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    UK Avalon Founder Bill Ryan's Avatar
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    Default The 45 Goals of Communism

    This deserves its own thread. Here are The 45 Goals of Communism. From this book, written by an FBI agent tasked to infiltrate the American Communist Party in the 1950s.
    Read through the list and see for yourself which have largely succeeded, or are succeeding, so far. It's pretty scary.

    1. U.S. acceptance of coexistence as the only alternative to atomic war.
    2. U.S. willingness to capitulate in preference to engaging in atomic war.
    3. Develop the illusion that total disarmament by the United States would be a demonstration of moral strength.
    4. Permit free trade between all nations regardless of Communist affiliation and regardless of whether or not items could be used for war.
    5. Extension of long-term loans to Russia and Soviet satellites.
    6. Provide American aid to all nations regardless of Communist domination.
    7. Grant recognition of Red China. Admission of Red China to the U.N.
    8. Set up East and West Germany as separate states in spite of Khrushchev’s promise in 1955 to settle the German question by free elections under supervision of the U.N.
    9. Prolong the conferences to ban atomic tests because the United States has agreed to suspend tests as long as negotiations are in progress.
    10. Allow all Soviet satellites individual representation in the U.N.
    11. Promote the U.N. as the only hope for mankind. If its charter is rewritten, demand that it be set up as a one-world government with its own independent armed forces. (Some Communist leaders believe the world can be taken over as easily by the U.N. as by Moscow. Sometimes these two centers compete with each other as they are now doing in the Congo.)
    12. Resist any attempt to outlaw the Communist Party.
    13. Do away with all loyalty oaths.
    14. Continue giving Russia access to the U.S. Patent Office.
    15. Capture one or both of the political parties in the United States. – Democrat Party captured.
    16. Use technical decisions of the courts to weaken basic American institutions by claiming their activities violate civil rights.
    17. Get control of the schools. Use them as transmission belts for socialism and current Communist propaganda. Soften the curriculum. Get control of teachers’ associations. Put the party line in textbooks.
    18. Gain control of all student newspapers.
    19. Use student riots to foment public protests against programs or organizations which are under Communist attack.
    20. Infiltrate the press. Get control of book-review assignments, editorial writing, policymaking positions.
    21. Gain control of key positions in radio, TV, and motion pictures.
    22. Continue discrediting American culture by degrading all forms of artistic expression. An American Communist cell was told to “eliminate all good sculpture from parks and buildings, substitute shapeless, awkward and meaningless forms.”
    23. Control art critics and directors of art museums. “Our plan is to promote ugliness, repulsive, meaningless art.”
    24. Eliminate all laws governing obscenity by calling them “censorship” and a violation of free speech and free press.
    25. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting pornography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio, and TV.
    26. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as “normal, natural, healthy.”
    27. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with “social” religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity which does not need a “religious crutch.”
    28. Eliminate prayer or any phase of religious expression in the schools on the ground that it violates the principle of “separation of church and state.”
    29. Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate, old-fashioned, out of step with modern needs, a hindrance to cooperation between nations on a worldwide basis.
    30. Discredit the American Founding Fathers. Present them as selfish aristocrats who had no concern for the “common man.”
    31. Belittle all forms of American culture and discourage the teaching of American history on the ground that it was only a minor part of the “big picture.” Give more emphasis to Russian history since the Communists took over.
    32. Support any socialist movement to give centralized control over any part of the culture–education, social agencies, welfare programs, mental health clinics, etc.
    33. Eliminate all laws or procedures which interfere with the operation of the Communist apparatus.
    34. Eliminate the House Committee on Un-American Activities.
    35. Discredit and eventually dismantle the FBI.
    36. Infiltrate and gain control of more unions.
    37. Infiltrate and gain control of big business.
    38. Transfer some of the powers of arrest from the police to social agencies. Treat all behavioral problems as psychiatric disorders which no one but psychiatrists can understand [or treat].
    39. Dominate the psychiatric profession and use mental health laws as a means of gaining coercive control over those who oppose Communist goals.
    40. Discredit the family as an institution. Encourage promiscuity and easy divorce.
    41. Emphasize the need to raise children away from the negative influence of parents. Attribute prejudices, mental blocks and retarding of children to suppressive influence of parents.
    42. Create the impression that violence and insurrection are legitimate aspects of the American tradition; that students and special-interest groups should rise up and use “united force” to solve economic, political or social problems.
    43. Overthrow all colonial governments before native populations are ready for self- government.
    44. Internationalize the Panama Canal.
    45. Repeal the Connally reservation so the United States cannot prevent the World Court from seizing jurisdiction [over domestic problems. Give the World Court jurisdiction] over nations and individuals alike.

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    This deserves its own thread. Here are The 45 Goals of Communism. From this book, written by an FBI agent tasked to infiltrate the American Communist Party in the 1950s.
    Read through the list and see for yourself which have largely succeeded, or are succeeding, so far. It's pretty scary.

    1. U.S. acceptance of coexistence as the only alternative to atomic war.
    2. U.S. willingness to capitulate in preference to engaging in atomic war.
    3. Develop the illusion that total disarmament by the United States would be a demonstration of moral strength.
    4. Permit free trade between all nations regardless of Communist affiliation and regardless of whether or not items could be used for war.
    5. Extension of long-term loans to Russia and Soviet satellites.
    6. Provide American aid to all nations regardless of Communist domination.
    7. Grant recognition of Red China. Admission of Red China to the U.N.
    8. Set up East and West Germany as separate states in spite of Khrushchev’s promise in 1955 to settle the German question by free elections under supervision of the U.N.
    9. Prolong the conferences to ban atomic tests because the United States has agreed to suspend tests as long as negotiations are in progress.
    10. Allow all Soviet satellites individual representation in the U.N.
    11. Promote the U.N. as the only hope for mankind. If its charter is rewritten, demand that it be set up as a one-world government with its own independent armed forces. (Some Communist leaders believe the world can be taken over as easily by the U.N. as by Moscow. Sometimes these two centers compete with each other as they are now doing in the Congo.)
    12. Resist any attempt to outlaw the Communist Party.
    13. Do away with all loyalty oaths.
    14. Continue giving Russia access to the U.S. Patent Office.
    15. Capture one or both of the political parties in the United States. – Democrat Party captured.
    16. Use technical decisions of the courts to weaken basic American institutions by claiming their activities violate civil rights.
    17. Get control of the schools. Use them as transmission belts for socialism and current Communist propaganda. Soften the curriculum. Get control of teachers’ associations. Put the party line in textbooks.
    18. Gain control of all student newspapers.
    19. Use student riots to foment public protests against programs or organizations which are under Communist attack.
    20. Infiltrate the press. Get control of book-review assignments, editorial writing, policymaking positions.
    21. Gain control of key positions in radio, TV, and motion pictures.
    22. Continue discrediting American culture by degrading all forms of artistic expression. An American Communist cell was told to “eliminate all good sculpture from parks and buildings, substitute shapeless, awkward and meaningless forms.”
    23. Control art critics and directors of art museums. “Our plan is to promote ugliness, repulsive, meaningless art.”
    24. Eliminate all laws governing obscenity by calling them “censorship” and a violation of free speech and free press.
    25. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting pornography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio, and TV.
    26. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as “normal, natural, healthy.”
    27. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with “social” religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity which does not need a “religious crutch.”
    28. Eliminate prayer or any phase of religious expression in the schools on the ground that it violates the principle of “separation of church and state.”
    29. Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate, old-fashioned, out of step with modern needs, a hindrance to cooperation between nations on a worldwide basis.
    30. Discredit the American Founding Fathers. Present them as selfish aristocrats who had no concern for the “common man.”
    31. Belittle all forms of American culture and discourage the teaching of American history on the ground that it was only a minor part of the “big picture.” Give more emphasis to Russian history since the Communists took over.
    32. Support any socialist movement to give centralized control over any part of the culture–education, social agencies, welfare programs, mental health clinics, etc.
    33. Eliminate all laws or procedures which interfere with the operation of the Communist apparatus.
    34. Eliminate the House Committee on Un-American Activities.
    35. Discredit and eventually dismantle the FBI.
    36. Infiltrate and gain control of more unions.
    37. Infiltrate and gain control of big business.
    38. Transfer some of the powers of arrest from the police to social agencies. Treat all behavioral problems as psychiatric disorders which no one but psychiatrists can understand [or treat].
    39. Dominate the psychiatric profession and use mental health laws as a means of gaining coercive control over those who oppose Communist goals.
    40. Discredit the family as an institution. Encourage promiscuity and easy divorce.
    41. Emphasize the need to raise children away from the negative influence of parents. Attribute prejudices, mental blocks and retarding of children to suppressive influence of parents.
    42. Create the impression that violence and insurrection are legitimate aspects of the American tradition; that students and special-interest groups should rise up and use “united force” to solve economic, political or social problems.
    43. Overthrow all colonial governments before native populations are ready for self- government.
    44. Internationalize the Panama Canal.
    45. Repeal the Connally reservation so the United States cannot prevent the World Court from seizing jurisdiction [over domestic problems. Give the World Court jurisdiction] over nations and individuals alike.
    Expecting the "wave"...
    "Your planet is forbidden for an open visit - extremely aggressive social environment,despite almost perfect climatic conditions.Almost 4 billion violent deaths for the last 5000 years and about 15000 major military conflicts in the same period."

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    This deserves its own thread. Here are The 45 Goals of Communism. From this book, written by an FBI agent tasked to infiltrate the American Communist Party in the 1950s.
    Read through the list and see for yourself which have largely succeeded, or are succeeding, so far. It's pretty scary.
    Bill, you are promoting the Red Scare -- I think that you don't know what you are doing here.

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Quote Posted by silvanelf (here)
    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    This deserves its own thread. Here are The 45 Goals of Communism. From this book, written by an FBI agent tasked to infiltrate the American Communist Party in the 1950s.


    Read through the list and see for yourself which have largely succeeded, or are succeeding, so far. It's pretty scary.
    Bill, you are promoting the Red Scare -- I think that you don't know what you are doing here.
    Well — just read through the 45 goals, one by one. Then, of course, you can decide for yourself.

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Quote Posted by silvanelf (here)
    Bill, you are promoting the Red Scare -- I think that you don't know what you are doing here.
    Well — just read through the 45 goals, one by one. Then, of course, you can decide for yourself.
    I've read through the "45 goals" before I posted my comment. I found the list utterly ridiculous, that's the reason why I called it "promoting the Red Scare."

    Quote ... and see for yourself which have largely succeeded, or are succeeding,
    That's a manipulative statement and you should know it. In other words, you are using a "loaded question" -- you failed to question the cause of these political and social changes. Many of them have nothing to do with any alleged "communist infiltration."

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Sorry silvanelf I don't get it. Are you saying the things on this list aren't happening, or are you saying that even if they are happening it isn't necessarily a bad thing?
    "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
    ~ Jimi Hendrix

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    I've considered this list from time to time over the years, I didn't have a copy of the book, thanks Bill for sharing it.

    I think one way to consider the information is to step back from the labels and to consider the actions as part of a larger plan being implemented under the label of communism. (Or any other label, for that matter.)

    It fits in with the progressive, gradual implementation of Fabian Society ideas, and I think it goes further back.
    George Orwell's classics, Animal Farm, and 1984, and Aldous Huxley's Brave New World are fictionalized accounts of what a world would look like when these goals have been implemented.

    I have a couple of books by W Cleon Skousen about the US Constitution. I've been thinking about rereading them lately and of putting some time aside to deepen my understanding of the US Constitution and the system of "separation of powers".

    I remember being surprised about how long the people who founded this system thought about, talked about, and developed the ideas implemented, it was about 25 years before it was set down in ink, well before the Declaration of Independence. They had all come out of the period of the bloody wars between monarchs. They took a long historical view of government systems and noted the pattern of a sort of pendulum swing between anarchy and tyranny and sought to find a way to bring that pendulum to a balanced point. They also incorporated ideas from the Iroquois Federation's form of government into the mix.

    I came across an idea a few years ago of how the Pope created Islam as a way to counter the Protestant Revolution, which undercut the Pope's (Vatican's) power over the people.

    With that idea in mind, I've been wondering of a potential relationship of the how Marx was tasked to come up with ideas and a potential system of government to counter the republican form with it's system of separation of powers that happened here in the US. This took power away from the more tyrannical leaning elements. I'm still weighing in on this idea and haven't decided what I fully think on the matter. I'm wondering if this goes further back than Marx.

    Skousen wrote the book, The Naked Communist, back in 1958. And that was during a time that the pathway to implementing these goals was through Soviet Communism. Since then, Russia has rejected that model. He was speaking to the people of that time. It's helpful to keep that context in mind, I think.

    That said, these 45 Goals seem to have continued to be incrementally and progressively implemented over time. And that list looks to be nearly completed. (Not just here in the US, but globally, as well.)

    It's curious to me, too, that many of the goals have nothing to do with the ideals of communism that is often sold to the public, but rather set the conditions for a totalitarian technocratic form of government. (Or as another person we know described as "technological fiefdom". Thinking of how the Agenda 21/30/40 goals align with these goals re: move people to cities, and shift from nation states back to, cities, ... mega-cities.)

    I think this may be why so many of these forms of government destroy the history of people when they takeover. Without that context people cannot see the gradual process that led to eventual outcome.

    (Note added: I also want to add that this could be another touchy topic, and thank you for the courage to raise it.)
    Last edited by edina; 17th August 2020 at 22:32.

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    What year is it?

    If one thinks that we are living in the communist dominated world, then I have a bridge to sell them.

    I think it is illuminating to understand the basis of the United States Intelligence Community

    Page 50 of the Church Committee Report Book 1.
    "By the mid-1950s covert action operations were no longer an ad hoc
    response to specific threats. They had become an institutional part of
    the "protracted conflict" with the Soviet Union and Communism. In
    September 1954, a Top Secret report on CIA covert activities, prepared
    in connection with the second Hoover Commission, was submitted to
    President Eisenhower. The introduction to that report is enlightening
    for what it said about how covert operations were viewed at that time,
    as well as the rationale for them.
    As long as it remains national policy, another important
    requirement is an aggressive covert psychological, political
    and paramilitary organization more effective, more unique,
    and if necessary, more ruthless than that employed by the
    enemy. No one should be permitted to stand in the way of the
    prompt, efficient, and secure accomplishment of this mission.
    It is now clear that we are facing an implacable enemy
    whose avowed objective is world domination by whatever
    means and at whatever cost. There are no rules in such a game.
    Hitherto acceptable norms of human conduct do not apply.
    If the U.S. is to survive, longstanding American concepts of
    "fair play" must be reconsidered. We must develop effective
    espionage and counterespionage services and must learn to
    subvert, sabotage, and destroy our enemies by more clever,
    more sophisticated, and more effective methods than those
    used against us. It may become necessary that the American
    people be made acquainted with, understand and support this
    fundamentally repugnant philosophy."


    We are living in the Red Scare Addled brain of CIA officers like Allen Dulles.
    Consider Bill, you are pushing the exact same agenda as John Foster and Allen Dulles.

    Anytime I find myself having the same opinion as Allen Dulles, I stop and seriously consider what I am doing.

    Talking about communism now is like talking about witches After the Salem witch trials were long in the past.

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Yes. I second the promotion of the Red Scare, as it was put to us here.

    No communist China social credit scores for us, thanks.
    Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless — like water...Now water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend. Bruce Lee

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism




    This has been posted on the forum several times already, but certainly belongs in this thread imo. It's about the slow and insidious infiltration of Soviet era ideology into the US.

    Nearly everything he says is going to happen, happens. It's astounding
    Last edited by Mike; 6th August 2020 at 16:05.

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Quote Posted by silvanelf (here)

    Bill, you are promoting the Red Scare -- I think that you don't know what you are doing here.
    Quote Posted by Praxis (here)
    What year is it?

    We are living in the Red Scare Addled brain of CIA officers like Allen Dulles.
    Consider Bill, you are pushing the exact same agenda as John Foster and Allen Dulles.
    Talking about communism now is like talking about witches After the Salem witch trials were long in the past.
    Most who embrace the left are no longer "scared" of the Red Scare; the propaganda of today is 100% opposite of what Dulles and CIA propagated in the 50s... as many politicians (and intelligence objectives) in the US openly promote a communist-like revolution.

    These sentiments were alive and well in the 50s but mostly underground, as people in media and politics were afraid to air their beliefs for fear of the backlash and reprisal you mention. But the tide has changed. The USA of today looks nothing like the USA in the 50s….
    Last edited by T Smith; 6th August 2020 at 16:13.

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Quote Posted by silvanelf (here)
    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Quote Posted by silvanelf (here)
    Bill, you are promoting the Red Scare -- I think that you don't know what you are doing here.
    Well — just read through the 45 goals, one by one. Then, of course, you can decide for yourself.
    I've read through the "45 goals" before I posted my comment. I found the list utterly ridiculous, that's the reason why I called it "promoting the Red Scare."

    Quote ... and see for yourself which have largely succeeded, or are succeeding,
    That's a manipulative statement and you should know it. In other words, you are using a "loaded question" -- you failed to question the cause of these political and social changes. Many of them have nothing to do with any alleged "communist infiltration."
    Well do you care to explain the specific reasons why you merely think this is promoting a supposed red scare rather than answer along the lines of 'because I said so.'

    That's a serious statement by the way. I would genuinely like to hear your counter-arguments. Just one example would suffice.

    As a starter for ten, we could take the promotion of repulsive and vicious artwork as just one of the means of demoralizing a population. I could list plenty of such examples where this has happened in the UK alone. Take the statue of a bisected pregnant woman on a Devon beach as just one example:

    https://www.devonlive.com/news/devon...-damien-597690

    This does nothing to uplift and inspire citizens, it serves only to crush them psychologically. These statues, which require a significant sum of public money to erect are not built for fun. There is an agenda behind them.
    Last edited by happyuk; 7th August 2020 at 07:27.

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    Avalon Member Star Mariner's Avatar
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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Personally I have little good to say about communism, even an ideal version of communism, as a model of governance, past or present. It isn't compatible with my way of life, the way of life I want to live. And that's my choice.

    That said, I have my doubts about an actual communist take-over. As Edina said, there are other agencies involved here, other powers, operating under the guise of communism.

    There is no doubt in my mind that insidious forces do exist, and have long existed in the shadowy background, which have been working to undermine western democracy, social cohesion, personal freedoms, spiritual truth, etc - working against them in every conceivable way as insinuated by those 45 bullet points. The goal, basically, is the dissolution of the sovereign individual and the creation of a one world government, a one world religion, a one world currency, a one world language, and so forth. However I suspect the nature of this conspiracy is less aligned with political communism as we understand it, and more with some sort of dark, secret society agenda, one deeply satanic in essence.
    "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
    ~ Jimi Hendrix

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    Madagascar Avalon Member silvanelf's Avatar
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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Quote Posted by Star Mariner (here)
    Sorry silvanelf I don't get it. Are you saying the things on this list aren't happening, or are you saying that even if they are happening it isn't necessarily a bad thing?
    Neither of them. I'm saying that many of them are happening, but on different grounds.

    The numbers 4., 5. and 6. from the list above:
    • Permit free trade between all nations regardless of Communist affiliation and regardless of whether or not items could be used for war.
    • Extension of long-term loans to Russia and Soviet satellites.
    • Provide American aid to all nations regardless of Communist domination.
    Financial institutions like IMF, World Bank or USAID are used by the US to manipulate and plunder the economies of other countries.

    If anyone believes that any foreign aid to Russia or China is due to a "communist infiltration" of the US, then this person is very gullible.

    Quote From the 1980s onward, one of the major aims of American foreign policy has been to make the world safer for US investment bankers. That might seem like an exaggeration until you look at the priorities of American economic policy as well as the actions of US-dominated international institutions like the World Bank and the IMF. The World Bank, though its International Finance Corporations, pushed emerging economies to set up capital markets. The posture was that more open markets were always better.
    https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2014...backfired.html

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    Madagascar Avalon Member silvanelf's Avatar
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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Quote Posted by edina (here)
    I came across an idea a few years ago of how the Pope created Islam as a way to counter the Protestant Revolution, which undercut the Pope's (Vatican's) power over the people.
    The Protestant Reformation began in 1517. On the other hand Islam originated in 622.

    You have a discrepancy by about 900 years.

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Quote Posted by silvanelf (here)
    Quote Posted by edina (here)
    I came across an idea a few years ago of how the Pope created Islam as a way to counter the Protestant Revolution, which undercut the Pope's (Vatican's) power over the people.
    The Protestant Reformation began in 1517. On the other hand Islam originated in 622.

    You have a discrepancy by about 900 years.
    Thank you silvanelf, it was in keeping with the idea itself of how one aspect of what is happening in the world often plays into other aspects of what is happening in the world that drives events in ways we don't often expect that I meant to express.

    I have been considering the potential relationship of the development of Marxism as a counter to the development of the idea of "a sovereign public" and "separation of powers" in republicanism, in the context of larger and longer global contests that preceded both.

    You can tell I'm still in process of formulating my thinking about this, because I'm not succinct in how I'm expressing it. I'm still researching and mulling over the ideas.

    Technically, my statement over-simplified the idea, and made the concept as expressed inaccurate. I read it years ago and it's been percolating in my mind since then. I went back to the original place where I read the idea and it was in context of a longer history, dating back to the Phoenicians.

    Another example would be some of the ideas expressed in Greg Hallet's books where Tavistock played a hidden but significant role in the rise of Hitler, Stalin, Churchill, WW1, WW2. In considering Hallet's ideas, I wondered if others, such as Mao, Pol Pot, even Xi Xinping had also been to London and perhaps influenced by Tavistock in ways similar to Hitler, and Stalin, as described by Hallet.

    Another example would come from a reading of the 100 Year Marathon, where over time it became apparent that China felt humiliated by the West in the Boxer Rebellion. This evidently influences their thinking in current foreign policy. The Chinese have a long memory, and have even reached centuries back into their own traditions to determine their strategy for relations with the US.

    It seems to me that there is this longer, broader range of events that often drive current events and influence actions in ways that we may not always understand. I'm willing to look outside the box a bit, and give this longer range view consideration.

    I'm not certain that this slow progressively gradual implementation of the 45 goals that Bill posted is really about nations, or even about ideologies.

    I went looking for the original place I read the idea, the author, JC Collins, takes a very long view of these events.

    Quote The Crown is not the British Empire. The British Royal Family are used by the Crown, much like other nations and people are used. It is my conclusion that the Crown is the reconstituted Phoenician Empire and its system of laws and city state governance structure. The Crown owns the vast majority of the world’s surface land and the people who dwell upon that land. All must be a part of the Beast system in order to participate in commerce and the purchase of goods.

    Sounds familiar, right?

    There is also building evidence that the Catholic Church was used to create the religion of Islam. It is probable that Islam was the tool used by the Crown (Phoenicians) to control the whole of the Middle East and its Arab peoples. Even the Seafaring People, who the Phoenicians used to invade and wage war against its enemies, evolved into the Jewish people of the modern world. The Hebrews, who absorbed much of the Babylonian religion, wandered without a homeland and were incorporated into the Phoenician forces as the mysteries Seafaring People of the Mediterranean.

    Both the United Nations and the Catholic Church have called for there to be a new international monetary system, and the call for a world government is getting louder. The Pope is even working towards merging all religions into one and is openly promoting the tenets of Islam and worldwide liberalism and multiculturalism.
    I think we may see action on that last line quite soon. I'm less concerned about religions and more about how religion is used to control people, and how it is often used to obscure our spiritual nature or place it under a religious control.

    JC Collins goes on to discuss the Protestant Reformation in relationship to the Crown control system.

    Quote The Protestant Reformation was an attempt by the forces of right-mindedness to counter the Crown and its growing institutions in the world. The Crown went to work on a counter-reformation and began a centuries long campaign against Russia and those who supported right-minded action based on integrity and honour. This war continues today, and until the Russian land mass is successfully conquered there will always be a beachhead from which the battles can be fought.

    All of the religions of the world suppress spiritual evolution. The Eastern religions still maintain some semblance of spiritual purpose, but the importing of these religions into the Western world is slowly corrupting them.
    He offers a bit more data supporting his thesis about the relationship of the Protestant Revolution as a counter to the Crown control through the Catholic Church in this post.

    To me, it's just another set of parameters to consider when looking at current events.

    I feel humanity has a choice to make.

    I do think now, not later, is the time to give this serious thought.

    This is what I think Bill's OP is about. I didn't read him as promoting anything, as he has been accused of by several people. Rather that Bill presented something written 60+ years ago as goals to be accomplished which has become quite evident today, as having been accomplished, or near accomplishment. And to what end?

    That in itself warrants serious consideration.

    I, for one, would not want to see the nuclear family destroyed. I'm quite concerned about the normalization of porn leading to the normalization of pedophilia. I don't agree with the implementation of those goals in our culture. I have serious concerns about our schools, academia and media.
    Last edited by edina; 7th August 2020 at 06:13.

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Communism/Marxism/Socialism is here in the states, and that's the important thing to note. I suppose on one level it doesn't necessarily matter where it came from. Whether it's arrived by way of the Soviet Union is secondary. I started a kind of woo-woo'ish thread suggesting it had a Satanic origin. Who knows?

    It's here. And that's the point. Some likely won't believe that until it's way too late. I continue to marvel at their cluenessness.

    It's making a hard, aggressive push. I would love to poo-pah it and pretend it had no chance of concretizing. I would love nothing more than to have that atitutde. But in the face of the unrelenting facts, it's impossible. It's bloody mainstream now, like T.Smith said. I don't know how anyone could possibly miss it!

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    The brief interludes in history when society is not controlled by corrupt autocratic bullies are rare, the west is just losing one of these interludes. It has been going for just long enough for the public to become complacent and forget that democracy is vulnerable and needs vigilance and occasionally may have to be fought for.

    The people who wrote the us constitution were trying to build in as many protections and checks and balances as they could, but corporate power is by-passing this. The aims of corporate power and the authoritarians who have infiltrated the left are congruent.
    we have subcontracted the business of healing people to Companies who profit from sickness.

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    Quote Posted by Baby Steps (here)
    The brief interludes in history when society is not controlled by corrupt autocratic bullies are rare, the west is just losing one of these interludes. It has been going for just long enough for the public to become complacent and forget that democracy is vulnerable and needs vigilance and occasionally may have to be fought for.

    The people who wrote the us constitution were trying to build in as many protections and checks and balances as they could, but corporate power is by-passing this. The aims of corporate power and the authoritarians who have infiltrated the left are congruent.
    I would only make one change to this post if I had written it. I would replace the word “democracy” with “sovereignty.”

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    Default Re: The 45 Goals of Communism

    It appears to me that the methods of Communism/Marxism are being used to facilitate the destruction of the capitalistic economic organization. Small business and the middle class is being effectively demolished in America. It does not mean we are headed for communism, because the "true believers" will be removed when they have served their purpose. Meanwhile, Progressive Agenda presents an expedient way to clear out many of the "old" ways of thinking. It was effective in Russia and China. Once maximum chaos has been achieved, the new Global Technocracy will step forward to restore a New World Order. Meet the new boss.... same as the old boss.

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