the same powerful misanthropes to regain power. I encourage Avalon members to create topics about the personalities that they feel need public dissection. I encourage Avalon members to create topics about the issues that they feel need public dissection.


    *(and I failed miserably when it came to hillary, bernie, mccain, haley, trump, netanyahu, bolton, etc. I get it - when the personalities are making evil policies and laws, it's near impossible to ignore them or not be triggered by them. I have blasted all of these personalities elsewhere, and I see Avalon as a place for more in-depth discussion than drive-by memes - which is how places like faceboog operate.)
    I love your eternal optimism Dennis.

    I love that after all your effort and thougtfulness what you get in return is stuff like this

    "Ahem..

    Again, if this thread is about "remarks made by a person... etc.." AND i can't point and laugh at "the stupidest meatsuit ever" then I have to check out.
    "

    Not worth engaging.

    Too many proud boys on this website now

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