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Thread: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

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    United States Avalon Member onawah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    MSOM SPECIAL REPORT SR5: Exposure - The Electromagnetic Human Test - James Grundvig
    1,940 views•Sep 7, 2020
    Making Sense Of The Madness
    (Also posted here: http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...=1#post1376941 )
    Transcript here: https://johnmichaelchambers.com/5g-e...ic-human-test/
    Each breath a gift...
    _____________

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    Canada Avalon Member Ernie Nemeth's Avatar
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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    Bill:
    Quote My own frustration is that I've done my very best to explain things, taking great care with my posts for accumulated hours and hours and hours, and the reaction is [sometimes] that I'm just some kind of orthodox-science, limited-intellect, closed-minded authority figure.
    I hear you. I know where my allegiance lies. If it seems otherwise, I am sorry.

    I always root for the underdog, and here it seems I have done it again. But if the words are read carefully I agreed with not accepting the epidemic at face value.

    The fact of whether there is or is not an actual virus does not mitigate the very real fear the public has, or the confusion on how to respond to it. And because so much disinformation has mixed with the facts, it is not even clear that every response was and is still being implemented in various countries. From no lock down and no face masks to stage four dictatorial house arrest and Gestapo-type check points, everything has been tried.

    As far as can be confirmed, no specific response has had better results than any other, except that it is fact that the collateral damage from severe draconian responses has caused the most harm. Some of that damage can be reversed, some is permanent.

    It is also true that many are rethinking their lifestyles, and many are re-prioritizing what they consider important. It is unclear yet what consequences that will have. Indicators seem to point to major readjustments with a possibility of a profound impact on society going forward. Time will tell.



    Gracy May:
    Quote e: Scientific Materialism versus Truth
    Quote Posted by Ernie Nemeth (here)
    Maybe, just maybe, we can see better now why Wade says we must sing in the choir - because we must stand in solidarity. Without singing from the same hymnal, we are easily picked off one by one by our own biases and prejudices.


    Exercise great care in choosing the right choir then Ernie.

    If I find myself in a Walking Dead zombie apocalypse scenario, I know I need to get with a group to survive. But I'm not just going to choose any group, and it sure is heck won't be the one that's loudest, and trying to pressure me in.

    No way Jose, I'm going with a group that's playing it smart. The loud groups may indeed be good people, but loud just winds up getting people killed, and that's not what I'm looking for.

    I truly hope you never find yourself in a zombie apocalypse - but we have been given lots of training by Hollywood in that regard, haven't we?

    The chorus of the song that choir sings is the reality of dirt cheap unlimited energy that will catapult humanity into an entirely novel epoch of abundance and fulfillment. The verses speak of that future and attempt to clarify the need for unity in order to bring that reality to fruition.
    Some of the fine details are contentious to some but the meat of the matter is evident.


    Not sure why scientific materialism has to conflict with truth. It is merely another perspective, worthy of every consideration, so long as the bias of that perspective is kept clearly in mind. Every perspective has its blind spots and no one has a monopoly on truth.
    Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless — like water...Now water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend. Bruce Lee

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    Scotland Avalon Member greybeard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    I agree that not enough attention is given to what may well be the reason behind all this media fear mongering.
    Its good to look at Global Reset, New World Order and what may be going into vaccines.

    The thought that there is a plot to reduce the human population and to interfere with the DNA -- insert chips via injection is so over the top to not be believed by most.
    That does not make it untrue.

    I support most of what David Icke says I do not support the website in which the video I recently posted appears.
    Its policy--statements, takes away from another wise excellent video.


    New information put out by Onawah is very important.
    Her research second to none.

    I have long felt that the law --- legality - will be the main way to defeat the cabal.
    This is why I have reposted legal challenges which I have donated to.
    There is little mention of these legal challenges in the UK media.

    The media continues to fear monger as does the Government.


    Gatherings of more than six people at home to be banned again in England amid fears of second coronavirus wave

    https://uk.yahoo.com/news/gatherings...211232676.html


    Chris
    Last edited by greybeard; 9th September 2020 at 15:31.
    In general what I post, is, a "IS THAT SO?" Definitely maybe.

    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    Some fallacies of physics.

    Scientific materialism really kickstarted with Einstein’s dismissal of the aether theory.

    Wilhelm Reich didn’t sound too impressed with Einstein in his book ‘The Function of the Orgasm’. I’d always been put off reading this book because after the sexual revolution of the 60’s and today’s hedonistic society, well who doesn’t know about about orgasms? Turns out this book is way more than just his theories on sexual energy, it’s an autobiography of his entire intellectual career from his work as a psychoanalyst under Freud, to why he broke away from the psychoanalytical crowd and began his own career researching different topics.

    He was working as a psychoanalyst when Einstein’s theories were being promoted, of which he found Einstein’s theory of lifeless rocks floating around in space to sound a lot like the “return to the womb fantasies” his psychosis patients had been describing.

    There was an experiment that was conducted around that time. The Michelson-Morley experiment, which was set up to prove or disprove the ancient aether theory of physics. Einstein said of the experiment that if aether drift proved accurate his theory of relativity would “collapse like a house of cards”.

    James DeMeo has a great book detailing the controversy and shows how the harbingers of materialism falsified and ignored the results in order to keep their materialistic worldview intact.

    ============
    THE DYNAMIC ETHER OF COSMIC SPACE:
    CORRECTING A MAJOR ERROR IN MODERN SCIENCE
    ,
    by James DeMeo, PhD
    Over 400 pages with 100+ photos and illustrations, references, index and two appendices.

    The Cosmic Ether Changes Everything!

    The historical ether-drift experiments of Michelson-Morley, Dayton Miller and others yielded positive results for an ether wind and light-speed variations of 5 to 18 kilometers per second. Academic bias and erasure has misrepresented these facts for over 120 years, to the point that few dare question today. Scientist James DeMeo reviews the original documents and archives, exposing the facts which demolish nearly all of the post-ether astrophysical theories, including Einstein's relativity, the "big bang", "black holes" and quantum magic. Cosmic ether exists and moves in a creative gravitational spiral vortex, as the long-sought prime mover and life-energy. A must-read item for the professional scientist, educated layperson and student, in ordinary language with minimal maths.

    Part I, Cosmic Ether as Theory and Experimentally Confirmed Fact, includes 8 different chapters which firstly introduces the concept of ether, then details the late 18th and 19th Century experimenters who made its detection by increasingly sophisticated instruments. The interferometer experiments of Dayton Miller are introduced, exposing facts by direct quotations from their publications in mainstream science journals, of multiple positive detections of the ether. In most every case, from the early to the more recent ether-drift experiments, the cosmic axis of Earth's motion in space, in right ascension and declination were in close agreement with the Sun's motion through the galaxy, towards the star Vega. These experiments provide evidence violating a major starting assumption for Einstein's theory of relativity, showing that light speed is variable, depending upon direction in the cosmos.

    Part II, The Empire Strikes Back: Erasure, Mystification and Falsification of History, covers the rise of Albert Einstein's theory of relativity, and how he and his supporters managed to obscure and ignore the positive outcomes of the various ether-drift experiments. It also details the unethical "hatchet-job" against Dayton Miller's ether research, years after his death, by Einstein sycophant Robert Shankland, whose paper is still cited today as "definitive proof against Miller's ether-drift findings". That, it most certainly was not! Einstein's originally friendly, but later dismissive treatment of Miller is detailed, including his statements in private letters wherein he expressed deep concern that, if Miller's work was correct, then his theory of relativity would "collapse like a house of cards".

    Part III, Into New Territory: Additional Evidence for a Material, Motional and Dynamic Ether, Dr. DeMeo overview findings from different disciplines, for a biologically-active and water-reactive cosmic life-energy. These findings are very agreeable to those of the ether-drift scientists, who postulated a material entrained ether. Direct evidence for the cosmic ether and ether-wind, by other names, are shown to have cosmic motions nearly identical to the older ether-drift findings: the interstellar wind, dark matter wind, cosmic ray wind, neutrino wind, and so forth. Seventeen different cosmological factors with nearly identical cosmic azimuth directions are identified in this study, integrating the older ether-drift findings with modern astronomy! The serious implications for modern astrophysical theory are detailed, even while empirical astronomy and space science engineering remain unchallenged. All the post-ether astrophysical theories are shown to be mired in mysticism and unproven assumptions.

    The Dynamic Ether of Cosmic Space provides over 100 photos and graphical illustrations, with full references, an index, glossary and two Appendices. It is developed for the educated layperson and student, but most scientific professionals will find it eye-opening and refreshing.

    A dynamic cosmic energy in space changes everything, indeed!
    ============

    Out of the theory of relativity comes the world of quantum. Eric Dollard describes Quantum Mechanics as a “khazarian circle jerk” but that doesn’t stop the industry and the billions of dollars of funding that’s been injected into it.

    There’s an electrical engineer who proposes a debunking of the ‘double split experiment’. The wave/particle paradox that the world of quantum builds its foundations on. His evidence shows the paradox can be explained, not by light being both a particle and a wave, but simply by the limitations of the measuring equipment that records the results, which gives the illusion of their being both a particle and a wave.

    If so much of our modern understanding of science is built on false premises, does some of this confusion spill over into the world of viruses. Wilhelm Reich did some interesting work in his Book ‘The Cancer Biopathy’, which proposed a new theory of how disease enters and multiplies within the body. It’s no wonder his books were burned and censored after he was jailed and died in prison for his sins of questioning medical orthodoxy. But his research does prove there’s more to the phenomenon of disease than the majority of scientists that conduct today’s studies are aware of today.

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    Scotland Avalon Member greybeard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    "If so much of our modern understanding of science is built on false premises, does some of this confusion spill over into the world of viruses. Wilhelm Reich did some interesting work in his Book ‘The Cancer Biopathy’, which proposed a new theory of how disease enters and multiplies within the body. It’s no wonder his books were burned and censored after he was jailed and died in prison for his sins of questioning medical orthodoxy. But his research does prove there’s more to the phenomenon of disease than the majority of scientists that conduct today’s studies are aware of today. "

    Thanks for this Jake, not throwing the baby out with the bath water, we are indebted to science for so much.
    However, I think The Exome Theory is well worth investigating, any new theory will perhaps be rubbished by the establishment.
    Eventually it will be proved valid or otherwise.
    Professor Dolores Cahill said that the body is full of viruses waiting for something to trigger them.
    Dont know if she was alluding to Exome theory or not.
    All a mystery to me as yet but I am curious about this theory.
    Chris
    In general what I post, is, a "IS THAT SO?" Definitely maybe.

    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    Quote Posted by greybeard (here)
    "If so much of our modern understanding of science is built on false premises, does some of this confusion spill over into the world of viruses. Wilhelm Reich did some interesting work in his Book ‘The Cancer Biopathy’, which proposed a new theory of how disease enters and multiplies within the body. It’s no wonder his books were burned and censored after he was jailed and died in prison for his sins of questioning medical orthodoxy. But his research does prove there’s more to the phenomenon of disease than the majority of scientists that conduct today’s studies are aware of today. "

    Thanks for this Jake, not throwing the baby out with the bath water, we are indebted to science for so much.
    However, I think The Exome Theory is well worth investigating, any new theory will perhaps be rubbished by the establishment.
    Eventually it will be proved valid or otherwise.
    Professor Dolores Cahill said that the body is full of viruses waiting for something to trigger them.
    Dont know if she was alluding to Exome theory or not.
    All a mystery to me as yet but I am curious about this theory.
    Chris
    Just to clarify, I didn't suggest to throw the exome theory out altogether. It's more the notions of whether we 'catch' a virus from others, or like Delores cahill says, are pre-existing cells activated through internal and external environmental conditions.

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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    The sciences never having been my strong suit, I wasn't aware of that earlier origin of the term "scientific materialism".
    When I entitled this thread, I was thinking more along the lines of how I've been seeing the term used more recently, describing how profit has become the goal of so much science today, rather than arriving at truth, or improving the lot of humankind.
    I didn't realize Reich shared the same tragic fate as Tesla and so many other martyrs to Truth.
    May this crucible we are suffering through now lead to a new era where science becomes truly humanitarian rather than a tool and plaything for the greedy and power-hungry...
    As we are reminded of those heroes, we can at least send them all a silent message of gratitude for all that they sacrificed.
    My hope is that the more those of us who can see the forest for the trees expose the lies, the less self-sacrifice will be the price for revealing the truth.
    Thanks for your considered contributions!
    Quote Posted by Jayke (here)
    Some fallacies of physics.

    Scientific materialism really kickstarted with Einstein’s dismissal of the aether theory.
    Last edited by onawah; 9th September 2020 at 20:25.
    Each breath a gift...
    _____________

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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    Scientific materialism may break down in the micro world of quantum physics, and there may have been a wrong turning taken in early 20th-century science. But it works well enough on the macro level of everyday reality, in a court of law, for example, where corroborating evidence rightly takes precedence over intimate convictions. Forensic science is important in many ways known and yet unknown. One being Bayesian statistics applied to tax fraud: the numbers added up, but they were demonstrably made-up numbers. See this post.

    There are three areas where (deliberate) error, stealth and deception are strategic tools: warfare, crime, and government. In war, resistance fighters can make these things ethically justified when defending against an aggressor. Criminals use these devices to dodge responsibility by hiding their crime or making it look accidental. And governments have all sorts of layers of secrecy to paper over the gap between their promises and their action.

    Government and crime. This is an area that calls for full spectrum treatment. Whenever stealth is used, the forensic approach will be necessary. However, we have reached the point where in-your-face truth is being served up. Only the other day, the British government brazenly admitted in Parliament that it intended to break international law. This crime is not only in the mainstream newspapers, it is there in the official video parliamentary record.
    You don’t need to be a scientist to witness this in flagrante delicto. Here scientific materialist inquiry makes way for simple truth for the whole world to see and hear from the horse’s mouth. Something else we get to see: every week Boris Johnson stands squirming in parliament facing the opposition as if he were in the dock under cross-examination by the former director of public prosecutions Keir Starmer. See this post. In such cases, there is no distinction required between criminality and incompetence because you are dealing at best with criminal incompetence/negligence, which is incompetence with some degree of probable intent. The criminal element came to the surface the other day – only with a reversal of roles, with Johnson accusing Starmer of being a former terrorist (IRA) sympathizer.

    Here is a recent fairly trivial example. The other day, tennis champion Novak Djokovic was thrown out of the US Open for hitting a ball in anger that struck a line judge, after losing a couple of important games. Had it not hit anyone (in an empty stadium), he would have got off with a warning, but the punishment is automatic because it is always a dangerous thing to do. One of the challenges of this sport is learning to let off steam in ways that don’t hurt people, i.e. deal with internal issues with no external violence. Whatever the source or nature of the Covid virus, the elite are behaving exactly in the same fashion; they are losing their grip on the power game, and taking it out on people. They are totally out of line long before they begin murdering virus sufferers. The next question being, is that what they are doing?

    Note, the above is not a blanket statement. Pandemic precautions being what they are, i.e. things a fascist dictatorship might impose, a benevolent government (I believe they do exist) needs to make sure it is understood as acting in one’s best interests. Measures from lengthy hospitalization down to quarantining and face masks are not automatically equitable with stealing our freedoms, provided the threat is real.

    Government and warfare. Stealth is a weapon of war. In 1944, Eisenhower took every step to feint a landing across the Straits of Dover before landing in Normandy. What we are talking about here is the next level up: war by stealth. This is nothing new: the CIA has been conducting clandestine wars around the world for seventy years. Economics and political unrest have been the usual weapons, but even a pandemic is nothing new.

    I remember Macron saying at the beginning of the pandemic, ‘We are at war’. This begins to make some sense when we consider that a virus is another weapon of war, and would be an ideal one for a war by stealth. See this post.
    We have a good idea of the conflicting forces, but we are not always sure who or what is one which side. As I describe in the above linked post, the Covid virus is ambiguous. Is it a harmless virus with sometimes devastating effects, or a killer virus that is mostly pretty harmless. If it were human, it would be a secret agent, possibly a double agent.

    This is a grey area along a spectrum having scientific materialism at one end and absolute truth at the other. Absolute truth I take to be the totality of reality; relative truth an individual perception of that reality. What humanity needs is somewhere in between: a global truth that parcels together 8 billion individual perceptions, in other words a workable minimum of peace. This spectrum includes a parameter we call causality. At the causal end, you have scientific materialism, with particles of matter behaving causally. Of course, there comes a point when the tiniest particles turn out to behave acausally/unpredictably and science freaks out. At the acausal end, you have absolute truth, where everything is at the same time; I quoted Jack True: confusion is part of the process. The huge grey area in the middle I call concomitance.



    Things happen because everything happens. Causality is just our way of stringing them together and trying to make sense of the world. There may be an acausal link within a given particle/thing/individual. The virus as described above could go through both slits in the double-slit experiment. Likewise, Donald Trump might have two souls, making him a double agent, although on a different level than working for Russia. ‘Making America great again’ is a two-edged slogan. When was America last great? A very long time ago, some would say.

    I have a great deal of work to do on this subject of concomitance, but even within the domain of causality, a hidden cause or operative can always override an overt one. If you want to harm Putin, for instance, you could do worse that poison his main opponent and blame Putin. But then again, Putin could be using this as his excuse: he didn’t do it but the job was done. But then again… This is what happens when deception takes over.

    Here is an interesting thought from today’s Le Monde newspaper. (In French)
    In France, in late August, positive cases had soared to their April peak (and now are way above), and yet there are hardly any deaths (3% of the maximum rate) or even hospitalizations (4%). The article concludes by explaining how five times more tests producing the same number of positives suggests that back then there must have been not 7,000 cases but 100,000 – demonstrating both that back then the virus was fifteen times less lethal than supposed, and that the current numbers are still lower than in April, although up on June/July. Donald Trump says the same thing and is laughed at by all and sundry. Why? Perhaps because all and sundry are seeing his ‘other soul’ being dumb as usual. It would suit his smarter side to keep out of sight.


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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    araucaria
    I love your examples, very relevant.
    Chris
    In general what I post, is, a "IS THAT SO?" Definitely maybe.

    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    It seems clear that even among reputable scientists, the whole subject of viruses --whether they exist as defined, how they function, their origins, etc. is still controversial.
    For any individual, whether they are familiarized with the science or not, as Mike stated in a recent post (see that following), what you think about it often will just boil down to who you TRUST.
    Bill, you obviously trust Dr. Martenson while I and others here on Avalon trust other reputable sources who don't always agree with his analyses.
    I don't think that's necessarily because we are too simple minded or unfocused to understand what's going on, or because our priorities aren't in the right order, or we are too lazy to apply ourselves sufficiently to the task.

    It's all definitely very confusing, made all the more so by the fact that often the most profound testimonies come from experts like Dr. Andrew Wakefield, Dr, Andrew Kaufman, Dr. Judy Mikovits, whose credentials and reputations were generally held to be in high standing up until the time that they took the incredible risk of blowing the whistle, and then their reputations were smeared, their careers were ruined, their very lives were threatened.
    (Although in the long run, it has made their word all the more worthy of trust, imho, much more so than those sources who still are supported and paid and basically controlled by TPTB. )
    And all the more reason why the onus of so much confusion should not fall on the shoulders of questioners and dissenters, as confusion and obfuscation is obviously one of the goals of TPTB.
    Because the more distracted we are, the easier it is for them to continue with their NWO agenda, step by step, and masking and testing (no matter how ineffective or inaccurate) are obviously important steps in that agenda.

    I'm sure that's obvious to you as well, Bill, so I don't understand why those two aspects of the plandemic have become such a bone of contention here on Avalon.
    In the matter of masking, I personally trust the judgement and ethics of RF Kennedy Jr.;though he is not a scientist, he knows and works with many scientists personally and he and his team are devoted researchers.
    See:
    Quote Posted by onawah (here)
    RFKennedy Jr. in "Vaccines Revealed" brand new 2 part interview, Part 1 showing free online now
    I watched it and here are some of my notes:
    ON MASKS: Children's Health Defense (RFKJr's team) did a research project and they found that of the 80 studies on Pub Med, almost all said masks don't work. They work for bacterial infections, but viruses are too small and they pass right through masks.
    They are unhealthy because bacteria grows on them and they prevent the flow of oxygen.
    (The controversy around the efficacy/accuracy of the Covid testing rages on, but I won't go into that here; I think Greybeard has covered that very well elsewhere on this thread and elsewhere.)

    Bill, even though I don't always agree with your opinions, I don't think that you are "some kind of orthodox-science, limited-intellect, closed-minded authority figure" or I never would have remained here so long or also put in all the "great care and accumulated hours and hours" that I have.
    (I speak for others as well, I'm sure, but speaking just for me, it's to the point now where now my eyesight is suffering and I am developing symptoms of carpel tunnel syndrome and frozen shoulder in my right arm because of so much time spent on my computer.)
    But that shouldn't mean that we always have to align with your opinions or your idea about what Avalon is, Bill ( or anyone's on the staff), or otherwise be subjected to lecturing, ridicule, belittlement condescension, banning, etc.
    That's certainly much less the case here than on other forums, and I understand that, but it still happens here.
    Bill:
    Quote If that's what you think I am, after all this time, then please leave now. I mean it. Get the hell outta here. You've not learned a thing about myself or Avalon.
    If I'm wrong, then please feel free to unsubscribe me. You might actually be doing me a favor...!
    But I don't think there is any way that you can reasonably expect to dictate what someone else's idea of Avalon should be.
    And speaking for myself, no offense intended, but I didn't come to Avalon to learn about you or anyone else here (though that has certainly been part of the process) but to learn about what is going on in the world that isn't being covered by the mainstream media, and to compare notes and share information that helps in that process.

    Bill:
    Quote (whatever that is!)
    As to any questions regarding the intended topic of this thread, I was hoping the subtitle, which is "Follow the Science...or Follow the Money?" would make that more clear.
    Apologies if I failed in that.
    (We all bring our failings as well as our strengths to the forum--the lesson perhaps is in developing tolerance...)
    I did not fully understand initially that the term "scientific materialism" applied so much to theories in physics and that has probably caused some confusion.
    The way in which I have been hearing that term applied lately (and the way in which I intended it to be applied here) has had to do with the unprincipled manner in which science has been hijacked by those in the corporatocracy with the means to do so, in order to serve materialistic goals (and genocidal NWO goals) and firstly and primarily -- to earn profits in furtherance of those goals.
    Rather than in service to Life, and working in harmony with Nature.
    Instead, continually and arrogantly trying to improve on Nature or simply to corrupt it.
    And in so doing, to further corrupt and obfuscate the truth by censoring those who dissent and point out the fallacy in those misguided goals.
    So my goal is to gain more clarity as to which sources of information are which, and, inasmuch as there is confusion and division here on Avalon as to which is which, to help resolve that schism, and to identify where we may have been misled and misled to censor others who are attempting to lay bare the lies.
    I hope any confusion as to the intent and purpose of this thread has been cleared up now.

    Quote Posted by Mike (here)
    I was just telling a close friend that I've always felt very strongly about the dangers of 5G and vaccines, but if I was challenged on my beliefs I wouldn't be able to coherently explain them. Not too well anyway. Because my actual knowledge is quite limited.

    I think there's quite a few of us like that in the alt. community. In general we know a little about a lot; our intellectual ocean is wide but not terribly deep. We listen/watch plenty of videos - and videos are great! - but we're at work or puttering around the house and maybe not totally engaged. And in general we're not fact checking every last detail being uttered by the interviewee. Who has the time anyway? I'm describing myself here, and assuming - rightly or wrongly - that many of you guys are like me.

    So, in other words, I have strong feelings and intuitions based on the little I do know about certain things, but I wouldn't last 5 seconds in an intellectual debate on some of it. I even have direct experience of the weakening effects of WIFI - it's plagued me for years! - but I couldn't argue my points scientifically, or even begin to change the mind of someone who has combed the literature and found nothing to suggest any harmful effects.

    So I pick and choose my battles. Or I don't battle at all. I know what I know, and that's good enough for me. But if the goal is to convince others, I know I have to do better than tell my personal story or quote videos; I need facts, science, citations, studies, so forth. And fair enough.

    But that's not always as straightforward as it sounds; I'll concede that. It costs an enormous amount of money to do scientific studies - at least ones that will be universally recognized anyway - and the drug companies aren't exactly lining up to do expensive, potentially damaging studies to their brand. And even if they do, how can they be trusted? They can't be, and neither can the FDA, who are clearly and demonstrably in bed with them. So who can we trust? These days, information is so corrupted that it's difficult if not impossible to tell in some instances.

    The problem is, we simply don't know enough. And we don't all have the time to research it all. It doesn't mean we throw our hands up in the air and declare it all hopeless. We do the best we possibly can with the information we have. And that information, for the most part, should be scientifically based. But, due to the corruption of information, due to conflicts of interests, due to moral and ethical and financial corruption etc etc, we know that even that information will never be completely accurate...

    ...And that's where the intuition comes in. In this life, you have to just trust people sometimes. You can't go to medical school maybe, you can't do these studies on your own, you don't have access to a lab...so you have to trust the people that do. This isn't blind faith. I'm simply saying that after collecting as much info as time and energy allows on something, there will still be some blank spaces. And intuition usually fills that void. It tells you what info to seek out and who to listen to, among other things. And for each person it may be different, because we all have different challenges that may require different solutions.

    So science and intuition aren't necessarily at cross purposes. Science and so called "conspiracy" aren't always at cross purposes either. The mainstream media and the alt media aren't always at cross purposes. They can often work together, alchemically, to provide us with something resembling truth. I say "resembling" truth, because we may not always know for sure when it comes to things like 5g and vaccines, but we can get pretty close to sure maybe, if we're diligent and reasonable; and I say "resembling truth" because in some instances my truth might be your conspiracy, and vice versa. I gave the example earlier of how I'm weakened by WIFI; well some people just refuse to believe that. And that's ok, because this is largely an individual journey, and we all discover things in our own time and in our own ways. And we tend to discover the specific things we need to discover for our own personal journeys; that's how the universe seems to operate, from my perspective anyway.
    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Quote Posted by silvanelf (here)
    According to this article, scientists have analyzed 2,492 genome sequences of SARS-CoV-2 strains up to 30 March 2020.
    Update: the number of sequences done is now 51,998. (Probably >52,000 by the time you've finished reading this post!)

    The lab techniques to isolate the virus for gene sequencing are different from fast-track, thousands-in-a day, drive-thru clinical testing. (And yes, that testing is (a) misused, (b) misreported, and (c) a very blunt instrument.)

    My advice to [some] members reading this:

    Focus on government and international agendas. Not the science of what the virus is — because many posting, despite their good intentions, still don't understand this all very well.

    Those well-meaning folks are often just mixing everything up into a giant stirred-up stew that's
    1. frequently inaccurate or not fully accurate (and sometimes just plain wrong)
    2. confusing to many reading this stuff. (I've been told this by visitors.)
    And making one-sentence statements that "it's just like the flu" helps no-one. (Certainly not those who have the thing.) People were saying this in January!

    If people reading this don't fully understand what the heck a virus is after 8 months of discussion and an enormous amount of simplified, well-illustrated, publicly available information, the odds may be against suddenly having an 'Aha' moment and understanding it all now.

    My own frustration is that I've done my very best to explain things, taking great care with my posts for accumulated hours and hours and hours, and the reaction is [sometimes] that I'm just some kind of orthodox-science, limited-intellect, closed-minded authority figure.

    If that's what you think I am, after all this time, then please leave now. I mean it. Get the hell outta here. You've not learned a thing about myself or Avalon.

    Whether you think the virus is real or not, it's how the authorities are handling it all that matters. Nothing else.

    Get real, get focused, and get your priorities right.

    (whatever that is!)
    Each breath a gift...
    _____________

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  21. Link to Post #91
    UK Avalon Founder Bill Ryan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    Quote Posted by onawah (here)
    It seems clear that even among reputable scientists, the whole subject of viruses --whether they exist as defined, how they function, their origins, etc. is still controversial.
    For any individual, whether they are familiarized with the science or not, as Mike stated in a recent post (see that following), what you think about it often will just boil down to who you TRUST.
    Bill, you obviously trust Dr. Martenson while I and others here on Avalon trust other reputable sources who don't always agree with his analyses.
    I don't think that's necessarily because we are too simple minded or unfocused to understand what's going on, or because our priorities aren't in the right order, or we are too lazy to apply ourselves sufficiently to the task.

    It's all definitely very confusing, made all the more so by the fact that often the most profound testimonies come from experts like Dr. Andrew Wakefield, Dr, Andrew Kaufman, Dr. Judy Mikovits, whose credentials and reputations were generally held to be in high standing up until the time that they took the incredible risk of blowing the whistle, and then their reputations were smeared, their careers were ruined, their very lives were threatened.
    (Although in the long run, it has made their word all the more worthy of trust, imho, much more so than those sources who still are supported and paid and basically controlled by TPTB. )
    And all the more reason why the onus of so much confusion should not fall on the shoulders of questioners and dissenters, as confusion and obfuscation is obviously one of the goals of TPTB.
    Because the more distracted we are, the easier it is for them to continue with their NWO agenda, step by step, and masking and testing (no matter how ineffective or inaccurate) are obviously important steps in that agenda.

    I'm sure that's obvious to you as well, Bill, so I don't understand why those two aspects of the plandemic have become such a bone of contention here on Avalon.
    In the matter of masking, I personally trust the judgement and ethics of RF Kennedy Jr.;though he is not a scientist, he knows and works with many scientists personally and he and his team are devoted researchers.
    See:
    Quote Posted by onawah (here)
    RFKennedy Jr. in "Vaccines Revealed" brand new 2 part interview, Part 1 showing free online now
    I watched it and here are some of my notes:
    ON MASKS: Children's Health Defense (RFKJr's team) did a research project and they found that of the 80 studies on Pub Med, almost all said masks don't work. They work for bacterial infections, but viruses are too small and they pass right through masks.
    They are unhealthy because bacteria grows on them and they prevent the flow of oxygen.
    (The controversy around the efficacy/accuracy of the Covid testing rages on, but I won't go into that here; I think Greybeard has covered that very well elsewhere on this thread and elsewhere.)

    Bill, even though I don't always agree with your opinions, I don't think that you are "some kind of orthodox-science, limited-intellect, closed-minded authority figure" or I never would have remained here so long or also put in all the "great care and accumulated hours and hours" that I have.
    (I speak for others as well, I'm sure, but speaking just for me, it's to the point now where now my eyesight is suffering and I am developing symptoms of carpel tunnel syndrome and frozen shoulder in my right arm because of so much time spent on my computer.)
    But that shouldn't mean that we always have to align with your opinions or your idea about what Avalon is, Bill ( or anyone's on the staff), or otherwise be subjected to lecturing, ridicule, belittlement condescension, banning, etc.
    That's certainly much less the case here than on other forums, and I understand that, but it still happens here.
    Bill:
    Quote If that's what you think I am, after all this time, then please leave now. I mean it. Get the hell outta here. You've not learned a thing about myself or Avalon.
    If I'm wrong, then please feel free to unsubscribe me. You might actually be doing me a favor...!
    But I don't think there is any way that you can reasonably expect to dictate what someone else's idea of Avalon should be.
    And speaking for myself, no offense intended, but I didn't come to Avalon to learn about you or anyone else here (though that has certainly been part of the process) but to learn about what is going on in the world that isn't being covered by the mainstream media, and to compare notes and share information that helps in that process.

    Bill:
    Quote (whatever that is!)
    As to any questions regarding the intended topic of this thread, I was hoping the subtitle, which is "Follow the Science...or Follow the Money?" would make that more clear.
    Apologies if I failed in that.
    (We all bring our failings as well as our strengths to the forum--the lesson perhaps is in developing tolerance...)
    I did not fully understand initially that the term "scientific materialism" applied so much to theories in physics and that has probably caused some confusion.
    The way in which I have been hearing that term applied lately (and the way in which I intended it to be applied here) has had to do with the unprincipled manner in which science has been hijacked by those in the corporatocracy with the means to do so, in order to serve materialistic goals (and genocidal NWO goals) and firstly and primarily -- to earn profits in furtherance of those goals.
    Rather than in service to Life, and working in harmony with Nature.
    Instead, continually and arrogantly trying to improve on Nature or simply to corrupt it.
    And in so doing, to further corrupt and obfuscate the truth by censoring those who dissent and point out the fallacy in those misguided goals.
    So my goal is to gain more clarity as to which sources of information are which, and, inasmuch as there is confusion and division here on Avalon as to which is which, to help resolve that schism, and to identify where we may have been misled and misled to censor others who are attempting to lay bare the lies.
    I hope any confusion as to the intent and purpose of this thread has been cleared up now.

    Quote Posted by Mike (here)
    I was just telling a close friend that I've always felt very strongly about the dangers of 5G and vaccines, but if I was challenged on my beliefs I wouldn't be able to coherently explain them. Not too well anyway. Because my actual knowledge is quite limited.

    I think there's quite a few of us like that in the alt. community. In general we know a little about a lot; our intellectual ocean is wide but not terribly deep. We listen/watch plenty of videos - and videos are great! - but we're at work or puttering around the house and maybe not totally engaged. And in general we're not fact checking every last detail being uttered by the interviewee. Who has the time anyway? I'm describing myself here, and assuming - rightly or wrongly - that many of you guys are like me.

    So, in other words, I have strong feelings and intuitions based on the little I do know about certain things, but I wouldn't last 5 seconds in an intellectual debate on some of it. I even have direct experience of the weakening effects of WIFI - it's plagued me for years! - but I couldn't argue my points scientifically, or even begin to change the mind of someone who has combed the literature and found nothing to suggest any harmful effects.

    So I pick and choose my battles. Or I don't battle at all. I know what I know, and that's good enough for me. But if the goal is to convince others, I know I have to do better than tell my personal story or quote videos; I need facts, science, citations, studies, so forth. And fair enough.

    But that's not always as straightforward as it sounds; I'll concede that. It costs an enormous amount of money to do scientific studies - at least ones that will be universally recognized anyway - and the drug companies aren't exactly lining up to do expensive, potentially damaging studies to their brand. And even if they do, how can they be trusted? They can't be, and neither can the FDA, who are clearly and demonstrably in bed with them. So who can we trust? These days, information is so corrupted that it's difficult if not impossible to tell in some instances.

    The problem is, we simply don't know enough. And we don't all have the time to research it all. It doesn't mean we throw our hands up in the air and declare it all hopeless. We do the best we possibly can with the information we have. And that information, for the most part, should be scientifically based. But, due to the corruption of information, due to conflicts of interests, due to moral and ethical and financial corruption etc etc, we know that even that information will never be completely accurate...

    ...And that's where the intuition comes in. In this life, you have to just trust people sometimes. You can't go to medical school maybe, you can't do these studies on your own, you don't have access to a lab...so you have to trust the people that do. This isn't blind faith. I'm simply saying that after collecting as much info as time and energy allows on something, there will still be some blank spaces. And intuition usually fills that void. It tells you what info to seek out and who to listen to, among other things. And for each person it may be different, because we all have different challenges that may require different solutions.

    So science and intuition aren't necessarily at cross purposes. Science and so called "conspiracy" aren't always at cross purposes either. The mainstream media and the alt media aren't always at cross purposes. They can often work together, alchemically, to provide us with something resembling truth. I say "resembling" truth, because we may not always know for sure when it comes to things like 5g and vaccines, but we can get pretty close to sure maybe, if we're diligent and reasonable; and I say "resembling truth" because in some instances my truth might be your conspiracy, and vice versa. I gave the example earlier of how I'm weakened by WIFI; well some people just refuse to believe that. And that's ok, because this is largely an individual journey, and we all discover things in our own time and in our own ways. And we tend to discover the specific things we need to discover for our own personal journeys; that's how the universe seems to operate, from my perspective anyway.
    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Quote Posted by silvanelf (here)
    According to this article, scientists have analyzed 2,492 genome sequences of SARS-CoV-2 strains up to 30 March 2020.
    Update: the number of sequences done is now 51,998. (Probably >52,000 by the time you've finished reading this post!)

    The lab techniques to isolate the virus for gene sequencing are different from fast-track, thousands-in-a day, drive-thru clinical testing. (And yes, that testing is (a) misused, (b) misreported, and (c) a very blunt instrument.)

    My advice to [some] members reading this:

    Focus on government and international agendas. Not the science of what the virus is — because many posting, despite their good intentions, still don't understand this all very well.

    Those well-meaning folks are often just mixing everything up into a giant stirred-up stew that's

    1. frequently inaccurate or not fully accurate (and sometimes just plain wrong)
    2. confusing to many reading this stuff. (I've been told this by visitors.)

    And making one-sentence statements that "it's just like the flu" helps no-one. (Certainly not those who have the thing.) People were saying this in January!

    If people reading this don't fully understand what the heck a virus is after 8 months of discussion and an enormous amount of simplified, well-illustrated, publicly available information, the odds may be against suddenly having an 'Aha' moment and understanding it all now.

    My own frustration is that I've done my very best to explain things, taking great care with my posts for accumulated hours and hours and hours, and the reaction is [sometimes] that I'm just some kind of orthodox-science, limited-intellect, closed-minded authority figure.

    If that's what you think I am, after all this time, then please leave now. I mean it. Get the hell outta here. You've not learned a thing about myself or Avalon.

    Whether you think the virus is real or not, it's how the authorities are handling it all that matters. Nothing else.

    Get real, get focused, and get your priorities right.

    (whatever that is!)
    ~~~

    Natalie, I don't "trust" researchers that I read or listen to — in any subject. I do whatever work I have to to understand what they're saying, follow their logic or hypotheses, and then decide for myself whether their presentations are likely to be flawed or reliable.

    I do that with virology, ufology, astrophysics, cryptozoology, and quite a few other subjects I have knowledge of and/or are fairly well qualified to take a good close look at — including whether or not a missile took out Beirut harbor on 4 August.

    Others, through no fault of their own, aren't in a position to do that. So they rely on "trust" instead.

    Anyone is entitled to do that, and humans rely on interpersonal judgment and trust a very great deal: when choosing a romantic partner, or maybe considering a job offer, the purchase of a house or used car, or even when bartering in a market.

    People do that often using subtle cues, like tone of voice, facial expression, eye movement, and all aspects of presentation of just about anything at all. Even the music accompanying YouTube videos.

    We have to understand that most presentations are tying to "sell" something.
    For instance, an idea: many videos use persuasion in all its subtle aspects, and their goal is to persuade the viewer or listener to accept their ideas or worldview. And many people "buy" (or not!), just as if they were responding to a car salesman.

    But that's not science.
    That's something much more likely to let you down sometime unless you're VERY VERY good at it.

    You mentioned Chris Martenson, and he's one of the very few who does NOT do this. He presents research papers that anyone can read. He interprets others' ideas in a very user-friendly and easily-understandable way. He's not trying to persuade you of anything. The only axe he grinds is trying to get to some useful truth.

    Most others have an agenda that they're selling. Caveat emptor.

    That applies in the alternative media every bit as much as it does in the mainstream.
    You've said many times (and kudos for your honesty ) that you're no scientist. But that leaves you relying a great deal on trust. All I can say about that is that you gotta have that trustworthiness-evaluation skill down to a very high level to be consistently correct.And it works the other way round. Others DIStrust, for the same basic human-nature reasons — because they don't fully understand.

    So trust, or distrust, is all they can fall back on. That's closer to my original point.There are many people on Avalon who are arguing points based on trust, or distrust.

    But I'm actually trying to talk about truth — which was in the title of your thread.
    When it comes to truth, Natalie, you're really just guessing, and hoping that you're right. (And you may be! But I'm describing the process here.) And my process is different.

    I try to explain things so that people will understand, but then they don't trust me either — and we get nowhere at all. I might as well not try.Do you understand what I'm saying here?

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  23. Link to Post #92
    United States Avalon Member onawah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    Yes, I understand Bill, but I think that intuition and clairvoyance get very short shrift when it comes to comparisons and discussions about science.
    And that is why I think science and spirituality don't always meet all that well on Avalon.
    Shamans, psychics, and dare I say it, some INFJs (of which I am one) can arrive at truth without doing all that incremental work that science demands.
    Developing the third eye (Intuition) allows us to see reality more directly than the third chakra (Intellect) without always knowing all the "facts", and to connect the dots by what appears to intellectuals to be taking impermissible "short cuts".
    The developed crown chakra (Imagination) allows us to imagine what might be, without knowing precisely how to get there; seeing what the future might bring, and thereby that from the past which might be proven in the future to be false.
    Both demand a lot of focus too, though of a very different sort, and certainly a lot of work on personal evolution.
    Most people are operating from the first 3 levels, and so the higher levels are not as well understood or accepted.
    Highly developed intuition and imagination are by no means the result of intellectual laziness, though they may appear to be more effortless.
    In this age of materialism, people operating from the higher chakras don't get a lot of credit and often won't risk the ridicule they are subjected to if they make any claims to such abilities or share what they know to be true.
    When I speak of the process of finding who to trust, it's not just guesswork or trust in chosen authorities I'm referring to, it's also the use of those higher faculties in choosing who to believe, as well as gut instinct, which is also not without value.
    And I don't make any claim to having those abilities more developed than anyone else--but I will say that in many cases, there is an equal if not greater general lack of understanding about how and why there are ways of arriving at legitimate conclusions that can be just as, if not more valid than the intellectual process, which is what mainstream science is so very dependent on.
    The late Dr. Christopher Hills
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Hills
    wrote extensively on that subject, and he was very far ahead of his time.
    He described himself as operating primarily from intuition but he was obviously also very much an intellectual, so I think he must have had an ability to evaluate both realms quite accurately, judging from the prodigious amount of writing he did.
    Last edited by onawah; 11th September 2020 at 04:50.
    Each breath a gift...
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    Scotland Avalon Member greybeard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    I lke to cross reference hence posting experts with a whole lifetime in their field --experts who have been peer reviewed like Professor Dolores Cahill-- whose reputation has been smeared.
    To many similar cases to mention here.

    This post has numerous cross references
    Is his research to be doubted?
    http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...=1#post1377275

    COVID diagnostic test: worst test ever devised?
    by Jon Rappoport
    September 10, 2020
    https://blog.nomorefakenews.com/2020...-ever-devised/

    http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...=1#post1377275
    In general what I post, is, a "IS THAT SO?" Definitely maybe.

    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

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    Scotland Avalon Member greybeard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    Do we trust David Icke ridiculed for years but one of the best researchers there is?
    Dont acquiesce, one of the best pieces of advice
    Chris


    https://brandnewtube.com/watch/virus...ImyIF4Pdv.html
    In general what I post, is, a "IS THAT SO?" Definitely maybe.

    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

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  29. Link to Post #95
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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    Pursuing the ideal of ‘double agents’ such as viruses and presidents, the concept may also be applied to materialism, as being both an idea and a thing. Materialism is to be found on both sides of the ideological argument, in the form of Marxism in the East, in the form of the accumulation of wealth in the American dream. World conflict is derived from the fact that, as a concept, materialism is self-contradictory in that, as a thing, it has two expressions, namely communism and capitalism. Capitalists, those notorious idealists, are inveterate materialists. And communists, those notorious materialists, are notably idealistic.
    Hence, you see two forms of materialism: historical materialism (it’s the economy, stupid!), and dialectical materialism, which are both somewhat oxymoronic, as I shall explain. Scientific materialism is another oxymoron or ‘double agent’.
    Since dialectical materialism asserts the power of dialectics (thesis v antithesis > synthesis), then dialectics apply to the materialism concept itself. See this post. The antithesis of materialism being idealism, then this means that some idealistic element is injected into the process to take it to a higher level. The same happens with historical materialism, where the idealistic element is of course money. What was originally all about things and their exchange (barter) has turned into little more than an idea (numbers on a screen), materialistic wealth being the very real things that this funny money can buy. Scientific materialism is antidialectical materialism as practised by science, and comes unstuck when it discovers experimentally that not everything is matter as we know it. In other words, dialectics also apply to such antidialectical materialism, and you end up with some form of idealistic science.

    Another way of seeing this is to say that we abandon universals for the world of particulars. I know, this is to place the emphasis somewhat on the material: for an idea as to why and how this might be, see this thread, dealing with ‘scientific nihilism’. The universe is everything that is, or rather it is everything that is plus everything that is not, i.e. a synthesis of all things and all ideas, a synthesis of materialism and idealism. Such a universe by definition cannot be one of countless multiverses: it is all those multiverses taken collectively. So when scientists veer off in the opposite directions of cosmology and subparticle physics, they have totally drifted away from any kind of materialism towards pure idealism. Counter-intuitive, maybe, but see this post by Mike Gorman.

    The tentative working conclusion then has to be that, like the open-ended Richter scale, we are talking about an open-ended scale where universality is an abstract concept tending towards taking concrete form without ever getting there. Infinity seen as a process rather than a thing, where everything is infinitely tiny and infinitely huge at any level. On the Richter scale of destruction, somewhere around 15 (?) indicates an exploding planet. There will be values further down the line corresponding to an exploding solar system, an exploding galaxy and so on. On the other hand, this universal scale is one of exploding creation. The notion of Imagination explored by Jon Rappoport with Jack True covers the operation of endlessly creating reality, i.e. being ungrounded. For me the purpose of being ungrounded is… to be grounded in a better place for a better world. Since we are all in this together, our ambitious personal creativity will naturally be tempered by everyone else’s, leading unreasonably, perhaps, to disappointment. We should not be disappointed but keep going, because the synthesis of idealism and materialism is process, and confusion is part of the process. As many people have been discovering during lockdown, love in the abstract is all well and good, but being in the physical plane, we need the physical expressions of a kiss, a hug, a caress, a loving word. Let’s keep it simple


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    Scotland Avalon Member greybeard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    My field of expertise was psychology (Hypnotherapy NLP Psychotherapy)
    Hence I am well aware of agenda, motivation,conditioning -- perceived pay value.
    Aware of my own too, so restrict to the best of my ability.
    I see repetition, memes, subtle devaluation of posts.
    Not the slightest bothered as people are entitled to express in anyway they choose.
    In the media this is very evident to a retired profe ssional like me.
    But not so to Joe average --they see it as truth not propaganda.

    Funnily enough some of the best psychological advice is to be found in spiritual text.
    "You are never angry for the reason you think you are" ACIM

    It takes experience to look beyond the presenting anger and see what lies there, yet I dont make assumptions,
    Its up to people to investigate what they present to the world-- very few do.
    Most make the same mistakes over and over without seeing a pattern.

    The third eye has to do with pattern recognition.
    Intuition not to be dismissed lightly.

    So I hope now the focus goes on what is happening now in the world rather than science.
    Where is all this leading to, what can we do about it?
    Dont acquiesce.
    For UK people

    https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/323442/

    Chris
    Last edited by greybeard; 11th September 2020 at 09:05.
    In general what I post, is, a "IS THAT SO?" Definitely maybe.

    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    Repeatedly we are being presented with case stories of persons with these new symptoms that are being labelled as a novel virus covid19. It is told to be extremely contagious, for some even severe and deadly. But analyzing statistics it are rather exceptions who become that seriously ill from nothing else than the virus
    Naturopaths have their holistic approach of disease : “ the terrain is everything , the microbe is nothing”.
    I think that is right ( in sofar that one knows how to keep his terrain in good shape) but something important is missing : a holistic view of the population of the planet as a group.
    This group is trying hard , like in the Avalon forum, to find truth and as a result a better life and future. The group is trying to move into a higher spiritual state. But what if this process has been booby-trapped ? As in mythical tales were the soul has to cross a chasm with deadly danger?
    The group is like a body and some of its members are like cells who get extremely ill or even die.
    It is important to realize as a group that it is in such process.
    I am no New-ager and do not know if Gaia is one being, but there is the knowledge of spiritual inter-connectedness . Like the skin is one organ, but an ulcer or rash appears only in some places.

    What I have been missing in the reports of Avalon members who got the covid disease is a description of their daily lifestyle over the last years or longer. This to establish how their ‘terrain” may have been weakened.
    It was not revealed for Avalon’s Hervé , probably because it’s health privacy and as a security measure. But I just don’t believe that a bio-weapon virus makes it to a small remote village.
    From William Sanford we got more information but it’s still not enough to find answers why he specifically got this disease out of nowhere and not his family.
    The same for Frank V. We only know that he functions with full trust in computer science to analyze a virus where this science is used to keep the planet in a state of dependency and slavery.

    We have not sufficiently thought how these strange symptoms of a respiratory disease may have been triggered from the distant past.
    Some call this an archetypal influence. I appreciate that member Jayke makes a reference to that. It is certainly a good concept to understand what may be there. This whole covid virus story just does not make sense And that is proven by several members who resist the scientific explanations and the focus on a virus.
    The story starts to make more sense if one sees the struggle of the group as a whole and by looking at the virus as a symptom of underlying spiritual entrapment and hazard.


    I considered the following definitions:

    Archetype in Psychoanalysis:
    (in Jungian theory) a primitive mental image inherited from the earliest human ancestors, and supposed to be present in the collective unconscious.

    Holistic Medicine: What It Is, Treatments, Philosophy, and More
    www.webmd.com
    Holistic medicine practitioners believe that the whole person is made up of interdependent parts and if one part is not working properly, all the other parts will be affected. In this way, if people have imbalances (physical, emotional, or spiritual) in their lives, it can negatively affect their overall health.Mar 18, 2020

    Notes:
    - I could not study all posts on this thread and the controversy.
    - Do I have subjective reality about what I wrote. On a personal level yes, but we are still in the group process in my opinion

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  35. Link to Post #98
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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    The media highlights anything that spreads fear of the virus to the degree that people in UK are driving miles to be tested-- such is the belief in validity of the virus, hence my repetitive posts contrary to this being a valid accurate reliable test.

    You will not get the media highlighting the no of suicides, nor the number of people having adverse effects to wearing masks.
    My Ex a nurse of quite a few years and disgustingly healthy passed out at work through wearing a mask.
    She and other nurses comparing notes -- she is not alone in this.
    She not the kind of person to go on protests but the one in Edinburgh attracted her.
    A bus load from Inverness went.

    The media (u tube etc) does not delete posts advocating masks but deletes those of science on u tube stating, it is not healthy to wear one and the adverse effect on the Kids.
    So Im inclined to believe those who have reputations trashed and U tube presentations deleted --just too many professionals going against the official narrative that the virus is the most deadly thing since -- you put a name to it.

    Members are entitled to support wearing masks and that the test is ok, if that is their choice.
    Im posting information for guests -- not trying to influence members.
    Members are welcome to criticize my posts there in lies the value of a balanced forum
    Guests can make up their own minds too.
    Chris
    In general what I post, is, a "IS THAT SO?" Definitely maybe.

    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

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  37. Link to Post #99
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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    Quote Posted by greybeard (here)
    hence my repetitive posts contrary to this being a valid accurate reliable test.
    My emphasis.

    Quote Posted by greybeard (here)
    Members are entitled to support wearing masks and that the test is ok, if that is their choice. Im posting information for guests -- not trying to influence members.
    Members are welcome to criticize my posts there in lies the value of a balanced forum
    Guests can make up their own minds too.
    Chris.

    Stepping far enough back from this issue to see the forum as a guest may view it, there is something else you need to consider. The squeaky wheel doesn't always get the oil, often times the listener hears it to such great extent, that the sound begins to be ignored, and slowly fades on off into the backdrop of daily consciousness.

    I did some quick basic math, and of the 98 posts thus far in this thread, 27 are yours. Someone scrolling through this thread will see that smiling face of yours 28% of the time. You're even light years ahead of two others adament in these issues, with onowah's current post count here at 15 (15%), and delight at 9 (9%).

    Adding together the drumbeat of all three equals a whopping 52% of all posts on this thread, with you leading the charge!

    Chris (and others), often times less is more. Don't think for one second that everyone in the general vicinity, from passing guest to members posting daily, don't know precisely how you feel about certain matters, and why.

    They've got it.

    Essentially what you're doing at this point by pounding that drum even more incessantly, is the exact opposite of what you're hoping for. Any more, rather than people curious to see your next opinion, they're just thinking to themselves "oh there he is again", and moving on to something else.

    You have a background in psychology? This is Psychology 101.

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  39. Link to Post #100
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    Default Re: Materialistic Science, Scientific Materialism... and Truth

    Perhaps a look at the number of posts advocating the use of masks and saying the tests are valid might give balance.
    Most times my posts are in response to these, they are not in isolation.
    Also look at the number of times per day the Government Memes come upon TV Papers Radio.

    Funnily enough Eckhart Tolle and other spiritual teachers have been saying identical things for many years.
    Thousands a week visit this thread to hear the same old.
    http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...=1#post1377288

    Of course you are correct in what you say Gracy May
    People can check my posts or not as the case might be -- freedom of choice.
    They do evolve with latest info on the subject from reputable sources.
    Its not just repeat of my opinion, which as said may be flawed.
    People have come to believe the propaganda of the official narrative, through being exposed to repetition
    Chris

    Ps We are at war --its not about proving anything --its about winning this battle against evil. Thats what beating a drum is about.
    Last edited by greybeard; 11th September 2020 at 12:10.
    In general what I post, is, a "IS THAT SO?" Definitely maybe.

    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

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