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Thread: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

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    Default How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    Every now and then someone writes me about some guru or meditation or New Age fad and then asks my opinion. I don't have time to answer stuff like that and deprive people of their naughty incomes. My teacher would always refuse comment, too. People who don't have any wisdom always get cheated even if you tell them so. Nevertheless, so that YOU don't get cheated, here's what you have to discover.

    Having psychic abilities or superpowers does not mean someone is more spiritual than people without superpowers and psychic abilities. Ghosts and demons have superpowers, so what does having them prove about anyone's state of virtue or spirituality?

    [More...]

    Have any members here had an experience with Fake Guru or spiritual teacher?

    If so please post them here.
    [B]
    I am a supreme being you must listen to me even when I don't make any sense[/B]

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    I'd say to some extent all external sources of teaching are distorted - especially at the level where written words and language are concerned.

    You may read what I wrote, but understand something quite different to what I was trying to say.

    Even the "good" teachers get misunderstood.

    It is all experience. At the end of the day - nobody other than yourself is responsible for sorting it all out.

    Teachers, good and bad, are catalysts to help that process along for you.

    John..
    Every majestic oak tree was once a nut who stood his ground.

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    Hmmm.... you might want to really read to the bottom of that article,
    and click on the next link andywight, i think you might have found yourself
    a Fake Guru!!

    The author is telling us how to spot a fake Guru with one hand,
    then trying to sell as a course with the other.

    For $800 US.

    http://www.meditationexpert.com/stages.html


    '"Discover How Far You Can Go in Your Spiritual Cultivation After You Learn About the Stages of the Path,
    the Proper Application of Spiritual Practices and the Kung-fu of Meditation Techniques
    ... All the Stuff You've Spent Years and Thousands of Dollars Trying to Find Out But No One Ever Told You " USD $800"


    Also the meditationexpert.com thing is a bit of a worry.
    True Spiritual teachers are quite humble beings.

    I Would be very much doubting the intent of this author, myself.


    As for finding a spiritual teacher that resonates with you it's simple.

    When the student is ready the teacher appears.

    Teachers are not necessarily in the physical form either.

    Blessings,

    Astrid
    Last edited by astrid; 3rd May 2011 at 23:10.
    The greatest privilege of a human life is to become a
    midwife to the awakening of the Soul in another person.”
    ~ Plato

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    Quote Posted by astrid (here)
    Hmmm.... you might want to really read to the bottom of that article,
    and click on the next link andywight, i think you might have found yourself
    a Fake Guru!!
    Hi Astrid, well spotted. I'm not pushing this website, I just used it to get this thread started. I think it's important though to be able to spot fakes! and a discussion about it can only benefit the members of this forum.

    Quote People who don't have any wisdom always get cheated even if you tell them so.
    The author's right about this IMNSHO.
    Last edited by andywight; 3rd May 2011 at 23:34.
    [B]
    I am a supreme being you must listen to me even when I don't make any sense[/B]

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    If the message includes ultimatums = fake
    If money is asked for the message = be wary, especially if it seems unreasonable.
    If the message overly demonizes someone or something = be wary, at best it's a dualistic message, a good guru teaches holiness (wholeness).
    If the Guru claims to be "more right" than others, or his message "more right" = be wary, a good guru knows everyone has his own path.
    If the Guru has something to gain by spreading his "word" = likely fake, good guru's require nothing in return and no worldly gain.

    My 2 cents.
    "You are NOT the form you animate, But the Force of Animation Itself" -Ken Carey

    The State of Grace already exists. It always has. Yet most humans are blinded to it by the incessant machinations of the rational thought processes that they worship.

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    To be absolutely fake as a Guru that person would be quite something special.

    My own experience with Gurus is that they have had illuminations that have caused them to express them somehow and according to their personal charisma they have attained varying degrees of Gurudom.

    When ever I've allowed myself to become 'involved' with a Guru I've accepted that what I was really doing was partaking in some charisma swimming. Seekers are very prone to such stuff.

    As I've got older I've realised that non gurus and non seekers are far more interesting.

    The first and most fundamental fact about gurus is that to accept one as a teacher is to accept that there is a problem to be solved. That's ok if you've got all the time in the world to while away on such a useless pursuit.

    Much better to get on with a working relationship with people.

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    Quote Posted by Anchor (here)
    I'd say to some extent all external sources of teaching are distorted - especially at the level where written words and language are concerned.

    You may read what I wrote, but understand something quite different to what I was trying to say.

    Even the "good" teachers get misunderstood.

    It is all experience. At the end of the day - nobody other than yourself is responsible for sorting it all out.

    Teachers, good and bad, are catalysts to help that process along for you.

    John..
    Exactly right Anchor J .. every "guru's" message is their interpretation of the message. Some people are better at this than others, and some (very good ones) approach others with a specific interpretation based on their current audience. But it's about finding the interpretation that resonates with you.

    ¤=[Post Update]=¤

    I think it was Jesus who said something like (paraphrased heavily) all your brothers are your teaches, even the "least" of them.
    "You are NOT the form you animate, But the Force of Animation Itself" -Ken Carey

    The State of Grace already exists. It always has. Yet most humans are blinded to it by the incessant machinations of the rational thought processes that they worship.

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    After living in India for 20 years I met may share of Guru's. Some Fake others not. I found that you just have to listen to your own inner voice to understand if something feel right for you, if it resonates. To be honest I have never been big on Guru's as I have always had my inner Masters and do not have to search on the outer.

    The story I wish to share is about a book I bought many years ago called - "HOW TO BE A GURU". And the part I found most interesting was - WHAT IS THE BIGGEST THREAT OR DANGER TO THE GURU? The answer " THE CHELA". (The Student).

    That is about right too.
    [B][COLOR="red"][FONT="Franklin Gothic Medium"]In the end, what is true will come to be known. The truth always appears eventually, despite all efforts to hide it. It is impossible to keep something secret forever[/FONT][/COLOR][/B]
    [IMG]http://www.foundationsforfreedom.net/Topics/TruthTransforms/_resTransform/Truthsetfree.gif[/IMG]

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    They have small squinty eyes and bad breath!!! LOL Couldn't resist

    But, seriously, your whole being tells you if something is the real deal or not. Also, one teacher will be 'your' teacher and not necessarily anyone elses you know. There is a 'meant to be' about meeting the real deal, for you.

    Some people need to kiss a lot of frogs before their prince/princess appears!!!

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    Quote Posted by andywight (here)
    Every now and then someone writes me about some guru or meditation or New Age fad and then asks my opinion. I don't have time to answer stuff like that and deprive people of their naughty incomes. My teacher would always refuse comment, too. People who don't have any wisdom always get cheated even if you tell them so. Nevertheless, so that YOU don't get cheated, here's what you have to discover.

    Having psychic abilities or superpowers does not mean someone is more spiritual than people without superpowers and psychic abilities. Ghosts and demons have superpowers, so what does having them prove about anyone's state of virtue or spirituality?

    [More...]

    Have any members here had an experience with Fake Guru or spiritual teacher?

    If so please post them here.
    I know this is a little tongue in cheek, but wouldn't it be more useful to discuss how to spot a real Guru?

    Serious now: One thing I have noticed is that even the fake ones can be of benefit to someone. Fake ones don't have to be bad people.

    I've seen people carrying tremendous pain going to a "medium" to be told that their beloved passed on relative/friend has forgiven them, and not to worry, and live life without the burden of guilt, etc... and these people come out feeling better.

    $80 well spent in that case, fake or not.

    I see the purpose of churches in a very similar way. They provide more of a support network of people rather than real spiritual help.

    To some degree Avalon provides a very similar purpose: very little (any?) real abilities on show, but a lot of people-to-people help going on all the time.

    Yay.

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    Yes, Perfectresonance, everyone you meet teaches you something,or has something to teach. Otherwise you wouldn't have met them. The catch is when people have 'worshiping' attitudes, and give their power away. Learn the lesson and move on. Do not be caught in the 'suck' of someone who you love and revere so much all learning has gone and you are just doing as you are told. A false guru is one who doesn't consider you equal, or potentially equal. They do not empower you and are very threatened by anyone who ranges up beside them and looks like passing!!

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    Go with your gut I say. I tend to think of people that have helped me along the way as mentor's rather than guru's. I can't say I've ever had a guru, but then that's open to interpretation. I was suckered out of a substantial amount of money at 21 to remove a curse...yip....(face in hands)...I did... but hey, that taught me discernment, among other things. Now I question everything - quite painful for my friends really.

    If I'm having a rough time of it, I can usually go within for answers, or I can simply ask for the perfect person (or wisdom) to come to me, as is perfect for me at this time.

    Then I wait and see what shows up......and something always shows up.

    Warm wishes..

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    We are all spiritual gurus. We need not rely on anyone. Meditation is the path to enlightenment, that's all that really matters at the end of the day. Meditation is free.
    People are so scared to believe in anything, for fear of being fooled, that they end up being fooled in to not believing.

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    Quote Posted by DeDukshyn (here)
    If the message includes ultimatums = fake
    If money is asked for the message = be wary, especially if it seems unreasonable.
    If the message overly demonizes someone or something = be wary, at best it's a dualistic message, a good guru teaches holiness (wholeness).
    If the Guru claims to be "more right" than others, or his message "more right" = be wary, a good guru knows everyone has his own path.
    If the Guru has something to gain by spreading his "word" = likely fake, good guru's require nothing in return and no worldly gain.

    My 2 cents.
    Personally I have never had nor sought a spiritual master or Guru, no doubt thats where I have been going wrong all this time. I have sought out or found seven very different masters of the sword, of different styles. I am sure there is an ocean of difference between one who has mastered the art of taking life to one who has the mastery of spiritual affairs, life affirming or giving, in a sense. But as I understand the term Guru, I see many similarities to masters of defense.

    I completely agree with DeDukshyn on this. In my small experience payment is key, does the master charge for their time, if so, what is the money going towards. For example some of my masters would use the money to further their schools or Dojo's existence, others have merely charged a small amount towards the cost of broken training blades etc and at the other end of the spectrum, one asked for a contribution that clearly went to her food and the expenses of her meager life and finally two refused any payment at all.

    Correspondingly to payment comes ego, in my experience. Those masters who charged the most also were the ones who would insist on being referred to by a title, master, maestro, sensei, etc and the ones who charged the least or not at all, were also the most down to earth and would simply go by their given name. Asrid is right that when the student is ready is also key, the master will appear. The extension of that thought is that the best masters are sometimes the most reluctant to teach, they have to be convinced of the pupils diligence and worthiness.

    Lastly in my experience comes the pace at which the master will teach, again it seems to come back to payment. Masters who charge the most have the most elaborate and time consuming grading systems, but those at the other end of the spectrum had no formal linear path but would rather teach whatever was appropriate, given the day, their mood, or the place, without distinctions of hard or easy. Clearly when payment is involved their is a motive to slow the pace of learning.

    In my opinion, a master in anything, from ironing through to whatever, is someone who has done the thing to death, so much so, that they have long since forgotten the techniques and experimentation that brought them here and have elevated their art of doing to a whole new level. At this point and one would hope not before, they are ready to teach. The difference between a master and a pupil are the amount of repetitions performed.

    I know it is not very spiritual in focus, but hope it helps none the less.. N

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    Quote Posted by Isthatso (here)
    I was suckered out of a substantial amount of money at 21 to remove a curse...yip....(face in hands)...I did... but hey, that taught me discernment, among other things. Now I question everything - quite painful for my friends really.
    In so doing you learned lessons and harvested wisdom that money cant buy. The irony

    Reading between the lines, it seems you also got a bit of practice in self-forgiveness.

    Value for money I'd say!!

    Perhaps you should go back and thank him for being such a charlatan
    Every majestic oak tree was once a nut who stood his ground.

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    It would also be good to hear members experiences with fake spiritual organizations.
    I had an ex-girlfriend who was picked up by the Moonies, unfortunatly for them! they shortly kicked her out for being too disruptive.
    [B]
    I am a supreme being you must listen to me even when I don't make any sense[/B]

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    Quote Posted by Anchor (here)
    Quote Posted by Isthatso (here)
    I was suckered out of a substantial amount of money at 21 to remove a curse...yip....(face in hands)...I did... but hey, that taught me discernment, among other things. Now I question everything - quite painful for my friends really.
    In so doing you learned lessons and harvested wisdom that money cant buy. The irony

    Reading between the lines, it seems you also got a bit of practice in self-forgiveness.

    Value for money I'd say!!

    Perhaps you should go back and thank him for being such a charlatan
    Yep..spot on, it sure was value for money....lol.

    I was free as a bird, on my big O.E. living in NYC....good time's. Sister Anna (yes, a women) would have seen me coming a mile away.

    Bless her....

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
    go w/your gut ANDY????????
    and heart...................
    OH,
    You may want to LOOK into their eyes..........tells a lot about someone.
    The ' I AM' movement is strong...
    And, Andy, they probably start out with "My dearly beloved ones.............etc., crap!
    PS
    They will probably tell you it's the best MONEY you have ever spent.........on your self-inprovement!
    ; )
    Last edited by starsmoonmtns; 4th May 2011 at 03:36.

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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    John Peniel discusses this in his book, The Children of the Law of One and The Lost Teachings of Atlantis (p201-204):

    (1) Charging money.
    (2) Telling you to do anything (s)he tells you to do. True teachers have no desire to control.
    (3) The teacher pursues students.
    (4) The teacher stresses "self", boosts your ego, or tells you of the great things your "self" can accomplish, or the abilities and power your self can attain.
    (5) Promises wealth or success
    (6) They push their dogma
    (7) The teachings are like political rallies - based on emotion and contrived "issues" that work on the group's popular sentiment, or they make a "show" of spirituality.
    (8) Their ego gets offended for any reason.
    (9) Channeling
    (10) Lack of Unselfish love.

    Starting on page 204 Peniel talks about things to look for in a true teacher.

    You can read the book online free. I liked it so much, I bought several copies (and passed them out).

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    Avalon Member noxon medem's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Know a Fake Guru When You Meet One

    Quote Posted by astrid (here)
    Hmmm....

    (edited)
    ..
    When the student is ready the teacher appears.
    ..
    There are many kind of people on this forum.
    We are all differend ("I am not") and here
    for different reasons, and own positions.
    - Also ..

    Here is an excellent gathering of
    people with all sorts of knowledge,
    talent, and forum relation (trajectory)

    Interacting in different ways, of course
    acting in different ways. And "roles".
    Here are great teachers, and gifted
    students. And everything inbetween,
    and then some more ...

    ( warriors and worriers, and ..)..

    Two words on the money-aspect:

    A truly highly enlightened person
    will have "things" just come to them.
    (the basics they realy need for intent)

    A qualified guru will anyway have happy
    students, who gladly bring him, or her,
    the basic need, so they can focus on
    being in the "sphere", their house ..
    - That "commonly" usefull focus.

    It can be that sincere, ok, "gurus" ask
    for money or some needed resources
    because it can (do) set a focus in the
    "student"
    It is strange, but most people tend to
    take things (and classes) more seriously
    if they pay a suiting fee .

    Another excample:
    A brilliant presenter like David Wilcock
    is in my view a good teacher, and both
    spiritual, and scientificly well scolared.

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...8613711060908#
    (2012 enigma)
    And sometimes a pinecone is just a pinecone .
    From a three ...
    ( for thee )

    Click image for larger version

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    http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...h_sparkles.jpg

    He is an excellent "motivational speaker"
    who put a lot of resources into creating
    a genuine audiovisual experience for
    "the audience" ... who should pay a
    reasonable fee for that service .

    ( Maybe you can do it better yourself !?!)

    - Why am I here ?
    Maybe to tell you
    that "why" is mostly
    a mindgame,
    and do not matter
    so much ...

    Just do it.
    (your life)

    - maybe, Astrid, the saying also
    go the other way, and more ..
    (btw: your avatar is a cool cat)

    Quote - hmmm ....

    - When the teacher is ready,
    the student(s) appear ?





    all well
    nm
    Last edited by noxon medem; 7th May 2011 at 01:40.

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