Dr. Bruce Goldberg - Techniques don't work for everyone... Anyone know why?

[realitycorrodes]

As with all spiritual salesmen who have books to sell, there is always alot of hype about the great inner journey, but as so often happens the techniques which are being touted to "so easily transport us to these inner worlds" don't actually work for the majority of people. Anyone know why? More often than not these people are peddling yet again another relaxation combined with their own customised visualisation with perhaps a breathing technique. At what point does imagination contained in the visualisation turn into some genuine experience. Does anyone know what the missing ingredients are? I know these basic things are enough for a small percentage to get direct experience but for the rest of us we are left feeling like we've just been patronised and treated like a complete idiot.

[greybeard]

Realitycorrodes that is an excellent question.
Ive been there and had disappointing results like the majority of people

The best answer I have found to it is in books by Eckhart Tolle and Dr David Hawkins also Anthony deMello.
Hawkins states that we are born with a unique spiritual vibration - an attractor field - and with in that field we have unique potential.
We manifest things into our life which is concordant with that potential.
I may have the desire to be a great tennis player and win Wimbledon but if I have one leg shorter that the other that is unlikely to happen.
I have to work with the raw material I am given. ie latent talent/ability.

De mello taught meditation as a Jesuit priest and maintained that everyone had some improvement in peace of mind and quality of life even though they did not have any "spiritual" experience during meditation.
Both Eckhart and Hawkins maintain that the problem is that we think we have to do something in meditation ie breathing technique, that may help, initially, to focus mind but has to be let go of.
When we try to force take control of the process the ego is very much in there in the disguise of the mediator. Im the mediator.
All labels have to go at some point for spiritual progress to continue.
The thought that I am a Buddhist, a spiritual seeker etc all these notions have to go, you are none of these labels you are pure soul.
Its a question of removing not gaining things so that the pure self shines forth illumined.
So in meditation the advice is just to sit there with eyes closed, watching, listening, experiencing without getting involved in what happens.

As far as manifesting goes, you can only manifest that which is in the same attractor field that you have, are in.
What you give out and spiritual intention dictates the spiritual vibration and hence what you draw to yourself.
If you give out love and kindness then that comes back to you one way or another.
Express negativity and thats what you get.
As the spiritual vibration rises through prayer, gratitude and meditation then the quality of life improves and manifestation happens more rapidly.

I would recomend "Power vs Force" by Dr Hawkins. In the book attractor fields are explained scientifically in great detail and a map of consciousness is given as a guide to that which is life supporting and that which is not.
Hope this helps
Chris

[realitycorrodes]

Thanks Greybeard for your answer. I can see you have thought about this. There is an assumption by such teachers as Eckhart Tolle that we are all the same. One size fits all - just live in the moment - works for everyone kind of thing. I could be wrong as I must confess I cannot read Eckhart Tolle and I can't listen to Dr Hawkins either for some reason - no offense intended. Just a personal thing. I like to pose the suggestion that has anyone considered for example that Eckhart Tolle has not had the experience he talks about in the beginning of his book and perhaps has made it up...as he knows that all most people need is to hear someone else's fantasy story and get told this can happen to them too...in order for them to buy books. Besides when I look at Eckhart Tolle or Dr Hawkins for me I just see two humans suffering just like the rest of humanity - I realise others may see enlightened teachers and I recognise their right to have a different belief in regard to this than me and that it is just as valid - I guess I may be looking for "PHYSICALLY" tangible results - different fruits from certain spiritual techniques...were as these characters are very cerebral, they talk a good talk, but their form of enligtenment can't be proven - ITS ALL IN THEIR HEAD. Often its a form of using the mind to overcome the mind, albeit by stilling the mind - its still working with the mind - as opposed to say Kundalini yoga where one can use the body to overcome the mind - no long winded ...hard to understand philosophical explanations about the intangible required! We can try their technique and prove something personal for ourselves, but can we know it is the same as their alleged experience? Also I would like to suggest that I sense that these experiences are perhaps not as sustainable as these teachers like to make out...what goes up must come down!

[greybeard]

I appreciate your response to my answer.
There is no quick way to evolve so to speak.
Its like a ladder, you step up from where you are.
The physical also appeals to me and have done yoga.
I am kundalini awakened but that came through the Grace of a Guru.
The states that alluded me came then if briefly.
I experienced bliss that lasted two days, and has returned several times unasked for.
I felt that I was loved.
A good teacher is a great help to take yo to the next stage-- rung of the ladder
In any meditation nothing seems to happen till about twenty minutes into it for me, then I feel very peacful.
Wishing you well
Chris

[realitycorrodes]

I have come across the old mind control paths stating stuff like...when one gets to a certain awareness they may realise the master that they thought was separate to them was really them. Its just that they at that particular time would never have believed they could actually do what this separate illusionary external master (who they have created for themself) did for them at the time. Whew, what a tongue twister! Just suggestions. Of course I admit to knowing nothing! Peace oh one with the greay beard!

[stardustaquarion]

Posted by realitycorrodes (here)
As with all spiritual salesmen who have books to sell, there is always alot of hype about the great inner journey, but as so often happens the techniques which are being touted to "so easily transport us to these inner worlds" don't actually work for the majority of people. Anyone know why? More often than not these people are peddling yet again another relaxation combined with their own customised visualisation with perhaps a breathing technique. At what point does imagination contained in the visualisation turn into some genuine experience. Does anyone know what the missing ingredients are? I know these basic things are enough for a small percentage to get direct experience but for the rest of us we are left feeling like we've just been patronised and treated like a complete idiot.

I was a teacher and used to do a lot of visualization journeys with the awaken your light body course from Da Ben and I must say you are 100 pct right that each individual has different distortions on their template and DNA. Over the years I practiced many techniques some worked for me and some didn't.

The fastest way to clear blockages are the techniques from the azuritepress, it takes persistance but boy! I have not meet a person that didn't felt something from the begining. In the groups section under Keylontic S there are links to many free techniques so you can experiment without spending a peny and also understand what the techniques are intended to do

[realitycorrodes]

Thanks stardustaquarion, I always wanted to know if anyone was getting any results from Anna Hayes Maharic Seal. I tried a few times but did not personally feel anything. I wonder why her courses are so expensive?

[justpeter]

Posted by stardustaquarion (here)
The fastest way to clear blockages are the techniques from the azuritepress.....

That's a sweeping generalisation if ever I heard one.

Scientology tech works and is demonstrable. I've read some of Tolle's books and if I remember correctly he just seemed to suddenly become divested of his ego and he had no idea how it happened. Since then he's spent his life trying to tell others how to do it but he didn't know how it happened in the first place. I'm sure he means well but personally speaking I'd rather have a technology that is demonstrable - "do this and you get this result".

Maybe the azuritepress have tech that works, I don't know, but I do know that Scientology has attracted millions of followers and the main reason they leave is because of the organization, not because of the tech.

Edit: Interestingly, in another thread stardustaquarion posted a list of all religions and religious philosophies that had been corrupted by aliens, according to Anna Hayes. The only ones that weren't on the list, as far as I could see were Anna Hayes herself, naturally, and Scientology.

[realitycorrodes]

Nicely put, justpeter. I have had the exact same thoughts on OneHeart Tolle. lol There is not enough corporate funding to take this stuff into the lab and do the double blind studies or similiar things if double blind can't be done. Its always the testimonials. Would it not be nice to get rid of the superstitious nonsense and just work out the technology...be it organic technology within the human body or external stuff outside? Just pondering. Alot of secrets perhaps...cos secrets give people power...the technology may very well be out there but it is just reserved for particular people. I have never understood why a yogi in a cave knows of a particular practice that can create bliss and love in someone but claims it has to be kept secret? Don't we need to get rid of this kind of secrecy and get these techniques out to our politicians as soon as possible?lol

[Vidya Moksha]

what is ananda? i can relate to tolle. Around 7-8 years ago i was also suddenly 'in the moment'. I had no concept of past or present (that i can now remember, this is how i remember it, and my memory is pretty good).. and i was in total bliss. i felt a connection to everyone in a way i cant explain. i thought everyone could see through my eyes and talking to anyone would convey the words to everyone, its so hard to explain, it was a feeling... the trip (no substances involved) lasted about 5 days... i believe it was triggered from the huge release when i gave away all that i 'owned' (farm, money, company) and just set off on foot....
its funny as i couldnt wear non natural fibres either so i was barefoot during this time....
it happened in the uk and around one of my spiritual homes .. a bit of a cliche im afraid, but on glastonbury tor is where i 'climaxed'.. i remember laughing a lot about 'how easy and simple the answer was'.
when i came down from the trip i was anxious, desperate even, to rediscover the place i had found but couldnt, and this is what started my trip to india in search of answers...and a 'method' to rediscover what i experienced.
i have never experienced this kind of thing since, but many people have told me i experienced a this or a that or the other....
i do realise intellectually that i will have to lose the search before i can find that place again.

but i couldnt begin to describe what happened and certainly couldnt give a method. but it was real and wonderful.

just be cautious in excluding something just becasue it is beyond your experience or current scientific understanding

also i am poor at visulation techniques.

(ps i am of the opinion there was a spiritual aspect to my trip in the true sense, a real spirit,in the form of a recently (at the time) dead friend.. think of that what you will, i am sure of it, through work with shamans, and work i can apply scientific tests to and know that 3 diferent shamans who didnt kno each other cant all tell me the same thing in such amazing detail without something going on.... none of them knew my tale or my history... interesting times....)

(pps this is also why i think 2012 is a hoax... one of the shamans was an amazing claivoyant, thats a really long story, but she told me of 2 prophecies of hers that i remember... (2012 was a non event, she told me that) but that israel would be flattened (this was 8 years ago) and that the vatican would start the next world war....this is a huge personal story, i havent done it justice here,,, just wanted to suggest people be more open, but not so open minded that their brains fall out)

[stardustaquarion]

Posted by justpeter (here)

Maybe the azuritepress have tech that works, I don't know

Desr justpeter, if you have not tried the techniques why try to put a bad spin on them? It is being negative for the sake of it

KS is in no way related to scientology, which are your bases for the comparison? If you had studied the KS material you will realize that scientology is not a recomended avenue

Yes we live in a up side down world where all that is official has been distorted and intended to keep us in the slave state that we are, you know that, everybody knows that

I am just relating my experience and the experience of many people that I know that have had great results. I am not recomending something I read somewhere

Not interested in a devate here so pick on other please

Love

[justpeter]

Posted by stardustaquarion (here)
Desr justpeter, if you have not tried the techniques why try to put a bad spin on them? It is being negative for the sake of it

KS is in no way related to scientology, which are your bases for the comparison? If you had studied the KS material you will realize that scientology is not a recomended avenue

Yes we live in a up side down world where all that is official has been distorted and intended to keep us in the slave state that we are, you know that, everybody knows that

I am just relating my experience and the experience of many people that I know that have had great results. I am not recomending something I read somewhere

Not interested in a devate here so pick on other please

Love

I'm not picking on anyone. I'm just pointing out that it's not a good idea to make such sweeping statements as one's favourite methodology being "the fastest". Nobody can say what tech is the fastest. It's not a debate or an argument, just a polite correction.

[stardustaquarion]

Posted by justpeter (here)
I'm not picking on anyone. I'm just pointing out that it's not a good idea to make such sweeping statements as one's favourite methodology being "the fastest". Nobody can say what tech is the fastest. It's not a debate or an argument, just a polite correction.

Ok, the fastest in my experience and the experience of a significant group of people, obviously. Is that better?

Love
PS I have been studiying spirituality for 35 years, read loads, experimented loads, I am a qualified "Awaken your light body" teacher which is quite tough. been traveling interdimenssionally for 7 years now.

[justpeter]

Posted by stardustaquarion (here)
Ok, the fastest in my experience and the experience of a significant group of people. Is that better?

Love
PS I have been studiying spirituality for 35 years, read loads, experimented loads, I am a qualified "Awaken your light body" teacher which is quite tough. been traveling interdimenssionally for 7 years now.

Thank you

[stardustaquarion]

Pleasure Justpeter enjoy the music!

Love

[annemirri]

Posted by stardustaquarion (here)

"Awaken your light body" teacher which is quite tough.

been traveling interdimenssionally for 7 years now.

What happens when you awaken your lightbody ? what is the lightbody ?

why do you want to awaken it ?

What do you mean by "travelling interdimensionally " ?
what happened seven years ago ?

a.

[annemirri]

I like to keep things simple, ask simple questions, as simple truths are the best...

Posted by realitycorrodes (here)
"so easily transport us to these inner worlds"

At what point does imagination contained in the visualisation turn into some genuine experience. Does anyone know what the missing ingredients are? I .

What kind of experiences are we talking about here ? a state of momentary bliss ?
losing one's ego, the self ?

or about tangible manifestation ? meaning phsyical things ?

One of the most important ingredients is to KNOW what you really want,
and go for it.

a.

[Niobe]

Interesting as I just went to an introductory presentation last night regarding the "Art of Ascension" as presented by the Ishayas. I naively went to listen, not knowing that they were selling their weekend workshop. I will say that it was a positive experience in that I did learn a new way of looking at the way our mind works that really made sense to me. I'd love to try to explain it (but that would cost you $300). No, just kidding. But that was the bottom line of their presentation: "We have an easy method to reach enlightenment, but only we can teach it and it will cost $300 for the weekend workshop". So disappointing as I am immediately turned off as soon as someone wants to charge exorbitant amounts of money for a technique to reach "enlightenment". If a person truly has a path that may help some, how can they justify charging tons of money for it? I just don't get it. The New Age community tied materialism into their philosophies by telling themselves that they are entitled to riches and should not be ashamed at charging people for their knowledge. That is the impression I have gotten anyway- as a justification for the fees.
In my community there is a man and woman that offer a guided meditation w/music session twice a month, which is absolutely beautiful, and amazingly, they ask for nothing in return, not even a donation. After leaving the first time I attended one of these, my friend and I both commented that we felt like we wanted to offer something in return to them for such a gift. That is the way it should be, imho.
Peace and blessings <3

[greybeard]

Regarding Eckhart Tolle.
He was genuinely looking for truth but in the wrong places.
When he had the thought "I can no longer live with my self" rapidly followed by the dualistic thought "is there two of me" that the answer to the question came -- removal of ignorance which is enlightenment.
If we seriously seek truth we will be given the right question and the answer.
Ramana (my avatar pic) recommended the question "Who am I?"

Dr David Hawkins was enlightened in a former life and ended up in the void which is not ultimate reality and came back for this incarnation to evolve into higher state.
Of course when we incarnate we forget why we incarnate and have to start over.

Science has now proven that everything is interconnected, some thing that the mystics have known for thousands of years,
The world of the mystic is formless non-duality - it is not possible to measure the non linear with the tolls of measurement of the linear world we live in.

Star has been on his path for a long time, he might agree that, bit by bit non truth is discovered and released-- not this not this. it takes time but when you read mystics throughout the ages all saying the same thing, then you tend to take heed.
I nether believe or disbelieve till I have cross checked and cross checked.
Enlightenment is valid as it is confirmed as subjectively experienced by many over thousands of years.
Many books and thirty odd years to crosscheck that and come to the belief it is so.
Chris

[stardustaquarion]

Posted by annemirri (here)
What happens when you awaken your lightbody ? what is the lightbody ?

why do you want to awaken it ?

What do you mean by "travelling interdimensionally " ?
what happened seven years ago ?

a.

Well it is called the light body, my understanding is that it makes the conection between the lightbody and the black matter body that corresponds to the complement or twin which is in a different particle spin. There is a point in the ribcage that takes you to the black matter body and after practicing for a while one starts seeing patterns, colours, flashes of light and there is the possibility to go to higher frequencies. There are also sets of frequencies that can be used to alter the patterns of what happens in our life. Everything manifested has a grid of scalar waves (sound) and dots (light). By altering the patterns one can alter reality, I have done it but the toughest thing is to find the pattern

Shamans do something similar with drugs but it is not necessary. The light body gets awakened with specific exercices that includes transmission of frequency. Frequency (sound) can only be transmitted by those that have it in their hologram

I guess that awakening is a personal call, for me it was the desire to go to other frequencies or dimenssions

To travel interdimenssionally one has to raise the frequency of the subtle body/(ies) and accumulate energy to propel the particle spin

Seven years ago I learned how to do interdimensional travel only bi-locating, but it is quite cool and builds up the harmonics of the DNA

std

Here there is a link http://www.orindaben.com/catalog/prodno/LB111/

Like with everything else, I personally like only the early LB course by DaBen. I have not tried any of the new stuff nor I am recomending any product, use your discernement