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Thread: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

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    France Avalon Member Amzer Zo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    Quote Posted by shiva777 (here)
    you can only apologise on behalf of yourself...how can you apologise for someone elses behaviour in any meaningful way?..and what would make you want to,some kind of guilt?..I would never say I apologise on behalf of all men as they have not given me that right..did you hear Lucia apologise on behalf of all women for the way they have treated men after Bill apologised?..just some thoughts...
    Ever heard of taking responsibility? We are one? Holographic universe? Ho'oponopono?

    http://educate-yourself.org/zsl/hooponopono25jul06.shtml

    Then, may be, this world can be transformed.
    "La liberté de chacun s'arrête là où commence celle des autres"
    “There is a condition worse than blindness, and that is, seeing something that isn't there.” LRH

    The psycho's utter terror: "This universe is entirely composed -- but for one trivial exception -- of others."

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    Quote Posted by shiva777 (here)
    did you guys know that challenging situations and achieving a goal increases and utilises mens testosterone levels,thereby reducing their cortisol/stress levels,whereas for woman in those situations it DOES NOT reduce their stress levels...Womens stress levels are twice as high as mens in the workforce since they don't get the same stress relief through challenges...so men are HORMONALLY wired to be the leaders in challenging situations...it's important to HONOR the differences between males and females and be aware of the roles that each are more suited to doing...women react 8 times as much emotionally then men do when they are stressed.

    When men are feminised(which the new-agey movement is intent on doing in many instances)they don't rebuild their testosterone .........
    Who is asking for this? I think that is an over-interpretation of the interview. I think she is talking about a shift of energy, of not operatiing from the 3rd chakra and not just men either. From what I took from the interview is that we all needed to move into this chakra area for learning at a certain time in our history. The shift was needed and expected, but now we need to move into the heart chakra area and work more from that area. To me this resonates, I respect that this may not for others.

    I'm also unsure of why some are so focused on Bill's apology. Lucia didn't ask for that as I recall, seemed something Bill felt he needed to do and I honor his voice for speaking that. But it certainly wasn't expected or required.

    What has happened with the terms "new agey" "earth motherly" etc? When did these become such horrid things to be? In terms of main stream society I imagine most people would view you Shiva as New Agey. But to me it's not an insult. I'd rather be new-agey than main-stream any day of the week.

    So using your argument Shiva, it feels like you are saying that men are wired to be leaders, and that by taking that away power/leadership roles feminizes them? Seems like a huge, huge over generalization to me, as well as somewhat insulting for both men and women.

    I know many instances where the over generalizations just do not apply any more. I see it in my own children, it's more about honoring your soul than your gender. There are more and more boys who do not fit the old patterns, I see it all around us, it is shifting. I honor them and I don't see them as less masculine in any way. One of my sons became a devout vegetarian at 6 years old, believes that all insects are his friends and would not hurt anything living. It's who he came on this earth as, his true soul. I am in total awe of him on a daily basis.

    Shiva, I realize that it is difficult to convey some thoughts on an internets board, so if I come across as harsh towards you, I apologize right here and now. This is a very charged subject for me, and I'm certain I am operating from a more emotional viewpoint, it's just they way I'm wired.

    Much love you~
    Namaste~
    Di

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene


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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    post removed as it wasn't helpful to the discussion...
    Last edited by DianeKJ; 30th March 2011 at 02:29.

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    sorry to say
    - I find the interview full of generalities
    - 'Men' do this 'Women' do that (or 'are')

    'men' are 'this' and 'that', un-emotional, conditioned etc etc etc

    sorry
    I am not like that
    .. I met a few who are neither
    .. she really talks about the the generality of a 'macho' dickhead, yes, I met many of those
    .. I also met rather vile, nasty women, of the bloodsucker type, manipulative etc.

    I agree that a 'change' is coming forward concerning 'authoritarianism'
    but this change has been going on since year 0
    when men were real beast .. some

    she talks about the 'femenine era of 6000 (or something) year ago'
    .. I recognize this notion from feminist anthropology, and might be an exception rather than the rule

    what she doesnt distinguish is cultured, well behaved people
    .. who like and protect their daugthers
    .. who like, respect and protect their wives, loved ones
    .. and who have been around since year 0, when some - other - men were real animals
    .. but they were'nt

    in Holland there has been a lot of experience with 'empowering' girls, by lessons from 'female emancipators'

    and boy, can that go wrong
    (of course it can go right .. with all generalities out of the way)
    Last edited by majapahit; 30th March 2011 at 00:56.

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    i watched it again, all the way through,

    ive stated here before that i wouldnt spew negativity into a post i disagreed with,
    and ive had to check my own reasoning to see if i'm polarised or not. and i'm not.

    where my erm.... disagreement is, or the issue i have, is this...

    balance, is exactly that. neither one thing or the other.
    androgyny is balanced, and so is truth.

    but LR is blatently polarised to the side of the feminine.
    look at the title of the book 'Unplugging the Patriarchy'
    not 'unplugging the power structure'
    does she think that males have been empowered?
    i dont see TPTB as a patriarchy.
    they screw over all sides. man woman & beast.

    it was said that for a few thousand years there was a matri-linear structure,
    do you really believe that woman deftly handed control to the males,
    who then set about treating women in the worst ways possible?

    more likely power was taken away from women with force and not without reason, which may explain the subsequent castigation.

    we lay ourselves at your feet, we are at your mercy and you toy with us like a cat and a mouse.

    i noticed that there was no apology to bill for the damage that the matri-linear system, did to males before the patriarchy happened.
    not a mention of that at all.

    it was frustrating to watch, because when LR talks about energy and cyles etc, i completely agree with her
    but at the root of it all is this imbalance again.
    the truth is the truth. its applicable to both sexes, and as soon as you direct info at one gender,
    you create division, and also you create villains. the patriarchs.
    if its balanced, why is it directed at one sex?
    if women need to unplug from the patriarchy, what is it men have to unplug from?.
    i wonder what LR's reaction would be if there was a man living in a womans world,
    who had written a book called 'unplugging from matri-liniarity'
    feminism and sexual equality allowed women the freedom to do to men,
    what men had been doing to women for years, does that make it right?
    men have been well messed up by the system, because WE are the main body of resistance to it.
    this is why i say its a power structure, that grabs everyone, turns them inside out, and then puts them in the worst position possible..
    this thing doesnt care what sex you are. IT, is a breed of human that cares only for itself.
    i think LR's obvious bias towards women, is whats contradicting the statements of balance.

    i want the power structure removed. (the patriarchy) but i dont want the opposite put in its place.
    two wrongs dont make a right.

    true balance and androgyny doesnt care what sex you are.
    and if you have to localise something to one sex, its not balanced.

    i hope i havnt stepped out of line with this post.

    steve
    Last edited by SKAWF; 30th March 2011 at 02:22.
    when i went there nothing happened!, i was bored out of my mind..................in the Twilight Zone.

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    Quote Posted by DianeKJ (here)
    Honestly Nancy, much of your opinions appear far more sexist and divisive than anything I witnessed on the interview. I don't even know where to start with it. I realize now that I must step away from this thread, I'm far too frustrated by it all. Suffice to say that you are certainly entitled to your viewpoint and I will simply state that I don't agree with much of the above statement.
    You're correct, Diane. I am admittedly somewhat of a sexist here on the physical plane and with no gender preference in astral, causal and other dimensions. Here I have a bias towards men and male energy. Part of what I was pointing out about Lucia is that I believe she is also a sexist with a bias towards female energy and women. There is nothing wrong with her promoting the divine feminine and the unplugging of the patriarchy, but to say she is unbiased and non judgmental does not ring true to me... and I may be incorrect, which is also fine because I don't really care. She is what she is and I am what I am.

    I will not deny that I make judgments all the time. What's the point of pretending to be non judgmental and non sexist when we are living in duality and our perspectives are colored by our gender, our upbringing, our society, our life experiences and our environment. I have absolutely no problem owning up to my preferences and opinions and no problem with anyone who has a different opinion... AND I love a good argument! Divisiveness is in the eye of the beholder. To me a good debate is stimulating and increases my knowledge of others and myself.

    Nancy

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    Quote Posted by shiva777 (here)
    you can only apologise on behalf of yourself...how can you apologise for someone elses behaviour in any meaningful way?..and what would make you want to,some kind of guilt?..I would never say I apologise on behalf of all men as they have not given me that right..did you hear Lucia apologise on behalf of all women for the way they have treated men after Bill apologised?..just some thoughts...
    Probably the most important thing is that it made Bill feel good to say what he said, in fact that's the only important thing. If a person knows that we are all ONE then they are still only speaking for themselves even if they say it's for everyone or every man. Although I feel no need to apologize for anything I very much understand that it felt meaningful and good to Bill and to others who found it meaningful. I like that! We don't have to agree that an apology was necessary or desirable but I'm sure we can agree that there are a lot of different opinions and I say: vive la différence!

    Nancy

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    Quote Posted by NancyV (here)
    Quote Posted by DianeKJ (here)
    Honestly Nancy, much of your opinions appear far more sexist and divisive than anything I witnessed on the interview. I don't even know where to start with it. I realize now that I must step away from this thread, I'm far too frustrated by it all. Suffice to say that you are certainly entitled to your viewpoint and I will simply state that I don't agree with much of the above statement.
    You're correct, Diane. I am admittedly somewhat of a sexist here on the physical plane and with no gender preference in astral, causal and other dimensions. Here I have a bias towards men and male energy. Part of what I was pointing out about Lucia is that I believe she is also a sexist with a bias towards female energy and women. There is nothing wrong with her promoting the divine feminine and the unplugging of the patriarchy, but to say she is unbiased and non judgmental does not ring true to me... and I may be incorrect, which is also fine because I don't really care. She is what she is and I am what I am.

    I will not deny that I make judgments all the time. What's the point of pretending to be non judgmental and non sexist when we are living in duality and our perspectives are colored by our gender, our upbringing, our society, our life experiences and our environment. I have absolutely no problem owning up to my preferences and opinions and no problem with anyone who has a different opinion... AND I love a good argument! Divisiveness is in the eye of the beholder. To me a good debate is stimulating and increases my knowledge of others and myself.

    Nancy
    Well that's fair enough! I was actually coming back to remove my post since it served no purpose other than my vent. I suppose I'm not that great at arguing myself, I tend to just trip over my words.

    You are right, we all have our filters that we view the world from. I think I was probably able to look past some of her sexist comments towards men in the interview because I really enjoyed and agreed with her views on energy. If I were a man that may have been far more offensive. For the record I don't think we need to swing towards a matriarical society, that's out of balance too.

    Namaste,
    Di

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    Quote Posted by SKAWF (here)
    i watched it again, all the way through,

    i want the power structure removed. (the patriarchy) but i dont want the opposite put in its place.
    two wrongs dont make a right.

    true balance and androgyny doesnt care what sex you are.
    and if you have to localise something to one sex, its not balanced.

    i hope i havnt stepped out of line with this post.

    steve
    Your views and opinions are just as important, you are in no way out of line. Thank you for sharing it with us.
    -Di

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    It is my belief that the future of this world lies within the heart of women.

    I say this because women have been able to trust that part of ourselves that is wrongfully called intuition as if it is something extra or outside of the human spirit.

    Its not that women will replace men and start the same order as the patriarchy, but after women have broken free they could teach men and help them to trust that tiny little voice that women have listened to for centuries.

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    Quote Posted by DawgBone (here)
    Human beings reach their peak at about age 10 or 11. Totally delightful beings. Then, in a few years the hormones start kicking in, and it's all down hill from there.

    Testosterone may have been useful when we had to battle saber-toothed tigers. I can't see that it is of much use these days.
    Try coming out of a late night movie with your goddess and having 4 guys demand your wallet and then comment on what they want to do with her.

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    Quote Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
    Quote Posted by DawgBone (here)
    Human beings reach their peak at about age 10 or 11. Totally delightful beings. Then, in a few years the hormones start kicking in, and it's all down hill from there.

    Testosterone may have been useful when we had to battle saber-toothed tigers. I can't see that it is of much use these days.
    Try coming out of a late night movie with your goddess and having 4 guys demand your wallet and then comment on what they want to do with her.
    I thought that is what your light saber was for???

    Listened intently for the Sound of One Hand Clapping ... only to hear the sound of the other hand Whacking me Upside the Head!

    Don't forget to take the time each day to smile.

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    I got that what we are going through is a normal part of the cycle where we are transiting from the male paradigm to one of loving balance.

    I found that reassuring. I hope I find it reassuring right up to the cliff edge she mentions.

    I ordered the book <evil grin> and I hope to pull a few plugs .

    Just call me a power mad mystic.
    Last edited by Sierra; 16th September 2011 at 22:02.

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    ooops - is this really the kind of men you would like to see in this world? That are needed on this planet?

    Although - she seems to benefit a lot, that's for sure. But he seems to have lost...

    Sepia
    Last edited by sepia; 30th March 2011 at 07:39.

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    Quote Posted by Calz_Avaretard (here)
    Quote Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
    Quote Posted by DawgBone (here)
    Human beings reach their peak at about age 10 or 11. Totally delightful beings. Then, in a few years the hormones start kicking in, and it's all down hill from there.

    Testosterone may have been useful when we had to battle saber-toothed tigers. I can't see that it is of much use these days.
    Try coming out of a late night movie with your goddess and having 4 guys demand your wallet and then comment on what they want to do with her.
    I thought that is what your light saber was for???

    Have you got any idea how long one of those things take to charge up?

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    Quote Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
    Quote Posted by Calz_Avaretard (here)
    Quote Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
    Quote Posted by DawgBone (here)
    Human beings reach their peak at about age 10 or 11. Totally delightful beings. Then, in a few years the hormones start kicking in, and it's all down hill from there.

    Testosterone may have been useful when we had to battle saber-toothed tigers. I can't see that it is of much use these days.
    Try coming out of a late night movie with your goddess and having 4 guys demand your wallet and then comment on what they want to do with her.
    I thought that is what your light saber was for???

    Have you got any idea how long one of those things take to charge up?
    You need one of those great big honking Crocodile Dundee knives ...

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    Quote Posted by Sierra (here)
    Quote Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
    Quote Posted by Calz_Avaretard (here)
    Quote Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
    Quote Posted by DawgBone (here)
    Human beings reach their peak at about age 10 or 11. Totally delightful beings. Then, in a few years the hormones start kicking in, and it's all down hill from there.

    Testosterone may have been useful when we had to battle saber-toothed tigers. I can't see that it is of much use these days.
    Try coming out of a late night movie with your goddess and having 4 guys demand your wallet and then comment on what they want to do with her.
    I thought that is what your light saber was for???

    Have you got any idea how long one of those things take to charge up?
    You need one of those great big honking Crocodile Dundee knives ...
    Even better.
    Can anyone say ''katana?''


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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    Quote Posted by Lord Sidious (here)

    Even better.
    Can anyone say ''katana?''

    slightly off topic, but is that a paul chen practical katana?, i have the wakizashi (more mobility in the house)
    when i went there nothing happened!, i was bored out of my mind..................in the Twilight Zone.

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    Default Re: Unplugging the Patriarchy - a new interview with Lucia Rene

    Quote Posted by SKAWF (here)
    Quote Posted by Lord Sidious (here)

    Even better.
    Can anyone say ''katana?''

    slightly off topic, but is that a paul chen practical katana?, i have the wakizashi (more mobility in the house)
    I just pulled the pic off the net, I have no idea if it is a good one or not.
    The wakizashi is too short for my liking, some of the moves I know are too hard with something that short.
    A ninja to is ok though.

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