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Thread: If You Ruled the World....

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    Avalon Member Star Mariner's Avatar
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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    The key to a utopia is re-aligning the distorted human psyche and soul. See point Five.

    The very FIRST thing to be done is learn exactly what the reality is at the root of all the world’s problems. See all the conspiracy theories on this forum for a list of potentials, from alien infiltration to secret societies to archons or whatever it is. Get to the bottom of that rotten core.

    SECOND: Expose that truth for what it is. Expose the con that was the old political system, banking system, and bureaucracy. Expose the ruling families and hidden players for who they are and what they have done. Try them, convict them. Liquidate all their assets and distribute reparations worldwide.

    THIRD. Abolish the fractional reserve banking system. Abolish usury. End poverty, hunger, and all economic strife worldwide by redistributing global resources.

    FOURTH. Disclose, disclose, DISCLOSE. Disclose everything. I mean everything. All the secret files, the concealed hidden history of Humanity, all the classified truths and realities – but carefully, piecemeal over a couple of years. As part of that program share all classified information that describes and/or proves a spiritual reality. Promote spirituality and metaphysics as the new philosophical foundation.

    FIFTH. As above, put the brightest minds in the world in science and metaphysics to work, with the aid of perhaps alien tech, to create and develop a kind a "God-chair", in which a person sitting in said chair undergoes an existential glimpse of Eternal Soul, to link also with the Universe and God-source, to see/hear and convene with deceased loved ones.. This 'therapy', once rolled out world-wide for every person in the world to experience at least once, will grant the experiencer a vital connection to his or her higher self, interdimensional self, past lives, and karmic plan – and thus the spiritual reality.

    All fear of death would cease. All fear would cease. No more tears. Crime would cease. Power games end. Corruption would be made *impossible*. Darkness to Light. The karmic wheel will cease turning, and the soul of Humanity will begin to heal. Religion will be usurped utterly, and humanity will unite.

    SIXTH. Roll out the hidden tech. Roll out the free energy, end all dependency on oil. Roll out the miracle cures and ET technology – including space craft. Repair all the damage to the environment. Begin to establish a new world economy based on tangible resources.

    SEVENTH. Step down from my position. The world hereafter rebuilds and redesigns itself.
    "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
    ~ Jimi Hendrix

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  3. Link to Post #42
    United States Avalon Member Strat's Avatar
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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Quote Posted by Deborah (ahamkara) (here)
    No one has addressed (or really come to terms with) the use of force necessary in the welding of absolute power. You might be benevolent, but inevitably individuals and groups would organize quickly to challenge your hold on power. The game of power and the mechanisms of organizing people and society eventually come up against the problem of what to do with those who have no qualms about using violence. The power game played with others is a dangerous one!
    Truer words were never spoken. It's just a fact of life that you will eventually have to wield the stick. This has gone on for a very long time and I don't believe anyone else has a better answer. I often refer to this as an example, (while context would change and would skew the translation) the image could essentially be morphed into someone being arrested:


    I can't answer the question in the OP. Not to be snarky, but I feel it'd be ignorant to even try.
    Last edited by Strat; 24th October 2020 at 14:09.
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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    1. Eliminate passports - open travel worldwide
    2. Eliminate social security numbers and all forms of personal identification
    3. Eliminate all law except for the most basic required to preserve life and safety- have just enough of a legal system to oversee that
    4. Eliminate all money and forms of barter. Everything is free. Keep doing what you were doing before- without income. Need something? Go get it. Over time, initial greed would dissipate when the fear of not having dissolves. Crime would cease as well. Yes initially it would be chaotic. That would subside.
    5. Create a totally free, do as you will world without causing harm to others, treat all species humanely during their life and dispatch, make no attempt to manipulate or control others or society in any way and let life continue to evolve organically without restraint.
    “The World is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don’t do anything about it.”
    Albert Einstein

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  7. Link to Post #44
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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Quote Posted by Gracy May (here)
    Quote Posted by The Moss Trooper (here)
    I'm not sure how I'd go about installing peace and harmony upon this land if I was the Boss, but I do know this much.......

    I'd de-criminalise and regulate all drugs and educate, educate, educate about them, installing as much importance as maths and language into the school curriculum about them.

    ------------------------ WHAT'S GOING ON HERE? ------------------------------------------

    Are our post's now being edited without an explanation or notice?

    The above is only half of what I wrote??
    Nothing nefarious going on here.

    I did explain in the reason for edit at the bottom of your post, but perhaps you missed it. Anyway, here's what happened: I deleted Plissken Boon's post that you had quoted, because it was rude, and then took it out of your post as well, thinking what you were expressing could stand well enough on it's own without it.

    That's it, that's all that happened, hopefully this clears it up once and for all.

    Yep, Loud & Clear.

    I don't see the explanation at the bottom of my original post though.
    May your Spirit stay unbroken, may you not be deterred.

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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Right now we have a system of King of the Mountain whereby past winners can bestow favourable positions on their progeny. How about a 100% death tax, to level the playing field and force even sociopaths to give back to the society they benefited from -- no inherited wealth. Also, automatic profit-sharing for any and all employees. Universal free education and healthcare. No secret societies: clubs must publish their membership annually. Severe term limits on all public offices. Real anti-monopoly protections, with a death penalty for companies as well as people. No political parties. A chicken in every pot and 40 acres and a mule for everyone :-)

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  11. Link to Post #46
    Avalon Member The Moss Trooper's Avatar
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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Quote Posted by Star Mariner (here)
    The key to a utopia is re-aligning the distorted human psyche and soul. See point Five.

    The very FIRST thing to be done is learn exactly what the reality is at the root of all the world’s problems. See all the conspiracy theories on this forum for a list of potentials, from alien infiltration to secret societies to archons or whatever it is. Get to the bottom of that rotten core.

    SECOND: Expose that truth for what it is. Expose the con that was the old political system, banking system, and bureaucracy. Expose the ruling families and hidden players for who they are and what they have done. Try them, convict them. Liquidate all their assets and distribute reparations worldwide.

    THIRD. Abolish the fractional reserve banking system. Abolish usury. End poverty, hunger, and all economic strife worldwide by redistributing global resources.

    FOURTH. Disclose, disclose, DISCLOSE. Disclose everything. I mean everything. All the secret files, the concealed hidden history of Humanity, all the classified truths and realities – but carefully, piecemeal over a couple of years. As part of that program share all classified information that describes and/or proves a spiritual reality. Promote spirituality and metaphysics as the new philosophical foundation.

    FIFTH. As above, put the brightest minds in the world in science and metaphysics to work, with the aid of perhaps alien tech, to create and develop a kind a "God-chair", in which a person sitting in said chair undergoes an existential glimpse of Eternal Soul, to link also with the Universe and God-source, to see/hear and convene with deceased loved ones.. This 'therapy', once rolled out world-wide for every person in the world to experience at least once, will grant the experiencer a vital connection to his or her higher self, interdimensional self, past lives, and karmic plan – and thus the spiritual reality.

    All fear of death would cease. All fear would cease. No more tears. Crime would cease. Power games end. Corruption would be made *impossible*. Darkness to Light. The karmic wheel will cease turning, and the soul of Humanity will begin to heal. Religion will be usurped utterly, and humanity will unite.

    SIXTH. Roll out the hidden tech. Roll out the free energy, end all dependency on oil. Roll out the miracle cures and ET technology – including space craft. Repair all the damage to the environment. Begin to establish a new world economy based on tangible resources.

    SEVENTH. Step down from my position. The world hereafter rebuilds and redesigns itself.

    Your fourth point Star Mariner, bolded, is an excellent statement.

    What utter bastar*s keeping that info from humanity, can you imagine the path we would've gone down had it not been covered-up and kept for the benefit of a small cadre of humans.

    I'm assuming that the implications would be of a positive nature, energy, technology, spirituality........ But I'm open to the possibility that the info could've been kept secret for our own benefit, that there were/are malignant implications for humanity, but I highly doubt it.
    May your Spirit stay unbroken, may you not be deterred.

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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Quote Posted by Star Mariner (here)
    [...]
    SEVENTH. Step down from my position. The world hereafter rebuilds and redesigns itself.
    That's fine and dandy... but that would only happens if the Galactic Council backed by the Universe Council allows you to step down once convinced they have a suitable replacement for the position... which is, apparently, the position Kim Goguen claims to find herself in at the moment with the Life Force Restoration Plan which about exactly what your steps are about .
    Last edited by Gwin Ru; 24th October 2020 at 17:03.

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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Quote Posted by Mashika (here)
    Quote Posted by DeDukshyn (here)
    Corruption is not a primal part of human nature - it is a result of observing (thus learning) or thinking in rivalrous dynamics terms and believing it contains an advantage.

    Desiring the greatest output for the least input might be a primal part of human nature. That is why you only need to demonstrate a new type of "fire" - one that is both non-rivalrous, and a greater advantage to both the individual and collective alike, and the desire for a greater output vs lesser input can be tapped.

    As I mentioned earlier in a post, the transformation would be like caterpillar to butterfly. No butterfly desires to return to a caterpillar state once they realize that they are actually a butterfly and not a caterpillar.

    But that is why educational reform and not dictatorship is needed. I would hire the greatest minds and corporations to work on the problem of creating the system that gets us from here to there without top down dynamics, but rather encourage bottom up. Humans are in a ripe position to want strongly enough ha change on the systems that have not and are not working for us.
    You would have to erase all the entirety of human history for that to happen, but also, you would be the carrier of the "virus" from one generation to the new ones, along with other people who would begin the new process

    But then again, you are enforcing your own world view, which may or may not be correct in the end, but you have turned the entire world into a world that fits your views

    That you are incorruptible doesn't mean you had full wisdom

    If you look into Mr Bill's post
    Quote If you ruled the world — and were a totally incorruptible, benevolent dictator — what would you do??
    Never once he said anything about wisdom, or knowledge, or pure thoughts, or even wanting the best for the world

    Hitler and Stalin, Lenin and others were probably incorruptible, and many people before them, they also were benevolent, but only to the people they liked, and they were dictators also :D

    If you are a dictator, you need to enforce your views across the world, therefore, a power structure based on your ideals will be created, one that won't care about any other view but yours


    I am using terms and lacking details that aren't forwarding this conversation as much as I thought it would. My apologies.

    When I say that non-rivalrous dynamics are superior to rivalrous dynamics in our current environment can be demonstrated, then that is all that is required. Dictatorship and "forcing my will on people" is NOT required. It is a natural evolution or progression back to the state where sharing (as we learn as children in a household) is most often a superior dynamic.

    Once you demonstrate to people that they have more to gain by mutual cooperation than by greed, they will wnaturally want what gives them "more to gain" -- no dictatorship is needed at all. As long as it can be properly demonstrated.


    Let me give you a theoretical example and a real life one.

    Let's say in a mostly transparent society I am a greedy ass. I am corrupt. I steal from people, I don't help them when they need help because its not my problem. I amass "stuff" but I do not share with anyone. I am driven by greed and care only for my self. Now consider that we, as humans, are a very social animal and we have to work and live together. Now consider that in my life, because of my "corrupt" status, no one wants to help me, with anything, no one wants to collaborate with me, no one cares about me; If I get hurt, I am left for dead, If I get poor, I am left for dead, and the "stuff" I have acquired does not make me happy or give me fulfillment, because those things are benefits of being a social creature, and I have alienated myself from the society by being "corrupt", and the results of my corruption cannot bring me happiness. - note that the environment already has been made somewhat transparent through the process of "leveling the playing field" I referred to earlier.

    Now let's say my concept of "ownership" is much more like native americans before white man corrupted their ways. I don't own the land, the land owns me, I am free to travel. If someone needs to use one of my tools I have no problem sharing. I freely give away the things I no longer need to those who need it, and help those who need help. Now in my personal life, the respect, help, and sharing relationship I have with others will garner me love and respect from those people. Corrupt people won't feel the need to steal from me as much because I share my things. In a social society I will gain social status, and be loved and cared for by others in the society because of who I am. If I am an organization, my organization becomes more loved - an augmented form of capitalism can still work inside this system easily and take advantage of the same concepts.

    Which of these two is superior in a roughly transparent environment? Is it not obvious?

    That is why I keep emphasizing the demonstration. Once the concept of a superior system is taught and demonstrated (again, after the playing field has been leveled, by exposing the world's secrets to all and making all info fully and freely available) then people will say "I want that". I won't have to force them. It is the correction of culturally programmed western greed into our society.

    Its a correction to something that can be demonstrated as not working well --- hell its 2020 ... To steal a phrase from Dr. Phil: "How's it working for ya?" -- people are sick of how things are, they will embrace new ways, and doing it from the bottom up is not "dicatorship" -- in fact it is the opposite -- it is allowing the correction to occur. A government tends to be a reflection of its people - Iraq had a dictatorship, because that is what their people required and expected for leadership -- look how "democracy is going there ever since it was introduced? You can't force top down changes because they don't work. Enter: bottom up or rather simultaneous changes.


    A real life example:

    I follow computer enthusiast tech news and channels on Youtube, and have been since youtube was invented. In the distant past, it was not uncommon for rival tech channels to try to **** on other channels to claim their superiority over the other channels. It seemed to work for them in the short term, but the audience grew weary of the "one-upmanship" that took focus away from why they subscribed to the channel in the first place.

    Fast forward to 2020, and most of the tech channels endorse one another, give shout outs, invite their rivals on to their shows and channels, have friendly competitions, and fully support one another. Why did this happen? What happened to the greed and rivalrous dynamics? It was demonstrated that non-rivalrous dynamics were actually superior when some of these guys had the balls to actually try it out. No dictator forced this change. The thought occurred to someone, they tried it, and everyone loved the idea and the channel got more support as a result. Now it is not just commonplace in the Youtube "tech" world but it has become the norm. Again no one forced them to do this. It was demonstrably superior and people migrated to it and audience (the consumer) appreciated it.

    Once you have systems that are built around transparency, and you have demonstrated that non-rivalrous dynamics are superior in every way and a critical mass is reached in that recognition, then corruption is not something that is desired, or something that even works at all, and therefore will be generally avoided - unlike our current secretive and locked in western systems that support corruption. Note that the system I am referring to is not communism or socialism at all --- it is a new system that we have never tried before and incorporates aspects capitalism, socialism and communism, but the system is driven from the bottom and is self correcting because it is built on closed loop systems. A closed loop system is one that is 100% synergistic so that inputs and outputs are 100% balanced. Perhaps I should describe this better, but a closed loop system is naturally self correcting.

    If one tried to make these changes over a span of say 10 years, force would probably be needed. If you do it over multi generations, then it can flower on its own with gentle guidance as the desired way of being.

    again, note that I am not referring to communism or socialism. This is a new system - a new way of thinking that is recognized in the individual and it is the will of the individual that implements these systems. It would be a bit tricky, but this is why in my initial list I strictly stated that it requires input and feedback from all levels of society to create a plan that gets us there.

    In the current environment it is not impossible, in fact it might even be probable. but one thing is for certain, if we do not move relatively quickly to create and implement closed loop socioeconomic systems (which requires concepts I outlined above and more), then humanity is in for a long and extremely painful ride over the next millennia.
    Last edited by DeDukshyn; 24th October 2020 at 17:17.
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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Quote Posted by Satori (here)
    I'd dismantle all technology, divide all habitable land in a fair and equitable manner among all people, and encourage them to return to a state of nature, seek spirituality, restore the family and local communities, grow food, keep the water clean, etc..., and live in peace and harmony amongst themselves--regardless of race, greed, sexual orientation....

    I would ask that all disputes be resolved at a local level, and that the final "appeal", if necessary, be brought to me for resolution.

    I would have and enforce only two rules: 1) Do undo others as you would have them do undo you, and 2) do not intentionally do any harm to any person, creature or nature.
    Satori,
    If I may add, that we also need to be aware of the non_or sub_human element that are on Earth or may come to Earth
    in the future. That means we would have to have an army and here we go again one thing leads to another and
    the circle continues.

    But, I'm sure you would be prepared in advance as we all would having known this world as it stands at present.

    ES
    Question Everything, always speak truth...

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  19. Link to Post #50
    United States Avalon Member TargeT's Avatar
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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Quote Posted by Strat (here)
    Quote Posted by Deborah (ahamkara) (here)
    No one has addressed (or really come to terms with) the use of force necessary in the welding of absolute power. You might be benevolent, but inevitably individuals and groups would organize quickly to challenge your hold on power. The game of power and the mechanisms of organizing people and society eventually come up against the problem of what to do with those who have no qualms about using violence. The power game played with others is a dangerous one!
    Truer words were never spoken. It's just a fact of life that you will eventually have to wield the stick. This has gone on for a very long time and I don't believe anyone else has a better answer.

    I can't answer the question in the OP. Not to be snarky, but I feel it'd be ignorant to even try.
    I feel I addressed the issue very efficiently.

    Quote Posted by TargeT (here)
    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    If you ruled the world — and were a totally incorruptible, benevolent dictator — what would you do??
    Abrogate the position.


    This is the best example/definition of TRUE CAPITALISM (not what we have now):
    Quote Posted by DeDukshyn (here)
    I follow computer enthusiast tech news and channels on Youtube, and have been since youtube was invented. In the distant past, it was not uncommon for rival tech channels to try to **** on other channels to claim their superiority over the other channels. It seemed to work for them in the short term, but the audience grew weary of the "one-upmanship" that took focus away from why they subscribed to the channel in the first place.

    Fast forward to 2020, and most of the tech channels endorse one another, give shout outs, invite their rivals on to their shows and channels, have friendly competitions, and fully support one another. Why did this happen? What happened to the greed and rivalrous dynamics? It was demonstrated that non-rivalrous dynamics were actually superior when some of these guys had the balls to actually try it out. No dictator forced this change. The thought occurred to someone, they tried it, and everyone loved the idea and the channel got more support as a result. Now it is not just commonplace in the Youtube "tech" world but it has become the norm. Again no one forced them to do this. It was demonstrably superior and people migrated to it and audience (the consumer) appreciated it.
    But then, I'd be a pariah for mentioning that.....
    Last edited by TargeT; 24th October 2020 at 17:23.
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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Quote Posted by TargeT (here)
    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    If you ruled the world — and were a totally incorruptible, benevolent dictator — what would you do??
    Abrogate the position.
    Well, maybe you could run the planet in anonymity?
    For that matter, maybe someone/something already does? And maybe we just are unable to perceive the "big picture" benevolence.
    It sure doesn't seem very benevolent at times, though!
    "We're all bozos on this bus"

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    United States Avalon Member TargeT's Avatar
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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Quote Posted by Sue (Ayt) (here)
    Well, maybe you could run the planet in anonymity?
    For that matter, maybe someone/something already does? And maybe we just are unable to perceive the "big picture" benevolence.
    It sure doesn't seem very benevolent at times, though!
    We love to think of reality as only one side of the coin, duality is a trap and reality is not benevolent.

    The shadow exists everywhere, especially in "reality". We need to get FAR more comfortable with our ballancer, our shadow; until that occurs there will continue to be strife.

    I do not believe that the word "benevolent" should be applied to what ever reality is.. a system isn't kind to its formulas and parts and pieces, it's not cruel either... it just "is".

    Though perhaps that train of thought is too philosophically slanted, I've been a bit deep on Nietzsche of late.
    Last edited by TargeT; 24th October 2020 at 17:55.
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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Quote Posted by Gwin Ru (here)
    Quote Posted by Star Mariner (here)
    [...]
    SEVENTH. Step down from my position. The world hereafter rebuilds and redesigns itself.
    That's fine and dandy... but that would only happens if the Galactic Council backed by the Universe Council allows you to step down once convinced they have a suitable replacement for the position... which is, apparently, the position Kim Goguen claims to find herself in at the moment with the Life Force Restoration Plan which about exactly what your steps are about .
    I honestly have no idea what this is, or who she is. All the steps I jotted down was purely on the fly and done in about 20 mins.
    "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
    ~ Jimi Hendrix

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    The Restoration Plan for the Planet 6:17

    May 8, 2020

    SPEAK Project

    Kim Goguen discusses the design of her Restoration Plan which, shaped like an atom, consists of "project" rings fed by the Trust at the center. Exquisite!


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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Quote Posted by East Sun (here)
    Quote Posted by Satori (here)
    I'd dismantle all technology, divide all habitable land in a fair and equitable manner among all people, and encourage them to return to a state of nature, seek spirituality, restore the family and local communities, grow food, keep the water clean, etc..., and live in peace and harmony amongst themselves--regardless of race, greed, sexual orientation....

    I would ask that all disputes be resolved at a local level, and that the final "appeal", if necessary, be brought to me for resolution.

    I would have and enforce only two rules: 1) Do undo others as you would have them do undo you, and 2) do not intentionally do any harm to any person, creature or nature.
    Satori,
    If I may add, that we also need to be aware of the non_or sub_human element that are on Earth or may come to Earth
    in the future. That means we would have to have an army and here we go again one thing leads to another and
    the circle continues.

    But, I'm sure you would be prepared in advance as we all would having known this world as it stands at present.

    ES
    Perhaps I took Bill’s “trip into the light fantastic” too literally. I understood the premise to be the I, and I alone, would rule the world. I would have no competition or challengers to my plenary power and rule

    Given the fantastical nature of the premise, I provided any equally fantastical, response. All in fun I suppose.

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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Most Likely Fail

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    Quote Posted by Satori (here)
    Given the fantastical nature of the premise, I provided any equally fantastical, response. All in fun I suppose.
    Yes, it was intended as an all-limits-off, free thinking brainstorm. Not a joke at all, more of a creative exercise.

    We live in such a cage (with invisible bars, and which we're very acclimated to), we rarely think about what we'd like to really see happen — because most of our attention is always on what we don't want to happen.
    Last edited by Bill Ryan; 24th October 2020 at 22:45.

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    Quote Posted by DeDukshyn (here)
    Quote Posted by Mashika (here)
    Quote Posted by DeDukshyn (here)
    Corruption is not a primal part of human nature - it is a result of observing (thus learning) or thinking in rivalrous dynamics terms and believing it contains an advantage.

    Desiring the greatest output for the least input might be a primal part of human nature. That is why you only need to demonstrate a new type of "fire" - one that is both non-rivalrous, and a greater advantage to both the individual and collective alike, and the desire for a greater output vs lesser input can be tapped.

    As I mentioned earlier in a post, the transformation would be like caterpillar to butterfly. No butterfly desires to return to a caterpillar state once they realize that they are actually a butterfly and not a caterpillar.

    But that is why educational reform and not dictatorship is needed. I would hire the greatest minds and corporations to work on the problem of creating the system that gets us from here to there without top down dynamics, but rather encourage bottom up. Humans are in a ripe position to want strongly enough ha change on the systems that have not and are not working for us.
    You would have to erase all the entirety of human history for that to happen, but also, you would be the carrier of the "virus" from one generation to the new ones, along with other people who would begin the new process

    But then again, you are enforcing your own world view, which may or may not be correct in the end, but you have turned the entire world into a world that fits your views

    That you are incorruptible doesn't mean you had full wisdom

    If you look into Mr Bill's post
    Quote If you ruled the world — and were a totally incorruptible, benevolent dictator — what would you do??
    Never once he said anything about wisdom, or knowledge, or pure thoughts, or even wanting the best for the world

    Hitler and Stalin, Lenin and others were probably incorruptible, and many people before them, they also were benevolent, but only to the people they liked, and they were dictators also :D

    If you are a dictator, you need to enforce your views across the world, therefore, a power structure based on your ideals will be created, one that won't care about any other view but yours


    I am using terms and lacking details that aren't forwarding this conversation as much as I thought it would. My apologies.

    When I say that non-rivalrous dynamics are superior to rivalrous dynamics in our current environment can be demonstrated, then that is all that is required. Dictatorship and "forcing my will on people" is NOT required. It is a natural evolution or progression back to the state where sharing (as we learn as children in a household) is most often a superior dynamic.

    Once you demonstrate to people that they have more to gain by mutual cooperation than by greed, they will wnaturally want what gives them "more to gain" -- no dictatorship is needed at all. As long as it can be properly demonstrated.


    Let me give you a theoretical example and a real life one.

    Let's say in a mostly transparent society I am a greedy ass. I am corrupt. I steal from people, I don't help them when they need help because its not my problem. I amass "stuff" but I do not share with anyone. I am driven by greed and care only for my self. Now consider that we, as humans, are a very social animal and we have to work and live together. Now consider that in my life, because of my "corrupt" status, no one wants to help me, with anything, no one wants to collaborate with me, no one cares about me; If I get hurt, I am left for dead, If I get poor, I am left for dead, and the "stuff" I have acquired does not make me happy or give me fulfillment, because those things are benefits of being a social creature, and I have alienated myself from the society by being "corrupt", and the results of my corruption cannot bring me happiness. - note that the environment already has been made somewhat transparent through the process of "leveling the playing field" I referred to earlier.

    Now let's say my concept of "ownership" is much more like native americans before white man corrupted their ways. I don't own the land, the land owns me, I am free to travel. If someone needs to use one of my tools I have no problem sharing. I freely give away the things I no longer need to those who need it, and help those who need help. Now in my personal life, the respect, help, and sharing relationship I have with others will garner me love and respect from those people. Corrupt people won't feel the need to steal from me as much because I share my things. In a social society I will gain social status, and be loved and cared for by others in the society because of who I am. If I am an organization, my organization becomes more loved - an augmented form of capitalism can still work inside this system easily and take advantage of the same concepts.

    Which of these two is superior in a roughly transparent environment? Is it not obvious?

    That is why I keep emphasizing the demonstration. Once the concept of a superior system is taught and demonstrated (again, after the playing field has been leveled, by exposing the world's secrets to all and making all info fully and freely available) then people will say "I want that". I won't have to force them. It is the correction of culturally programmed western greed into our society.

    Its a correction to something that can be demonstrated as not working well --- hell its 2020 ... To steal a phrase from Dr. Phil: "How's it working for ya?" -- people are sick of how things are, they will embrace new ways, and doing it from the bottom up is not "dicatorship" -- in fact it is the opposite -- it is allowing the correction to occur. A government tends to be a reflection of its people - Iraq had a dictatorship, because that is what their people required and expected for leadership -- look how "democracy is going there ever since it was introduced? You can't force top down changes because they don't work. Enter: bottom up or rather simultaneous changes.


    A real life example:

    I follow computer enthusiast tech news and channels on Youtube, and have been since youtube was invented. In the distant past, it was not uncommon for rival tech channels to try to **** on other channels to claim their superiority over the other channels. It seemed to work for them in the short term, but the audience grew weary of the "one-upmanship" that took focus away from why they subscribed to the channel in the first place.

    Fast forward to 2020, and most of the tech channels endorse one another, give shout outs, invite their rivals on to their shows and channels, have friendly competitions, and fully support one another. Why did this happen? What happened to the greed and rivalrous dynamics? It was demonstrated that non-rivalrous dynamics were actually superior when some of these guys had the balls to actually try it out. No dictator forced this change. The thought occurred to someone, they tried it, and everyone loved the idea and the channel got more support as a result. Now it is not just commonplace in the Youtube "tech" world but it has become the norm. Again no one forced them to do this. It was demonstrably superior and people migrated to it and audience (the consumer) appreciated it.

    Once you have systems that are built around transparency, and you have demonstrated that non-rivalrous dynamics are superior in every way and a critical mass is reached in that recognition, then corruption is not something that is desired, or something that even works at all, and therefore will be generally avoided - unlike our current secretive and locked in western systems that support corruption. Note that the system I am referring to is not communism or socialism at all --- it is a new system that we have never tried before and incorporates aspects capitalism, socialism and communism, but the system is driven from the bottom and is self correcting because it is built on closed loop systems. A closed loop system is one that is 100% synergistic so that inputs and outputs are 100% balanced. Perhaps I should describe this better, but a closed loop system is naturally self correcting.

    If one tried to make these changes over a span of say 10 years, force would probably be needed. If you do it over multi generations, then it can flower on its own with gentle guidance as the desired way of being.

    again, note that I am not referring to communism or socialism. This is a new system - a new way of thinking that is recognized in the individual and it is the will of the individual that implements these systems. It would be a bit tricky, but this is why in my initial list I strictly stated that it requires input and feedback from all levels of society to create a plan that gets us there.

    In the current environment it is not impossible, in fact it might even be probable. but one thing is for certain, if we do not move relatively quickly to create and implement closed loop socioeconomic systems (which requires concepts I outlined above and more), then humanity is in for a long and extremely painful ride over the next millennia.
    Thank you, i understand perfectly what you mean, and thanks for explaining in such detail

    I had been posting all along from the point of view of the original premise, that of "if you were a benevolent dictator", which indicates that you have already somehow got into the top of a previous power structure and you have placed yourself as dictator of the world. That on itself indicates you had to get up there somehow, you see what i mean?

    I like what you described, i believe it would be a great thing to happen, i don't think it can happen right now, but maybe later on, with good schools, good parents are home (let's have some parents at home first lol) and good people all around the streets that don't abuse you because they see you out there trying to become someone on your own. Because i have seen tons and tons of people almost like zombies reaching out to anyone they can trying to harm their sense of worth and plenty other things

    I almost feel like it would require to completely eliminate and don't allow a bridge between generations, because ideas would still jump from one to the next generation, and grow from there again. That's another dangerous road, because i said before, who will plan this, who will continue after you and everyone you trust dies, how do you ensure it will continue on the right track, once you're not around anymore?

    This has been tested before, but as i said, it was from the point of a dictator, as Stalin did, he cleaned up all the people who was considered not worthy of the new future he envisioned, there was no other way in his eyes, that's what a dictator does. Hitler attempted a similar thing, the issue is that, to enforce this and turn the world around to what you believe is the best for the world, you would have to make it so that the people who are not fit for the new world, are not able to influence in any way, you can do this through generations, but how really? In order to educate new generations on your ideals, you first would have to somehow prevent this other people from also have their own plans and implement them, the world would be divided, how do you plan to make everyone fall into this agreement about education in the first place?

    I understand the closed loop system, but it also means that you have a variable that you need to control, so that the state is consistent with the results you want to receive back. And that, in the end, is programming, this is a complicated topic, human minds are not as easy to program such that the result is always the expected one, you would have to "clean up" the human race so that you receive a constant, stable output of the teachings, there will always be variations (people who don't conform), what would you do with them?

    NOTE: I'm not trying to go against you in everything you say. Wanted to make that clear, what i'm doing is, and you probably already know is, point out all reasons the approach could fail, so we can figure out and see why and how and what would have to change so that it would actually work

    I'm just curious to see what the end result would be
    Last edited by Mashika; 25th October 2020 at 02:05.

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    Default Re: If You Ruled the World....

    Quote Posted by Mashika (here)
    Quote Posted by DeDukshyn (here)
    Quote Posted by Mashika (here)
    Quote Posted by DeDukshyn (here)
    Corruption is not a primal part of human nature - it is a result of observing (thus learning) or thinking in rivalrous dynamics terms and believing it contains an advantage.

    Desiring the greatest output for the least input might be a primal part of human nature. That is why you only need to demonstrate a new type of "fire" - one that is both non-rivalrous, and a greater advantage to both the individual and collective alike, and the desire for a greater output vs lesser input can be tapped.

    As I mentioned earlier in a post, the transformation would be like caterpillar to butterfly. No butterfly desires to return to a caterpillar state once they realize that they are actually a butterfly and not a caterpillar.

    But that is why educational reform and not dictatorship is needed. I would hire the greatest minds and corporations to work on the problem of creating the system that gets us from here to there without top down dynamics, but rather encourage bottom up. Humans are in a ripe position to want strongly enough ha change on the systems that have not and are not working for us.
    You would have to erase all the entirety of human history for that to happen, but also, you would be the carrier of the "virus" from one generation to the new ones, along with other people who would begin the new process

    But then again, you are enforcing your own world view, which may or may not be correct in the end, but you have turned the entire world into a world that fits your views

    That you are incorruptible doesn't mean you had full wisdom

    If you look into Mr Bill's post
    Quote If you ruled the world — and were a totally incorruptible, benevolent dictator — what would you do??
    Never once he said anything about wisdom, or knowledge, or pure thoughts, or even wanting the best for the world

    Hitler and Stalin, Lenin and others were probably incorruptible, and many people before them, they also were benevolent, but only to the people they liked, and they were dictators also :D

    If you are a dictator, you need to enforce your views across the world, therefore, a power structure based on your ideals will be created, one that won't care about any other view but yours


    I am using terms and lacking details that aren't forwarding this conversation as much as I thought it would. My apologies.

    When I say that non-rivalrous dynamics are superior to rivalrous dynamics in our current environment can be demonstrated, then that is all that is required. Dictatorship and "forcing my will on people" is NOT required. It is a natural evolution or progression back to the state where sharing (as we learn as children in a household) is most often a superior dynamic.

    Once you demonstrate to people that they have more to gain by mutual cooperation than by greed, they will wnaturally want what gives them "more to gain" -- no dictatorship is needed at all. As long as it can be properly demonstrated.


    Let me give you a theoretical example and a real life one.

    Let's say in a mostly transparent society I am a greedy ass. I am corrupt. I steal from people, I don't help them when they need help because its not my problem. I amass "stuff" but I do not share with anyone. I am driven by greed and care only for my self. Now consider that we, as humans, are a very social animal and we have to work and live together. Now consider that in my life, because of my "corrupt" status, no one wants to help me, with anything, no one wants to collaborate with me, no one cares about me; If I get hurt, I am left for dead, If I get poor, I am left for dead, and the "stuff" I have acquired does not make me happy or give me fulfillment, because those things are benefits of being a social creature, and I have alienated myself from the society by being "corrupt", and the results of my corruption cannot bring me happiness. - note that the environment already has been made somewhat transparent through the process of "leveling the playing field" I referred to earlier.

    Now let's say my concept of "ownership" is much more like native americans before white man corrupted their ways. I don't own the land, the land owns me, I am free to travel. If someone needs to use one of my tools I have no problem sharing. I freely give away the things I no longer need to those who need it, and help those who need help. Now in my personal life, the respect, help, and sharing relationship I have with others will garner me love and respect from those people. Corrupt people won't feel the need to steal from me as much because I share my things. In a social society I will gain social status, and be loved and cared for by others in the society because of who I am. If I am an organization, my organization becomes more loved - an augmented form of capitalism can still work inside this system easily and take advantage of the same concepts.

    Which of these two is superior in a roughly transparent environment? Is it not obvious?

    That is why I keep emphasizing the demonstration. Once the concept of a superior system is taught and demonstrated (again, after the playing field has been leveled, by exposing the world's secrets to all and making all info fully and freely available) then people will say "I want that". I won't have to force them. It is the correction of culturally programmed western greed into our society.

    Its a correction to something that can be demonstrated as not working well --- hell its 2020 ... To steal a phrase from Dr. Phil: "How's it working for ya?" -- people are sick of how things are, they will embrace new ways, and doing it from the bottom up is not "dicatorship" -- in fact it is the opposite -- it is allowing the correction to occur. A government tends to be a reflection of its people - Iraq had a dictatorship, because that is what their people required and expected for leadership -- look how "democracy is going there ever since it was introduced? You can't force top down changes because they don't work. Enter: bottom up or rather simultaneous changes.


    A real life example:

    I follow computer enthusiast tech news and channels on Youtube, and have been since youtube was invented. In the distant past, it was not uncommon for rival tech channels to try to **** on other channels to claim their superiority over the other channels. It seemed to work for them in the short term, but the audience grew weary of the "one-upmanship" that took focus away from why they subscribed to the channel in the first place.

    Fast forward to 2020, and most of the tech channels endorse one another, give shout outs, invite their rivals on to their shows and channels, have friendly competitions, and fully support one another. Why did this happen? What happened to the greed and rivalrous dynamics? It was demonstrated that non-rivalrous dynamics were actually superior when some of these guys had the balls to actually try it out. No dictator forced this change. The thought occurred to someone, they tried it, and everyone loved the idea and the channel got more support as a result. Now it is not just commonplace in the Youtube "tech" world but it has become the norm. Again no one forced them to do this. It was demonstrably superior and people migrated to it and audience (the consumer) appreciated it.

    Once you have systems that are built around transparency, and you have demonstrated that non-rivalrous dynamics are superior in every way and a critical mass is reached in that recognition, then corruption is not something that is desired, or something that even works at all, and therefore will be generally avoided - unlike our current secretive and locked in western systems that support corruption. Note that the system I am referring to is not communism or socialism at all --- it is a new system that we have never tried before and incorporates aspects capitalism, socialism and communism, but the system is driven from the bottom and is self correcting because it is built on closed loop systems. A closed loop system is one that is 100% synergistic so that inputs and outputs are 100% balanced. Perhaps I should describe this better, but a closed loop system is naturally self correcting.

    If one tried to make these changes over a span of say 10 years, force would probably be needed. If you do it over multi generations, then it can flower on its own with gentle guidance as the desired way of being.

    again, note that I am not referring to communism or socialism. This is a new system - a new way of thinking that is recognized in the individual and it is the will of the individual that implements these systems. It would be a bit tricky, but this is why in my initial list I strictly stated that it requires input and feedback from all levels of society to create a plan that gets us there.

    In the current environment it is not impossible, in fact it might even be probable. but one thing is for certain, if we do not move relatively quickly to create and implement closed loop socioeconomic systems (which requires concepts I outlined above and more), then humanity is in for a long and extremely painful ride over the next millennia.
    Thank you, i understand perfectly what you mean, and thanks for explaining in such detail

    I had been posting all along from the point of view of the original premise, that of "if you were a benevolent dictator", which indicates that you have already somehow got into the top of a previous power structure and you have placed yourself as dictator of the world. That on itself indicates you had to get up there somehow, you see what i mean?


    Yes I see that point. But the plan itself doesn't require a dictator, I was just taking advantage of Bill's proposition that I get to be one . The concept does require a solid cooperative leadership of some sort though ... and unfortunately politicians are too busy being politicians to be leaders so we can't rely on them much, but once demonstrated in a small communities perhaps, they would be more willing to come on board with assistance.



    Quote Posted by Mashika (here)
    I like what you described, i believe it would be a great thing to happen, i don't think it can happen right now, but maybe later on, with good schools, good parents are home (let's have some parents at home first lol) and good people all around the streets that don't abuse you because they see you out there trying to become someone on your own. Because i have seen tons and tons of people almost like zombies reaching out to anyone they can trying to harm their sense of worth and plenty other things

    I almost feel like it would require to completely eliminate and don't allow a bridge between generations, because ideas would still jump from one to the next generation, and grow from there again. That's another dangerous road, because i said before, who will plan this, who will continue after you and everyone you trust dies, how do you ensure it will continue on the right track, once you're not around anymore?
    The pain we see being inflicted in this world is a result of us being 'off course', a result of us being made to be - un-natural from our core behaviour and instincts. Humans are extremely social animals, and a large part of the personal and behavioural issues we see plaguing this world stem from a type of "loneliness" - a feeling if being disconnected, that people seek to fill by being directed to consume "things" by the corporate world.

    But it seeks to correct itself, the path just needs to be "un-hidden" so the effort to sustain this requires a certain level of transparency to be established, to prevent the path from being hidden again. The over-arching concepts are simple enough that any layman can grasp and be motivated to work towards the goal. This, along with the transparency of an outline (something I did plan out in my original OP) would work to help keep it moving and non-corrupted.

    A global reset of some sort would certainly provide an opportunity to get something like this going more quickly and perhaps with a stronger motivation. I think the world's secrets would still need to be revealed to level the playing field and provide that base of transparency though. But I don't believe global reset / catastrophe would be a requirement, as long as a critical mass of motivation is reached one way or another.

    Since the ideas and concepts I put forth can be easily seen and demonstrated as superior, even if old ideas are re-presented, there's lots of evidence to say "no we already tried that and it isn't working" - the foundation of the new plan is different enough from what we have done previously (my apologies but there is much much more to the overall plan than what I have been able to infer on this thread - everything is synergistic) that any attempt to steer the plan back to ways that have failed us in the past will stick out like a sore thumb, and be identified -- especially if we have already established some newer systems with high levels of transparency.



    Quote Posted by Mashika (here)
    This has been tested before, but as i said, it was from the point of a dictator, as Stalin did, he cleaned up all the people who was considered not worthy of the new future he envisioned, there was no other way in his eyes, that's what a dictator does. Hitler attempted a similar thing, the issue is that, to enforce this and turn the world around to what you believe is the best for the world, you would have to make it so that the people who are not fit for the new world, are not able to influence in any way, you can do this through generations, but how really? In order to educate new generations on your ideals, you first would have to somehow prevent this other people from also have their own plans and implement them, the world would be divided, how do you plan to make everyone fall into this agreement about education in the first place?
    That's the beauty of it being demonstrably superior. Almost everything the western world does has a basis of rivalrous dynamics -- everything. It is programmed culturally into us from birth and that programming supports those dynamics in all our systems - from personal interactions all the way up to corporate decision making. If it is demonstrated that a new superior way of being, education systems, and leaders of countries will want to improve their systems, there will be innate desire to make these changes.

    Those groups who refuse to change might be ok with living in a weaker system, one that still pollutes their land, one that doesn't yield the same results ... but for how long? How long before a farmer who tills his land by hands inquires to his neighbour about how he plows his land with an ox? How long before they decide to share resources, inputs and recycling outputs for each other's benefits? Again, I am not seeing that much force is needed - once it can be demonstrated. Educations systems would automatically fall in line and evolve.

    Humanity has never really tried anything like this in conjunction with closed loop systems, and without a dictatorship. Again, I was just using Bill's proposition to take advantage of a way to lay some of this out. I don't think any dictator ship is needed, or even desired at all to implement this. It would require a bit of global cooperation, maybe some loss leading to establish proof of concept and create some willing communities to demonstrate it to get the critical mass of leadership and civilians on board for a global implementation.



    Quote Posted by Mashika (here)
    I understand the closed loop system, but it also means that you have a variable that you need to control, so that the state is consistent with the results you want to receive back. And that, in the end, is programming, this is a complicated topic, human minds are not as easy to program such that the result is always the expected one, you would have to "clean up" the human race so that you receive a constant, stable output of the teachings, there will always be variations (people who don't conform), what would you do with them?
    To address the first part, closed systems only need to worry about processes, not people. If the processes are designed properly, breaking the loops would be a difficult and obvious process, that could be easily identified and corrected.
    The second part I somewhat addressed further above.



    Quote Posted by Mashika (here)
    NOTE: I'm not trying to go against you in everything you say. Wanted to make that clear, what i'm doing is, and you probably already know is, point out all reasons the approach could fail, so we can figure out and see why and how and what would have to change so that it would actually work

    I'm just curious to see what the end result would be

    Playing devil's advocate is usually my prerogative, so thanks for taking that on
    Last edited by DeDukshyn; 25th October 2020 at 17:50.
    When you are one step ahead of the crowd, you are a genius.
    Two steps ahead, and you are deemed a crackpot.

  40. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to DeDukshyn For This Post:

    Bill Ryan (25th October 2020), Mashika (26th October 2020)

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