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Thread: Censorship here?

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    United States Administrator ThePythonicCow's Avatar
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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    Quote Posted by Siberia9 (here)
    Oh boy, here we go again, and Im new LOL. I am currious about what set Chicodoodoo off? He said that he was censored can he tell us what drew the mods attention, without getting slapped again that is.
    Welcome!

    Chicodoodoo just came back from a weeks "vacation". His Project Avalon posting privileges were removed for a week. If you click on the number of Posts he has made (see green circled number in image below) you can view his recent posts. Look for about the next to the last post, before his week of vacation, to see where I edited out a paragraph, stating (in summary) why I did so, and who I was.

    My quite dormant website: pauljackson.us

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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    Quote Posted by Siberia9 (here)
    Oh boy, here we go again, and Im new LOL. I am currious about what set Chicodoodoo off? He said that he was censored can he tell us what drew the mods attention, without getting slapped again that is.
    The mods are indeed watching me closely, so any word I post might trigger a reaction from them. That really is too bad, because it illustrates the potential severity of the censorship problem here. But I'm guessing it won't hurt to post a link to the spot where I was censored on Avalon, since it is a matter of public record (to some extent).

    https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...929#post212929

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    Avalon Member HORIZONS's Avatar
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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    Quote Posted by Chicodoodoo (here)
    Quote Posted by HORIZONS (here)
    Quote Posted by Teakai (here)
    I agree, Chicodoodoo - I feel that is about the one failing of Avalon. I haven't any solutions as to what we can do about it,though
    No offense, but it is simple really... We could always choose to deal with it! I've been here since AV1 and see no point in getting caught up in all the hoopla - it is what it is - so I deal with it
    That is putting your private interest ahead of the best interests of Avalon members.
    Which is exactly what you are doing - remember YOU agreed to the terms of use -- Deal with it, or start forum where "the best solution for all concerned" is the motto.
    ~ If nothing changes then nothing changes ~

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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    124 members logged in, 22 members logged into this thread, One admin and one Mod logged in, both logged onto this thread!

    "Wanted" dead or alive Chicodoodoo aka Chico.

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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    Quote The mods are indeed watching me closely, so any word I post might trigger a reaction from them. That really is too bad, because it illustrates the potential severity of the censorship problem here.
    The core of the problem is simple. If there has been no censoring here though sometimes I wish there was...But of course it's worth remembering that there has been no such pressure lately !
    Last edited by Gaia; 15th May 2011 at 01:50.

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    Avalon Member truthseekerdan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    Quote We have the opportunity to do something very special here. I recommend we don’t waste it.
    Then lets all do this for a change!


    https://youtube.com/watch?v=QMBZDwf9dok
    Unity Consciousness
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Free your mind, and open your heart to LOVE.
    You'll then become enlightened able to just BE.

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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    Heh... "be moderate when you moderate"...

    Sorry, that is all.

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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    Quote Posted by Paul (here)
    Quote The United States is a joke of a country today. Do we want to see Avalon follow suit?
    There is a fundamental difference between a nation and a web forum.
    I believe you've missed the point, Paul. The point is not to compare countries with forums. The point is to look at the basis of the "Love it or leave it" argument. It is fundamentally a form of censorship. It is essentially saying, "You either agree with us, or we don't want to hear you."

    Quote Posted by Paul
    That you (Chicodoodoo) would overlook this major and obvious difference between nations and web forums (and that you would title this thread "Censorship") suggests to me that you are more interested in complaining than in understanding.
    Perhaps you are misjudging me again, much as you did in the "Another member gone" thread when you suspended me for "impugning the motives of fellow members". By suggesting that I am more interested in complaining than in understanding, you are impugning the motives of a fellow member, namely me. A one-week vacation might do you some good.

    My motives, just for the record, are to make Avalon a more welcoming place for open discussion. That is why this thread is entitled "Censorship here?"

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    United States Avalon Member Dennis Leahy's Avatar
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    Default The Sky Is Falling!

    When I was a child, there was a story that was told, and I'm not sure how popular it was in other countries, so I'll supply a Wikipedia link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henny_Penny

    Chicken Little (sometime referred to as "Henny Penny", in some versions), was walking along one day, and an acorn fell on her head. She had no idea that she had just encountered an acorn, all she knew is that something hit her on top of the head, and when she looked up, all she saw was the sky. Quickly, she formed a conclusion about what must have happened. She shrieked, "The sky is falling! The sky is falling!" and ran to tell the king.

    On the way to the king, she ran into one of her friends, Foxy Loxy. Chicken Little brethlessly shrieked to Foxy Loxy, "The sky is falling! The sky is falling! I'm going to tell the king!"

    Foxy Loxy quickly formed a conclusion that Chicken Little must be correct, and said, "I will go with you, to warn the king!" And off they went, the two of them, toward the castle.

    On the way to the castle, they run into another friend, Goosey Loosey. Both Chicken Little and Foxy Loxy breathlessly shrieked to Goosey Loosey, "The sky is falling! The sky is falling! We're going to tell the king!"

    Goosey Loosey quickly formed a conclusion that Chicken Little and Foxy Loxy must be correct, and said, "I will go with you, to warn the king!" And off they went, the three of them, toward the castle.

    (the story goes on and on, and we meet a few more of Chicken Little's friends along the way. Invariably, they come to the conclusion that yes indeed, the sky must be falling, because, well, their friend said so. With each new member in the "sky is falling mob", the combined voice becomes stronger and stronger, more and more convincing to those who do not take the time to use their own discernment.

    Chicodoodoo, you can shriek "The Censorship Is Here! The Censorship Is Here!" as many times as you want, and it still won't be true. You can find a dozen more people to join in the chorus, "The Censorship Is Here! The Censorship Is Here!", and it still won't be true.

    Avalon is a moderated forum. You knew that the day you joined. The concept of a moderated forum is to moderate the expletives, the flame wars, the ad hominem attacks, the trolling, the thread hijackers too lacking in focus or with a purposeful agenda to destroy a thread, the mean-spirited voices that seem to get excited pleasure from creating a big stir. Moderation is not censorship, again, regardless how many times or how many ways you state it.

    You expressed before that you wanted a forum with no moderation (I know, you probably said "censorship", but it certainly does appear that you meant "moderation.") I encouraged you to start the new forum, and pointed you to technical help to do it. You started a forum. I didn't join, because I don't want to be in an unmoderated forum. Life's too short to wade through the crap that some people can spew. It is exactly why I don't bother reading the posts on YouTube.

    I like that Avalon is moderated. I liked it before I joined (it made the quality of reading MUCH higher), I liked it when I joined and there was a moderation team I was not on. As this is a temporary job for any person who volunteers here, I will enjoy the fact that Avalon is moderated after I am no longer a moderator here.

    Bill sets the ambiance, the tone of Project Avalon, and he asks his moderators to help do that. We do that, to the best of our ability. I am not the only one that likes it here - there are many more people posting now. Many members have contacted me personally, and/or other mods, and/or sent kudos to the mods/admins for the job of moderation here. It feels more comfortable for more people, and some of the gentler voices, some of the coolest people that preferred not to post before are sharing here now.

    A few people are gone. They don't like it here anymore. They liked it better when it was more of a boxing match, and there were fewer voices, more dominant personalities. That's OK. I sincerely hope they are happier wherever they go, and sure hope that the move was positive enough for them that they can stop focusing on "censorship" and get back to the serious business of opposing the Global Rulers' agenda.

    You know, there is a lot going on in the world right now, and 99.99999% of it is more important than arguing about the moderation on Avalon. I sure hope you'll focus your attention on some of the problems in the world or insights into some of the wonderful things your compatriots are doing, maybe some ideas for solutions or support some good ideas, maybe participate in discussions others have started...

    The whole "The Censorship Is Here! The Censorship Is Here!" thing is a downward spiral. You're a bright guy, and I hope you'll abandon that spiral track, and I'll get the benefit of finding out what else you've been thinking about.

    Dennis


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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    The definition of madness is Doing the same thing and expecting different results.

    If we are going to be the change we want to see we must change.
    Live and let live is good
    Be kind to all life including your own no matter what.
    and finally

    God grant me the serenity to accept the things I can not change
    Courage to change the things I can
    Wisdom to know he difference

    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    Okay with no affinity to any particular person being it Bill or Mod, but appreciating the work and difficult position of Bill and the Mods, being as politically free as possible and being happy to follow and keep in line with guidance agreed in joining (okay think I've covered all potential hotspots) wouldn't it be wonderful to have a forward thinking circular system that took all the responsibility from the poor Mods and shared it as equally as possible among all members? How about Mods make the initial decision and final decision shared among final members group of say 20 people that rotate every month............with a majority of ?? to carry forward and a minorty of ?? details to be refined of course (still covering hotspots and reaching a higher community participation and responsibility).................just a thought
    "Beyond Right Doing and Wrong Doing, there is a Field, I will meet you there." ( Rumi in the 12th century spoke of the Field as a finer vibration of Consciousness) The truth is timeless............dejavu

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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    Quote Posted by Chicodoodoo (here)
    Quote Posted by Paul (here)
    Quote The United States is a joke of a country today. Do we want to see Avalon follow suit?
    There is a fundamental difference between a nation and a web forum.
    I believe you've missed the point, Paul. The point is not to compare countries with forums. The point is to look at the basis of the "Love it or leave it" argument. It is fundamentally a form of censorship. It is essentially saying, "You either agree with us, or we don't want to hear you."
    I can't help but agree with Chicodoodoo here; the logic of his reduction is unpalatable but, I think, undeniable.

    We should be careful in exercising authority believing that authority is self-justifying. The authority exercised in this forum has to be oriented such that it furthers the development of this forum. As things presently stand, Chicodoodoo has been thanked in over 85% of his posts, with thanked posts receiving on average thanks from five different people. Simple sensibility would behoove any moderator, in exercising their unenviable duty and function, to consider most carefully the utility of moderating a member held in such esteem by the Avalon community.



    To the Moderators: it seems to me that this will not be over until it has been established conclusively by the community whether censorship occurred or did not occur. Being told by the moderators that censorship did not occur will always be insufficient to some. Since moderators can see what has been removed from general sight, let them contact those allegedly impugned in the removed posts seeking their permission to republicise them, asking in a poll whether, the hidden material being newly available, Avalon believes the removal of the posts/parts constituted fair and acceptable exercise of the moderator's capabilities. If it is established that the removal was fair, those who say that there is censorship will be forced to accept public opinion, and if it is established that the removal was not fair, we can all accept the community's verdict and work out how to move forward together and what changes, if any, need to be made and how they might be done.
    Last edited by Seikou-Kishi; 15th May 2011 at 02:02.

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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    food for thought ..

    we crack this nut we also provide a solution/model for the world (politcians/corporations etc.).

    could the answer not be as simple as transparency?

    what ever mods do/say/ban is out in the open. No PMs / behind closed doors with these types of issues. It's all out in the open (perhaps a mod thread visible to the everyone).

    ..... it's an idea, maybe a step in the right direction, but may need a little tweaking. 4D has its limitations and we need to accept this.

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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    Quote Posted by dejavu (here)
    wouldn't it be wonderful to have a forward thinking circular system that took all the responsibility from the poor Mods and shared it as equally as possible among all members?
    No. Bolshevism stinks, and this thread is crawling with it.
    "I never gave a damn 'bout the meter man, 'til i was the man who had to read the meters, man." -- Mike Watt

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    Default Re: The Sky Is Falling!

    Quote Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
    The concept of a moderated forum is to moderate the expletives, the flame wars, the ad hominem attacks, the trolling, the thread hijackers too lacking in focus or with a purposeful agenda to destroy a thread, the mean-spirited voices that seem to get excited pleasure from creating a big stir.

    <snip>

    Life's too short to wade through the crap that some people can spew.
    This statement would appear to be wholly counter-intuitive to accepting the role of being a moderator; that is exactly what they are tasked to do, traditionally..
    "Thus, the task is not so much to see what no one yet has seen, but to think what nobody yet has thought about that which everybody sees."
    — Arthur Schopenhauer

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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    Quote Posted by Seikou-Kishi (here)
    Quote Posted by Chicodoodoo (here)
    Quote Posted by Paul (here)
    Quote The United States is a joke of a country today. Do we want to see Avalon follow suit?
    There is a fundamental difference between a nation and a web forum.
    I believe you've missed the point, Paul. The point is not to compare countries with forums. The point is to look at the basis of the "Love it or leave it" argument. It is fundamentally a form of censorship. It is essentially saying, "You either agree with us, or we don't want to hear you."
    I can't help but agree with Chicodoodoo here; the logic of his reduction is unpalatable but, I think, undeniable.

    We should be careful in exercising authority believing that authority is self-justifying. The authority exercised in this forum has to be oriented such that it furthers the development of this forum. As things presently stand, Chicodoodoo has been thanked in over 85% of his posts, with thanked posts receiving on average thanks from five different people. Simple sensibility would behoove any moderator, in exercising their unenviable duty and function, to consider most carefully the utility of moderating a member held in such esteem by the Avalon community.
    Chicken Little was held in high esteem by many as well.
    ~ If nothing changes then nothing changes ~

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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    Chicodoodoo, sweetie,

    The title of this thread ~ Censorship Here? Is provocative. All of us are aware of the heated battles that have raged on Avalon. The personal attacks, the friendships who moved on suddenly. The hurtful things said to someone on the forums that was cruel and uncalled for.

    Further, when you say that this community doesn't belong to Bill or the Moderators, this purposely incites them and they are the ones who spend incredible amounts of personal time here fixing things; modifying temper tantrums; outbursts; people under duress who need technical assistance, and you're not making their job any easier.

    You've slapped them with your glove and even I winced at the blow and I am so laid back the house could burn down and I'd hardly notice, I'd just leave quietly with my kittens and laptop.

    I know you didn't mean it, you are upset over a decision they made. You have a love for provocative threads, sometimes that is okay but it's not necessary. We need to monitor ourselves and keep our own issues in check, at least as much as possible. Saying things you know can be so easily taken the wrong way and harm someone's sensitive feelings is just not nice.

    By way of explaining, let me say this again: As the solar winds keep blowing in they are bringing Adamantine Particles. These can be of great benefit to our health and wellbeing or not. I've noticed that every emotion we've ever felt in this life and many others is coming up to the surface to be deal with ~ this is when we are forced to resolve in one way or another all negatives, old hurts, feelings of being inadequate, unprocessed anger, old dusty issues we've long forgotten go away, so they will trouble us no more. When we don't, it can very well kill us. These feelings are all amplified now and it's pretty agonizing.

    This is where your anger over perceived censorship issues is coming from not Avalon!

    We are being asked to sort and get rid of all that is no long needed including how we've been censored, stifled, held back, abused and so forth. All which is true, of course, but doesn't happen to apply to Avalon. It's old stuff that is going to cause bile to rise but not where it belongs. For you to get rid of but please not on public forums. You have already manged to get others to start talking about leaving and bringing up old worthless threads of discontent. The tone you are setting is not positive for anyone. No one has a gun to anyone's head.

    We are all going through this sorting of wheat from chaff in different ways and it hurts and is not pretty. I had a bout myself while in Utah with old issues. It affects all of us. What you are forgetting is that all you have to do is be kind to others and not incite them. Do not insult their hard efforts on your behalf. You are beating the wrong horse, here and if you can realize it and get back into the real flow of things, all will be well.

    Before posting, all of us need to ask if this will help anyone or not? Will it cause hurt feelings or not? Will it get others into a foul mood or cause negativity to run wild? We must ~ Do no harm!

    It's kind of like saying the Earth doesn't own us. Bill doesn't own one of his own creations this Project and those who love him are not giving all their time for a worthy cause, as you have pointed out so well, and now it is suspect. Bill and his Nazi's have resurfaced from Inner Earth instead of the kinder Agarthans and all hell is upon us now and right here on this enlightening thread. If we had that attitude, Earth could well boot our persons off the planet in about two seconds flat. Is your merkaba finished?

    Everyone ~ please be kind. We are all suffering the last birth pangs with Mother Earth. We all suffer when these changes radically affect our bodies, minds, spirits, and etheric arenas. Give us a few little nuggets like Lord Sid does, and even he has his bad days but we are a family and we journey together and are creating something so wonderful. Let's keep practicing until we get it right. Love all of you! xoxoxoxox
    Ep 6:12: For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places." Even so, let your light shine and keep it real...

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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    I will say in defense--- not that it needs it-- The Avalon prior to the release of the Charles video was not a boxing arena-- it was very civilized and many interesting subjects debated.
    I have nothing against Charles or the members who came after the release- many are my friends but around about that time there was a change in the energy of Avalon.
    No doubt there will be records that show that the deleting of threads expelling members to the degree that it happen now just did not happen before 2011.
    That is no reflection on the current mod team their job is difficult.
    Something happened and I know not what.

    im tired and not expressing well but I will also say that the Mayan Calander predicted changes in energy that would be unsettling-- so It may not be a personal thing but a global one.
    Look at the news violent crime bizarre murders unusual weather, animals and fish dying.

    I suggest just let go of all imagined or real grievances.
    AA has the saying "Let go let God"
    Good advice

    Good night may God bless us all.
    He is the ultimate authority for me.

    Chris
    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

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  35. Link to Post #39
    United States Avalon Member NancyV's Avatar
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    Default Re: Censorship here?

    Quote Posted by Chicodoodoo (here)
    Quote Posted by Siberia9 (here)
    Oh boy, here we go again, and Im new LOL. I am currious about what set Chicodoodoo off? He said that he was censored can he tell us what drew the mods attention, without getting slapped again that is.
    The mods are indeed watching me closely, so any word I post might trigger a reaction from them. That really is too bad, because it illustrates the potential severity of the censorship problem here. But I'm guessing it won't hurt to post a link to the spot where I was censored on Avalon, since it is a matter of public record (to some extent).
    https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...929#post212929
    I can sure understand why the mods are watching you, Chico. You recently had a week's vacation because of your style of frequent complaining....and here you go again. I really have to wonder if you want to be banned because it's some kind of badge of honor over on the NEXUS forum and you want to be in the "I was banned from Avalon" group?

    You started your own website and you can do anything you want there. Why do you have to make Avalon be what YOU want it to be? You're a member of NEXUS and I guess you're happy with the free-for-all bashing and vitriol over there (oops, I mean free speech).

    I'm perfectly fine with the way Bill and the moderators operate this forum and I'm sorry that you aren't. By now anyone who reads your posts KNOWS you aren't happy with the way Bill runs Avalon and the way the moderators moderate. Okay, we get that... and we've gotten it over and over and over....ad nauseum.

    You're an intelligent man, Chico, so I know you aren't doing this for no reason at all. After many weeks of complaining you know you aren't going to get Bill to change the website so you are continuing these tactics for another reason besides a hope for change. Perhaps deliberate provocation or do you just get a kick out of continual carping?

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  37. Link to Post #40
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    Default Re: The Sky Is Falling!

    Quote Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
    Avalon is a moderated forum. You knew that the day you joined.
    I agree the forum should be moderated. The question being asked here is what should be done when moderating crosses the line and becomes unwarranted censorship, or better yet, what can be done to prevent that from happening in the first place. That is why Avalon needs a system of "checks and balances".

    Another example of subtle censorship (which you claim does not exist here) is the excuse given to members being banned for an action as innocent as thanking posts on another forum. They are informed that they obviously aren't happy at Avalon, and so for their own good, they are being pushed out the door. Really! I kid you not! How convenient to silence a voice you don't want heard by claiming they aren't happy.

    Just so there's no confusion, I'm very happy! I'm happy I can post on Avalon!

    Aren't you?

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