What technologies, activities or concepts will be made obsolete by Free Energy

[onawah]

I was on retreat on Dauphin Island, just off the coast of Alabama on the Gulf Coast a couple of years ago before the oil spill, while it was still relatively pristine.
There are lots of vacation homes there on high stilts to protect them from storms, high tides, etc.
I had a sort of lucid waking vision of a future where zero point technology and anti gravity devices in each home would make homeowners, assisted by home computers, able to move their homes anywhere they wanted to go, including above the storms, over the ocean, or docked hovering just above or on the ground.
Each home was self sufficient with it's own hydroponic garden, recycling unit, water system (pulling and distilling water from the air), and all were connected remotely to the same AI which automatically kept homes and transportation modules on course, protected from collisions or other dangers.
Cities were also airborne.
This would make it possible for much more land to remain undeveloped, with many more parks, wildlife preserves, undisturbed rainforests, etc.

One of my favorite visions of the future is of a time when all earth creatures are vegetarian, and animals and humans are unafraid of each other.
I would love to be kissed by a giraffe
https://youtube.com/watch?v=8oGig...eature=related

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=8oGigO8YQRE

Or snuggle up to a big cat, go down a waterslide with a river otter, play catch with an orangutan, fly with a flock of birds as in the movie "Winged Migration", take a ride on a whale's tail.
I saw a video once of a family who lived in Africa, whose dining room was open on all sides. When they were having a meal, there was a tame/wild giraffe that would lean it's head in and eat fruit from their table. Can you imagine? I would love that!

[Robert J. Niewiadomski]

Beautifull vision! I dream of such flying homes for couple of years now. Wade mentioned them in one of his vision post. I am glad there are more of us

We had a thread on Avalon about girl named Tippi. She has wonderfull childhood I immediatelly though about her when Ernie and Onawah had written about befriending our "little brothers"... She is a proof a prototype for such visions. I wish such childhood for everyone soon

[Elly]

Posted by Ilie Pandia (here)
Hello all,

Wade wrote on another thread:

In the last level, the one that may be ahead [the FE level], you can see that “efficiency” begins to become an obsolete concept. That would be a long discussion, but it is also germane to your “what would become obsolete” thread.

I must confess that I have hard time seeing that... "efficiency" becoming an obsolete concept.

(...)

So probably, to properly get this, one would have to define what "efficiency" means and to whom...

From Wikipedia "Efficiency in general describes the extent to which time or effort is well used for the intended task or purpose. It is often used with the specific purpose of relaying the capability of a specific application of effort to produce a specific outcome effectively with a minimum amount or quantity of waste, expense, or unnecessary effort."

God is efficient. If a structure becomes useless, a center of love is created elsewhere. Love is retracted from the old structure. The electrons migrate towards the new love center where they are really needed. God is perfection so there is no waste of energy.

In the physical plane, we would still need construction workers, farmers, clothing makers, leaders, etc. People would still need to be efficient to maintain a functional society. People in a new system that do a job well.

Even with free energy, we would still need to be careful in the level of consumption. An object is needed to attract that energy with a limit to the influx and containment of it. Otherwise, one box would be enough for an entire neighborhood, city, or country. Therefore, we still have to be efficient in the way we use this new form of energy, IMO.

[Wade Frazier]

Hi:

OK, I read this thread since I have been away. I see that “efficiency” is being kicked around. If you study the history of industrialization, particularly in the capitalist incarnation of it, “efficiency” became a kind of Holy Grail, because the most efficient operation would yield higher profits. The idea was primarily aimed at energy efficiency, but it could be in subtle ways. Making a person’s actions more “efficient” was a huge aspect of the efficiency efforts in the twentieth century ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Efficiency_Movement ), but when you look at what it really meant, it meant a person taking less time to perform a task. In factory settings, that meant that they could keep up with the machines, kind of on the squirrel wheel. But if you break that down further, what makes people run? Energy. They have a requirement of so many calories per hour to live, and they were working at that factory primarily to secure that caloric energy, for them and their families.

FE, especially FE from the ZPF, is essentially unlimited. While the idea of efficiency as a physics concept would still survive, energy efficiency, and all the subtle ways that “efficiency” constrains our daily lives, would largely disappear. I see many variations of the theme on this thread: no need to rush, and so on.

Again, this is a deeply-baked concept. Take Dennis and what happened in Ventura. That investigator for the prosecution said that he did not care if Dennis was guilty or innocent, because getting convictions was all that mattered to him.

http://www.ahealedplanet.net/advent.htm#care

Why did he think that way? It was because all he cared about was his “prosecutorial efficiency.” They literally call it that in the profession, and the informal term is “kill ratio.” Instead of justice, the goal is efficiency.

That is along the lines that I am referring to, and if you follow the idea back to its roots, in the example of that prosecutor, it usually comes back to energy efficiency.

With FE, instead of efficiency and profit being the bywords that everybody bowed to, it would be ideas such as harmlessness, helpfulness, and so on. The idea of “efficiency” would largely disappear. Look at that chart that I have of the energy epochs:

http://www.ahealedplanet.net/lessons.htm#chart

one of the columns is energy efficiency, and reality of energy efficiency has huge real-world impacts on those stages of civilizations, but in ways that can seem invisible, especially in societies that homogenize everything with money.

Yes, Ernie is getting at some of the built in inefficiencies in the system. As I say on my site, most of the effort engaged in by average Americans has nothing to do whatsoever with providing anything of real benefit to society. Capitalism may be the most inefficient system, in the final analysis.

What Hughe is referring to about alien civilizations is germane, and Sparky’s time = energy idea is noteworthy. These are all ideas that deserve to be explored in the open, but that is part of the conundrum. Yes, as Ilie says, there would not be any “work” in a FE society, but I have seen it called “joy time,” and yes, one of the hardest tricks right now is even imagining what a society based on FE would look like, which is why I highly encourage this thread.

Ah Ilie, I am happy to have my puny conceptions eradicated! But, when I think about what it takes to make heavy elements in stars (at least the orthodox theory of it today), everything is imploding due to gravity. There is nothing to push against. It is like Einstein’s “no hitching posts in the universe” idea” I have a hard time imagining what the “infinite” energy could push against to create that force, but it may just be my lack of imagination. I understand what Paul is saying regarding “alchemy.” All of the elements heavier than uranium were created by artificial bombardment. Yes, it is highly energy intensive, but my concern with that method of transmutation is that it is an atom at a time, and it is also creating a kind of firework, with particles traveling that fast. Heck, maybe they are already making seawater into gold by processes that I can barely imagine, but playing with nuclei is about the hardest trick in “White Science” today. Right now, I’ll settle for FE. I’ll leave transmuting elements in any meaningful way to some future that only Nason knows.

Yes Ernie, wasted genius in our current system is one of the greatest wastes of all. I have seen that one in spades for many years – frustrated geniuses in rocking chairs who gave up.

Yes Ilie, respect would be one of the basic principles, and it would apply to all life forms and even planets like Nason visited.

What I see the others offering is good stuff, too. Keep up the thinking on this! Yes, onawah, that is the direction this can all go.

Gotta go be social right now, but that was good reading.

Best,

Wade

[Ilie Pandia]

Hello,

I've just returned from a trip in the mountains. The road was a bit bumpy, but that would not be a problem in a FE world

I like the "majestic presence" of the mountains, but also the fresh air and clear, truly blue sky. What a pleasure to take in deep breaths.

We've talked above asking permission of the land to stay there, but in my case I think the mountain is actually inviting me!

So living on the mountain side would be a big part of my free energy vision. Even though I might teleport/hover to other places, as it is now I prefer the mountains.

On the top of the mountain the issue of energy is quite literally obvious. The big supermarkets did not make it there (and may they not!) so it's obvious to a lot of people now much energy is required to get supplies up there or go about your daily activities.

I hope that in an abundant world we will still keep the "wild side" of the mountain and learn to live in harmony with it, and not conquer it, as we often hear.

[Wade Frazier]

Hi Ilie:

You have Mountain Fever! I got it when I was seventeen, when I took my first backpack (image attached, although my time in the Alps the year before http://www.ahealedplanet.net/matterhorn.jpg was an early indicator), and I have been hooked ever since. There are worse addictions.

So, what mountains were those? Yes, you get to places where gravity begins to become an issue, and the energy issue can become very obvious. I wish you mountains,

Wade

[Ilie Pandia]

Hello Wade,

I was in the Făgăraș Mountains. They are part of what we call here "Carpații Meridionali" (Southern Carpathians).

After I wrote the previous post about the majestic presence of the mountain, I realized that the mountains are still "wild" and nature rules there, exactly because of Energy Scarcity. I fear a little that with enough energy humans might have left their foot print on the mountain side too.

However, as we've discussed so far, with Free Energy out overall "attitude" towards nature and environment would change as a reflection of the inner changes that would lead to that abundant world...

I don't do hiking that much, but I do it often enough to know that I enjoy it more than "driving around" the mountain

[centreoflight]

Beloveds,
We are blessed to have this stunning view from our residence; in the Verzasca Valley in the south of Switzerland and we are lucky that in our house nearly all our energy is already free. (electric from solar and heating from wood)
Thank you all for your ideas on this tread - I know that when many people are focused on something - they eventually create it.
Blessings

[Wade Frazier]

Thanks Ilie:

I know them as the Carpathians. I became somewhat of a mountain connoisseur over the years, but have not been in as many mountain ranges as I would like. I also get pretty pronounced altitude sickness above about 3,000 meters, so I doubt that I will play in the Himalayas in this lifetime.

Yes, the inability to easily wrench energy out of the mountains is what keeps them relatively pristine. Mountains are generally considered poor land, so the world’s mountain ranges are generally inhabited by poor “hillbillies” who were pushed off the fertile valley land by the dominant class. It is that way in America’s Appalachians, the mountains of Southeast Asia and elsewhere.

You hit on one of the big bones of contention about FE. The environmentalists fear FE because they believe that the only thing keeping humans from strip-mining the entire planet is energy scarcity, so they had better keep energy scarce, to protect us and the planet from ourselves. But, when you begin to drill down into why people strip mine, clear-cut forests, use plow agriculture, and many other “normal” practices, it becomes evident that energy scarcity drives those practices, and energy abundance can make such practices obsolete.

Other things that can become obsolete with FE and related suppressed technologies are (some of which are mentioned in this thread already):

1. Preserved food;

2. Plow agriculture;

3. Strip mining, dangerous mining and mine tailings;

4. Roads;

5. Water pollution, air pollution, landfills, waste in general;

6. Stationary dwellings;

7. Hazardous dwellings;

8. Rote “learning;”

9. Resource wars (securing resources are at the root of all wars);

10. Violent “medicine;” (prevention will be primary, and interventions will be gentle);

11. Also, I have not brought up another “suppressed” area, which is that of computer intelligence. In the black projects world, they may have achieved sentient computers by now. The ETs have living technology, and not exploited “artificial” life forms, either (see David Adair’s testimony, among others http://www.forbiddenknowledgetv.com/...sts-story.html ).

12. Animal exploitation;

13. Destructive forest products;

Of course, some of that is here:

http://www.ahealedplanet.net/visions.htm#can1

http://www.ahealedplanet.net/lessons.htm#advanced

When I get that energy essay done, I will be updating those sections, and will happily “rob” this thread for more ideas!

Best,

Wade

[Lord Sidious]

Posted by Ilie Pandia (here)
Hello Wade,

I was in the Făgăraș Mountains. They are part of what we call here "Carpații Meridionali" (Southern Carpathians).

After I wrote the previous post about the majestic presence of the mountain, I realized that the mountains are still "wild" and nature rules there, exactly because of Energy Scarcity. I fear a little that with enough energy humans might have left their foot print on the mountain side too.

However, as we've discussed so far, with Free Energy out overall "attitude" towards nature and environment would change as a reflection of the inner changes that would lead to that abundant world...

I don't do hiking that much, but I do it often enough to know that I enjoy it more than "driving around" the mountain

You might groan at the stereotypical attitude, but I always wanted to see the Carpathians and the area around bran, in particular.
I find Vlad Tepes to be fascinating.

[Ilie Pandia]

Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
You might groan at the stereotypical attitude, but I always wanted to see the Carpathians and the area around bran, in particular.
I find Vlad Tepes to be fascinating.

According to Romanian history books Vlad Țepeș was still locked in war for resources... so still not a good example for Free Energy! You need to look deeper Lord Sid

Interesting idea from Wade's post that we will have "living machinery" and not abused artificial life forms... if we are to be respectful we will have to be respectful to every body and every thing.

My dear computer will run so much smoother on some free energy juice

[ulli]

I decided to call for free energy with our signatures here at Avalon,
and maybe even other forums where we are active.

We know about the power of the word and intent, backed by emotion...
what do we have to lose...

[onawah]

I read somewhere, I don't remember where, that in some advanced ET civilization, the issue of "efficiency" is based on what certain impartial "think tanks" of individuals who understand systems and how they work together, decide what impact new ideas, inventions, innovations, etc. would have on their civilization as a whole, from the individual up to the planetary level.
So for example, assuming we adopted such a procedure on earth, flush toilets would never be approved for obvious reasons, while composting toilets would.
Products could not be developed just because they would earn money for some corporation, or because a lot of people might buy them.
Products could only be developed if they pass stringent environmental and health standards,taking into consideration the needs of the seventh generation, and would actually represent some kind of real advancement or improvement, provided it was sufficient improvement or advancement to justify the work/cost needed to produce it.

This concept is obvious, but it certainly fits.

[Robert J. Niewiadomski]

Posted by ulli (here)
(...)what do we have to lose...

Scarcity! Lack! Fear!

[Ilie Pandia]

Another activity that will become obsolete will be: stealing / theft! This is closely related to scarcity (not being more than enough for everybody) and to the sense of "property" and ownership that will also be gone.

Most likely the people in an abundant world would have a difficult time understanding what "stealing" was

[ktlight]

So, we would become human, as opposed to what we think is human today.

[Wade Frazier]

Hi onawah:

This is certainly one way to do it, along a “council of elders” concept. It might work for Earth, but also might be too Big Brother-ish for the early stages of the revolution, at least in the USA (we like our independence, even if most of it is illusory ). Once we get to the harmless stage of FE’s implementation, I hope that tinkerers can spend their lives playing the creativity game. Their activities would not hog or impair “resources,” because they would be abundant. But for coordinated activities, that kind of idea makes a lot of sense. In this future Earth:

http://www.ahealedplanet.net/visions.htm#roads1

they probably have something like that, but it probably would not be seen as governance, but facilitation.

Hi Ilie:

Kind of like onowah’s post, some of the ideas we see coming up (or lack of them) were common among the “primitive” peoples of Earth before the Europeans showed up.

From Columbus’s initial encounters with the natives:

http://www.ahealedplanet.net/columbus.htm#first

to the English’s initial encounters with the natives:

http://www.ahealedplanet.net/america.htm#english

to Europeans' initial encounters with equatorial Africans and elsewhere, the natives did not have much sense of personal property, so yes, there was little to steal. In places like Africa, the Europeans had to campaign hard to get the natives to understand materialism. They had to campaign for greed. It eventually worked.

Even dishonesty and lying was a European specialty, which often took the natives by surprise.

http://www.ahealedplanet.net/america.htm#exaggerate

In the New World, people who lied were considered crazy:

http://www.ahealedplanet.net/america.htm#steal1

So, a lot of what FE could make happen in some ways would bring humanity closer to its roots, and in others would launch us on a fantastic journey way beyond what any other human civilization has known. I’ll take that journey.

Best,

Wade

[ulli]

Posted by Ilie Pandia (here)
Another activity that will become obsolete will be: stealing / theft! This is closely related to scarcity (not being more than enough for everybody) and to the sense of "property" and ownership that will also be gone.

Most likely the people in an abundant world would have a difficult time understanding what "stealing" was

What about those people who have lived all their lives in material abundance
yet still see the need to steal small antique silver spoons?
I know some wealthy people who see that sort of theft as a sport, and which is habitual for them.
Embassy functions are notorious for this kind of thing happening.
I got very hurt when some of my cherished objects vanished at a wine and cheese party I hosted.
What about those objects that we cherish that are antiques,
passed down the generations and which have emotional value?

I guess we will have to totally cut with the past, but sometimes it feels that we would then throw away the baby with the bath water.
Yet it is tradition consciousness that got us into this mess in the first place.

[yaksuit]

Posted by ulli (here)
I guess we will have to totally cut with the past, but sometimes it feels that we would then throw away the baby with the bath water.
Yet it is tradition consciousness that got us into this mess in the first place.

I try to only "own" what I use. It has taken me many years to achieve this. Of course there is still a bit of clutter that likes to hang around but it is diminishing year by year.

[Robert J. Niewiadomski]

I think "tradition" is some kind of "obsessive–compulsive disorder". It is often associated with fear. As fear will be obsolete in FE society, I hope so will be "The Tradition"...