Freemasonry

[Rimbaud]

I would like to open a debate about FreeMasonry as I am an ex Grand Master of the thirty first degree..also an adept of the Rose Croix..in short I am a Mason supposedly a member of the Illuminati.

I joined the Freemasons mainly because I thought that I could do some good in this World. yes there are some dark proceedures in the initiation..but they're in no way Satanic..the first question asked of any of us is.."Do you believe in God" I answered !"" and writing this ,writing at this moment I feel bathed in HIS Glory.

I am NOT a member of the supposed Illuminati although Kerry would "Pidgeon Hole" me as a sort of Satanist nutter. I am none of the above..just a regular bloke, with a lovely Mum and Dad. I am however an extremely high ranking Mason..and am wondering where to distribute our money..I want to do it for the animals ..my Lodge members want the cash to go towards Kids.

Guys and Girls,

I'm so sorry to burst your bubble over Freemasonry..90% of what you read is not true and I'm more than happy to discuss or debate any questions that you'd like to ask.

Best Regards

Rimbaud

[perfectresonance]

As the saying goes... "be careful what you wish for"

But since you ask.

I have concluded some time ago, after research and after talking with masons directly, that "some Illuminati may have been/be masons, but virtually none of the masons know any specific esoteric knowledge that they keep to themselves and won't share with the world. So in that respect, I can concur - Masons are not evil, and if you take a while to study the ritual and know the reasons behind them, they aren't any more dark or strange than a Catholic eating a symbolic part of the body of Christ and drinking his blood. Symbolic cannibalism of your saviour doesn't seem to put off a lot of people, so I don't see why a symbolic death and rebirth ritual is somehow worse.

As for where your Lodge members want to spend the money, that's really for your Lodge members to decide. Our opinion doesn't matter as none of your funds came from our pockets through taxation or by means of having made promises as to what would be done with it.

Personally I'd favour the reduction of human suffering, the increase of opportunity for youth, and I'd think global but act local.

Go to your local college and talk to a student advocate/councilor. See if they can identify some people that are top notch but are having to drop out through financial hardship. Look through your neighbourhood for old, dilapidated or unsafe playgrounds. Visit your local food banks, city missions and night shelters and ask them what they are desperately short of. You'd be surprised how little can go a long way. Look for community volunteers that are angels on earth, but can do with better tools, transport, equipment.

And finally, well done for inviting open questions. Be prepared to have your patience tested

[Snowbird]

Rimbaud, please allow me to be the first to genuinely thank you for coming onto this board with intention for open discussion. I realize that you have the powerful support of your brothers and sisters within the Masonic Lodge. However, opening discussion such as this, especially on this particular board, requires an open heart and mind.

I think that for the most part, the population at large realizes and accepts the good works and truthful religious underpinnings of the vast majority of Freemasons. Most likely, 90-92% of those who have taken the oath are faithful to good works and to the God that they serve. I was quite amazed when I recently learned that the Rev. Dr. Norman Vincent Peale was a 33 degree Freemason.

My concern and most likely the concern of many others on this board, centers around those 8-10% of Freemasons that you and your brothers and sisters may not even know exist. It is, quite frankly, the secrecy of current and historical malevolent actions that bring these few Freemasons into the same spotlight that shines on the current and former benevolent Masons.

Some might wonder why I or someone else, would speak so freely and openly about a powerful group of mammoth historical proportions. It is because I envision a world into the future devoid of secrecy and unjust power over humanity. May I assume that this is the vision of our future that you and many of your brothers and sisters hold also?

You mentioned in your opening post that 90% of what is heard about the Freemasons is not true. Because I and any others who might join this thread discussion, are not involved with the Freemasons, it will be impossible for us to debate anything with you. We can however, discuss.

[3(C)+me]

[QUOTE=Rimbaud;13098]I would like to open a debate about FreeMasonry as I am an ex Grand Master of the thirty first degree..also an adept of the Rose Croix..in short I am a Mason supposedly a member of the Illuminati.

I joined the Freemasons mainly because I thought that I could do some good in this World. yes there are some dark proceedures in the initiation..but they're in no way Satanic..the first question asked of any of us is.."Do you believe in God" I answered !"" and writing this ,writing at this moment I feel bathed in HIS Glory.

Ok Questions for you Rimbaud;
1. Why did you quit? You say you are an ex Grandmaster, what happened?
2. I am told there are levels above 33 degree, true?.
3. I am told that Masons would build buildings with secret geometry within them to condiction the space. Secretly of course, so if this organization is not so bad, why all the secrets?. I am also told they have a bloodline to goes all the way to I think it was the Annunki? Yes? Are you a blue blood? Don't worry I will not freak out and probably deal with them daily and don't even know it.
Thanks,
C

[Majorion]

Posted by Rimbaud (here)
I'm so sorry to burst your bubble over Freemasonry..90% of what you read is not true and I'm more than happy to discuss or debate any questions that you'd like to ask.

Hi Rimbaud, in my experience what you say is true, the freemasons are just a fraternity really, who've been implicated in almost every major conspiracy to date. They are not "satanic", you're right about that, nor do they "control the world".

The thing that really bothers people is the secrecy, they never get; why all the secrecy. Frankly, anybody that interested could join a lodge just as a learning experience and actually see for themselves, before they judge.

The reason they ask you if you believe in god, during the initiation, is because its a requirement of freemasons to believe in a "supreme being" as they call it, no matter who or what deity, if you believe in something then you're allowed in.

I'm interested to hear, if you're willing to say of course, about how you became a thirty first degree mason, how the system works, will you explain what each level is about, how you "go through the ranks", what's so special with each level, how many levels are there, etc.

All the best,

[sunnyrap]

I'm very interested in this discussion, and have entered into this type of discussion with a number of other Masons with poor outcomes. My grandfather was a Mason, my grandmother an Eastern Star. My stepfather became a Mason and achieved the 32nd degree, but refused when they wanted to elevate him to the 33rd. He died 6 months after this refusal of a massive heart attack.

I have done a great deal of research about them and their history from a number of sources. Our founding fathers were Masons, and from their perspective, 'keepers of the truth'. Washington is considered by many to be an 'ascended master'. My grandfather was a highschool principle, staunch Baptist, and a good loving man and my grandmother a wonderful Christian woman. So I didn't have any bone to pick with Masons until I stumbled upon their dark side.

I live in a town that is nearly completely run by Masons. If you are not a Mason, your business will likely not survive or thrive. If one is a Mason, he can and may well have gotten away with capital crimes, here. It is well known and well documented that they have abused their acquired power terribly for many decades. This may be entirely to some bad apples spoiling the local barrel, but I've just run into too many instances of this elsewhere to believe that is so. It becomes the old 'power corrupts' and 'absolute power corrupts absolutely' story.

Whatever good intentions may have begun any fraternal order, subversion to power schemes seems to be an ever present hazard. I have to concur that any 'secret' order becomes a target for this. Any groupings based on exclusion seem to eventually corrode at the core. Just an observation.

[sunnyrap]

By the way, I was told that masons are not made privy to 'real' teachings until well after 33rd degree. I was also shown some of this material that is not revealed, and it is dark indeed. Very dark.

In his book, The New World Order, A. Ralph Epperson states:

The Masons know that they must conceal their horrible secret from the people. That secret is simply the fact that certain of their members worship Lucifer. And that they keep that secret from the overwhelming majority of their own members. And certainly the public is not to know this fact.

In this study we are going to show the connection between Eliphas Levi, one of the most prominent occultists of all time - and Albert Pike one of the most prominent Freemasons of all time. The degree of influence that Eliphas Levi had upon Albert Pike is so great that it should make any thinking Freemason pause to consider what he is involved in.

Albert Pike has been introduced to you as a Freemason; and Eliphas Levi as an occultist. The facts are: Albert Pike was an occultist and a Freemason; and Eliphas Levi was also an occultist and a Freemason. When seen in this light, the attraction that Albert Pike had for the bizarre writings of Levi is not so hard to understand.

The Dictionary of Satanism says of Levi:

LEVI, ELIPHAS French magician and author of works on the occult. Eliphas Levi, whose real name was Alphonse Louis Constant, claimed to have summoned up the ghost of Apollonius of Tyana in London in 1854. Born in Paris about 1810, he is said to have been reincarnated as Aleister Crowley.

Aleister Crowley was the most influential Satanist of all time and Eliphas Levi had such a profound influence on Crowley, that Crowley actually believed that he was Eliphas Levi reincarnated. The influence of Levi can be seen not only on Freemasonry, but also upon modern Satanism. It can also be said of Crowley that he was an occultist and a Freemason. John Charles Cooper said of Levi:

"He popularized occultism in Europe, and through Aleister Crowley, in America. Levi stressed magic as a means to power and emphasized sex and drug abuse."

¤=[Post Update]=¤

By the way, I was told that masons are not made privy to 'real' teachings until well after 33rd degree. I was also shown some of this material that is not revealed, and it is dark indeed. Very dark.

In his book, The New World Order, A. Ralph Epperson states:

The Masons know that they must conceal their horrible secret from the people. That secret is simply the fact that certain of their members worship Lucifer. And that they keep that secret from the overwhelming majority of their own members. And certainly the public is not to know this fact.

In this study we are going to show the connection between Eliphas Levi, one of the most prominent occultists of all time - and Albert Pike one of the most prominent Freemasons of all time. The degree of influence that Eliphas Levi had upon Albert Pike is so great that it should make any thinking Freemason pause to consider what he is involved in.

Albert Pike has been introduced to you as a Freemason; and Eliphas Levi as an occultist. The facts are: Albert Pike was an occultist and a Freemason; and Eliphas Levi was also an occultist and a Freemason. When seen in this light, the attraction that Albert Pike had for the bizarre writings of Levi is not so hard to understand.

The Dictionary of Satanism says of Levi:

LEVI, ELIPHAS French magician and author of works on the occult. Eliphas Levi, whose real name was Alphonse Louis Constant, claimed to have summoned up the ghost of Apollonius of Tyana in London in 1854. Born in Paris about 1810, he is said to have been reincarnated as Aleister Crowley.

Aleister Crowley was the most influential Satanist of all time and Eliphas Levi had such a profound influence on Crowley, that Crowley actually believed that he was Eliphas Levi reincarnated. The influence of Levi can be seen not only on Freemasonry, but also upon modern Satanism. It can also be said of Crowley that he was an occultist and a Freemason. John Charles Cooper said of Levi:

"He popularized occultism in Europe, and through Aleister Crowley, in America. Levi stressed magic as a means to power and emphasized sex and drug abuse."

[sunnyrap]

Freeman is the moniker of a man whose father was VERY high up in the Masonic order. Freeman is an internationally-known award-winning TV producer, film maker, radio talk show host and lecturer. Freeman is considered an expert in the fields of the occult, trauma-based mind control, government conspiracy, and ancient civilizations.
Freeman graduated with an Associates of Arts with honors in Interdisciplinary Studies and attended Kansas University, specializing in ancient and environmental architecture.

Freeman has lectured extensively on Templar history, secret signs and symbolism of Freemasonry, the ancient astronaut hypothesis, trauma-based mind control, and government cover-ups.

He has several videos on his website http://freemantv.whynotnews.eu/ dedicated to the story of the Masons.

[perfectresonance]

Posted by sunnyrap (here)
I live in a town that is nearly completely run by Masons. If you are not a Mason, your business will likely not survive or thrive. If one is a Mason, he can and may well have gotten away with capital crimes, here. It is well known and well documented that they have abused their acquired power terribly for many decades. This may be entirely to some bad apples spoiling the local barrel, but I've just run into too many instances of this elsewhere to believe that is so. It becomes the old 'power corrupts' and 'absolute power corrupts absolutely' story.

That's not a reflection on Freemasonry in total.

I've sat in a church where they said "Now, this is Steve, he's just joined us, and he's an electrician, from now on, all your electrical business comes to him".

If you don't like the community you're in, get out.

[Curative]

Welcome in Rimbaud,

IMO, no apologies required, as no bubbles were harmed during the making of your announcement. (not mine anyway)

It is of course potentially possible that; all Illuminati are Masons......But not all Masons (including 31st degree grand masters) are Illuminati.

Do you (personally) believe in a "secret elite" or "T.P.T.B" behind the faces in government and the N.W.O ?

[Ross]

Posted by perfectresonance (here)
That's not a reflection on Freemasonry in total.

I've sat in a church where they said "Now, this is Steve, he's just joined us, and he's an electrician, from now on, all your electrical business comes to him".

If you don't like the community you're in, get out.

Every town in Australia and New Zealand and I suspect the western world, have a Masonic Lodge, even the very small towns, My home town In NZ was totally run by masons, The Mayor, directors of power/water/telecommunications utilities( before all were sold) Dairy farmers Ass, All local councillors, Police cheif and officers, Doctors, right down to the local mechanics...they run the towns, Every town is the same. All the decisions made under the local council(usually voted) are masons. My father, Uncle and great Uncle 33rd, top in NZ before he died, were masons, I understand more than the average Joe, I will say this, most masons believe they are for the good of all and mostly live by this code, however most masons, 95% are not privy to the real 'whats going on' (compartmentalized).

Peace

[3optic]

Hi Rimbaud. I too have heard the same thing related to Free Masonry. I believe the OTO has higher rankings than 33. Crowley is a famed member of that lodge. I have heard the highest secrets are kept until the 40th degree. Thus the phrase "Life begins at 40."

Most of the current controversy over the Masons and their influence originates, I think from Scottish Rite Free Masonry and it's controversial figurehead Albert Pike. It seems to me there are a number of clubs, think tanks and lettered agencies that have more power and influence (See: Club of Rome, CFR, etc)

Is it possible you are no more privy to what goes on at the very top than an American Catholic Priest or Bishop would be of the highest practices in the Vatican?

This is a clip of an Alan Watt interview where he discusses this discrepancy with the daughter of a 32nd degree Mason. He is just a researcher but has claimed to have corroborated testimony from ex-members who are allegedly unaffiliated. He also likes book learnin'..

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=RLok74l-a5s

[blue777]

Posted by Ross (here)
Every town in Australia and New Zealand and I suspect the western world, have a Masonic Lodge, even the very small towns, My home town In NZ was totally run by masons, The Mayor, directors of power/water/telecommunications utilities( before all were sold) Dairy farmers Ass, All local councillors, Police cheif and officers, Doctors, right down to the local mechanics...they run the towns, Every town is the same. All the decisions made under the local council(usually voted) are masons. My father, Uncle and great Uncle 33rd, top in NZ before he died, were masons, I understand more than the average Joe, I will say this, most masons believe they are for the good of all and mostly live by this code, however most masons, 95% are not privy to the real 'whats going on' (compartmentalized).

Peace

I totally agree with what you say Ross...95% have been demonized...most have not got a clue whatis going on
lol

[steve_a]

Hi Rimbaud,

I really don't see why you started this thread. 'Real' Freemasons should stay in the background and not expose themselves. People say that within the Freemason organization there is another refined organization which is even more reserved. How would a Mason be invited into this inner circle if he manifests himself openly in public, telling to all and sundry about his degree status? How will he be trusted with deeper secrets if he can't keep the ones he knows? Jaques de Molay would be turning in his grave to think that the Freemason movement was being openly discussed on an internet forum.
Don't try and prove anything about Freemasonry. Let the people think as they wish. Whilst you're preocupied in what others think, you could be taking your eye off the ball.

Best regards,

Steve

[steve_a]

Hi cccme,

"so if this organization is not so bad, why all the secrets?"

Are we to arrive at the conclusion that ALL organizations with secrets are evil? How do you come to this conclusion?

Best regards,

Steve

[3optic]

Posted by steve_a (here)
Hi Rimbaud,

I really don't see why you started this thread. 'Real' Freemasons should stay in the background and not expose themselves. People say that within the Freemason organization there is another refined organization which is even more reserved. How would a Mason be invited into this inner circle if he manifests himself openly in public, telling to all and sundry about his degree status? How will he be trusted with deeper secrets if he can't keep the ones he knows? Jaques de Molay would be turning in his grave to think that the Freemason movement was being openly discussed on an internet forum.
Don't try and prove anything about Freemasonry. Let the people think as they wish. Whilst you're preocupied in what others think, you are taking your eye off the ball.

Best regards,

Steve

He did claim to be an ex Grand Master of the thirty first degree. Further he hasn't actually revealed his identity or any of his "secrets" which I'm guessing are a part of public record at this point. Thirdly, why should anyone care and what is the ball he needs to keep his eye on? The Great Work? Or is he supposed to infiltrate the organization on our behalf?

"so if this organization is not so bad, why all the secrets?"

Are we to arrive at the conclusion that ALL associations with secrets are evil? How do you come to this conclusion?

Good question, Steve. By implication AA may be a Satanic cult.

I think the problem people have though is not the secrecy per se but the membership of public servants to a secret organization that has an agenda that may be reflected by policies. Again, you can reference The CFR who, it seems to me are far more influential these days than the Masons and have a decidedly elitist and anti-democratic vision.

[steve_a]

Hi 3optic,

Most, if not all masonic secrets are out. Just have a quick browse on the internet and you will find thousands upon thousands of pages.
If there is an inner circle within Freemasonry, we must come to the following conclusions: There are some secrets which are probably the most powerful masonic secrets that exist; these secrets are given to only the most discreet few, so much so that the vast majority of Freemasons don't know that this inner circle exists.
Those conclusions being true, the thread author has just barred himself from being let in to this inner circle, as he is manifesting himself in a public forum as being a Mason. How can the inner circle trust someone who wishes to discuss what he knows - even if it isn't the whole truth - in public? That's why I mention keeping his eye on the ball. If he steps on the ball, basically his future in advancing within the Freemason organization would stop there.

I think the reason why people regard secret societies as evil doers is probably because: They haven't been included; they fear things they don't know; or if people think things that are not how they perceive them, automatically these people must be wrong. As for public servants being part of secret societies, one must find out first if these people were public servants before or after they joined these organizations. I think you will find the tendency of being a public servant before hand. Just as you or I would go out to a good film or restaurant with our work colleagues, so they may have been nvited to meetings by theirs.

Best regards,

Steve



"He did claim to be an ex Grand Master of the thirty first degree. Further he hasn't actually revealed his identity or any of his "secrets" which I'm guessing are a part of public record at this point. Thirdly, why should anyone care and what is the ball he needs to keep his eye on? The Great Work? Or is he supposed to infiltrate the organization on our behalf?"

[sunnyrap]

Simplistic solutions very often do not apply. And that is especially so in my case, as family obligations have kept me here. I do plan to leave this community in the near future, however. Meanwhile, I simply work with open groups on good causes I believe in, with the thought in mind of replacing the sole secretive, exclusionist groups with, open, community-minded wholistic groups. I take that back--sometimes simplistic solutions DO apply...

[3optic]

Thanks for the reply Steve. I am still confused as to your point of view. You seem to be suggesting he ruined his opportunity for advancement in an club (he is no longer a member of btw) that has a few esoteric tricks they can teach their senior members. Is this the ball you speak of?

I think the reason why people regard secret societies as evil doers is probably because: They haven't been included; they fear things they don't know; or if people think things that are not how they perceive them, automatically these people must be wrong. As for public servants being part of secret societies, one must find out first if these people were public servants before or after they joined these organizations. I think you will find the tendency of being a public servant before hand. Just as you or I would go out to a good film or restaurant with our work colleagues, so they may have been nvited to meetings by theirs.

I think there is another reason some have low regard for secret societies and that is they tend to be funded by people with ideas about how to run the world with methods most would find inhumane or immoral. Think tanks are often set up with the sole intention of misleading the public and to advance agendas that include wars, eugenics, looting economies and installing dictatorships. All the magic, Satanic hocus pocus is really secondary.

Now if they'd only invite me to one of those Bohemian Grove parties..

[steve_a]

Hi 3optic,

You're right, he "ruined his opportunity for advancement in a club" because the club is based on guarding secrets and he is wishing to openly discuss such. He is not necessarily an ex member. He is an ex Grand Master, not an ex Mason (although that could be next).

Just as one poster commented about secret societies being evil, merely because they are secret, you seem to be assuming that there is a tendency for secret societies to be funded by evil do'ers who want to change the world. Why do you think this way? Your assumption is based on what? Was Pol Pot a Mason? Idi Amin Dada was a Luciferian? Mao Tse Tung was a Skull & Bones?

Secret think tanks have nothing to do with secret societies. Secret think tanks are government backed and have nothing to do with societies as such we are discussing in this thread. So, for example, the Iron Mountain people were not part of a secret sect, but were a cross section of people who were asked to think in a certain way in a government backed program. Also this: http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/137157 backed by the "Washington Institute".

Of course we can discuss who is behind the governments. They normally are people behind big business and corporations who unfortunately think that they must expand to be successful at any cost. If you want to know who is trying to change the world, follow the money.

As the Tears for Fears song goes, "Everybody wants to rule the world".

Best regards,

Steve