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Thread: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    I have several thoughts with respect to the response I got. I'm not sure what it is, or why it was said. It was rather forcefully delivered at the same time that Samantabhadri made clear she was connected to the new one, by her and by Sukhasiddhi. Separated by other words, Sukhasiddhi's name is in it. I've thought about it and have no idea whether it was said as something I should learn, whether it was a response to the mantra I said, like some kind of answer, whether it was yet another stern warning to stay on topic, or what.

    The colors that surround the new one -- the one we have been trying to name -- are apparently relevant to where I will end up if I 'dissolve' during the contractions that represent this one dancing in my physical body -- during the smooth toroidal contractions. When I said above that something had been stretched out from an instant to the blink of an eye, I have been trying -- I have been being tested on and failing to be precise -- to be completely in my clear body to get to the cauldron where the rainbows are -- that's the current task. I go there but can't figure out how it happened, I'm totally stuck and then I might even be on my next try or looking at my watch and it just happens and I have no idea how. Last night, it happened slower and in the blink of an eye I could tell it was a dissolve, a really fast one. But I ended up in the wrong place because the colors (which seem to represent different kinds of bliss and be associated with different Dakinis) were not right before I did it. I made it to a pool, but it wasn't rainbow, it was black with a green and a silvery yellow line around it.

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    Interesting.

    In the Nepalese system, Samantabhadri could be that White Tara in Vairocana Family; in Guhyagarbha, she would be in Vajrasattva Family. Now if we recall after Avatamsaka Sutra is some kind of Vyuha which is a display, and Vairocana's Display is the Dharmadhatu, and so we should learn Vyuha in the first few lines of Mahakarunika, because it is usually mistaken and this will be missed:

    Namo Ratnatrayaya
    Namo Arya Jnana Sagara Vairocana Vyuha Rajaya

    People tend to misprint it as Vyuhara Jaya...but the point here is that you get Raja, King, of Vairocana's Vyuha, i. e. King of the Display of Vairocana, king of displaying the Dharmadhatu. It is trying to say that Avalokiteshvara is the king of doing this, not that he is in Vairocana Family or whatever else you would get from losing the word which is clearly pointed out by being the title of the book he is in.

    So a Samantabhadri in Vairocana Family would mean she "is" the Display which Avalokiteshvara is able to master.

    If she is in Vajrasattva Family then she would have a different role.


    If she is in league with Sukhasiddhi then you ostensibly have Two Celestial Women:


    Sukhasiddhi-->Yeshe Tsogyal is a contemporary of Niguma-->Mandarava.

    In that first life, it is presumed they did not know each other, and then the other life is when they were with Padmasambhava. These are human Yoginis or Gurus.


    Sukhasiddhi is widely known, however, Rangjung Yeshe has some clarifications to her normal story:


    A yogini came every day to buy beer from Sukhasiddhi for her master and Sukhasiddhi asked her whom she was taking this beer to. The yogini answered that she was taking it to the Great Yogi Virupa who lives in the forest.

    (It must be noted that this Virupa is NOT the famous master who is the originator of the Lamdre teachings of the Sakyapa school! Sukhasiddhi's Virupa is known as the Eastern Virupa [shar phyogs bir wa pa] or Later/Younger Virupa [bir ba pa phyi ma] and was a master of various Vajrayogini tantras, especially of the Severed Head Vajrayogini [dbu bcad ma]. Some of his works on a longevity practice known as "Amritasiddhi" remain in the Tengyur. Interestingly, a later Shangpa master, Sangye Nyentön, was to receive these teachings much later from an Indian adept in Lhasa and brought them into the Shangpa tradition. According to Taranatha's "bka’ babs bdun ldan gyi brgyud pa’i rnam thar ngo mtshar rmad du byung ba rin po che’i khungs lta bu’i gtam" this Virupa was a student of the older Virupa.)

    Sukhasiddhi then offered her best beer and would not accept any payment. When Virupa learned of this he sent for Sukhasiddi and gave her the four complete empowerments for the yogic practices, as well as the secret practices of the generation and completion process meditations. She became a wisdom dakini just after receiving the empowerments. Through the power of her realizations her body was thoroughly purified and transformed into a rainbow body.


    A brief teaching of Sukhasiddhi, from the "shangs pa mgur mtsho":

    When the awareness dakini Sukhasiddhi received perfect empowerment into the emanated mandala from the glorious master, the great Virupa, she attained to the eighth stage of awakening in a single night. She truly beheld Vajradhara and became inseparable from the Bhagavani Nairatmya. In order to impart the essential instructions to fortunate disciples, she uttered this song:

    Disengaging from the objects of the six senses,
    To experience non-thought, is the path that leads beyond.
    The expanse of ultimate reality is non-conceptual.
    Mahamudra is devoid of mental activity.
    Do not meditate! Do not meditate! Do not engage in mind-made meditation!
    Mind-made meditation is a cycle of delusion!
    Conceptual thoughts are the shackles binding you to samsara.
    Turning away from conceptual mind, there is no meditation!
    Space is empty and non-conceptual!
    The root of conceptual mind, cut off!
    Cut off this root and then, relax!
    Thus it was said.

    Her main students include Tilo and the founder of Shangpa.

    When it says she reached the Eighth Stage it means she was on the Eighth Bhumi.

    Most of the important Mahasiddhas were on the Sixth, and there are examples of someone or some practice from the First.

    Because Namasangiti has a unique Bhumi, in that classification she would be Ninth. She is ultra powerful and able to speak as Nairatma, who is for Hevajra Tantra.




    So there is a Rainbow Cauldron which is a type of goal or attainment?

    It perhaps is similar to a Bliss Whorl which can often be found on a Vajrayogini Hexagram. It is actually the Hexagram which is, so to speak, the final Mudra of Generation Stage. When there are four whorls, they are the Four Joys or half of a Suksma Yoga cycle.

    1800s Shangpa Sukhasiddhi:








    There I believe the lowest figure is Ekajati with an Aksa Mala (circular beaded or skull item), which corresponds with the fluid in Sukhasiddhi's bowl.

    "White Tara" is granted a Six Color Rainbow. And so with hers, the inner ring, Sky Blue, is a code for White. The outer ring is her Smoky color:









    The whorls are on the Hexagram, and the foundation for all mandalas is a tetrahedron and for most of those it is a single tetrahedron. The Yoginis are most often depicted above a double tetrahedron (Sanskrit: dharmadayo, dharmakara) but not in all cases. We just see a flat picture, so a double tetrahedron looks like a Hexagram.

    A single tetrahedron is one set of the aspects. And so to clarify, it is really Samaya Agni who is Yellow and holds an Initiation Pitcher. Jnana Agni is Red and holds Dharmadayo or Reality Source:







    Red Agni Triangle points downwards, i. e. dakinis' triangle, part of Inverted Stupa.

    White Triangle points upwards and is Vajrasattva.

    So the full hexagram laces Vajrasattva to Dakinis, or, arguably, to Dakini Jala.

    Nagaraja is the teacher of this or of the potency of one's Dharmodaya which itself is a mudra or gesture.





    So if you have evidences of both main women then this is like both halves of Internal Bindus as well as both parts of a Hexagram which is mental. When both parts of the Hexagram are working, then you can execute Nagaraja's Dharmodaya. It is so to speak this Hexagram which holds the highest mysteries to man.

    I do not know them although I believe they are somewhere back there in the Refuge Tree.

    In terms of an imparted mantra, perhaps it is:

    sikra = citra?

    prabhala = prabhana or prabhava?

    In the original, they do not quite seem like words to me, it is easy to hit a snag in this stuff and I think there are errors to be found in several transmitted mantras, even when they just garble Sumbha Nisumbha into Sumbhani Sumbha. Or like in Mahakarunika with the Vyuha.
    Last edited by shaberon; 18th July 2020 at 08:28.

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    Quote Turning away from conceptual mind, there is no meditation!
    Space is empty and non-conceptual!
    The root of conceptual mind, cut off!
    Cut off this root and then, relax!
    This sounds very much like the instant of the dissolve. Except that it feels more like letting go than turning away, but then again I am very frustrated precipitating that event, and I can't stay in the dissolve itself without being helped (usually by Kurukulla).

    Quote So there is a Rainbow Cauldron which is a type of goal or attainment?
    Definitely. In the shaking notes I put up before, I was seated on one side and Mandarava on the other and she said:

    Quote She dipped her hand in the rainbow liquid, and for the first time I noticed that her rainbows and the liquid rainbows were the same flowing colors. “This is your path, to fill with this,” she said.
    The "her rainbows" are her body. She very often puts up a single dew droplet from inside a rainbow for me to look at with the sun glinting in it.

    Also, on each subsequent visit to the cauldron (it's very hard to get to for me) it is bigger and goes up higher into my body. The furthest has been up under my rib cage, something happened in that shaking to make things confused at the end, and the rainbows splattered all over my ribs.

    Quote So the full hexagram laces Vajrasattva to Dakinis, or, arguably, to Dakini Jala.

    Nagaraja is the teacher of this or of the potency of one's Dharmodaya which itself is a mudra or gesture.
    I didn't know Vajrasattva was involved in the hexagram. Is the whole hexagram considered Dharmadayo?

    Quote In terms of an imparted mantra, perhaps it is:

    sikra = citra?

    prabhala = prabhana or prabhava?

    In the original, they do not quite seem like words to me, it is easy to hit a snag in this stuff and I think there are errors to be found in several transmitted mantras, even when they just garble Sumbha Nisumbha into Sumbhani Sumbha. Or like in Mahakarunika with the Vyuha.
    Possibly. One thought I had was that all the 's'es were doubled, so it was "Om sukhas suklas siddhis sikra prabhala svaha" which puts everything in "genitive" case according to the online dictionary, so it would be "the sikra of the siddhi of the sukla of the sukha", which would be "the instruction of the power of the moonlight of bliss." Which does have a meaning in my shakings. But maybe that's stretching things looking for a meaning.

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    Quote Posted by Old Student (here)
    Turning away from conceptual mind, there is no meditation!
    Space is empty and non-conceptual!
    The root of conceptual mind, cut off!
    Cut off this root and then, relax!

    This sounds very much like the instant of the dissolve. Except that it feels more like letting go than turning away, but then again I am very frustrated precipitating that event, and I can't stay in the dissolve itself without being helped (usually by Kurukulla).

    Anger is Baseless and Desire has no Root.

    That is what they say.

    Here, Sukhasiddhi goes into Mahamudra. One of the ways I think of Mahamudra is like the narrow waist of an hourglass; all previous learning is compressed to a small point, the words dissipate into the non-conceptual state, and something new trickles out the other side. Cycle repeats itself tomorrow.

    When she says "turning away", that must mean you are looking at something other than concepts, i. e. Space.

    Yes, letting go of the concepts at first takes effort, we are so identified with the stream of them, it is almost impossible to conceive of any other form of existence.

    It sounds a bit like you are doing Paramadya with more advanced deities such as Kurukulla. Paramadya is the base meditation which makes the Hand Symbol. Here it is essential to get the inner meaning. It might be going backwards to conjure a minor goddess like Vajra Raga in order to literally copy the practice. She is the first or eastern deity. In the sadhanas, the east or direction of dawn is first, and employs "that which is already established". Then you are doing a cycle whose result is represented by the last deity as a form of achievement. You could do a simple retinue as a static appearance for practice, but, it must begin to be understood as Four Activities of the Gatekeepers--which causes a type of spin, which of course torques the aura into a drill.

    It consistently drills through all the layers of tantra to Dakarnava,

    In Paramadya, the first goddess:

    Vajra Raga pleases Vajrasattva's mind so he will not swerve from the thought of enlightenment.

    Does this sound like how Kurukulla is helping? Or is it not really the issue?

    This tricky event or state of concept-free dissolution is what we are all trying to get into, stay in, and then manifest Fullness, or Full Moon Sacrifice. Buddha basically did Suksma Yoga overnight. He was dissolved four to perhaps six hours. However because he had spent eons becoming Vajradhara, when he hit this condition, he hit it way harder than any of us.

    And so for outer purposes, we do not literally have to be initiated into Paramadya and follow its practices. Inner meaning is a particular philosophy which is the Profound View of Nagarjuna and transmitted in the Manjuvajra Guhyasamaja lineage of Jnanapada to Nyan Lotsawa. And Manjuvajra is the deployment of the massive Cunda leading to Shrnkala or what we might call Hevajra's Chain.

    Kurukulla has got to have the most notorious lack of chain in all the tantras. So it makes perfect sense if she in some way puts on the brakes and requires you to really get something.






    Quote So there is a Rainbow Cauldron which is a type of goal or attainment?

    Definitely. In the shaking notes I put up before, I was seated on one side and Mandarava on the other and she said:

    She dipped her hand in the rainbow liquid, and for the first time I noticed that her rainbows and the liquid rainbows were the same flowing colors. “This is your path, to fill with this,” she said.
    If we were to interpret this through the Guhyasamaja, it is pretty specific. This is where Varuni starts becoming really useful.

    Each tantra has slightly different ways of doing this, but to really understand the Agni Triangle, there are Three Skulls which support a fourth or cauldron.

    What happens is that Varuni kicks out Varuna, who would usually be the holy water container in any orthodox Vedic rite. She kicks him out because we are going to use Soma, which may alternately be holy water, tea, a certain intoxicating beverage, or purely imaginary. No matter what kind, it must be magic. This means it is inert until Varuni is invoked into it.

    The other containers hold the Buddhas and Prajnas as Meats and Nectars, things like dog meat and urine. In this case, it is not known that anyone has ever taken the tantras literally by using any of the actual substances. But we imagine them. This form is their "sinful" condition. Then they are swirled and mixed.

    And then it is a mixture of Soma, meat, and nectar, which becomes Pure Nectar, which is Orange.

    That is what the Yoga attempts to engage in the Agni Triangle.

    It doesn't sound like a Rainbow yet but the three skulls are Om Ah Hum. Tibetan view generally lacks the third holy water input, but suggests rainbow shimmering from the substances;








    And so if we were to imagine getting intoxicated from a beverage in the mind:

    visualization with meditation on voidness is the way to actualize the rainbow body.


    Samadhi is meditative equipoise with respect to such a visualization. And the inner meaning of the Path filling with rainbow energy is the realization of Seven Syllable deity from a Sambhoga Kaya deity. Any Fancy Pants Tara shows it; any Arrow has the colored streamers. In other words, there are various visualizations which all equate to Sambhoga Kaya on various deities. We want to stabilize on one of these in order to gain Heruka Yoga which is for the Seven Syllable deity which is Completion Stage. The Seven Syllable is what it is, and has one of the most original, distinct rainbow flames.

    No matter how many Dakinis become aware on one's Net, that method cannot be performed without a male seed or Vajrasattva. The levels and degrees of tantric evolution are all Vajrasattva.

    The Rainbow Cauldron plus the relatively abandoned White Stupa sound like pretty important markers and I think you will get something to stabilize based on these.



    Quote
    I didn't know Vajrasattva was involved in the hexagram. Is the whole hexagram considered Dharmadayo?
    Either way. A single triangle such as Agni's may be called Reality Source, and the Hexagram as well. The particular way I am referring to it is not necessarily the graphic geometric design. It is Vajrasattva as the upright triangle (knower, knowing, knowledge) and the Three Gunas as the downwards goddess triangle (Tamas, Rajas, Sattva). That is what is related to Nagaraja's gesture, which is universal. Closer to the pineal gland.

    Vajrayogini's Hexagram is her Dharmodaya.

    In Vairocana tantra, Locana starts it all with a White Triangle.

    An Agni Dharmodaya would be considered the Hand Symbol of:

    Dharmadhatu Vajra

    Who is a "joining" goddess similar to Samantabhadri, except this is a generic name.

    If you think of Five Elements, she would be the Dharmadhatu as Space.

    But as things arise in stages and by degrees, in a system of Six, she would become like female Vajrasattva. Although these sound like "updates", like why shouldn't we just throw away the system of Five, no, it literally means the Rupa Skandha is a five-fold object, which is pinned to a mainly mental system of Six Senses, because even with a scent I can remember and experience it mentally, and am somehow on a "different ring" than input of the physical nose. So the systems are co-existent, although the sixth sense, mind, does not have a corresponding form element.

    And so Dharmadhatu Vajra goddess may have many names and forms, Padma Jalini, Guhya Jnana Dakini, and others. The first reason I thought Padmajalini is really Lotus Net was from a Tibetan note:

    KHAM, Pema Drawachenma (she who has the net of lotuses) (Skt. Dharmadhatuvajra or Padmajvalini), she has three faces and six arms.

    Kha is the Akash or Space syllable, and Tibet recorded the right meaning, with a Sanskrit spelling error that would mean Fire Lotus, but lose the "v" and it is the same.



    Dharmadhatu Ishvari is the state of perfect enlightenment related to her.

    Marici 73 in Drub Thab Gyatso is Dharmadhatu Ishvari, Red with Six Faces and Twelve Hands.

    Oddiyana Marici 138 and 139 match this form, and 140 Svadisthana Krama Marici, or 143. These are the highest and most explanatory Maricis at the top of the big Ekajata. She has acquired Varahi and also has become Vajra Dhatu Ishvari.

    So if we understand Mental Object--Dharmadhatu Vajra--then it has a universal meaning which is the same for anyone. Someone might need to seek her as a Samaya being first such as Vajra Gharvi or Vajra Ghanta. Then in specific tantras there are the specific methods and names. The "Objects" are Bodhisattvas and to them are made Offerings, so you offer Silk to Touch Object and so forth. It is like a higher degree of purification, rather than stopping something bad, I am providing something good.

    In the system of Tara, Vajra Tara is the perfection of the fifth or Dharmadhatu wisdom, and Marici is all I find who gives a personal name to the universal terms Dharmadhatvishvari as well as Vajradhatvishvari.

    Asanga explains that the Dharmadhatu is ten-fold because it is the Bhumis; or, each Bhumi has its own kind of Dharmadhatu. So, on the first Bhumi, the Tri-kaya is obtained, but it is not until the tenth that it is Suvisuddha or completely pure.







    If we see a water pitcher is for initiation, and a fire pot is a reality source, the fierce generation stage goddesses from Dakini Jala might make sense:

    Gauri is fair-complected and tranquil-faced, or Peaceful. She has severed four heads of Brahma with four arrows, which is unique and quite powerful. Some other deities have his head, but not in that style. Cauri is Red and Fierce. Pramoha means infatuation or fascination, has Visnu's boar avatar face, has wine, and does the same thing as Varaha avatar, uplifting the earth or the crust. White Vetali is plainly unusual, having a Nectar Vase. Pukkasi has gotten Dombi's multi-colored role and dances in smoky cemeteries with a wind-whipped branch of a wish-granting tree; finally come Whirlwind Candali, Fire Pot Ghasmari, and a dark "Heruka-alike" (Herukasambhini) similar to Naro Dakini except she has a Vajra instead of a Chopper. None of them have a chopper.

    Sight Object Gauri is pleasant yet powerful. Red Cauri's main item is an eight-spoked wheel and she tramples three worlds, which suggests Visnu's Vamana incarnation, but says little about Sound, unless one says Primordial Sound filled the planes at the dawn of time. Scent Object Pramoha is strongly tied to the Earth plane and the nose of a pig. Taste Object Vetali, who in this case is joyful and has a clear transparent cup, pours Amrita while making a Banner gesture. So there is actually a wine deity followed by a nectar deity. Candali could not more literally be riding on the wind, and, from this meaning, then Ghasmari appears intended to harness and apply Candali's power or activity.


    I saw this a while back and it was weird enough having Vetali turn into Aquarius, but then when I found out who Ghasmari is, I stopped.

    Again, this would be considered "the" Samvara, or i. e. original path to Chakrasamvara. And so a very similar group of goddesses is used in many tantras and this one has been forgotten. Usually multi-colored Dombi comes at the end of the retinue in other places, and none of these deities have these kind of forms elsewhere.

    So you have a visual Hexagram as a way of dealing with Six Families, but, here, Ghasmari is holding the Female Triangle, which is to be hit with one's personal Vajrasattva Triangle. And so I believe going to this Ghasmari with the Agni Triangle is as far as we can go in the Pranayams or Japa without engaging Completion Stage: beholding the triangle which is highly conditioned by dakinis. Fusing the second triangle "completes" it.

    The fire pot item is extremely rare. Now if we can say, Tinuma Vajrayogini is a pretty close parallel to Red Lion Face Vajrayogini, Tinuma has "a" Tara with firepot similar to Ghasmari:







    So in the practice I am evolving, Lion Face + Ghasmari seem to be the closest approach I can reasonably make which appears to be the same as the actual Sakya system. The source of that form of Ghasmari is in Dakini Jala. I am not necessarily "trying to become" a Sakya--but when analyzed and assembled in terms of inner meaning, what I find on these Yoga deities very nearly equates to what they are doing. They are using a Suryagupta Tara; Dakini Jala is ripping into the Sandhya Bhasa or Twilight Language of all tantra with Ghasmari.


    Now even if one does not proceed with a tantric completion, one is still going to meditate like Mahamudra and possibly experience the signs or the dissolutions anyway.

    In the Fire triangle it is still Ali Kali, or Ah Vajrasattva plus goddesses. They are non-dual. Vajrasattva is not itself an object of extensive rites, it is the operator of them. And so it is common for instance a Kurukulla sadhana to include hundred syllable mantra.


    And so at first what we are trying to get that Orange Nectar to do, is burn the Buddhas and Prajnas in the head, i. e. the constituents of human personality and outer perceptions. In the middle of them is a White Drop, which is like a Shiva weapon made of moonlight, and melting that produces the First Joy.

    The Gauri goddesses as just enumerated are the blazing, and the intended melting happens with enough heat and balanced reversed winds.

    Balancing three channels across four chakras is the main practice:







    Edit: the main description of Dakini Jala is published in Genesis and Development of Tantra, Tokyo 2009. The "Gauris" are the same as in Hevajra Tantra--except he replaces Pramoha with Sabari, and Heurkasamnibha with Dombi.

    In the standard symbology, Gauri is Generation Stage; the retinue starts with her and results in a "Heruka-alike" dakini. Heruka Samnibha means "just like" Heruka, but she is also called Heruka Samnivesa, which infers a host, and an arrangement of letters.

    They are not the whole assembly; but see the pattern used for Six Buddhas:

    Vajrasattva, Vairocana, Heruka, Padmanartesvara, Vajrasurya, and Paramasva.

    It is not like Shingon, it uses the same idea as Namasangiti in placing Vajrasattva at the beginning, as a cause.

    The rest of those names are much more informative than the common ones.

    For Amitabha, it uses that Avalokiteshvara who is with Guhya Jnana, i. e. Lord of the Dance, Padma Jala with Four Dakinis. Vajra Surya is the relatively secret sun as depicted in Sarvadurgati; Ekajati is the Protector of Jewel Family tantra, Vajra Tara is a Yidam of it. Paramasva "Supreme Horseman" is rapidly confused with Hayagriva, but is clearly distinguished in Sadhanamala.
    Last edited by shaberon; 19th July 2020 at 18:55.

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    Quote And so if we were to imagine getting intoxicated from a beverage in the mind:

    visualization with meditation on voidness is the way to actualize the rainbow body.
    I had thought of the rainbow body. The cauldron started as something that looked like one, in my (clear body) pelvis. Every time I make it to there, it is bigger. Simultaneously, my muscles that vibrate, that murmurate in my abdomen entrain muscles farther and farther up my chest. I first thought this was impossible because they felt so close to my heart, but it turns out that this is physically quite possible, just that the muscles have to be coordinated in different patterns than normal.

    As of last night, the murmurating (very fast fire breathing type shaking of maybe 3 beats/sec, and then the deepening and scattering feeling like the ripples are a flock of birds -- hence murmuration) got all the way up to my neck, which means that the rainbow liquids in the cauldron stretched from the base of my pelvis to my neck.

    Quote The Rainbow Cauldron plus the relatively abandoned White Stupa sound like pretty important markers and I think you will get something to stabilize based on these.
    It has only from my throat to my crown to go if these are going to somehow join forces.

    Quote And so if we were to imagine getting intoxicated from a beverage in the mind:

    visualization with meditation on voidness is the way to actualize the rainbow body.
    If the dissolve is considered voidness. It's a reasonable way to see it.

    Quote In Vairocana tantra, Locana starts it all with a White Triangle.
    Is it possible for Locana to be yellow? She was around for the first time in a long time last night, and she is always yellow when in my shaking, but it seems like she is never that color in the thangkas and depictions.

    Quote Yes, letting go of the concepts at first takes effort, we are so identified with the stream of them, it is almost impossible to conceive of any other form of existence.

    It sounds a bit like you are doing Paramadya with more advanced deities such as Kurukulla. Paramadya is the base meditation which makes the Hand Symbol. Here it is essential to get the inner meaning. It might be going backwards to conjure a minor goddess like Vajra Raga in order to literally copy the practice. She is the first or eastern deity. In the sadhanas, the east or direction of dawn is first, and employs "that which is already established". Then you are doing a cycle whose result is represented by the last deity as a form of achievement. You could do a simple retinue as a static appearance for practice, but, it must begin to be understood as Four Activities of the Gatekeepers--which causes a type of spin, which of course torques the aura into a drill.

    It consistently drills through all the layers of tantra to Dakarnava,

    In Paramadya, the first goddess:

    Vajra Raga pleases Vajrasattva's mind so he will not swerve from the thought of enlightenment.

    Does this sound like how Kurukulla is helping? Or is it not really the issue?
    So the issue for getting to the cauldron is that I need to make the change to be completely clear body -- to be so "in" my clear body that I do not have a concept of my physical body while there. The way to get there is apparently through the dissolve -- which I've been through a lot for other things, but usually is something that "just happens" and not something I can "do". So one way of looking at the current training task is to be able to "do" the dissolve, but with the correct colors lined up.

    Normally the dissolve is a rapid thing -- at least to me since I very often blank the time going through it or it happens instantly (I have no way of knowing which). I think I blank it because without some help it is too much dissolution and "not self"-ness for my consciousness. But Kurukulla will sometimes open it out in time, in which case inside it is a very stupendously glorious display of interpenetration (and I kind of associate with being able to see into a jewel in her net -- the net, really Mayajala and really maybe not hers but she makes it visible), like cosmic scale visions or enormous grottoes of singing Buddhas and Bodhisattvas, or similar things.

    The context for Kurukulla is that she's been the one who stretches out the dissolve into those visions.

    Quote So in the practice I am evolving, Lion Face + Ghasmari seem to be the closest approach I can reasonably make which appears to be the same as the actual Sakya system. The source of that form of Ghasmari is in Dakini Jala. I am not necessarily "trying to become" a Sakya--but when analyzed and assembled in terms of inner meaning, what I find on these Yoga deities very nearly equates to what they are doing. They are using a Suryagupta Tara; Dakini Jala is ripping into the Sandhya Bhasa or Twilight Language of all tantra with Ghasmari.
    Not sure I understand what you mean here by Ghasmari.

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    So far I am going to say I have no idea who Old Student's white deity derived from Sukhasiddhi may be. Perhaps I will call her Fourteen, after the verse which features "stomping".

    The Samputa system I am studying uses Varuni to produce Orange Vairocani, who, according to Taranatha, is also that White Vajrayogini who reverses Heruka. Vairocani is so eminently close to Cinnamasta, the two may be confused as the same. The main way to know Cinnamasta is in play is due to the use of her Triple Mantra, or Triple Om mantra. This combines her with her two attendants. Rather than doing that, I am looking at each of the two attendants individually as a single mantra. And so at first, we say Vairocani is not related to Buddha Vairocana, she is hidden in the Puranas, and is practically her own subject. Her song uses pieces of Maha Narayana Upanishad, and we see that in Buddhism, Narayan appears one time, in his inquiry to Mahamaya Vijayavahini. Puranic Vairocani's song with lyrics and translation is in this post I put in a thread starting from the basic Hindu Solar Gayatri. And so from there and Orissa we find we are drawing from Katyayani, Vimala, and Viraj. And so there is Katyayani with her mantra in some other post there. As a Buddhist you are of course allowed to participate in whatever in Hinduism you want. We certainly find "vimala" quite replete in our lexicon, such as Vimala Prabha (the main Kalachakra commentary), or Vimala Bhumi.

    Vairocani is also not a Samaya being in the normal sense, you cannot just say her name and make her work. She only exists as a Fruit of Varuni, who, herself, only has a tantric meaning.

    Perhaps the oldest preserved text that is considered tantra is Manjushri Mula Kalpa. Among other subjects, it is considered the only surviving record of that epoch of east Persian history. I do not believe there is any translation of it, but, its female Candra is generally accepted as the name from which Cunda is derived.

    Tara Two is either Sarasvati or Cunda, no one would argue much either way, although the specific color is Autumn Moon.

    So when I think of Tara, first is Red Pitha Ishvari Tara, from Siddha Saraha and related to Arrow Dakini, and either very close or identical to the Pitha and syllable system of Jnana Dakini. She stands on the female Dhamodaya or red triangle. Then, there is Sarasvati, whom I have known outside of Buddhism and followed her in her normal manner as a Sherab, something like that, but she is very versatile in her changes. Her "moon power" appears to be Cunda, while Vajra Sarasvati and Vetali are her in red or dark (usually).



    We have found that Cunda is perhaps the oldest known Buddhist goddess mantra, and that in Buddhism, after a few introductory sadhanas, Prajnaparamita and Sarasvati become mantricly identical.

    Cunda occasionally uses the Initiation Vase, as does Vetali in Dakini Jala, and, I believe, Vetali also does this with Jnana Dakini; Vetali is just Sarasvati tantric and wrathful, calling her a Possessed Corpse or Zombie.

    Cunda is said to be a Vairocana emanation, but is close to Lotus Family (meaning mantra practice generally), and sometimes is crowned by Vajrasattva. Prajnaparamita is however an Akshobya emanation. In Nepal, Sarasvati is looked at as female Manjushri. They don't all share an origin, but they do seem to conjoin as White Goddess. The full explanation of the mantric identity is in Kubjika tantra.


    Chapter Four reveals Cunda as "the" Ellora goddess: she is represented not less than twenty-three times. It also says Prajnaparamita is "replaced" by Sarasvati and Cunda--mostly by Cunda.

    Well, when you have a book whose smallest form is eight thousand verses, truncated into an extremely short mantra from another book, we do not know that her mantra practice itself ever changes, even though her growing form makes a particular trail in the tantras as described in the prior post.

    It is sometimes observed that in Tibet, Prajnaparamita forms a triad with Herself as central bodhisattva flanked by Sarasvati, She-Who-Flows-Eloquently-Onward, and Cunda.

    However, because in Nepal, Prajnaparamita fades from view for many cycles of spiritual practice, but eventually discloses herself as Guhyeshvari, to me she seems both indispensible and a separate form of Tara. The whole Bodhisattva Path is defined by her, and even though it is a Sutra, the tantras have the same meaning--just much more powerfully experienced.


    And so if you have transmission of Prajnaparamita mantra, you see what you have.

    Prajnaparamita Sutra was revealed by Nagarjuna, which is the next thing to Nagaraja. Therefor since I have a connection to Tara, going to Nagarjuna's White Vajra Tara and Mrtyu Vacana makes a whole lot of sense. Especially also if Nagarjuna's Profound View is what pertains to Manjuvajra who employs Cunda's Maha form, whose lineage goes to Nyan Lotsawa, who revealed the only Red Lion Face Vajrayogini. At that point, what does Vajrayogini do, she discourses on Dakini Jala, and if successful on her, eventually you compose Tri-kaya Vajrayogini, which is Cinnamasta, which is a Bhumi and the rest of the Bhumis, just as is the Dharmadhatu. Dharma is the Sixth Sense of Mind; Dhatu is a Root Element like a Tattva. So then when you say Dharmadhatu Vajra, that is the Root Element shaped into a Mental Object. If you say Dharmadhatu Ishvari, it is ultimate enlightenment as within the Unconditioned Root Element. There are two kinds of mental object: Rupa Skandha and Nama (Name) Skandha. The Name Skandha is the part which is "only" mental, Vedana, Samjna, Samsara/Cetana, Vijnana.

    That is rather cohesive and it is also quite large.

    Naga Ishvara Raja is not wearing some kind of sweater, he is di-chroic. Mongolian Tashi Choling where he is commonly under Red and White Moons with a Seven Serpent Hood:











    If I get some of the following books, it will blast me with Cinnamasta almost at the beginning. But really, it is evidence of a major national system which would have to be categorized as a victim of genocide.

    They are nearly worthless notes because they do not quite spell out what is going on. The only way it does work is by combining a piece of this with something else from over here with the understanding it likely has a Hindu background and so we have to know their astrology and so forth.

    So it is like a net full of knots, but here are its major components, in conjunction with the Sanskrit Buddhist Canon which is awesome, except that it has a terrible search feature that can only give a useful link by pulling up a separate page. But it does preserve many unique manuscripts and several of the standard ones.



    De-mystifying source texts. Tibet has been pretty meticulous with medieval scribery, but we are able to find the occasional error, plus the fact that they are historically misleading. For example, they call Orissa "West India". That is why it has been overlooked and so much of the credit given to Kashmir.

    We are not trying to detract from anything else, but, rather, to show how primordial Orissa and Ratnagiri really are, that Uddiyana and Sambal Pur or Shamballah most likely either are Orissan, or, perhaps have shared equivalencies in Kashmir and Assam. I don't think it can be deleted.

    Tibet's mixed bag of its own stuff and Indian originals is whipped up in:

    Lama Yeshe's Rinjung Gyatsa (ca. 1983)

    Expanded/improved etc. ca. 2003 by:

    Wilson & Brauen Deities of Tibetan Buddhism--sometimes called Lokesh Chandra's Sadhanamala, which again is only partially correct.

    Those are not Indian, it is a Tibetan legacy--so I take them to task on Guhya Jnana's mantra. I believe it is trying to say Dum skyes, which is Generation Stage, same meaning as Khandaroha or Gauri (Kyerim).

    So although Tibetan Deities is quite well made, having only a few stray issues, it should be understood as mainly based on Atisha's Seven Eye Tara. However within the alternates, it includes Nyan's Tara as well as Sita of Ngor. It really gives too much, there is only a minor amount of it that might be attempted, but it is very educational.

    Both of those books are in "categories", so there is a block of Sherabs with Sarasvati, Red Power deities with Kurukulla and so forth.



    In general, the transcendental or Lokottara siddhis are Generation and Completion Stage--Utpatti and Nispanna. When we bump into the title of Nispanna Yoga Vali (NSP), we would expect it to mainly be Completion Stage rites. It is, it has the whole Kalachakra and Dharmadhatu Vagisvara Manjughosha mandalas. But just as frameworks. The original text would tell many details, but, again Bhattacharya was interested in basic artistic representations and does not speak much as to actual practice. So the thing looks like a gigantic chart of meaningless lists. It is quite difficult. However, having done a great deal of backstudy, I understand most of it or am familiar with the missing who/what, and can say that it is something far more than a scorecard.

    NSP text archive or NSP e-book archive, or actually pdf is probably the best copy.

    And so for instance its Dharani goddesses have faults and if we go to Sanskrit Buddhist Canon it can be figured out: "Sumati" = Vasumati Lakshmi, "Mari" = Marici.


    The original Sanskrit treasure is:

    228 practices in Sadhanamala



    They are both written to a Guhyasamaja adept or to someone who has practical working knowledge of the system, such as Maya Jala or Dakini Jala and all the accompanying philosophies and practices.

    The difficulty with Sadhanamala is that nothing is translated, and the beauty of it is that it blows away anything else I have seen.

    The Tibetan books have things in common with it, which is why we will say 43 here is like 162 over there and so forth.

    Bhattacharya's Indian Buddhist Iconography is "sort of" a translation of Sadhanamala. More substance than his NSP but still lacking a praxis. And so again if we go to the original, we can find where he made a few assumptions or slipped on a detail. The original seems like a shelved project, it should have a hundred or so more articles. We have found content for almost all of the absent parts except Raja Sri Tara; we mostly know what is missing. The part that is available is what has all the massive Tara material. It is variegated, for example it gives about three lines to Viswamata who is queen of the whole Kalachakra, but elsewhere it may spend eight pages on a single form of Vajra Tara.

    Varuni is mostly described in Circle of Bliss and a 2017 paper by Gundred Buhneman which I think can only be found on subscription sites.

    In modern times or post-1995 is really when we in the west have much of anything Nepalese or Sanskrit, and the Digital Canon project is ongoing. If I recall correctly, Min Bahadur Sakya and other Nepalis work with the modern Nalanda University in India. That piece of Sanskrit Sadhanamala has exactly the same flavor as theirs, just seems unfinished/unpublished, and maybe just posted online by a student. That is why I tried to dispute it with a crowbar which turned to dust.

    It makes a gigantic bundle of related material, which is freely available online. But then the only way I can point to a certain form of Cunda, for example, is to link a two hundred page book and you have to search by word. Most of those pdf's are not searchable at all. Archived text tends to make a lot of misprints, and there are spelling variations all over the place anyway. That makes it really difficult to navigate. I just happen to like putting time into it and so I, so to speak, know where to look, or have some kind of idea about it. And then, for instance, if one were to scroll through the unsearchable RG from 1983 until noticing Aparajita, it would not mean much, until we put together the ruins of Ratnagiri, with the tantric explanation of Buddha's Enlightenment, and the observance of Noose Power. That is how this is like shards of a shattered mirror, it is extremely profound, even though it has been heavily veiled.
    Last edited by shaberon; 11th September 2020 at 15:28.

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    Quote Posted by Old Student (here)
    The Rainbow Cauldron plus the relatively abandoned White Stupa sound like pretty important markers and I think you will get something to stabilize based on these.

    It has only from my throat to my crown to go if these are going to somehow join forces.
    Yes, that path is Kurukulla. That makes utter sense to me.



    Quote Is it possible for Locana to be yellow? She was around for the first time in a long time last night, and she is always yellow when in my shaking, but it seems like she is never that color in the thangkas and depictions.
    She changes.

    Locana does a weird transition as seeing or perception, from Vairocana to Akshobya and Earth, eventually to Karma and Space.

    Basic, original Locana is simply Prajnaparamita, and so her movement is consistent with changing names or forms of the central deity, but the movement is also how or why the central evolution becomes real.

    As recently as 2017, Locana initiation (or all Vajrasana initiations) requires nothing but Refuge Vow and a commitment to Bodhicitta. On this Locana, many deities are said to cure disease, she is the only one literally said to stop Pain and to provide physical relief. This one is in the Tibetan books from the previous post. Amazingly brief.

    According to tantra:

    White Dharmadhatu Vajra's dharmodaya is white and points down. We have seen this item in Vairocana Abhisambodhi, where it is with White-robed Gold Gagana Locana (Gagana is Sky Samadhi of Entry).

    So yes, she personally is yellow there.

    And then the important concept may be called The Rotation of Yoginis.

    Originally, Sense of Touch is with Air, meaning "sensations of entire surface". But if you stop moving and there is no wind, you quit noticing it. Then Touch Object (Sparsha Vajra) enters Space or the center of the mandala in Union.


    In Guhyasamaja, Dharmadhatu Vajra asked to replace Sparsha Vajra as the consort. The rite changes and proceeds into something physiologically and mentally different.

    One may accurately say that "Locana in her starting position" uses a white triangle, the item of Dharmadhatu Vajra, and this has to do with basic metaphysical definitions and an identification of what we would call dhyana or samadhi--which is not just one concentrated moment, but, is One Taste of many forms, as Locana will be found to move to new positions, and, the Triangle itself becomes heated in order to really use it. The Perceived Mental Object, Dhardmadhatu Vajra, becoming clear and purified, intensifies her energetic states into dakini and others.

    The four mothers may be meditated Four Brahma Vihara:

    goddess Locana in the
    Nirmana-cakra represents universal compassion
    (karuna), Mamakl represents
    universal brotherhood ( maitri ) and concentration
    (pranidhi), Pandara represents self-contentment
    (mudita) and Tara represents absolute indifference
    ( upeksa ).



    Siddharajni transmitted a Jinasagara--Guhyajnana Union which is a Lotus Family Vilasini or Love Play.

    It has a popular form at Mani Rimdu, but, in terms of tantric language, it is related to the correction of the name Padma Jalini or Lotus Net as a personalized name for Dharmadhatu Vajra--despite which, she then gets a rather unusual Grey Space form in Jewel Family. And what the Twilight Language talks to us about is the nature of Space Element: in basic tantras, its attribute is Vairocana--Sight/Form, then Akshobya--Sound. but this is a realization on perhaps the Second Bhumi, what the heck does it mean for some freaky Jewel female to display the Dharmadhatu?

    Let us see who is involved:


    Vajravilasini is hailed in two stotras to Trikayavajrayogini by Virupa (GSS26 and GSS27). The note to this gives:

    namolocanadi dasavajravilasinibhyah. namo yamantakadi dasakrodhavirebhyah saprajne-bhya

    Locana has Ten Vilasinis or Playful Ones and Yamantaka has Ten Wrathful Ones.



    Well, we just said Cinnamasta Virupa was the Guru of Sukhasiddhi.





    Aside from these, there is relatively little mention of Vilasini. Sumangala Vilasini is Buddhoaghosa's commentary on Digha Nayaka, which explains Buddha would spend the Third Watch gazing over the world with the Divine Eye (presumably Locana), to see who had aspired under a former Buddha to arouse bodhicitta and had manifested the perfections (Paramitas). There is a Madhuratha Vilasini, and a Visuddhajana Vilasini, which is Dipankara predicting Buddhahood for Gautama.

    The Four Mothers or Prajnas are also Vilasinis.

    The four mothers are also referred to as vilasini (possibly in an adjectival sense) in the KYT ch. 16 v. 6cd (p. no): anandarupavilasinyah sarvabharana- bhitsitah, in which they appear as essentially kapalika goddesses in the intermediate corners of the outer mandala of the "great Heruka," Yamantaka. So then, if, as far as Yamantaka is concerned, there is such a thing as "vilasinis" which are not necessarily being used for sex, but have a close relation to wrath and death, then they are needed, because they are an active part of the human aura.

    The Yoga mandala of Ten Vilasinis does show two sets of distinct goddesses, even though the "lesser" names are decided to be nicknames for the Prajnas. I get the impression this is trying to provide a "Prajna Bodhisattva", a level that is accessible to us and transforms us; it is only the Bodhisattvas themselves who get Buddha's teaching directly. When I take Refuge in the Sangha, it mainly means to inner teaching Bodhisattvas, and so the "Sense Object" deities such as Dharmadhatu Vajra are Bodhisattvas.

    Vilasini may in fact be in Jewel Family and still be named Padma Jalini, who is defined as Dharmadhatu Vajra or Mental Sense Object.

    Locana--and here, most importantly as Nirmana Cakra--is inveigled with the Vilasinis as a whole.



    At a certain point in Hevajra, Vajrasurya--Ratnasambhava is with Locana.

    Varuni, Mamaki, and Vajradhatvishvari are something like a flow from Jewel Family to Vajra Family.

    There is one instance of Vajradhatvishvari plainly swiping Tara's place in the retinue of Khasarpana Avalokiteshvara 26. Tara has not become or absorbed her, because Tara and Bhrkuti have special places right beside Khasarpana.

    He also says:

    locanādidaśadevatāṃ

    Locanadi Dasa (Ten) Devata.

    Suddenly he is the only example of apparently having hitched Vilasini retinue without exactly telling anyone about it.




    In Jewel Family:

    The special characteristic of Locana is Suvisuddha Dharmadhatu Jnana, or Dharmadhatu Wisdom. That of Mamaki is Three Flasks (Anti wine, Khayakori yogurt, Thapin beer). Pandara is passion, lust, or pleasure. Tara is Activity of All Tathagatas. Vajradhatvishvari is the center, yellow, space element, Ratnasambhava consort. "Because of her role as the embodiment of Tathata or Prajnaparamita she is also called Nairatma, Vajravarahi and Jnanadakini. In Sadhanamala she is identified with six headed and twelve armed Marici whose lord is Vairocana."



    Page 128 of Yamantaka Roar of Thunder equates Charchika to Locana.


    A female Mahabhairava or Mahabhairavi is used by Varahi in the north under Locana.


    I would have to say this Locana is more subtle and sly than just being passive white and blue consorts of Vairocana and Akshobya. She starts yellow with a Dharmodaya at the very onset of Yoga Tantra.









    What you are describing is Guhyasamaja. This, so to speak, has a physiological component and a mental one. And so I am pretty sure that you are approaching Sunyata or White Moon or First Void. To me, that describes what you are saying about the clarity and Kurukulla guidance:

    Quote
    So the issue for getting to the cauldron is that I need to make the change to be completely clear body -- to be so "in" my clear body that I do not have a concept of my physical body while there. The way to get there is apparently through the dissolve -- which I've been through a lot for other things, but usually is something that "just happens" and not something I can "do". So one way of looking at the current training task is to be able to "do" the dissolve, but with the correct colors lined up.

    Normally the dissolve is a rapid thing -- at least to me since I very often blank the time going through it or it happens instantly (I have no way of knowing which). I think I blank it because without some help it is too much dissolution and "not self"-ness for my consciousness. But Kurukulla will sometimes open it out in time, in which case inside it is a very stupendously glorious display of interpenetration (and I kind of associate with being able to see into a jewel in her net -- the net, really Mayajala and really maybe not hers but she makes it visible), like cosmic scale visions or enormous grottoes of singing Buddhas and Bodhisattvas, or similar things.

    The context for Kurukulla is that she's been the one who stretches out the dissolve into those visions.

    Not sure I understand what you mean here by Ghasmari.

    Well in considering Dakini Jala as a system, when it gives "the Gauris", these are the same as Candalis or fierce heat goddesses of Generation Stage, which are still used in Hevajra tantra, slightly differently. Ghasmari winds up with the burning triangle which was originally Locana's white triangle. And so there is a unique, extraordinary sequence among them. Sow Face with Wine and the Globe, Vetali with Nectar, and so on up to the point of Ghasmari with fire pot, the last of something like all of the "known powers" of this rite which should be culminated by the final goddess "Heruka-alike organization of hosts by letters".

    Agni Kunda is almost impossible to find with any deities, but, Ghasmari uses it in Dakini Jala. In this case, she is Krsna or Dark Blue, having a sword in her right hand, and Agni Kunda in the left. We want to highlight this because it will be obscured by her more common forms.

    Dakini Jala is highly entwined to Mamaki and the Vajramrita or Jewel Family tantra. Prajnaparamita-->Paramadya-->Vajramrita-->Samputa is the series.

    Dakini Jala's male Armor Deities includes:

    Vajradhara + Samvari (Vimala--Katyayani--Bhairavi--Ucchista-- Shrikshetreshvari at the navel or Oddiyana Pitha in Orissa)

    which is equivalent to Vairocani.

    That is part of its protection, whereas the Gauris and Ghasmari are more like fierce heat burning through the senses or overwhelming them.

    Ghasmari or Power of Food is Samputa Tantra (Seven Secrets). Ghasmari mantras are used by Nairatma.


    Ghasmari begins in Panchadaka as a green bell goddess, and she becomes the South Gatekeeper of Heruka's Jnana Chakra, having characteristics of the southern dakini. Ghasmari is power of food, or taste, similar to Rasa, and the enjoyment of soma or amrita or nectar. She is defined by Drakpa Gyaltsen as the Samputa Tantra itself. Samputa and Hevajra are slightly different systems of similar ingredients; Samputa having more to do with making a Bliss Chakra of Four Dakinis, whereas Hevajra takes this for granted and applies it to higher stages of the Path. Almost any picture of Ghasmari is going to be the green kind which is how Hevajra does it.

    The main rationale to any Hindu or Buddhist tantra is the destruction of Rudra--Maheshvara.

    In the Maheshvara myth as summarized by Sa-chen from Guhya Tilaka and others, Vajra-Ghasmari was the actual subjugatrix of Isana-Mahesvara, while Heruka converted Indra, Brahma, Mara, and the like (Heruka tramples on Brahma, lndra, Kamadeva, and Mahesvara, while Ghasmari tramples on Isana-Mahesvara, apparently considered the principal variety of the species Mahesvara). After that point, the Hevajra (Jnana Nava) Tantra and others amounting to Dakarnava were given.

    Ghasmari is invoked as Vajramahesvari in the Mantras of the retinue of Heruka given in the Samputodbhava (Samputa Tantra).


    Luminous Wisdom gives Hevajra's Ghasmari as the purified sixth principle, manas of self-grasping, or sakkaya-ditthi or what we have called Sixth Skandha and Gnosis Element. Her name literally means voracious, rapacious.

    In Sadhanamala, Ghasmari is in the northern quadrant of Nairatma's retinue as Rame, right after Vetali is "Scent Object" and the like, but this name indicates little other than seed syllable Ram, feminine of Rama, and to delight or enjoy, like Ramate.

    So in the visualization I am refining, rather than doing the Completion, I am looking at Dakini Jala Ghasmari as the heat source to the Nectar, which I intend to boil and purify and offer to Ziro Bhusana because she drinks, which is how I would plan to do something similar to what Kurukulla is doing for you. A kind of practice-til-perfect gate.

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    Quote It has only from my throat to my crown to go if these are going to somehow join forces.
    Quote Yes, that path is Kurukulla. That makes utter sense to me.
    It's not going to be easy. Last night, the rainbow cauldron, which has, as I said, stretched out into a lake, reached the bottom of my throat in a kind of a sustained way, but there is a real obstacle in the back of my mouth. It is a flow I have had no problem with since the beginning of my shaking, but there is a different kind of obstacle to it: There has emerged a "light dancer" (a very beautiful female dancer made up only of light beams) at my throat. There was already a dancer in my head, which I've always referred to as the "tan dancer" which is made up only of desert scenery -- he (and it is one of the few "he"s in my shaking) isn't really there, he's a mirage of desert colors, but dances and produces scenery.

    The solution to this new puzzle is that they are supposed to conjoin. The obstacle is penetrated by a very specific physical action which they showed me but I can't reproduce: A very physical "squirt" of liquid needs to shoot upwards out of my throat and hit the very back of my mouth. It has happened once (when they showed me) so I know it is possible, but I have to be able to do a whole lot of things with the muscles back there that right now I can't -- right now when I try, I start to choke. I know that my entire tongue needs to be against my palate, with the tip in the ridge at the front and the whole tongue flat against the length of the roof of my mouth. I can do that part. I can't do the little rippling motion down near my valecula

    You can see how this goes -- some of the tasks are control over mind and senses and some are control over usually autonomic body functions.

    Quote As recently as 2017, Locana initiation (or all Vajrasana initiations) requires nothing but Refuge Vow and a commitment to Bodhicitta. On this Locana, many deities are said to cure disease, she is the only one literally said to stop Pain and to provide physical relief. This one is in the Tibetan books from the previous post. Amazingly brief.

    According to tantra:

    White Dharmadhatu Vajra's dharmodaya is white and points down. We have seen this item in Vairocana Abhisambodhi, where it is with White-robed Gold Gagana Locana (Gagana is Sky Samadhi of Entry).

    So yes, she personally is yellow there.
    This sounds right, her bliss is not hard to do but she rarely shows up in my shakings.

    Quote I would have to say this Locana is more subtle and sly than just being passive white and blue consorts of Vairocana and Akshobya. She starts yellow with a Dharmodaya at the very onset of Yoga Tantra.
    A Dharmodaya that heats and changes. There are two Dharmodayas that I've read about, one visualized between the ears and the "third eye" that is white and holds
    Vajrasattva and consort, and one which is in the pelvis, is yellow, and holds Vajrayogini. And then Robert Thurman who calls Dharmodaya a vagina.

    Quote ...what the heck does it mean for some freaky Jewel female to display the Dharmadhatu?
    Isn't Dharmadhatu also a womb in which Dharmakaya resides?

    Quote Ghasmari is invoked as Vajramahesvari in the Mantras of the retinue of Heruka given in the Samputodbhava (Samputa Tantra).


    Luminous Wisdom gives Hevajra's Ghasmari as the purified sixth principle, manas of self-grasping, or sakkaya-ditthi or what we have called Sixth Skandha and Gnosis Element. Her name literally means voracious, rapacious.

    In Sadhanamala, Ghasmari is in the northern quadrant of Nairatma's retinue as Rame, right after Vetali is "Scent Object" and the like, but this name indicates little other than seed syllable Ram, feminine of Rama, and to delight or enjoy, like Ramate.

    So in the visualization I am refining, rather than doing the Completion, I am looking at Dakini Jala Ghasmari as the heat source to the Nectar, which I intend to boil and purify and offer to Ziro Bhusana because she drinks, which is how I would plan to do something similar to what Kurukulla is doing for you. A kind of practice-til-perfect gate.
    That's really something! My shaking visions and any kind of visualization I've done in meditation are pretty distinct. I can see/feel how one is the other and the other is the one, but they never mix for me, they seem like different types of will.

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    Quote Posted by Old Student (here)

    You can see how this goes -- some of the tasks are control over mind and senses and some are control over usually autonomic body functions.
    Indeed. It sounds like what you are doing is...an unusual and vivid way...of the upper part of Yoga. Which I would guess consists of the Kurukulla-period until the Stupa...happens.




    Quote A Dharmodaya that heats and changes. There are two Dharmodayas that I've read about, one visualized between the ears and the "third eye" that is white and holds
    Vajrasattva and consort, and one which is in the pelvis, is yellow, and holds Vajrayogini. And then Robert Thurman who calls Dharmodaya a vagina.
    Yes, those sound accurate, although I am not familiar with them. In the practice of Armor Deities, it is noteworthy that, whereas the Pranayama is at first attempting to operate only Four Chakras, the Armor Deities protect six, even though they continue to ignore the base of the spine. There is one at the ajna, and another at the upper head between it and the crown.

    Yellow Vajrayogini in the abdomen refers to Vairocani (usually white or yellow, orange in Samvarodaya).

    Just in the spectrum of Yoga Tantra, in Vairocana Abhisambodhi, Locana starts with a White Dharmodaya, it is not a common item, but then when we get to Dakini Jala, it is Red in the hands of Ghasmari.

    This is how it is found in a narrow band of only seven or eight tantras, and so, how it may come up in Suryagupta or Atisha Taras or other areas is incidental.

    As two triangles, it is effectively Shakti or red triangle of the abdomen plus Moon or white triangle of head, again similar to joining five-fold form to six-fold mind.

    Quote Isn't Dharmadhatu also a womb in which Dharmakaya resides?

    More or less.

    We do not dispose of "System of Five", again, it most be considered a type of working unit that hitches to the System of Six. Here, rather than looking too much at the very popular versions of this, we are going to proceed to attach both to the Seven Jewels of Enlightenment.

    Although this system is more esoteric, it is something like taking 160 verse Namasangiti and attaching it to the thousands of doctrines which are not necessarily given or enquired by the public. So the beginning must be about the same, and just as well similar to the main mandalas of Shingon: Garbha Dhatu and Vajra Dhatu. (Mahāvairocana Sūtra and the Vajraśekhara Sūtra; Ah and Vam).

    Garbha is Womb, and that part is like Five-fold Vairocana of Space Element, Vajra adds the Sixth Element of Mind.


    Yogi Chen uses the terms as:

    When the heart Vajra is extended to the body Vajra, mentality and materiality are identified. When it is extended to the hermitage or mandala, its subjectivity and objectivity are identified. When it is extended to the Dharmadhatu Vajra, Garbhadhatu and Vajradhatu are identified. When any one of the four Vajras is taken as the Chief, all Vajras of other sizes would encircle it as its retinue and a great interwoven function will take place.

    (cf. ch. 9)

    The combination of the Garbha and Vajra is Dharma Dhatu. Feminine and masculine, womb--lotus and vajra. One can perhaps encapsulate the whole thing with a female Lotus deity and Vajrasattva.

    ‘dharmadhatu’ also refers to sugatagarbha or buddha nature.

    It is possible the Dharmadhatu could at first arise as Knowledge, Existence, Emptiness, the Mind, and so forth, but the meaning of Lotus Family is that it must arise as Womb of Compassion, or Buddha Nature, Tathagatagarbha, Sugatagarbha, and other names. This produces Karuna, or Compassionate Means, a form of Upaya, or virtuous action. It is precisely these Means which generate Bliss and start melting the water poison glue with Jnanagni.

    We can easily pick up Karuna as Mahakarunika songs and dharanis, and so the aspect of Lotus Family is the "upgrade" to any basic Vajrasattva or experience of voidness.


    Karuna is part of Ekayana or Refuge of One, the Lion:

    Lion's Roar Sutra of Queen Srimala Devi

    is one of the fastest and best Sutras that underlies Para Sunya or Shentong.

    If I am not in Shingon, one of the only descriptions of Garbha and Offerings is Vajra Tara. Garbha or Lotus is the opening of her eight-petaled lotus. This is considered so important, she has some of the only artifacts of mechanical statues that start like an egg and open into a blossom with her popping out.

    Garbha and eight petaled lotus:

    tasya garbhapuṭe aṣṭadalaṃ padmaṃ...

    The action of the Offerings in her retinue:

    With Vajra Tara, White Puspa arises from Om. Dhupa is Blue and surūpiṇīm (form of Sukha). Dipa is yellow and calatkanakakuṇḍalām (has swaying golden earrings). The same word, kundala, can be earrings, or, "coiled like rope" which becomes kundalini. Gandha is Red and devīṃ bhāvayed garbhamaṇḍale, installs in the mind the Garbha Mandala or Pancha Daka.

    So if I am not Shingon, if I bring in a Quintessence in my own way, Vajra Tara's Perfume is going to respond in a gnostic or esoteric experience to it. Vajra Tara was one of the most important Yidams at Ratnagiri, she is a Yoga deity who is considered capable of delivering Non-dual Highest Yoga Completion Stage by the Sakya to this day.



    Aspects of Dharma Kaya have been described as:

    The first is the 'Knowledge-body' (Jnana-kaya), the inner nature shared by all Buddhas, their Buddha-ness (buddhata)
    ... The second aspect of the Dharma-body is the 'Self-existent-body' (Svabhavika-kaya). This is the ultimate nature of reality, thusness, emptiness: the non-nature which is the very nature of dharmas, their dharma-ness (dharmata). It is the Tathagata-garbha and bodhicitta hidden within beings, and the transformed 'storehouse-consciousness' (Alaya).

    Thusness or Suchness is the way over the Second Void. The three voids or subtle minds are whisked away by No Ego, Suchness, and Ultimate Meaning.


    The other aspects are Vajra Kaya and Dharmadhatu Kaya. That makes all Seven Buddha Bodies. This is behind what we call Vajra Ignorance which is Varahi.

    The more intricate tantras are a blend, so instead of just Earth of Earth you get Earth of Air, and so on, and since these are also the categories of life winds, it simultaneously means a swirling of...I believe it is called Six Families Nine Ways, or fifty-four, of which the Rosary or 108 is a doubling. That is what is intended by "precise control of prana".

    Varuni adds Kha Garbha, Sky Womb, to the Soma. She is Buddhist because then you also have the regular five meats and nectars, and so at that point, the total mixture is boiled into the hot orange broth, it is something like you are trying to cook off Varuni and get Vairocani. If I look at that in terms of the Ziro Bhusana sadhana, consistent with the teachings, then it would seem humble of me to offer the orange liquid and see if she is pleased. If I was able to stabilize that, then I would probably do Suksma Yoga.
    Last edited by shaberon; 20th July 2020 at 21:39.

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    There is a less tantricly-complex guide to having an Avalokiteshvara-seeded Kurukulla tutelage of subtle affairs of the throat.

    The Dharmadhatu is described as arising within Vairocana or Buddha Family, but it is really Pandara and quickly commandeered by Lotus Family as a womb of not just truth or anything that may happen to be in the mind, but also the womb of compassion--Karuna, which is defined as the only way to go further on the Path.


    In Sanskrit, two apparently separate words in Avalokiteshvara's mantra are just one: Manipadme.

    Jewel Lotus. I. e., you perceive a jewel at the center of a net at the throat. So this experience is already equivalent to stability in the samadhi of Om Manipadme Hum.

    We are saying the basic five-fold form Rupa Skandha of Vairocana intersects the sixth element of mind there, or meets Nama Skandha or mental activity not directly involved with the "intellect within the senses", but more like the Witness, Observer, or Knower. Usually it is the ego, experienced as getting beaten up by itself, but it has other capabilities.

    If I was to say the entire System of Six as in Vajradhatu is then bound to a system of Seven, it is shown by Six Syllable Avalokiteshvara into Seven Syllable Avalokiteshvara. So yes, there is a system of using his six syllables as the Families and so forth. To the extent it has its own unique Sadaksari or Six Syllable goddess. If that is an easy way for someone to learn it, it is legitimate.

    If there is a skandha, then there is a Kaya or Buddha body formed from it, and Six Syllable Sadaksari goddess gives the first iteration of these:

    Applied to the Six Bodies, om is the dharmakaya, ma sambhogakaya, ni nirmanakaya, pad svabhavikakaya, me abhisambodhikaya, hum unchanging vajrakaya; to spontaneously obtain the six bodies [rely on] the six syllables.

    Padmavajra explained them all by calling the abhisambodhikaya, the Jnana Kaya, and the seventh is Dharmadhatu Kaya.

    This makes the normal "Three Kayas" plus:


    Svabhavikakaya, the Androgyne or Vajrasattva, Prajna-Upaya

    Jnana Kaya, or Vajrasattva as Gnosis

    Vajra Kaya, unchanging Hum of the Heart, Deathlessness

    Dharmadhatu Kaya, or, a Fruit from within the Dhatu that Manifests Perfect Wisdom.


    So there you can take this ordinary mantra and essentially derive the entire Dakarnava on it. It takes not only the Six Families but posits an even more Shentong view that when the corresponding Wisdom is attained, there is a relevant Buddha Body. Padmavajra, one of the principal Dakarnava commentors, has only added a seventh by infusing Seven Syllable Avalokiteshvara as explained by Vajradaka and the Seven Jewels of Enlightenment.

    And so there is something to the Dharmadhatu even more subtle and profound than immortality.



    Currently or at first, Avalokiteshvara is that samadhi pertaining to the throat, and he is a fan of Cunda.


    If one is familiar with Lakshmi lineage, then we have Mahakarinika Dharani for Eleven Face Lokeshvara. This is some chick in China or Vietnam singing Sanskrit in a dance groove version, she really nails it, there is no way you cannot follow it. She sings it twice, the rest is just fluff. And so if we use the corrected translation we got from India, the song describes Avalokiteshvara as the king of making the Vyuha or Display of Vairocana. Nobody usually notices something like that, since a dharani also uses words that have no meaning, so the question marks fall there. That is correct. But if you follow the inner meaning, it is talking about mastery of making the Vyuha. Then, in some way towards the end, it indicates Cunda and the Universe Lotus.








    Namo Ratna Trayāya, (homage to the triple gem)


    Namah Aryā Jñāna Sāgara, (homage to the ocean of noble wisdom)


    Vairocanavyuha Rajāya (to the king of the display of Vairocana [Dharmadhatu Tower])


    Tathagatāya, (to the tathagata)


    Arhate, (to the arhat)


    Samyak sambuddhāya, (to the perfectly awakened one)


    Nama Sarva TathagatebhyaH (homage to all tathagatas)


    ArhatebhyaH, (to the arhats)


    Samyak SambuddhebhyaH, (to the fully and perfectly awakened ones)


    Nama Aryā Avalokiteshvarāya (homage to noble Avalokitesvara)


    Bodhisattvāya, (to the bodhisattva)


    Maha Sattvāya, (to the great being)


    Maha Karunikāya, (to the greatly compassionate one)


    Tadyatha (thus):


    Om Dhāra Dhāra, (bearing)


    Dhīri Dhīri, (firm)


    Dhuru Dhuru (bearing a burden)


    Itte Vatte, (??)


    Cale Cale, (moving, trembling, shaking)


    P[u]racale P[u]racale, (moving, trembling, shaking)


    Kusume (in flower)

    Kusuma

    Vare, (in the circumference)


    Illi Mili (??)


    Citi Jvālam, (blazing understanding)


    Apanaye Svāhā. (leading away) hail!




    The song, per se, is likely known by millions, and due to the common error, they are probably not getting anything about the Vyuha. But we can see its importance, it is like a mandatory breeding ground for other samadhis.

    "Apanaye" is a complex conjugation of "Ni" as in Parasol's mantra.
    Last edited by shaberon; 21st July 2020 at 00:36.

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    I like posting on this stuff because with every pass, it boils down a little more, and millions of seemingly unrelated bits settle into something like a crystalline lattice, or a gene, or a blueprint, which guides one through the inner meaning into the Path.


    Although many of the Mahasiddhas and their sadhanas are on the first to sixth Bhumis, with Bhikshuni Lakshmi, we can find a reason to place a Universal or Cosmic 1,000 Arm form as the highest kind of spontaneous realization:


    Lakshmi saw Amoghapasha with all the Kriya deities on the eighth bhumi. On the tenth, she saw Thousand Arm Avalokiteshvara with all four classes of tantric deities inside him.

    On the tenth Bhumi, the state of Vajradhara, she saw the major form which included everything else in the pantheon.

    And so in Nepal there is Red Avalokiteshvara who contains Hindu deities, which we say are "converted", and perhaps White Avalokiteshvara may help explain the conversion.

    From a sadhana of Vairocana Lotsawa:

    chönyi ngönsum namnang gangchen tso

    The direct realization of dharmatā is Vairocana of the Vast Glacial Ocean,

    And the same name is repeated later, i. e. Vairocana of the Vast Glacial Ocean, namnang gangchen tso.

    Namnang Gangchen Tso is the upmost figure over Tigle Chu Drug Avalokiteshvara, who is under two White Jinasagaras and over the Dharmakaya:








    Dharmakaya is called Zungjug (Yughannada) Jangchub (Bodhi) Sempa (Sattva). Yughannada or "pair united" is also defined as the final stage of completion stage of Highest Yoga Tantra, where the practitioner is able to unite the clear light mind called the meaning clear light (which is a direct realization of emptiness) with the pure illusory body, the experience of the winds entering the indestructible drop at the central channel.

    Indestructible Drop does not come from one's parents.

    Tigle is a Drop, or Bindu, or Syllable.




    As much as Lotus Family is related to sex, we also find that it employs the Vaisnava powder kunkuma, which is a female celibacy mark, similar to male ash-smearing. Celibacy is specifically referred to only a few times in Sadhanamala. Brahmacharya is only mentioned by Avalokiteshvara Mahakarunika Dharani 41, Sragdhara 109, and Vajra Sarasvati 164-165. Although the latter continues her "prajna vardhani" mantra, she is a red deity with a lotus as her primary item.

    Lotus Garland or Sragdhara is similar to Mahakarunika, or is its sub-category related to Twenty-one Taras and other goddess songs.

    Sragdhara Tara is a Bhattarika, something like lady of the house, and this title is carried by only a few others, which are not or are barely sexualized.

    Bhattarika Taras include Sragdhara, Mahamaya Vijayavahini, Maha Cina (Fat Blue Ghora Four Arm Sword Warrior), Vajra Tara, the heart of White Ekajata, referred to by Marici a few times, and Tara 115 that splits Golden Drop Kurukulla.

    So, along the Lotus Garland or Sragdhara ("wearing a garland") are a few other things that are tangential to Lotus Family.

    But there is one that seems rather powerful within it, so here is a rundown of this new to the west, and almost totally lost, opposite sex and color of Lakshmi's Avalokiteshvara.

    In Nepal's Dharani Samgraha, there is Thousand Arm Tara Bhattarika.


    It was found by Bhattacharya in a Nepalese Dharani Samgraha in its Tarabhattarika-namastotraiata section. A sloka of this says she is adored by Vajradhara, and is Padmapani Priya or the beloved (usually wife or consort) of Avalokiteshvara (cf. ch. 1 p.17):

    Sahasramukhi sahasrasire sahasrabhuje jvali-
    tanetre sarvatathagatahrdayagarbhe asidhanuparasupasupasat oma-
    lakanayasaktimusaramudgalacakraliaste ehyelii bhagavati sarvatatha-
    gatasatyena devarsisatyena Mahamayavijayavahini smara smara
    sarvatathagatajhanarupenagaccha gaccha sarvavaranaksayamkari
    parasainyavidrapani mohaya sarvadustan. Vajradharavandite
    pujite svaha / Padmapanipriye svaha / sarvadevanamaskrte svaha /
    matrganavandite pujite svaha /

    They say the only other description is almost identical in Narayanapari-prccha and this is the only 1,000 Arm Tara, or, according to the text, also has a thousand heads. We have "taken" Vairocani from Maha Narayana Upanishad, and "returned" a Narayan adventure with Buddha.

    Mahamaya Vijayavahini has been mostly translated by someone with an interest about Vishnu in Buddhism. This is a reciprocal of our interest in Agni Vaisvanara--Yajnawalkya--Sita and Yogacara.

    It is from the same original Narayan Maha Maya Vijaya Vahini Sanskrit document.

    Hindu Vishnu is an emanation of Red Avalokiteshvara. Buddha himself is more like a verb or quality of "vishnu", a fully-fledged Agni Vaisvanara, called Sangyas in Tibetan, Vibuddha in Sanskrit, which is like a combination with "vibhu", expanded or all-pervasive, basically the same meaning as the name Vishnu. The same flow as progress in Tantra or Abhisambodhi from "previously awakened--not expanded" to "previously awakened--fully expanded".

    This Dharani is extremely similar to Indra requesting Dhvajagrakeyura Dharani. That is more like invulnerability or armor, and this one is more weapon-like. Vishnu Narayan suffers a defeat and petitions Buddha for his magic. So this translation explains most of the text while remaining oblivious to the part about the goddess herself, which we can get from the original.

    Notice that Buddha is talking about Aloka or i. e., Void Light at first, in a location related to Yakshas.

    From the translation:


    The Dharani requested by Narayana

    There is an interesting Dharani Sutra with the title “nārāyaṇaparipṛcchā āryamahāmāyāvijayavāhinī nāma dhāraṇī” – The āryamahāmāyāvijayavāhinī named Dharani requested by Narayana”. As explicitly indicated by the title, in this Dharani sutra Narayana is seen as requesting a Dharani from the Buddha.

    The Buddha is residing at the city of Kubera [*Vaisravana in the text], expounding the Dharma named “Dharma-Aloka-Mukha” [The Bright Faced Dharma]. There Narayana appears, after being defeated by the Asuras. He then circumambulates the Buddha and pays homage to him by placing his head at the Bhagavan’s feet and then requests the Dharani that grants victory in war.

    tadevaṁ deśayatu bhagavān sarvajñaḥ sarvadarśī sarvasattvānukampakastaṁ dharmaparyāyaṁ yamete devanāgayakṣarākṣasādayo manuṣyā vā dhārayamāṇāḥ saṁgrāme mahāśūlapātebhyo vā sarvopadravebhyo vā sarvavitarkavicārebhyo vā vijayino bhaviṣyanti

    Therefore instruct, Oh Bhagavan Knower-of-all, Observer-of-all and Sympathizer-of-all beings – that dharma-paryaya (Dharma teaching) by which the Devas, Nagas, Yakshas, Rakshas or Men on hearing will become victorious at war from the attack of great-tridents, all calamities and all-doubtful-thoughts.

    On the request from Narayana, the Lord Buddha expounds the Dharani.

    [The Dharani verses commence with “tadyathā namo’stvadhvānugatapratiṣṭhitebhyaḥ” and conclude with “phaṭ phaṭ svāhā“]

    [*section 7 of text]


    After hearing the Bhagavan’s Dharmopadesha (Dharma-Instruction) –


    bodhisattvasaṁvarīyo nārāyanaḥ aho āścaryamiti kṛtvā śaṅkhacakragadāpuṣpamālyayuktaḥ utthāyāsanāt bhagavantaṁ triḥpradakṣiṇīkṛtya praṇamya prahasitavadano bhūtvā bhagavantaṁ gāthayā stauti sma|

    aho hyasuradevānāṁ lokānāṁ jyeṣṭhaṁ śreṣṭho hyanuttarīkaḥ|

    śivaḥ śānto’thāgrāhya lokātīto namo’stu te||

    abhāvaḥ sarvadharmāṇāṁ bhūtadharmaprakāśakaḥ|

    dharmādharmavimuktaustau dharma satya namo’stu te||


    Surrounded by the Bodhisattvas, Narayana after saying “Oh! Amazing”, having risen up from the seat with the Conch-Discus-Mace-Flower Garland, then having circumambulated the Lord three times, and having bowed down [then] having a smiled-face praised the Lord through a verse (gātha) .

    Behold ! The foremost, best [and the] unsurpassed of the Asuras and Devas of the Worlds

    The Auspicious, Peaceful, un-conceived and the one beyond the world, homage to Him

    The Illuminator of the past Dharma of the non-existant All-Dharmas

    [The] Dharma [and] Satya [which are] liberated [from] Dharma and Adharma, homage to Him

    The Narayana proceeds to bow to the Buddha and utters “tvaṁ mama vibhuḥ bhagavan” (Oh Bhagavan, You are my Lord !) and then disappears. Alternatively, Vibhu also means All-Pervading (Vishnu also means All-Pervading). Again, it seems like Vishnu implying, “[They call me the All-pervading one (Vishnu), but really] you are my all-pervading one”.




    Like Mahalakshmi, Mahamaya's form appears to start when Narayan takes you. Both 7 and 8 begin with a variety of grha tvam (Graha, the name of planets, meaning "to seize", i. e. you may be seized or gripped by their malignancies). In 8 there is Evam or "thus" before her name. "Having taken you" "thus" she is fully recited (pathitva). 7 seems to be present tense, 8 is past. The grammar could mean "she takes you, Narayan", but we should understand him and know that this is more or less the "inquiry of man" or one's self to the entire Great Illusion.

    The very beginning of her form in the Dharani itself is:

    mahāmāyājālasahasramukhi

    Maha Maya Jala Thousand Faces

    sarvatathāgatahṛdayagarbhe

    All Tathagathas in her Heart Womb



    Dhanurveda-saṃhitā or art of war defines Asi as a sword measuring forty anguli. So although she is not called Khadga Dakini, she is:

    asidhanuparaśupāśatomarakanayaśaktinṛmuṇḍihaste

    Having in her hand Sword, Bow, Axe, Noose, Tomara (javelin or lance), Kanaya (short spear of twenty anguli) śaktinṛmuṇḍi, which seems to be Power of a female Nirmunda, which is something like a eunuch, who has no (nir) head (munda) to his member. Otherwise it would be saying she holds Headless Shakti or Cinnamasta. After that, she has a Hammer and Chakra. It sounds close to a Pashupati, Shingon, etc., generally celibate warriors.

    sarvatathāgatajñānarūpeṇa

    All Buddhas' Wisdom is her form.

    Her noted epithets were honored by Vajradhara, by all devas, by Matrikas, Jaya, Vijaya and Aparajita, but she is also:

    mahāmaṇḍalādhiṣṭhite

    Maha Mandala Adhistithe (consecration, seal--just as Parasol is Sarva Buddha Adhistithe). Maha Mandala would be understood as Vajradhatu Maha Mandala (the transform from its basic mandala, when Vairocana arises in Sambhoga Kaya). In other words, she has steady, calm Buddhi towards Vajradhatu. This is really her first "epithet" after her "name", Mahamaya Dhariniye, before Vajradhara gets excited.

    mahākālavanditapūjitāya

    Honored by Mahakala

    kāmarūpiṇīye

    Takes any form desired as in Devi Mahatmya, Durga, etc., or, she has a desirable form.

    māyārākṣasīye

    Maya Raksasi


    After the Dharani:


    nārāyaṇa atha tasmin

    Narayan now in that

    samparāye senayorubhayormadhye

    (War or calamity or future state or next world) in the middle of an army in (fear or danger?)

    pañcasu sthāneṣu etaddhāraṇīcakraṃ rathapratikṛtau yuñjyāt

    In five places (or at the time of death) (this) dharani cakra chariot (image or copy) (should be placed, practiced, contemplated).

    nārāyaṇa ubhayormadhye parasenāgre

    Narayan in the middle of (both or two) front guards of armies

    tasmin rathamadhye

    meanwhile in a chariot (i. e., with the mantra wheel)

    is the goddess. Her appearance is referred to and her color is:

    lohitakṛṣṇavarṇāṃ

    Lohita is red, or, more specifically, blood, and in any case, it is krsna or dark, so a burgundy or alizarin type of color.

    She is now called:

    guhyamantrapadāni

    vidyārājñīṃ

    (Secret Mantra Vidya Queen or Mahavidya)

    with four rows of faces like lamps and:

    parasenāṃ bhakṣayantīmiva

    (over the) army, bhaksa (eating food or gluttonous) antima (ultimately or finally) miva (growing fat). This last perhaps similar to Annapurna. She does not explicitly say this, but she has Upeksa with respect to Six Families as per Maha Mandala, and her Victory resembles Annapurna. So this in essence includes or stems from the entire esoteric training in successful application, inwardly and outwardly, since Annapurna also indicates Maha Sukha chakra or the voids and Great Void. Or esoterically Prathyahara "control of food" to Nisprapanca or "unelaborated" or the winds have entered the central and risen.


    Next, the dharani is likhitvā (written) with kunkumena: transcendental kunkuma powder. In Srimad Bhagavatam, Tenth Canto, 21.17, Krishna walks around Vrindaban leaving a reddish powder on the grass (saffron or turmeric). Krishna got it from the breasts of his gopis, i. e. they held his feet to their breasts which were powdered red. The Pulidyah, or Sabaris, saw it in the grass, and rubbed it on their breasts, and lost adhim or sexual anxiety and became satisfied. It seems to be saying whoever writes it this way will be victorious over poverty and the like, and equal to a general. So the sentence ending "cintayet" (contemplate like this) is the end of the goddess, The next sentence speaks about writing, and then Narayan comes back as the subject. Kunkuma is used in Sadhanamala at least twenty times. This is perhaps similar to males smearing with ash.

    As "mental pain", the dictionary suggests adhi, or adhih, which appears to be a negation of dhi or Buddhi.

    Like Maitri's Doha, this distinctly uses Vaisnava terminology. Her actions or parasainya or crushing are related to Pramardani and final samadhi. Vahini is another term for an entire army, it may all be her, since after vidyarajni, it is many thousands of rupa, i. e. forms or bodies. Usually, Vahini is a "vehicle", which here specifically is a "Ratha" or chariot.

    With almost blatant Vaisnava imagery, this is like an altered scene of Krishna and Arjuna, using his powder to make Amazons. If we follow the meaning, the main use of the goddess is a Dharani, and she would really be "worshipped in Eighteen Arm form", i. e. Khandaroha. That means Generation Stage as a whole. The universal or Blood Red 1,000 Arm form would be a transcendental experience of her. It evolves from tapas including sexual retention if not outright celibacy. Possibly Karmamudra. Hard to say. At the very least, mental and physical tranquility towards it. Her violence is against any attachment, which Pandara is full of.

    So, ok. The Thousand Arm mega deities are intended to be "worshipped", i. e. visualized and Muttered in Eighteen Arm Forms, such as Samputa Vajrasattva, Padma Jala Avalokiteshvara, Khandaroha, Varuni, Cunda, and Parasol. To attain these is itself more or less a sequence from a small number of arms or attributes to a greater.

    If we follow this thought, there is a major pause on deity growth at the six arm stage, and in fact there are almost none or are no Hindu deities that even have six arms.


    In Vairocana Abhisambodhi, Earth Locana is called the Mother of Sakyamuni; to her right is White Urna, and to her left are five Usnisa deities beginning with Sitatapatra. Locana's symbol is an Usnisa with Vajra signs. Around them are Pure Land deities, more Usnisas, Agni, and Yama. Here, urna or tilaka is forehead mark, i. e., ajna center, which is a valid chakra and source of white moon, but perhaps emphasized less than the rest of the head.


    In Vairocana or Tathagata Family, the Mother is equivalently Marici, Grahamatrika, and Pancha Raksa--Pratisara.

    It also has the unique Usnisa class, from whom, Sitatapatra Parasol can arise in 1,000 Arm form.

    However, when White Tara in general arises to the point of having Six Arms, something weird happens.

    There is Sukla Tara, who is an Amoghasiddhi emanation in the cemeteries who casts Vajra Fence. There is Six Arm Grahamatrika. And although there is a Six Arm Parasol, the text very plainly states that her Parasol is absent:


    Sadhanamala Six arm Parasol: "Sitatapatra Aparajita, who is three faced, six armed, and has three eyes in each of her faces. She is of white (Sukla) colour. Her faces to the right and left are respectively of blue and red colour. She carries in her three right hands the Cakra, the goad and the bow, and in the three left the white Vajra, the arrow and the noose with the Tarjani. She has angry looks, destroys all sorts of evil spirits (Grahas lit. Planets), wears celestial ornaments and garments, and is led by Vairocana. Thus meditating... "

    Grahamatrika in Taranatha's version has faces that agree with Parasol's, and as Mother of Planets works against paralysis, unconsciousness, and harm caused by these bhutas. Her hand pairs are doing Dharmachakra mudra, Vajra and Lotus, Bow and Arrow. Vajra feet, divine robes, Om Ah Hum in her Three Places. Vairocana goddess arisen from Hum, lotus and moon disk.

    Grahamatrika is Peaceful and Sitatapatra Aparajita is Wrathful, both are related to Grahas or are close to Vajrapani and Eight Planets in the scale of Kama Loka. Grahamatrika is not necessarily an Usnisa, but she is quite important in Nepalese Dharanis.

    Sitatapatra does not always have the epithet Aparajita, who we have found is important for Noose, which Sitatapatra Aparajita carries.

    As this type of form, she will take her basic mantra in a wrathful tone:





    Six Arm Parasol without parasol at Tabo:









    There "is" a parasol, but she is not holding it.

    With Hayagriva, Parnasabari in her leaves and kneeling pose, which is a pelvic prana control, and the Grahas or Planets:







    Or, at least, there is Yellow Bhu Devi on Boar with Indra, Agni, etc. Parasol perhaps has "Kurukulla hands" plus two for a Chakra (held on a spoke) and a Vajra (held at her heart). The Four Kings surround Yamantaka at the bottom. She seems to be adorned with Citrons.

    She must deal with the same subject as Grahamatrika, who is something like a peaceful teaching version of her, and is considerably more elaborate.

    After this ambiguous "border" (similar to Acala), when she increases to Eight Arms, she recovers her Parasol and has a lighter background:













    She has a ten arm Amoghasiddhi emanation, fourteen arm Amaravajra, and Pratyangira.
    Last edited by shaberon; 21st July 2020 at 08:21.

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    I wonder this would be of any interest:

    A comparative study of frequencies of “Om Mani Padme Hum” and “Om Namah Shivaye”

    Lokeshvara ( means both “sarva loka ishvara” or “aishvarya locana” , the lord of the worlds, the one with powerful eyes, is an epitaph of both Shiva and Lord Mahavishnu, alternatively in ancient Hindu scriptures and worship traditions and lineages.

    The mantra Om Mani Padme Hum as practiced today had an older Hindu and perhaps, surprisingly even Sufi version of itself that was related to the legend of Chintamani ( The Wishfulfilling Jewel). Chintamani can be said to be “Chitta” Mani, the Jewel of the Mind or a physical object ( probably some kind of ancient ET relic).

    In either case, the mantra is known among Hindu sadhus in various alternative versions such as Om Mani Padmani Hum etc.


    In short it was once in history used as powerful “wish granting mantra” by devotees following Shiva( or Narayan) manifesting from a Lotus flower( Brahmā) and transcending powers of creation and cyclic existence
    surpassing the power of stagnation
    causing both dissolution and sublimation
    throughout all realms.



    Dissolving all action to non-action the Principle itself dissolves to pure Sky of Dhammakaya.


    🌈

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    Quote Posted by Agape (here)

    Lokeshvara ( means both “sarva loka ishvara” or “aishvarya locana” , the lord of the worlds, the one with powerful eyes, is an epitaph of both Shiva and Lord Mahavishnu, alternatively in ancient Hindu scriptures and worship traditions and lineages.
    Cintamani and Citta Mani are very different Taras.

    Cintamani is Fruit-picker Vasudhara; Citta Mani is a Tara with Mind Mandala. One is a Samaya being, the other is an almost impossible-to-find lineage.


    Again, a great deal of Buddhism is drawn from or is a close copy of Hinduism, but in most cases there is some kind of change. And so there is a different idea about the standard translation of Avalokiteshvara.

    It is tricky to worm through the "personalizations" of deities, since they are not people or devas. They are more like different qualities of powers of nature and the mind. Tibetans will eventually explain this if you press them, but, original Theosophy was rather emphatic. The Mahatma Letters completely reverse the normal interpretation of Avalokiteshvara: Koothoomi refutes the then-current English analysis:

    "Avalokiteshvara" (a manwantaric intelligent nature crowned with humanity) -- the mystic name given by us to the hosts of the Dyan Chohans (N.B., the solar Dyan Chohans or the host of only our solar system) taken collectively, which host represents the mother source, the aggregate amount of all the intelligences that were are or ever will be whether on our string of man-bearing planets or on any part or portion of our solar system.

    "The name Avalokitesvara, which means 'the Lord who looks down from on high,' is a purely metaphysical invention. The curious use of the past particle passive 'avalokita' in an active sense is clearly evident from the translations into Tibetan and Chinese."

    Now saying that it means: "the Lord who looks down from on high," or, as he kindly explains further -- "the Spirit of the Buddhas present in the church," is to completely reverse the sense. It is equivalent to saving "Mr. Sinnett looks down from on high (his Fragments of Occult Truth) on the British Theos. Society," whereas it is the latter that looks up to Mr. Sinnett, or rather to his Fragments as the (in their case only possible) expression and culmination of the knowledge sought for. This is no idle simile and defines the exact situation. In short, Avalokita Isvar literally interpreted means "the Lord that is seen." "Iswara" implying moreover, rather the adjective than the noun, lordly, self-existent lordliness, not Lord. It is, when correctly interpreted, in one sense "the divine Self perceived or seen by Self," the Atman or seventh principle ridded of its mayavic distinction from its Universal Source -- which becomes the object of perception for, and by the individuality centred in Buddhi, the sixth principle, -- something that happens only in the highest state of Samadhi. This is applying it to the microcosm. In the other sense Avalokitesvara implies the seventh Universal Principle, as the object perceived by the Universal Buddhi "Mind" or Intelligence which is the synthetic aggregation of all the Dhyan Chohans, as of all other intelligences whether great or small, that ever were, are, or will be. Nor is it the "Spirit of Buddhas present in the Church," but the Omnipresent Universal Spirit in the temple of nature -- in one case; and the seventh Principle -- the Atman in the temple -- man -- in the other.


    Of course you know that the double-triangle -- the Satkiri Chakram of Vishnu -- or the six-pointed star, is the perfect seven. In all the old Sanskrit works -- Vedic and Tantrik -- you find the number 6 mentioned more often than the 7 -- this last figure, the central point being implied, for it is the germ of the six and their matrix. It is then thus . . . [At this point in the original there is a rough drawing of the interlaced triangles inscribed in a circle. -- ED.] -- the central point standing for seventh, and
    the circle, the Mahakâsha -- endless space -- for the seventh Universal Principle. In one sense, both are viewed as Avalokitesvara, for they are respectively the Macrocosm and the microcosm. The interlaced triangles -- the upper pointing one -- is Wisdom concealed, and the downward pointing one -- Wisdom revealed (in the phenomenal world).



    This explanation seems much more consistent with Buddha who during enlightenment, after dissolving the voids, beheld the Absolute Object, or Lakshmi, who, on a vision of the tenth bhumi, beheld the whole Avalokiteshvara.

    We generally do not think of any of them as "a being". In its half-name, Lokeshvara, this is perhaps a more worldly or less Absolute observance of it. But if you fumble with the grammar, "Self-existent lordliness which is seen", is valid, and, in my experience, much more relevant to Yoga practice.

    Is it more primevally and less-worldly seen via the Jewel Lotus that Old Student is describing, yes, that seems rather close.

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    Quote As a Buddhist you are of course allowed to participate in whatever in Hinduism you want. We certainly find "vimala" quite replete in our lexicon, such as Vimala Prabha (the main Kalachakra commentary), or Vimala Bhumi.
    Vimalaprabha was also the protector bodhisattva of Khotan, who incarnated as a princess there (also named Vimalaprabha) and promised to protect Khotan as long as they maintained the Dharma. I have no idea how she was ever pictured. I do know that the destruction of Khotan did figure at some point in the stupa that I see in my crown. And that the prayer flags in a thicket of sticks I saw in the notes I posted above the shrouds look like those on the hill above there (which was converted centuries ago from a vihara to a mazar of some kind).

    The new one seems to sometimes be multiple things, perhaps she is many different emanations of the same being. The ties to Cunda made sense in that she has some traits that might relate to Chandra -- as you say, Cunda may have come from Chandra. I don't know what was the meaning of the mantra stuff, I had thought it would be a way to find out, to recite her mantra, but they responded with another one. I don't know if that meant a positive or a negative.

    Prajnaparamita has had connections to my heart before, that doesn't stop it from being her.

    She dances in a space that is definitely a womb and makes it grow until it is the size of space. But any female deity might lay claim to symbolism involving the womb. Last night that space directly "went into" a part of the shaking where rainbow liquid developed, instead of expanding as it had several nights before.

    And Samantabhadri is, not sure of the word, kind of "protective" of the new one, she has more than once cradled her.

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    Quote Indeed. It sounds like what you are doing is...an unusual and vivid way...of the upper part of Yoga. Which I would guess consists of the Kurukulla-period until the Stupa...happens.
    I had decided, because of all this, that the essence of Yoga was this kind of extension of control, because this seemed like it was mirrored in some of the practices there. The muscle movements and extensions of sensation have really begun to move into my chest area now. The top of my chest started to get involved last night. It has been involved in other movements before, but this is the movements that have been moving up from my abdomen -- from my solar plexus, and they are quite different. As of yet, everything above around the nipple line (maybe 4th-5th rib) is still very crude, the movements below that are getting quite complex and refined.

    Quote Yes, those sound accurate, although I am not familiar with them. In the practice of Armor Deities, it is noteworthy that, whereas the Pranayama is at first attempting to operate only Four Chakras, the Armor Deities protect six, even though they continue to ignore the base of the spine. There is one at the ajna, and another at the upper head between it and the crown.

    Yellow Vajrayogini in the abdomen refers to Vairocani (usually white or yellow, orange in Samvarodaya).
    One is from Lama Yeshe, the yellow one is from Alexandra David-Neel, I did find that the ways of doing breathing for Tummo seems to be different between monks and nuns. Oddly, what worked best for me (granted I was standing and not sitting), was a combination of both.

    Quote The combination of the Garbha and Vajra is Dharma Dhatu. Feminine and masculine, womb--lotus and vajra. One can perhaps encapsulate the whole thing with a female Lotus deity and Vajrasattva.
    This combination in a simultaneous rather than a joined manner showed up in my shakings as what I ended up calling a 'Dao sheng yi' sequence. That was because the male showed up first, then the female, then both, and then there was a dissolve. During that, the first time and at least one subsequent time, those lines (from Laozi) were prominent and very loud. They come from Laozi Ch. 42: "“道生一,一生二,二生三,三生萬物。 (Dao sheng yi, yi sheng er, er sheng san, san sheng wan wu. -- The Dao begets one, one begets two, two begets three, three beget the ten thousand things.) It was the exercise just before the one of being "completely in" my clear body or my physical body, in which I am in my clear body (for instance) to the point of having no awareness of my physical body, no knowledge of how to get there. That "completely in" exercise was the one right before the "pelvic shaking" with the shaman stuff and the loom and the cauldron and then the new one.

    Quote Aspects of Dharma Kaya have been described as:

    The first is the 'Knowledge-body' (Jnana-kaya), the inner nature shared by all Buddhas, their Buddha-ness (buddhata)
    ... The second aspect of the Dharma-body is the 'Self-existent-body' (Svabhavika-kaya). This is the ultimate nature of reality, thusness, emptiness: the non-nature which is the very nature of dharmas, their dharma-ness (dharmata). It is the Tathagata-garbha and bodhicitta hidden within beings, and the transformed 'storehouse-consciousness' (Alaya).

    Thusness or Suchness is the way over the Second Void. The three voids or subtle minds are whisked away by No Ego, Suchness, and Ultimate Meaning.


    The other aspects are Vajra Kaya and Dharmadhatu Kaya. That makes all Seven Buddha Bodies. This is behind what we call Vajra Ignorance which is Varahi.
    There is one beyond Svabhavika Kaya called Mahasuka Kaya? I tried to find out about it and whether "suka" was supposed to be "sukha"?

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    Quote In Sanskrit, two apparently separate words in Avalokiteshvara's mantra are just one: Manipadme.

    Jewel Lotus. I. e., you perceive a jewel at the center of a net at the throat. So this experience is already equivalent to stability in the samadhi of Om Manipadme Hum.
    This would fit with Samantabhadri and consort being there. Manipadme is the Vajra in the Lotus you were referring to earlier. Whenever I hear it described like this, all I can think of is Georgia O'Keefe. But truth be told I have this motif all over the place. Both of the moons, the thin smoke, and others.

    Interesting song. Not sure what she is saying at the end, it sort of sounds like Chinese but not intelligible or at least not compatible with facial expressions.

    Here is Om mani padme hum in Mongolian

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    Quote If we follow this thought, there is a major pause on deity growth at the six arm stage, and in fact there are almost none or are no Hindu deities that even have six arms.
    ?? Durga has ten.

    Quote In Vairocana or Tathagata Family, the Mother is equivalently Marici, Grahamatrika, and Pancha Raksa--Pratisara.

    It also has the unique Usnisa class, from whom, Sitatapatra Parasol can arise in 1,000 Arm form.

    However, when White Tara in general arises to the point of having Six Arms, something weird happens.

    There is Sukla Tara, who is an Amoghasiddhi emanation in the cemeteries who casts Vajra Fence. There is Six Arm Grahamatrika. And although there is a Six Arm Parasol, the text very plainly states that her Parasol is absent:


    Sadhanamala Six arm Parasol: "Sitatapatra Aparajita, who is three faced, six armed, and has three eyes in each of her faces. She is of white (Sukla) colour. Her faces to the right and left are respectively of blue and red colour. She carries in her three right hands the Cakra, the goad and the bow, and in the three left the white Vajra, the arrow and the noose with the Tarjani. She has angry looks, destroys all sorts of evil spirits (Grahas lit. Planets), wears celestial ornaments and garments, and is led by Vairocana. Thus meditating... "
    Does Sukla then indicate both a color and a deity?

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    Thanks, Agape, an interesting topic for a paper.

    I have my doubts about Om Mani Padme Hum being the newest of them. Especially when talking Sufi. The great Sufi center at Bukhara derives its name from Vihara, indicating its original nature, that flows went from Buddhism to Sufism. It is even speculated that the onion dome, so prevalent in post Sufi Islam may actually have come from the shape of a stupa, and probably from either Bukhara, or Merv.

    No guesses on Hinduism and Buddhism except that in 3rd and 4th c. "Northern India" at the time (Bactra and Khotan), neither were they very well delineated, nor were the various "vehicles" of modern Buddhism. Shiva and Lakshmi, as well as others, Devi Ma, regularly hung around with various kinds of sattvas.

    "What are you studying as a monk? Hinayana, Mahayana, and Vajrayana, Sir. And which do you prefer? Vajrayana, Sir." (exchange between a monk and a border guard, the latter was trying to decide whether the other was really a monk.)

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    Quote "Avalokiteshvara" (a manwantaric intelligent nature crowned with humanity) -- the mystic name given by us to the hosts of the Dyan Chohans (N.B., the solar Dyan Chohans or the host of only our solar system) taken collectively, which host represents the mother source, the aggregate amount of all the intelligences that were are or ever will be whether on our string of man-bearing planets or on any part or portion of our solar system.

    "The name Avalokitesvara, which means 'the Lord who looks down from on high,' is a purely metaphysical invention. The curious use of the past particle passive 'avalokita' in an active sense is clearly evident from the translations into Tibetan and Chinese."
    Indeed. His(or her) name in Chinese is 觀世音 (Guanshiyin, Kanzeon in Japanese), "Attends to the sounds of the world."

    A History of Chittagong, Volume 1 (From Ancient Times down to 1761)
    by Dr. Suniti Bhushan Qanungo is a good book for history on an area "at the corner of maps" as Rila Mukherjee called them. In it you find quite a bit that contradicts what is usually written in non-historical literature -- that the Nath yoga culture originally trained and learned their art from Buddhists in the tradition of Naropa, for instance.

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    Default Re: Does Anybody Else Have Clear Body Experiences?

    Quote Posted by Old Student (here)
    There is one beyond Svabhavika Kaya called Mahasuka Kaya? I tried to find out about it and whether "suka" was supposed to be "sukha"?
    Suka would be a spelling error for Sukha.

    The technical terms can be tricky--very different words can be synonyms, and something that looks similar can be completely different. So by way of reasoning, what is called Abhisambodhi Kaya in one place, is called Jnana Kaya by Padmavajra, since the full explanation of Jnana means to do Abhisambodhi. Abhisambodhi Kaya is a Maha Yoga term, which means mostly used in Nyingma, speaking in terms of five kayas.

    More synonyms internal to the Trikaya:

    A fourth kaya is the svābhāvikakāya (Skt. svābhāvikakāya; Tib. ngowo nyi ku; Wyl. ngo bo nyid sku), which is not another manifestation but the supreme buddha-kaya as the essence of the other kayas (Buddha nature). It is free from Avidya and the body of true nature.

    [more or less non-dual Vajrasattva as the operator or driver of meditation]

    His wisdom-aspect is the Jnanakaya ( Skt. jñānadharmakāya; tib. yeshe chöku; Wyl. ye shes chos sku), also Sahaja-Kaya or Sahaja-tanu or Mahasukha-Kaya (Body of sublime bliss) or the Visuddha-Kaya, through which the suchness is directly recognized.

    That means there is no other way to get Buddha's Wisdom. We are just talking about it; it only exists in that state.

    So there are quite a few terms for the same thing--and Sahaja has an extremely precise meaning in Suksma Yoga. Mahasukha Chakra refers to the crown, and for that reason, it seems to me redundant to use it as a term for a Kaya--but if it has the same definition in the Abhidharma, I cannot refute it. All I can say is that Jnana Kaya is used in Dakarnava discourse which gets us to Seven Kayas.

    Sahaja Heruka is a name for the basic white deity of Completion Stage, and Sahaja is very deep in Suksma Yoga. In Ayurveda, suksma "subtle" is the opposite of sthula "coarse", and since the physical body is Sthula Sharira, Subtle Yoga is its opposite, and the far side of that opposition is Sahaja:


    The first union of Vajrasattva and consort, or Candali Yoga, produces heat in the core, and we are trying to backdraft this into the crown or Mahasukha Chakra to experience the first Joy.

    The Joys do not depict heat rising; they begin with melted Bodhicitta.

    And so when all that power is balanced and perfectly aimed at the pinpoint aperture in the head, eventually it will burn Locana and the others until it gets to the White Seed of Bodhicitta. This seed is conceived as different things, syllables like Hum or Ham, or Shiva's Trident. Regarding this in Hevajra Tantra, Marpa says:

    As for the syllable HAM , its actuality (svabhava; ngo-bo-nyid) being the moon (viz "containing a hare"), it is Vajrasattva or Vajradhara, or the bodhicitta (byang-chub-gyi sems). This intuitive awareness of the great bliss (mahasukhajnana; bde-ba chen-po'i ye-shes) drips from the mahasukhacakra and, by means of the body of the yogin identified with Hevajra, it induces the experience of the co-emergent (sahaja; Ihan-cig-skyes- pa): "Not otherwise is sahaja called, nor elsewhere is it attained."

    He says it drips, it "induces" sahaja.

    Its controlled descent makes the Four Joys (Ananda):

    According to basic Ekarasa or "One Taste", Nectars swirl counterclockwise and are the first Four Joys, Head, Throat, Heart, Navel; Meats swirl clockwise, and ascend, the second Four Joys of Navel, Heart, Throat, Head. This again is like a corkscrew or drill; the goal of the first set is Sahaja, then the rest are all Sahaja.

    So the idea is really when the bodhicitta drips all the way down to the core, that is finally Sahaja. Then the second set of ascending joys are all Sahaja. This is not merely an idea. It really means that White Bodhicitta has dripped down into the boiling Orange Nectar of Nirmana Chakra. And this makes the "real" Nectar--when these substances merge, they make cool Mercury. So this is--what? Huh? We spend all this time in Tapas dealing with heat, and something cold comes out of it??

    That is how it works.

    Ananda would generally be the first or one Joy, or the descending set, until the fourth is Sahaja. The Sahaja in the navel, abdomen, or core, produces something utterly unknown, whose rise is all Sahaja. It must be purified or it is dangerous, but this is the triple nectar of Immortality, Medicine, and Wisdom. Then perhaps if we flip back through the Mercury symbolism, it will make sense.

    The Meats, at their starting point, are in the:

    Khay pot or Khaythala: sahaja-sukhabandha (Upaya Hevajra, Bhairava or Bhairavi). Khay is fermented curd, or i. e. yogurt, traditionally made into a mixture which contained a piece of meat.

    Bandha is a tie or lock, the meat is for locking Sahaja and Sukha, and this is also the verb for Chain Activity:

    Om Vajrasphoti Bandhaya Vam



    Bliss annihilates impediments; in Hindu terms:

    Holding on to the supreme state is Samadhi. When it is with effort due to mental disturbances, it is Samprajnata [or Savikalpa]. When these disturbances are absent, it is Nirvikalpa. Remaining permanently in the primal state without effort is Sahaja.

    This characterization of Nirvikalpa is desirable in Buddhism.

    Vajra Tara says:

    idam ucyate lokottaraṃ śūnyatājñānaṃ niṣprapañcaṃ nirvikalpam


    Lokottara is the transcendent, non-worldly siddhis of Generation and Completion Stages, so Void Gnosis, Sensory Reversal, and Nirvikalpa are a large part of its diet.



    Jamgon Kongtrul actually attributes the practice of Tinuma Vajrayogini to Nyan Lotsawa--no wonder she is a close parallel to Ziro Bhusana Vajrayogini from the same Lotsawa.

    There are Hindu deities with more than six arms, but few if any have six specifically.

    If I translate "White Tara", there are two possibilities:

    Sita Tara, having four arms, doing dharmachakra mudra

    Sukla Tara, having six arms, casting Vajra Fence

    Sukla means moonlight color, or, moreover, glowing like the moon. Most, if not all, the advanced "White Taras" share the sukla coloration. But only this one has it as her name.



    In the sense of a womb expanding to space, I don't know if this pertains to the new mystery dancer, but, just drawing from the words:

    Space Womb is the name of a male bodhisattva, Akasha Garbha or Kha Garbha. He is a standard Bodhisattva, also appearing in Dharmadhatu Vagisvara mandala; these usually refer to nothing female.

    However, in Vajradaka and Dakarnava, his consort is the same, Chakravarmini. They are also in Six Chakravartins, there is Akashagarbha with Cakravarmini: Chakra Clad in Armor, and they are mindfulness, or Smrti. Pabonkha and Naro's Secret Dakini say Chakrawarmini [is the same as] Parnashavari; in other words, she rests under this name in Chakrasamvara Completion Stage. Parnasabari is "doubled" in Dakarnava, as herself and as Chakravarmini. In the big Vajravarahi, Chakravarmini is in Pandara's southern lotus, which is perhaps her only non-coupled appearance. All the goddess of the southern lotus petals are to be visualised as dancing naked and being half-male / half-female (ardhanarīśvarī) with their two sides being yellow and red. In their four arms they brandish a bowl and staff, with a ḍamaru and their familial attribute. In the other tantras, she changes form and function. It is impossible to say what she and/or her partner "are", but in Dakarnava, they reach a very interior part of him.

    With Dakarnava, we could perhaps say that our whole Trikaya and Mahasukha is just the very outer edge of him, and he has a pile of other chakras, there is just no way to get this system to work without serious grounding in the prior processes, it is bigger than Kalachakra, having over 900 deities.

    Six Chakravartins/Dakini Jala/Chakrasamvara uses a similar process to Vajradaka about the Seven Jewels of Enlightenment, with different deities. Of thirty-seven point enlightenment, it is said that it is clear that those 7 categories are all inter-related, and thus all 37 factors may be cultivated by focusing only on Cattārō Satipaṭṭhāna, Satta Bojjhaṅga, or the Noble Eightfold Path.

    We are heavily perusing four Satipatthanas (Pithas or Chakras) and seven Bodhyanga, the Seven Jewels of Enlightenment. The first group are the Four Dakinis, and in Chakrasamvara Sacred Sites, the Jewels are Joy, Piti or Mudita--Cakravega, Dharma Vicaya--Saundini, Striving or Virya--Khaganana, Cathartic or Prasrabdhi--Khandaroha, Smrti--Cakravarmini, Samadhi--Hayakarni, and Upeksha--Suvira. These are re-iterated with new names for Seven Syllable deity (Vajradaka), taking them to be Vajradakini caliber at that stage, fully developed.

    Chakravarmini at least achieves the distinction of serving as a Jewel of Enlightenment along with Khandaroha (Varuni) and Khaganana (Guhyeshvari). It happens to be the same one that gets male-seeded by Seven Syllable Vajradaka; here, she is engulfing Akasha Garbha in order to do it.

    Although Varma is common for Armor, the closely related Varmi also means That is familiar or intimate with the turnings and windings, the mysteries and intricacies, the art or trick (of a process or business, of a machine or contrivance). That pierces into or discerns the latent meaning or purpose (of a passage in a book, of a speech &c.); that apprehends or knows the point, sting, bearing, aim, drift. This is somewhat because the sub-meaning of Varma is a sensitive area (even a sore or tumor), which armor protects; and this implication of "sensitive point" enters a metaphorical condition, i. e., the knowledge and understanding of subtle points.

    Akasha Dakini is Maitri Dakini, urdhva pada, "raised foot", i. e. flying, which would generally have been the first guess according to the words, but if the unusual pose is not noticed, it may not be her.


    Concerning Vimala, it is the second Bhumi, and an Orissan goddess equivalent to Katyayani, but also someone much more familiar, identified by inscription.

    There is another figure to whom Dalai Lamas have attempted to tie themselves. This goes back to India. There is a major series of paintings, in the same style, of Konchog Bang, the Tibetan name for an Indian king that is believed to have lived during the 1st millennium. All that we know of this king is what is recorded in the Kadam Legbam (by Atisha). The Dalais attach themselves to Dromton, an incarnation of Padmapani. So Atisha was attempting to link Dromton to Konchog, and the Dalais picked up on this later. Aside from the possibility or degree of tulku in this line, we find a fairly standard major description of King Konchog Bang.

    The monk in the upper left is the teacher Vajradhara, wearing monastic attire and a pandita hat, holding a vajra scepter and a bell. The female figure at the upper right is Guhya Jnana Dakini, white in colour, holding a drum and skullcup. In Tibetan language she is also referred to as Daki Wangdu, and in similar paintings, the figure is identified as Siddharajni. Or, in another way, at the top left is Vimala Guru as a monastic figure wearing robes, a pandita hat, and holding a vajra scepter and bell. At the top right is a figure of a woman, Guhya Jnana, white in colour, in the appearance of a peaceful deity, holding a double-sided drum (damaru) upraised in the right hand and a skullcup in the left. She cradles a katvanga staff in the bend of the elbow. Atop a moon disc and pink flower blossom, she sits with the proper left leg pendant. In some literature she is referred to as Daki Wangmo, or Daki Wangdu.








    "By the compassionate moon rays of Vimala Guru and Guhya Jnana,
    Nurturing the lily garden,
    Ripening the beings of the land of Uddiyana;
    To the One Lord Konchog Bang I pray!"


    I am not sure who the legendary king is, but, male Vimala is Pandita Vajradhara, associated with White Guhya Jnana--Siddharajni.

    Buddha as a Bodhisattva trained the first nine Bhumis with Vimala Buddha.

    Vimala is Manjushri's Pure Land.

    Ananta Mukhi Dharani has Vimala; Pancha Raksa Dharani involves Vimala and Viraj.

    In the Tibetan canon, Vimala Usnisa distinctly exists and should have a dharani, but I cannot find a legible one.
    Last edited by shaberon; 22nd July 2020 at 09:56.

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