Help Needed: I seek advice from people I highly regard (you)

[Phoenix]

Dear All,

I seek words of wisdom from the great people that you all are. I’ll be succinct.

I’m a passionate undergraduate engineering student approaching my senior year at my university. My life goal is to positively influence as many people in the world that I possibly can.

My issue: I want to diverge from the pretty paved road, and take the dive into uncharted waters. I want to study abroad on a program that goes around the world in and gives a taste of several very different countries. But, being a full time student, I would pay for a large chunk of the program with my private student loan - which my parents sign. My parents are so out of touch and live the average American sheep roles. It breaks my heart to see them and my family as a whole so blind and close-minded… I can’t get this part of the puzzle unless I make them see that the co-sign is worth it..

I know this part of my life will be so rewarding and amazing that it will only bring me closer to my goals.

My question: How do I show the people that are closest to me that I must and I will spread my wings and do what I think is best for me, not what anyone else thinks is best for me? Is it possible to do this without totally losing their respect and love?

-Phoenix

EDIT: To clarify, I pay for every cent of my education, loans and all.

[T Smith]

Posted by Phoenix (here)
Dear All,

I seek words of wisdom from the great people that you all are. I’ll be succinct.

I’m a passionate undergraduate engineering student approaching my senior year at my university. My life goal is to positively influence as many people in the world that I possibly can.

My issue: I want to diverge from the pretty paved road, and take the dive into uncharted waters. I want to study abroad on a program that goes around the world in and gives a taste of several very different countries. But, being a full time student, I would pay for a large chunk of the program with my private student loan - which my parents sign. My parents are so out of touch and live the average American sheep roles. It breaks my heart to see them and my family as a whole so blind and close-minded… I can’t get this part of the puzzle unless I coerce my parents to co-sign the loan.

I know this part of my life will be so rewarding and amazing that it will only bring me closer to my goals.

My question: How do I show the people that are closest to me that I must and I will spread my wings and do what I think is best for me, not what anyone else thinks is best for me? Is it possible to do this without totally losing their respect and love?

-Phoenix

What ideas do you have to positively influence people? Are your parents aligned with those ideas?

[Trinity]

G'day mate,

So encouraging to here someone whois so young yet so aware about what this journey is all about.. Inspiring others with positivity..!
As long as you pursue your ambitions you can rest assured that you are on the path of being all that you can be. Don't be distracted if those around you don't understand your path, they will come to understand you by the very fact that perhaps unlike them you followed your dreams.
Please remember that you brought yourself here on to this earth to inspire people.

Inspire your family too..!

regards brother..

t

[Omni]

Be honest with them IMO.

Let your heart show through, speak openly with them. Do some thinking about how to word it IMO. Carefully draw out what points you want to speak about, and what points you want to leave out(if any).

Oh and don't speak of conspiracy at all when telling them your plans IMHO lol. But you probably know that.

Make sure to mention your goals, to effect as many people as you can in a positive manner. If they are so lost they can't identify with that, I feel bad for them...

Also remember to look out for your future as well. If you are not setting up a career somehow by all of this, they might not sign the loan just based on that, as paying back a student loan without an income is pretty hard, or an 8$ an hour job. It may be better to finish your senior year.

Don't make the mistake I did and just think it will all work out for you(although it may), take action in making sure it happens. Securing a resume and an education takes the cake over exploring the world IMHO. You could do that later once you save up after you have finished your education and have a secure job. Not much is worse than having a no good resume and being seen as a loser by society, and what matters more, not having the money to buy good food or travel or enjoy certain things.

My advice is to finish the senior year, and graduate, find a job, and THEN seek out traveling the world and such. If it doesn't work out, you have something to fall back on. Once you have the diploma a lot more is possible. That might not be what you want to hear, but it's what I would do. I wish I had the opportunity to go to a university.

[sandy]

Dear Phoenix,

Sometimes respect doesn't come until one has achieved what they said they were going to do. Sometimes we have to risk losing respect and love for a while to achieve finding ourselves through living out what we truly believe is our passion. There are lessons for you and for those who love you but getting through them to a win/win situation will depend on your total sovereignty and living out your passion with out the aid and sometimes support of others, both financially and emotionally.

Big risks ahead for you my friend, I believe in you and your courage.

[Mark Aldebaran]

> I can’t get this part of the puzzle unless I coerce my parents to co-sign the loan.
This sentence is your problem.

If your parents won't sign unless you coerce them (by misleading? dishonesty? physical threats?) then you have a lot to learn about human nature, integrity, your life and your purpose.
My suggestions are:
1) Finish education here, then go do what you like on your nickel.
2) Take a gap or two, work your way somewhere interesting, go explore, come back and finish off.
3) Say this out loud every day:
I know that truth cannot be fetched, any more than it can be avoided or enslaved, for truth only exists within.

[Lily de Cuir]

Hello Phoenix,

Firstly I admire your passion! Secondly, I had to baulk a little of the word 'coerce' (your parents to co-sign the loan). In my opinion, the first part of your journey is realising you need to be independent and spread your wings under your own steam. Then you owe nobody anything. This in itself will only make your parents and family respect and love you even more.

You are young and it's wonderful to see someone so young with a grand plan for their future. Don't be too impatient. Work out a plan, take one step at a time. Keep learning and researching.

You CAN get everything you want in life - just not all at the same time.

Don't know if I'm begetting any 'words of wisdom' here, lol...the older I get the more I realise what I don't know.

I wish you well on your journey.

Warm regards,
Lily

[MargueriteBee]

Do not go into debt, debt is slavery.

[Phoenix]

Posted by T Smith (here)

Posted by Phoenix (here)
Dear All,

I seek words of wisdom from the great people that you all are. I’ll be succinct.

I’m a passionate undergraduate engineering student approaching my senior year at my university. My life goal is to positively influence as many people in the world that I possibly can.

My issue: I want to diverge from the pretty paved road, and take the dive into uncharted waters. I want to study abroad on a program that goes around the world in and gives a taste of several very different countries. But, being a full time student, I would pay for a large chunk of the program with my private student loan - which my parents sign. My parents are so out of touch and live the average American sheep roles. It breaks my heart to see them and my family as a whole so blind and close-minded… I can’t get this part of the puzzle unless I coerce my parents to co-sign the loan.

I know this part of my life will be so rewarding and amazing that it will only bring me closer to my goals.

My question: How do I show the people that are closest to me that I must and I will spread my wings and do what I think is best for me, not what anyone else thinks is best for me? Is it possible to do this without totally losing their respect and love?

-Phoenix

What ideas do you have to positively influence people? Are your parents aligned with those ideas?

I want to use my education and compassion to help those who need help, for example i am working for a non profit now that is aligned with these ideas and my family doesnt even really care what im doing, all they seem to care about is their fear of me not being safe or something silly

[Phoenix]

Posted by Omniverse (here)
Be honest with them IMO.

Let your heart show through, speak openly with them. Do some thinking about how to word it IMO. Carefully draw out what points you want to speak about, and what points you want to leave out(if any).

Oh and don't speak of conspiracy at all when telling them your plans IMHO lol. But you probably know that.

Make sure to mention your goals, to effect as many people as you can in a positive manner. If they are so lost they can't identify with that, I feel bad for them...

Also remember to look out for your future as well. If you are not setting up a career somehow by all of this, they might not sign the loan just based on that, as paying back a student loan without an income is pretty hard, or an 8$ an hour job. It may be better to finish your senior year.

Don't make the mistake I did and just think it will all work out for you(although it may), take action in making sure it happens. Securing a resume and an education takes the cake over exploring the world IMHO. You could do that later once you save up after you have finished your education and have a secure job. Not much is worse than having a no good resume and being seen as a loser by society, and what matters more, not having the money to buy good food or travel or enjoy certain things.

My advice is to finish the senior year, and graduate, find a job, and THEN seek out traveling the world and such. If it doesn't work out, you have something to fall back on. Once you have the diploma a lot more is possible. That might not be what you want to hear, but it's what I would do. I wish I had the opportunity to go to a university.

Omniverse, thanks for taking the time to respond. To be more specific, my lust for global travel will only make my resume more attractive to globally expanding companies who need people with global viewpoints, I would finish my senior year right after, and have a small global experience under my belt.

-Phoenix

[Phoenix]

Posted by sandy (here)
Dear Phoenix,

Sometimes respect doesn't come until one has achieved what they said they were going to do. Sometimes we have to risk losing respect and love for a while to achieve finding ourselves through living out what we truly believe is our passion. There are lessons for you and for those who love you but getting through them to a win/win situation will depend on your total sovereignty and living out your passion with out the aid and sometimes support of others, both financially and emotionally.

Big risks ahead for you my friend, I believe in you and your courage.

Sandy, always happy to see your words - thank you. This helps immensely.

Your friend,

-Phoenix

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Posted by Mark Aldebaran (here)
> I can’t get this part of the puzzle unless I coerce my parents to co-sign the loan.
This sentence is your problem.

If your parents won't sign unless you coerce them (by misleading? dishonesty? physical threats?) then you have a lot to learn about human nature, integrity, your life and your purpose.
My suggestions are:
1) Finish education here, then go do what you like on your nickel.
2) Take a gap or two, work your way somewhere interesting, go explore, come back and finish off.
3) Say this out loud every day:
I know that truth cannot be fetched, any more than it can be avoided or enslaved, for truth only exists within.

Sorry, I misused the word coerce. I meant persuade. Thank you for pointing that out, I won't make that mistake ever again

-Phoenix

[learninglight]

Posted by Phoenix (here)
Dear All,

I seek words of wisdom from the great people that you all are. I’ll be succinct.

I’m a passionate undergraduate engineering student approaching my senior year at my university. My life goal is to positively influence as many people in the world that I possibly can.

My issue: I want to diverge from the pretty paved road, and take the dive into uncharted waters. I want to study abroad on a program that goes around the world in and gives a taste of several very different countries. But, being a full time student, I would pay for a large chunk of the program with my private student loan - which my parents sign. My parents are so out of touch and live the average American sheep roles. It breaks my heart to see them and my family as a whole so blind and close-minded… I can’t get this part of the puzzle unless I coerce my parents to co-sign the loan.

I know this part of my life will be so rewarding and amazing that it will only bring me closer to my goals.

My question: How do I show the people that are closest to me that I must and I will spread my wings and do what I think is best for me, not what anyone else thinks is best for me? Is it possible to do this without totally losing their respect and love?

-Phoenix

Dearest Phoenix

My advice as a mother is to sit down with them and say exactly what you ask here. 'How do i show the people that are closest to me that i must and will spread my wings and do what i think is best for me, not what anyone else thinks is best for me? Is it possible to do this without totally losing their respect and love?' You are telling them you need to do this but they mean so much to you too and you dont want to lose them if you do this.
Be honest and open to discussion with them, expect questions about why you choose this path and once again your answer is in your statement here..'I want to diverge from the pretty paved road and take the dive into uncharted waters. I want to study abroad on a program that goes around the world and gives a taste of several very different countries.' and here 'I know this part of my life will be so rewarding and amazing that it will only bring me closer to my goals'
It will show them that if you are mature enough to open up about your future to them and discuss it, you are mature enough to decide what road you wish to take

If they don't agree to it you can do it after your education is done, and remember, they do what they do because they love you and want what they precieve as best for you

I hope it goes well for you Phonix

Much love

[Second Son]

Here's the skinny as I see it... Remember, you asked for it.

Watch as many videos as you can about the nature of student loans, and the value of a college diploma/education... and by THAT I mean alternative videos, Phoenix, we all know the conventional wisdom is "get a diploma so you can make a million dollars more in a lifetime than those that are un/der educated". There are many videos on these subjects available, and I have actually watched some right here at Avalon.

Remember that the majority of those multi-national companies you aspire to cater to with your unique type of education ARE the problem Phoenix, and one starry-eyed new hire isn't going to change that fact any time soon. The best way (in my HO) is to completely opt out of this system not prop it up with cooperation and tacit approval. Remember too that this "world view" you speak of is nothing more than "collectivism", and THAT my friend is the beautiful, guilded, politically correct nail which will be the last one in our collective coffins. This great big happy one world "New World Order" though being a recent catch phrase, is as old as the genocide of the Aztecs, Native Americans, Aborigines, the native Celts, and basically all of the tribes of Africa. This world view is what created the already crumbling European Union, which is nothing but a consolidation of the already almost omnipotent world bankers... a financial weapon of mass destruction. I firmly believe that nationalism and personal sovereignty, NOT collectivism is the thing which will stem this massive ongoing pilfering and genocide.

So.... here it is in a nutshell:

Debt IS slavery. Watch a handful of videos about it.

Schools in general are, and always have been a tool of the elite to manipulate and control, as well as to instill in the masses this notion of collectivism.

We ALL want to travel the world and experience other cultures at any age... so DO IT before you are saddled with a job or kids (like some of us). It is not as expensive as you think to travel light and stay in hostels etc. If this is your passion do it, BUT don't try to get it done under the guise of creating an impressive resume, especially if that resume will be created on your parents dime. Could it be that your parents. average Americans that they are, now that they have kids, have never been to Europe themselves? What are the odds of them taking their own dream vacation after they go into massive debt for YOUR education?

If you are really passionate about engineering put a team together in college. Get some electrical engineering students to help you study/build a zero-point generator. There are many retired metal workers who have some equipment at home who would help with the manufacture of parts. This would be a learning/teaching/multi-generational outreach type thing which would open the minds of many. YOU WILL NOT find this technollogy even mentioned in any of your college text books... this fact alone should raise your eyebrows as regarding the education system.

I have not spent one minute in a college classroom, but have been self-employed since I was 23 doing something I am passionate about, AND I am proud of the fact that I am a self made man who struck out on my own path, and I am not beholden to any person or institution for what I have accomplished and become.

I firmly believe that had I become entrenched in academia and conventional "wisdom" in my formative years, I might not be as aware of or open to the alternatives as I am. Just two examples, and then I will shut up...

I was at a cafe with my laptop some time ago. A retired electrical engineer and his wife were there, and after learning his vocation, I decided to show them a few short videos about zero point energy. Now his wife was agog, and more than slightly miffed that our "system" has been lying (and polluting) for so long, she watched the videos, he on the other hand, had been in the system for so long just could not bring himself to jetison his dearly held coventional beliefs regarding electricity. Even though he could actually SEE it with his own two eyes he would not believe it was possible.

A young lady at that same cafe, who would be described by some as a "conspiracy theorist", and who was very aware of many political facts, told me she was going to go to Oregon to learn engineering specifically to work on in the burgeoning field of wind power. My knee-jerk response was something like "We don't need to look at those ugly windmills dotting the horizons, we are SO FAR beyond that type of archaic technology." I could see she was visibly shaken, and (almost) regret saying it. To me this is just another example of peoples' tendency to cling to the conventional world view when education is concerned. She new about 911, etc, because let's face it when it comes to politics anything goes, but come on... the education system? It's just imutable facts and figures in books right? WRONG.

[Charlie Pecos]

Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans. Go with your heart, the rest will fall in place.

Please do not coerce or deceive anyone to achieve your goals. Honesty is the best policy. Treat others the way you want to be treated- how would you feel about a loved one coercing you? When you look back on your life, you want to be proud of what you have done, not filled with regrets because you should or shouldn't have done something. Take risks. Sometimes those risks pay off. Sometimes they don't, but even when they don't, they still pay off in valuable learning experience.

And one more thing- STAY AWAY FROM DEBT. Live simply, buy only what you absolutely need. Don't get caught up in "bigger, better, more". Work to live only, do not get caught up in the corporate game. Much regret you will find there.

These are some of the things that I have learned, I hope they help you.

Please check and this thread:

https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...s-of-the-dying

It has much bearing on this discussion
Good luck and much love to you, Phoenix.

[Cjay]

Hi Phoenix, I feel you. My dad is 84. Only in the last 18 months has he begun to open his mind. It has been frustrating to say the least. My dad told me many times, "you can only eat an elephant one bite at a time, or climb the highest mountain one step at a time."

I suggest that you identify your next step or next few steps, so you are very clear about where you want to go. Then show your parents, as gently yet enthusiastically as you can, specifically which steps you want to take and why. The "why" part is critical - you must have a clear and definite purpose.

If you venturing overseas to further your education and life's journey is intimidating for your parents, may I suggest that you come to Australia because there is nowhere else on earth that is more like the United States, in terms of our overall culture and our universities are world class. This might not be too far out of your parents' comfort zone.

It might seem to you to be so far from your original plans, if you have your heart set on experiencing a wide range of different cultures. But it is just a first step and Australia has a mix of people and cultures from literally every country on Earth. Australia could be the perfect starting point for a much bigger journey.

Here are two websites that may be helpful to get you started on your search:

http://www.universitiesaustralia.edu.au/

http://studyinaustralia.gov.au/
The official Australian Government site for advice on study in Australia. Impartial information about courses, institutions, study and living costs, ...

Wherever you go, I wish you well on your journey.

[bilko]

In the words of Ion " it doesn't matter if you win the race or hit the ditch, so long as you are driving".
This reference refers to life of course.
We win and lose friends and relationships along the way but by living a life true to yourself, your wishes, your dreams; you will exude more life and passion than any cause.
People will flock to you and bask in you and be all the better for it.

A cause may be noble but action is the path that will lead you to joy.
Give those you love the chance to live their own path by following yours and it will all work out as it should.

[Heartsong]

Until you can respect your parent's "culture" I'm not sure you have the maturity to travel the world. Nor should you be using them to co-sign a loan.

[Flash]

Your parents must be very rich for you to think that way. Or you are showing a selfish side of yourself.

Why would anyone pay for anyone the trip of their life, if the former cannot even afford it for himself?

I am fairly well educated, paid for my studies myself and never asked my very hard working parents for a cent. They provided when I was in extremely bad shape, without having me to coerce or persuade, they provided from their heart when they could..

And guess what: once the education finished, I could find jobs abroad that made me travel and widen my horizons. All paid by myself or the employers. What about that?

Omniverse, thanks for taking the time to respond. To be more specific, my lust for global travel will only make my resume more attractive to globally expanding companies who need people with global viewpoints, I would finish my senior year right after, and have a small global experience under my belt

I could mention to you a few companies that need engineers to work abroad once out of university. There is quite a few on the market.

You are surely also aware that a lot of engineering work has been transfered to poor countries where they pay engineers peanuts when comparing with US. Which means that the market is a bit tighter, so don't incur new debts just to put something that looks, to you, glamorous on your resume. It may not really pay back as much as you think it will.

[Anchor]

Follow your heart.

Consider what you were doing when you were asking the question in the opening post, try to figure out if you are motivated to follow the standards of what you might consider to be the judgements of others; but in contemplating this, remember that you are the only one that can judge yourself with complete validity.

You can get stuck in analysis paralysis - ask all the people you want - at the end of it all - you'll be making the decision anyway

John..

[Mulder]

Hi, I'm really excited for you, its such an important time in your life. When I was your age, people told me to "get an education" so I did.

But I didn't know that "Everything is upside down! The doctors are destroying health, the lawyers are destroying justice, professors are destroying knowledge, the media are destroying information and the truth, while religion is destroying spirituality" -David Icke.

Now I have to tell you that your education could turn into a nightmare - just watch this video - "the college conspiracy": https://youtube.com/watch?v=VpZtX32sKVE

I know you won't want to hear this, but DON'T get this loan, find some other way to reach people. In years to come you will see things differently than now.