The Real Story about Trails in the Sky.

[Icecold]

There has been a debate on the Chemtrail Pilot Talks thread. In my view, that debate has shown that with the use of solid real world evidence, that chemtrail conspiracy is a pack of disinformation mainly presented on two suspect sites.......

1. www.rense.com

2. educate-yourself.org

Other than these two disinformation sources, there is very little discussion of chemtrails anywhere else.

I've started this thread as a place to lay down the evidence for the contrail/chaff theory of trails in the sky.

The problem with the new age movement is that a bunch of fairy-loving myth readers want to convince you that they understand science or natural phenomena. They have no clue outside of fairy tales or hysteria peddling.


Original thread here.....
http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...il-pilot-talks

[Icecold]

This is the conspiracy theorists main chemtrail offender, an agri business that uses planes to crop spray its vineyards and orchards.. I DO NOT SUPPORT THE SPRAYING OF CROPS....

...yet the chemtrail theorists claim that this company is deliberately following a policy of poisoning the entire population with a bio weapon program!!!!!



Chemtrail Pilot Line
Show Audio

Date: 03-26-04
Host: George Noory
Guests: Open Lines, Steve Quayle

George set up a special open line for pilots to disclose what they knew about the alleged chemtrail spraying over America. One military pilot, who said he flies out of Edwards AFB, told of seeing a substance loaded into planes, which he described as clear and gelatin-like, that is then dropped between 10,000 and 30,000 ft. in the air. Its purpose, he said, is to create a kind of film that blocks radar from penetrating the area for a certain amount of time before it dissipates.
Another caller, who said he was an airline pilot instructor, referenced William Thomas' website, willthomas.net(1), and said chemtrails were colloidal substances containing human blood derivatives, being dropped in an effort to sicken the population.

The articles report that a company called Evergreen Air is poisoning select groups United States citizens. With jet streams and the movement of air, large areas of the united states are being poisoned. Areas where elites would probably live, including senior Air Force/other military/elites and their families. Has anyone noticed groups of military personnel/or others of any kind going about wearing gas masks? You would think the people in the know would be taking precautions to protect their families from the dangerous biological weapons. Has any US members noticed if this is the case in their area?


Evergreen Air

http://www.evergreenaviation.com/




Here are some of their affiliate companies...

http://www.evergreenag.com/

http://www.evergreenorchards.com/

http://www.evergreenvineyards.com/

[Gajanana]

I'm not going to add anything smart or scientific. I see these trails all over denmark and have been suspicious for a long time, but one thing nags me constantly. Denmark is a small country, the trails are everywhere and also to be found in the skies above the homes of many prominent politicians etc.... unless they have a secret antidote (dont hink so) then they and thier families will also be affected. why would they accept that? it does'nt make sense to allow the spraying of poison knowing that it will affect ones own family.
just something that bugs me, no more... G

[Icecold]

The trails are a result of unprecedented air traffic over Europe which has been a result of the increase in flights and aircraft in our skies.

Dumping fuel is perfectly normal. It needs to be understood that the maximum takeoff weight differs from the maximum landing weight. If for some reason the aircraft has to return, or land before its intended destination fuel will need to be dumped to get below or under the maximum authorized landing weight.

BTW. The fuel dumping is a bad thing, it is a plausible theory that aircraft fuel is carcinogenic and therefore a BAD THING!

But this is a long way from saying that there is a deliberate policy of bio genocide of entire populations!

BUNK!!!!

[T Smith]

Posted by Gajanana (here)
I'm not going to add anything smart or scientific. I see these trails all over denmark and have been suspicious for a long time, but one thing nags me constantly. Denmark is a small country, the trails are everywhere and also to be found in the skies above the homes of many prominent politicians etc.... unless they have a secret antidote (dont hink so) then they and thier families will also be affected. why would they accept that? it does'nt make sense to allow the spraying of poison knowing that it will affect ones own family.
just something that bugs me, no more... G

Some politicians have addressed the matter.

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides/...DOC+XML+V0//EN

In the United States, Dennis Kucinich also attempted to introduce legislation against Chemtrails, among other things: H.R. 2977. See page 5, line 15...

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-1...7hr2977ih.pdf/

The PTB minions then modified this bill in the eleveth hour to take out any reference to Chemtrails. Sometimes the forces that effectively silence this phenomenon are bigger than any political action. I'm not exactly sure what's going on with the whole Chemtrail thing, but I'm not surprised at all that politicians are mute on the matter.

[T Smith]

Visit the following URL:

http://www.carnicom.com/

This is a good compilation of scientific evidence to get a handle on what's going on in the skies.

[andrewgreen]

Ive seen enough chem-trails to believe they are more than aircraft dumping fuel. Obviously they are not immediately dangerous but I don't believe the intention is beneficial for humanity.

[blufire]

There was a time Icecold that I did not believe in chemtrails and I too thought it was a bunch of hogwash.

But I could not deny the actuality when you wake up to a clear blue sky and then four planes begin to fly over and back and forth, forming an almost perfect “grid” pattern and within a couple hours the sky is completely overcast.

I have personally seen this several times.

I have seen the “dust” and/or “flakes” that look a little like vermiculite settle on my equipment and tops of my high tunnels and a skim on the ponds if the water is still. Sometimes there is no visible residue at all.

I have seen planes flying and forming a “chemtrail” or if you wish a contrail and then the trail just “shuts off” and the plane can still be seen. I don’t think that is possible with contrails

I don’t know why “they” are spraying or what they are spraying but I know they are and that it consists of different components at different times.

I have my own personal thoughts and musings but no scientific “proof”.

I will try to get pictures the next time it happens . . . . it is very dramatic when you see a “checkerboard” in the sky.

By the way . . . . this happens at my farm in Kansas . . . . the bread basket of the US

[13th Warrior]

I wonder where all the aluminum and barium is coming from then?

A documentary about chemtrail spraying:

Source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jf0khstYDLA

You should also research "Geo Engineering"

The problem with the new age movement is that a bunch of fairy-loving myth readers want to convince you that they understand science or natural phenomena. They have no clue outside of fairy tales or hysteria peddling.

For those of us who have "no clue" you've only proven to discredit yourself with this statement; perhaps you will think twice next time before using such words...

[Ahkenaten]

I used to think the chemtrail business was a bit of over-exercised imaginative bunk, too............until one day I sat outside for hours watching the sky. I saw planes creating a grid pattern - and actually saw them turn around and double-back to create the parallel lines. I also saw the 'contrail' on one sputter out and stop, only to resume when the plane was back in position to continue on with its grid-making. Since then I have paid closer attention - especially when I observe the grid patterns, which I have seen in all parts of the US. I have NOT observed these patterns in Mexico or South America. I have observed other phenomenon connected to these grids but will not go into that here. I do not have enough information (or know any trustworthy insiders I can speak with) to come to the conclusion from this that materials toxic to humans are deliberately being sprayed by these planes. I DO however note the grid patterns and that they are deliberately being created for some reason.

The only reasonable hint I have found in all my reading on this subject is that supposedly (I am not able to verify this statement however) Edward Teller, inventor of the H Bomb, had recommended to the US government that such sprayed grids be put up to reflect back/deflect electromagnetic bursts entering the atmosphere from the Sun as a protective measure. As I recall, Rich Hoagland said that. I had thought once of looking into the commodities markets to see if there had been some inexplicable spike in the price/value of various minerals ostensibly being sprayed (barium, etc.) to see if there might be any connection, thinking that the way things are, the mere demand for certain commodities would cause certain human activities to take on a life of its own based on the profit motive REGARDLESS of benefits or not (example, the so-called nuclear industry!!) - but I do not have the skill to analyze that kind of data.

Anyway, no one flying a jet makes a complete turn in the opposite direction for no reason, especially a few of them. The only time I was ever on a plane that did a complete 360-degree turn was in the Andes when the pilot learned that he was unable to land at the Cuzco airport due to poor visibility, so back we went to La Paz........it cannot be mere coincidence and normal air traffic that accounts for ALL of the grid patterns we are seeing in the skies of the so-called "Developed World."

[blufire]

Few more thoughts . . . . .

The Kansa farm is no where near an airport.

I see “single” or “double” chemtrails fairly often when at my farm in the Appalachian Mountains. But in these mountains you can see very little of the sky or not as large expanse of the sky as in Kansas. Also there is no crop land and the population is very minimal . . . . mostly coal miners and gas line workers and families.

I see the chemtrails as much in the winter as in the summer . . . so they are not “seasonal”.

I began seeing them about four or five years ago and only became a believer in the phenomenon about a year and a half ago.

[raparee]

This is a tough one ,is it real?, is it not? some speculate it is for radiation protection , or weather modification,or a catalyst for Haarp the list goes on and on .I personally believe it is real but I know from experience that I could spend a year researching it reading all the scientific data and the opinions of experts and I would end up in the same position that I am right now, not knowing what its purpose is. This plays right into the TPTB mo, keep them guessing, let them fight amongst themselves about it, scare the crap out of them, ridicule them with outlandish claims, a drunk pilot, yeah and crop circles created by two drunken men. I agree with some previous posters that whatever they are spraying falls on ALL people so it is likely that we do not have to succumb to fear. My own personal opinion is that it may be tied in with with the elites super weapon which is GM crops, which I am sure you are all aware cannot grow without being sprayed with patented chemicals. Assuming for a moment that this operation is real, could its purpose be to change the nature of soil world wide that ONLY GM crops would grow in the future? Could it be that after the expected earth changes and resultant pollution that the only crops that could be grown would be GM crops? I don"t know, what I do know is that the elite always post their intentions and I invite everyone to check out this mural from the Denver airport where they have laid our their plans for us and let me know what you think http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/so...l_denver05.htm go about 2/3 s of the way down the page for the section on GM crops

[Ahkenaten]

It would be convenient to dismiss all theories about plans to exterminate us in mass numbers as the ravings of paranoid lunatics but unfortunately there is enough information available to suggest that this, in fact, is exactly what is occurring - whether it be a CONSCIOUS, deliberate, intentional diabolical and destructive plan of certain elites or not!! Remember that Bill Clinton, a figurehead for the elites, mindlessly gorged himself on McDonald's hamburgers leading to coronary artery disease and heart surgery......so the "HARD RAIN" is gonna fall on us all; 'elites' of all stripes, reptilians, hybrids, military personnel, CIA agents, CIA/NSA agent wanna-bees, clerks, babies in prams, nannies, kids in baseball uniforms, etc. IGNORANCE is the root of the problem....and there are actual organized and destructive human activities on going that ARE taking a toll on the human genome and the earth that has supported and nurtured us. That is not a mere fantasy of some delusional new-age kooks, it is real. Examples? The Gulf Oil Spill last year....even if it was an accident, it is stupid to drill at such depths, it is a profit motive (RX - human greed+human ingorance+misuse of advanced technology=disaster) that is the driver. Ditto the Nuke catastrophe unfolding in Japan....same driver, same human dark-side underpinnings.

It may be too late to save us. We may have destroyed ourselves and only have ourselves (humanity in general, and specifically those decision-makers and all their slaves) to blame.

Chemtrails and who does what is only one segment of the problem..........we need to refocus on the big picture here. If we HAVE in fact committed hiri-kiri or seppeku, at least in the last moments of clarity we need to understand exactly what happened, why, and what is responsible for the horrific situation we find ourselves in - and HORRIFIC it is.

At least we should learn from what has happened and take responsibility. Yeah - someone has conspired to kill us alright - and it is our own DARK side that these forces playing out in the real world around us are but manifestations of.

[gardunk]

Haarp states that it is an ionospheric heater and I have seen the sundogs that come shortly after the trails are laid out and then comes the smear to the sky and the end of another sunny day/more than meets the eye indeed and yet to debunk the whole thing as fairy airy science is just another form of cognative dissonance!

[TimC.]

Again another opinion that causes a lot of stress amongst the Avolonian community. I personally disagree with you Icecold because to me, it is all "plane" to see. But then again it is my reality and my truth, so I never expect anyone to see the world as I do. I'm not happy with knowing what could possibly be the outcome of all this spraying, I'd rather see it in your view to be quite honest. I don't have the smoking gun or any physical proof that there is a so called "secret" project to reduce the population.

But I was not born yesterday and neither are the millions of people that have come to such a conclusion, as to what is going on in the skies. More air traffic? Okay, can't argue there. But for the longest time the argument has been contrails only form at a certain elevation due to temperature. And the trail lasts a mere 30 secs to a minute at most. So now that argument is out the window that these trails spanding the entire sky are simple contrails. They spread out and are visible for hours upon hours. So what's the argument now? Can't be more air traffic. Tic-Tac-Toe grid patterns, only once or twice a month though. Most of the time they're staight patterns hidden above the clouds. And others times it's blaitingly done in blue skies. Planes fly every hour, everyday above Toronto and yet there is only spraying every 2-4 days. Implying that there is a specific agenda with these flight patterns.

Just the way I see it. I can't physically stop it but I get people to question it, and that's all I can do really. We all have a purpose in life and I totally except your opinion. We couldn't all think alike. Anyway, It's not like you are not in the know, that's the first part. 90% of the population is however.

Cheers

[Chinaski]

i live near an airport. in fact, planes often fly directly over my house before they land. this hardly makes me a chemtrail expert, but it gives me a unique perspective as an observer. and like Ahkenaten, i've actually spent a few hours outside - just observing.

what i've observed is very suspicious. like other posters, i have seen what appear to be intelligent patterns in the sky(mainly x patterns). but what really gets me is this: there were a couple nice days here in upstate ny recently, almost identical days(sunny, bright blue sky, approx 30 degrees). air traffic was similiar on both of these days. yet, while one day revealed an almost flawless blue sky with no markings, the other looked like a damn tic-tac-toe board. i cannot think of any rational explanation for my observations.

[ghostrider]

use your own mind, they say tptb are spreading barium/ other chemicals to create a shield from radiation caused by the sun/nibiru. It could be the canvas for the hologram/fake alien invasion plan. I wonder what the effects really are? What happens to aluminum when microwaved? They could set the sky on fire and retreat to their D.U.M.B.S. There are so many paths, the truth will always be hidden, our perception is the only variable. One thing is sure, they are spraying something everywhere, and fake clouds surround the planet, when is the last time you saw a clear blue sky for eight hours?

[conk]

Sorry Icecold, I disagree. Why would a plane fly over the same area over and over and over, laying down these trails that do not diminish over the whole day. A bright, sunny day at 8am, only to have a completely washed out sky by lunch time. They are very deliberate with their patterns. They are doing something odd, there is no doubt. An evil plot? Perhaps not. But why no answers at all? Or pretend it is not happening?

[SKAWF]

Source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrI9h8yCqdI

this is what i saw out of my window.
i doubt that any of it is natural cloud.
nor is it disinformation.
they are changing the sky/atmosphere.

[i_am_becoming]

I'm not sure what they are spraying, but it really angers me whenever I see the planes dumping endless streams of crap from their wings. Notice I didn't say their engines, since they fly low enough over my house that I can pick out with my eyes the actual four spraying nozzles on the back of the wings. More specifically, there are more often two engine planes with only a few four engine 747s spraying the chemtrails. I have stood outside and watched many planes at once flying around leaving endless trails, sometimes turning them on and off as they fly through the sky.

The planes are so close and flying slowly that there wingspan looks to be about an inch to an inch and half wide from the ground, meaning they are not flying at commercial jet traffic height. I've watched as many as 9 distinct different planes spraying chemtrails turning around going north to south and south to north many, many times. Most often I will see about 4-5 planes, but 9 was the most I've seen at once. There was one time where an actual line of 5 different planes flew over my house in a line one directly behind the other each leaving a line in the sky.

It really angers me to see this blatant dumping going on. My theory is that it could be barium, aluminum, arsenic or some other chemicals to dumb us down further or perform a "slow-kill" on our population. However, I think that another possibility that I do not see discussed much is the dumping of hazardous waste products. Just like the military-industrial complex gets rid of their uranium nuclear fuel waste through the illegal use of Depleted Uranium munitions that are fired off in Iraq, Afghanistan and now Libya, I would not put it past the PTB to dump other costly hazardous waste into the skies rather than pay to dispose of it properly. What do you all think about this theory?

I do NOT believe that this is for weather modification or some BS statement about "protecting us from solar radiation" when this is not done in third world countries. This has allegedly only been noticed over developed countries.