Is Monogamy Natural?

[paul1972]

Is Monogamy Natural?

For Mammals, like us tweaked Humans... it's a rare event
it's well explained here, I'd love your response on this TOPIC

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=DEdHz0eIpm4

Love

Paul1972

[crosby]

i remember a line from an older chick flick that i used to watch where the father explains to his grown, pregnant daughter: "You want monogamy, marry a swan." - - i have always admired couples whom have stayed together forever. something very idealistic about it, and when we're young, idealism is what we're seeking. however, in real life, i think the divorce rate for first marriages in the united states is something like 70%. and maybe 50% for second timers. i could be wrong about those figures, but even if they're running a little less, it makes taking the leap a lot more scary.
warmest, corson

[Flash]

it seems that monogamy is possible when testosterone goes down

I also said to one of my teacher once: in men, spirituality goes up when testosterone goes down. lol

[Bridey]

To each his own......no judgements ever. For me personally, its not natural.

[Lifesong]

I'm not sure it matters if its natural. It's certainly a choice, and not one impossible to achieve.

[Davidallany]

Monogamy is as natural as wearing clothes.

[DeDukshyn]

Ok here's me: To me having one sexual partner is a tad absurd. It just doesn't seem natural. It's like someone made this rule "Since you are so emotionally weak, more than one sexual partner will destroy your life so dont do it" and everyone has the program downloaded, but at the same time I'm not that emotionally weak. At all. But the "rule" makes us all believe we are, and thus obey it. Having more than one relationship partner at time is a bit more odd, but I still see nothing wrong if all parties are fully conscious and aware (aka - no cultish brainwashing - thats just plain wrong) -- after all I'm not one with authority to judge anyone (but one girlfriend is usually quite enough thanks )

In a perfect world, strong negative feelings won't exist ... sure opens up possibilities for a richer interactive experience IMHO.

Edit: I think it may be important to note -- I have been extremely monogamous in my life ...

[Lord Sidious]

If you consider that there is the possibility that your consciousness merges with someone that you are intimate with, then I would think it is not only a good idea, I would think it is a safe idea.
Talk about safe sex!
How would you like to merge with lots of different people, not even taking into account who they had already merged with?

[Davidallany]

How would you like to merge with lots of different people

Sounds interesting.

[Tangri]

Posted by Flash (here)
it seems that monogamy is possible when testosterone goes down

I also said to one of my teacher once: in men, spirituality goes up when testosterone goes down. lol

Blaming testosterone in not fair, since polygamy needs second opposite sex.
Without consent of both sides it will never happen, then do not go blaming one side

[Positive Vibe Merchant]

Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
If you consider that there is the possibility that your consciousness merges with someone that you are intimate with, then I would think it is not only a good idea, I would think it is a safe idea.
Talk about safe sex!
How would you like to merge with lots of different people, not even taking into account who they had already merged with?

LS, would you constitute 'merging' as the more spiritual aspect of sex eg 'making love' where there is deep emotional input as opposed to sexual encounter for the sake of it?
Either way, interesting topic.
M@

[NancyV]

This post is categorized as "TL-DR" - Too Long, Don't Read. Ulli came up with that designation and I think it applies here. So if you hate longer posts, Don't READ!

Monogamy is partially natural and partially a moral tenet or doctrine in many religions and cultures. Some religions and cultures allow polygamy for men but not for women. There are also some cultures which allow polyandry (having more than one husband), but that is more rare than polygamy. I think it is more natural for men not to be monogamous than for women, depending on their age of course. Men seem to have a natural, biological imperative to spread their seed, all for the survival of the species of course.

I began exploring this question when I was 19, a year after marrying my first husband. It took me that long to find out that he was having many affairs. I didn't want to leave him since I was so madly in love with him and he is the one who prompted me to begin researching the validity of monogamy. I ended up dealing with it for a couple of years and we even engaged in wife swapping which was pretty popular in certain circles in Southern California when we moved there from Chicago in 1967. Then there was the hippie peace/love movement in the late 60's and 70's where it was accepted that you could "love" or have sex with multiple partners. Casual sex was no big deal in the peace/love community.

So I managed to convince myself that it was absolutely normal to LOVE more than one person at a time and that it was natural to engage in sex with others besides my spouse. But I reached a point in about a year where I realized that I couldn't overcome my conditioning (or my basic nature) completely and it didn't feel good to me for my husband to have sex with other women. It wasn't jealousy, as I am not the jealous type, but it felt wrong. I would have been quite willing to give up my lovers but he was not willing to give up his lady friends. So we decided to remain just friends and not live as husband and wife. We are still friends all these years later.

As I got older it seemed to me that monogamy was more strongly desired by women who were of child bearing age and wanted a stable father for their children. As mentioned in the video about how women choose men, I normally chose very high testosterone/macho type men for my lovers until it came to the point where I wanted to have children at about age 30. At that point I chose a really nice, more artistic type man who was not prone to excessive aggression. I was 33 when my first child was born and my husband was a wonderful father. We stayed married for 16 years. After we divorced my 3rd and 4th husbands have been very macho types again. I wasn't looking for a father for my children anymore. So I think the video has validity in it's points about how women choose men and why they choose certain types.

Monogamy is a very touchy subject since most of us are brainwashed to think of sex with someone other than our spouse or mate as "cheating" or even a sinful, if your religion considers it to be a sin. Depending on what you think your agreement is with someone you either live with or marry, that might have some validity. If you have a religious wedding where you promise to be faithful, cleaving only unto your spouse, to have and to hold as long as you both shall live, etc. etc. then you may be "cheating" on that agreement and may feel like you are sinful. Perhaps the usual wedding vows are a bit unrealistic for many people to live up to.

I don't think everyone is similar in their vision of an idealistic relationship. There is so much personal psychology involved that it's difficult to generalize. Many women want men they can control and others want macho men. It also seems to make a difference if you are with your soul mate (if you happen to have one alive on earth when you are). I didn't meet and marry my soul mate until I was 48, but when I met him I have never since been even slightly interested in another man and the feeling I had all my life of searching for something that was missing, disappeared.

Monogamy is a multi-faceted subject on biological (genetic), psychological, religious, cultural and spiritual levels. Each of us needs to do what we are drawn to do to learn our lessons. Hopefully one can become aware of the difference between the beliefs they have that are mostly brainwashing and conditioning, and what is the true nature of their individuated soul in this incarnation.

[Lord Sidious]

Posted by Positive Vibe Merchant (here)

Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
If you consider that there is the possibility that your consciousness merges with someone that you are intimate with, then I would think it is not only a good idea, I would think it is a safe idea.
Talk about safe sex!
How would you like to merge with lots of different people, not even taking into account who they had already merged with?

LS, would you constitute 'merging' as the more spiritual aspect of sex eg 'making love' where there is deep emotional input as opposed to sexual encounter for the sake of it?
Either way, interesting topic.
M@

That is exactlly what I am getting at.
When we do that, there is a merging of consciousness.
Surely I am not the only one to have felt this?

[mondaze]

i tried to merge with my wife, i gave it 30 years. There was never that connection. I am totally merged now and very happy to be so.

[Lord Sidious]

Posted by mondaze (here)
i tried to merge with my wife, i gave it 30 years. There was never that connection. I am totally merged now and very happy to be so.

Note to self, leave this one alone, do NOT give the poor sod some smart alec comment.
Ok, got it.

[mosquito]

For all those women out there who seem to believe that only men have affairs, let me assure you YOU'RE WRONG !

Monogamy is a very complex issue, and one I only feel qualified to comment on having gone through various life stages, 2 marriages and looking at things from a new perspective.

Monogamy seems to be biologically/ evolutionarily advantageous when we're in the procreation stage, it's probably highly politically incorrect to dare to suggest that children need 2 parents, but they do !

Monogamy can be wonderful, when you're in a relationship with someone with whom you merge during love making, it's true ecstacy and can't be beaten. Some of you will never have experienced this, others will have, you know what I mean.

But people change and grow, couples part, and we need to move on. I for one haven't yet found someone else who can give me that deep sense of fulfilment, but I'm looking, and YES, I'm having a lot of fun doing so. (Don't even try to lay a guilt trip on me, it won't work !)

Something else to bear in mind is that a man remains fertile for a far longer time than awoman, so yes, sorry to offend the PC brigade but it is a natural drive for a man to continue spreading his seed. I've said in many other threads that becoming conscious is a process whereby we become aware of all of ourselves, including the deep primitive urges. These don't go away just because you've started to wear sandals and burn incense, we're all human, we have needs and desires, that ARE NOT bad in themselves. Remember - what you repress has a nasty habit of coming along and booting you up the arse !!

That said, I abhore adultery and cheating in any way - if I make a conscious decision to commit to someone and love and support them, then I will do so. I also expect her to do the same. (That's fair isn't it ?) We mustn't judge those who lapse from this contract though, when you're young and idealistic it's easy to say "thou shalt not ..." but which of us has been in a relationship, knowing it to be bad for us, but been too afraid to do something ? (My first wife was violent. What is a man supposed to do in that situation ? Report it to the police and get laughed at ?)

Some people choose to be in an open marriage - that's fine, it's upto them.

Please let's also not forget that one of the main ways that the system controls us, especially religion, but governments more and more so, is through demonising and criminalising our sexuality. In my experience sexuality is the manifestation of spirit in my body, it's what gives me pleasure, joie de vivre, the plain old va va va voooom !

[Tangri]

Monogamy is for tracing family trees .It will be easy to extract need it one

[bennycog]

Posted by Lord Sidious (here)

Posted by Positive Vibe Merchant (here)

Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
If you consider that there is the possibility that your consciousness merges with someone that you are intimate with, then I would think it is not only a good idea, I would think it is a safe idea.
Talk about safe sex!
How would you like to merge with lots of different people, not even taking into account who they had already merged with?

LS, would you constitute 'merging' as the more spiritual aspect of sex eg 'making love' where there is deep emotional input as opposed to sexual encounter for the sake of it?
Either way, interesting topic.
M@

That is exactlly what I am getting at.
When we do that, there is a merging of consciousness.
Surely I am not the only one to have felt this?

I am looking forward to the day that i do lord nug.... um sid
but till then monogamy can wait..

[sirac]

I certainly hope monogamy is natural, otherwise i have wasted alot of energy optimizing for it

i think monogamy is natural for a person/people with career path, who need a life rhythm {i.e. cooling down toward the end of it}, and needs daily rhythms (one need to cool down and maintain other things like motivation for work).

but, when it comes to choosing a partner.
one finds that monogamy is unnatural.
many partners can fit into the addictive phase the body takes up when 'addicting to a person'
---if one can taste your partner (like others taste food, and thinkers taste thought){obviously one is tapping into a few dimensions to taste}, you will find different strengths for different people and so one might not be able to choose ONE (how many have experienced this running thru varsity).


in the discussion of who is more faithful.....man or woman (ridicules discussion for those who are still trapped by this meaninglessness)
estrogen is just as strong as testosterone behaviourally# {personally i think testost. does not make more unfaithful, certainly a males body will respond to a female body, that's how man are wired, but i think testost. is primitive/primary on 'fight related reactions'}
that aside,
there is also the personality dimension of that person. (see MTBI or the russian Socionics),
with social types tending to be more promiscuis (regardless of being male or female, the females main advantage is that she does not need to hunt so hard, or adjust to society with the hatred and vehemency that can be in a man;--is woman blind to a dimension of society?)
...let me not say promiscious.....let me rather say........more optionate (swimming in the pool of people)

[Nanoo Nanoo]

Posted by Davidallany (here)
Monogamy is as natural as wearing clothes.

Excellent comment , it sums it up really

When i was younger i had such high testosterone that i almost had brain damage .. and a mild stroke . I did however stay faithful to my girlfriends. Its something that we are capable of if the person believes in it .. like most things. If its a part of you then yes monogamy is great .. Is it natural ? yes .. we see it in nature all the time .. is promiscurity natural ? yes we see it all the time ... What is Un natural is feeling obliged to stay with someone thats not doing it for you ...

One thing i did tend to notice in my experience is that the chemistry must be there or all else can fail and if its not there you may tend to look at other alternatives. Some people just dont know when to stop looking .. We also need to have better experience and education if we are to understand Monogamy . we are all left to our own devices and have to learn the hard way.



N