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Thread: Political Egregores

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by TomKat (here)
    Quote Posted by wttah (here)
    I suppose that is because the concrete mind always compares things in relation to itself. I wonder if the mental plane of the Theosophists is just a human thing and no one else lives there.. If the mental plane were to disappear would it only be humans that were affected? Like the mental plane is purely a human construct.
    If there's a mental plane begetting further downward planes all the way to the physical, then couldn't there be a physical plane begetting the upward planes all the way to the mental? If God is creating the physical plane from the mental plane downward, couldn't humans (God viewpoints incarnate) be creating the various upper planes from the physical? If so you'd have 2 mental planes, 2 astral planes -- God's creation and humankind's creation. The difference between Being and Becoming? Nature and artifice?
    Well if you presume the existence of a god creating from above. I haven't seen any of those personally so don't know myself.

    Creating from below? I see that happening within compound egreggores, like a cult will build a heaven within their egreggore. Plus all the other architecture. A well built one has a boundary of self. They live in those.

    One can build a thought form as an interface. A form that another Being can animate for communication purposes.. Made one as a personal guardian once complete with a personality and dissociative identity disorder. Her name was Lucy and was an 'off the shelf model' one might say. I got into so much trouble over that with "Upstairs".

    The world does look suspiciously like it was built from below up.
    If the Ancients discovered the secrets of life and created living organic machines; where do the machines go when they die?

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by wttah (here)
    The world does look suspiciously like it was built from below up.
    That would explain why we physical beings can destroy astral spaceships by mere directed thought. And why they are afraid of us. And want our energy.

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by TomKat (here)
    Quote Posted by wttah (here)
    The world does look suspiciously like it was built from below up.
    That would explain why we physical beings can destroy astral spaceships by mere directed thought. And why they are afraid of us. And want our energy.
    I dunno if one explains the other.

    Just a few opinions of mine here;
    Quote physical beings can destroy astral spaceships by mere directed thought
    Are they all astral?

    and

    What do they say on TV? "Don't try this at home kids" ; )

    Quote they are afraid of us
    Are they? Or just wary?

    Logic and the narrative says alienz are thousands of years ahead of earth in terms of technology, so why would they be afraid or wary? Nukes? Guns? Secret hi tech energy weapons? Harsh words? I've heard lots of arguments. : )

    One hypothetical would be if there was organic alienz and tissue samples fell into human hands. Ever see that HG Wells movie War of the Worlds? Maybe there is the biological equivalent of the Manhattan Project running somewhere on this planet.

    That would worry the alienz.

    I should write a screenplay and call it Plague Planet!. Maybe a sequel from the alienz perspective; Return of the Plague Planet! Shock! Horror! - Make millions of dollars and retire : )

    Quote want our energy
    Do they?

    There was a book called The Greys Have Been Framed. I never read it but I liked the title.

    I mentioned "yellows" in another thread, and how they can play with proteins. Basically disassembling proteins and re-assembling as designer proteins in their stomachs. They would need to access existing living forces and building blocks of life for their research. Nothing to say their research is necessarily nefarious. After all, they probably have problems of their own to fix. Researching a cure for a plague in a race against time maybe? I would write that into the second movie.

    It would explain Project Paperclip and the timeline of abductions and how they accelerated globally since WW2.

    By the way, I have never, to my knowledge, met physical alienz so all just hypothetical ; )

    But this is thread drift : )

    I think the egreggore are more of a problem to this planet then alienz.
    Last edited by wttah; 14th March 2020 at 05:04. Reason: Argh! Typos!
    If the Ancients discovered the secrets of life and created living organic machines; where do the machines go when they die?

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by TomKat (here)
    Quote Posted by wttah (here)
    I suppose that is because the concrete mind always compares things in relation to itself. I wonder if the mental plane of the Theosophists is just a human thing and no one else lives there.. If the mental plane were to disappear would it only be humans that were affected? Like the mental plane is purely a human construct.
    If there's a mental plane begetting further downward planes all the way to the physical, then couldn't there be a physical plane begetting the upward planes all the way to the mental? If God is creating the physical plane from the mental plane downward, couldn't humans (God viewpoints incarnate) be creating the various upper planes from the physical? If so you'd have 2 mental planes, 2 astral planes -- God's creation and humankind's creation. The difference between Being and Becoming? Nature and artifice?
    Mental plane is not remotely human, it is where One Life lives. The closest "thing" to it is Space.

    To speak of a sort of creation from "below up", it is not really a creation, but more like an objective reflection. These are what is called the Talas or Hells. In other words, if your mind is full of garbage, and that's what you take into death, you go straight to hell. But the same "world" or "plane", in a pristine condition, has no such effect. Physical plane is the same. Plenty of people are already in hell, here, but not all. So yes, roughly, each "world" is two worlds.

    Nature descends through the spheres one time, and if we make a "human model of the divine", we are doing it again, which is forbidden. We are really in a condition of "inversion of the divine", and that is what we have to work with; in this sense, ascent goes from Violet to Red. This may seem confusing, suggesting that Violet is the base color or most dense or physical, but that is not what it means. It means on the physical plane, one is concerned with Violet, as in just the highest frequency, or the purest and most refined mind. Such is the esoteric teaching of original Theosophy and the main method of Buddhist Yoga. I am not aware of anything else that makes the same indication.

    I would also think the Vatican casts egregor, not necessarily politically, but especially as Millenial and Apocalyptic beliefs, and anything that will erase one's national heritage or culture. They are mainly looking for voluntary surrender; e. g., our hospital system and football has quite a few devotees.

    The neo-TS has no clue about Maitreya and have more or less created blasphemy by trying to manipulate it. The first reason to stop talking about him is that even in Buddhist legend, the guru of Maitreya will be Parasu Rama, who is Vishnu's only avatar that does not die. We don't really hear from him these days since he is an Axe maniac who slaughtered quite a large number of people, is in some kind of penance. The wife of Parasu is Dharani, or, spell casting. Until the majority of the population can renounce violence and turn to some kind of beneficial spell casting, contra-Vatican, there is nothing for Maitreya to do.

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by wttah (here)
    Quote want our energy
    Do they?
    energy is like the money of this (limited quarantined) universe
    vital energy is like gold, or maybe precious stones, as to say .

    the ambition creates the occasion
    Last edited by RogeRio; 14th March 2020 at 06:42.

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by RogeRio (here)
    Quote Posted by wttah (here)
    Quote want our energy
    Do they?
    energy is like the money of this (limited quarantined) universe
    vital energy is like gold, or maybe precious stones, as to say .

    the ambition creates the occasion
    Like gold, yes, and gold comes in many forms. If the physical aetheric life forces are food for fairy folk, then it stands to reason that destruction of the natural world will cause a famine in unseen Beings. So too inorganic agriculture changes the life forces of plants which may be distasteful.

    I'll go into a little of my home grown research into . . . organic alchemy? - as good a name as anything I can think of.

    My organic citrus orchard is where I research "who eats what". Just the other day, a small Being was complaining of hunger. So I put her within my boundary of self (bioelectric field? Aetheric? I just have " self" without the technical names.), we then "stepped" into a lemon on one of my trees. She could then absorb the fruit's vital forces through my vital processes. It can be done.

    The real "value adding" comes from "processed by a human".

    To explain, mineral sulfur is very "mineral" as far as life is concerned. In bio-dynamic agriculture it is known the sulphur is taken up by plants which adds an intelligence and complexity to sulfur. Animals eat the plant and add their intelligence. Then a human eats the animal and adds his intelligence to sulfur. The sulfur does undergo a process of reduction in digestion, and reassembly. Mineral sulfur is very different to human sulfur.

    If I eat a lot of cabbage which has a high sulfur content, I can create an excess of sulfur I don't need myself. Now that is gold to certain Beings - human processed sulfur. I'm aware of what they want that for so I give it to them for free. Simply because the consequences of their research will eventually help a lot of "folk", including fairies.

    It is as easy as creating an excess and soaking in a hot bath with the rind of a grapefruit added. I wil add this is done in the Japanese fashion of bathing where you are clean of dirt before getting in the bath for soaking.

    Appologies for waffling on RogeRio, There is so much research to be done in this direction of study and I am quite sure there are a few readers here on Avalon who can do some wondrous things with a little inspiration.

    I would suggest that ambition and desire are the driving forces within this world, the psychsoma, the desire world.

    (sad smile) Occassionally I will throw rocks at the heavens while telling them in no uncertain terms to get off their enlightened arses and help out down here.

    Silence is what I get from them. It is not completely a waist of time, at least they know what I think of them.

    In a way, I think ascending the psychosoma, ascending the desire world, is to render oneself useless, for they have no desire. The maitraya probably can't come to this world without a psychosoma body, nor would he or she have the desire to do so.

    So it follows that; if anything is to change here, we have to do it ourselves.

    The sin in my eyes is they let the lie continue, and bask in the light of adoration undeserved.

    Well, well, that was a mini rant wasn't it : )
    Last edited by wttah; 14th March 2020 at 08:37. Reason: Argh! Typos!
    If the Ancients discovered the secrets of life and created living organic machines; where do the machines go when they die?

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by shaberon (here)
    Quote Posted by TomKat (here)
    Quote Posted by wttah (here)
    I suppose that is because the concrete mind always compares things in relation to itself. I wonder if the mental plane of the Theosophists is just a human thing and no one else lives there.. If the mental plane were to disappear would it only be humans that were affected? Like the mental plane is purely a human construct.
    If there's a mental plane begetting further downward planes all the way to the physical, then couldn't there be a physical plane begetting the upward planes all the way to the mental? If God is creating the physical plane from the mental plane downward, couldn't humans (God viewpoints incarnate) be creating the various upper planes from the physical? If so you'd have 2 mental planes, 2 astral planes -- God's creation and humankind's creation. The difference between Being and Becoming? Nature and artifice?
    Mental plane is not remotely human, it is where One Life lives. The closest "thing" to it is Space.

    To speak of a sort of creation from "below up", it is not really a creation, but more like an objective reflection. These are what is called the Talas or Hells. In other words, if your mind is full of garbage, and that's what you take into death, you go straight to hell. But the same "world" or "plane", in a pristine condition, has no such effect. Physical plane is the same. Plenty of people are already in hell, here, but not all. So yes, roughly, each "world" is two worlds.

    Nature descends through the spheres one time, and if we make a "human model of the divine", we are doing it again, which is forbidden. We are really in a condition of "inversion of the divine", and that is what we have to work with; in this sense, ascent goes from Violet to Red. This may seem confusing, suggesting that Violet is the base color or most dense or physical, but that is not what it means. It means on the physical plane, one is concerned with Violet, as in just the highest frequency, or the purest and most refined mind. Such is the esoteric teaching of original Theosophy and the main method of Buddhist Yoga. I am not aware of anything else that makes the same indication.

    I would also think the Vatican casts egregor, not necessarily politically, but especially as Millenial and Apocalyptic beliefs, and anything that will erase one's national heritage or culture. They are mainly looking for voluntary surrender; e. g., our hospital system and football has quite a few devotees.

    The neo-TS has no clue about Maitreya and have more or less created blasphemy by trying to manipulate it. The first reason to stop talking about him is that even in Buddhist legend, the guru of Maitreya will be Parasu Rama, who is Vishnu's only avatar that does not die. We don't really hear from him these days since he is an Axe maniac who slaughtered quite a large number of people, is in some kind of penance. The wife of Parasu is Dharani, or, spell casting. Until the majority of the population can renounce violence and turn to some kind of beneficial spell casting, contra-Vatican, there is nothing for Maitreya to do.
    I find it difficult to read your message because there are so many missing "according to" phrases. Please don't state things as fact that you have only read. And if you experience something, I would love to hear it, stated it as an experience ... please?
    Last edited by TomKat; 14th March 2020 at 15:18.

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote
    Egregore (also egregor) is an occult concept representing a "thoughtform" or "collective group mind", an autonomous psychic entity made up of, and influencing, the thoughts of a group of people. The symbiotic relationship between an egregore and its group has been compared to the more recent, non-occult concepts of the corporation (as a legal entity) and the meme.

    Source: Wikipedia
    and

    Quote
    Etymology

    From French égrégore: spirit of a group, and from the Ancient Greek meaning watcher,

    Source: Wictionary
    A "thought form" - A fluffy cloud of thought in the shape of Donald Duck? Hmmm, a bit simplistic maybe?

    The "spirit of a group". - A group of like minded individuals working together? "Spirit" seems to suggest it is the feelings the perceiver receives of the group working together. The spirit of a biker gang. The spirit of a group of wandering minstrals in Arthurian days. This definition suggests the spirit naturally appears when a group forms.

    A "collective group mind". Now that definition goes a lot further then just a spontaneous natural "spirit" arising from group activity.

    So a thing called a mind that is the sum of a group of people working as a collective. That definition can be applied to a cult, religion, a philosophy, a corporation, workers union, governmentnt and lots of other things.

    Now "watcher" is from the old Greek and book of Enoch. - I would suggest a "Watcher" arises out of a collective group mind. I would define a Watcher as a disembodied group mind. "The Watchers" are therefore entities.

    - - - - - -

    Just a note on etiquette that will help make unseen friends, or at least so unseen potential friends don't hate you from the getgo.

    The word entity is a big insult in the unseen world. Everyone hates it when they get called an entity by a human.

    Why? Because humans create entities such as corporations and egregores. To call a Being an "entity" implies that a human made the Being. In ancient times magicians would capture elementals and fairies to make their alchemical chimeras (entities).

    Humans don't clean up after themselves either, the inner is littered with discarded and forgotten entities of human creation. Like rubbish on the side of a highway.

    So entity basicly means trash . . . .
    Last edited by wttah; 15th March 2020 at 02:27. Reason: Argh! Typos! and fixed link
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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by wttah (here)
    .

    - - - - - -

    Just a note on etiquette that will help make unseen friends, or at least so unseen potential friends don't hate you from the getgo.

    The word entity is a big insult in the unseen world. Everyone hates it when they get called an entity by a human.

    Why? Because humans create entities such as corporations and egregores. To call a Being an "entity" implies that a human made the Being. In ancient times magicians would capture elementals and fairies to make their alchemical chimeras (entities).

    Humans don't clean up after themselves either, the inner is littered with discarded and forgotten entities of human creation. Like rubbish on the side of a highway.

    So entity basicly means trash . . . .
    Thank you. Something I will definitely keep in mind.
    The world is changed... I feel it in the water... I feel it in the earth... I smell it in the air...
    Much that once was is lost, for none now live who remember it.

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    You're welcome, just one of those little details you learn along the way. I'm always trying to watch my thoughts.
    If the Ancients discovered the secrets of life and created living organic machines; where do the machines go when they die?

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by wttah (here)
    The word entity is a big insult in the unseen world. Everyone hates it when they get called an entity by a human.
    Why? Because humans create entities such as corporations and egregores. To call a Being an "entity" implies that a human made the Being. In ancient times magicians would capture elementals and fairies to make their alchemical chimeras (entities).
    Humans don't clean up after themselves either, the inner is littered with discarded and forgotten entities of human creation. Like rubbish on the side of a highway.
    So entity basicly means trash . . . .
    I agree. I've sent lost souls to the astral plane and did not consider them trash any more than a living soul. But the main work I've done with entities is where the term trash is appropriate. That is, exorcism.

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Sorting out problems is difficult, yet can be rewarding. Especially when there are happy outcomes for all concerned. Deceased human adults can be such a-holes just like they were in life.

    So much unnessessary sadness and suffering out there, especially the children left to fend for themselves in an astral slum.
    If the Ancients discovered the secrets of life and created living organic machines; where do the machines go when they die?

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote I suspect there are black magic practitioners in the Vatican who create and feed these eggregores. You could never get someone to allow an exorcism of their political eggregore, but if you did, they would probably re-create it if around partisan cronies again.
    Edit.

    I misunderstood.

    Okay, so someone creating a collective thought form and surrounding political parties?
    Last edited by wttah; 16th March 2020 at 14:28. Reason: misunderstood context
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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by wttah (here)
    Okay, so someone creating a collective thought form and surrounding political parties?
    I think yes.

    we may introduce another useful terminology about the thought-form which also can be applied to someone or to a colletive.

    Immanent Power

    so for example, the catholic church (egregore) assume that God has (absolute) "immanent power" over the Creation (nature).

    its interesting, because that (immanent) power have an opponent, so its immanency may not too absolute as the church tell.

    this reasoning lead two Hypothesis - God have a Evil brother or the Evil is also son of God and may wants to occupy the "throne"of"God".

    this can happen through direct war or through the path of more peaceful (diplomatic), even subversive political approaches.

    --

    follow some myths about the creation and relationship between the Creator, his sons or relative brothers:

    Indian culture :
    Shiva cut the head of Brahma to stop the (God) creation, while Vishnu works to appease the fight.

    Egyptian culture:
    Osiris was killed by his son Seth, which also plucks out the eyes of her brother Horus to Horus can't see anymore.

    Greco Roman culture:
    Saturn cuts the testicles of Uranus to stop creation and assumes the throne (of Gaia)

    Saturn start to eat their sons to not be dethroned by his childrens, but Gaia deceives him to save Zeus (Dionysus-Jupiter)

    Zeus come back to figth with Saturn, assume the throne and start to use more politics than war, but if he needs to fight for something he fires lightning and awakens thunder, causing a huge storm to fall on his opponents.

    the common point of greco roman lineage is Uranus, Saturn and Zeus, all married Gaia (Hera) to have childrens (the psych complex of Oedipus?).

    ---

    looking closely at the meaning of these myths (as egregores) it may be that politics and war can be just different ways of making the same things happen.

    so, may Political Egregores be similar to War Egregores ?
    Last edited by RogeRio; 16th March 2020 at 22:23.

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    TomKat, are you thinking on a practical "what can be done about this" level?


    Quote I suspect there are black magic practitioners in the Vatican who create and feed these eggregores. You could never get someone to allow an exorcism of their political eggregore, but if you did, they would probably re-create it if around partisan cronies again.
    Or that there seems to be ann unseen war going on?
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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by RogeRio (here)
    Quote Posted by wttah (here)
    Okay, so someone creating a collective thought form and surrounding political parties?
    I think yes.

    we may introduce another useful terminology about the thought-form which also can be applied to someone or to a colletive.

    Immanent Power

    so for example, the catholic church (egregore) assume that God has (absolute) "immanent power" over the Creation (nature).

    its interesting, because that (immanent) power have an opponent, so its immanency may not too absolute as the church tell.

    this reasoning lead two Hypothesis - God have a Evil brother or the Evil is also son of God and may wants to occupy the "throne"of"God".

    this can happen through direct war or through the path of more peaceful (diplomatic), even subversive political approaches.

    --

    follow some myths about the creation and relationship between the Creator, his sons or relative brothers:

    Indian culture :
    Shiva cut the head of Brahma to stop the (God) creation, while Vishnu works to appease the fight.

    Egyptian culture:
    Osiris was killed by his son Seth, which also plucks out the eyes of her brother Horus to Horus can't see anymore.

    Greco Roman culture:
    Saturn cuts the testicles of Uranus to stop creation and assumes the throne (of Gaia)

    Saturn start to eat their sons to not be dethroned by his childrens, but Gaia deceives him to save Zeus (Dionysus-Jupiter)

    Zeus come back to figth with Saturn, assume the throne and start to use more politics than war, but if he needs to fight for something he fires lightning and awakens thunder, causing a huge storm to fall on his opponents.

    the common point of greco roman lineage is Uranus, Saturn and Zeus, all married Gaia (Hera) to have childrens (the psych complex of Oedipus?).

    ---

    looking closely at the meaning of these myths (as egregores) it may be that politics and war can be just different ways of making the same things happen.

    so, may Political Egregores be similar to War Egregores ?
    I will pose a question for you RogeRio.

    let's say that the Devil and God both exist within the religious egreggore.

    Does God and Devil exist outside the egregore?
    If the Ancients discovered the secrets of life and created living organic machines; where do the machines go when they die?

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by wttah (here)

    let's say that the Devil and God both exist within the religious egreggore.

    Does God and Devil exist outside the egregore?
    As Above, So Bellow

    (principle of correspondence)

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by RogeRio (here)
    Quote Posted by wttah (here)

    let's say that the Devil and God both exist within the religious egreggore.

    Does God and Devil exist outside the egregore?
    As Above, So Bellow

    (principle of correspondence)
    So, is that a "yes"?

    Anecdote time (grin) - to be told in the voice of Vincent Price.

    Once upon a time, there was an group of dowsers from all over the world who had a forum.

    In that forum was an older gentleman who really knew his subject. He was an expert from decades of practical experience. He would teach others what he had learned.

    One day, someone appeared on the forum who was a bit of an upstart.

    To put this young upstart in his place, the older gentleman issued a challenge.

    "Dowse the Devil!"

    The upstart being young and impetuous said;

    "Challenge accepted!"

    The young and impetuous upstart then sat down and proceeded to "Dowse the Devil" himself.

    He discovered a secret.

    Later the young impetuous upstart returned to the forum and announced the results of his personal encounter and examination of the Devil.

    "The Devil is a lie." is what the young impetuous upstart said.

    The moral of the story: Lies are thought forms too, and egregores can be full of lies.
    Last edited by wttah; 17th March 2020 at 09:43. Reason: Argh! Typos!
    If the Ancients discovered the secrets of life and created living organic machines; where do the machines go when they die?

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    Quote Posted by wttah (here)
    So, is that a "yes"?
    Yes, my friend

    Yes, Yes.

    Quote The moral of the story: Lies are thought forms too, and egregores can be full of lies.
    Yes, Yes too .. -lol-

    as above, so bellow

    using a more tech names -- Distortions, Illusions, Untruths, or anything like that
    Last edited by RogeRio; 17th March 2020 at 04:51.

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    Default Re: Political Egregores

    I guess when it comes to philosophies, it is a case of caveat emptor.

    As Below, So Above.

    oops

    I mean As above, so below, ; )

    Quote Distortions, Illusions, Untruths, or anything like that

    I would suggest the Devil is not an illusion nor an untruth. Lies are deliberate.

    Why lie?

    To create conflict is one reason.

    All the world's a stage, and all the men and women merely players -- Shakespeare.

    . . . . and every good play has a villain. Where would Snow White and the seven dwarfs be without the wicked witch?
    Last edited by wttah; 17th March 2020 at 06:16. Reason: Argh! Typos!
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