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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    US Regime Change in Venezuela: The Documented Evidence

    By Tony Cartalucci Global Research,
    January 25, 2019



    The Latin American nation of Venezuela faces dangerous destabilization with the United States and its allies having recognized opposition figure Juan Guaido as “president” and declaring actual Venezuelan president – Nicolas Maduro – no longer recognized.

    In response, President Maduro has demanded US diplomatic personnel to leave the country.

    Protests and counter-protests have reportedly taken to the streets as both sides attempt to seize the psychological and political initiative.

    Why Venezuela?
    According to US Secretary of State Mike Pompeo – the impetus for Washington’s sudden interest in Venezuela is the suffering of the Venezuelan people.

    Reuters in their article titled, “Pompeo calls on Venezuela’s Maduro to step down, urges support from military,” would claim:
    In a statement, Pompeo said Washington would support opposition leader Juan Guaido as he establishes a transitional government and prepares the country for elections.

    “The Venezuelan people have suffered long enough under Nicolas Maduro’s disastrous dictatorship,” Pompeo said. “We call on Maduro to step aside in favor of a legitimate leader reflecting the will of the Venezuelan people.”
    In truth, Washington’s motivation is the fact that according to The Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) – Venezuela has the largest proven oil reserves on Earth – more than Saudi Arabia and accounting for nearly a quarter of all OPEC production.



    The US doesn’t necessarily need this oil in terms of energy – but in terms of maintaining a US-led unipolar international order – controlling or crippling nations with large amounts of hydrocarbons prevents the emergence of a multipolar world nations across the developing world seek, led by reemerging global power – Russia – and newly emerging global power – China.

    A Venezuela governed by a stable political order able to produce wealth from its massive oil reserves – and dedicated to a multipolar alternative to Washington’s current international order is intolerable for Wall Street and Washington and explains the vast amount of time, energy, money, and resources the US has invested in destabilizing and overthrowing first President Hugo Chavez – with a coup attempt in 2002 – and now President Maduro.

    US Meddling in Venezuela
    Even the Western media has admitted that the US has long meddled in Venezuela’s internal affairs by funding the opposition.



    The UK Independent in a recent article titled, “Venezuela military chief declares loyalty to Maduro and warns US not to intervene,” would admit (emphasis added):
    The US has a long history of interfering with democratically elected governments in Latin America and in Venezuela it has sought to weaken the elected governments of both Mr Maduro and Mr Chavez.
    Some of the effort has been in distributing funds to opposition groups through organisations such as the National Endowment for Democracy, while some has been in the form of simple propaganda.
    Mark Weisbrot, co-director of the Centre for Economic and Policy Research in Washington, said that for the past 20 years it had been US policy to seek a change of government in Caracas. Mr Trump’s recognition of Mr Guaido was the most obvious effort to undermine the government.
    The US National Endowment for Democracy’s (NED) own current webpage admits to extensively interfering in every imaginable aspect of Venezuela’s internal political affairs with funds directed at:
    • Building Strategic Capacity for Local Democratic Actors
    • Cohesive Strategic Communications
    • Defending Human Rights Victims
    • Developing Tools for Agile Communication
    • Empowering Citizens through Local and National Policy Dialogue
    • Facilitating Humanitarian Aid Relief
    • Formulating a Comprehensive Public Policy Reform Package
    • Fostering Scenario Planning and Strategic Analysis
    • Fostering Small Business Enterprise in Defense of Democracy and Free Markets
    • Improving Democratic Governance in Venezuela
    • Improving Local Democratic Governance
    • Leadership Empowerment and Socio-Political Participation
    • Monitoring Human Rights Conditions
    • Monitoring the Human Rights Situation
    • Promoting Access to Justice and Public Services
    • Promoting Checks and Balances
    • Promoting Citizen Journalism
    • Promoting Citizen Participation and Freedom of Expression
    • Promoting Democratic Governance
    • Promoting Democratic Values
    • Promoting Dialogue and Reconciliation
    • Promoting Freedom of Association
    • Promoting Freedom of Expression and Access to Information
    • Promoting Human Rights
    • Promoting Independent Journalism
    • Promoting Political Engagement and Advocacy
    • Promoting the Rule of Law
    It is clear that the US is funding virtually every aspect of opposition operations – from media and legal affairs, to indoctrination and political planning, to interference in the economy and the leveraging of “human rights” to shield US-funded agitators from any attempt to arrest them.

    At one point during US regime change efforts, NED-funded front, Sumate, would even organize a recall referendum against President Chavez – which he won. The Washington Post in a 2006 article titled, “Chavez Government Probes U.S. Funding,” would admit:
    [Sumate] organized a recall referendum in 2004 that Chavez won and also is a vociferous critic of the government and the electoral system.
    The article also admits that:
    USAID which hired the Maryland-based company Development Alternatives Inc. to administer the grants has declined to identify many Venezuelan recipients, saying they could be intimidated or prosecuted.
    While the nature of the US government’s extensive meddling in Venezuela remains intentionally covert – admissions surrounding Sumate’s activities illustrate how even entire referendums are organized through the use of US money and guided by US directives.


    Maria Corina Machado, founder of Sumate, an alleged Venezuelan election monitoring group, funded by the US National Endowment for Democracy (NED), meeting with US President George Bush who presided over the failed 2002 coup attempt seeking to oust President Hugo Chavez.

    NED and other organizations operating in parallel – including convicted financial criminal George Soros’ Open Society Foundations – seek to entirely overwrite Venezuelan institutions, governance, and law, replacing it with an obedient US-sponsored client regime and system of administration.

    US support is not confined to broad efforts to build up the opposition – but also specific efforts to aid senior opposition leaders.

    A leaked 2004 US State Department document titled, “Status of Capriles and Sumate Cases,” made it clear that NED funding was ongoing even then, and that the US State Department was required to provide aid to NED-funded front Sumate being prosecuted for the very obvious treason they were engaged in. It also illustrated US State Department support for senior opposition leader Henrique Capriles Radonski.
    Capriles – along with Leopoldo Lopez – served as mentors to current opposition leader Juan Guaido who is now openly being offered some $20 million by the US State Department in aid.

    US Efforts to Cripple Venezuela’s Economy
    Reuters in an article titled, “Pompeo urges regional bloc to support Venezuela’s Guaido,” would claim:
    [Pompeo] pledged $20 million towards humanitarian aid for Venezuela, where economic collapse, hyperinflation, and food and medicine shortages have sparked an exodus of millions of people.
    The paradoxical nature of this supposed aid is that the United States had deliberately caused this economic collapse, hyperinflation, and food and medicine shortages in the first place – specifically to undermine and destabilize first President Chavez’ government and now Maduro’s.

    The US Treasury Department aimed sanctions specifically at (PDF) Venezuela’s central bank and Petroleos de Venezuela, S.A. (PdVSA) – Venezuela’s state-owned oil and gas company to restrict financing and to block transfers – while the US and allied OPEC members acted in concert to lower global oil prices – not only to cripple Venezuela’s oil-based economy – but those of other US adversaries including Iran and Russia.



    While the Western media repeatedly claims US sanctions have been reserved for Venezuelan officials only, the Washington Post itself would admit in an article titled, “Venezuela’s oil gives Maduro little leverage against the United States,” that (emphasis added):
    “Seventy-five percent of cash-generating oil exports are coming here,” said Scott Modell, the managing director of Rapidan Energy and a former CIA officer in Latin America. Though Venezuela exports considerable amounts of crude oil to major diplomatic allies like Russia and China, almost all of the profits are used to service preexisting debts. “They don’t get cash for that, and they are desperate for cash,” Modell said.
    The article also stated:
    Citgo’s ownership has long been a source of tension between the United States and Venezuela. In August 2017, the Trump administration signed an executive order that blocked the repatriation of dividends, and sanctions on Venezuelan officials have placed Citgo in an increasingly fraught position.

    Just under half of PDVSA’s shares in the company were used as collateral for a $1.5 billion loan the Venezuelan government took out from Russian energy giant Rosneft in 2016. Foreign creditors have suggested they may try to acquire parts of Citgo to service their debts.

    Modell said that there is debate in the United States about whether the U.S. government could seize the company itself. Some opposed this, arguing that Citgo should be an asset available for a post-Maduro Venezuela that could help provide a “petroeconomic recovery” for the ailing country.
    It is clear that significant efforts have been made to cripple Venezuela’s ability to profit from its oil with even the US media and those it interviews admitting the US is unsure of just how far to go – realizing that once the damaging sanctions are reversed, remaining, intact infrastructure will allow Venezuela to “provide a “petroeconomic recover” for the ailing country.”

    In other instances of economic warfare, large sums of Venezuelan gold have been withheld in the UK which refuses to return it to the Venezuelan government, The Times reports.

    Efforts within Venezuela through US-funded opposition groups, focus on hording certain essential goods creating artificial shortages while armed gangs hired by wealthy business and land owners ravage state-backed farmers and industries to further exasperate prices, supply, and demand.

    A Washington Post article titled, “Venezuela’s paradox: People are hungry, but farmers can’t feed them,” refers to the armed gangs merely as “criminals” but links to Venezuela Analysis which gives a fuller but contradictory version of events.

    Venezuela Analysis’ article, “Venezuelan Farmers on Disputed Land Say They Have No Intention of Vacating,” depicts efforts by farmers to use land reclaimed from wealthy owners to produce agricultural goods, but who are targeted by hired mercenaries, attacked and driven off. In other cases, wealthy oligarchs are able to secure concessions from courts to consolidate control over farmlands used to produce food.

    The Venezuelan government has been increasingly resorting to price controls and emergency measures to compensate in the face of overwhelming economic warfare but with varied success.



    Economic destabilization is a key component in US regime change efforts – witnessed in all of Washington’s past and current confrontations including against Iraq, Libya, Syria, Iran, North Korea, and Russia for an array of alleged offenses centered around “human rights” and fabricated threats to US national security.

    Conversely – nations like Saudi Arabia whom even former US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton admitted is “providing clandestine financial and logistic support to ISIL and other radical Sunni groups in the region,” and undeniably among the worst human rights abusers on Earth – has escaped not only sanctions, but even the most basic condemnation for its serial violations of international law and rights abuses.

    This stark contrast helps illustrate the true, politically-motivated nature of US sanctions arrayed against targeted nations with but the thinnest rhetorical veneer applied to obtain public support.

    Where even powerful nations like Russia and China must work for years to create alternatives to US-dollar domination across global finances – a nation like Venezuela already destabilized from decades of US-fomented chaos stands to suffer greatly in the face of sanctions and economic warfare – now coupled with another overt US-backed coup attempt.

    Imperialism, Not “Socialism”
    Venezuela sits on an ocean of proven oil reserves. It has been openly slated for regime change by the US and has been for years with documented evidence proving the current opposition vying for power is funded by Washington, for Washington’s, not Venezuela’s benefit.

    Sanctions and economic warfare have been aimed at Venezuela just as the US has done with the numerous other nations it has overthrown, invaded, and otherwise destroyed – or those that it is trying to overthrow and destroy.

    There is no missing puzzle piece that makes Venezuela an exception to what is another textbook case of US-backed regime change.

    Attempts to claim Venezuela’s crisis was precipitated by “socialism” – even if one is able to ignore the voluminous amounts of evidence proving US subversion has instead – still doesn’t add up.

    China is also socialist – communist in fact – with a high degree of central planning and nationalized industry. It possesses the largest high-speed rail network on Earth, has a space program with the ability to launch people into orbit, and has the world’s second largest economy.

    Conversely, the US hasn’t a single mile of high-speed rail, currently pays the Russian Federation to launch its astronauts into orbit, and has thoroughly squandered its place as largest global economy in pursuit of aspirations toward unrealized global domination.

    There is clearly more that contributes to a nation’s success or failure than being “socialist” or “capitalist” – whatever either term even really means. For Venezuela, its failures are a direct and clear result of US imperialism. And only through exposing and rolling back US meddling, can Venezuela’s fortunes be reversed.


    This article was originally published on the author’s blog site: Land Destroyer Report.

    Tony Cartalucci is Bangkok-based geopolitical researcher and writer, especially for the online magazine “New Eastern Outlook” where this article was originally published. He is a frequent contributor to Global Research.
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    Venezuela Avalon Member perolator's Avatar
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    Angry Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Mr. Hervé,

    I was laughing all the way reading this:

    Quote Posted by Hervé (here)
    For some background from Global Research:

    The Coup in Venezuela Must be Resisted

    By Craig Murray Global Research,

    January 24, 2019 Craig Murray

    Venezuela has elections. Juan Guaido has never even been a Presidential candidate. Despite massive CIA opposition funding and interference over years as Big Oil tries to regain control of the World’s largest oil reserves, Nicolas Maduro was democratically re-elected in 2018 as President of Venezuela.
    The Venezuelan 2018 elections were a farce. Less than 10% people voted. There were 2 government hand-picked "adversaries" to give the appearance of "fair" elections. Anyway, the election process was, as the chavista way dictates, heavily rigged.

    Quote The coup now under way is illegitimate. I opposed Maduro’s move to replace the elected National Assembly. Sometimes I read back things I wrote in the past and decide I was wrong. Sometimes I think the article was right, but a bit of a potboiler. Occasionally I am proud, and I am proud of my analysis on Venezuela written on 3 August 2017...
    It is not a coup. The military executes coups. Venezuelan upper ranks of the military supports Maduro, they are actually a political party. Guaidó and his team are civilians. Maduro is illegitimate all the way from 2013. I am sick of "journalists" like Craig Murray.

    I think I am wasting time reading and answering this post.

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    Avalon Member Carmody's Avatar
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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    It may also be that there is a new method, waiting in the wings, to more effectively (financially) remove the oil from the deposits. From small technological advances and new thinking-- big things can come.

    Thus to control this huge reserve and be able to do it at an effective cost, and thus control world oil pricing and thus stabilize and move forward 'world control' with a strong, stable arm --of oil power. Being able to directly wrangle the middle east to the ground, economically, is a very big deal. This can only be enacted with oil power. Every other method has been tried, and failed.

    Thus, attack Venezuela, and destabilize the bolivarian initiative, all at the same time, along with the drug business black ops (destabilizing countries, secret programs, etc) re-empowerment scheme (double down).

    China can take a direct hit in this as would Venezuela as, something akin to South America under the us umbrella.. can and probably would be used to whip the Chinese economy around. Plus, it's cheap, inexpensive to pursue Venezuela. All the boxes are ticked and functional. Some of the best low hanging inexpensive effective fruit on the globe, it is. It simply can't be anything but squarely in the US empire's crosshairs.


    I note that the chart supplied does not mention Canada at all, with a proven 166 billion barrels of oil in the western canadian tar sands. And there are more reserves elsewhere. Any improved method of removing oil from the Venezuela reserves might work for the tar sands, or vice versa.
    Interdimensional Civil Servant

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    Venezuela Avalon Member perolator's Avatar
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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Quote Posted by Carmody (here)
    ...Thus, attack Venezuela, and destabilize the bolivarian initiative, all at the same time, along with the drug business black ops (destabilizing countries, secret programs, etc) re-empowerment scheme (double down).
    The bolivarian initiative? Go to Venezuela and enjoy it. But try to do it with minimum wage. Be my guest.

    Please quit watching spy movies.

    The propaganda machine is well-oiled. (pun intended).

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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Perolator

    I Love your avatar picture

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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Quote Posted by perolator (here)
    Quote Posted by Carmody (here)
    ...Thus, attack Venezuela, and destabilize the bolivarian initiative, all at the same time, along with the drug business black ops (destabilizing countries, secret programs, etc) re-empowerment scheme (double down).
    The bolivarian initiative? Go to Venezuela and enjoy it. But try to do it with minimum wage. Be my guest.

    Please quit watching spy movies.

    The propaganda machine is well-oiled. (pun intended).

    I just spoke with a friend on the phone, who is highly intelligent and does considerable research into all he speaks on, and is a historian by trade/education.

    We spoke about integrity in elections and how they were monitored by various groups, concerning Venezuela, and he says your line about the elections only having 10% participation, is a pile of utter dog crap.

    Exactly who's propaganda are we dealing with, here?

    Those Koch brothers really are a human stain.....
    Interdimensional Civil Servant

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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Quote Posted by Carmody (here)
    Quote Posted by perolator (here)
    Quote Posted by Carmody (here)
    ...Thus, attack Venezuela, and destabilize the bolivarian initiative, all at the same time, along with the drug business black ops (destabilizing countries, secret programs, etc) re-empowerment scheme (double down).
    The bolivarian initiative? Go to Venezuela and enjoy it. But try to do it with minimum wage. Be my guest.

    Please quit watching spy movies.

    The propaganda machine is well-oiled. (pun intended).
    I just spoke with a friend on the phone, who is highly intelligent and does considerable research into all he speaks on, and is a historian by trade/education.

    We spoke about integrity in elections and how they were monitored by various groups, concerning Venezuela, and he says your line about the elections only having 10% participation, is a pile of utter dog crap.
    I take that as a compliment. I was giving 10% as a maximum possibility, being optimistic.

    Tell your friend thanks on my behalf, and also tell him no matter how he manages his information, most Venezuelans know what happened that day. That's why the "bolivarian initiative" will be kicked out of my country, sooner or later.

    And Chavez is dead, by the way.

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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Ok, so your avatar says you are in Venezuela and the participating groups of election monitoring says the elections had far far more participation than your claimed 10%.

    You have a cutesy avatar, but the words are, what, well, we're not sure.

    But we do know that to disarm initiatives before they begin, or stabilize into something, they can be distracted into not forming or being retarded or delayed, with a few words spoken at the right time and place. Disinformation, well couched, and well placed, is key.

    So, a critical point becomes, this 'speaking of', or 'statement of' this...10% participation thing. all while having a cute avatar and looking like you are in -or are in- Venezuela.


    Avalon can be an important forum, in some ways. Polite discussion goes a long way in helping inform people who count. So a civilized forum can be far more important than it looks at first glance.
    Interdimensional Civil Servant

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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Quote Posted by Carmody (here)
    [...]
    We spoke about integrity in elections and how they were monitored by various groups, concerning Venezuela...
    [...]
    Somewhere in this video (~ 13:15 mark), Abby Martin explains the strategy used by the "empire" to undermine the election results since they couldn't win up front with any of the opposition candidates:

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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Quote Posted by Carmody (here)
    Ok, so your avatar says you are in Venezuela and the participating groups of election monitoring says the elections had far far more participation than your claimed 10%.

    You have a cutesy avatar, but the words are, what, well, we're not sure.
    If you read my first post in this thread, You'll know I clearly stated I left my homeland. I am keeping my avatar for two reasons:
    • To protect myself and my family in venezuela. I am making heavy statements against the Venezuelan government, and if I were in my country, I may be "suicided". There are people in jail there for less. Do you remember Venezuela has a dictatorship, do you?
    • Because I will return someday, all my family is still there. I said above I love my country.

    Quote But we do know that to disarm initiatives before they begin, or stabilize into something, they can be distracted into not forming or being retarded or delayed, with a few words spoken at the right time and place. Disinformation, well couched, and well placed, is key.
    Wholeheartedly agree.

    Quote So, a critical point becomes, this 'speaking of', or 'statement of' this...10% participation thing. all while having a cute avatar and looking like you are in -or are in- Venezuela.

    Avalon can be an important forum, in some ways. Polite discussion goes a long way in helping inform people who count. So a civilized forum can be far more important than it looks at first glance.
    Fair enough. One of the points of the forum is exchange information and points of view. I cannot be more uncivilized because my mother taught me to be polite, no matter how hard the situation is. You said my opinion is crap, and used a single source of information to back up your claims, via phone call.

    Have a nice day.

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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Quote Posted by Carmody (here)
    It may also be that there is a new method, waiting in the wings, to more effectively (financially) remove the oil from the deposits. From small technological advances and new thinking-- big things can come.

    Thus to control this huge reserve and be able to do it at an effective cost, and thus control world oil pricing and thus stabilize and move forward 'world control' with a strong, stable arm --of oil power. Being able to directly wrangle the middle east to the ground, economically, is a very big deal. This can only be enacted with oil power. Every other method has been tried, and failed.

    Thus, attack Venezuela, and destabilize the bolivarian initiative, all at the same time, along with the drug business black ops (destabilizing countries, secret programs, etc) re-empowerment scheme (double down).

    China can take a direct hit in this as would Venezuela as, something akin to South America under the us umbrella.. can and probably would be used to whip the Chinese economy around. Plus, it's cheap, inexpensive to pursue Venezuela. All the boxes are ticked and functional. Some of the best low hanging inexpensive effective fruit on the globe, it is. It simply can't be anything but squarely in the US empire's crosshairs.


    I note that the chart supplied does not mention Canada at all, with a proven 166 billion barrels of oil in the western canadian tar sands. And there are more reserves elsewhere. Any improved method of removing oil from the Venezuela reserves might work for the tar sands, or vice versa.
    This is a very sensible analysis, when looking at worldwide picture.

    Plus, I have very rarely, if not never, seen the US government intervening in a country because its people are suffering. All I have seen is the US government intevening to protect their interest or to further them forwards in a global chess game. Completely heartless.

    But, don't worry, China and Russia are doing exactly the same - primitive world we have.

    The US supporting anybody to the presidency of a country is of significance for the future of the US. And more to the point, for the future of the world oligarchy, nobody else (not even the US citizens).

    I am a Canadian. We have oil, minerals to the tons, land, sea, and the north pole, annnnd the know how, education to manage it, everything everyone wants to grab. China is buying our land to the billions, Russia is quiet but we do share the north pole with them, and the US has always been taking for very cheap about everything Canadian, under the cover of free trade (no, you are not in trade deficit, USA, even your dirty milk is pushed on us right now, full of products not allowed in Canada, one of the reason we are still a tiny bit thinner).

    We, Canadian, are used to the one sided propaganda. Believe me, Venezuela is in for exploitation to the core.

    Starve the people, than feed the people so that they welcome us, while we win on the international chessboard. But make sure the people is fed much below their previous good standards, to keep the fear going.

    Make of it a plaque tournante of the drug cartels, to make sure every single family has drug problems to deal with (if not autism). Happening in the oil and minerals rich Mexico too.

    And no, I do not watch spy movies, I have seen it pretty directly - ex: when the US or its oligarchy wanted to put down the extraordinarily good Canadian communication industry (we were about 20 years ahead of US) - have an American president named at the head of its main Canadian company and make sure he puts it down while raking millions for himself. I have seen it hundreds of times. At the corporate levels as well as at the government levels. No kidding.

    Personally, I am truly sorry for the people, the suffering people. And wonder when are we going to become humanly evolved.

    ------ as an aside: at least Target could not take hold in Canada, I hope the same will happen with the US milk and food industries. We do not want nor need the US food crap, nor the Chinese one (which has invaded our markets as well).

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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Well done to Herve for starting this post but just putting Main Stream Media clips here is a bit of a joke considering all of us in Avalon know that the MSN is not to be trusted.

    And yet people here seem to be believing it over what perolator is saying and what I know to be true about the situation...

    Are we to believe what Global Reasearch says? Such an independent source of unbiased truth?

    As for Abby Martin, she is just repeating the Russia Today viewpoint and after a few words with a few locals doesn't really know what she is talking about.

    I guess people believe the MSN when it suits them.

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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Well, what about some verifiable data, then?
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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Quote Posted by Flash (here)
    Plus, I have very rarely, if not never, seen the US government intervening in a country because its people are suffering. All I have seen is the US government intevening to protect their interest or to further them forwards in a global chess game. Completely heartless.

    But, don't worry, China and Russia are doing exactly the same - primitive world we have.

    .
    You mean China and Russia also has 800 military bases around the world? You mean China and Russia also been in the front line of all the wars in the world?
    Protecting interest is one thing killing people to do that is another thing.

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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Quote Posted by 5th (here)
    Well done to Herve for starting this post but just putting Main Stream Media clips here is a bit of a joke considering all of us in Avalon know that the MSN is not to be trusted.
    I also thank Hervé for starting the thread. I have a friend who told me to check out this thread and felt compelled to post some thoughts.

    Quote And yet people here seem to be believing it over what perolator is saying and what I know to be true about the situation...

    Are we to believe what Global Reasearch says? Such an independent source of unbiased truth?

    As for Abby Martin, she is just repeating the Russia Today viewpoint and after a few words with a few locals doesn't really know what she is talking about.

    I guess people believe the MSN when it suits them.
    I am not commenting about Abby because her opinion as the opinion of a large amount of people, may be biased but without all the information at her disposal, she is not able to give a fair opinion. I also mistrust RT, and some journalists from The Guardian are backing Maduro's regime (!). That propaganda machine is well-oiled, as I said before. My intention is not to compete with this people. It is impossible.

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    Avalon Retired Member
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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Quote Posted by Bubu (here)
    Quote Posted by Flash (here)
    Plus, I have very rarely, if not never, seen the US government intervening in a country because its people are suffering. All I have seen is the US government intevening to protect their interest or to further them forwards in a global chess game. Completely heartless.

    But, don't worry, China and Russia are doing exactly the same - primitive world we have.

    .
    You mean China and Russia also has 800 military bases around the world? You mean China and Russia also been in the front line of all the wars in the world?
    Protecting interest is one thing killing people to do that is another thing.
    this is not Carmody's text, Bubu, this is mine.

    No, I do not mean they have all the military bases all over the world, but I mean that economically, they are all over too. This is the pulling the blanket to oneself game. Of course USA has lots of military power, which in fact is descriptive too. They spend about half of their --- produit national brut (someone help for translation) - on the military. Take that money to change the world for the better, there will be no more need for military.

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  20. Link to Post #37
    Philippines Avalon Member
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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Fact: wherever oil is, there would be US gov. meddling.

    What are the possibilities of them playing the two factions like they did in US politics and to so many medllings?

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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Quote Posted by Hervé (here)
    Well, what about some verifiable data, then?
    Verifiable from what source? The only data you've supplied is 'verified' by the MSN. It's impossible for anyone to provide real verification and so we can only go on what is coming out of Venezuela itself from people who've seen what is happening rather than what the media is reporting.

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    Venezuela Avalon Member perolator's Avatar
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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Quote Posted by 5th (here)
    Quote Posted by Hervé (here)
    Well, what about some verifiable data, then?
    Verifiable from what source? The only data you've supplied is 'verified' by the MSN. It's impossible for anyone to provide real verification and so we can only go on what is coming out of Venezuela itself from people who've seen what is happening rather than what the media is reporting.
    I am a high-ranked employee of the Koch Brothers.

    Here is one of my favorite quotes ever:
    Quote You take the blue pill—the story ends, you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill—you stay in Wonderland, and I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.
    I live in a free world. I hope my people can also say the same.

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    Canada Avalon Member Justplain's Avatar
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    Default Re: Turmoil in Venezuela

    Unfortunately the Venezuelan people are suffering so badly, and the maduro government is apparently so corrupt and incompetent, that it becomes obfuscated how the cia has caused this situation in the first place. Although I don't know the details, this smells similar to the 'populist' uprising in the Ukraine, in which a democraticly elected leader was ousted by a bunch of fringe neo-fascists. As Mr. Leahy mentions, after reviewing Perkins' 'Confessions of an Economic Hitman' you can see the trademarks of a covertly sponsored coup in the Venezuelan situation. The cia would be strenuously involved because of the big oil money. The cia gets involved with overturning regimes for much less money.

    It is very sad that Venezuelans are suffering so badly from this situation. Chavas and Maduro had a real opportunity to improve the paradigm in their country, but appear to have fallen for power politics and money instead of being primarily concerned about the welfare of their people.

    I know that Maduro is 'the devil that you know', and the one you want to get rid of, but don't expect the replacement to be much better. If maduro is overthrown, the people are best off appealing to someone other than the USA. I am not sure who to appeal to, but not the usa, nor the EU, nor the IMF, nor the world Bank, not NATO, but perhaps there is someone out there who can help.

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