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Thread: Political Polarization, Unmitigated Rage, and the Unbridgeable Divide

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    Default Re: Political Polarization, Unmitigated Rage, and the Unbridgeable Divide

    I agree with you people see things differently and we must show respect. But how about those people who deliberately "slings mud everywhere, poisons your food and water, sprays your air with contaminants and then waterboards your wife and kids" Are we going to choose respect than "call them out" as Daozen said. We have those kind of people here on avalon. Shall we flush them out or continue to pretend that they are nice and be nice to them. Look at the main page, who are deliberately posting the useless threads to your opinion. Those are the ones who bring mud to this forum. We are lucky to have this kind of thread once in while now. And how about those who are caught sneaking subliminal very often.

    I am lucky to be a member of this forum. I can positively say that I have grown with the help of grown ups here. too bad now the goodness is dying slowly being buried into mud, by whom? Sorry its difficult to show respect to people who...perhaps our niceness out of proportion is to be blamed.

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    Default Re: Political Polarization, Unmitigated Rage, and the Unbridgeable Divide

    For me, it's good that this is being discussed here. People here are much more of the ass kickers, ones that I find friends, then some would perceive. Allowance for varying viewpoints, within my understanding of my own review of past experiences, is like looking at myself under different influences, at different times in this life. Restraint within this forum is a recognition of it's members self-worth and if there is an ideology it is based upon a very strong balance of the heart-centered warriors way.

    Most discussions founded on political opposition as the basis for expounding on a viewpoint seem very superficial and cartoonish to me. That's why I rarely engage in these subjects. When common experiences are discussed, those that have distinct value apart from politics, then I see grounds for growing a humane connection that empowers both to live beyond the manipulators grasp.

    Personally, when I am hearing the surface repetition of a well known viewpoint it means I have not shared enough of my experience to create a space where people really feel comfortable enough to share theirs. I look deep into the heart of my time in that moment with anyone and I always see an entrainment through some self-serving source that has temporarily taken over their focus, their humanity, their worth. It is up to me to prompt their sharing, valuing the listening and the expression, often times more than hearing the subject matter or the details, even details which I have an eidetic memory for.

    I ask myself what in that person's life is really bugging them and what thought process are they attached to that has attached itself to them, limiting their breath and preventing them from living in the moments we are sharing? What is their personal story and why are they here with me now?

    Many often miss the core of a problem and neglect to discuss or even evaluate the influence of those who profit from the divisions they share. Look there for solutions if you are not already in the habit of listening to others. In fact cultivating, prompting the personal experiences from those who share common understanding creates an openness and real empathy of everyone, even those who seem to have extreme viewpoints, seemingly not based on any reality we know of.
    Common ground is always a good thing when it does not seek a common enemy beyond the lie, the manipulation, the profit, yet works for a wider understanding. As well, in the same light, it has to call out the problem in order to remove the manipulative influence.

    I know it seems like a difficult thing to do, but experiencing the illusion of the difficulty is the reward. The holographic illusion of overwhelming odds is just a paper tiger, especially in the often useless world of words and impressions, stories, and symbols. Overvaluing the importance of words diminishes their ability to represent the truth.

    Granted that words, impressions, stories and symbols have been used for the good of many but their misuse has been exposed. These present exposures are now providing the opportunity for all of us to examine our use of those words for our own positive benefit and the benefit of others.

    Along those positive lines I would emphatically say there is no political correctness. For whose political correctness is this mild, fear-based, diminutive, soul-squeezing and creativity killing dogma serving? I know it is invented only by those who work hard to impose some political and social constriction, imprinting their guilt and the emotional tyranny that they feel they have been a party to, or those psychopaths who revel in their twisted story telling that seems to guide much of the imagery seen these days. Someone is moving that dialog along in an easy to see and overtly orchestrated way.

    Without a deeper understanding of those seemingly opposing viewpoints there is no common ground found. When found, that common ground often reveals to both parties the manufactured conflict as it exists, in the naked construct that some third and deeply influential provocateur has given it's energy and resources to.

    I always ask who is funding the provocation and I look for the payouts, financial, ego-inflating, political, tribal.

    Daozen's new thread brings understanding to this subject:

    "Some articles on forum manipulation"
    http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...63#post1293963
    Last edited by Hym; 30th May 2019 at 19:08.

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    Default Re: Political Polarization, Unmitigated Rage, and the Unbridgeable Divide

    Quote Posted by Bubu (here)
    I agree with you people see things differently and we must show respect. But how about those people who deliberately "slings mud everywhere, poisons your food and water, sprays your air with contaminants and then waterboards your wife and kids" Are we going to choose respect than "call them out" as Daozen said. We have those kind of people here on avalon. Shall we flush them out or continue to pretend that they are nice and be nice to them. Look at the main page, who are deliberately posting the useless threads to your opinion. Those are the ones who bring mud to this forum. We are lucky to have this kind of thread once in while now. And how about those who are caught sneaking subliminal very often.

    I am lucky to be a member of this forum. I can positively say that I have grown with the help of grown ups here. too bad now the goodness is dying slowly being buried into mud, by whom? Sorry its difficult to show respect to people who...perhaps our niceness out of proportion is to be blamed.
    We need to call out those who are deliberately poisoning our water and spraying our skies. Empathy need not apply, unless one subscribes to the notion that social engineering and herding the sheep is necessary with diet, injections, and injunctions (among other things), and is not only necessary, but also a moral and noble pursuit. I don't buy it -- but that's just me. The problem is, in my view, those who are deliberately orchestrating the discord to suit their agendas are elusive entities at the very top of the social structure; they are few and far in-between. But they also have the power to shape the narrative via propaganda, indoctrination, and through various institutions that propagate culture. They are sucking in droves of unconscious observers to do their bidding, including family and friends and many innocents who may not fully understand they are but unwitting participants, and with whom we should have empathy. People don't necessarily have ideas -- ideas have people, and this is the dynamic that seems to foment the rage and polarization we are seeing today.

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    Default Re: Political Polarization, Unmitigated Rage, and the Unbridgeable Divide

    It was not my intent to suggest that we necessarily empathize with the wrongdoers. (However you may define wrongdoing.) I'm suggesting that if there was more empathy across all sectors, there would be less wrongdoing. Along the lines of: "Do undo others as you would have them do undo you."

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    Default Re: Political Polarization, Unmitigated Rage, and the Unbridgeable Divide

    Quote Posted by Satori (here)
    It was not my intent to suggest that we necessarily empathize with the wrongdoers. (However you may define wrongdoing.) I'm suggesting that if there was more empathy across all sectors, there would be less wrongdoing. Along the lines of: "Do undo others as you would have them do undo you."
    Yes I agree but it does not mean that we don't call them out as they are. there are new members, new to this awareness. I was ones like them and was thankful to the learned ones who call them out. Saved me a lot of time and headache.

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    Default Re: Political Polarization, Unmitigated Rage, and the Unbridgeable Divide

    T Smith, that was a wonderful and heartfelt post.

    Manners today are appalling and there is so much lack of respect for others. I used to hear this from my parents and grandparents 40 years ago and I'd roll my eyes, but it's something that I agree with today. Learning more from them in later life, I discovered with astonishment that my parents and grandparents had sometimes been disobedient and naughty, so it's nothing new. Instead of being a phenomenon of our times it has been a slow process, a drip-drip-drip over the course of at least a century, and I believe that has been directed culturally by TPTB.

    I can't believe what is going on in this country over Brexit - mild-mannered people that I know shrieking about it, friends falling out over opposing positions. I keep quiet unless I know that I'm in like-minded company as I have no wish to have a hysterical person in my midst.

    One thing that I have thought about - I think that 9/11 has cast a huge psychic scar over the world. I don't think it matters if you believe the official version or not, but a lot seemed to change in my observation from that time on. The 1990s was a fun decade, and there has been no return to that since.

    I hope that my random musings make sense!

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    Default Re: Political Polarization, Unmitigated Rage, and the Unbridgeable Divide

    No witch hunts.

    If there are agents here, oh well, there are agents everywhere. In every walk of life. There are gas station attendants that are agents, CEOs, coffee shop barristas, politicians, revolutionaries, even just regular folks who are just being themselves, having no idea that others perceive them to be agents of anything other than an unpopular opinion. Dealing with them is often easier than dealing with that within ourselves that responds negatively to the provocation and acts out, contributing to the divide.

    Breath. Settle down and contribute. Get in where you fit in, anyone who is suspicious, if you do not have absolute proof of their agent-hood, will just have to be engaged with according to the merits of the moment.

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    Default Re: Political Polarization, Unmitigated Rage, and the Unbridgeable Divide

    Quote Posted by HikerChick (here)
    T Smith, that was a wonderful and heartfelt post.

    Manners today are appalling and there is so much lack of respect for others. I used to hear this from my parents and grandparents 40 years ago and I'd roll my eyes, but it's something that I agree with today. Learning more from them in later life, I discovered with astonishment that my parents and grandparents had sometimes been disobedient and naughty, so it's nothing new. Instead of being a phenomenon of our times it has been a slow process, a drip-drip-drip over the course of at least a century, and I believe that has been directed culturally by TPTB.

    I can't believe what is going on in this country over Brexit - mild-mannered people that I know shrieking about it, friends falling out over opposing positions. I keep quiet unless I know that I'm in like-minded company as I have no wish to have a hysterical person in my midst.

    One thing that I have thought about - I think that 9/11 has cast a huge psychic scar over the world. I don't think it matters if you believe the official version or not, but a lot seemed to change in my observation from that time on. The 1990s was a fun decade, and there has been no return to that since.

    I hope that my random musings make sense!
    Our elders often chided us about manners (to which we invariably rolled our eyes) but what I tell my kids and those who are younger and believe they already know everything, is why manners are so important. Manners are actually a sort of "language" of sorts shared between generations and cultures of disparate tradition and origin. Every generation grows up in a world different from the generation before them, and vastly different from a couple generations before. So manners serve to bridge a communication gap between generations (and differing cultures). Manners are a common tool we can all employ to communicate between age groups and cultural tribes whose experiences may otherwise be too disparate to forge effective communication. That said, I don't mean to confuse manners with political correctness, which is something entirely different.

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    Default Re: Political Polarization, Unmitigated Rage, and the Unbridgeable Divide

    Quote Posted by Rahkyt (here)
    No witch hunts.

    If there are agents here, oh well, there are agents everywhere. In every walk of life. There are gas station attendants that are agents, CEOs, coffee shop barristas, politicians, revolutionaries, even just regular folks who are just being themselves, having no idea that others perceive them to be agents of anything other than an unpopular opinion. Dealing with them is often easier than dealing with that within ourselves that responds negatively to the provocation and acts out, contributing to the divide.

    Breath. Settle down and contribute. Get in where you fit in, anyone who is suspicious, if you do not have absolute proof of their agent-hood, will just have to be engaged with according to the merits of the moment.
    What about those you may suspect are unwitting agents? I agree with you very few are knowing agents of any certain ideology or cause or movement. But almost all of us carry the water for something greater than ourselves, or for some cause, even every day folks who are gas attendants, baristas, etc. And it would seem one of the underlying dynamics of the rage and vitriol characteristic of the political polarization of our times is a subconscious recognization of this dynamic in each of us. There is so much ignorance and programming and indoctrination prevalent in our present day world. There is our neighbor or brother-in-law or professional associate (who otherwise is a good person) but who is unknowingly carrying the water for our Luciferian overlords bend on enslaving the human race (to allude to earlier posts in this thread), or for the White Supremest Patriarchs who are just as happy marginalizing the rest of us in the name of the status quo. These are the people we rage against--to hell with their ideas and thoughts on the matter--to let them know just what the hell they're doing and how horrible it is.

    I often times find myself asking someone who tickles a trigger in me something along the lines of, "you do realize you are carrying the water for such-and-such, right?" And if said person realizes it and owns it and is okay with -- suddenly I'm okay with it. We simply agree to disagree. We can have a rational discussion on the matter and I proceed via the merits of persuasion and argument to convince them why they are misinformed, etc. But it's when they know not what they do when I find tempted to the dark side of the divide. That's what triggers the emotional side of things...
    Last edited by T Smith; 1st June 2019 at 03:30.

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    United States Avalon Member Rahkyt's Avatar
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    Default Re: Political Polarization, Unmitigated Rage, and the Unbridgeable Divide

    Quote Posted by T Smith (here)
    What about those you may suspect are unwitting agents? I agree with you very few are knowing agents of any certain ideology or cause or movement. But almost all of us carry the water for something greater than ourselves, or for some cause, even every day folks who are gas attendants, baristas, etc. And it would seem one of the underlying dynamics of the rage and vitriol characteristic of the political polarization of our times is a subconscious recognization of this dynamic in each of us.
    It is true, we do carry water for ideologies and causes beyond us and that is right and good, insofar as those moralistic expressions go in characterizing reality, which is often at its base level beyond relativistic perceptions. Rage and vitriol are emotive expressions that have their place in life, in human interactions that serve the purpose of those who engage them. That we see a lot of it lately is indicative of the times. Is anybody else paying attention to the Schumann Resonance these days? It has been off the charts.

    Quote Posted by T Smith (here)
    There is so much ignorance and programming and indoctrination prevalent in our present day world. There is our neighbor or brother-in-law or professional associate (who otherwise is a good person) but who is unknowingly carrying the water for our Luciferian overlords bend on enslaving the human race (to allude to earlier posts in this thread), or for the White Supremest Patriarchs who are just as happy marginalizing the rest of us in the name of the status quo. These are the people we rage against--to hell with their ideas and thoughts on the matter--to let them know just what the hell they're doing and how horrible it is.
    Yes. According to our perception of what is right. To them, people are different and some are superior to others. How many times have you ever walked by a homeless person on the street and looked the other way knowing they were going to ask you for money? How did you feel about that person, or perhaps some other person in a fleeting instant of visceral and automatic responsiveness to the awareness of the difference between you? My point is that the relativism of perception is related to so many ingrained and indoctrinated perspectives that we each hold that form the very basis of our understanding and interpretation of the world around us and that we are slave to these perceptions even as we seek to transcend them.

    Quote Posted by T Smith (here)
    I often times find myself asking someone who tickles a trigger in me something along the lines of, "you do realize you are carrying the water for such-and-such, right?" And if said person realizes it and owns it and is okay with -- suddenly I'm okay with it. We simply agree to disagree. We can have a rational discussion on the matter and I proceed via the merits of persuasion and argument to convince them why they are misinformed, etc. But it's when they know not what they do when I find tempted to the dark side of the divide. That's what triggers the emotional side of things...
    And that leads to good times and a productive discussion which will allow all of the participants to leave the interaction feeling like they have made a connection and have found a higher way through the morass of polarity. I would say it is all ok. It is all good. The reason why it is so is merely because it is so and it is what is. Perhaps simplistic and overly zen, but effective to recognize difference and allow it to be, to exist as what it is, purely. And to extrapolate that understanding to every level of materialization, of worldly interaction is to cultivate a perspective that allows for things to just be, no matter how they fit within our own personal belief systems.
    Last edited by Rahkyt; 3rd June 2019 at 19:04.

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    Default Re: Political Polarization, Unmitigated Rage, and the Unbridgeable Divide

    Thank you T Smith for this great thread and comments.

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    Default Re: Political Polarization, Unmitigated Rage, and the Unbridgeable Divide

    People are polarized right now, but as AI gains traction, technocrats and all kinds of white collar professionals are going to be as displaced as factory workers were in the 1970's. It will become an across the board disenfranchisement. Massive poverty lies ahead. Social capital and reaching across traditional divides may be the only way forward.

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