The face mask discussion

[DaveToo]

Posted by TomKat (here)

Posted by DaveToo (here)

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

But for reasons that I've never fully understood, there's still a frequently held belief that masks are designed to protect you. They're not. They're to protect the other person from you, in case you might be shedding the virus — maybe without having any idea that's happening at all.

Bill this is the crux of the argument.

This is where I am asking you and others to think LOGICALLY.

You are saying emphatically that masks are not designed to protect you.

So let's examine their function carefully and logically.

Assumption 1: Masks do not protect the wearer.
Assumption 2: Masks protect 'the other person'.

Let's really simplify this and look at just two people.

Both Subject A and Subject B are wearing masks.

Subject A has COVID-19 (either symptomatic or asymptomatic), Subject B does NOT have COVID-19 (not symptomatic nor asymptomatic).


Subject A coughs or sneezes. Their mask allegedly holds back their potential aerosols, thereby protecting Subject B from getting sick.
So in this case, the mask was STRONG enough to stop the virus from getting out of the mask, even with a forceful cough or sneeze.
So far so good right?


Now let's take a case where virus particles are in the air, due to someone coughing or sneezing nearby.

Subject B, who is wearing their mask strangely is NOT protected from the virus !!!
That's what officials say (and Bill Ryan).

So the same facemask that is strong enough to stop virus particles from escaping the mask,
all of a sudden becomes weak and won't protect Subject B from catching the virus!!!

Is that logical?

Seems logical to me. Mask can stop virus-containing moisture from escaping the mask. But mask cannot block viruses not within moisture droplets.

The size of holes in masks compared to the size of virus particles is like trying to stop grains of salt from going through hockey net.

So in addition to the moisture droplets you've got a ton of virus particles floating in the air as well.
Watch any of the dozens of Youtube videos showing someone sneezing while wearing a mask.
They are very enlightening.

[ClearWater]

Posted by DaveToo (here)
Watch any of the dozens of Youtube videos showing someone sneezing while wearing a mask.
They are very enlightening.

FYI, the video that Bill posted and suggested watching earlier actually acknowledges and directly addresses this. It may not sway your opinion, but it's worth watching.

[greybeard]

Botttom line for me is strengthen the immune system -- loads of advice on other threads
The Irish female Professor -- a true expert said that many lives would have been saved if the authorities had given fair warning of this virus coming and advised the use of Vitamin D --zinc and vitamin c -- also the tablet that was temporarily down graded by the Lancet, then reinstated -- its safe, has been used for 70 years.

If you use a crutch (vaccine --flu jab) then you weaken the immune systems natural facility.
Masks weaken the immune system --loads of information on that--isolation weakens the immune system, Lack of exercise and fresh air weakens .
the immune system.
Fear greatly weakens the immune system

Masks increase the amount of carbon dioxide breathed in -- the blood supply needs as much natural oxygen as it can get--- the list of ailments caused by a compromise blood system is long.

So when you release people from lockdown with weakened immune systems dont be surprised if there is a massive spike --that covered in the Doctors in Black video which has quite a few clips of professional Dr's stating the Truth.

Basically if lockdown had not happened fewer would have died that is the over whelming view of the Dr's who have dared to come out.

People are hung up on death and that was used to great advantage to promote fear by vaccine promoters..
Vaccinate the world and all will be well. (Bill Gates quote)

We can talk about infection rate etc but that is of no consequence because the faster people get infected and recover the faster the Virus is done -- no more susceptible people

People will die regardless -- that happens every flu- virus season, however fatalities can be reduced with sensible precautions
Its not rocket science.
Just do as we have always done and take the vitamins suggested

Dont take the word of one professional check the many coming forward.
And yet again I suggest watching all the way to the end.
This video --almost all you need to know is in it.
Chris

https://www.bitchute.com/video/zU4jR4nkrSy3/

[greybeard]

Swedish Doctor: T-cell immunity and the truth about Covid-19 in Sweden
She speaks of herd immunity

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=CwQpg62Kflg

Freddie Sayers talks to Swedish doctor Soo Aleman about Covid-19.

We hear a lot about Sweden’s experience of Covid-19, with the New York Times declaring this week that that country is now “the world’s cautionary tale.”

But what’s it really like on the ground?

Dr Soo Aleman has been both on the front lines of the Covid-19 epidemic as a senior physician at Stockholm’s leading Karolinska hospital, and on the research side, as Assistant Professor at the Karolinska Institute and one of a group that last week published new data around T-cell immunity.

We talked to her about the findings of that study, and how it matches what she is seeing in her hospital.

Link to the Karolinska Institute T Cell study:

https://news.ki.se/immunity-to-covid-...


Key quotes:

“Intensive care units are getting empty, the wards are getting empty, we are really seeing a decrease — and that despite that people are really loosening up. The beaches are crowded, social distancing is not kept very well ... but still the numbers are really decreasing. That means that something else is happening – we are actually getting closer to herd immunity. I can’t really see another reason.”

“I can’t say if the Swedish approach was right or wrong – I think we can say that in one or two years when we are looking back. You have to look at the mortality over the whole period.”

“I don’t think that we have more new cases, I think we are just detecting more cases”

“We found that if you have a mild case you can be negative for antibodies afterwards … in those almost all of them had strong T-cell activity. This study says that there are cases that you can have a strong T-cell response even though you have not had antibodies, meaning that you have encountered the virus and built up immunity.”

[onawah]

Win Keech's reply when I inquired about the price of his new invention:
"Win Keech Yes Natalie, I have worked hard to keep the price to a minimum and the effectiveness to a maximum. They are specifically cheaper to use in longterm use than disposible masks and even conventional room air filtration. Systems. There are no throw away filters, which saves huge costs and prevents the eco disaster of throw away mask pollution. They are intended for general use, but are specifically designed to aid sufferers of COPD, asthma and hay fever... But are also designed to fight viral, fungal and bacterial disease spread when used. We are committed to making them as available as possible to those that need them. Yes, there is a cost, but that is a simple 3d fact of the cost of manufacturing and distribution. I would love to set up a charity to provide them for no charge, but right now I am fully occupied with producing them. They will be available for purchase and even day rental soon. If you need to use masks for more than a few weeks, it is much cheaper to use an Ayrheart... By design. I know, because I designed them and it is me driving this."

Win Keech is a well-known, successful inventor in the UK.
See: https://patents.justia.com/inventor/...n-donald-keech
( I believe Bill Ryan is familiar with his work.)
I learned about him and his work when Simon Parkes was a member of Avalon, as they were good friends.
He is soon to be making available his new invention which he says will help to solve the mask problem. The following is from his Facebook page at:
https://www.facebook.com/win.keech?c...AwNzI0Ng%3D%3D
I will post updates on this thread as they become available.
"Win Keech
July 15 at 2:02 PM
"Facemasks as filters are not effective against viruses.. If they were you wouldn't be able to breath at all through the filter meshes, the mesh size would have to be so small. How do I know? After more than a year of research and development, I invented the solution to these problems. I have just completed a further four months of production development and I should be manufacturing them very shortly, The Ayrheart range of personal air purifiers/sterilisers... No mask, particulate filtered down to virus particle size and an added stream of safe antiseptic vapour to protect your face, eyes and respiratory tract. Named after the amazing Amelia Earhart... They should be flying out of manufacturing very soon. I will start sharing details in the coming days - I have developed this very quietly uptil now. Creating the solutions, not the problems, Win x "

[greybeard]

Tell Them To Shove It – Or It Will Just Get Worse And Worse – David Icke

https://davidicke.com/2020/07/17/tel...at-censorship/

[avid]

bad gateway!!! N/a, ah well...

[greybeard]

The Truth About Masks | COVID-19 Facts From The Frontline

Tony Robbins speaks to Senator Scott Jensen, a family physician from Minnesota, to uncover the truth about masks. After initially discouraging the public to wear masks, the CDC now recommends the use of cloth face coverings to slow the spread of coronavirus. But are they really effective? According to Senator Jensen, the answer is no.

This interview is part of the “Facts From the Frontlines” episode of #TheTonyRobbinsPodcast, where Tony uncovers the truth about coronavirus with a 7-person panel of highly qualified researchers, an experienced epidemiologist, a Nobel Laureate, and M.D.s testing and treating patients on the frontlines. Together, they reveal the evidence-based research that has come to light in the last two months.

This is one of the most important interviews Tony has ever conducted. It reminds us to stand guard at the door of our mind, practice discernment when determining trustworthy sources, and think critically in order to stay flexible and maintain the ability to pivot in light of new information – especially when lives depend on it.

To hear the full interview, go here: https://www.tonyrobbins.com/podcasts/...

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=7_b0AhqvAVw

[greybeard]

Thankfully the video above is short and to the point.
Anyone who still maintains that we should wear masks --- feel free
Chris

[Rawhide68]

Greaybeard, you are everywere do you ever sleep ?

It was quite shocking to see a Chinese Swedish women doctor speak of this matter, from "Karolinska Institutet". where did you dig it up from? (never mind).

We don't were any masks anywhere, have never done so, and we are not dying in covid more than other countrys, is my short answer.

I'll be glad if anyone has any questions about masks

Maskwearing has to do with this: starts at 7:00 in the vid. But I recomend you watch all.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=3RVG8qNLdoY

" 'Reality' is just a word, and you shoudn't use it without quotation marks around it anyway."

- Joseph Campbell

[TomKat]

Laura Ingraham puts paid to the mask controversy. There is no "viral shedding" with confirmed covid patients, so masks are irrelevant:

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=RBlyh96yL7Q

[greybeard]

Mask Wearers are Collaborators Who Could Destroy Us All

International best-selling author, Dr Vernon Coleman MB ChB DSc FRSA, explains why mask wearing rules are illogical, unscientific and dangerous, and why those who insist on wearing masks are ignorant and are threatening our lives and our future.
For more unbiased information, please visit http:www.vernoncoleman.com The transcripts of the videos that YouTube banned are also on the website.
Thank you for all your encouragement and support.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=pYk6nfnx_84

Vernon sure has some sense of humour in the way he puts across very serious information.
I hope he is wrong but unfortunately, I feel in the main he is right.
Anyone who thinks the Government is doing the right thing by forcing people to wear masks -- is agreeing to freedom of choice being eroded in a big way.

Next may be the knock on your door telling you someone in the pub you visited has tested positive, so you and your family and everyone you have "bumped" into since your pub outing will have to self isolate -- again.
Contact tracing has only just begun.
Its happening already.

Its been mentioned I post a lot on this subject.
Well the media bombard you with miss information very moment of the day.
Information that is posted helps to alleviate/counter, the constant brain washing in the media.
Im safe and secure through spiritual practise and age -- if this body dies tomorrow, thats ok

I post because I am genuinely concerned for the young people -- no other reason.

Chris
Ps towards the end he is quite "political"
Im not into politics.
Ch

[DaveToo]

I don't think anyone has posted this here yet.
It's quite significant.

Coronavirus: Georgia governor voids mandatory mask orders for 15 cities, counties
https://globalnews.ca/news/7182923/c...georgia-masks/

[Justjane]

Masks interfere with facial recognition technology so there’s that 💁🏻‍♀️

Seems kind of illogical to imagine that the controllers would want us to do something that would directly work against one of their methods of control.

[Gwin Ru]

There is something that's barely entertained in this "debate" and that's the "Placebo Effect" and its corollary, the "Hypochondria Effect":

Henry Makow @HenryMakow

Reddit conspiracy--Came across this excerpt from Think and Grow Rich. Written in 1937.

2:29 PM · Jul 19, 2020·

Now... what do you think that people who fancy growing rich on the sale of vaccines are gonna do...

As far as I am concerned, I would say that masks are semi-effective/ineffective and I am willing to wear one so as not to scare sh!tless anyone under the yoke of fear.

[pyrangello]

As the media continues to create fear every morning and night on the network tv news for 5 minutes each morning and night and then segway to entertainment afterwards for the rest of their dog and pony show. Its really appalling. Ex. Showing a refrigerator trailer for the dead saying multiple trailers have been dispatched. They show 1 trailer parked who knows where. Or the statement that 50 icu units are almost at capacity. So ok did you know in the state of Texas with 29 million people they only have 1500 icu beds?. I went over to my parents house the other day, my mom who is 81 was horrified I didn't have a mask on. She was actually historical so I left. She watches the news constantly.

So the numbers of confirmed positive cases are going up but where is the data on how many that are being tested everyday vs positive or negative results vs back ijn March of this year? Where is the data of the people who have just the regular flu where in 2017/18. 71,000 people died in America of the regular flu. I don't wear a mask, half of my customers that come in do which most are older and I respect that , the other half the younger do not. My buddy who is a surgeon gets the cdc reports, been a good friend of mine for years. He's done some 30,000 surgeries, he's had Mersa before and a bunch of other health issues thru the years . We golfed a few weeks ago and he told me 86% OF ALL OF THE COVID DEATHS WERE PEOPLE THE AGE OF 84 YEARS OLD OR OLDER. He also said that this virus dies in 1 minute of the sun and even in artificial high uv light . My buddy did not wear a mask the entire time he was here.
In fact he said the opposite , we need to build herd immunity by more of us getting this.

Now let's move to the positive numbers and cases, oh the numberrs and the money, I have another friend who is a COVID nurse, she doesn't wear a mask unless it's in a store now because of our state mandate. So hear are 3 stories of positive results of COVID and how the hospitals get 13 to 16k for a positive diagnoses. 1) had a customer come in the other day, his father just died recently of a heart attack, hospital listed as covid,family wanted an open casket funeral, took hospital to court to change cause of death to heart attack to have an open funeral casket. NOPE, court wouldn't overturn .2) spoke with anothe r buddy,his daughter is a nurse, she said tests are coming back positive because many have the antibodies now because they already had this virus 3) yesterday I spoke with a friend in Alabama, she was telling me last week her sisters husbands mom went to the hospital because she was feeling dizzy. Hospital made them wait outside in their car in the sun for 3 hours and never set foot in the hospital . His mom started feeling better after 3 hours so they left. Guess what the next day the hospital called and said the mom tested positive for covid,she never was in the hospital,follow the money baby.

My friend who is a nurse said to me this isn't about a virus anymore, it's about control. For any elderly who feel they should wear a mask, sure why not. But for all of us on the younger side of 80 and are healthy, time to build herd immunity.

On a final note, back in May in the country of Tanzania testing was done on 3 specimens submitted for COVID. A paw paw vegetable, a papaya fruit, and a goat , all came back positive, President of Tanzania kicked the who out of the country. It should be your own preference when wearing a mask.

[Sarah Rainsong]

The whole politicization of masks here in America is diversionary.

There is a long, global history of mask-wearing during epidemics which has never resulted in some loss of liberty or global occult ritual, and which has anecdotal evidence of helping to curb the spread. Why some countries (America--I'm looking at you!) have to turn it into a fight is indicative of deeper issues.

Mask wearing is not the hill to die on, nor is it some rallying cry. Neither the Republicans nor the Democrats [establishment] care about mask-wearing. They only care about staying in control. Turning mask-wearing into a fight is taking part in the furthering of division in America, when we should be uniting (against the ESTABLISHMENT which includes GOP and DNC!)

The issue with Kemp (the Georgia governor) is just a part of that. Since before he took office, he has done nothing but push that division further. I don't remember him being like this before his run for governor. From what I do remember, he was an honest, decent guy. But since then, his integrity has gone down the drain. He's made it clear that he's only interested in moving up the power chain. In other words, he just a d@mn politician. And so he politicizes mask wearing.

He "strongly encourages" people to wear mask...and then sues Atlanta when they mandate it. That is a political temper tantrum. It is juvenile and a form of bullying, much like the people out there that want to turn wearing a mask into a political statement.

If you're a healthy person, wearing a mask is not going to endanger you. It's not encroaching on your freedom. It's not going to give you some kind of CO2 poisoning. It's not forcing you to be part of a black magic ritual. And it does NOT create fear!

Pandemics are fearful all in their own power. Facing that fact does not make it more or less so. With regards to fear, all that wearing a mask does is make people not ignore the actual health crisis going on. Ignoring the elephant in the room does not make it go away. Ignoring what's going on while your hospitals fill up and your nursing homes turn to morgues is not going to stop the pandemic.

I can hear the argument now: "But masks won't stop the pandemic either!" Fine. Don't wear a mask...if you're not required. But don't turn it into a fight.

The bottom line is this: There are way too many other more important issues that actually need to be addressed. Turning mask-wearing into a fight makes it a diversion from the real issues--like people losing their jobs and their livelihoods! That diversionary tactic is exactly what people are contributing to when they constantly push the "don't wear a mask" narrative. That is what politicians like Kemp are doing--distracting people into fighting over something unimportant.

If everyone in the US populace united on the wearing of a mask, that would send a very frightening symbol to TPTB.

[ClearWater]

Posted by Justjane (here)
Masks interfere with facial recognition technology so there’s that 💁🏻‍♀️

Seems kind of illogical to imagine that the controllers would want us to do something that would directly work against one of their methods of control.

I'm definitely not vouching for this, but I saw a video recently where the person claimed that their 'contacts' say this is being used as a way to test some advanced facial recognition technology.

[greybeard]

Peter Hitchens: Mandatory mask wearing is more superstition than science
Columnist Peter Hitchens has argued against compulsory face masks, calling for “relaxed” train carriages and shops for those who do not wish to wear one.

Speaking with talkRADIO’s Mike Graham, he said mandatory mask wearing was “more superstition than science”.

Boris Johnson has urged the public to wear face coverings in shops, with an announcement on whether they will be compulsory in England due in the coming days.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=gZL9JgnQkmw

The overall subject of masks is not a fight.

Its about truth in the context of mandatory enforcement.
Mandatory can not be justified in the weight of scientific evidence -- both of the harm masks do and the fact that it will not stop the transmission of a virus
If if you can breath in and out through a mask can it be believed that you cant breath in and breath out a virus?

Its not about being right its about giving information from professionals in an ever evolving situation.

Its important to get as much information from as many sources as possible in order to make a personal decision.
Not that there is choice at the moment and that is alarming.

Choice is what is important.
If people have made up their mind no need to visit this thread .
However, many non-members visit here and they are entitled to get the best information available.

We are fighting a war for freedom.
Chris

[Billy Vasiliadis]

Posted by Delight (here)
I KNOW already that there is a schism between those who have faith (in the body, the SPIRIT, nature and SELF) and those who have no faith. I am keeping a low profile and clinging solidly to my SPIRIT ROPE. It is not "out there". It is in me and is a real life line. I will wear masks when I must and believe that no matter WHAT I am SAFE.

NO ONE CAN BE TRUSTED TO TELL US WHAT WE SHOULD DO. They all are only good for telling themselves where their limits bound them (and that is the trick for us to grok). All around we see the shattering of common ideas by way of EXPERT obfuscations.

I couldn't agree more. It is disheartening to see people afraid and distrustful of themselves, each other and nature. This kind of mentality and perspective cannot be good for health and well being. Even mainstream medicine acknowledges the mind body connection. If your mind is in danger mode and the environment is perceived as a threat, what kind of effect will this honestly have on the body.

There does seem to be an agenda to drive people apart and to make people distrustful of their own bodies. You can see this accelerating now in regards the mask issue. People who are not wearing a mask will be seen in the most suspicious of lights and perhaps even have the police called on them. Some will say this is justified but it seems to me this is being orchestrated.

I'm with you Delight. I'm going to affirm the validity of the body, nature and self as much as I am able. Contrary to what we are bombarded with, the body is not completely at the mercy of outside forces which could swoop in at any minute and tear it down. There is a beautiful order and spontaneity to it and to the natural world that we inhabit.

Even if having to sometimes slap a mask on, I'll be keeping my focus on the validity and worth of self and other self. I won't be seeing other humans or the air I breathe as a threat.