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Thread: A homeless drifter in my town

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    United States Avalon Member thepainterdoug's Avatar
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    Default Re: A homeless drifter in my town

    Mashika / yes, a line must be drawn. there are people that begrudge you for having things. Some may say regarding the homeless, hey you don't know their story why they are homeless , how the have lost everything etc,

    well, people don't know my story, how I have what I have by sticking with it, getting up everyday and applying myself , working hard , seeking knowledge and trying to be a good soul etc

    the story needs to be heard both ways. no one should judge anyone and the only time i will begrudge those who have, is if they lack manners, compassion generosity and kindness.

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    United States Moderator Mike's Avatar
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    Default Re: A homeless drifter in my town

    Quote Posted by thepainterdoug (here)
    Mashika / yes, a line must be drawn. there are people that begrudge you for having things. Some may say regarding the homeless, hey you don't know their story why they are homeless , how the have lost everything etc,

    well, people don't know my story, how I have what I have by sticking with it, getting up everyday and applying myself , working hard , seeking knowledge and trying to be a good soul etc

    the story needs to be heard both ways. no one should judge anyone and the only time i will begrudge those who have, is if they lack manners, compassion generosity and kindness.

    nailed it Doug. and the fact is, anyone that does those things - getting up early, applying oneself, working hard, seeking knowledge - won't he homeless! not if they don't want to be. it sounds cliche, but it's cliche in the best of ways because it's all true. it may not be easy, but it's pretty simple.

    everyone falls on hard times. that's life. and if that happens, accept any help that is extended your way. take all the help you can get! but while one is accepting that help, there is a moral obligation to be consciously improving oneself and moving towards self-sufficiency. that's how we honor those that are helping us, and it's also how we honor ourselves. to take advantage of the help and make no effort to work on oneself is a great karmic sin against oneself and the helper, in my opinion. it dishonors you, them, and life itself.

    I write this because, back home in NY anyway, i saw the same homeless folks day after day, week after week, month after month, and year after year. although I'm getting a bit more "conservative" as I get older, I've always been sort of a "bleeding heart lefty"; for years I would give money to these homeless folks. I was an easy touch. I felt for them. And I'd still give to them occasionally as the years went on (Catholic guilt maybe lol) but not nearly as much as I did in the earlier years. And it's all because this sense of being taken advantage of slowly began to erode my compassion and empathy.

    The majority of the homeless folks I saw were making no effort to get out of that situation. when you rely on other people for too long, it becomes something like a disease in the sense that you begin to feel entitled to their help. and when it no longer arrives, or when it no longer arrives as often you get bitter and resentful and nihilistic. those are the big clues that you've fallen way off the rails and need to get your **** together. i'm not preaching from the pulpit - ive never been homeless but ive taken advantage of help much longer than i should, so i know the symptoms.
    Last edited by Mike; 11th November 2019 at 17:01.

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    Default Re: A homeless drifter in my town

    Quote Posted by thepainterdoug (here)
    Mashika † / †yes, †a line must be drawn. †there are people that begrudge you for having things. † Some may say regarding the homeless, †hey you don't know their story why they are homeless , how the have lost everything etc,
    I think when someone has lost everything (family ties & worldly possessions) what we are failing to understand is that they somehow lost or never had their mental health. Many people become homeless because of addiction but that in itself is also a mental disease. For those that are not addicted and they find themselves on the street for any prolonged time they (I believe) have lost their ability to cope with the world.

    It is extremely difficult to understand mental illness. In the overall scope of health very little research, effort and resources have been put into mental disorders.

    Many times we are dealing with someone that sounds normal, looks normal but does not give us a normal response that we are accustomed to. You can not and should not expect a rational response from an irrational person.

    One of the most difficult task that we are faced with when we are confronted with someone with mild mental illness is understanding their response to our words are not typical. We need to put this in the front of our minds and process their words differently. If you suspect that someone has a mild form of mental disease because of their circumstances and your response is confusion or even anger then you have not processed all the information you in your possession correctly. This is an extremely hard thing to do, it takes concentration, understanding and awareness. Even when you start understanding this it is particularly hard to do overtime when you have repeated contact with the same person.

    I know I have said the same thing a few times here and that is intentional. It is just a very hard thing for "normal" people to understand.

    Also, I am not trying to derail this topic and make it about mental illness it is just so misunderstood and it is a major component of homelessness.
    R†

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    United States Avalon Member thepainterdoug's Avatar
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    Default Re: A homeless drifter in my town

    I get that RGRAY 222 . and yes we speak amongst ourselves in all accounts as if we are all mentally well. What does that mean??
    I'm not sure ,but perhaps mentally capable as with the masses etc.

    again, I look to the hard reality of nature. in the animal world, things are taken care of in a way that we would feel is very hard and cruel. but we give that name, that judgement to it.

    Regardless ,we have not constructed a society that cares for others as we ourselves want to be cared for.

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    Default Re: A homeless drifter in my town

    Quote Posted by thepainterdoug (here)
    I get that RGRAY 222 . and yes we speak amongst ourselves in all accounts as if we are all mentally well. What does that mean??
    I'm not sure ,but perhaps mentally capable as with the masses etc.

    again, I look to the hard reality of nature. in the animal world, things are taken care of in a way that we would feel is very hard and cruel. but we give that name, that judgement to it.

    Regardless ,we have not constructed a society that cares for others as we ourselves want to be cared for.
    That's true, Doug, life in Nature can seem very cruel to us, we call it cruel. But even the animals surprise us with their compassion and fellow-creature-care. See the elephants pushing/pulling one of their kids out of a ditch on the Animals Are Magical thread. (Also, humans digging out a little elephant, same thread). Also cross-species, the cat saving the baby from falling down the stairs. Mind-blowing.

    http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...24#post1323024

    I think some of the homeless may not really want to be here anymore and are just kinda waiting it out. Remember the business world drop-outs boozing it away on the Bowery in the '50s? You don't think men and women from that same world still drop out and give up, disgusted? And should we judge them for that? I sometimes think if I were a physician and diagnosed a patient with some "terminal" illness, I would hope I'd have the heart and cojones to talk to them about death--to frankly ask them "Do you want to live--really want to live?"

    Compassion is a mystery unto itself.

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    Default Re: A homeless drifter in my town

    Quote Posted by thepainterdoug (here)
    I get that RGRAY 222 . and yes we speak amongst ourselves in all accounts as if we are all mentally well. What does that mean??
    I'm not sure ,but perhaps mentally capable as with the masses etc.

    again, I look to the hard reality of nature. in the animal world, things are taken care of in a way that we would feel is very hard and cruel. but we give that name, that judgement to it.

    Regardless ,we have not constructed a society that cares for others as we ourselves want to be cared for.
    Hi Doug
    I apologize if you found my post objectionable. It truly was not meant to be offensive in any way whatsoever.

    Mental illness and homelessness is a topic near and dear to my heart. I have a sister that has been diagnosed with acute paranoia and schizophrenia. That said she holds down a full-time job, drives goes to church on Sundays and even does some charity work. †No one is quite sure what triggered this behaviour, it was most likely the simultaneous death of our parents and a nasty divorce that she went through at the same time. The trauma of these events presumably triggered PTSD, regardless, in one fell swoop, she found herself homeless, confused and destitute. Without getting into too much detail my brothers and I eventually managed to install her in a nice house so she has a place to call home with no worries about rent or mortgage payments.

    I was completely unprepared to deal with her. To this day I a reluctant participant in her life. It is not because I don't love her it is because I do. It is just too difficult to be around someone you care about and feel so helpless. I had to learn how to process her not so typical responses to normal conversation. Many times she would say something that would trigger anger in those on the receiving end. I am still learning and at times not doing a very good job of it.

    She believes in her heart that you should share whatever you have with the less fortunate. She does not comprehend why people should have more than they need, this goes for money, cars, clothes, computers, etc. She does live as she sees the world. She has brought homeless people to her house for a meal and a shower. She has put homeless people up for weeks at a time. She frequently will go without so others don't. She does some charity work with the church and donates money when she only has a few dollars in her pocket. When she has donated, given away or simply spent all her money she will make sure that her cat has food before she does. I am not saying my sister or my behaviour towards her is right or wrong. It just is what it is.

    I was reluctant to post this information but after giving it some consideration it may help others to understand how and why at least one person became homeless. It may also give a little insight as to why their family members are reluctant participants in their lives.†

    My post #43 was written as advice to others that may have contact with a homeless person that is suffering. From the outside, all may look well but I assure you there is something going on. Respect, patience and kindness go a long way. Again apologies if my post seemed harsh in any way.
    Last edited by rgray222; 12th November 2019 at 02:30.

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    Australia Avalon Member Innocent Warrior's Avatar
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    Default Re: A homeless drifter in my town

    I donít care what caused a person to be homeless, whether itís through no fault of their own or whether they messed up somehow, whether itís by choice or not. Itís their life, thatís nobody elseís business.

    I also donít care if they appreciate it or not when I give them something. I once gave 50 dollars to a man who was busking for money. I had watched him days before, he was obviously hungry and had nothing but a guitar. I watched him play his guitar, scrape enough coins together to buy a burger and then he scoffed it down on the cement steps outside of the shop.

    He was beaming when I gave him the money when I next saw him and then insisted he play me a song, then he proceeded to play a crappy song that he seemed to make up on the fly and it was about him being gay. In his mind it seemed more likely I wanted something from him than it being given to him out of kindness.

    Iíve handed a packet of cigarettes to a woman going through the ashtrays for butts, she didnít look up, just took them and walked off.

    Whatever restores a little dignity, makes their life just a little easier that day, and sends the message that this world isnít completely heartless, Iíll do, no conditions. Itís just money and stuff, I have enough, and itís nothing compared to a human heart.
    Never give up on your silly, silly dreams.

    You mustn't be afraid to dream a little BIGGER, darling.

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    Default Re: A homeless drifter in my town

    Quote Posted by Innocent Warrior (here)
    Iíve handed a packet of cigarettes to a woman going through the ashtrays for butts, she didnít look up, just took them and walked off.
    Some of them seem to be operating at an animal level.

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    United States Avalon Member thepainterdoug's Avatar
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    Default Re: A homeless drifter in my town

    RGRAY

    IM SURPRISED! i didn't find your response offensive at all. I agreed with you. so NO APOLOGY NEEDED!!
    I apologize for wording an unclear response if thats what you gleaned from it.

    and Innocent Warrior, exactly! Totally agree.

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