+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 38

Thread: The Question of God and the Nature of God

  1. Link to Post #1
    UK Avalon Member Star Mariner's Avatar
    Join Date
    15th November 2011
    Location
    Southwest UK
    Posts
    1,634
    Thanks
    8,828
    Thanked 10,399 times in 1,555 posts

    Default The Question of God and the Nature of God

    What is God? That is one big nugget to grind down. Is there any question more profound? Everyone and anyone can answer it, depending on their point of view, but at the same time it can never really be answered.

    I wonder what the different interpretations are, and what it might lead to if discussed? For my part, this is my take on the question.

    The answer for me lies in the very first spiritual literature I came across, which has served me so very well all these years. These are the spiritual teachings and philosophies I personally believe in, hold dear, and try to live my life by.

    These teachings were communicated from the spirit world itself (so from the horse's mouth), by the Native-American spirit guide Silver Birch, read by medium Maurice Barbanell. A series of books on Silver Birch were published in the early 20th century, in days long before 'AI' and the controversies of channelled material, and before spiritualism and the new age movement were co-opted. But why else do I trust them? Because they reflect logic, intelligence, and just common sense. And they resonate to the deepest level of the soul.

    Silver Birch doesn't describe every concept perfectly and in its totality. If you read between the lines, you get a feeling that what's being said is worded, tailored very carefully for the ears of the time, as well as to the level of a relative spiritual novice. But it's still bursting with incredibly deep, and at the same time, simple wisdom. Silver Birch peals back the layers of spiritual reality and the great mystery that is life like no other I have ever found. If you want to cut through the crap, if you want to bypass all the human baggage that accompanies religion, faith, and ideology, if you want to go to the source, the spring waters of purest truth, if you will, this is surely it, and I cannot recommend it enough.

    It feels as though I'm trumpeting Silver Birch, though this is more to share what this advanced spirit says of such big questions like God, or as he calls him/her/it, The Great Spirit, and spirit itself, and the nature of spirit. Because I feel these hugely important questions, on which so many differ, can and do have answers, human answers we can all at least appreciate and understand, even if not all of us will believe them.

    Q. How would you describe God?
    A. It is impossible to give you a complete picture. God is infinite. All language, concepts and pictures must be finite. The lesser cannot include the greater. You can obtain some idea of what the Great Spirit is like by looking at the universe. See how it is regulated by natural law, where provision has been made for every facet of life, even though these manifestations are multitudinous in their variety. Whether it be minutely small or majestically mighty all that lives, moves and breathes, all that exists, are controlled by natural law.

    Nothing is outside the orbit of natural law. The seasons follow one another, the earth rotates on its axis, the tide ebbs and flows. Whatever seeds you plant, what will grow is contained within it; it will be true to its nature. Law reigns supreme. Every new discovery, whatever it may be, wherever it may be, is controlled by the same natural law. Nothing is forgotten, nothing is overlooked, nothing is neglected. What is this power responsible for it? It is infinite. It is not a magnified man, the Jehovah of the Old Testament. It is not a deity who is full of vengeance and sends plagues because of displeasure. It is not a capricious, wrathful deity. History and evolution show that the world slowly moves forward, upward, revealing that the power behind it is benevolent. So gradually you get this picture of infinite love and wisdom that rule all, that govern all, that direct all and are within all. And that I call the Great Spirit.
    Q. What of spirit itself? What is spirit?
    A. Spirit is perfect in its origin, spirit possesses intrinsically the creative forces of all life. Spirit is not subject to age, infirmity, wastage or to any of the defects that affect the physical body. The line of spirit evolution is from immaturity to maturity. Part of its evolution is accomplished through a physical body, which it has created for that purpose. Spirit is dominant, spirit is king, spirit is the ruler. But here comes the paradox. There is an interaction between spirit, mind and body, and the body restricts the activity of the spirit on earth because the spirit can express itself on earth only through the body at its disposal.

    Q. So spirit needs contact with the world of matter in order to gain conscious individuality?
    A. Yes. In order to gain consciousness it must incarnate through matter and have the experience of matter. It evolves from matter into spirit. That means that its association with a body of matter enables it to express itself as an individual working through the personality of the physical. Spirit becomes aware of itself after it has incarnated into matter.
    Q. If so, is the Great Spirit gaining experience through us?
    A. No. Your evolution cannot affect that which is already perfect.
    Q. But we are all parts of the Great Spirit. Does not the evolution of a part affect the whole?
    A. It only affects that part which is manifesting through you, which in itself is perfect, but is not perfect in its expression through each one of you. In itself spirit is perfect. It is the primary substance of the universe. It is the breath of life. In its expression through you it is imperfect because you are imperfect. As you evolve, more of the perfection can express itself through you. You are not evolving the spirit, but you are evolving the consciousness through which the spirit can express itself.

    [For me, that resolves the enigma that a perfect God created an imperfect world. SB explained further in another question.]

    Q. If the Great Spirit is perfect, and we are of the Great Spirit, how and why is humanity so imperfect?
    A.There is perfection and imperfection, but imperfection contains within itself the seeds of perfection, for perfection comes from imperfection. Perfection does not come from perfection, but from imperfection. Life is evolution, it is progress, a striving upward, a development, unfolding, extension, reaching out.

    The Great Spirit is the Law and the law is perfect. But that part of the Great Spirit that is expressed in your world is subject to the evolution of that world so far as its expression is concerned. Remember that your world is evolving, and these things are the signs of its evolution. Your world was born in fire and tempest and is gradually evolving towards perfection.

    You cannot say that the Great Spirit is responsible for the beauty of the sunset and the sunrise, for the myriads of glittering stars in the firmament, for all the delightful songs of the birds, and then say the Great Spirit is not responsible for the storm and the lightning, the thunder and the rain. They are all part of the great law of the Great Spirit.

    In that sense, you might argue that the Great Spirit is responsible for those who are depraved, for those who are so unenlightened that they render harm to their brothers in your world. But to each one of you there is given that amount of free will which, as you evolve, you learn to exercise. The higher you evolve in the spiritual scale, the greater can you exercise your free will. You are your own limitation but, because you are of the Great Spirit, you can conquer all the difficulties and obstacles in your world.

    Man is the gardener of his own soul. The Great Spirit has provided him with all that is necessary for it to grow in wisdom, grace and beauty. The implements are there, he has but to use them wisely and well.
    Q. But evil... If evil is due to man's misuse of free will, then why should the Great Spirit endow him with that free will which He knows would be misused?
    A. How else could you have man fulfilling his destiny? Not all are evil, to use that word. There is a mixture in mankind. If you have to choose between a puppet, an automaton, and a being with potential powers of selfishness and saintliness, which would you prefer? Would you prefer man to participate in the infinite processes of creation? If so, he must have virtues and faults, for without the faults he could not have the virtues. Life is comparative. Man rises through struggle and difficulty; man attains, because attainment is not easy, but because it is hard, and that process refines the soul, purifies his nature and makes his character grow. Darkness is where light is not; evil is where good is not; ignorance is where knowledge is not. If all the world were good, it would cease to be good. If all the world had knowledge, it would cease to be knowledge. If all the world had light, it would cease to be light. You grow through comparative experiences. You achieve the heights because you have tasted the depths. That which is achieved without struggle is lightly prized. That which is achieved with struggle is counted as an endearing prize.

    Of God, the Great Spirit, he summarizes:

    The Great Spirit is not a person. The Great Spirit is not a deified individual. The Great Spirit is beyond personality. The Great Spirit is the epitome of law, love, wisdom, truth. It is the natural law of the universe; the creative force behind all life, whether registered in the plane of matter or in the plane of spirit.

    The Great Spirit pervades all the universe, whether it is that tiny portion known to you or that larger part which, as yet, has not been revealed to earthly gaze. The Great Spirit fills all life. The Great Spirit is within all beings. The Great Spirit is within all laws. The Great Spirit is the Great Spirit. He is life. He is love. He is everything.
    Last edited by Star Mariner; 23rd August 2019 at 19:19.
    "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
    ~ Jimi Hendrix

  2. The Following 25 Users Say Thank You to Star Mariner For This Post:

    Baby Steps (28th August 2019), Bill Ryan (23rd August 2019), enigma3 (24th August 2019), Franny (24th August 2019), Gracy May (24th August 2019), greybeard (27th August 2019), gs_powered (23rd August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Jayke (23rd August 2019), Jill (24th August 2019), Justplain (24th August 2019), Ken (24th August 2019), NancyV (26th August 2019), Nasu (24th August 2019), Orph (23rd August 2019), Peter UK (24th August 2019), Sadieblue (24th August 2019), Sammy (31st August 2019), T Smith (24th August 2019), Valerie Villars (24th August 2019), what is a name? (26th August 2019), Wind (24th August 2019), wondering (25th August 2019), Words of Joy (20th September 2019), XelNaga (26th August 2019)

  3. Link to Post #2
    England Avalon Member
    Join Date
    12th February 2019
    Location
    Northwest UK
    Age
    38
    Posts
    143
    Thanks
    96
    Thanked 382 times in 102 posts

    Red face Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    God is love 1 john 4v8.
    God is love and that is infinite and unconditional. Love is stifled and ignored a lot here upon our planet and society through elite systems thinks that fear rules over love. Which I beg to differ. But Love is gentle, love is kind, it is not self seeking nor , it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes and always perserveres. 1 Corinthians 13:4–8a

    Love is an energy with ample grace enough that you will make it through to letting go of anything unloving. Which is not holy. We are fed through the minds to be egotistical and use the brain as though it's us. The heart is to be filled with love. The heart penetrates love and love covers all sins too.
    So when you ask what is GOD? God is this patient father waiting heart wrenching for us to turn to love through JEsus or Mohammed what ever belief route you prefer we come back to a palace of Gold in heaven.

    Call it what you want but we are all love inside of us, we were born out of love as a baby we are love and innocent it's the upbringing and society that rots us with dread, fear, negativity and hatred and i'ts taught to not love, keep an upper stiff lip, don't forgive, Keep your emotions to your self, do not hug me, do not touch me, do I need to keep going on? okay I get that, some situations we have to be careful.

    Love is about forgiving and letting go of the low energy that we have and having a light shiny personality and being proud to be kind, loving, generous and forgiving plus compassionate.

    I don't know why churches are dead but the thing for me is being a walking example for others . We require this more nowadays than ever. So if you are loving that is good but don't feel ever that you are ashamed to be emotional or over come with joy or the hard ships.
    We can believe in anything. GOD who is love wants you to be abundant and to receive but we don't know how sometimes.
    I 'm not going to preach, but I say this one thing. Jesus said the same and I don't think Jesus is to be shunned to be honest. I think he was ridiculed for speaking out in society about being free in love not restraint in fear.
    Please don't shun love. GOD the energy that I felt was deep true love but ten thousand fold that. We blame them for things when we shouldn't because if we had patience and belief and trust and asked for their help, he does and he is alive.

    GOD is everything but he resides within each one of us so he can sample a lot of different situations that is why he says he is always near to us not wishing to harm us but to love us. We including myself become afraid of love because of being taught we will be cast into hell. Hell is manmade it's not being judged for we judge ourselves.
    Love is unconditional so why should they judge you. You do it' with your tongue and mouth.
    Love is comfort, blessings why should we frown if someone blesses you?

    I bless my family and I see that God does deliver and it's all those nice things you get for you or OMG I never knew that could happen good, or that was a phew. Yeah please Credit God and Jesus for those. They do it' because they want to show you that they care and that they are real. Love is real. Please love yourself and others.

    End of Preach lol. Sorry. I am so passionate about talking about love. peace to you all. Angel.

  4. The Following 17 Users Say Thank You to Angels1981 For This Post:

    amor (24th August 2019), Caliban (24th August 2019), enigma3 (24th August 2019), Franny (24th August 2019), greybeard (23rd August 2019), gs_powered (23rd August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Jayke (23rd August 2019), Ken (24th August 2019), NancyV (26th August 2019), Nasu (24th August 2019), Orph (23rd August 2019), Sadieblue (24th August 2019), Sammy (31st August 2019), Star Mariner (24th August 2019), Wind (24th August 2019), wondering (25th August 2019)

  5. Link to Post #3
    UK Avalon Member
    Join Date
    20th February 2011
    Location
    Manchester
    Age
    35
    Posts
    977
    Thanks
    7,438
    Thanked 5,397 times in 901 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    Silver Birch sounds like he’s been studying some neo-pythagoreanism.

    Who was it that said “everyone is born with a spirit, but the soul has to be earned”? It’s the difference between the ‘Ka’ (spirit) and ‘Ba’ (soul) in ancient Egyptian, and the transfiguration of the various aspects of the soul to be in union with god—or Ka-Ba-lah as it became known to the Jews—the path to embodying the virtues of god.

    The hermetic texts describe The Great Spirit, or the great universal mind of god, as The Divine Pymander, or The Great Dragon.
    POIMANDRES, THE VISION OF HERMES

    Hermes, while wandering in a rocky and desolate place, gave himself over to meditation and prayer. Following the secret instructions of the Temple, he gradually freed his higher consciousness from the bondage of his bodily senses; and, thus released, his divine nature revealed to him the mysteries of the transcendental spheres. He beheld a figure, terrible and awe-inspiring. It was the Great Dragon, with wings stretching across the sky and light streaming in all directions from its body. (The Mysteries taught that the Universal Life was personified as a dragon.) The Great Dragon called Hermes by name, and asked him why he thus meditated upon the World Mystery. Terrified by the spectacle, Hermes prostrated himself before the Dragon, beseeching it to reveal its identity. The great creature answered that it was Poimandres, the Mind of the Universe, the Creative Intelligence, and the Absolute Emperor of all. (Schure identifies Poimandres as the god Osiris.) Hermes then besought Poimandres to disclose the nature of the universe and the constitution of the gods. The Dragon acquiesced, bidding Trismegistus hold its image in his mind.
    Maximinus is attributed a poem on the Pythagorean Y, the hard and narrow path of character development, a path of ascetic yoga, or union with the divine through virtue.

    Quote “The Pythagoric Letter two ways spread,
    Shows the two paths in which Man’s life is led.
    The right hand track to sacred Virtue tends,
    Though steep and rough at first, in rest it ends;
    The other broad and smooth, but from its Crown
    On rocks the Traveller is tumbled down.
    He who to Virtue by harsh toils aspires,
    Subduing pains, worth and renown acquires;
    But who seeks slothful luxury, and flies,
    The labor of great acts, dishonored dies.”

  6. The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to Jayke For This Post:

    enigma3 (24th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Nasu (24th August 2019), Peter UK (24th August 2019), rogparan (25th August 2019), Star Mariner (24th August 2019), Valerie Villars (24th August 2019), XelNaga (26th August 2019)

  7. Link to Post #4
    Switzerland Avalon Guide: Here to help
     
    Nasu's Avatar
    Join Date
    6th April 2011
    Location
    Lost in the woods
    Age
    48
    Posts
    1,246
    Thanks
    45,972
    Thanked 5,705 times in 970 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    I like the idea that God is love, but perhaps not our earthly definition of love. Unconditional love perhaps, but not loving as we would understand it. Most of life on this planet is either predator or prey or both, love as we understand it, is difficult to pair with that reality.

    My own view is that we haven't the intellectual abilities to truly understand God. Much as an ant can’t hope to understand the world of man or their place in our homes or cities, so I think we in turn can’t hope to understand our place in creation on this planet, let alone this galaxy, let alone this universe with countless galaxies floating about it. Then of course there is the multiverse to consider..

    In my opinion, the mysteries of our life, such as OBE’s, ghosts and people with abnormal abilities such as healing or clairvoyance for example, are attempted to be answered by the world’s various religions. I am of the opinion that all the religions hold some part of the truth but none holds all the truth.

    This universe is truly vast. The distances between galaxies is greater than the size of each galaxy. If there is one overseeing entity responsible for all it’s creation then she / he / it has a great deal on their plate, never mind our short lives and minuscule part to play within it all.

    The closest thing that makes any sense to my mind and experience, limited as it is, is that God is akin to a scientist. She / he / it is no doubt fascinated by their creation / experiments and is interested to see how it all plays out, warts and all, suffering and all, evolution and devolution, life and death, creation and destruction, form and formlessness, the bigger picture if you like. But is a watcher rather than an influencer.

    Saying that though, with all the intrinsic inequalities, hardships and suffering we see in every creature’s life on this planet, including our own species, love is a hard word to pin on her / him / it. IMHO….x…. N
    Last edited by Nasu; 24th August 2019 at 02:48.

  8. The Following 15 Users Say Thank You to Nasu For This Post:

    Franny (24th August 2019), greybeard (24th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Jayke (24th August 2019), Justplain (24th August 2019), Ken (24th August 2019), Peter UK (24th August 2019), robinr1 (24th August 2019), rogparan (25th August 2019), Sadieblue (25th August 2019), Star Mariner (24th August 2019), Valerie Villars (24th August 2019), Wind (24th August 2019), Words of Joy (20th September 2019), XelNaga (26th August 2019)

  9. Link to Post #5
    Canada Avalon Member Justplain's Avatar
    Join Date
    8th April 2016
    Posts
    1,195
    Thanks
    3,242
    Thanked 6,577 times in 1,129 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    I agree with you, Nasu, the Great Spirit, or Prime Creator, or the true God, is really well beyond our comprehension. In Michael Newton's research some of his subjects with 'high advancement' in human terms discussed how they caught glimpses of what is in store for human souls once they evolve beyond the human realm (where the soul is evolved higher so it no longer needs human experiences), and they described an energy and consciousness that was overwhelming, a complexity beyond comprehension, yet blazing with love. We have a long way to go folks, but it sounds like the trip is well worth what's at the destination.

  10. The Following 12 Users Say Thank You to Justplain For This Post:

    Franny (24th August 2019), greybeard (24th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Jayke (24th August 2019), Ken (24th August 2019), Nasu (24th August 2019), Peter UK (25th August 2019), Sadieblue (25th August 2019), Valerie Villars (24th August 2019), Wind (24th August 2019), Words of Joy (24th August 2019), XelNaga (26th August 2019)

  11. Link to Post #6
    UK Avalon Member Star Mariner's Avatar
    Join Date
    15th November 2011
    Location
    Southwest UK
    Posts
    1,634
    Thanks
    8,828
    Thanked 10,399 times in 1,555 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    I remember that Justplain. Many of those subjects called it 'the presence'. What God is cannot be grasped by human consciousness, it's way beyond that. But what it is not is quite plain. It's not an entity, a being, a consciousness, in the same way that we are those things. Man constantly tries to anthropomorphise God, and that's a mistake. God simply is, like 'the Force' in Star Wars simply is, but infinite awareness mixed in with that, and infinite love. Almost every question I ever had or understanding I ever grappled with was answered quite simply by Silver Birch. The model of 'how things are' that he constructs in the teachings ties everything together just perfectly.

    Quote Posted by Jayke (here)
    Silver Birch sounds like he’s been studying some neo-pythagoreanism.

    Who was it that said “everyone is born with a spirit, but the soul has to be earned”? It’s the difference between the ‘Ka’ (spirit) and ‘Ba’ (soul) in ancient Egyptian, and the transfiguration of the various aspects of the soul to be in union with god—or Ka-Ba-lah as it became known to the Jews—the path to embodying the virtues of god.
    [/B]
    The thing is, Silver Birch speaks entirely without religious cadences - such are all man made, written by man, elevated by man, catechized by man, but man is a distorted creature so everything he does, says, and believes in is a distortion.

    The idea of one must 'earn' a soul is just wrong. You are a soul. The soul is your consciousness. The spirit is that particle of divine light, the God spark, that shines through it. Thus you are one, and have the other. We are souls with spirits. That's the difference. One is already perfect (the spirit), but it shines through an imperfect lens that is the human consciousness (the soul). We are imperfection striving for perfection. That's the goal, to polish that lens, constantly, over life times, so that more of the light and the love and the truth of God shines through.
    "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
    ~ Jimi Hendrix

  12. The Following 12 Users Say Thank You to Star Mariner For This Post:

    Franny (24th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Jayke (24th August 2019), Justplain (24th August 2019), Ken (24th August 2019), Nasu (24th August 2019), Peter UK (25th August 2019), Sadieblue (25th August 2019), Valerie Villars (24th August 2019), what is a name? (26th August 2019), Wind (24th August 2019), XelNaga (27th August 2019)

  13. Link to Post #7
    Finland Avalon Member Wind's Avatar
    Join Date
    25th September 2011
    Location
    A dream called Life
    Posts
    7,025
    Thanks
    76,978
    Thanked 41,415 times in 6,809 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    Quote Posted by Star Mariner (here)
    We are imperfection striving for perfection. That's the goal, to polish that lens, constantly, over life times, so that more of the light and the love and the truth of God shines through.
    That's a very beautiful way of saying the truth.
    "When you've seen beyond yourself, then you may find, peace of mind is waiting there." ~ George Harrison

  14. The Following 11 Users Say Thank You to Wind For This Post:

    Baby Steps (24th August 2019), Franny (24th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Jayke (24th August 2019), Justplain (24th August 2019), Ken (24th August 2019), Nasu (24th August 2019), Peter UK (25th August 2019), Sadieblue (25th August 2019), Star Mariner (24th August 2019), wondering (25th August 2019)

  15. Link to Post #8
    UK Avalon Member
    Join Date
    20th February 2011
    Location
    Manchester
    Age
    35
    Posts
    977
    Thanks
    7,438
    Thanked 5,397 times in 901 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    Quote Posted by Star Mariner (here)
    Quote Posted by Jayke (here)
    Silver Birch sounds like he’s been studying some neo-pythagoreanism.

    Who was it that said “everyone is born with a spirit, but the soul has to be earned”? It’s the difference between the ‘Ka’ (spirit) and ‘Ba’ (soul) in ancient Egyptian, and the transfiguration of the various aspects of the soul to be in union with god—or Ka-Ba-lah as it became known to the Jews—the path to embodying the virtues of god.
    [/B]
    The thing is, Silver Birch speaks entirely without religious cadences - such are all man made, written by man, elevated by man, catechized by man, but man is a distorted creature so everything he does, says, and believes in is a distortion.

    The idea of one must 'earn' a soul is just wrong. You are a soul. The soul is your consciousness. The spirit is that particle of divine light, the God spark, that shines through it. Thus you are one, and have the other. We are souls with spirits. That's the difference. One is already perfect (the spirit), but it shines through an imperfect lens that is the human consciousness (the soul). We are imperfection striving for perfection. That's the goal, to polish that lens, constantly, over life times, so that more of the light and the love and the truth of God shines through.
    Gurdjieff! Pretty sure it was Gurdjieff who said that. He’s not wrong. I understand what he means at least, so does Silver Birch. In Silver Birchs’ own words from your OP:

    Quote ”Man is the gardener of his own soul. The Great Spirit has provided him with all that is necessary for it to grow in wisdom, grace and beauty. The implements are there, he has but to use them wisely and well”.
    To earn a soul that isn’t a barren wilderness, one has to master the tools of the spirit and cultivate the soul to its full potential and majesty. So yes, the soul does have to be earnt through one’s effort and commitment to Gods virtues. Not that it isn’t their if you don’t cultivate it, but it can become dulled to a low ember without the cultivation practice. Which isn’t an easy task when the animal passions and the lenses of logic obscure the task at hand. Only the avatars; Pythagoras, Jesus, Buddha, Krishna etc have truly achieved total embodied soul status. Hence the imperfections of man are in such disarray across the world right now, causing so much destruction and chaos.

    If those setting fire to the Amazon rainforest, for instance, had truly cultivated their soul to a high level, would they still be brazen enough to light the flame? or are they simply acting through the spirited animal passions of greed, envy, lust etc.

    What Gurdjieff alludes to is spirit = soul in its imperfected state. So yes, everyone has a soul, but it requires cultivation before the soul bares fruits of ‘the Great Spirit’, rather than the impulsive ‘volitional’ spirits of the flesh-and-blood aspects of man (the imperfected lens).

    I know it’s just playing around with semantics, but there are infinite subjective paths that lead to universal truth. None of them are wrong if they lead to the same wisdom, just different paths of the Jedi.

  16. The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to Jayke For This Post:

    Franny (24th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Nasu (24th August 2019), Peter UK (25th August 2019), Sadieblue (26th August 2019), Star Mariner (24th August 2019), Valerie Villars (26th August 2019), Wind (25th August 2019)

  17. Link to Post #9
    Scotland Avalon Member greybeard's Avatar
    Join Date
    17th March 2010
    Location
    Inverness-----Scotland
    Age
    74
    Posts
    9,829
    Thanks
    23,050
    Thanked 50,574 times in 8,524 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    Seems to depend on what you listen to.
    Advaita is clear--You are Brahman--"One without a second"
    That comes from ancient Sanskrit teaching--that language written is one o the most advanced complex of all times.
    In brief you are complete,eternal the one soul.
    Self improvement fine but nothing to do with spiritual.
    One suggestion from Ramana Maharshi--"Find out who/what you are and all questions disappear"
    We are here to experience--no other reason. You cant improve perfection--thats what you are in your natural state.
    We are here in a grand illusion called Maya.
    Enlightenment is the removal of ignorance-the ignorance being that you think you are an individual in need of improvement.
    One the true Self is revealed thats job done no further reincarnation.
    Thats called Self realization.
    Happening for many these days as the interviews on this site show.
    Buddha at the gas pump
    https://batgap.com/




    Chris

  18. The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to greybeard For This Post:

    Franny (24th August 2019), Fredenit (3rd September 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Jayke (24th August 2019), Jill (24th August 2019), Nasu (24th August 2019), Peter UK (25th August 2019), Star Mariner (24th August 2019), Wind (25th August 2019)

  19. Link to Post #10
    UK Avalon Member Star Mariner's Avatar
    Join Date
    15th November 2011
    Location
    Southwest UK
    Posts
    1,634
    Thanks
    8,828
    Thanked 10,399 times in 1,555 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    Good post Jayke, thanks for the clarification. And you're right, so much confusion arises from pesky semantics. It's a common struggle in this vast subject, to convey these higher concepts under the constraints of human language.

    We all have/are souls, but there's an upward climb in order to refine it. In so doing, we attain more and more understanding, awareness, wisdom. Eventually, I believe we gain more influence in the 'grand scheme of things'. From teacher, or a healer, to being a spirit guide. And ultimately, to partake and assist in the process of creation itself. I don't believe it's true that Jesus, Krishna, Buddha, etc, are the only avatars. They are just the select ones whose special mission it was to come to earth to spread their message. The higher spheres don't belong only to them, but all the other advanced souls and masters, who have each won their spiritual 'rank', for want of a better word, from centuries (more like eons) of toil and service. That's where we all eventually aim to end up one day. And we have all eternity to try
    "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
    ~ Jimi Hendrix

  20. The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to Star Mariner For This Post:

    greybeard (24th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Jayke (24th August 2019), Nasu (24th August 2019), Peter UK (25th August 2019), Sadieblue (26th August 2019), Wind (25th August 2019), Words of Joy (20th September 2019), XelNaga (27th August 2019)

  21. Link to Post #11
    UK Avalon Member Star Mariner's Avatar
    Join Date
    15th November 2011
    Location
    Southwest UK
    Posts
    1,634
    Thanks
    8,828
    Thanked 10,399 times in 1,555 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    The stuff of which we're made - spirit - is perfect, but the form that it takes - the individual soul - is not. Thus the journey we must take.

    For what it's worth, this is SB's take on enlightenment, what lies beyond, and the climbing of the spiritual ladder:

    A. The ultimate is not Nirvana. All spiritual progress is towards increasing individuality. You do not become less of an individual, you become more of an individual. You develop latent gifts, you acquire greater knowledge, your character becomes stronger, more of the divine is exhibited through you. The Great Spirit is infinite and so there is an infinite development to be achieved. Perfection is never attained, there is a constant striving towards it. You do not ever lose yourself. What you succeed in doing is finding yourself.
    Q. Is it possible to describe the state we are supposed to reach?
    A. No, because you get to conditions and spheres that are beyond language. They consist of consciousness and awareness. This is something you will not understand until you attain it. You do not lose your individuality in a sea of greater consciousness, but the depth of the ocean becomes included in your consciousness.


    That maybe different to your understanding Chris, but no worries, nothing wrong with differing
    "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
    ~ Jimi Hendrix

  22. The Following 12 Users Say Thank You to Star Mariner For This Post:

    Franny (24th August 2019), greybeard (24th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Jayke (24th August 2019), NancyV (26th August 2019), Nasu (24th August 2019), Peter UK (25th August 2019), Sadieblue (26th August 2019), Valerie Villars (26th August 2019), what is a name? (26th August 2019), Wind (25th August 2019), Words of Joy (20th September 2019)

  23. Link to Post #12
    Avalon Guide: Here to help
     
    Peter UK's Avatar
    Join Date
    10th June 2019
    Language
    English
    Posts
    285
    Thanks
    1,662
    Thanked 1,814 times in 269 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    The question of the nature of God not unnaturally tends to be defined in the closest terms to our human experience. With that in mind we will, inevitably I think, incorporate the highest human virtues and values such as love, empathy, compassion and inclusiveness. The opposites of these appear for the most part to threaten our survival as a species.

    Whether one accepts the argument, or not, that the human genome is an experiment in DNA manipulation, as an idea at least, it does seem to suggest at least one compelling argument (there are other arguments of course that are equally not compelling) that a species has to define themselves as the best that is witnessed in humanity in terms of loving awareness in order to evolve.

    Of course all this is enacted out in our quadrant of the universe which may be a localised awareness understood in terms of either our planet, or our solar system, or our galaxy or several galaxies depending on where you choose to stop defining things in terms of localised.

    When people talk about God I doubt if they are talking in local terms at all. God spontaneously means everything by default. With the notion of everything, whether realised or not, the concept of infinity is introduced.

    What infinity is and whether our localised description in terms of human values is broad enough to encompass it I don't know but I suspect in part some of it must. Equally in terms of infinite consciousness and awareness I don't know what would be considered the additional qualities or components either.

    Infinity seems to be the eternal unfathomable mystery.


  24. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Peter UK For This Post:

    greybeard (25th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Nasu (26th August 2019), Star Mariner (27th August 2019), Valerie Villars (26th August 2019)

  25. Link to Post #13
    Scotland Avalon Member greybeard's Avatar
    Join Date
    17th March 2010
    Location
    Inverness-----Scotland
    Age
    74
    Posts
    9,829
    Thanks
    23,050
    Thanked 50,574 times in 8,524 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    https://www.thefreedictionary.com/anthropomorphic
    Anthropomorphic
    Ascribing human form or attributes to a thing or a being not human, as to a deity.
    "God" is not human.
    Pure Divine love is an energy not an attribute
    We seem to want a creator that resembles human beings.
    The formless became form---it condensed into matter--all of it without exception--there is no where that God is not.
    The Self realized in India--say they are the totality all of it.
    Sages of today say similar but not in such bold terms--they say there is nothing but consciousness--seamless God--how can you improve or modify the eternal--which we are.

    Not my opinion or thought but the direct experience of every non-duality--enlightened being I have ever read.
    They all say all concepts must go--you are none of that.
    Spirit--soul-god are all human concepts--but as best the unrealized can manage.
    This is why I accept what those with direct experience relate--share.
    One member has this experience ongoing and will answer questions.
    Here is the link
    http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post456904
    A charity to help African Children become self sufficient. :attention:

    http://www.learningtoolsforselfdevelopment.co.uk/

    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

  26. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to greybeard For This Post:

    Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Nasu (26th August 2019), Star Mariner (27th August 2019), Wind (26th August 2019)

  27. Link to Post #14
    Germany Avalon Member Iyakum's Avatar
    Join Date
    7th October 2015
    Location
    Andeluiven
    Age
    55
    Posts
    114
    Thanks
    327
    Thanked 706 times in 110 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    The nature of God, that's a good question if we leave all religions out. what is left then? In my opinion, there are two fundamental powers in the universe. One of the powers is the positive, the other the negative power. You can also describe it differently, good or bad. However both are called is irrelevant, because both are powers that hold the universe in the scale. All religions are not really able to describe God. who is able to do that? I do not think that our universe is infinite, everything has an end, only what comes behind it? Suppose one day we have progressed to the limit of our universe to find and find it ... what then? What lies behind the border? Another universe, truth, love, malice, or both, or a space an empty space, I do not think God is there, waiting for us or others to find him.

    My personal opinion is that we are not able to describe the nature of God. All religions can not, they interpret what God could be. Only recently I have thought, the universe is quite large and there are certainly not only humans as living beings, there are also other planets that are inhabited, let's suppose there are living things on our planet like us humans also believe in a higher being ... what then? Then I imagined I would take the place of God, what would I see, experience, hear, how many prayers would reach me daily, now we take only our earth and say of the 7.5 billion people would be 5 billion believe in God. Ok, then I asked myself how many times a day do I say oh my god, or how many times a day do I ask God for help, how many times do I pray to God, how many times do I implore God for help? God really has a lot to do, or do not you think so? I do not think he has boredom, ...


    We are energy beings, when we give birth to children, we pass our energy on to our children, that is my answer to the question of the nature of God, who knows maybe I will find an answer when I am older and wiser than today. But I do not think that I and I mean that I am personally in a position to find an answer. There are mysteries we will never find an answer to, and maybe that's just fine ...

    Sorry, my english is terrible I know it
    Iyakum
    All the questions we have, all the answers we are looking for, about the meaning of life. Mother Nature, she has already answered, we just have to read it.

  28. The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to Iyakum For This Post:

    Baby Steps (28th August 2019), greybeard (25th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Nasu (26th August 2019), Peter UK (25th August 2019), petra (26th August 2019), Star Mariner (27th August 2019), Valerie Villars (26th August 2019), Wind (26th August 2019)

  29. Link to Post #15
    Canada Avalon Member Ernie Nemeth's Avatar
    Join Date
    25th January 2011
    Location
    Toronto
    Age
    61
    Posts
    3,541
    Thanks
    15,171
    Thanked 20,764 times in 3,306 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    It is the nature of god that is at issue.

    There doesn't seem to be any archetype that describes the attributes of an ultimate God. I believe a lot of that has to do with our own distorted views of reality. The nature of god is beyond our understanding at this time. The best that can be hoped for is personal mystical experiences that point in an ambiguous manner towards the notion of the possibility of god.

    Much of that seems to be the refusal of the individual to accept the awesome potential of their own true nature...

    It is often the expression of that very power, the awesome power of self, that has the most accurate assessment about the nature of god.
    Forget about it

  30. The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to Ernie Nemeth For This Post:

    greybeard (25th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Iyakum (25th August 2019), Nasu (26th August 2019), Peter UK (25th August 2019), petra (26th August 2019), Star Mariner (27th August 2019), Valerie Villars (26th August 2019), Wind (26th August 2019)

  31. Link to Post #16
    Germany Avalon Member Iyakum's Avatar
    Join Date
    7th October 2015
    Location
    Andeluiven
    Age
    55
    Posts
    114
    Thanks
    327
    Thanked 706 times in 110 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    So far I was afraid to write in the forum but after your contribution I had to answer, so a big thank you to ...@Ernie Nemeth

    Some time ago I was ill and was often in the hospital and then in therapy for six months. I had severe depression and hardly spoke to anyone. I sat most of the time in the big hall by the window and looked into nature. My only thought I ever had was, I have to climb a mountain, I have to climb to the top of a mountain. That's the only thing that can help me. That's the only thing that can give me healing.

    After about four months in which I asked again and again to bring me to a mountain, they responded to my request. It was not a very high mountain, but it served its purpose. I went up to the summit and then something happened that I've never experienced before. I turned around and looked straight ahead, I felt, felt it so strongly that a nearly black cloud was floating out of my forehead, it was so relieving. I can not really describe the feeling, as I said a black cloud that looked the same as a cloud, I saw it with my inner eye the cloud was not big about 10-12cm x 7-8cm. At that very moment, the thought came to me. what would have happened if I had purposefully sent this cloud to something? That was self-healing, if I had used my gifts properly all the time ... if I had listened to my feelings on them, today I would be much more developed than before the therapy.

    After healing, I left the therapy and worked as far as I could with the gifts given to me. One day my wife left me, she disappeared for three months. When she came back she told me that she has a new boyfriend. Of course, I was very upset about it and asked her to talk to me about it. While she told me everything, I sat there listening carefully. She described to me her new friend as closely as possible, his name, what he looked like, where he lived, what he worked for, what his political thinking was. We sat in a restaurant and she ate something while I just drank coffee. Then she got a sms from her new boyfriend who wrote that he loved her and missed her. He is traveling by motorcycle and the sun is shining and he would like it if she were with him now. The day was very warm and the sun was shining everywhere, no rain or clouds.

    She then replied via sms and wrote that she is sitting with her husband in a restaurant and she eats and drinks something. He then wrote back to her that he wants to use the time as long as it is light and wants to continue to ride a motorcycle. At that moment, I was filled with grief, annoyed because I did not know what I did that she wanted to leave me. So I imagined her new boyfriend riding his motorbike on the road and enjoying the nice weather.

    It happened by itself, for the first time I used my gifts. I did not bother, it was like just sending out my thoughts. I imagined that he sits on his bike and drives. I sent him black clouds, rainstorms, lightning. The only thing I did not send him was that he had an accident, I did not want that, it did not even come to my mind. It was not long before about 20-30 minutes when her new friend called her. I told my wife to put her on loudspeakers I want to listen. He told her that he drove in the street and he had to stop because it suddenly started to rain. Rain, clouds and lightning, that was so strange around the clouds everywhere the sun shines and it does not rain only with him, he got scared and stopped.


    I got scared after that, even though I knew nobody knew it. Nevertheless, one day I repeated it without endangering anyone. Just to see if I'm really capable of doing that. Now I can also grasp thoughts, I do not mean mindsteps, but really capture thoughts. That depends on how much they are sent out.

    I also think that I am in a position to direct my gifts to the positive, but I lack the experience and someone who helps me with this. I firmly believe that we can do a lot of good with gifts. This is part of the nature of God, thanks to your contribution, I see much clearer and I try to help not to hurt.
    Iyakum
    All the questions we have, all the answers we are looking for, about the meaning of life. Mother Nature, she has already answered, we just have to read it.

  32. The Following 14 Users Say Thank You to Iyakum For This Post:

    arborealis (29th October 2019), Cara (26th August 2019), Ernie Nemeth (26th August 2019), Franny (26th August 2019), greybeard (26th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), NancyV (26th August 2019), Nasu (26th August 2019), Peter UK (25th August 2019), petra (26th August 2019), Star Mariner (27th August 2019), Valerie Villars (26th August 2019), what is a name? (26th August 2019), Words of Joy (20th September 2019)

  33. Link to Post #17
    Avalon Guide: Here to help
     
    Peter UK's Avatar
    Join Date
    10th June 2019
    Language
    English
    Posts
    285
    Thanks
    1,662
    Thanked 1,814 times in 269 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    Quote Posted by Iyakum (here)

    We are energy beings, when we give birth to children, we pass our energy on to our children, that is my answer to the question of the nature of God, who knows maybe I will find an answer when I am older and wiser than today. But I do not think that I and I mean that I am personally in a position to find an answer. There are mysteries we will never find an answer to, and maybe that's just fine ...

    Sorry, my english is terrible I know it
    Your english looks fine to me.


  34. The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to Peter UK For This Post:

    arborealis (29th October 2019), Cara (26th August 2019), Franny (26th August 2019), greybeard (26th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Iyakum (26th August 2019), Nasu (26th August 2019), Star Mariner (27th August 2019), Valerie Villars (26th August 2019)

  35. Link to Post #18
    Canada Avalon Member
    Join Date
    7th July 2016
    Location
    Newfoundland, Canada
    Age
    39
    Posts
    1,504
    Thanks
    5,625
    Thanked 4,973 times in 1,360 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    Quote Posted by Peter UK (here)
    Quote Posted by Iyakum (here)

    We are energy beings, when we give birth to children, we pass our energy on to our children, that is my answer to the question of the nature of God, who knows maybe I will find an answer when I am older and wiser than today. But I do not think that I and I mean that I am personally in a position to find an answer. There are mysteries we will never find an answer to, and maybe that's just fine ...

    Sorry, my english is terrible I know it
    Your english looks fine to me.

    Looks fine to me too!
    I question what God would think of us attempting to define Him, and I imagine he must have a sense of humor. I mean, you're trying to use words to define something that's essentially "ineffable"... that's funny

    God is Love gets on my nerves because it's breaking our language

    For me there's no question of God - that's by choice. I sure did question God's nature though! I asked myself not if god was good or evil, but would I trust God to choose good, instead of evil. That helped me choose to trust God... sorry if that sounds naive. I choose to, but at the same time I also have to.

    EDIT: For the nature of God, the best I have is "God is Everything, God is Everywhere" (note: And I think God would agree with me!)
    Last edited by petra; 26th August 2019 at 12:15.

  36. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to petra For This Post:

    arborealis (29th October 2019), Ernie Nemeth (26th August 2019), greybeard (26th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Iyakum (26th August 2019), Star Mariner (27th August 2019), Valerie Villars (26th August 2019)

  37. Link to Post #19
    Avalon Guide: Here to help
     
    Peter UK's Avatar
    Join Date
    10th June 2019
    Language
    English
    Posts
    285
    Thanks
    1,662
    Thanked 1,814 times in 269 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    Quote Posted by petra (here)

    For the nature of God, the best I have is "God is Everything, God is Everywhere"
    Actually that's more profound than it looks on paper.

    If someone asks is THIS God? You can say yes.

    If they then ask is THAT God? You can also say yes.

    If they then ask Can you tell me what isn't God?

    You can look at them with a blank stare as though they have tried to code something into the computer and it's not accepted because of an error in the programme.


  38. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Peter UK For This Post:

    greybeard (26th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), petra (26th August 2019), Star Mariner (27th August 2019), Valerie Villars (26th August 2019)

  39. Link to Post #20
    Canada Avalon Member
    Join Date
    7th July 2016
    Location
    Newfoundland, Canada
    Age
    39
    Posts
    1,504
    Thanks
    5,625
    Thanked 4,973 times in 1,360 posts

    Default Re: The Question of God and the Nature of God

    Quote Posted by Peter UK (here)
    Quote Posted by petra (here)

    For the nature of God, the best I have is "God is Everything, God is Everywhere"
    Actually that's more profound than it looks on paper.

    If someone asks is THIS God? You can say yes.

    If they then ask is THAT God? You can also say yes.

    If they then ask Can you tell me what isn't God?

    You can look at them with a blank stare as though they have tried to code something into the computer and it's not accepted because of an error in the programme.

    Hah ha ha ha ha!!
    Come to think of it, I think I WAS aiming to "break" something... I aimed to break the thing in my head which keeps asking me questions that I don't have the answer to! PS: Didn't work

    I got that answer from my mother. My thoughts were telling me to ask a particular friend (who's definition was much more technical), but then another set of thoughts said "Ask your mother" and that's what she said - word for word.
    Last edited by petra; 26th August 2019 at 14:24.

  40. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to petra For This Post:

    greybeard (26th August 2019), Iloveyou (28th August 2019), Iyakum (26th August 2019), Peter UK (26th August 2019)

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts